@@PhillRS I've had a Raleigh roker comp for years and it is a great bike and takes a 45 in a 700. Costs over 3000 but I got one on amazon for 1500 with riva1 and hydraulic brakes. Not stiff at a11. Have a carbon 29er as we11 and is a great bike . Way better for me than aluminum or heavy stee1
I call BS on Abbey's bad mouthing TRP Spyres. I've put them on both of my drop bar bikes, and they work great. If the right cable housings are used and they're minimally adjusted, these brakes work fine. I'll be the first to admit they're not as powerful as hydros, but they"re powerful enough to be safe and efficient.
They weren't TRP Spyres, just base level Tektros. Having said that, I have TRP Spyres on my GT GTR (Mk.1 Grade re-born?) and I'm not that impressed by them. Maybe I need to fine tune them a bit more?.
I don't quite understand the comment about bike shops servicing the Canyon either. Unless they have some policy about not servicing 'consumer direct' brands (in which case, f*** them), I don't see what they couldn't fix? The shop likely sells bikes that have every serviceable component on that Canyon; not like there's proprietary stuff going on here. I'd assume most shops are blind to the brand name if you're paying them to fix it. If they won't service a popular Shimano groupset because it's bolted to a Canyon, well there's plenty of other shops in town I can take my business to.
I've never met a local shop that turns its nose up at servicing a bike that a customer brings in; the reality of the industry is that it is hard for an LBS to stock multiple brands and keep all of them happy, and the LBS knows that customers don't always want a bike from the few manufacturer they do carry. That said, I've never tried to bring my Tracer into the Trek-branded retailer for service, only the small independent shops. That might be an interesting interaction to have!
You can find a LBS that will service brands they don't stock, but there is no such thing as a Canyon shop that can stand behind their product in case of warranties/etc. Expect to pay for any required service and be willing to do some work for your warranty claims.
I have spyre mechanical disc brakes on a 21 lb gravel bike and weigh 230 and have never had an issue stopping on very busy trails or staying in control. I have shimano slx hydraulics on my mountain bike that are amazing but the mechanical brakes are just easier to deal with on a daily basis, 3mm allen to tighten up maybe once a month.
I’ve got those same tektro cable actuated brakes on my Specialized Diverge and can vouch they are as good as hydraulic brakes, in fact I’d say even better, for the simple fact that you can adjust the “take” with the thumb screws. My previous diverge with hydraulic STIs felt like they needed constant bleeding, and just never felt alive. Another point worth making is that carbon frames should not be seen as a better technology than today’s hydro formed alu frame which absorbs vibrations far better and are just as light. Finally my diverge has a future shock built into the headset which makes a huge comfort difference and enables endurance significantly. I’ve done a couple of 100mile races with the future shock and can testify that this is not a gimmick but a total game changer.
Yeah I was expecting to see at least that on here. I was surprised. It's such a unique bike that slots right in this convo pretty well I thought. My wife and I picked them up last week and they're dope rides, surprisingly well spec'd as well.
Hello from Celebration, Florida “first time listener first time caller” As a beginning “Gravler” I found your insights to be concise and helpful towards my next Gravel purchase...
It feels off to compare a $1000 bike directly to a $1600 or $1700 bike. A bike that is 60-70% more expensive should be "more"... It would be better to compare that $1000 bike + $600-700 upgrades to those other bikes. I can say from personal experience that the Revolt 2 feels a lot more "lively" after a $700 wheel/tire upgrade. The stock setup is 3.45kg...
I mean, to be fair, they did explicitly state that this wasn't intended to be a direct head-to-head, it's intended to demonstrate what's available in this price category. 00:20 So, it's not so much a comparison as a it is an evaluation of the bikes demonstrated.
Trek Checkpoint ALR 5 - 2100 USD - negotiate 100$ off your at 2K, ALR 4 $1700 - now both have GRX for 2021 the ALR5 mix of 600 and 800! Much lighter than the AL4 and much nicer frame. The ALR5 frameset I built up is the BEST riding Aluminim frame I have ever ridden at any cost. My only 2 gripes with trek even on the much better 2021 builds is - too narrow a wheel and no flared drop bar. I have ridden road for ages and now that I have ridden a 12d/16d drop bar their is no going back even for road as someone who isn't racing or time trialing their just more comfortable and offer better control
As a consumer in this price range, one should look at value, tire clearance, and ride quality. You can find a ton of good rides sub 2k. I’d easily go with the Grail AL, a Revolt Advanced, or maybe even a TCX from previous gen. You can really get a lot of bang for your buck going Giant or Canyon.
IMO It’s BS about the servicing comments in the video. The components are all standard apart from that odd Giant hydraulic brake set up and any bike shop mechanic could work on any of them or swap out components.
Yea, and any bike shop mechanic should be able to get common cable actuated gravel disk brakes working to within 2% of a hydraulic system in about 10 minutes. These aren't enduro bikes. I have Tektro cable brakes on a Salsa road bike and I couldn't tell they weren't hydraulic without looking. The heat dissipation, surface area, even the actual force are all the same. It is just the drag of the cable that matters. If the Marin was defective why didn't someone get it fixed before there was an accident? I like these three and their review style, but sometimes I wonder ... I bet someone cleaned the demo/test bike with chemicals, contaminated the brakes, and handed it off to the reviewers.
@@adaycj Can confirm that cable discs are still pretty good; I just came from test riding a new Specialized Tarmac with full Ultegra set-up. You know, one of road-cyclings benchmark groupos, including the hydraulic disc brakes. This was my first road bike; I'm coming from an MTB and I'm spoiled by the power in Shimano XT discs. I nearly ran out of road to stop in while I figured out the shifters, because I was expecting XT bite and instead got bite comparable to the cable-actuated Shimano discs on my old 2008 Raleigh Mojave 4.0 MTB. If Ultegra is about on par with that, and Ultegra is the standard, then surely cable discs can't be that bad at all.
I think I see what she was trying to say, but the way she communicated it came off as "this bike is hard to service anywhere." I think what she was meaning is that if you buy a bike from a shop that sells that brand, any "quirks" that brand holds, that shop is prepared to deal with both in knowledge of the brands quirks itself as well as any proprietary bikes. But that really only makes sense with the very-new rider looking for a one-stop-shop kind of approach. Either way, the majority of those quirks exist on the really expensive models where a lot of liberties are taken by manufacturers to do whatever they feel the need to do to make a bike more aero or lighter or whatever (looking at you Trek and your integrated aero brakes). Components are components, the shop I worked at fixed up any kind of bike that came into the shop no matter what.
I have a Canyon and after traveling around Tokyo getting flat NO from all bike shops I visited I had to email Canyon to get the name of a shop they are partnered with. There is a reason LBS are dying, they turn too many people away.
Shops that won’t service a bike based on brand should go out of business pretty quickly..... bikes especially road and gravel bikes aren’t complex, they take mechanical parts out of one of three places, Campagnolo, sram or Shimano, it’s really not a big deal
I've had 5 bikes and only one was bought from a local bike shop. I've never been turned away for any type of maintenance or repairs on any of my bikes. Any shop that would do that I'd never use again. You're still paying for any parts or manual labour time at the end of the day.
I bought the checkpoint ALR5 and I love this bike , I’m 58 yrs old and am fairly new to this sport and peddled 2156 miles on it last year , I love that bike.
Jamis Renegade Expat. Steel Frame. Carbon Fork. Tiagra Group. $1,300.00 Great value...but snobs will throw shade because it is a Jamis. Wise up people. You can get a Renegade with full GRX for $2,000.
I own a Canyon Grail Al6.0. It has the same wheels, frame, cockpit as the 7.0 but it is only 2x10. It is cheaper by 300 euros. I ride the size S. It seems that the slacker head angle, compared to the M, makes a huge difference. It does feel like a lazy road bike on tarmac, it's not lively whatsoever. On dirt roads is great, on steep descents is pretty stable. One more thing. It's not a comfortable frame. I find it extremely rigid. Especially the fork. I weigh 66kgs. I guess the tubes was designed for riders around 80kgs.
The average buyer looks at the drivetrain when buying a budget bike. This is not the point. Sora, Apex etc are are reliable, just different speeds and feel. The real issue are the wheels. Once it starts breaking spokes, it's time for a new wheel (400 CAD +) , and installation. Also, there's a wide variety of combos of rim, brakes, and cassette. It takes a good mechanic to get the correct replacement fit. .
That break issue mentioned in the beginning sounds a lot like they weren't adjusted properly. Mechanical disc brakes can definitely stop the rider but they're a pain for maintenance and adjustment. I definitely don't recommend them but they are certainly capable of stopping the rider. It does require a bit more force on the levers than hydraulic brakes do.
Absolutely terrible review/discussion. Not one mention of specific groupsets other than "there's no Sora hydraulic brakes". Exactly what kind of brakes does the Marin have? One of the biggest takeaways is that one should get a "mainstream" bike for ease of maintenance in this price range, but you don't have a Specialized. Silly.
These are people that have ZERO clue to the real world of the everyday cycling enthusiast. If they don't ride $7k+ bikes with electronic Shimano Dura Ace everything or SRAM Red eTap front to back, then it has to suck. Even then they MUST upgrade anything upgradeable with Ceramic Speed. I get it. $5k bikes would suck to me to if I rode FREE $7k bikes everyday. Not sayin", just sayin". Just don't bother with so called "budget $2K" tests when you know going in that they are all going to suck TO YOU.
That’s what you get when you get bike snobs talking about “budget” bikes. (Which is the majority of the market). Totally disregarding the largest segment of bike riders.
I would like to see how the Cannondale Topstone 105 and Felt Breed 30 fit into this bunch, especially the Felt because of its full GRX setup and ability to switch between 650b and 700c wheels.
Just picked up the Topstone 105 and it's great! Did a lot of looking to find the best spec'd bike for the money. Similar geometry and weight to the bikes discussed here and the 105 shifting and hydro brakes feel great!
What specifically about the Canyon isn’t spec-standard? Why would getting it worked on be a problem? And what would be difficult about upgrading it? Again please be specific.
TD05SSLegacy the fork steerer is larger diameter than most others, so you need the appropriate stem. Can be a pain, but canyon stocks pretty much all sizes, so not the end of the world.
The ONLY thing that isn't the most common standard on the Grail AL is the steerer tube being 1 1/4" diameter instead of 1 1/8". But many other brands/models also has 1 1/4" steerer forks so finding a shorter/longer stem (if needed) is super easy and doesn't break the bank. Like www.bike-components.de/en/components/cockpit/stems/?filterSteerer%2520Clamp=1%201%2F4%22 or www.bike24.com/road-stems.html?content=7&menu=1000%2C4%2C25&sort=price_asc&__qf_form-filter=&pgc%5B100%5D%5B593%5D=1
I got the impression they’re alluding to Canyon being a direct to consumer brand and assuming a lot of shops aren’t going to want to work on one. It’d be interesting to know how much that is the case.
I was also surprised about the comments about servicing and upgrading the Canyon. It’s only the 1 1/4 steerer that is non standard. Giant also uses 1 1/4 on some of their bikes.
I just want to mention that if you want a nice comfy gravel/road bike that’s LIGHT, the Canyon Endurace CF 8.0 is a great choice. I live in Florida and there’s more road than gravel but my Endurace CF 8.0 can fit 35c gravelking sk’s and I got a showroom model off the canyon site for $1,500. Aside from a slight scuff on one of the hoods this thing was mint and I’m so happy with my choice. Plus it’s carbon so for those that like the feel of carbon you can’t go wrong.
Had one in college and never failed me. Left outside in all weather. Never rusted. Sold it for $100 lol. Wish I had it. Now looking for a $2000 Trek gravel bike lol.
Wow!!! is that all you can get for less than $2,000? Here are my bike specs for about $1,800 purchased in 2019. 1050 gram carbon fiber disc brake cross frame with thru axles. 40 mm carbon fiber wheel set at 1580 grams. 2x11 speed integrated shifters with 11/34T cassette, long cage derailleur. Total weight of bike with pedals (8.3 kg). In total over 10,000 miles on frame, and 7,000 on wheelset thus far.
Interesting field, I would not consider any of these with all the great options out there now. Just stick with an S bike. Surly, Salsa, Specialized, or even Soma.
I weigh 105 kilos and ride a Giant Defy with TRP Spyres and they stop me fine. Sounds like there was some sort of contamination on the rotor or they were not set up properly.
As an individual who is new to cycling I'm looking to get a gravel bike. The terrain I'll be riding is a solid 50/50 mix gravel/pavement. I was looking at the surely midnight, canyon grail Al 7.0 and Cannondale topstone 105. Any advice on which would be a good pick?
Cube Nuroad Race, Cannondale Topstone Al 105, Scott Speedster Gravel 20, Felt Breed, Specialized Diverge Elite E5 and.... So many Gravelbikes under 2k not included in this field test. So you really think these are the best one? For example in Europe bikes like the Marin are Discounter Garbage. Things you should buy in a Hardware Stores beween Nails and Toilets.
Well I ride with people that has very expensive and beautiful machines but they just see my X10 toiletry on their front. Of course I have Rene Herse sweet tires. Looks intimidate until you start riding with them ha.
Why did they say working on smaller brand bikes is more difficult? The only one bike had a novel part and that was Giant, a larger bike company, with it's hybrid brake system. Bikes are way easier to diagnose and fix problems compared to motor vehicles.
Have you had the chance (or are you planning ) to test the Bianchi Impulso All Road 2020 which mounts the Shimano GRX (either 600 or 810) group? I’d like to get your opinion on that bike. It’s sold at 1999 € (so a little bit over 2k USD, but not so much)
Inspired by Abbeys recommendation of the Grail AL 7.0, but got the SL as they just ran out of stock on the AL 7.0 w. GRX, I’m curious to know which road tire to get, hoping for a tube recommendation. Thanks in advance, great review 👍🏻
I bought the 2020 Canyon Grail AL 7.0 and hated it because the ride was stiffer and harsher with 40mm tires as my Cannondale r4000si racing bike with 30mm tires. Even riding on average city roads was too painful. A gravel bike this harsh is a non-starter. Even worse is spending hours on the phone to resolve all the numerous issues with the bike, waiting for parts to ship, then taking it to a local shop and finally submitting receipts. I ended up having to spend even more time boxing it to return it. I also tried the Cannondale Topstone 105 and it was compliant while still being agile. It had all the responsiveness of the Canyon but without the harshness. Even just looking at the Topstone 105's frame it is apparent that it is a vastly superior aluminum construction. Plus, if there are any issues you can just take it the local shop and they take care of everything! What's even better is that it is much cheaper at $1750 vs $1988 (Canyon with shipping). I think the reviewers should add the Topstone 105 to the comparison rather than the Canyon.
I have a gestalt 2 and yes the brakes are the weak part of that package and the only part of the bike that reminds me of the price point. It’s a shame because the bike rides beautifully in every other way, it just stops like a 60’s muscle car. It also has one of the best paint jobs I’ve seen on a bike, flat black and heavily pearled blue.
Can you please help me to findout the major geometric difference a road / endurance and gravel bikes apart from considering break systems and tyres. How to distinguish between a gravel geometry ,. It's a tough thing to me . @Cycling Tips
What about the Salsa Journeyman at $900 base or $1200 upgraded model. Can do 700x51mm tires or 27.5x2.2.1 & you can spec it with cowchipper handlebars.
Abby Mickey. You said you had actually never ridden a gravel bike before this in another review. What exactly is your perspective or specific expertise here?
From what I've read, the only real downside is a heavy wheelset. No clutch on the derailleur which may be an issue if you regularly use the bike on challenging terrain.
'You can't put expensive parts on a thousand dollar bike'. This is true, but I'm still at a loss to understand why you get so little for so much with gravel bikes. With a 1000 dollar hardtail you can get good drivetrains (say SRAM NX) and basic hydraulic brakes (plus, of course, a suspension fork). With some of these gravel bikes, you might as well just use your feet to try to stop.
I don't get why the Marin's brakes are such an issue. I got rim brakes on a 20 year old Trek 8500 and they stop just fine. I don't have to pull the brake levers all the way in like she was describing on the Marin. How can mechanical disc brakes be total crap like that?
Any bike shop will work on any bike its not exactly quantum physics....same group set same work. The TRP Spyres brakes take long time to bed it and start bitting really well, hydro is better but not by a huge amount....probably would buy new pads if I ever bought a bike with TRP brakes again, but can’t see running into something stock....maybe just take a tiny bit more force to squeeze
Nope, it is the front piece (clamp) of the stem. It can be screwed onto the front of many Giant stems. So you just buy a shorter or longer Giant stem and you're good to go.
Caley: "Abby, you ran into the back of a truck" James: "Your truck!" Caley: "My truck!" Caley: "Yeah, my truck". Abby: "Yeah, the brakes… they don't… they don't stop… Yeah, they do not stop". I: :D :D :D :D
I remember when you didn’t get shi-- groupsets for your 1500-1800. I’ve been looking for a new bike and these companies are bending us over. I’m going direct sale maybe ribble, shimano 105. 2-11 $1500. I could wait for the drought that’s coming, upping prices 5-700 dollars, Fu-- ridiculous and with crap parts.
I'm a bit confused. The trek Bike here is described as a Toyota Camry but the Canyon bike is described similarly in your Canyon Grail Field Test review: th-cam.com/video/dBDRZHjgEPQ/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=CyclingTips
Buy a Giant TCX advanced 1 on special for $3,100 AUD $1900 USD - Top grade carbon frame, sram force 1x group and brakes, carbon rims, 8kg, 45c @ 700 and 2.0 @ 27.5. Great to ride everywhere. How do I know because I own one. These bikes are sub par and I would not even consider any of them.
In the US will bike shops not work on direct to consumer bikes? I mean they probably don’t like the sales model, but surely they still have to accept servicing and upgrading them? They have to pay the bills right?
They will work on them. The skinny with bike shops is that it takes a lot to keep a brand happy, so they tend to only stock a few brands so they can focus on that. They are keenly aware that this limits the number of customers who will buy a bike from them because they know not everybody wants a bike from the brands they support. They just want you to ride, and they are happy to work on whatever comes through the door from a paying customer. The only thing that might make an LBS nervous is if you come in with an ultra high-end, $12,000 super-bike from a brand they do not carry due to potential liability issues, but even then that usually just results in extra caution being used when performing work rather than a refusal to do work because components are mostly common regardless of price.
Odd that a bike 🚲 over 1k is considered BUDGET. Seeing I can buy a budget MC 🏍 for $300. Having owned a Gestalt 2 and riding in New Orleans I never found the brakes not adequate especially decelerating from 30mph to zero. However I have been riding longer then Abby has been alive.
Is that really safe? How much is service? What if the chain or cassette is messed up? I also don’t like sitting on something that’s been farted on multiple times.
TraumaER you can get a basic service for under $100 - not including replacement parts. Replacing chain/cassette/cables/brake pads is possible for less than $150 too (unless you’re going super high spec). Unless the frame, wheels or chainset is damaged or worn beyond repair it shouldn’t be expensive or unsafe. Farts can be washed off or covered up with other farts.
The Giant Revolt Advanced 3 MSRP $1850. Comes with Tiagra Group. Full Carbon. Still under 2k even with taxes.
Romeo Papa I would argue that you don’t see carbon as a good thing for gravel riding, it’s way to stiff.
@@neilk22 My carbon bike is way more comfortable than aluminum
@@thegefster1988 how much you paid for it? Cause a 1800 bucks bike for gravel made outta carbon will be stiff...
@@PhillRS I've had a Raleigh roker comp for years and it is a great bike and takes a 45 in a 700. Costs over 3000 but I got one on amazon for 1500 with riva1 and hydraulic brakes. Not stiff at a11. Have a carbon 29er as we11 and is a great bike . Way better for me than aluminum or heavy stee1
@@thegefster1988 like I said... A 1800 carbon frame bike will be heavy and uncomfortable... Yours cost 1800 but its a 3000 (weird)
I call BS on Abbey's bad mouthing TRP Spyres. I've put them on both of my drop bar bikes, and they work great. If the right cable housings are used and they're minimally adjusted, these brakes work fine. I'll be the first to admit they're not as powerful as hydros, but they"re powerful enough to be safe and efficient.
She rode into the back of a truck. There were a few contributing factors, but sure, blame the brakes, Abbey. So odd.
They weren't TRP Spyres, just base level Tektros. Having said that, I have TRP Spyres on my GT GTR (Mk.1 Grade re-born?) and I'm not that impressed by them. Maybe I need to fine tune them a bit more?.
@@redart64 so long as you don't run into a truck, I'd said you're doing fine with them. 🙄
@@redart64 ,,,,then I stand corrected and retract my call of BS. So sorry.
They're OK. RTFM about adjustment and they lock up on pavement.
I don't quite understand the comment about bike shops servicing the Canyon either. Unless they have some policy about not servicing 'consumer direct' brands (in which case, f*** them), I don't see what they couldn't fix? The shop likely sells bikes that have every serviceable component on that Canyon; not like there's proprietary stuff going on here. I'd assume most shops are blind to the brand name if you're paying them to fix it. If they won't service a popular Shimano groupset because it's bolted to a Canyon, well there's plenty of other shops in town I can take my business to.
I've never met a local shop that turns its nose up at servicing a bike that a customer brings in; the reality of the industry is that it is hard for an LBS to stock multiple brands and keep all of them happy, and the LBS knows that customers don't always want a bike from the few manufacturer they do carry.
That said, I've never tried to bring my Tracer into the Trek-branded retailer for service, only the small independent shops. That might be an interesting interaction to have!
Quite right. More and more, bike shops will rely on maintenance to keep going.
You can find a LBS that will service brands they don't stock, but there is no such thing as a Canyon shop that can stand behind their product in case of warranties/etc. Expect to pay for any required service and be willing to do some work for your warranty claims.
I have spyre mechanical disc brakes on a 21 lb gravel bike and weigh 230 and have never had an issue stopping on very busy trails or staying in control. I have shimano slx hydraulics on my mountain bike that are amazing but
the mechanical brakes are just easier to deal with on a daily basis, 3mm allen to tighten up maybe once a month.
I’ve got those same tektro cable actuated brakes on my Specialized Diverge and can vouch they are as good as hydraulic brakes, in fact I’d say even better, for the simple fact that you can adjust the “take” with the thumb screws. My previous diverge with hydraulic STIs felt like they needed constant bleeding, and just never felt alive. Another point worth making is that carbon frames should not be seen as a better technology than today’s hydro formed alu frame which absorbs vibrations far better and are just as light. Finally my diverge has a future shock built into the headset which makes a huge comfort difference and enables endurance significantly. I’ve done a couple of 100mile races with the future shock and can testify that this is not a gimmick but a total game changer.
I would have loved to see a Surly Midnight Special in this list, or any of the QBP bikes in this category.
Yeah I was expecting to see at least that on here. I was surprised. It's such a unique bike that slots right in this convo pretty well I thought. My wife and I picked them up last week and they're dope rides, surprisingly well spec'd as well.
Hello from Celebration, Florida “first time listener first time caller” As a beginning “Gravler” I found your insights to be concise and helpful towards my next Gravel purchase...
I love my 2020 Trek Checkpoint AL 4! Super versatile for riding roads to riding trails!
It feels off to compare a $1000 bike directly to a $1600 or $1700 bike. A bike that is 60-70% more expensive should be "more"... It would be better to compare that $1000 bike + $600-700 upgrades to those other bikes. I can say from personal experience that the Revolt 2 feels a lot more "lively" after a $700 wheel/tire upgrade. The stock setup is 3.45kg...
I mean, to be fair, they did explicitly state that this wasn't intended to be a direct head-to-head, it's intended to demonstrate what's available in this price category. 00:20
So, it's not so much a comparison as a it is an evaluation of the bikes demonstrated.
Trek Checkpoint ALR 5 - 2100 USD - negotiate 100$ off your at 2K, ALR 4 $1700 - now both have GRX for 2021 the ALR5 mix of 600 and 800! Much lighter than the AL4 and much nicer frame. The ALR5 frameset I built up is the BEST riding Aluminim frame I have ever ridden at any cost. My only 2 gripes with trek even on the much better 2021 builds is - too narrow a wheel and no flared drop bar. I have ridden road for ages and now that I have ridden a 12d/16d drop bar their is no going back even for road as someone who isn't racing or time trialing their just more comfortable and offer better control
Glad to see Thomas Middleditch is into biking after spending all those years working on his app.
As a consumer in this price range, one should look at value, tire clearance, and ride quality. You can find a ton of good rides sub 2k. I’d easily go with the Grail AL, a Revolt Advanced, or maybe even a TCX from previous gen. You can really get a lot of bang for your buck going Giant or Canyon.
Could you do a review on the Cannondale Topstone Alloy (Sora or 105)? It would be interesting to see how it compares to the bikes in this category.
IMO It’s BS about the servicing comments in the video. The components are all standard apart from that odd Giant hydraulic brake set up and any bike shop mechanic could work on any of them or swap out components.
Yea, and any bike shop mechanic should be able to get common cable actuated gravel disk brakes working to within 2% of a hydraulic system in about 10 minutes. These aren't enduro bikes. I have Tektro cable brakes on a Salsa road bike and I couldn't tell they weren't hydraulic without looking. The heat dissipation, surface area, even the actual force are all the same. It is just the drag of the cable that matters. If the Marin was defective why didn't someone get it fixed before there was an accident? I like these three and their review style, but sometimes I wonder ... I bet someone cleaned the demo/test bike with chemicals, contaminated the brakes, and handed it off to the reviewers.
@@adaycj Can confirm that cable discs are still pretty good; I just came from test riding a new Specialized Tarmac with full Ultegra set-up. You know, one of road-cyclings benchmark groupos, including the hydraulic disc brakes. This was my first road bike; I'm coming from an MTB and I'm spoiled by the power in Shimano XT discs. I nearly ran out of road to stop in while I figured out the shifters, because I was expecting XT bite and instead got bite comparable to the cable-actuated Shimano discs on my old 2008 Raleigh Mojave 4.0 MTB. If Ultegra is about on par with that, and Ultegra is the standard, then surely cable discs can't be that bad at all.
The entire review is BS. Knocking down the value of a bike because of poor bike control... Come on.
I think I see what she was trying to say, but the way she communicated it came off as "this bike is hard to service anywhere." I think what she was meaning is that if you buy a bike from a shop that sells that brand, any "quirks" that brand holds, that shop is prepared to deal with both in knowledge of the brands quirks itself as well as any proprietary bikes. But that really only makes sense with the very-new rider looking for a one-stop-shop kind of approach.
Either way, the majority of those quirks exist on the really expensive models where a lot of liberties are taken by manufacturers to do whatever they feel the need to do to make a bike more aero or lighter or whatever (looking at you Trek and your integrated aero brakes). Components are components, the shop I worked at fixed up any kind of bike that came into the shop no matter what.
I have a Canyon and after traveling around Tokyo getting flat NO from all bike shops I visited I had to email Canyon to get the name of a shop they are partnered with. There is a reason LBS are dying, they turn too many people away.
I don't see why the brand name on the frame of canyon would make problems in a bike shop. The components and parts are still the same.
Shops that won’t service a bike based on brand should go out of business pretty quickly..... bikes especially road and gravel bikes aren’t complex, they take mechanical parts out of one of three places, Campagnolo, sram or Shimano, it’s really not a big deal
That’s why I’m making sure I buy a Trek bike at a Trek bike shop so I get unlimited free maintenance.
I've had 5 bikes and only one was bought from a local bike shop. I've never been turned away for any type of maintenance or repairs on any of my bikes. Any shop that would do that I'd never use again.
You're still paying for any parts or manual labour time at the end of the day.
I bought the checkpoint ALR5 and I love this bike , I’m 58 yrs old and am fairly new to this sport and peddled 2156 miles on it last year , I love that bike.
Jamis Renegade Expat. Steel Frame. Carbon Fork. Tiagra Group. $1,300.00 Great value...but snobs will throw shade because it is a Jamis. Wise up people. You can get a Renegade with full GRX for $2,000.
I saw another recommendation for the renegade, now going for $2500!
I own a Canyon Grail Al6.0. It has the same wheels, frame, cockpit as the 7.0 but it is only 2x10. It is cheaper by 300 euros.
I ride the size S. It seems that the slacker head angle, compared to the M, makes a huge difference. It does feel like a lazy road bike on tarmac, it's not lively whatsoever. On dirt roads is great, on steep descents is pretty stable.
One more thing. It's not a comfortable frame. I find it extremely rigid. Especially the fork. I weigh 66kgs. I guess the tubes was designed for riders around 80kgs.
The average buyer looks at the drivetrain when buying a budget bike. This is not the point. Sora, Apex etc are are reliable, just different speeds and feel. The real issue are the wheels. Once it starts breaking spokes, it's time for a new wheel (400 CAD +) , and installation. Also, there's a wide variety of combos of rim, brakes, and cassette. It takes a good mechanic to get the correct replacement fit. .
That break issue mentioned in the beginning sounds a lot like they weren't adjusted properly.
Mechanical disc brakes can definitely stop the rider but they're a pain for maintenance and adjustment. I definitely don't recommend them but they are certainly capable of stopping the rider.
It does require a bit more force on the levers than hydraulic brakes do.
Absolutely terrible review/discussion. Not one mention of specific groupsets other than "there's no Sora hydraulic brakes". Exactly what kind of brakes does the Marin have? One of the biggest takeaways is that one should get a "mainstream" bike for ease of maintenance in this price range, but you don't have a Specialized. Silly.
X2. They should have posted the specs of each bike and a fair amount of hypocritical snobbery going on here.
These are people that have ZERO clue to the real world of the everyday cycling enthusiast. If they don't ride $7k+ bikes with electronic Shimano Dura Ace everything or SRAM Red eTap front to back, then it has to suck. Even then they MUST upgrade anything upgradeable with Ceramic Speed. I get it. $5k bikes would suck to me to if I rode FREE $7k bikes everyday. Not sayin", just sayin". Just don't bother with so called "budget $2K" tests when you know going in that they are all going to suck TO YOU.
That’s what you get when you get bike snobs talking about “budget” bikes. (Which is the majority of the market). Totally disregarding the largest segment of bike riders.
I would like to see how the Cannondale Topstone 105 and Felt Breed 30 fit into this bunch, especially the Felt because of its full GRX setup and ability to switch between 650b and 700c wheels.
I have the 2019 Topstone 105 and I love the bike. Super duper versatile machine.
Have the Topstone Alloy SE and it’s a fantastic stable bike once you dump the wobbly dropper post.
Just picked up the Topstone 105 and it's great! Did a lot of looking to find the best spec'd bike for the money. Similar geometry and weight to the bikes discussed here and the 105 shifting and hydro brakes feel great!
Just rode my topstone 105 60 miles on road, gravel, and mud and it’s a beast! Got mine for $750 on Craigslist so I’d definitely look there.
Topstone 105 alloy rider here. It's a dream. I don't do rough gravel, but I do fly down dirt roads, and a feel like a superhero on the pavement.
What specifically about the Canyon isn’t spec-standard? Why would getting it worked on be a problem? And what would be difficult about upgrading it? Again please be specific.
TD05SSLegacy the fork steerer is larger diameter than most others, so you need the appropriate stem. Can be a pain, but canyon stocks pretty much all sizes, so not the end of the world.
The ONLY thing that isn't the most common standard on the Grail AL is the steerer tube being 1 1/4" diameter instead of 1 1/8". But many other brands/models also has 1 1/4" steerer forks so finding a shorter/longer stem (if needed) is super easy and doesn't break the bank. Like www.bike-components.de/en/components/cockpit/stems/?filterSteerer%2520Clamp=1%201%2F4%22 or www.bike24.com/road-stems.html?content=7&menu=1000%2C4%2C25&sort=price_asc&__qf_form-filter=&pgc%5B100%5D%5B593%5D=1
I got the impression they’re alluding to Canyon being a direct to consumer brand and assuming a lot of shops aren’t going to want to work on one. It’d be interesting to know how much that is the case.
@@feldybikes if you need a shop to work on your bike, you shouldn't be hiking...... ;)
I was also surprised about the comments about servicing and upgrading the Canyon. It’s only the 1 1/4 steerer that is non standard. Giant also uses 1 1/4 on some of their bikes.
It would be interesting seeing the Marin with Yokozuna Motoko / Juin tech tech brakes getting reviewed. I rode them have had no issues.
Bought a Devinci Hatchet Sora G. Coronavirus is affecting delivery, and I can't wait to ride it.
1800.00. I got a Reynolds 853 framed bike,with full top of line GRX 2 x 11 810 group. Not a budget bike. The thing fit and works great. 2020 bike.
Please do a Field Test series of their Carbon counterparts. Somewhere around $2,000 - $3,000 range 😁
Good series This! Looking forward to more!!
I just want to mention that if you want a nice comfy gravel/road bike that’s LIGHT, the Canyon Endurace CF 8.0 is a great choice. I live in Florida and there’s more road than gravel but my Endurace CF 8.0 can fit 35c gravelking sk’s and I got a showroom model off the canyon site for $1,500. Aside from a slight scuff on one of the hoods this thing was mint and I’m so happy with my choice. Plus it’s carbon so for those that like the feel of carbon you can’t go wrong.
I have the giant . Having a blast on it so far.
This is the perfect time to bring home a new bike. Picking up my revolt 2 in an hour. Just buy her something shinny to distract her 😁
@@ttacx it's home , my butt is still intact! A short shakedown ride after work yesterday has me wanting a long day out
Excellent insights for budget bikes. Keep them coming...
specialized diverge?
This
Giant always gives you the best bang for the buck
Had one in college and never failed me. Left outside in all weather. Never rusted. Sold it for $100 lol. Wish I had it. Now looking for a $2000 Trek gravel bike lol.
Mechanical brakes are excellent if you take the time to adjust them properly.
Wow!!! is that all you can get for less than $2,000? Here are my bike specs for about $1,800 purchased in 2019. 1050 gram carbon fiber disc brake cross frame with thru axles. 40 mm carbon fiber wheel set at 1580 grams. 2x11 speed integrated shifters with 11/34T cassette, long cage derailleur. Total weight of bike with pedals (8.3 kg). In total over 10,000 miles on frame, and 7,000 on wheelset thus far.
All of the field test videos are to the point with honest opining on now clowning because there's a camera. Superb job!
Interesting field, I would not consider any of these with all the great options out there now. Just stick with an S bike. Surly, Salsa, Specialized, or even Soma.
what's your opinion about the specialized diverge flat bar compared to what y'all have here in this video?
Trek = #1. It’s the Glock of bikes. 💯
Shit now I want a festka
My diverge is the whole quiver 😄
Couldn't agree more 😏
same. lol.
This was a really helpful review. Thanks.
I weigh 105 kilos and ride a Giant Defy with TRP Spyres and they stop me fine. Sounds like there was some sort of contamination on the rotor or they were not set up properly.
As an individual who is new to cycling I'm looking to get a gravel bike. The terrain I'll be riding is a solid 50/50 mix gravel/pavement. I was looking at the surely midnight, canyon grail Al 7.0 and Cannondale topstone 105. Any advice on which would be a good pick?
100% diverge e5 comp from specialized
@@PhillRS thank you I'll definitely add it to my list of bicycles to research.
The only problem with the trp s-pires is that people don't know how to adjust them.
Y'all should review the mulekick 853
Yeah u guys really should.
Would be interested in seeing the new salsa stormchaser stack up. It is in the middle of the price range.
Trek checkpoint my favorite. Very solid bike
Cube Nuroad Race, Cannondale Topstone Al 105, Scott Speedster Gravel 20, Felt Breed, Specialized Diverge Elite E5 and.... So many Gravelbikes under 2k not included in this field test. So you really think these are the best one? For example in Europe bikes like the Marin are Discounter Garbage. Things you should buy in a Hardware Stores beween Nails and Toilets.
Marin discounter garbage is very harsh. I would buy the x11 i/o the x10 but it's not a bad bike.
Well I ride with people that has very expensive and beautiful machines but they just see my X10 toiletry on their front. Of course I have Rene Herse sweet tires. Looks intimidate until you start riding with them ha.
No Specialized Diverge?
Why did they say working on smaller brand bikes is more difficult? The only one bike had a novel part and that was Giant, a larger bike company, with it's hybrid brake system. Bikes are way easier to diagnose and fix problems compared to motor vehicles.
Have you had the chance (or are you planning ) to test the Bianchi Impulso All Road 2020 which mounts the Shimano GRX (either 600 or 810) group? I’d like to get your opinion on that bike. It’s sold at 1999 € (so a little bit over 2k USD, but not so much)
great series 😀👍
What are your options if you want a 650b bike, or which not too expensive wheels would you recommend? (And thanks for the video ofcourse)
JAZZ salsa journeyman is great if you don’t mind quick release.
Inspired by Abbeys recommendation of the Grail AL 7.0, but got the SL as they just ran out of stock on the AL 7.0 w. GRX, I’m curious to know which road tire to get, hoping for a tube recommendation. Thanks in advance, great review 👍🏻
Im running 38mm gravel king slicks on my grail al. Very nice tire
I think it would have been cool to add an XC hardtail and a Cyclocross bike to the test for comparison.
I bought the 2020 Canyon Grail AL 7.0 and hated it because the ride was stiffer and harsher with 40mm tires as my Cannondale r4000si racing bike with 30mm tires. Even riding on average city roads was too painful. A gravel bike this harsh is a non-starter. Even worse is spending hours on the phone to resolve all the numerous issues with the bike, waiting for parts to ship, then taking it to a local shop and finally submitting receipts. I ended up having to spend even more time boxing it to return it.
I also tried the Cannondale Topstone 105 and it was compliant while still being agile. It had all the responsiveness of the Canyon but without the harshness. Even just looking at the Topstone 105's frame it is apparent that it is a vastly superior aluminum construction. Plus, if there are any issues you can just take it the local shop and they take care of everything! What's even better is that it is much cheaper at $1750 vs $1988 (Canyon with shipping).
I think the reviewers should add the Topstone 105 to the comparison rather than the Canyon.
I have a norco search and i love it, great gravel bike
I have a gestalt 2 and yes the brakes are the weak part of that package and the only part of the bike that reminds me of the price point. It’s a shame because the bike rides beautifully in every other way, it just stops like a 60’s muscle car. It also has one of the best paint jobs I’ve seen on a bike, flat black and heavily pearled blue.
Marin - direct to consumer?? There are 4 different bike shops in my area that sell Marin bikes!
Can you please help me to findout the major geometric difference a road / endurance and gravel bikes apart from considering break systems and tyres.
How to distinguish between a gravel geometry ,. It's a tough thing to me . @Cycling Tips
any reviews by you guys on the 2022 Marin DSX FS?
What about the Salsa Journeyman at $900 base or $1200 upgraded model. Can do 700x51mm tires or 27.5x2.2.1 & you can spec it with cowchipper handlebars.
Abby Mickey. You said you had actually never ridden a gravel bike before this in another review. What exactly is your perspective or specific expertise here?
The perspective of somebody who is coming from road and considering getting into gravel? Seems pretty useful to me.
Thoughts on the Topstone 105?
The Cannondale Topstone 105 and the Canyon grail 7 are the best bikes in this price range for sure.
From what I've read, the only real downside is a heavy wheelset. No clutch on the derailleur which may be an issue if you regularly use the bike on challenging terrain.
Tested Aluminum Topstone 105 and Checkpoint ALR 105 back to back on pavement. The checkpoint seemed to soak up bumps better.
@@porkchop2723 Interesting comparison...$350 price difference between the 2, in my area...$1750 Topstone vs. $2099 Checkpoint....
'You can't put expensive parts on a thousand dollar bike'. This is true, but I'm still at a loss to understand why you get so little for so much with gravel bikes. With a 1000 dollar hardtail you can get good drivetrains (say SRAM NX) and basic hydraulic brakes (plus, of course, a suspension fork). With some of these gravel bikes, you might as well just use your feet to try to stop.
Great video, can you guys produce a video in the future for best gravel bikes from $2,000 to $3,000 price point? Thanks in advance
Excellent!
I don't get why the Marin's brakes are such an issue. I got rim brakes on a 20 year old Trek 8500 and they stop just fine. I don't have to pull the brake levers all the way in like she was describing on the Marin. How can mechanical disc brakes be total crap like that?
I know it shouldn't bother me, but the guy on the left keeps acknowledging the camera way too much, but it does bother me a bit.
very helpful, thanks......someone needs to explain to Kaylee what a wheelie is tho.
Why no RONDO Ruut AL . It has geometry both Abby and Caley would like.
Should've included any out of the Merida Silex series in this price range.
Any bike shop will work on any bike its not exactly quantum physics....same group set same work. The TRP Spyres brakes take long time to bed it and start bitting really well, hydro is better but not by a huge amount....probably would buy new pads if I ever bought a bike with TRP brakes again, but can’t see running into something stock....maybe just take a tiny bit more force to squeeze
Looks like your stuck with that length stem. It's integrated into the brake system. What if you want a shorter or longer stem?
Nope, it is the front piece (clamp) of the stem. It can be screwed onto the front of many Giant stems. So you just buy a shorter or longer Giant stem and you're good to go.
I could never hand out with these people. Do they even drink their beers? Seriously?
"It's not your fault you are wrong." Man, that dude is pure hostility and anxiety brewed together.
Di Saar “I love you put that in quotes”
Dude you read my mind. I quit listening and started counting minutes without a sip instead
Can you do a video on the best budget shimano 105 road bicycle?
Caley: "Abby, you ran into the back of a truck"
James: "Your truck!"
Caley: "My truck!"
Caley: "Yeah, my truck".
Abby: "Yeah, the brakes… they don't… they don't stop… Yeah, they do not stop".
I: :D :D :D :D
I have the Marin everything they say it’s so true. Awesome bike except for the brakes. I’m changing those soon.
Newbie here. What would you change the brakes to?
Get TRP Spyre mechanical, aa good as hydros
maybe next time you can include a Bombtrack or a NukeProof
Someone needs to review Vitus bikes, they've got incredible specs for the price!
I feel like the Trek is probably the best bet, especially for novice cyclists
I was hoping the girl would slam that beer and start talking $hit. The beers were just props?
Would you go for carbon or aluminum for a gravel bike(cost aside purely function)
Aluminium without any doubt
I would to see the “octane one” ya heavy, but Beefy enough for a ton of bike packing.
I remember when you didn’t get shi-- groupsets for your 1500-1800. I’ve been looking for a new bike and these companies are bending us over. I’m going direct sale maybe ribble, shimano 105. 2-11 $1500. I could wait for the drought that’s coming, upping prices 5-700 dollars, Fu-- ridiculous and with crap parts.
What about 650b tyres for gravel bikes?
What about the GT Grade Carbon Elite 2020 ?
I'm a bit confused. The trek Bike here is described as a Toyota Camry but the Canyon bike is described similarly in your Canyon Grail Field Test review: th-cam.com/video/dBDRZHjgEPQ/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=CyclingTips
Buy a Giant TCX advanced 1 on special for $3,100 AUD $1900 USD - Top grade carbon frame, sram force 1x group and brakes, carbon rims, 8kg, 45c @ 700 and 2.0 @ 27.5. Great to ride everywhere. How do I know because I own one. These bikes are sub par and I would not even consider any of them.
I've never seen a Canyon bike for this money
Great info, thx, :-)
Why does that guy keep looking at the camera when other people are talking?
In the US will bike shops not work on direct to consumer bikes? I mean they probably don’t like the sales model, but surely they still have to accept servicing and upgrading them? They have to pay the bills right?
They will work on them. The skinny with bike shops is that it takes a lot to keep a brand happy, so they tend to only stock a few brands so they can focus on that. They are keenly aware that this limits the number of customers who will buy a bike from them because they know not everybody wants a bike from the brands they support. They just want you to ride, and they are happy to work on whatever comes through the door from a paying customer. The only thing that might make an LBS nervous is if you come in with an ultra high-end, $12,000 super-bike from a brand they do not carry due to potential liability issues, but even then that usually just results in extra caution being used when performing work rather than a refusal to do work because components are mostly common regardless of price.
check British brands as Nukeproof Digger or Genesis Crox de fer
How many inches is it?
Odd that a bike 🚲 over 1k is considered BUDGET. Seeing I can buy a budget MC 🏍 for $300.
Having owned a Gestalt 2 and riding in New Orleans I never found the brakes not adequate especially decelerating from 30mph to zero. However I have been riding longer then Abby has been alive.
Always try and go second hand. Buy used and spend good money on a good service.
Is that really safe? How much is service? What if the chain or cassette is messed up? I also don’t like sitting on something that’s been farted on multiple times.
TraumaER you can get a basic service for under $100 - not including replacement parts. Replacing chain/cassette/cables/brake pads is possible for less than $150 too (unless you’re going super high spec). Unless the frame, wheels or chainset is damaged or worn beyond repair it shouldn’t be expensive or unsafe.
Farts can be washed off or covered up with other farts.
why hydraulic brakes?
A little fatigued by all of the overthinking related to bikes...just ride and enjoy it. #firstworldproblems
1500 and you can get hydraulic brakes maybe 2yrs ago.