46:30 - So spot on. Thank you for saying it out loud. Having to play the game to belong and being shamed for basic trust of leaders who misuse and abuse authority in order to belong and be accepted IN A CHURCH is a sad and distorted. May there be resistance to this cultural push in the churches. "Toxic positivity" is destroying churches because of the harm not being willing to look at the hard stuff causes. Praying for people in roles of authority, that they lean into Jesus and not follow the crowd for gain.
The solution is encouraging. Love God and others more than our own self-interest. Trust God and believe He will Do what He promised, continue to renew our minds through his Word, and pray!
I'm an atheist and I fully agree that tribalism and politicization are a large part of the problem. I have religious friends who had all sorts of ideas about what atheists were like before they met me, and I was the same towards them. Finding our common humanity is the way forward, whether you are religious or not.
I've come to value truth more than beliefs. Beliefs are usually propped up by an Intellectual Construct/Paradigm + Faith (which sometimes is only a notch or two away from delusion), however, Truth is shaped by Testing, Reality, Reproducibility, Criticism, Questioning, Humility, Curiosity...
However, truth claims are generally evaluated (embraced or rejected) by underlying belief filters. For super clear historic example: the abortion issue. Everyone now knows (or can find and discover) scientific truth about the developing human life in the womb (unknown, merely speculated about in 1973). The fetus is “living” and its DNA is human. By any meaningful definition, the developing baby is a human life. However, with a belief system predisposed to deny human life protections to the unborn, abortion advocates have done a sleight of hand for a generation to shift the issue of killing small living humans previously protected in the womb to a matter of “choice”. So, as had been said a billion times by those with this belief system: “I support a woman’s right to choose…” And they never finish the grammatically impaired sentence. Who ends a sentences on a verb without an object? The implied object of course is (… choose) “to kill her developing baby.” This is truth. But belief systems blind people, as corollary to what you’ve correctly stated. So we do want to pursue truth ! But we need to somehow be willing to submit our prior belief systems to truth. History and biblical teaching affirm that people are generally unable to do this. We our slaves to our blindness. Scripture offers the solution: The Truth will set you free. Jesus is the way, the Truth, and the life. Once he opens our eyes, we can see truth that always existed but to which we were previously blind.
“Many of us like to ask ourselves, ‘What would I do if I was alive during slavery? Or the Jim Crow South? Or apartheid? What would I do if my country was committing genocide?’ “The answer is, you’re doing it. Right now.” - Aaron Bushnell (RIP) 🛐
2serve4Christ. To a certain extent, Aaron’s words are true. And to a certain extent, Aaron’s actions were heroic. But ethics are seldom simple. Seldom one sided. He fought evil, true enough. But he also stood up for evil. Those who fight slavery often end up bringing in a different kind of slavery in its wake. Those who fight racism often end up bringing in a different kind of racism. Those who fight apartheid and genocide the hardest often end up committing an apartheid or a genocide of their own.
The book The Solution of Choice by Marcus Warner and Jim Wilder talks about how the church has went the way of the culture since the enlightenment. That may be the problem.
“Many of us like to ask ourselves, ‘What would I do if I was alive during slavery? Or the Jim Crow South? Or apartheid? What would I do if my country was committing genocide?’ The answer is, you’re doing it. Right now.” - Aaron Bushnell (RIP) 🛐
I'm late to this interview, but I found it to be so vague. I wanted to learn why culture is rejecting the church and why Russell left the SBC. I don't think I learned either. Using the word "toxic" and "ideologies", but not providing specifics left me scratching my head. Maybe I'm either not on the inside, or it's above my intellect.
Gossip. That’s all this former Southern Baptist and editor of the liberal Christianity Today magazine can do now that he’s gone woke. To think that we used to value his opinion!
If the current political climate continues and morphs into something more sinister, disciples of Jesus may be forced into an exodus from many of the sectarian traditions which they have cherished. Those denominational traditions from which they flee will have become that “world” which they were warned about in their youth.
God warned us to beware of wolves in sheep’s clothing. Megan Basham reveals who the wolves are and who is funding them in her new book, Shepherd for Sale.
The tragedy to me in this interview is how obviously absent scripture is. A few reference paraphrases, but nothing really solid. As far as the answer to the young lady in college with " nicer" unbelieving friends.,... well that is most likely because the young lady was not revealing Jesus Christ in True representation. Here's some scripture: Matthew 6 32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. Stop being backed into a corner to defend the obvious. The world loves people that are like them. That proves nothing! There's nothing for me as a Christian to defend here. What you will not find in the world is people sincerely loving their enemies. The world loves people who agree with them. This is so obvious! Those "sweet, nice, kind" worldly friends were still gossiping behind people's back, competing ( though perhaps very cunningly) for recognition above their peers, willing to be passive towards a "friend" when they came to competing interests, etc. So stop allowing this " buddist are nicer" baloney. They hate the True God and they hate you for loving the True God. Only if they are being drawn by the Truth of the Gospel will they hang around a True Spirit filled follower of Jesus Christ. John 14:23 Is the Love of Jesus Christ and His Father enough for you in these last days? Remember that lots of people in " the church" are of the world and not of the Father in Heaven. Terrible times are here. Hebrews 13:5 "I will never leave you". We can confidently say " The Lord is my helper" Most American men have compromised so much for so long they are so off course they don't know what is up or what is down. Sadly many of these men are "pastors, teachers, administrators," leading their families and many people in the wrong direction. Read Jeremiah and Ezekiel.... nothing new.
I am in my mid-eighties and thankful for the good in my Southern Baptist upbringing, but left in the 1960's after graduating from an excellent Baptist liberal arts college and finding the denomination to be on the wrong side of scholarship, ministry, social justice, the spiritual life and more. I didn't leave belief, but the Southern Baptist denomination that became an impediment to faith and the practice of faith. I didn't feel rage or anger, but disgust with what the Southern Baptist denomination has become. It is now an instrument of white nationalism that prefers the southern culture to Jesus and is doing harm to his message. It's embrace of the immoral, unethical, corrupt, Trump as God's anointed tells me they have forsaken Jesus.
Heres something new. The story of Jesus changing water into wine is a prophecy. It concerns the loss of faith in Jesus. I wish I could tell someone about it.
Russell Moore, shocking that you would dare to speak after what you did to the southern Baptist convention. Especially, as I understand from John Whitehead interviews the two letters you released to do damage that apparently weren’t quite accurate.
I would note that the cartoonish stereotypes of non-believers are not new. That has been going on in earnest since the rise of the Moral Majority in the Reagan era. Given that Reaganism itself was fueled by exactly the angry nostalgia Dr. Moore describes here, current circumstances are wholly unsurprising.
"Why Culture is Rejecting the Church and Leaving the SBC." I listened to this from beginning to end and really did not get an answer to the question. There were a lot of Kumbaya moments about how we can get along with atheists, agnostics, and secularists but nothing about why the SBC is losing people. The problem is minor in the SBC compared to the mainline denominations. I did a detailed study of the loss of members within the 7 mainline groups since 1985 in graduate school, and the numbers are astounding. Most have lost 2/3 of their members and attendance is even more startling. They have done an excellent job relating to the non-churched culture and are losing members so fast that it is hard to keep the data current. The reasons for the decline across the board are complex and barely touched on in this video. The most important reason is not your list of church ills, which are important to discuss. The reason is a general disinterest and disdain for religion, especially organized religion. Is corruption, celebrity pastors, tribalism, and hypocrisy a problem? Sure, but those have always been around to one degree or another. It is that people hate the God of the Bible and have made a god after their own image that they like and that agrees with them. They may or may not call it god, but it is, and it enables them to form a worldview that tells them, "You're OK. Be yourself and everything will be all right." There are still many churches that are growing and thriving and not because they have a great band. It is because they preach Christ and Him crucified and that he has a claim on each human life he created. He's the boss. People really don't like to hear that but lots of them are being saved.
Thankful to be part of an SBC church and contributing member of the Cooperative program. Also thankful that Russel Moore is no longer a part of the SBC and especially no longer head of the ERLC. We are much better off without him!
We just joined a SBC church after attending a huge nondenominational church for decades. We love the conservative values and excellent Bible teaching we’re getting now. Once our old church got progressive, they started getting squishy on what the Bible said and we didn’t fit in anymore. Good riddance to pastors like Russell Moore and egotistical women like Beth Moore.
Small amounts of people have turned the world around in history. Christ and 12 Apostles, Churchill and so many other instances. The issue is you are speaking in general terms about politics of the Church or whatnot. You took stances on Trump, whatever term you'd like for what is called wokeism and others and others didn't agree with you. It isn't a small number. If you or Chandler or whomever believed YOU were/are 'racists' then that's your personal issue but to imply everyone is reading hearts and you can't do that.
@@chaddonal4331 Telling children that a space dwelling entity made the world in its image without any Evidence to back it up is Lying! If you want to teach children that a space dwelling entity exists and it creates stuff then you need to provide evidence of your claim and let the process of peer review happen. After no one can disprove you're evidence and the vetting process is complete and you're god claims get vetted then you can teach children about God in such a capacity. Right now all you have is the Bible and nothing of substance.
@@Gfish17 You are mistaking categories, so you are unable to see appropriate evidence, exactly as the Bible prophesied. Your spiritual blindness actually confirms biblical claims about the inability to see reality. You are taking a scientific evidentiary foundational approach based on naturalism, a closed system you imagine yourself capable to evaluate. However, the most basic foundational claim of a biblical worldview is that the world is supernatural, and that all things are under control of a primary spiritual being who is invisible, and is perceived spiritually. You do not judge Him. You are accountable to Him and He will stand in judgement of you. You are imagining in your closed evidentiary naturalistic system that three dimensions can account for a fourth dimension, which is both impossible and illegitimate. (Just as the best astronomers and physics scientists know almost nothing about dark matter which might be 90% of the universe. We rightly stand in awe and humility of what we cannot comprehend). Scripture claims that God’s ways are higher than our ways, and that spiritual truth and realities are spiritually discerned. You may suppose that seeing (“evidence”) produces faith, but it is the opposite. God calls the humble, we respond in faith, and in our belief, we begin to see. In pride, people reject God‘s calling, refuse to believe, and therefore, not seeing, you remain in your blindness. This is basic teaching of Jesus. If you want to listen to some brilliant people (scientists, philosophers) who establish justifiable rationale for spiritual belief that some skeptics have found to be persuasive, then check out the likes of: Reasons to Believe, William Lane Craig, and John Lennox for starters. But I guarantee, even though these men can run intellectual circles around most skeptics, and are among the most brilliant people alive, you will likely miss their argumentation and mock them, unless you humble yourself before God, and seek to actually be a seeker. God will not be mocked, and will not reveal himself to mockers. As Proverbs states: “The beginning of knowledge is the fear of the Lord. Fools despise wisdom and instruction.” And Hebrews 11:6 ”But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.“
Churches are getting too big and no one really knows the Senior Pastor and there’s not good accountability, we elevate Pastors to celebrity status, we need to have perhaps 3 pastors leading together, not one. People don’t want to see or hear about abuse as it’s too hard and perhaps they haven’t worked thru their own abuse either, head in the sand, that’s weakness not courage
My friends, there is but one way to Beverly deal with the problems that you have postulated. Stop considering the church as a large force in the society and start taking a look at the remnant. Or else Jesus wasted his breath and Matthew 24 and 25 telling us the conditions set for for people who will inherit the kingdom of God the people who are pictured are lonely persecuted and waiting for salvation. They are not the princes and the rulers in the oppressors. And their humility is so Christ-wrought that the world didn’t even think they were a factor. It is these people who fed him when he was hungry, etc. But just try getting on the speaker circuit with a message like that as a matter of fact we’re not gonna do it we’re going to the hungry ones.
Southern Baptist convention ain't no denomination. It's a loosely affiliated convention with lanyards and nametags. Basically, it's just a mission board really.
Luke 7 New International Version The Faith of the Centurion 7 When Jesus had finished saying all this to the people who were listening, he entered Capernaum. 2 There a centurion’s servant, whom his master valued highly, was sick and about to die. 3 The centurion heard of Jesus and sent some elders of the Jews to him, asking him to come and heal his servant. 4 When they came to Jesus, they pleaded earnestly with him, “This man deserves to have you do this, 5 because he loves our nation and has built our synagogue.” 6 So Jesus went with them. He was not far from the house when the centurion sent friends to say to him: “Lord, don’t trouble yourself, for I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. 7 That is why I did not even consider myself worthy to come to you. But say the word, and my servant will be healed. 8 For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes; and that one, ‘Come,’ and he comes. I say to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.” 9 When Jesus heard this, he was amazed at him, and turning to the crowd following him, he said, “I tell you, I have not found such great faith even in Israel.” 10 Then the men who had been sent returned to the house and found the servant well. Jesus Raises a Widow’s Son 11 Soon afterward, Jesus went to a town called Nain, and his disciples and a large crowd went along with him. 12 As he approached the town gate, a dead person was being carried out-the only son of his mother, and she was a widow. And a large crowd from the town was with her. 13 When the Lord saw her, his heart went out to her and he said, “Don’t cry.” 14 Then he went up and touched the bier they were carrying him on, and the bearers stood still. He said, “Young man, I say to you, get up!” 15 The dead man sat up and began to talk, and Jesus gave him back to his mother. 16 They were all filled with awe and praised God. “A great prophet has appeared among us,” they said. “God has come to help his people.” 17 This news about Jesus spread throughout Judea and the surrounding country. Jesus and John the Baptist 18 John’s disciples told him about all these things. Calling two of them, 19 he sent them to the Lord to ask, “Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?” 20 When the men came to Jesus, they said, “John the Baptist sent us to you to ask, ‘Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?’” 21 At that very time Jesus cured many who had diseases, sicknesses and evil spirits, and gave sight to many who were blind. 22 So he replied to the messengers, “Go back and report to John what you have seen and heard: The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy[a] are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor. 23 Blessed is anyone who does not stumble on account of me.” 24 After John’s messengers left, Jesus began to speak to the crowd about John: “What did you go out into the wilderness to see? A reed swayed by the wind? 25 If not, what did you go out to see? A man dressed in fine clothes? No, those who wear expensive clothes and indulge in luxury are in palaces. 26 But what did you go out to see? A prophet? Yes, I tell you, and more than a prophet. 27 This is the one about whom it is written: “‘I will send my messenger ahead of you, who will prepare your way before you.’[b] 28 I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.” 29 (All the people, even the tax collectors, when they heard Jesus’ words, acknowledged that God’s way was right, because they had been baptized by John. 30 But the Pharisees and the experts in the law rejected God’s purpose for themselves, because they had not been baptized by John.) 31 Jesus went on to say, “To what, then, can I compare the people of this generation? What are they like? 32 They are like children sitting in the marketplace and calling out to each other: “‘We played the pipe for you, and you did not dance; we sang a dirge, and you did not cry.’ 33 For John the Baptist came neither eating bread nor drinking wine, and you say, ‘He has a demon.’ 34 The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and you say, ‘Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners.’ 35 But wisdom is proved right by all her children.” Jesus Anointed by a Sinful Woman 36 When one of the Pharisees invited Jesus to have dinner with him, he went to the Pharisee’s house and reclined at the table. 37 A woman in that town who lived a sinful life learned that Jesus was eating at the Pharisee’s house, so she came there with an alabaster jar of perfume. 38 As she stood behind him at his feet weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears. Then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them and poured perfume on them. 39 When the Pharisee who had invited him saw this, he said to himself, “If this man were a prophet, he would know who is touching him and what kind of woman she is-that she is a sinner.” 40 Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to tell you.” “Tell me, teacher,” he said. 41 “Two people owed money to a certain moneylender. One owed him five hundred denarii,[c] and the other fifty. 42 Neither of them had the money to pay him back, so he forgave the debts of both. Now which of them will love him more?” 43 Simon replied, “I suppose the one who had the bigger debt forgiven.” “You have judged correctly,” Jesus said. 44 Then he turned toward the woman and said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I came into your house. You did not give me any water for my feet, but she wet my feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45 You did not give me a kiss, but this woman, from the time I entered, has not stopped kissing my feet. 46 You did not put oil on my head, but she has poured perfume on my feet. 47 Therefore, I tell you, her many sins have been forgiven-as her great love has shown. But whoever has been forgiven little loves little.” 48 Then Jesus said to her, “Your sins are forgiven.” 49 The other guests began to say among themselves, “Who is this who even forgives sins?” 50 Jesus said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.” Footnotes Luke 7:22 The Greek word traditionally translated leprosy was used for various diseases affecting the skin. Luke 7:27 Mal. 3:1 Luke 7:41 A denarius was the usual daily wage of a day laborer (see Matt. 20:2).
I have listened to this episode a few time. "There is no risk free time for integrity". Well said.
46:30 - So spot on. Thank you for saying it out loud. Having to play the game to belong and being shamed for basic trust of leaders who misuse and abuse authority in order to belong and be accepted IN A CHURCH is a sad and distorted. May there be resistance to this cultural push in the churches. "Toxic positivity" is destroying churches because of the harm not being willing to look at the hard stuff causes. Praying for people in roles of authority, that they lean into Jesus and not follow the crowd for gain.
Thank you to both of you. Despite the difficult things discussed, I am actually encouraged.
Me too! God is faithful.
The solution is encouraging. Love God and others more than our own self-interest. Trust God and believe He will
Do what He promised, continue to renew our minds through his Word, and pray!
I'm an atheist and I fully agree that tribalism and politicization are a large part of the problem. I have religious friends who had all sorts of ideas about what atheists were like before they met me, and I was the same towards them. Finding our common humanity is the way forward, whether you are religious or not.
Thanks for sharing this, Hugh.
I've come to value truth more than beliefs. Beliefs are usually propped up by an Intellectual Construct/Paradigm + Faith (which sometimes is only a notch or two away from delusion), however, Truth is shaped by Testing, Reality, Reproducibility, Criticism, Questioning, Humility, Curiosity...
Chris Silver🎉a rare voice of reason. Don't stop speaking truth to egos and lazy thinking🙏👍
However, truth claims are generally evaluated (embraced or rejected) by underlying belief filters.
For super clear historic example: the abortion issue. Everyone now knows (or can find and discover) scientific truth about the developing human life in the womb (unknown, merely speculated about in 1973). The fetus is “living” and its DNA is human. By any meaningful definition, the developing baby is a human life.
However, with a belief system predisposed to deny human life protections to the unborn, abortion advocates have done a sleight of hand for a generation to shift the issue of killing small living humans previously protected in the womb to a matter of “choice”.
So, as had been said a billion times by those with this belief system: “I support a woman’s right to choose…” And they never finish the grammatically impaired sentence. Who ends a sentences on a verb without an object? The implied object of course is (… choose) “to kill her developing baby.”
This is truth.
But belief systems blind people, as corollary to what you’ve correctly stated.
So we do want to pursue truth ! But we need to somehow be willing to submit our prior belief systems to truth.
History and biblical teaching affirm that people are generally unable to do this. We our slaves to our blindness. Scripture offers the solution: The Truth will set you free. Jesus is the way, the Truth, and the life. Once he opens our eyes, we can see truth that always existed but to which we were previously blind.
“Many of us like to ask ourselves, ‘What would I do if I was alive during slavery? Or the Jim Crow South? Or apartheid? What would I do if my country was committing genocide?’
“The answer is, you’re doing it. Right now.”
- Aaron Bushnell (RIP) 🛐
2serve4Christ. To a certain extent, Aaron’s words are true. And to a certain extent, Aaron’s actions were heroic. But ethics are seldom simple. Seldom one sided. He fought evil, true enough. But he also stood up for evil.
Those who fight slavery often end up bringing in a different kind of slavery in its wake. Those who fight racism often end up bringing in a different kind of racism. Those who fight apartheid and genocide the hardest often end up committing an apartheid or a genocide of their own.
I believe Jesus is alive! Amen
The book The Solution of Choice by Marcus Warner and Jim Wilder talks about how the church has went the way of the culture since the enlightenment. That may be the problem.
Jim Wilder! Worth reading and listening to.
“Many of us like to ask ourselves, ‘What would I do if I was alive during slavery? Or the Jim Crow South? Or apartheid? What would I do if my country was committing genocide?’
The answer is, you’re doing it. Right now.”
- Aaron Bushnell (RIP) 🛐
His assessment is so very true. Often times the small minority is loud and obnoxious and they exhaust the rest to oblivion.
It was a very small minority within the SBC that stood up to systematic racism. They were considered loud and obnoxious by the SBC.
true.
@@Erdos777
It’s important not to take up other people’s offenses while calling it caring about justice.
If you do not focus on Jesus' word, you are not a Christian.
Can you invite someone on the other side of RM’s experience when he left the SBC? There is always two sides.
I'm late to this interview, but I found it to be so vague. I wanted to learn why culture is rejecting the church and why Russell left the SBC. I don't think I learned either. Using the word "toxic" and "ideologies", but not providing specifics left me scratching my head. Maybe I'm either not on the inside, or it's above my intellect.
Gossip. That’s all this former Southern Baptist and editor of the liberal Christianity Today magazine can do now that he’s gone woke. To think that we used to value his opinion!
If the current political climate continues and morphs into something more sinister, disciples of Jesus may be forced into an exodus from many of the sectarian traditions which they have cherished. Those denominational traditions from which they flee will have become that “world” which they were warned about in their youth.
God warned us to beware of wolves in sheep’s clothing. Megan Basham reveals who the wolves are and who is funding them in her new book, Shepherd for Sale.
Eddie Munster! Love seeing child actors be successful later in life.
The tragedy to me in this interview is how obviously absent scripture is. A few reference paraphrases, but nothing really solid.
As far as the answer to the young lady in college with " nicer" unbelieving friends.,... well that is most likely because the young lady was not revealing Jesus Christ in True representation.
Here's some scripture: Matthew 6
32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.
Stop being backed into a corner to defend the obvious. The world loves people that are like them. That proves nothing! There's nothing for me as a Christian to defend here. What you will not find in the world is people sincerely loving their enemies. The world loves people who agree with them. This is so obvious! Those "sweet, nice, kind" worldly friends were still gossiping behind people's back, competing ( though perhaps very cunningly) for recognition above their peers, willing to be passive towards a "friend" when they came to competing interests, etc. So stop allowing this " buddist are nicer" baloney. They hate the True God and they hate you for loving the True God. Only if they are being drawn by the Truth of the Gospel will they hang around a True Spirit filled follower of Jesus Christ.
John 14:23
Is the Love of Jesus Christ and His Father enough for you in these last days? Remember that lots of people in " the church" are of the world and not of the Father in Heaven. Terrible times are here.
Hebrews 13:5 "I will never leave you". We can confidently say " The Lord is my helper"
Most American men have compromised so much for so long they are so off course they don't know what is up or what is down. Sadly many of these men are "pastors, teachers, administrators," leading their families and many people in the wrong direction.
Read Jeremiah and Ezekiel.... nothing new.
I am in my mid-eighties and thankful for the good in my Southern Baptist upbringing, but left in the 1960's after graduating from an excellent Baptist liberal arts college and finding the denomination to be on the wrong side of scholarship, ministry, social justice, the spiritual life and more. I didn't leave belief, but the Southern Baptist denomination that became an impediment to faith and the practice of faith. I didn't feel rage or anger, but disgust with what the Southern Baptist denomination has become. It is now an instrument of white nationalism that prefers the southern culture to Jesus and is doing harm to his message. It's embrace of the immoral, unethical, corrupt, Trump as God's anointed tells me they have forsaken Jesus.
Whatever you do, please don’t allow those memories to embitter you. I did just that with my early memories of my involvement with Christianity.
Jesus is Orange according to RINO Senators
Don't know anyone rejecting their church.
Why not become CBFer Dr. Moore?
Heres something new. The story of Jesus changing water into wine is a prophecy. It concerns the loss of faith in Jesus. I wish I could tell someone about it.
Perhaps it’s a matter of whether we’ll act on what Jesus taught, or keep responding with an endless stream of “yes, but…” arguments.
Russell Moore, shocking that you would dare to speak after what you did to the southern Baptist convention. Especially, as I understand from John Whitehead interviews the two letters you released to do damage that apparently weren’t quite accurate.
I would note that the cartoonish stereotypes of non-believers are not new. That has been going on in earnest since the rise of the Moral Majority in the Reagan era. Given that Reaganism itself was fueled by exactly the angry nostalgia Dr. Moore describes here, current circumstances are wholly unsurprising.
"Why Culture is Rejecting the Church and Leaving the SBC." I listened to this from beginning to end and really did not get an answer to the question. There were a lot of Kumbaya moments about how we can get along with atheists, agnostics, and secularists but nothing about why the SBC is losing people. The problem is minor in the SBC compared to the mainline denominations. I did a detailed study of the loss of members within the 7 mainline groups since 1985 in graduate school, and the numbers are astounding. Most have lost 2/3 of their members and attendance is even more startling. They have done an excellent job relating to the non-churched culture and are losing members so fast that it is hard to keep the data current. The reasons for the decline across the board are complex and barely touched on in this video. The most important reason is not your list of church ills, which are important to discuss. The reason is a general disinterest and disdain for religion, especially organized religion. Is corruption, celebrity pastors, tribalism, and hypocrisy a problem? Sure, but those have always been around to one degree or another. It is that people hate the God of the Bible and have made a god after their own image that they like and that agrees with them. They may or may not call it god, but it is, and it enables them to form a worldview that tells them, "You're OK. Be yourself and everything will be all right." There are still many churches that are growing and thriving and not because they have a great band. It is because they preach Christ and Him crucified and that he has a claim on each human life he created. He's the boss. People really don't like to hear that but lots of them are being saved.
Thankful to be part of an SBC church and contributing member of the Cooperative program. Also thankful that Russel Moore is no longer a part of the SBC and especially no longer head of the ERLC. We are much better off without him!
That just sounds bitter
Doesn’t sound bitter at all
We just joined a SBC church after attending a huge nondenominational church for decades. We love the conservative values and excellent Bible teaching we’re getting now. Once our old church got progressive, they started getting squishy on what the Bible said and we didn’t fit in anymore.
Good riddance to pastors like Russell Moore and egotistical women like Beth Moore.
How abt SBC womanizer men of the congregation?
Small amounts of people have turned the world around in history. Christ and 12 Apostles, Churchill and so many other instances. The issue is you are speaking in general terms about politics of the Church or whatnot. You took stances on Trump, whatever term you'd like for what is called wokeism and others and others didn't agree with you. It isn't a small number. If you or Chandler or whomever believed YOU were/are 'racists' then that's your personal issue but to imply everyone is reading hearts and you can't do that.
"They didn't know how to do children's ministry, so they just taught us the Bible!" Russell Moore
I love Russell Moore!
That's what childrens ministry is. Teaching children lies about reality.
@@Gfish17No, that spot is firmly locked up by the public educators.
@@chaddonal4331 Telling children that a space dwelling entity made the world in its image without any Evidence to back it up is Lying!
If you want to teach children that a space dwelling entity exists and it creates stuff then you need to provide evidence of your claim and let the process of peer review happen.
After no one can disprove you're evidence and the vetting process is complete and you're god claims get vetted then you can teach children about God in such a capacity.
Right now all you have is the Bible and nothing of substance.
@@Gfish17 You are mistaking categories, so you are unable to see appropriate evidence, exactly as the Bible prophesied. Your spiritual blindness actually confirms biblical claims about the inability to see reality.
You are taking a scientific evidentiary foundational approach based on naturalism, a closed system you imagine yourself capable to evaluate. However, the most basic foundational claim of a biblical worldview is that the world is supernatural, and that all things are under control of a primary spiritual being who is invisible, and is perceived spiritually. You do not judge Him. You are accountable to Him and He will stand in judgement of you.
You are imagining in your closed evidentiary naturalistic system that three dimensions can account for a fourth dimension, which is both impossible and illegitimate. (Just as the best astronomers and physics scientists know almost nothing about dark matter which might be 90% of the universe. We rightly stand in awe and humility of what we cannot comprehend).
Scripture claims that God’s ways are higher than our ways, and that spiritual truth and realities are spiritually discerned.
You may suppose that seeing (“evidence”) produces faith, but it is the opposite. God calls the humble, we respond in faith, and in our belief, we begin to see. In pride, people reject God‘s calling, refuse to believe, and therefore, not seeing, you remain in your blindness. This is basic teaching of Jesus.
If you want to listen to some brilliant people (scientists, philosophers) who establish justifiable rationale for spiritual belief that some skeptics have found to be persuasive, then check out the likes of: Reasons to Believe, William Lane Craig, and John Lennox for starters.
But I guarantee, even though these men can run intellectual circles around most skeptics, and are among the most brilliant people alive, you will likely miss their argumentation and mock them, unless you humble yourself before God, and seek to actually be a seeker. God will not be mocked, and will not reveal himself to mockers. As Proverbs states: “The beginning of knowledge is the fear of the Lord. Fools despise wisdom and instruction.”
And Hebrews 11:6
”But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.“
Churches are getting too big and no one really knows the Senior Pastor and there’s not good accountability, we elevate Pastors to celebrity status, we need to have perhaps 3 pastors leading together, not one. People don’t want to see or hear about abuse as it’s too hard and perhaps they haven’t worked thru their own abuse either, head in the sand, that’s weakness not courage
Yes! Plural elders, smaller churches, real accountability!
My friends, there is but one way to Beverly deal with the problems that you have postulated. Stop considering the church as a large force in the society and start taking a look at the remnant. Or else Jesus wasted his breath and Matthew 24 and 25 telling us the conditions set for for people who will inherit the kingdom of God the people who are pictured are lonely persecuted and waiting for salvation. They are not the princes and the rulers in the oppressors. And their humility is so Christ-wrought that the world didn’t even think they were a factor. It is these people who fed him when he was hungry, etc. But just try getting on the speaker circuit with a message like that as a matter of fact we’re not gonna do it we’re going to the hungry ones.
Southern Baptist convention ain't no denomination. It's a loosely affiliated convention with lanyards and nametags. Basically, it's just a mission board really.
Luke 7
New International Version
The Faith of the Centurion
7 When Jesus had finished saying all this to the people who were listening, he entered Capernaum. 2 There a centurion’s servant, whom his master valued highly, was sick and about to die. 3 The centurion heard of Jesus and sent some elders of the Jews to him, asking him to come and heal his servant. 4 When they came to Jesus, they pleaded earnestly with him, “This man deserves to have you do this, 5 because he loves our nation and has built our synagogue.” 6 So Jesus went with them.
He was not far from the house when the centurion sent friends to say to him: “Lord, don’t trouble yourself, for I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. 7 That is why I did not even consider myself worthy to come to you. But say the word, and my servant will be healed. 8 For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes; and that one, ‘Come,’ and he comes. I say to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.”
9 When Jesus heard this, he was amazed at him, and turning to the crowd following him, he said, “I tell you, I have not found such great faith even in Israel.” 10 Then the men who had been sent returned to the house and found the servant well.
Jesus Raises a Widow’s Son
11 Soon afterward, Jesus went to a town called Nain, and his disciples and a large crowd went along with him. 12 As he approached the town gate, a dead person was being carried out-the only son of his mother, and she was a widow. And a large crowd from the town was with her. 13 When the Lord saw her, his heart went out to her and he said, “Don’t cry.”
14 Then he went up and touched the bier they were carrying him on, and the bearers stood still. He said, “Young man, I say to you, get up!” 15 The dead man sat up and began to talk, and Jesus gave him back to his mother.
16 They were all filled with awe and praised God. “A great prophet has appeared among us,” they said. “God has come to help his people.” 17 This news about Jesus spread throughout Judea and the surrounding country.
Jesus and John the Baptist
18 John’s disciples told him about all these things. Calling two of them, 19 he sent them to the Lord to ask, “Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?”
20 When the men came to Jesus, they said, “John the Baptist sent us to you to ask, ‘Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?’”
21 At that very time Jesus cured many who had diseases, sicknesses and evil spirits, and gave sight to many who were blind. 22 So he replied to the messengers, “Go back and report to John what you have seen and heard: The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy[a] are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor. 23 Blessed is anyone who does not stumble on account of me.”
24 After John’s messengers left, Jesus began to speak to the crowd about John: “What did you go out into the wilderness to see? A reed swayed by the wind? 25 If not, what did you go out to see? A man dressed in fine clothes? No, those who wear expensive clothes and indulge in luxury are in palaces. 26 But what did you go out to see? A prophet? Yes, I tell you, and more than a prophet. 27 This is the one about whom it is written:
“‘I will send my messenger ahead of you,
who will prepare your way before you.’[b]
28 I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.”
29 (All the people, even the tax collectors, when they heard Jesus’ words, acknowledged that God’s way was right, because they had been baptized by John. 30 But the Pharisees and the experts in the law rejected God’s purpose for themselves, because they had not been baptized by John.)
31 Jesus went on to say, “To what, then, can I compare the people of this generation? What are they like? 32 They are like children sitting in the marketplace and calling out to each other:
“‘We played the pipe for you,
and you did not dance;
we sang a dirge,
and you did not cry.’
33 For John the Baptist came neither eating bread nor drinking wine, and you say, ‘He has a demon.’ 34 The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and you say, ‘Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners.’ 35 But wisdom is proved right by all her children.”
Jesus Anointed by a Sinful Woman
36 When one of the Pharisees invited Jesus to have dinner with him, he went to the Pharisee’s house and reclined at the table. 37 A woman in that town who lived a sinful life learned that Jesus was eating at the Pharisee’s house, so she came there with an alabaster jar of perfume. 38 As she stood behind him at his feet weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears. Then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them and poured perfume on them.
39 When the Pharisee who had invited him saw this, he said to himself, “If this man were a prophet, he would know who is touching him and what kind of woman she is-that she is a sinner.”
40 Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to tell you.”
“Tell me, teacher,” he said.
41 “Two people owed money to a certain moneylender. One owed him five hundred denarii,[c] and the other fifty. 42 Neither of them had the money to pay him back, so he forgave the debts of both. Now which of them will love him more?”
43 Simon replied, “I suppose the one who had the bigger debt forgiven.”
“You have judged correctly,” Jesus said.
44 Then he turned toward the woman and said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I came into your house. You did not give me any water for my feet, but she wet my feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45 You did not give me a kiss, but this woman, from the time I entered, has not stopped kissing my feet. 46 You did not put oil on my head, but she has poured perfume on my feet. 47 Therefore, I tell you, her many sins have been forgiven-as her great love has shown. But whoever has been forgiven little loves little.”
48 Then Jesus said to her, “Your sins are forgiven.”
49 The other guests began to say among themselves, “Who is this who even forgives sins?”
50 Jesus said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”
Footnotes
Luke 7:22 The Greek word traditionally translated leprosy was used for various diseases affecting the skin.
Luke 7:27 Mal. 3:1
Luke 7:41 A denarius was the usual daily wage of a day laborer (see Matt. 20:2).
Sodom and Gomorrah sound familiar, same course, we all know the ending