Quad turrets are also better because you can set the weapons back farther into the main hinge, so that the center of the weapon aligns with the pivot points. Makes them faster to track, and more precise (when automated). When the controller is calculating where to point the turret, it doesn't calculate the actual point from which the weapons-fire is generated. It's just calculating from the hinges/rotors. So, if the weapon is more centered relative to that rotation point, the tip where the bullets are generated and "fired" doesn't have to move quite as many degrees of arc to be accurate. Like an ice skater pulling their arms in. Except in this case, the end of the gun is closer to where the controller thinks the hinge/rotor is pointed. And the corrections happen more quickly because that end doesn't have to rotate as far. But, it only works for quads, unless you're ok with an unbalanced turret, which I don't think the game really penalizes.
I'd say each turret has it's specific use, for example I'd rather have the tutorial turret for a broadside weapon emplacement on the side of my ship rather than the improved gun depression one, but I'd rather have the ladder as a top mounted emplacement
Broadsides are a good way to lose a battle in space. And aren't really good for anything else. Unless the other guy is using it too, and then it's...well...not terribly interesting, would be the polite thing to say.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 Fair to say, I suppose. But it's space...if you're any closer to your opponent than 100,000 km...you've made a grave error. Unfortunately, space games aren't really about space. So, that's kind of not a thing. It really only matters in games like KSP, and that doesn't have weapons in its vanilla form (aside from missiles, which are mostly useless since their range is trash and they're trivially easy to shoot down).
I didn't think of that. Thats a simple yet clever solution to the problem. Cheers! You can fix the turret hitting itself by changing the lower limit in the terminal.
Found this video over a year after it was out while trying to find out how to make these turrets with a better range of motion. The only video I've found so far fixing this issue. I was racking my brain trying to figure it out myself at first, but I'm happy I came across this video! Thank you!!
I have been building my turres in a similar fashion, with the difference that rather than building a tube to go around and portrude from the hinge at a 90° angle, my guns usually just sit on top of the hinge.
Another option would be to hang the turret by an advanced rotor and a Curved conveyor so that the turret gets the full range of elevation by virtue of its neutral position being 0° and being able to tilt to both 90° and -90°. Granted, you limit your range of lateral rotation to less than 180°, but it's an option for directional turret. Edit: Spelling error
I was going to point out that you moved the blind spot from the bottom of the turret to the top. Which either way isn't bad cuz you can add more turrets for better coverage of lines of sight. But you brought up the blind spot being moved and kinda covered a fix for it. Like you said, this is space Engineers, we can engineer our way into and out of problems. But thanks for the input and the awesome video. I'll be checking this myself and fixing it if I find it to be a big enough problem. I'm on single player so I don't have to worry about hydro man myself
I honestly think this new turret design works best for player-controlled turrets, while the original design works better for AI-controlled turrets, since you have to worry about the AI shooting your own ship if any part of your ship gets between the turret and the enemy.
@@Dolph_VaderIn theory you should be able set the limits on the rotors & hinges themselves to avoid such issues. Black Armor's tutorials on Mech leg configuration explains how to set these sorts of limits well. The priciple is the same, however he demonstrates how to avoid leg armour from hitting other parts of the Mech while walking. Like I said, the principle is the same; So when applied to the custom Turret Rotors & Hinges they shouldn't be able to aim past those limits. Would have to double check in game to confirm, however I don't see why it wouldn't work.
They have different fire arcs, and would be each suited for different applications. The simple turret would be better when placed on a flat surface when the need to depress the guns lower than 90° isn't as important as 360° coverage all around the turret. The other turret is better in all other scenarios.
Is this allowing the hinge to over extend past the 90 degree mark? Cause that would be useful in a bunch of scenarios. I would not use this for guns cause once its a hinge I take into account that I will only have -90 up to 90. 0 degrees would be looking straight up. With a hinge on the top of your grid then most players find it easier to make good looking and/or compact guns by placing a hinge on a block on the bottom of the hinge. If its the top of my grid but I still need the gun to go below my horizon I guess you could say....I tend to use rotors rather than hinges. If I do use hinges I connect the hinge to a block that is behind it rather than underneath it. 0 degrees would be straight ahead rather than straight up. I personally get less clang with hinges but often need my top mounted guns to shoot as low as it can below my horizon without shooting the grid its mounted on. I find that I gravitate more towards using the hinge and just deal with less degrees of movement when how the gun looks or how compact it is was the important factor to me because to me its way more easy to make the guns look good and make them more compact when using a hinge rather than rotor. But most of the time I build very ugly WTF is that looking grids. I mostly go for the rotor with top mounted guns sometimes on a piston so it can spin a full 360 when turned on. Thanks for sharing this video. Interesting stuff. I love this game. Now to get them to add a "Reset Air Tightness" button. I grow tired of reloading my entire game because airtightness glitched out making all vents display one green bar even when the doors are open. If I could reset just the airtightness I feel like I would not need to reload the whole game. And humanoid NPC's. I want a 2nd in command. Where's my William Riker dammit??!! Where's my Lieutenant Commander Data except with less bags under the eyes?? Could bag groceries with them things.
Yes it shifts the 90° angle so the horizontal rotor makes up for the new angle of attack. Also if you want a Riker and a data there is a mod that let's you do this it's called AI Enabled Mod and you can have up to two npcs that can do a variety of things including cover you in a fight.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 I saw that mod but never tried it out. I'm gonna give it a try today. Still have not tried aerodynamics mod either. I need to live a lil more.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 You are right bro!! I added it right after you mentioned it. I have been missing out. I play a lot of single player. I'm literally the only person in the universe other than Reavers and crap. Just having a NPC there Is awesome. I got the lil weld bot. Go's around and welds up things on my outpost. Good call bro. Me and NPC mod get along
The mods only turn the missles into homing missles making them slightly more accurate. The big part is it let's you have finer control over your weapons giving you more build options with ether vanilla or mod weapons. I show and trouble shoot it in the vid which will be out tomarro.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 Yea, i did all that, i can access all the guns if i place a small cargo pod in the mix, but i cant access the guns or pod from the main grid
2 thinks 180° isn't like a flat plane it is a flat plane. Secondly it is far worse to leave your over and under exposed than a sliver of your side. Also turret placement can cover that blind side. You're suggesting someone cut off their head to cure their acne...
1. I may not have been clear but I'm shifting the plane of movement on the hinge to get more angle of attack with the turrets and get more coverage in combination with the azimuth. 2. I'm not advocating for turrets on only one side of the ship. If buil it normally you will get only two of four guns on target where as when you shift the plane you can put more turrets on target (ie. Top side and bottom) resulting in faster threat elimination. 3. I never you only needed to cover blind spots. In Space Engineers combat ships mostly fall into the class of (turret farm) or (flying rifle). More turrets you can pack the better infact I have a video showing the custom turret is better that the stock turrets thus making good turret design essential for proper ship defence and offense.
Stupid haha if my turret is on top of my ship and the enemy beneath I'll just build a second one under the ship or turn my ship in range 😂 than I'll not have the problem by shooting myself lol
No but I have a survival play thru called "Survival Under Fire" where I'm surviving with a ton of hostile npc mods including one that drops a squad of heavly armed robots on me.
Quad turrets are also better because you can set the weapons back farther into the main hinge, so that the center of the weapon aligns with the pivot points. Makes them faster to track, and more precise (when automated).
When the controller is calculating where to point the turret, it doesn't calculate the actual point from which the weapons-fire is generated. It's just calculating from the hinges/rotors. So, if the weapon is more centered relative to that rotation point, the tip where the bullets are generated and "fired" doesn't have to move quite as many degrees of arc to be accurate. Like an ice skater pulling their arms in. Except in this case, the end of the gun is closer to where the controller thinks the hinge/rotor is pointed. And the corrections happen more quickly because that end doesn't have to rotate as far.
But, it only works for quads, unless you're ok with an unbalanced turret, which I don't think the game really penalizes.
I make my turrets with 2 advanced rotors. All the motion you need, only downside is figuring out the armor
You could seat the blocks in each other so the joint has some protection.
I'd say each turret has it's specific use, for example I'd rather have the tutorial turret for a broadside weapon emplacement on the side of my ship rather than the improved gun depression one, but I'd rather have the ladder as a top mounted emplacement
It's a good idea you could make the first a quad barrel assault cannon and the others anti small ship/hydroman guns.
Broadsides are a good way to lose a battle in space. And aren't really good for anything else. Unless the other guy is using it too, and then it's...well...not terribly interesting, would be the polite thing to say.
Well a broad side of assult cannons for those moments you get in close would be some what nice.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 Fair to say, I suppose. But it's space...if you're any closer to your opponent than 100,000 km...you've made a grave error.
Unfortunately, space games aren't really about space. So, that's kind of not a thing. It really only matters in games like KSP, and that doesn't have weapons in its vanilla form (aside from missiles, which are mostly useless since their range is trash and they're trivially easy to shoot down).
Ya I'm hoping the new ai update will fix this and we will have plug in play missles as ai controled builds is what everyone has been asking for.
I didn't think of that. Thats a simple yet clever solution to the problem. Cheers!
You can fix the turret hitting itself by changing the lower limit in the terminal.
Yes it just requires some tweeking.
Some great advice. i updated a buch of my turrets using this info. Such a simple solution.
Your welcome.
Found this video over a year after it was out while trying to find out how to make these turrets with a better range of motion. The only video I've found so far fixing this issue. I was racking my brain trying to figure it out myself at first, but I'm happy I came across this video! Thank you!!
You're welcome now go forth and smite thy enemies🤣
This is a great bit of game experience content, thanks for doing this!
Your welcome.
I have been building my turres in a similar fashion, with the difference that rather than building a tube to go around and portrude from the hinge at a 90° angle, my guns usually just sit on top of the hinge.
I've seen that done and it makes sense as it would put your guns on a higher plan of fire.
Thank you for making this video. Very helpful.
I'm just here doing the lords work my friend.
really nice. that limit i thought was armor or the barrel got in the way.. thanks for sharing this.
Ya it's frustrating when your fighting a pirate small ship and the guns just stop part of the way down.
Such a simple solution that had completely escaped me! Thanks for this!
Your welcome!
Another option would be to hang the turret by an advanced rotor and a Curved conveyor so that the turret gets the full range of elevation by virtue of its neutral position being 0° and being able to tilt to both 90° and -90°. Granted, you limit your range of lateral rotation to less than 180°, but it's an option for directional turret.
Edit: Spelling error
Yes rotor turrets are a thing that needs to be made more I built one with the north winds mod in survival Under fire.
I was going to point out that you moved the blind spot from the bottom of the turret to the top. Which either way isn't bad cuz you can add more turrets for better coverage of lines of sight. But you brought up the blind spot being moved and kinda covered a fix for it. Like you said, this is space Engineers, we can engineer our way into and out of problems. But thanks for the input and the awesome video. I'll be checking this myself and fixing it if I find it to be a big enough problem. I'm on single player so I don't have to worry about hydro man myself
Your welcome hope it helps.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 I have to rework much of the armaments on my ships anyways, I'll keep you updated if I can.
Awsome.
That tutorial turret is great for whenever them getting below the limit is the point where you don't have much of a chance to stop it anyway
Yup have to limit it some because they now shoot the ship their attached to🤣
Seems the tutorial one is better for anti air, and the other for general use, at a glance.
Ya did you see my portable Flack gun?
@@badgerwildgaming6908 I have not! I'll take a look.
Here. Also showed off a truck to pull it with. th-cam.com/video/ldTvz_hZ4IQ/w-d-xo.html
Basically said. If you like a flat plain turret. Set your hinge at +90*. If you want to depress your guns set it to 0^.
Yes it depends on what the turret is used for.
I honestly think this new turret design works best for player-controlled turrets, while the original design works better for AI-controlled turrets, since you have to worry about the AI shooting your own ship if any part of your ship gets between the turret and the enemy.
Yup shooting your own ship is a problem.
does the turret controller override the limits on the hinges?
No it will not unfortunately.
@@Dolph_VaderIn theory you should be able set the limits on the rotors & hinges themselves to avoid such issues.
Black Armor's tutorials on Mech leg configuration explains how to set these sorts of limits well.
The priciple is the same, however he demonstrates how to avoid leg armour from hitting other parts of the Mech while walking.
Like I said, the principle is the same; So when applied to the custom Turret Rotors & Hinges they shouldn't be able to aim past those limits.
Would have to double check in game to confirm, however I don't see why it wouldn't work.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 Great content mate, you have some great work around's and unique ideas overall.
They have different fire arcs, and would be each suited for different applications. The simple turret would be better when placed on a flat surface when the need to depress the guns lower than 90° isn't as important as 360° coverage all around the turret. The other turret is better in all other scenarios.
If you check the Discord I have a great example of that with the missouri class I'm building.
does anyone else have a problem with custom turrets just shooting through each other if the enemy is behind one of them?
Yes that is a common problem. I've found you have to be very strategic with your turret placement.
Sometimes, that limitation is preferable
Is this allowing the hinge to over extend past the 90 degree mark? Cause that would be useful in a bunch of scenarios. I would not use this for guns cause once its a hinge I take into account that I will only have -90 up to 90. 0 degrees would be looking straight up. With a hinge on the top of your grid then most players find it easier to make good looking and/or compact guns by placing a hinge on a block on the bottom of the hinge. If its the top of my grid but I still need the gun to go below my horizon I guess you could say....I tend to use rotors rather than hinges. If I do use hinges I connect the hinge to a block that is behind it rather than underneath it. 0 degrees would be straight ahead rather than straight up. I personally get less clang with hinges but often need my top mounted guns to shoot as low as it can below my horizon without shooting the grid its mounted on. I find that I gravitate more towards using the hinge and just deal with less degrees of movement when how the gun looks or how compact it is was the important factor to me because to me its way more easy to make the guns look good and make them more compact when using a hinge rather than rotor. But most of the time I build very ugly WTF is that looking grids. I mostly go for the rotor with top mounted guns sometimes on a piston so it can spin a full 360 when turned on. Thanks for sharing this video. Interesting stuff. I love this game. Now to get them to add a "Reset Air Tightness" button. I grow tired of reloading my entire game because airtightness glitched out making all vents display one green bar even when the doors are open. If I could reset just the airtightness I feel like I would not need to reload the whole game. And humanoid NPC's. I want a 2nd in command. Where's my William Riker dammit??!! Where's my Lieutenant Commander Data except with less bags under the eyes?? Could bag groceries with them things.
Yes it shifts the 90° angle so the horizontal rotor makes up for the new angle of attack. Also if you want a Riker and a data there is a mod that let's you do this it's called AI Enabled Mod and you can have up to two npcs that can do a variety of things including cover you in a fight.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 I saw that mod but never tried it out. I'm gonna give it a try today. Still have not tried aerodynamics mod either. I need to live a lil more.
Trust me the npc mod is great and adds so much now to the game.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 You are right bro!! I added it right after you mentioned it. I have been missing out. I play a lot of single player. I'm literally the only person in the universe other than Reavers and crap. Just having a NPC there Is awesome. I got the lil weld bot. Go's around and welds up things on my outpost. Good call bro. Me and NPC mod get along
Yup we called him steve....RIP steve.
God damnit now I have to rebuild all my turrets -_- Thanks for that ;-D
Your welcome. Got a new vid on how to use weapon core better with vanilla replacement mod to really make your creations kick ass.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 Well I'm a vanilla plus scripts kind of guy, so this is not for me. But I'll check out your other stuff.
The mods only turn the missles into homing missles making them slightly more accurate. The big part is it let's you have finer control over your weapons giving you more build options with ether vanilla or mod weapons. I show and trouble shoot it in the vid which will be out tomarro.
I just use 2 hinges to make a custom turret and block the gun with blocks so it doesn't hit the grid
You can do this too. It's amazing how versatile the turret control block has become.
This doesnt give a wider range, just a different one. if the target moves directly above you, good luck!
Yes and no. The top blind spot is tiny and when the turret turns it will be able to put rounds on just as effectively.
and when it turns to fire across your ship it'll end up firing into your ship if the enemy goes over the other side.@@badgerwildgaming6908
Thats all well and good but how do you get ammo to the guns? mine dont seem to want to draw ammo the cargo containers
It's all in the piping. You also have to use an advanced rotor.
@@badgerwildgaming6908 Yea, i did all that, i can access all the guns if i place a small cargo pod in the mix, but i cant access the guns or pod from the main grid
I have tutorial on how to build one up. th-cam.com/video/XP4WYQUAy7Q/w-d-xo.html
It’s yo boy dragon lord
Hey dude how's it going?
I may not get the translation, you say to use an armored T-block below the hinge? You mean a armored conveyor t-block, right?
I was already doin this 😉
Great minds think alike.
Does that still work with AI? I assume the AI uses the camera to point in the right direction?
Yes your just adding some pipes to get more coverage.
Does it still work on ai mode?
Yes it does all your doing is adding a few more pipes to get more coverage.
odd, i dont have this problem no matter how i build my turret, i can always aim them down....???
Are they ball turrets?
@@badgerwildgaming6908 yep. just mass made a save for em today, all can aim down...
2 thinks 180° isn't like a flat plane it is a flat plane. Secondly it is far worse to leave your over and under exposed than a sliver of your side. Also turret placement can cover that blind side. You're suggesting someone cut off their head to cure their acne...
1. I may not have been clear but I'm shifting the plane of movement on the hinge to get more angle of attack with the turrets and get more coverage in combination with the azimuth.
2. I'm not advocating for turrets on only one side of the ship. If buil it normally you will get only two of four guns on target where as when you shift the plane you can put more turrets on target (ie. Top side and bottom) resulting in faster threat elimination.
3. I never you only needed to cover blind spots. In Space Engineers combat ships mostly fall into the class of (turret farm) or (flying rifle). More turrets you can pack the better infact I have a video showing the custom turret is better that the stock turrets thus making good turret design essential for proper ship defence and offense.
Stupid haha if my turret is on top of my ship and the enemy beneath I'll just build a second one under the ship or turn my ship in range 😂 than I'll not have the problem by shooting myself lol
Yes or you could also limit the down ward angle so the turret does not hit its own ship and not have ether problem.
Well the at first I apologize for the "Stupid" second you get a sub and 3rd do you have a server? :]
No but I have a survival play thru called "Survival Under Fire" where I'm surviving with a ton of hostile npc mods including one that drops a squad of heavly armed robots on me.
Nice but do you do multiplayer? Maybe on your singleplayer game?
I'd like to eventually.