Super Bike Vs Mid Range Bike - The Gravel Edition | Will A Top End Bike Make You Faster?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- Gravel bikes are becoming an increasingly popular choice for cyclists, and possibly offer more versatility than any other type of bike you can buy. But how does a mid range gravel bike match up to a super gravel bike? We've got both, and we're off to the woods to find out!
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What would you go for? A superbike, or the mid-range?
I went for a mid-range+ by account of this comparison xD steel frame so a bit heavier, but GRX600 so inbetween your groupsets and while the brakes are GRX400 the rear derailleur on a 1x set-up is GRX812. feel so much more willing to let the bike get a bit beat up with a steel frame than I would an alloy or carbon, and the Ti frame would be blissful bling but then I would worry about ruining its shiny bare metal finish.
Mid-range ... can you guys review the new Domane please... seems CANYON is always here but honestly having now been put in the position of needing to replace a stolen bike ... I going with Domane SL6 ... only rub i missing tire clearance for tires is only 38c with no fenders or at least i will need to be mindful of clearance but my biggest beef with canyon is NO fender mounts or rack space options.. they have them now but still no rack other than a seatpost clamp? ...
I cannot honestly be the only person who commutes to work and wants to have a dryish rear end when conditions are less than favorable =\
... I mean heck i might even bail on commuting with it and go mountain bike with a belt drive when my bike packing bike comes in Priority 600x .... if the maintenance stuff is as good as people say on a belt drive as degreasing and lubing a chain every two weeks on my 50 mile a day commute is anything to speak for a belt drive is way better! .. but then I am left with 'what do i use for a hillclimb bike event when i want some speed ... the N+1 struggle is REAL!
Would of course love a high end bike but can’t justify and I’d be more worried about getting it scratched.
I retro modded a 90s mtb for gravel riding. Less than £150, rides amazing and looks amazing. Bloody heavy tho!
Can you do a video on top range manual gearshift and the battery operated and the pros and cons for gravel bikes specifically please
Watching Oli on a gravel bike is like watching Bambi on ice.
True
👌🤣🤣🤣
😂
I hope they make him run at some point
@@Calum_S if they do it would be like he's wearing clown shoes.
Hearing the camera man suppress his laughing at Olie walking across the stream made most of us feel like we're normal 😁.
Came here for this comment ;-)
Sometimes I like to turn my bib cycling shorts inside out so I look like I have the arse of a Baboon while I cycle.
I approve of this message
Oh wow never thought of this lmao 😂😂
It would definitely improve visibility on the road,
And it would be a good way of asserting dominance over slower riders
😆😆😆
@@ivanallenenns you mean seduce slower riders?
When Si asked. If you go off road "can you faster, can you go further?" He forgot the most important question. Can Ollie ride off road?
Last week a was racing on gravel on my steel bike with roadies on alu and carbon bikes. They were able to gain some distance on-road but on offroad I was catching them easily. It's really more up to skills than technology.
😂 Something of an oversight, given his history riding anywhere without tarmac!
@@gcn just watched the video and noticed that the bikes were mudded up to the max and yet Si and Ollie both seemed to be as clean at the end of the video as they were at the beginning.
@@gcn mm vb k.l
@@gcno
"You have to be able to ride what you can afford to replace." Well said 👍
There’s just something about gravel and off road riding that makes me NOT want to go fast. In other words, totally different mindset for me where I don’t care so much about speed, aero, or whatever. On the road, it’s a much different story.
When it comes to bike weight I always think: Let me first get rid of my 10Kg+ overweight 😀
ha! and a steel frame is very compliant, wish they tested that against the carbon bike!
@@andrewnorris5415 I don't have overweight so it doesn't apply to me!
Easier and more expensive to shave a few grams off the bike
some people want to enjoy the bike no to lose weight in that case it doesn't apply
The more these hosts develop "Top Gear" style chemistry, the better the channel gets. I think Si's "low blow" comment and Manon's shutting the window on Ollie (prior vid) are some if the funniest moments yet..
Normal bloke Ollie, makes these video accessible. Great vid. I do agree, a set of videos where Ollie learns to off road would be great and then a suitably hard challenge at the end. Dirty Kansa Ollie?
Trueee, everyone on comment teasing ollie really feel good seeing normal bloke ollie, pathetic
I'm ollie right now when it comes to road bikes
We're all know which current GCN guy would be perfect for Lasty role!
ollie! come to the us and ride Kansa
He did this race in 2019 and did pretty well: th-cam.com/video/4wHmo5-OvwQ/w-d-xo.html
I would contribute to any fund that puts Ollie on the Dirty Kanza start line.
Owning an aluminium Trek Checkpoint Alr5 from 2018 fitted with 105, back rack for panniers and mudguards, I have to say that weight is absolutly not my main preoccupation! What is important is the handling (->do a good bikefit), the gearing (-> 105 is great in Switzerland) and the carrying capacity! I use my bike as a commuter, for bikepacking adventures and I also take it for the weekend rides in the club with the roadies! It just does everything so well (on and off road !) that I almost don't use my carbon Trek Emonda anymore on the road!
Salut!
Every time I see Si and Ollie together I just know it is going to be a good video.
The compliance-engineered bars and seatpost add the majority of the ‘Magic Carpet ride’, no?
Good point; put both on the less-expensive bike and see if it's transformed.
Man, I forgot how good GCN is at making cinematics! Great vid and comparison as always!
Thanks! That means a lot to us as the team work really hard.
Gimme the AL version in 1X, I’ll make a couple of component changes for weight savings...and that will be my all terrain weapon, it will NOT feel outdated in about...a year or so. I could even mount my bags and go bike packing with no worries or I could take it to single track trails. I don’t want to think that DI2 derailleur been knocked down by a root or a rock...in the middle of nowhere...far away from home.
Is 1x a better endurance / long ride setup?
I think gravel geometry has got a long way to evolve before it stops feeling outdated within a few years of buying it. It doesn't make sense to have a high stand over on a gravel bike as you can generate a lot of compliance from a longer seatpost, I also think they will start becoming a bit slacker at the front and when we get a widely available 1x12/13 with a 9/10 tooth cog at the front 2x drive trains will be a thing of the past allowing for the development of more comfortable, grippier low resistance wider tyres to become more standard. I agree though buy a cheaper bike and get a good wheelset on it and your performance for money spent is top. Expensive groupsets and carbon don't represent good value on a gravel bike.
The easiest way for most of us to lose a few kilo is by doing a little more exercise! :-)
Bikepacking is an excellent point. The double decker handlebars on the Grail CF are totally incompatible with handlebar bags.
@@Zzzzzzzzzzzzjjjj What kind of drivetrain do you have - what rear mech accommodates 46t?
I looked for a gravel bike last year and ultimately bought the Rose Backroad Ultegra DI2 instead of the Canyon Grail. The Backroad is in theory quite similar to the Grail SL, the Grail SLX is another step upwards, so one might call it not yet middle class anymore, but not yet highest.
I am living more or less in the middle between both companies in Germany and drove to both to test the bikes. The reason why I did not go for the Canyon which I originally wanted to buy was this weird hover bar design.
Canyon says it is more comfortable if you grab the upper bar while on gravel due to the increased flex. Of course with a bit less flex on the drops.
But to me that is really a stupid reason for such a design. I had a pretty bad accident on my commuter bike a few years ago, when a tractor crossed my path. He took a turn without looking onto the bike lane and I could not break fast enough because I was holding the bar ends, far away from the breaks. You do not contemplate over the fact that it was exclusively the tractor driver’s fault when you fly over his front wheel at 20 km/h while your bike remains on the other side of the wheel and then land on your head, hearing the reassuring cracking noises of your helmet. And since then there are two things I never ever did again:
1. Ride a single meter without a helmet - not even on my new commuter bike 500m on an almost deserted street to the bakery to buy some bread.
2. Put my hands in a position where I cannot reach the break levers instantly, unless the condition is perfect.
And perfect means high quality tarmac, where I can see and judge the surface for at least the next 50 m. No cycling lane with roots, no bad road with potholes, etc. Only Autobahn like perfect Tarmac. And also no motorized vehicles that might do stupid things. Otherwise I would never move my hands further than an inch away from the breaks.
If the road condition is even slightly imperfect my standard position is on the hoods. If the road gets bad - or if I am off-road where I have to expect bad conditions constantly - I am in the drops, because it offers more stability AND due to the longer lever on the breaks I have better control over the breaking power.
Call me a coward, but I would never EVER dare to ride on a gravel or forest path with my hands on the upper bar, where I could not grab the breaks within the blink of an eye. So as far as I am concerned, an invention that reduces flex on the drops but increases it on the upper bar is utterly useless and the most important reason why I did not buy an otherwise perfectly fine Canyon.
But isn't this a drop down bar issue in general? Unless you're on the hoods or drops, you can't get to the breaks. Similairly if you have flat bar and install the attachable drop ons, you can't get to the brake in time
I'm here at Australia wanting to buy a Grail AL (Don't have enough money for a CF frame) And apparently both the 6 and 7 are sold out...
@@kerbodynamicx472 that’s a different story
I would never go on that type of terrain without an MTB with front suspension
@@stephenr80 well yes. But my first XC Mountainbike …a FAT Chance Yo Eddy also had a straight fork (no damping) …and it was alright. You have to ride a bit more cautious but you get used to it soon. Bike riding isn’t always about being the fastest or against the clock… I swapped the straight fork back then mainly for a small technical issue: the headset often became lose because of those constantly transmitted vibrations.
I love my lower-mid level aluminum gravel bike (Diamondback Comp) as much and sometimes more than my high end road bike (Cannondale SuperSix high mod). And everytime I hear a large rock ping off of my down tube on my gravel bike, I'm glad I have aluminum rather than carbon
Great vid and edit, but you've got to get the boys at GMBN to teach Ollie some off road skills. He'll love it!
Not sure they will though!
@@gcn Neil taught Hank....!
So basically the better ride quality made the carbon bike more of an upgrade for the rider who wasn't as used to off road riding. Whereas for the more experienced off road rider the carbon bike did not make so much difference.
No, that was not the conclusion. Both said the super bike provided marginal quality of life improvements
I noticed that too! Si was marginally improved by upgrading the bike while Ollie’s improvement was more pronounced.
The claimed comfort of a carbon bike compared to a aluminium bike is in my opinion overrated. Probably mostly marketing. I would love to see this claim tested.
I went from alu to carbon a few years ago, and didn't notice anything significant. I think seatpost, saddle, handlebars and tires make a bigger difference in terms of comfort. Maybe it is better to save money on that expensive carbon frame, and upgrade these components instead.
Dim With I agree I think it’s mainly placebo which is further encouraged by watching videos like this one.
I’ve got a carbon bike and an alloy bike. Only 900 grams between them and they both feel equally comfortable and capable.
@@michaelb9664 wind speed affects the carbon more, since its lighter
The deflecting seatpost can be put in the alloy bike. That will make it more comfortable too.
@@Zzzzzzzzzzzzjjjj Thanks, I will check it out!
@@luukrutten1295 Yes, all the flex in that seatpost must make it comfortable. A bit expensive upgrade though.
i have a 250€ bike and im scared of damadging it or getting it stolen
keep it in the garage then ;-)
@@zyghom i mean generally when riding or locking it up somehwere for a stop
@@Daniel-dj7fh Bike thieves barely care how much your bike costs. They're just out to take any bike that's easy to steal and sell and how much it's worth isn't as important to them as how easily they can turn a theft into cash.
@@chrisfanning5842 I don't think that's true, they wouldn't want a beater bike that wouldn't even get them the cost of a fix with a quick sale plus I remember reading that when you have multiple bikes locked up in a rack somewhere (work, college etc) it is always wise to not have the nicest bike which is often the first to be stolen. If you can only steal one bike at a time why steal a £200 bike if a £2k bike is next to it. Just stripping the £2k bike of components to sell and dumping the frame will merit far more money and much lower risk too. In the UK the most stolen bike is Carrera, they are basically incredibly common, About 1 in 5 bike shops in the UK are Halfords and they have about 20-25% of all bike sale revenue. Hence Carrera bikes are easily resold because so many of the same bikes are out there. In contrast high end bikes are quite rare and account for very few sales but that doesn't mean that they aren't a huge magnet for thieves when they spot one. That's the great thing about a beater bike that looks like crap but rides well. You can use it and enjoy it and not worry much about it but I realise for those who see their bike as a sort of status symbol like a high end car would not want such a bike. Ages ago I saw a row of bike that had toppled in a rack so were all resting against each other. One of which was carbon fibre so its not just about theft its also about general knocks and abuse that bikes get when out and about. Did the owner of the bike get the carbon fibre frame and forks scanned to make sure was not damaged internally or did they risk it? Maybe they weren't sure so sold it on so someone else took the risk with the bike unknowingly.
Generally though people are sensible, they will ride something basic if there is a high risk of theft or damage and keep their higher end bikes for situations where they have more control, group rides, loop rides back to their home etc. Weekend vs weekday bikes.
@@Daniel-dj7fh get an old cheap bike for commuting if you can't guarantee your expensive bike's safety i guess? maybe a gearbox one too, less maintenance.
Imagine my shock, based on the title of this being gravel bikes, to see those two standing there at the beginning vs. J Pow.
I got a second hand boardman cx for £250 of ebay. Quickly become my go to bike for a bit of fun.
I own one too. My commuter, my off roader, my club runner, my favourite (and cheapest) of the three bikes I own!
I used to have one too, loved it, just wish I never got rid of it 😔
@@HPaulModels I really want to sell my road bike and get some ridiculous deep carbon rims for the boardman. I can then just use the one bike like yourself
That's a hedge 😂😂😂
i love the pun Opportunity " CanYOUN go further on budget gravel bike?/"
Good video. Interesting if you'd have swapped the wheels and seatpost, 2 of the things affecting acceleration and comfort and then seen how much difference between there was between bikes
Presumably you could get a lot of the comfort advantage by upgrading the cheaper bike with a carbon seat post?
Also, the compliance of that seat post has nothing to do with the material it's made of, but its construction.
The cheaper bike has a carbon seat post
@@mateuszQRDL not really... you can't produce such "springs" from aluminum... would need special steel (quiet heavy) or some kind of flexible plastic-compound...
The special construction was made possible by using carbon... so the material is relevant.
@@ThorDyrden Ah, fair enough. Makes sense.
@@ThorDyrden can't aluminium be designed to flex like on airplane? So why not on a seat post?
RE: Opinion of gravel bikes being a fad.
Gravel bikes, while obviously not as good as road bikes are on the road, are still great on the road but can also be taken on light offroad stuff where it's not so great to ride on your average 23c road bike tyres. They also have more comfortable geometry and lower gearing if you need it, and you also have loads of options for wheels and tyres.
I just got a gravel bike after having a MTB for nearly 10 years (which I still have). Since I mainly ride on roads, but sometimes also canals and gravel bike paths, it's really the perfect option for me. A MTB isn't needed for that sort of thing and are slower on the road and climbing due to tyres, riding position etc. This type of riding is very common for many people, so I really don't think they'll go away. I think they will only get more popular. I can understand why people think it's a fad, but imo it won't be.
With that said, I do see some videos on here promoting them where I just think "that looks completely out of its depth and out of place on that terrain, just use a MTB", like in the Iceland backpacking video. I know they're trying to compare them but it's just not the right tool for the job in a place like that. Also, if I was going to go riding somewhere like the place in this video, over rocks and through mud and streams, I'd choose the MTB for the grip, suspension and control. Gravel bikes definitely have their place but for some of these places GCN keep using them, a MTB would really be the better choice, and I'm sure they know that themselves. However, if your ride consists of a lot of road sections as well as trails such as these, then a gravel bike again becomes a good choice.
Some gravel bikes have suspension like specialized FutureShock in the head tube. Thoughts on that? Seems like a nice mix.
12:05 I love that you can hear the camera man laughing while Ollie stumbles through the stream. The music pause was perfect too. Don't worry Ollie, I'm always on your side though buddy.
It’s an adventure. Don’t care about going faster. As long as i can go through the same course.
Still, thanks for the vid guys
Unless i'm mistaken, that's the Grail AL 7.0, not the 6.0? The 6.0 comes in a slightly darker green. I have a 7.0 on order (gotta wait until March :( )
I like how gravel bikes in Europe are used almost exclusively for forest paths instead of gravel roads
It’s true! Around where I live in the UK there’s not that many gravel roads to ride. A typical gravel bike ride for me is a combination of quiet (tarmac) back roads and some forest paths / single tracks to join them together to keep off the main roads. These rides would be too tough for my road bike but not enjoyable on my mountain bike because of the amount of tarmac riding
The closet we get is canal tow paths.
In the UK we don’t really have the kinds of gravel fire roads you have in the US. Lots of canal towpaths though which are perfect gravel bike territory :)
Plenty of forresty gravel roads in Wales
@@MrAndybell10 Rubbish. There are vast numbers of woodland, moorland and hill paths that qualify as 'gravel' here in the UK. The National Parks are full of them, including many old railway lines converted to paths. Public footpaths and bridleways criss cross farmland, through villages, around industrial estates, reservoirs and lakes. Wonder round a country park, managed woodland or nature reserve and you'll find plenty there too. 🙄
Next time test better engineered bikes, and you’ll see bigger differences. Instead of Canyon, Open or Specialized, or Pinarello.
Yep. My LBS here in US on servicing a Canyon recently noted it is 2012 Giant technologies on a very recent servicing. (He carries Giant and promotes them) He talked me off the Canyon ledge....so to speak!!
Great test, good to see that there is little difference from a speed perspective. It just depends on how much you want or can spend on it, seems like the "budget" version is a more BASTERD proof version
Gravel dismount walking ... bike dismount walking ... a fairer comparison would be different frame+fork with similar components .
Finally, 2 of my favourite bikes where i got a dilemmas of which of them I will pick . GREAT VIDEO!
My gravel snapped in to
Pieces when I did a double jump 😂
Cheap Taiwan China bike rebranded by fake german branding lol ... not worth 13k ... its not even custom built frame no passion in it ...
Si used to give Matt a hard time about having his cap's peak down rather than up, does he hassle Ollie over the same 'crime' ? 😆
Even though Matt’s national road championship title would make him more qualified as a judge of how to wear any cycling gear. 😄
Ok... Well...
The Grail AL 6 costs 1500 €
The Grail CF SLX 8 Di2 costs 4500 €
Easy choice...
£1500 classed as a midrange bike 😂🤣
#realworld?
My thoughts exactly!
I'd rather the AL any day, and save the money to buy something else.
@@cottontop99 Yeah the GCN lads generally live in a world of free, sponsored high-end products. Much like GMBN, there's little or no content on bikes that the vast majority of their subs ride. Both channels have real nice lads as presenters, but outside of the maintenance vids, they couldn't be much more disconnected from the normal rider.
@@moonshinin They ride bikes from manufacturers willing to pay them to do it. An entry level bike manufacturer probably doesn't have the advertising budget to spend on a GCN sponsored video. Shimano paid for this one, I haven't seen GRX400 on bikes under 1k and they aren't likely to pay to advertise their lower margin, lower cost parts in this way.
@@davidrostron7224 Not all content needs to be sponsored. Sponsored content is basically an advert, with no criticism whatsoever.
Not Really much in it to make you want a super bike ..but good vid guys
At the end of the day the main difference is speed but very small the main deciding factor would be your budget
The main benefits of superbike are bragging rights nothing else ... a world class rider will beat any pros even they are on the mid range or low end bike . Superbike are what you toss to your alfred to take back to service center after riding ... low end or mid range bikes are what most people will service themselves ... you ride harder on low end and mid range bikes . Superbike are paris hilton type of riders ... if you want to get a superbike get a real motorbike instead ... no brainer ... its not a race there is no benefit in cost to performance rather if you maintain it yourself a superbike waste more of your time drilling your wife or getting money into your pocket ... This also lead to the stupidity of gravel bike for aero advantages over a old school mtb rigid all round bike .
Love the subtle laugh of the cameraman in the background
I have the Grail 7.0 AL SL SRAM 1x and it’s a blast on road and on gravel. It surely is versatile.
I plan on doing 80% paved bike path. Should I be looking into the canyon endurance instead you think?
@Nick Naccarato - It's up to you and what you enjoy. I ride 90% road / 10% gravel/dirt trail and I average about ~100miles/week. I am still super happy with my Grail on and off road, climbing, riding flat, or doing long 100+ mile rides in a group. Aside from the 1K price difference between the Grail and the Endurace, the Grail offers the widest tire clearance. I've found that 38 (Panaracer Gravel King SS) is my favorite tire width for speed and comfort on and off road. So for me, 38s on a 1-by is how I like to ride and get the most out my environment and/or group rides with buddies. So, trust your gut. Pay for what ever you think will be the most fun to ride. At the end of the day, you just want a bike that inspires you to ride it. And let's be honest, you are picking from a win-win option. You can't go wrong with either purchase. much respect!
"You spent How Much for that bike w/ those handlebars?". Cuz your gonna have to answer that question a lot.
I actually ordered the grail 6 back in June....Still waiting for it to arrive 😂 but it was good to see a more in depth video specifically about it!
Damn, that's a long wait. 😣
I have one. Took it out today, you made a good decision im super happy with mine.
You can hear the camera man laughing at Ollie at 12:06! 😂 I don’t know if I could have done it either!
So sad, Ollie has forgotten all his CX lessons from Jeremy
THE most important feature in any road/gravel bike is FIT. Also, unless you are getting paid to win races, save your money and get a mid range (or lower) bike. The extra 1-2 lbs you save won't impact your fun level. And you'll likely save many thousands of dollars....
Is this a new thing then? I've been seeing more and more gravel bikes over the last four years while out mountain biking (didn't even know they had a name until recently). I think they're a fantastic idea.
It's not entirely new, but it's definitely growing in popularity!
Gave up after the 104th ad during the film
i bought the Cannondale Topstone Sora for £950 earlier in the year. 1300 miles later on every British countryside surface you can image, in every British spring to autumn weather condition you can imagine, i can safely say that the bike is an absolute monster. It hasn't flinched once, it's effortless in the muck, fast on the road, and cosmetically dignified (which it, and you, should be in the countryside). Keep your money in your pocket people, you don't need to go anywhere near bikes like this... it's genuinely a waste. ps. enjoyable video
I love gcn and all presenters … Great people 👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽
Ollie swearing on the technical path is the funniest thing I've seen on GCN
Good comparison video but seriously - HOW MANY ADVERTS?
Great comparison, a nice mix of tech and practical info. Love the video quality and Brit humour, as always!
Hello GCN,
Please kindly stop making videos about gravel bikes.
Sincerely, my wallet.
I tried both the aluminium and some low-end carbon version of the Grail during a local Canyon test day. I liked the carbon one a lot, but I'm still gravitating towards the aluminium one for my next bike. That biplane handlebar on the carbon frames is just so ridiculous. There's a portion there where you must not hold your hands or it might snap. Also you can't change the stem so if the frame is a bit too long or short, then tough luck. I like to ride a shorter stem during snowy season to be a bit more upright.
Hi. Should i get the Canyon grail or the cannondale top stone 1?
The whole logic behind a carbon gravel bike is pure daft, unless you are racing and paid - i,e there will be a second bike waiting for you if the one you are riding suffers a catastrophic failure. If I have to "take care" not to damage my frame when I am cycling off-road, why on earth would I buy a carbon bike!
I agree but some people have enough money where they don't stress a carbon bike getting dinged up. And I guess you can still put protective coats over the delicate areas.
I agree with Si regarding the comfort of the di2 shifter ergonomics. Switching to di2 unexpectedly fixed my wrist/hand soreness that I had been experiencing.
I absolutely LOVE my mid range $2500 Giant Revolt Advanced (2021 edition) gravel bike. I've never ridden a "High end" bike before so I can't speak to the difference, but I've got a full carbon frame, Shimano GRX 600/800 set, and its so light, agile, and comfortable. I just knew gravel bikes would be a lot of fun and I can totally recommend this bike, although I've also heard the Canyon are good also and well rated.
Shimano: "11 speed cassettes with 'nice' 'wide' ratios..."
Campagnolo: "Hold my beer"
You mean "Hold my chianti"?
Probably been mentioned already but GRX RX400 is 10 speed, not 11.
seems you were the first to mention it, i was just checking the comments.
I just do not get this obsession with speed that you seem to have. Is this a channel solely for racers?
Comfortable is faster
They did do a video about slowing down and enjoying the view. When they're doing races, they also try to enjoy the view. But when it's a commercial or for their personal enjoyment, they go for speed.
And that’s the crux of the problem. They’re both racers, and unfortunately they’re racers bereft of the emotional
intelligence required (it’s not much) to talk in anything other than the language of speed and competition. I own four bikes, I cycle everyday and I have never been in a race nor do I intend to. I’m sure there are many others like me.
I'm sure that most people here don't race. There's plenty that complain that Si can still out perform them. So you aren't alone, and I hope that they do create more content that you'll like. I own a BMX and a cheap mountain bike and I never plan to race. I just enjoy these goofballs and their antics.
and I think I only heard the 'fun' word once
I'd love to see the comparison with with the carbon seat post on the AL frame (if that's possible). I've a funny feeling that's responsible for a lot of the difference in 'feel'. Oh and, if you're riding off road, get an off road rider. Maybe borrow Blake from GMBN?
We'd love to see Blake shred on both these bikes - although we feel Ollie is representative of a lot of our viewers who are interested in getting into gravel from a background of road riding so it's good to see both sides! Si is also a very competent off-road rider so I wouldn't write him off!
@@gcn Never wrote Si off! Just Olly was a bit too timid.. Still interested to see the difference in feel with the same seat post on both...
@@jemwoo2001 agreed, Si talking compliance with a seat post that is meant to move is just too ridiculous - I'd like to see him try that with a normal carbon post
Looks cold and wet, I’ll stick to the road. Great fun to watch though
If your weight starts with a 2, you don't need CF or anything past 105.
What if you're 6'5"?
Ah I'm always happy when it's a Si/Ollie combo
I think the comparison with high end bikes and Audi and BMW is quite accurate. Nowadays such cars are quite unreliable and have high repair costs often the cars have shorter lives as major issues with engines or transmissions can result in uneconomic repairs sometimes getting close to 5 figures, i.e. £8k.
www.reliabilityindex.com/manufacturer
The issue with the high end bike there is the frame and forks are more vulnerable to impacts, there is more proprietary parts that may not be available in the future and the components as they wear will have far higher replacement costs so the bike is more likely to be scrapped early despite it higher purchase price. It's likely the cheaper bike will actually have the longer working life which in itself is a huge saving.
Of course you can get many CF bikes that use standard easily replaceable parts, i.e. if you broke the frame it would be easy to replace but Canyon's high end stuff is very proprietary which personally I would avoid like the plague. I hate to be forced into a situation where I have to buy parts that are obscenely expensive and whose supply may dry up. Obviously to manufacturer's it is a way of exploiting customers to make the maximum revenue. £2k should get you a decent CF gravel bike anyway from many brands it will feature mid range components that deliver the sweet spot on value vs performance and may even feature a higher quality CF frame as Quest Composites aren't great, they are a fairly mediocre CF manufacturer.
As ever spend your time looking and you should be able to find a much better deal than either of these Canyon bikes. Admittedly the cheaper model the gains will be marginal but you could probably easily beat the higher end model with minor effort and save a grand or more and reduce your future costs of maintaining the bike.
For the price of the higher end model you could actually get a pretty decent Gravel ebike like the Giant Revolt-E which I think is about £3500 and you'd have full support of your local cycle shop. Of course that has even more proprietary components and would likely have a shorter life than the high end Canyon but would have greater performance and be more enjoyable while it worked. Personally I'd rather go that route than the high end Canyon at least with a motor and battery I'd feel like I've got something for the money I paid and probably get 3-4 years out of it before it got repurposed as Coke cans.
7:02 Shows just how big of an aero dork Ollie is 🤣
I wanted steel over carbon and aluminum. So, I chose a '21 Kona Rove LTD. It probably falls between these two in price. I like it so far.
isgrimner My thinking exactly - made me go with the Big Rove ST 2016 a few years back. The latest LTD would probably be my go-to choice too if I ever needed a new bike and learned to like drop handlebars. :) Know Spider, ride steel. *thumb*
Great to see Dr. Bridgewood and Si working together! Fabulous video Team!
@2:54 surely Ollie, a man from Yorkshire, can't be afraid of mud and hedges! 😂
He seems a little hedge-adverse.
@@kimberlystewart8980 I'd say he's hedging his bets as usual. 😆
@@ViveSemelBeneVivere At least he doesn't look like Sonic the Hedgehog while doing it!
Good to see Ollie has fully learned the cross bike carrying methods ...
Have had my Grail for less than a year and I have some thoughts...it came missing some parts...which are still missing as they don't seem to have any in stock. Not big pieces mind you, but little pieces like axle covers and hole covers...annoying, but no ride ending by any means. Love the fit, love the ride. Wish I would have had more 1x options. Cockpit is a love hate....love the looks, the thumb positions work well and it seems to take a bite out of vibrations on the top bar...but I barely use that position. Also, trying to find a bag to fit it, or a bell, is very difficult. And finally, the paint is already coming off in areas where I just have a bike bag touching it. I used the tape in areas where they showed it was being attached but it looks like the paint is super thin and just rubs off super easily.
I live in Mumbai city. My entire rides are off-road adventures with the amount of potholes. Why people buy road bikes in the city is beyond me? I've been telling them, ''Get a gravel bike.''
...I live in Huddersfield...the roads are shit here too...
Why does India change all their city names? There's thousands of cities in the world. Why should we learn more than one name for some crappy third world dump? What was wrong with the name Bombay?
@@stevek8829 The cities' names were renamed in the post-colonial era (after the British left in 1947) in accordance with the local region or state language.
Also, nobody is forcing you learn more than one name for some 'crappy third world dump'. But for people like you who call it so, it is necessary because you could learn something about the world instead of just trolling another for the hell of it.
What's wrong with the name Bombay? Absolutely nothing. Lot of organisations have the name 'Bombay' in them. E.g. Bombay Scottish School, Bombay Stock Exchange etc.
Hello I am from ph and we call our friend indians "bombay" I don't know where that name came from
@@s1mpleniko488 Bombay means 'good bay' in Portuguese, because our city has a natural harbour which was discovered by some Portuguese sailors. Mumbai is derived from the goddess Mumba who is the patron goddess of the local Koli community (fisher-people) who have inhabited the western coastal lands for centuries.
Surely Ollie’s ridiculous hair makes up the 1.2kg difference in weight between the super bike and mid-range bike
I get that the presenters have to wear their branded up Lycra ALL THE TIME but it looks a tad ridiculous when they’re doing gravel routes or MTB trails.
The Cyclocross guys also waering aero lycra kits, though.
@@Charles_Bro-son 🤢
@@ghostkid8324 haha, yeah I know, I know... you gotta give the roadies that it's super effective though. GCN showed in a video that you can save up an incredible amount of Watts by wearing aero!
12:07 you can actually hear the cameraman laughing lol
Looking down at the awful birds nest of cables on the CF for a whole ride would cause me severe OCD pangs.
Ollie started his carbon bike ride with gloves and finished without - presumably scene filming rather than actual ride but defo would be grateful to have them on when you slide off and put your hands down on jagged rocks
Finally ollies long hairs are gone
Gravel is the only bike I dont fret over speed on
You guys do such a great job. Thank you for these videos and all the questions you address. Both of you are serious, fun, and obviously have a great sense of camaraderie. Well done!
I think it's really about comfort. Even the entry level carbon gravel bikes ride so much nicer than top end aluminum. And they are not that much more in terms of price. The Merida Silex costs 2200€. Sure, 700€ is a lot of money but the difference is night and day.
If I wanted a something affordable to ride on gravel, I'd get a trecking bike. They ride smoother, are more versatile and start at lower price point.
I think Ollie needs a long term challenge to improve his offroad skills. Time some trail loops, get some skills coaching from the GMBN guys, race a season of cross, then measure the improvements, for SCIENCE!
those welds on the alu frame are horrid. Where are the smooth welds?
Not just me then? They look like the trainee did them.
As far as I understood, the welds are actually quite good, but Canyon choose not to polish/hide them. For a gravel bike I would be ok with that, but for a road bike, it’s a different story 😎
They probably changed factories. I think Canyon used to use Giant for both their CF and aluminium frames but the CF frames went to Quest Composites quite a long time ago and they have probably changed to a cheaper factory for their aluminium frames now too. Giant have become a lot more expensive and don't have any factories that avoid the EU tariffs like Cambodia and Bangladesh so for both reasons have lost a lot of OEM manufacturing especially for European importers.
@@bonzobanana1 I have a Giant (carbon frame) which was made in the Netherlands, but it's from a couple of years ago so maybe that facility is no longer operational?
@@maxrevell3830 I could be wrong but thought the Giant facilities in Europe were assembly plants only as labour is so expensive in Europe so would of thought a CF frame from Taiwan or China would be assembled into a bike in Europe or they would just finish the bare frame from Asia i.e. paint it. You would still get a 'Made in Netherlands' sticker. Many German brands import products from Asia merely box the items and get a 'Made in Germany' sticker in what is called 'the last significant process' rule. Same as many Italian bicycle frames. Carbon fibre is such a labour intensive manual process that it could double or treble the price of the frame if made in Europe. If you know where the facility is in the Netherlands perhaps there are videos or pictures of it inside somewhere. Normally it is obvious what sort of facility it is either purely assembly or more manufacturing. Many of the bicycle factories in Europe are clearly assembly only you can see no facilities to manufacture at all with all components coming in pre-made.
Imagine changing that hover bartape for the first time 😳
I can be your top gear stig for bikes
For free
For off-road, I still prefer a mountain bike over any gravel superbike.
The feeling difference is probably about 90% due to the Grail CF's leaf sprint like seat post.
I think more important in Gravel is how comfortable you are with crashing! Riding a carbon bike I'd definitely take less risks and would that make you slower? I think it would 😃.
Thanks, guys! Very informative - and you made me laugh!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Stop oli being in off road videos he’s not helpful don’t learn from watching him ride off road
the aluminium one with the handlebar of the carbon one would be a dream. I'm not big fan of carbon, it may be awesome in some aspects but it is more britle in others.
What i wonder is how would you feel on each bike after say 20, 30 or 50 kilometers of riding on each one, that would tell me much more than a stopwatch in a short circuit lap
What if your Midrange gravel bike is carbon fiber....like my 2020 Giant Revolt Advanced 3
When I get a gravel bike I hope I look like Si but probably look like Oli
Man, throwing all those ridiculously long names & model numbers I'm confused... I'll stick with my Custom SUX2000