Mark, I’m looking at this four years later, and it shows me how to ‘convert’ my own little Ryobi band Saw. Thanks for all the great detail mate 👍 Robert
Thanks. If I were to do this again I would probably use a gearbox with a 20:1 ratio rather than the 30:1 that I used. I should also get some blades with a coarser pitch for thicker materials. However it has worked well and I have never broken a blade or had a blade come off the wheels. The laser is a gimmick and I now find it annoying. It tends to be too bright and it makes it hard to see the line. Maybe a red filter would be useful to cut down the brightness. Regards, Mark
It's nice to see some light at the end of the tunnel. It's also a gamble submitting two videos of a build like this. If it's a complete failure you sort of need to own up and admit defeat.
I would have either chosen round stock for the blade guides, or rounded the edges of the square stock. That’s cause I be more lazy then you. I think brass is ideal. Seen many that used phenolic. Worked great. You are what I wished I had for an industrial arts teacher. One was similar in that he was involved and a great guy. The other was a lazy wood shop drone who assigned me to instruct the students for everything that he was deficient in……..which was all of metal working, which was the name of the class. But you have to know what is going on to teach, so I really profited from the experience. Last paying job was teaching Aircraft Maintenance, which required a federally licensed mechanic to instruct. Guess I figured it out along the way. Great stuff here, appreciate your sharing
Thanks for watching. The brass has worked quite well and I copied the mechanism from a very old wood bandsaw which has a much higher blade speed. It seemed to work OK so I figured it would work for the metal bandsaw. Regards, Mark
Prezza ! pall! Mate ! Comrade ! Great job.... I bought a brandnew Scheppach wood cutting bandsaw and did pretty much the same to it... The wheels were sturdy and wide enough, so I didn't have to make new ones. The reduction I bought had a motor attached to it. I have three phase, so I pretty much bolted it straight into the spot where the original motor was. It had a few 100 watt more than the original motor. I use a 12 tpi bi-metal blade and this thing works great. The only thing I still want to change is the table. That is die cast aluminium and I have a mind to bolt a 5 mm steel plate on top of that (the casting is quite substantial, not flimsy) But this indeed a great way of having a metal cutting bandsaw for little outlay, even when you buy all the stuff new, you barely come to a 1/4 of the price. No Worries! Paddy
Paddy, I still have to make a new table for mine. It really is too flimsy for cutting metal. I find it springs quite a lot when the joint in the blade passes through the stock. I want to cast an aluminium replacement to keep the weight down. I have to store the saw on top of a tall metal cabinet and my arms are like pipe cleaners. The struggle is real! 😁
Mr Mike, I agree. I had heard this works, however I was not sure as I thought it may be a wives tale. Glad to hear it does work. Excellent work as usual Mark, Thanks for bringing us along on the journey. Cheers all from John, Australia.
@@toni1907 Yes that kind of works. Have a look at where the motor will end up if you go down this path. There is what looks like a dust extraction port to clear so larger offset or move the port to the other side and it needs to be able to open. If this is/were an option then you have the motor sticking out the front of the band saw, less compact for storage. If going this path then the shaft from the reduction box will have to be extended a long way putting a huge amount more of load on most of the lower part of the drive/blade system. That is bearings and chassis. Just my thoughts, John.
@@joandar1 what i meant was put shaft in other side of gearbox turn over that way shaft raises stragt up to top of box in place of the bottom where it is now
Toni, I didn't really want to mess with the gearbox. I had a look and it seems like it has been designed to be sort of modular and that means that some of the seals, mountings and bearing surfaces are probably interchangeable. At the end of the day, reversing the armature in the motor was a pretty easy fix. The motor has no warranty but the gearbox does! 😁
Thank you for sharing your metal working journey. And here I always thought you Aussies were all about beer and barbecues, along the same lines as us Canadians with beer and hockey. LOL . Excellent work on the sandblasting gun, and on this project. I have full confidence you will get this one too. 👍👍👍
I was lucky enough to work with a teacher and some students from Winnipeg, Manitoba. We were working on a joint technology project back in 2009 and we met up in a hotel in London prior to the competition. Within an hour of meeting, the teacher and I were drinking beer in the bar and the 6 students on the team were playing hockey in the corridors on the 5th floor. 😀 My wife and I have been to Canada twice in the past two years. We loved every minute of it. Such nice people and your country is so different to ours. PS: I like barbecues too! Regards, Mark
I had exactly the same setup on my wood bandsaw although I think the square blocks were bronze. We had a large Woodfast saw at work with brass plate guides and it copped a hiding from kids using it but it gave a really long surface contact to the side of the blade. I changed my wood bandsaw over to "cool blocks" a while ago but I haven't noticed a great deal of improvement over the original configuration. Regards, Mark
Hi Mark ! Very nice video - thx for sharing ... oh, I loe that size of band saw - "table-size" and I'm surely gonna make one myself too ! Motor - I don't knaow about motors in Australia, but here in Denmark you can get a nice 3 phase 400/240V second hand for 10 US$ - so no need for feedling around too much with that ;-) It's so nice to see your castings come out so well with just the right amount af machining - they look very prof, I think ! Now I'll go and prepare some drawinds for chassis, patterns for wheels and so in Fusion360 and then 3D-print my first patterns ! Please make a playlist for this project and sure many will want to see it ! Thx !
How's Brexit going? It's interesting to watch the news each night here in the colonies. Seems like such a mess. I wonder how the pollies get the time to actually run the country.
Adding a nice thick plate steel stiffener into the drive section would help control tensioning deflection on the frame. Also, it would allow you to move the gear box forward in the frame cavity; just need to mill a cutout for it to pass through. Of course; as small as the saw is and availability of scrap metal; welding up a new frame doesn't seem all that unreasonable either.
I have a nice big piece of 6mm hot rolled steel plate just the right size to go in the back plate of the saw body but I want to try aligning the wheels accurately first. If that fails I will be strengthening the back plate. I am trying not to add too much weight to the saw since I will have to store it off my welding bench. I have just about run out of places to mount machines permanently. 😥
Nice project. I believe you have tons more money and certainly hours into this than simply purchasing such a metal band-saw. However, you seem to be like me and love doing things like this, and therefore the price and labor doesn't matter. Thumbs Up!
Gary, I had already purchased a metal cutting bandsaw that only operates as a cutoff saw. It does a great job but it won't tilt up far enough to allow for fitting of a horizontal table like some of the larger metal cutting saws. I thought it was a bit of a stretch to convince my wife that I needed a second metal cutting saw. The other fun fact was that I was telling my mate this sorry tale when he dug out this wreck from under his bench and gifted it to me. It seemed a little churlish to just toss it in the bin without making some effort to use it's constituent parts. As you have observed I have plenty of time (now that I am retired) so I don't begrudge the labour aspect. Regards, Mark Presling
Thanks. I only found out about these collet blocks by watching other TH-cam makers. I have two. One for hex and one for square. The technique for offsetting stock for eccentric turning came to me one morning when I was struggling with trying to do it in the 4 jaw chuck without the collet block. It can be done but it is just that much harder. Regards, Mark Presling
@@Preso58 I have the same ER32 collet blocks, but it never occurred to me to use them in lathe chucks. I just use them for mill work. Using the square one for offset work on a lathe is a great idea; especially when more than one part needs to be turned with the same offset. Your idea can save a lot of time. Thanks again for sharing it. I have an ER32 collet lathe chuck, but it's a pain to switch out for small projects. I'm going to try the collet blocks next time.
Capi Berra, I have wanted a small metal cutting bandsaw for such a long time. I have a large supply of thin sheet aluminium, steel and stainless steel. It's mostly stock up to about 3mm thick and I use it for lots of fabrication. However it is such a pain to cut up. I have a plasma cutter which does a really good job but it is a chore to set it up and my shop is tight on space so I have to put it away each time I have finished with it. A little bandsaw like this one can be set up on the bench in minutes and it is a lot easier to see what you are doing. I am almost ready to reassemble the whole machine for the last time. I spent most of today doing all the finishing processes on the new parts. Lots of sandblasting, polishing, powder coating, zinc plating and anodising. I want it to look good! Regards, Mark Presling
Mark, This is another very interesting video! As far as your lower wheel/blade tracking, could it be a combination of the blade tension pulling up the "rigid" lower wheel & also the weight of the gearbox & motor? They may be teaming up against you because both look (to me) like they could cause the tracking problem in the direction that you are having.
Hi MARK. That is looking very promising, and redesigning something takes time for sure. I have done a few myself. Taking a broken or poorly made item and making it useful again is rewarding, at least for me. Thanks again for another great video! P.S. by all means sand blast that thing and make it look “ purrdy “ especially after all the sweat, blood and tears put into the sand blaster. 😆
Gary, I have to somehow justify buying the "stuff" that goes into my shed. My wife is very tolerant but I suspect she sometimes questions why I really needed a giant red box with gloves sticking out of it! Regards, Mark
Very good progress. I do like the slow speed you now have with the correct gearmotor. I think the blade guides could have been machined from a block of aluminium. I have a 17in wood cutting bandsaw. The rear of the blade guide is a bearing on its side like your original guides, so the back of the blade engages on the rim of the bearing. Not desirable, but likely designed to save space in the guide. It works, but I would have preferred engaging on the outer race like your guide design. Dave.
I was questioning my decision to cast the body of the blade guides. I had some 40mm square 6011 alloy all ready to go but I was still experimenting with cored casting and decided that it was worth trying to cast them with the voids. As it turned out only one of the cored castings were used and I cast a second one with no cores for the finished upper guide. I have never liked the design with the blade rubbing on the rim of the bearing. It always seems like a compromise and must set up a lot of friction. We had a machine like this at work and the resonance set up by the scraping action made the saw sound like a shrieking banshee! Regards, Mark
FYI the tracking crown on a bandsaw is not the same as a say conveyor belt. The bandsaw width includes the teeth which offer no tension factor and therefore the blade with say a 1/3 width gullet depth means the centre of the blade tension is 2/3 the width away from the tooth tip. Thats why your bottom wheel has the teeth hanging off the front edge. In short move the wheel crown backward.
I do recall watching a very good video on how to tune a wood bandsaw and it included the advice you are offering. As it turns out though, the blade has done a lot of work (I am actually on my second blade now) and it seems to track well and has not given me any problems. There's always something to learn though so thanks for the info. Regards, Mark
In the opening sequences where the blade is shown cutting the metal the blade looks to me like it is mounted upside-down down (teeth pointed up), is that just the “video” and me seeing or imagining that? Thanks for the very interesting fix and information on the motor. I’m eagerly waiting to see your fix on the blade tracking on the lower wheel. Any observations on possible flex of the sheet metal frame when the blade is tensioned? The finishing touches should include some or your trade mark art deco embellishments.
It is just a trick of the video frame rate. I was watching the video shortly after I published it and had myself totally convinced that the blade was in fact upside down. I actually went down to the shed to check. I should have just trusted myself since there is no way the blade would cut if it were reversed. I have marked out a large piece of 6mm steel plate to reinforce the back frame of the saw but I still need to do some realignment of the lower wheel before I go ahead and make any changes to the frame. I suspect that all I need is a spacer to bring the top and bottom wheels into the same plane. I have made some artwork for a new brass maker's plate with a few vintage touches. It will replace the horrid "GMC" brand on the saw at the moment. Regards, Mark
G’day Mark, you’re a cut above the rest. As you mentioned those brass guides don’t have to be square, is it one of those times where you get too committed then think I should have spent a coupla bucks on some round! Square holes aren’t fun even in aluminium. Cheers Peter
I just like making things difficult for myself. I couldn't buy 10mm square brass stock either. I had to machine it from 1/2" stock. I only tried to order the brass after I had cast in the 10mm square hole. Like I said in the vid, this whole adventure is a prototype. If I were making another one it would look quite different. Still, it's fun trying to anticipate the next step in the process. Regards, Mark
Preso, very nice job on reversing the motor. I was thinking to reverse the reduction worm drive, by flipping the gear box mounting, with worm drive on top side of the gear box. It would of raised the center of gravity by having electric motor up higher, but in may of been easier. You would of have to swap sides of the output shaft as well. Would that of been possible to do with that reduction gear box? Also I guess the worm gear should be mounted at the bottom for the oil to lubricate it, or it it lubricated with greased? But i like your method, as it keeps the CoG lower.
I considered altering the gearbox but at the end of the day, the gearbox has a warranty but the motor doesn't. If I started breaking down the gearbox and if failed prematurely I would just have to toss it!
Hey Prezzo, loving ur work. Has anyone told you that you could pass as a sound double for Jon over at Superhouse/Freetronics??? Anyway I'm sure it's just my eyes deceiving me, but it sure looks like the blade is upside down when you are cutting the aluminium/steel. I know it can't be cause it wouldn't cut but???
David, you are correct and that is why the motor reverse is shown towards the end of the video. If you hold enough downward pressure you can do things in the Southern Hemisphere, lol. Cheers from John, Australia.
Hey John, as they say today "my bad" x 2. I totally forgot about the reversing of the motor that Mark only spent half the video explaining!!! Some people are slow learners lol. Also as you said you can do thing in the Southern Hemisphere... when you live here you tend to forget the "Down Under" & upside down effect. It fits perfectly with the concept of mounting the blade upside down ;)
David, I guess all us Aussies sound the same! I just checked out Jon's channel and will have to go back and look at some more. He seems to be offering some interesting stuff. Many people have commented that I had the blade reversed but it is just a trick of the video frame rate. It certainly wouldn't cut if it were reversed.
Hi Mark. You mention that you think that the hole in the gearbox appeared to be tapered. I'm wondering if in fact it was a morse 2 taper because the weird sizing of 14.7mm may indicate that. (I just went thru a similar exercise making a locating lug for my new rotary table and I thought it weird that it had a 14.43mm hole. As it turns out, it was in fact a morse 2 taper. Great info on this conversion.
I must say, I didn't even check that. Now that you mention it the company selling these gearboxes also sell a lot of equipment for CNC conversions and the like. The hole wasn't deep enough for a full MT2 though. I assumed it was so that any misalignment between the coupling and an output shaft would be taken care of. In any case the gearbox is still functioning really well. Regards, Mark
@@Preso58 the rotary table doesn't have a full depth Morse 2 taper either. A mate suggested it may be, and it was. I use mine in the quill to quickly locate the centre of the table. Works a treat.
I have been looking into converting a wood band saw to metal for some time, and your video is exactly what I need. I have already rushed out and ordered all sorts of parts (as is usual for me) and will be copying your build as closely as possible. One question is, would you consider selling castings of the wheels? The rest is easy enough to do in other ways, but the wheels are a bit more tricky (particularly the bottom one). Another option I thought might be to make aluminium inserts and weld up the holes in the factory wheels for strength. Anyway, thanks for your videos, very inspiring.
Rohan, I would try the stock wheels first. The ones that came with my GMC saw were very flimsy and only had three spokes. The Ryobi and Ozitio ones that I had seen at the hardware supplier were a little stronger looking. The main issue was the bottom wheel which needed quite a large boss to offset it enough from the gearbox spindle. It might be possible to just machine up a spacer for this.I am not really in the business of selling parts but you might be able to find someone who does aluminium casting who cam make up some castings for you. Regards, Mark
Mark Presling thanks Mark, I thought it would be a long shot, but you never know unless you ask. My machine (which I don’t have yet) appears to be of the generic Chinese variety and according to the pictures has the flimsy looking 3 spoke wheels. I’ll have a closer look when it arrives.
Awesome conversion!! We have an old Craftsman that I would like to convert over to metal cutting, now I have some Ideas for the conversion, thanks. I was wondering if you could add some various thousand thickness shims to the bottom bolts of the reduction box in order to get the bottom of the lower pulley to move inward for better tracking. Great video!
Craig, That is what I was thinking and then I did some checks and found that the bottom wheel was about 3mm inboard of the top wheel. I am not sure how that happened because I did all sorts of measurements and checks before I committed to machining the extension shaft for the gearbox. I am going to make a spacer to realign the two wheels tomorrow and if that doesn't work I will shim and strengthen the mounting for the gearbox. Surprisingly, the blade still tracks OK and it still cuts metal as it is!
Many people have told me that but I currently own a large commercially made 7 X 12 metal cutting bandsaw and it has cast iron wheels with plain machined surfaces for the blade to ride on. My smaller horizontal bandsaw also commercially made and purchased as a new machine is also the same but it has aluminium wheels. In my view the blade has a different geometry to wood cutting bandsaws and also the material is usually a bi metal construction which holds its edge much longer. There is also a lot more tension on a metal cutting blade and it may damage a rubberised wheel very quickly. Regards, Mark
how did cnc converting this mini mill work for you? everywhere i read, they say its horrendous because of the huge backlash of the leadscrews? are you having videos on it?
Sharky, The only change I have made to the saw is to use the Nema34 gearbox to reduce the shaft speed of the existing induction motor. It is not a CNC conversion. I am not sure why you think it is a CNC saw? Regards, Mark
Another great project. Do you think that the gearbox will handle the torque of a 7.5 amp (120v) or 1 HP on a typical 14 inch wood band saw , which are readily available used? Metal band saws are much harder to come by.
Stephen, The gearbox that I purchased seems to be quite well made and it appears to be filled with oil or grease. There is a filler plug in the body so I am guessing it is well lubricated. The gear reduction might mean that the torque at the motor will be way less than if it were driving the bandsaw wheel at normal wood cutting speeds. So at least the input end of the gearbox is going to feel a lot less stressed than the output end. I would think that for the outlay (around $135 Australian, that's probably about $15 US 😁) it is worth a try. Regards, Mark
Hi! Nice work! We seem to share interrests/hobby. I cast aluminium and bronze. I'm more into "micro-casting". Currently I try to make a 1:4 scale v8 ferrari engine. -Struggeling to make the main engine block, but will try with "epoxy sand" insted of oil sand. The engine top are ok, using oil sand, but imagine the water chamber inside the engine block.. Very difficult! Are you from New Zealand or Australia? I'm Norwegian. Best Regards, Arild
Arild, I live in Queensland, Australia. My father was born in Wellington, New Zealand and my son lives and works there now. I am guessing you are a Ferrari fan so you must be ecstatic about Charles Le Clerc's win in Monza. I must say, I was a bit happy that he took the win from Mercedes. And Danny Ric got in the points too. The only type of engine I have not built yet is an internal combustion type. I am keen to have a go though. As you say, the complexity of the castings and the camshaft with it's associated gearing has put me off. I would love to see how you tackle the casting for the engine block. If you put it up on TH-cam, let me know. Regards, Mark Presling
That is correct. It is more like a rail but another viewer confirmed that a mitre attachment could be mounted on it. I have just made up a wooden pattern to cast a new aluminium table and it will have a milled slot for the mitre attachment. That pressed steel table is way to flimsy for the blade loading. Regards, Preso
Be careful with the blade guides, chamfer the corners and give enough clearance so the guide the blade and not machine it. I ruined a brand new blade in the wink of an eye when I got handy adjusting the guides on a bandsaw at work.
vel wheel. I did a lot of cutting today on the saw. A viewer who lives locally gave me about 18 kg of 2 and 3mm brass sheets that are leftovers from his CNC plasma cutter. So far the brass blade guides have held up well with no sign of wear. My biggest issue is the table which is way too flimsy. I have made up a wooden pattern so I can cast a new aluminium one. The viewer who gave me the brass has a massive industrial wood bandsaw, (you'll see it on an upcoming video) and I was surprised that it had aluminium blade guides! Regards, Mark Presling
Yes, I hadn't thought of that though! I still have a few checks to do before I change the setup. I spent ages measuring the blade position and the mountings for the blade guides before I committed to machining everything. I was a little surprised and disappointed when I ran out of adjustment on the eccentrics. I stripped everything down after I posted the video and checked again and now it appears that the design was correct to start with. Maybe I just hadn't assembled everything correctly when I shot the video. I feel confident that I can get it right though. It's always good to hear suggestions because despite how clever I think I am there is always someone who has fresh eyes on my project who will point out an overlooked aspect of the design. Regards, Mark
I take the view of Stefan Gotteswinter who regards cheap Chinese goods as a "kit of parts". I was actually considering building a saw from scratch but this machine was given to me as scrap and I felt it was worth trying to rescue it from the rubbish skip. Regards, Mark
No, the blade is not running in reverse. It just looks that way because of the video frame rate. The nut on the guide is loose. I cannot set these permanently because the bottom wheel is still misaligned. I have to make up a spacer to ensure that the top and bottom wheels are in the same plane. Regards, Mark Presling
I could not find a small metal cutting bandsaw that I could lift onto the top of a storage cupboard where it lives most of the time. I only take it down when I have a job for it. I have limited space in my workshop and as much as I would like to have an industrial style metal cutting bandsaw, I just don't have the room. Also, the project was as much about the challenge as it was about having a means of cutting up small pieces of stock. Even if the saw turned out to be a total failure, I will have still learned something. Regards, Mark
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Mark,
I’m looking at this four years later, and it shows me how to ‘convert’ my own little Ryobi band Saw.
Thanks for all the great detail mate 👍
Robert
Thanks. If I were to do this again I would probably use a gearbox with a 20:1 ratio rather than the 30:1 that I used. I should also get some blades with a coarser pitch for thicker materials. However it has worked well and I have never broken a blade or had a blade come off the wheels. The laser is a gimmick and I now find it annoying. It tends to be too bright and it makes it hard to see the line. Maybe a red filter would be useful to cut down the brightness.
Regards,
Mark
@@Preso58
Advice noted 👍
Always impressive. Very few people I know would even attempt half of what you do on projects. Thanks for sharing.
Thanx for sharing, good to see the job being done, instead of being explained and not understanding what your doing
I begin to see your vision, for what you want it to do I believe it will work. Well done Mark, your dogged determination is once again bearing fruit.👍
It's nice to see some light at the end of the tunnel. It's also a gamble submitting two videos of a build like this. If it's a complete failure you sort of need to own up and admit defeat.
I would have either chosen round stock for the blade guides, or rounded the edges of the square stock. That’s cause I be more lazy then you. I think brass is ideal. Seen many that used phenolic. Worked great. You are what I wished I had for an industrial arts teacher. One was similar in that he was involved and a great guy. The other was a lazy wood shop drone who assigned me to instruct the students for everything that he was deficient in……..which was all of metal working, which was the name of the class. But you have to know what is going on to teach, so I really profited from the experience. Last paying job was teaching Aircraft Maintenance, which required a federally licensed mechanic to instruct. Guess I figured it out along the way. Great stuff here, appreciate your sharing
Thanks for watching. The brass has worked quite well and I copied the mechanism from a very old wood bandsaw which has a much higher blade speed. It seemed to work OK so I figured it would work for the metal bandsaw.
Regards,
Mark
Prezza ! pall! Mate ! Comrade !
Great job.... I bought a brandnew Scheppach wood cutting bandsaw and did pretty much the same to it...
The wheels were sturdy and wide enough, so I didn't have to make new ones. The reduction I bought had a motor attached to it. I have three phase, so I pretty much bolted it straight into the spot where the original motor was. It had a few 100 watt more than the original motor.
I use a 12 tpi bi-metal blade and this thing works great.
The only thing I still want to change is the table. That is die cast aluminium and I have a mind to bolt a 5 mm steel plate on top of that (the casting is quite substantial, not flimsy)
But this indeed a great way of having a metal cutting bandsaw for little outlay, even when you buy all the stuff new, you barely come to a 1/4 of the price.
No Worries!
Paddy
Paddy, I still have to make a new table for mine. It really is too flimsy for cutting metal. I find it springs quite a lot when the joint in the blade passes through the stock. I want to cast an aluminium replacement to keep the weight down. I have to store the saw on top of a tall metal cabinet and my arms are like pipe cleaners. The struggle is real! 😁
Smart move reversing the armature. There’s more than one way to skin a cat. Good job Mark.
Mr Mike, I agree. I had heard this works, however I was not sure as I thought it may be a wives tale. Glad to hear it does work.
Excellent work as usual Mark, Thanks for bringing us along on the journey.
Cheers all from John, Australia.
could have just turned the gearbox around
@@toni1907 Yes that kind of works. Have a look at where the motor will end up if you go down this path. There is what looks like a dust extraction port to clear so larger offset or move the port to the other side and it needs to be able to open.
If this is/were an option then you have the motor sticking out the front of the band saw, less compact for storage. If going this path then the shaft from the reduction box will have to be extended a long way putting a huge amount more of load on most of the lower part of the drive/blade system. That is bearings and chassis.
Just my thoughts, John.
@@joandar1 what i meant was put shaft in other side of gearbox turn over that way shaft raises stragt up to top of box in place of the bottom where it is now
Toni,
I didn't really want to mess with the gearbox. I had a look and it seems like it has been designed to be sort of modular and that means that some of the seals, mountings and bearing surfaces are probably interchangeable. At the end of the day, reversing the armature in the motor was a pretty easy fix. The motor has no warranty but the gearbox does! 😁
Thank you for sharing your metal working journey. And here I always thought you Aussies were all about beer and barbecues, along the same lines as us Canadians with beer and hockey. LOL . Excellent work on the sandblasting gun, and on this project. I have full confidence you will get this one too. 👍👍👍
I was lucky enough to work with a teacher and some students from Winnipeg, Manitoba. We were working on a joint technology project back in 2009 and we met up in a hotel in London prior to the competition. Within an hour of meeting, the teacher and I were drinking beer in the bar and the 6 students on the team were playing hockey in the corridors on the 5th floor. 😀 My wife and I have been to Canada twice in the past two years. We loved every minute of it. Such nice people and your country is so different to ours. PS: I like barbecues too!
Regards,
Mark
Cutting speed looks and sounds perfect.
Brass, bronze, copper... are some of the first known self lubricating metals, that is a awesome reason to use them on the blade guides.
I had exactly the same setup on my wood bandsaw although I think the square blocks were bronze. We had a large Woodfast saw at work with brass plate guides and it copped a hiding from kids using it but it gave a really long surface contact to the side of the blade. I changed my wood bandsaw over to "cool blocks" a while ago but I haven't noticed a great deal of improvement over the original configuration.
Regards,
Mark
Hi Mark !
Very nice video - thx for sharing ... oh, I loe that size of band saw - "table-size" and I'm surely gonna make one myself too !
Motor - I don't knaow about motors in Australia, but here in Denmark you can get a nice 3 phase 400/240V second hand for 10 US$ - so no need for feedling around too much with that ;-)
It's so nice to see your castings come out so well with just the right amount af machining - they look very prof, I think !
Now I'll go and prepare some drawinds for chassis, patterns for wheels and so in Fusion360 and then 3D-print my first patterns !
Please make a playlist for this project and sure many will want to see it !
Thx !
Making small lumps of the large problems. You really do good work.
Great Vid Mark, thanks for sharing and taking the time to show us what you're doing and why. Greetings from Southport, UK.
How's Brexit going? It's interesting to watch the news each night here in the colonies. Seems like such a mess. I wonder how the pollies get the time to actually run the country.
Adding a nice thick plate steel stiffener into the drive section would help control tensioning deflection on the frame. Also, it would allow you to move the gear box forward in the frame cavity; just need to mill a cutout for it to pass through.
Of course; as small as the saw is and availability of scrap metal; welding up a new frame doesn't seem all that unreasonable either.
I have a nice big piece of 6mm hot rolled steel plate just the right size to go in the back plate of the saw body but I want to try aligning the wheels accurately first. If that fails I will be strengthening the back plate. I am trying not to add too much weight to the saw since I will have to store it off my welding bench. I have just about run out of places to mount machines permanently. 😥
Us I mentioned on your part one, good job and for sure better than my saw, Have a good day
Nice project. I believe you have tons more money and certainly hours into this than simply purchasing such a metal band-saw. However, you seem to be like me and love doing things like this, and therefore the price and labor doesn't matter. Thumbs Up!
Gary,
I had already purchased a metal cutting bandsaw that only operates as a cutoff saw. It does a great job but it won't tilt up far enough to allow for fitting of a horizontal table like some of the larger metal cutting saws. I thought it was a bit of a stretch to convince my wife that I needed a second metal cutting saw. The other fun fact was that I was telling my mate this sorry tale when he dug out this wreck from under his bench and gifted it to me. It seemed a little churlish to just toss it in the bin without making some effort to use it's constituent parts. As you have observed I have plenty of time (now that I am retired) so I don't begrudge the labour aspect.
Regards,
Mark Presling
Thank you for showing your use of the collet block. That was very cleaver:)
Thanks. I only found out about these collet blocks by watching other TH-cam makers. I have two. One for hex and one for square. The technique for offsetting stock for eccentric turning came to me one morning when I was struggling with trying to do it in the 4 jaw chuck without the collet block. It can be done but it is just that much harder.
Regards,
Mark Presling
@@Preso58 I have the same ER32 collet blocks, but it never occurred to me to use them in lathe chucks. I just use them for mill work. Using the square one for offset work on a lathe is a great idea; especially when more than one part needs to be turned with the same offset. Your idea can save a lot of time. Thanks again for sharing it.
I have an ER32 collet lathe chuck, but it's a pain to switch out for small projects. I'm going to try the collet blocks next time.
Hat off to you buddy, I'm impressed. Hope you get lots of use out of this saw! Cheers.
Capi Berra,
I have wanted a small metal cutting bandsaw for such a long time. I have a large supply of thin sheet aluminium, steel and stainless steel. It's mostly stock up to about 3mm thick and I use it for lots of fabrication. However it is such a pain to cut up. I have a plasma cutter which does a really good job but it is a chore to set it up and my shop is tight on space so I have to put it away each time I have finished with it. A little bandsaw like this one can be set up on the bench in minutes and it is a lot easier to see what you are doing. I am almost ready to reassemble the whole machine for the last time. I spent most of today doing all the finishing processes on the new parts. Lots of sandblasting, polishing, powder coating, zinc plating and anodising. I want it to look good!
Regards,
Mark Presling
Mark, This is another very interesting video! As far as your lower wheel/blade tracking, could it be a combination of the blade tension pulling up the "rigid" lower wheel & also the weight of the gearbox & motor? They may be teaming up against you because both look (to me) like they could cause the tracking problem in the direction that you are having.
Hi MARK. That is looking very promising, and redesigning something takes time for sure. I have done a few myself. Taking a broken or poorly made item and making it useful again is rewarding, at least for me. Thanks again for another great video! P.S. by all means sand blast that thing and make it look “ purrdy “ especially after all the sweat, blood and tears put into the sand blaster. 😆
Gary,
I have to somehow justify buying the "stuff" that goes into my shed. My wife is very tolerant but I suspect she sometimes questions why I really needed a giant red box with gloves sticking out of it!
Regards,
Mark
But I’m sure that having you out from under foot is a condition that she likes? “ justification “ 😁
As usual, excellent engineering and follow through...👍🏻👍🏻
Very good progress. I do like the slow speed you now have with the correct gearmotor.
I think the blade guides could have been machined from a block of aluminium.
I have a 17in wood cutting bandsaw. The rear of the blade guide is a bearing on its side like your original guides, so the back of the blade engages on the rim of the bearing. Not desirable, but likely designed to save space in the guide. It works, but I would have preferred engaging on the outer race like your guide design.
Dave.
I was questioning my decision to cast the body of the blade guides. I had some 40mm square 6011 alloy all ready to go but I was still experimenting with cored casting and decided that it was worth trying to cast them with the voids. As it turned out only one of the cored castings were used and I cast a second one with no cores for the finished upper guide. I have never liked the design with the blade rubbing on the rim of the bearing. It always seems like a compromise and must set up a lot of friction. We had a machine like this at work and the resonance set up by the scraping action made the saw sound like a shrieking banshee!
Regards,
Mark
FYI the tracking crown on a bandsaw is not the same as a say conveyor belt. The bandsaw width includes the teeth which offer no tension factor and therefore the blade with say a 1/3 width gullet depth means the centre of the blade tension is 2/3 the width away from the tooth tip. Thats why your bottom wheel has the teeth hanging off the front edge. In short move the wheel crown backward.
I do recall watching a very good video on how to tune a wood bandsaw and it included the advice you are offering. As it turns out though, the blade has done a lot of work (I am actually on my second blade now) and it seems to track well and has not given me any problems. There's always something to learn though so thanks for the info.
Regards,
Mark
I just realized, i have the Ryobi clone of that saw. Now i know my next project!
Thank you. Great tutorial.
Nice job on the castings. Maybe next time use a square end mill to make those square holes 🤔😉😆! Another good one. Cheers.
Have you got a square end mill? If so, send over a set please! 😀
In the opening sequences where the blade is shown cutting the metal the blade looks to me like it is mounted upside-down down (teeth pointed up), is that just the “video” and me seeing or imagining that? Thanks for the very interesting fix and information on the motor. I’m eagerly waiting to see your fix on the blade tracking on the lower wheel. Any observations on possible flex of the sheet metal frame when the blade is tensioned? The finishing touches should include some or your trade mark art deco embellishments.
It is just a trick of the video frame rate. I was watching the video shortly after I published it and had myself totally convinced that the blade was in fact upside down. I actually went down to the shed to check. I should have just trusted myself since there is no way the blade would cut if it were reversed. I have marked out a large piece of 6mm steel plate to reinforce the back frame of the saw but I still need to do some realignment of the lower wheel before I go ahead and make any changes to the frame. I suspect that all I need is a spacer to bring the top and bottom wheels into the same plane. I have made some artwork for a new brass maker's plate with a few vintage touches. It will replace the horrid "GMC" brand on the saw at the moment.
Regards,
Mark
G’day Mark, you’re a cut above the rest. As you mentioned those brass guides don’t have to be square, is it one of those times where you get too committed then think I should have spent a coupla bucks on some round! Square holes aren’t fun even in aluminium. Cheers
Peter
I just like making things difficult for myself. I couldn't buy 10mm square brass stock either. I had to machine it from 1/2" stock. I only tried to order the brass after I had cast in the 10mm square hole. Like I said in the vid, this whole adventure is a prototype. If I were making another one it would look quite different. Still, it's fun trying to anticipate the next step in the process.
Regards,
Mark
Preso, very nice job on reversing the motor.
I was thinking to reverse the reduction worm drive, by flipping the gear box mounting, with worm drive on top side of the gear box. It would of raised the center of gravity by having electric motor up higher, but in may of been easier. You would of have to swap sides of the output shaft as well. Would that of been possible to do with that reduction gear box?
Also I guess the worm gear should be mounted at the bottom for the oil to lubricate it, or it it lubricated with greased?
But i like your method, as it keeps the CoG lower.
I considered altering the gearbox but at the end of the day, the gearbox has a warranty but the motor doesn't. If I started breaking down the gearbox and if failed prematurely I would just have to toss it!
Hey Prezzo, loving ur work. Has anyone told you that you could pass as a sound double for Jon over at Superhouse/Freetronics??? Anyway I'm sure it's just my eyes deceiving me, but it sure looks like the blade is upside down when you are cutting the aluminium/steel. I know it can't be cause it wouldn't cut but???
David, you are correct and that is why the motor reverse is shown towards the end of the video. If you hold enough downward pressure you can do things in the Southern Hemisphere, lol.
Cheers from John, Australia.
Hey John, as they say today "my bad" x 2. I totally forgot about the reversing of the motor that Mark only spent half the video explaining!!! Some people are slow learners lol. Also as you said you can do thing in the Southern Hemisphere... when you live here you tend to forget the "Down Under" & upside down effect. It fits perfectly with the concept of mounting the blade upside down ;)
@@DCJones06 All good D J. Cheers Cobber, John.
David,
I guess all us Aussies sound the same! I just checked out Jon's channel and will have to go back and look at some more. He seems to be offering some interesting stuff. Many people have commented that I had the blade reversed but it is just a trick of the video frame rate. It certainly wouldn't cut if it were reversed.
I was almost going to ask if you were related...
Bloody hell TH-cam stopped notifying me of your uploads
Yes, I have heard others complaining about notifications disappearing. Must be a TH-cam algorithm thing.
Hi Mark. You mention that you think that the hole in the gearbox appeared to be tapered. I'm wondering if in fact it was a morse 2 taper because the weird sizing of 14.7mm may indicate that. (I just went thru a similar exercise making a locating lug for my new rotary table and I thought it weird that it had a 14.43mm hole. As it turns out, it was in fact a morse 2 taper. Great info on this conversion.
I must say, I didn't even check that. Now that you mention it the company selling these gearboxes also sell a lot of equipment for CNC conversions and the like. The hole wasn't deep enough for a full MT2 though. I assumed it was so that any misalignment between the coupling and an output shaft would be taken care of. In any case the gearbox is still functioning really well.
Regards,
Mark
@@Preso58 the rotary table doesn't have a full depth Morse 2 taper either. A mate suggested it may be, and it was.
I use mine in the quill to quickly locate the centre of the table. Works a treat.
I have been looking into converting a wood band saw to metal for some time, and your video is exactly what I need.
I have already rushed out and ordered all sorts of parts (as is usual for me) and will be copying your build as closely as possible.
One question is, would you consider selling castings of the wheels? The rest is easy enough to do in other ways, but the wheels are a bit more tricky (particularly the bottom one).
Another option I thought might be to make aluminium inserts and weld up the holes in the factory wheels for strength.
Anyway, thanks for your videos, very inspiring.
Rohan,
I would try the stock wheels first. The ones that came with my GMC saw were very flimsy and only had three spokes. The Ryobi and Ozitio ones that I had seen at the hardware supplier were a little stronger looking. The main issue was the bottom wheel which needed quite a large boss to offset it enough from the gearbox spindle. It might be possible to just machine up a spacer for this.I am not really in the business of selling parts but you might be able to find someone who does aluminium casting who cam make up some castings for you.
Regards,
Mark
Mark Presling thanks Mark, I thought it would be a long shot, but you never know unless you ask.
My machine (which I don’t have yet) appears to be of the generic Chinese variety and according to the pictures has the flimsy looking 3 spoke wheels. I’ll have a closer look when it arrives.
$127 on eBay, can’t really go wrong.
www.ebay.com.au/itm/Baumr-AG-Bandsaw-Cutting-Band-Saw-Portable-Wood-Vertical-Benchtop-Machine-Bench-/142921329699
Awesome conversion!! We have an old Craftsman that I would like to convert over to metal cutting, now I have some Ideas for the conversion, thanks. I was wondering if you could add some various thousand thickness shims to the bottom bolts of the reduction box in order to get the bottom of the lower pulley to move inward for better tracking. Great video!
Craig,
That is what I was thinking and then I did some checks and found that the bottom wheel was about 3mm inboard of the top wheel. I am not sure how that happened because I did all sorts of measurements and checks before I committed to machining the extension shaft for the gearbox. I am going to make a spacer to realign the two wheels tomorrow and if that doesn't work I will shim and strengthen the mounting for the gearbox. Surprisingly, the blade still tracks OK and it still cuts metal as it is!
Should have put rubber on wheels it helps keep blade sharp and helps with alignment of blade
Many people have told me that but I currently own a large commercially made 7 X 12 metal cutting bandsaw and it has cast iron wheels with plain machined surfaces for the blade to ride on. My smaller horizontal bandsaw also commercially made and purchased as a new machine is also the same but it has aluminium wheels. In my view the blade has a different geometry to wood cutting bandsaws and also the material is usually a bi metal construction which holds its edge much longer. There is also a lot more tension on a metal cutting blade and it may damage a rubberised wheel very quickly.
Regards,
Mark
At 3 to 3.5 mins in when you cut a couple of samples it appeared that the blades teeth were pointing up?!?
Ged,
It's just a trick of the video frame rate. The saw would definitely not cut if the blade were reversed.
how did cnc converting this mini mill work for you? everywhere i read, they say its horrendous because of the huge backlash of the leadscrews? are you having videos on it?
Sharky, The only change I have made to the saw is to use the Nema34 gearbox to reduce the shaft speed of the existing induction motor. It is not a CNC conversion. I am not sure why you think it is a CNC saw?
Regards,
Mark
did you consider taking the shaft out of the other side of the gearbox ?
I did not. I am guessing that those little gearboxes are designed to be modular and probably have multiple ways of arranging the parts.
Regards,
Mark
Another great project. Do you think that the gearbox will handle the torque of a 7.5 amp (120v) or 1 HP on a typical 14 inch wood band saw , which are readily available used? Metal band saws are much harder to come by.
Stephen,
The gearbox that I purchased seems to be quite well made and it appears to be filled with oil or grease. There is a filler plug in the body so I am guessing it is well lubricated. The gear reduction might mean that the torque at the motor will be way less than if it were driving the bandsaw wheel at normal wood cutting speeds. So at least the input end of the gearbox is going to feel a lot less stressed than the output end. I would think that for the outlay (around $135 Australian, that's probably about $15 US 😁) it is worth a try.
Regards,
Mark
@@Preso58 Thanks Mark. I think i'll look out for one and give it a go.
Hi! Nice work! We seem to share interrests/hobby. I cast aluminium and bronze. I'm more into "micro-casting". Currently I try to make a 1:4 scale v8 ferrari engine. -Struggeling to make the main engine block, but will try with "epoxy sand" insted of oil sand. The engine top are ok, using oil sand, but imagine the water chamber inside the engine block.. Very difficult! Are you from New Zealand or Australia? I'm Norwegian. Best Regards, Arild
Arild, I live in Queensland, Australia. My father was born in Wellington, New Zealand and my son lives and works there now. I am guessing you are a Ferrari fan so you must be ecstatic about Charles Le Clerc's win in Monza. I must say, I was a bit happy that he took the win from Mercedes. And Danny Ric got in the points too. The only type of engine I have not built yet is an internal combustion type. I am keen to have a go though. As you say, the complexity of the castings and the camshaft with it's associated gearing has put me off. I would love to see how you tackle the casting for the engine block. If you put it up on TH-cam, let me know.
Regards,
Mark Presling
That thing on the end of the table appears to be a miter slot to me.
That is correct. It is more like a rail but another viewer confirmed that a mitre attachment could be mounted on it. I have just made up a wooden pattern to cast a new aluminium table and it will have a milled slot for the mitre attachment. That pressed steel table is way to flimsy for the blade loading.
Regards,
Preso
👍👌
Be careful with the blade guides, chamfer the corners and give enough clearance so the guide the blade and not machine it. I ruined a brand new blade in the wink of an eye when I got handy adjusting the guides on a bandsaw at work.
vel wheel. I did a lot of cutting today on the saw. A viewer who lives locally gave me about 18 kg of 2 and 3mm brass sheets that are leftovers from his CNC plasma cutter. So far the brass blade guides have held up well with no sign of wear. My biggest issue is the table which is way too flimsy. I have made up a wooden pattern so I can cast a new aluminium one. The viewer who gave me the brass has a massive industrial wood bandsaw, (you'll see it on an upcoming video) and I was surprised that it had aluminium blade guides!
Regards,
Mark Presling
Can't you use slightly larger bearings on the blade guide?
Yes, I hadn't thought of that though! I still have a few checks to do before I change the setup. I spent ages measuring the blade position and the mountings for the blade guides before I committed to machining everything. I was a little surprised and disappointed when I ran out of adjustment on the eccentrics. I stripped everything down after I posted the video and checked again and now it appears that the design was correct to start with. Maybe I just hadn't assembled everything correctly when I shot the video. I feel confident that I can get it right though.
It's always good to hear suggestions because despite how clever I think I am there is always someone who has fresh eyes on my project who will point out an overlooked aspect of the design.
Regards,
Mark
why engineer excellent work on top of engineered crap. great video, I question the original decision
I take the view of Stefan Gotteswinter who regards cheap Chinese goods as a "kit of parts". I was actually considering building a saw from scratch but this machine was given to me as scrap and I felt it was worth trying to rescue it from the rubbish skip.
Regards,
Mark
Blade running in reverse?
Set nut on the guide is loose?
No, the blade is not running in reverse. It just looks that way because of the video frame rate. The nut on the guide is loose. I cannot set these permanently because the bottom wheel is still misaligned. I have to make up a spacer to ensure that the top and bottom wheels are in the same plane.
Regards,
Mark Presling
@@Preso58 well I'll be, as the yank I am, I thought everything over there ran counter to the direction it ran here. Good on ya. Cheers
Conversions and remodeling are the same, the problems keep coming, better off moving.
I could not find a small metal cutting bandsaw that I could lift onto the top of a storage cupboard where it lives most of the time. I only take it down when I have a job for it. I have limited space in my workshop and as much as I would like to have an industrial style metal cutting bandsaw, I just don't have the room. Also, the project was as much about the challenge as it was about having a means of cutting up small pieces of stock. Even if the saw turned out to be a total failure, I will have still learned something.
Regards,
Mark
Yeah, I'm first.