Sterling all day long baby. Ben Sterling is awesome. Always there to answer your questions. I have bought £10,000 worth of their systems. Today a Vulcan PV inverter with battery charger all built in. Systems are good.
You really can tell these things in a very simple way which encourage people to know more about the system. Your tutorials are hands down the best I know. Thank you so much!
Good info, Luke. I've been running a relay charger on my wife car to keep her 2nd battery for her freezer battery charging. But both batteries are gel batteries, and now I'm upgrading my Class A RV to solar and lithium batteries. I upgraded the engine chassis alternator to 250 amps, so I'll dedinitly be applying this mppt charging system to the mix. Already have 4 of them to control the solar panels. Using a Victron 12/ 3000 / 120 for the old girl. It's been fun learning this stuff from you guys.
Can I ask a question, my sterling b2b charger will only allow the sealed option to he selected, I've tried to select agm 2(which is whays needed with my battery) but it won't allow this..any advice
Having 1st fitted a VSR i soon upgraded to the Sterling and then had problems even after ringing Sterling, i soon replaced the Sterling for a Orion and its been 100% reliable, battery is a 220ah AGM, fitted to a ford Transit then swapped over to my Mercedes Sprinter, Orion and Victron products all day long, they are just fit and forget and the App is pure 1st Class.
Hi Ross. Great video. Love the clarity of this. I have a 2022 F350 with dual alternators and dual batteries from factory. I want to use alternator charging on a slide in camper I’m making. My question is “does it matter which battery in the engine bay I pull a red (+) cable back to the DC to DC?” Hidden in my question is my lack of knowing how Ford hooked up those two batteries up front. I ASSUME (yikes!…) that they are in parallel and I ASSUME the two alternators work in tandem and split the workload? Both alternators are 390A alternators. Last is “what size DC to DC charger would you think is best if I have alternators that are 390A?”
Hey there, thanks for tuning in. I would have to dig into this to determine the setup for your specific vehicle. I have data on other vehicles but not that one. If you would like to get consulting on this, I would be glad to dig into it with Ford to help you solve this. My consulting service is available here: www.rosslukeman.com/offers/Au4HykMc Thanks again for tuning in!
Just FYI the blue sea ACR is NOT COMPATIBLE with lithium as the voltage connect setting is too low at 13.1v ! Therefore the house and start will almost always be connected due to the high voltage of the lithium (idle at 13.25v) you need to use a Victron LICT if you want this same setup with a VSR
Wow! Finally a great teacher to help along the way! I was just about to install my sterling on my boat. What timing! Getting my engine rebuilt. The mechanic is installing a 55amp charger. Any recommendation on the right size alternator to use? I’m completing a 600 lithium battle born system with almost 1500watts of solar. Was using 400amps bank for awhile Thanks!
Very interesting episode I would like an episode on hybrid battery storage AGM/LITHIUM as well and how to go about fitting from a costs safety installation aspect with the different charging inputs.
Great teaching video. Is there a system training video that explains how a solar charger, a DC-DC charger and a shore power charger might work in concert? Assuming the do not know of each other and may overlay charging stages for the Lithium batteries?
New subscriber here and very impressed with your presentation . Question..... I just purchased 2 Vitrer 460ah lithium batteres for my custom build . I have a new 140amp alternator . I also purched a L- BIM 226 to cferent charger ?. Thank you Sir.harge my batteries off the alternator. Now I am having second thought after watching your videos and thinking about ditching the BIM and buying the Orion smart charger like you show in this video. Will the Orion safetly charge my two 460ah batteries or should I go with a dif
I'm confused - for the relay (device One) - you had a black cable going off screen to your chassis and then ties to the chassis side of the Victron shunt. I'm happy. For the other two devices - there was no longer a link from the Victron Shunt to the Chassis - so how do they charge the Lithium battery??? If the "U" shaped bus bar on the top of the shunt is connected directly to your chassis - then you never needed the black chassis cable for the relay. If not - then the Lithium battery would not have charged with the B2B charger.
Me too, I was looking at part two - victron - and part three - sterling - and asking myself where is the negative/ground/chassis for the li battery...?
The Sterling should be connected close to the starter battery. It shouldn't be at the back of the van. It states that in the installation instructions. I think the same applies to the Orion as well? In an ideal situation you want the B-B mounted under the seat close to the starter battery.
There are 2 issues b2b chargers solved. Initially as eco alternators appeared, where starter battery is maintained at 80% and boosted while braking. Obviously this is not great if you have a house battery which is lead acid, lithium not so much as alternator voltage can go to 16v briefly while braking. I hava a basic voltage sensing relay with my setup with lithium battery, my solar panels maintain my house battery, and i have the fuse out mostly in my vsr, i can plug it in when needed and run the engine.
Thank you for the time and effort put into your content. For a first time skoolie builder, it will be a great help. I have a question though. Our shuttle bus that we recently purchased, already has two alternators. I am pulling the engine for a rebuild and would like to make any upgrades to the alternators process. Is it a good idea to dedicate one alternator for the starter batteries and the other for the house batteries? What should the set up look like with a dedicated house battery alternator? Should I stay with 12 V or go to 24 or 48? I have so many questions lol, but any advice you can give would be greatly appreciated. Thank you so much
Hey there, yes I think it's a decent idea to dedicate each alternator to the two different areas. This will reduce the load on each one. The voltage of the 2nd alternator depends on the voltage of your rear system and batteries. The higher the voltage, the lower the current in the lines, so you can use smaller cables. I have done 12V second alternators only and the lines are 2/0 running to the back. Just a positive red cable running through a fuse. The negative conducts through the alternator body itself, running through the chassis and engine block as well. So there is no negative cable to the 2nd alternator typically. You just have to bond your rear system negative to the chassis, using the same large 2/0 cable. If you would like more info, I have a course on all of this here: www.rosslukeman.com/vanpower
I use a switch connected to the Victron Orion DC-DC sharger.to turn this off with shorepower connected. I have another charger (shorpower connected) for the lead acid statrerbattery. it will sharge the Lithium battery with the wrong voltage if this switch is turned on. Use it only when driveing down the road and shargeing the the LITHIUM batterybank
Is the Winnebago Revel just a freak in having a stand-alone alternator for charging the house batteries? While I get that the belting and fixturing for adding an alternator to the MB engine isn't trivial, if it's such a bad idea that no one does it, is it something that Revel owners should seek to abandon?
It's just a matter of cost. It's about $3k to add that to a Sprinter. It takes the load off of your factory alternator, but most DIY builders don't want to spend that. If you throttle down the load, your factory unit can handle it. The Winnebago Revel is for the semi-luxury buyer. So it's in the budget. The ARV units out of Cleveland also have 2nd alternators, but those vans are over $300k. So it's not a bad idea, it just has to be in the budget.
@@rosslukeman ARV seems to think that solar is bogus 🤷♂️ Yeah their attention to interior detail is out of this world, and I don't begrudge those who want to pay for it. They are the EarthCruiser of the Sprinter realm. Pretty, but too pretty. This weekend, heavy overcast all weekend, our revel boiled water in our oxo kettle both mornings. The inverter complained about it the second morning, but didn't give up until just as the water came to a boil. So I guess it's getting the job done.
Hi Ross I have a Toyota Verso car with caravan behind - Knaus Sport 500 FDK ,what would your recommendation for alternator charger as I think I wood have to run a seperate large wire from under the hood where battery and alternator are located? I already have 100/30 Victron attached to my 340w of solar to my current 2 x 105ah AGM’s soon to be 300ah lithium x1. Also have BMV Victron 712, & battery protect. Also attached 2000w pure sine wave inverter (not Victron yet🙏cost) I don’t think I can run this via the normal caravan / Car hookup plug!! Thanks for your assistance in advance cheers Chris “The Aussie living in The Netherlands “ 🇦🇺🍾😎
I've never heard a good thing about Sterling. An engineer friend of mine pointed out a design flaw to Sterling and they threatened to sue him if he made it public....
I am upgrading a class b+, class C RV. It already has a generator and I would like to keep it for extra redundancy. That being said how do I include the generator in my system? Will have solar, alternator and shore power
The best is a dc to dc charger, it having a relay that takes the starting battery out of the system for a short time would work much better with at least 4gauge cable, running back to the battery,. With a heavy duty relay or contactor, disconnecting the starter batt, from the alternator, while keeping a battery connected, have both connected after starting, disconnecting the front battery, until the voltage has risen to a near equal , maybe running a wire back to sense the voltage, a couple on 200-250 amp relays and micro controller, programmed to sense voltage , maybe add a relay and scroll dc buck boost, to allow the alternator to charge the rear bank, and charge the front batt , and power things done what, with about 20 amp buck boost to prevent killing the battery, with lights and engine accessories, with near 100 amps charging the rear bank it should not take long to get to about 12.9-13.4 so both can be connected together, and charged to 14.4,, but doing the opposite would probably be best, just use a dc to dc to charge the rear battery, just shut it off when full, 20 amps isn't that much, but that con be Doubled or tripled, but would likely require a larger or double alternators, a micro controller, programmed to switch on dc boost converters, for more current, with a current sensor on the vehicle main pos, to detect current load, if it's low, charge at full power, careful to not wire it up to sense its own current load, connect directly to the alternator. With pod+ and neg- a larger gauge from alt to batt, and ground from alt case, to body/frame and battery, because the stock is on the limit, 100-130a plus amps I like to go with 6ga for very short runs, and 4gauge over 3' adding a ground, from the case to body/frame to battery, and alt pos to battery, connecting the original alt wire to the battery, if it doesn't come from there, I have seen some go to the main fuse box pos, with another 8 ga going to the battery, especially if going to a higher current alternator, 200 amps 2gauge or 1/0, or 250+2/0 cables pos and neg, from alt to battery and body, if the ground isn't replaced, it's going to burn that tiny ground strap or 8 gauge pos cable, some may be 10 gauge, I started out in car audio, pulling tons of power, killing the battery completely with the car running, with a 130amp alternator! Partly because the tiny wiring couldn't handle the extra 80-90 amps , I went to a 140 amp alt, from 105a alt, the amp was fused at 80a each, so with lights , it wasn't enough, it's not a constant 160 amps, can easily be close to 200amps in short peaks, inverters are more constant load compared, if possible adding a second 24v alt, going to a 24v bank, and equipment, with doctor dc dropping to 12/13.8v for 12v loads, probably 20a +/-, maybe use the doctor dc to charge another small 12v bank 50ah for 12v loads and 24v for the inverter, a bit complex more for large rv and campers, connected camper to the tow vehicle by 175a Anderson is not a bad idea, using the vehicle to power it , with solar as a main charging system, but you can only get so much solar, and ppl hate running low on power, having the ability to full charge the batts in about an hour is awesome, I have a slightly complex 2vank system in my off grid house, 12v for lights, cameras security system, and emergency power, 2kw inverter, for the fridge and freezer, and 12vdc for lighting, along with 120v lights, but not from 12v, a second small well pump 12vdc, to keep some water Incase of a low main bank voltage, another reason for the 12v backup system, I can connect jumper cables to a car and charge it if needed, I'm building a 100amp dc generator, to charge it to 13.8v, when needed, and another capable of charging and powering the main inverter, while putting about 150a in the batteries! I'm thinking about adding a inverter to it making it also a inverter generator, also a dc generator, just add about 50 ah lead acid battery to start it, and as a buffer keeping the inverter happy!!. Sorry to ramble!! Have an awesome day!!
We had Renogy 50A DC DC charger in our Ford Transit but we heard you mention we can connect 2 DC DC charger to get double the amperage to charge house battery bank. How can we wire them? Thank you for all your gray helpful videos 😊
Q I have a 7 pin plug on my van I know it changes the battery for the brake away on the trailer I am going to have battery powered for both with inverter
Ross, this is great info! We have a 2020 Ford Transit with heavy duty alternator connected with a Sterling 1260 charger going to 600ah lifepo4 battery bank. We have not yet installed the ‘ignition on’ wire. We’ve had six months of great charging, but recently we’ve had issues where the house batteries only seem to get power from the Sterling during idle, or when the van is moving but only during periods when the gas is not being applied. Any ideas? Thanks☺️
Hi Krysta, great question. It sounds like the voltage coming from your alternator is varying under different conditions (idling, accelerating, etc) and the Sterling is reacting to that. A lot of these chargers have "engine-on detection" settings and if they are not dialed in correctly, this can happen. The ignition signal wire may bypass a lot of that and give the charger more of an "on-off" functionality without having to detect whether the engine is running. Personally if I were to troubleshoot this, I would measure the DC voltage between the "IN" and "GND" terminals of the Sterling with a multimeter, and have someone drive around or at least vary the engine RPMs while I took this measurement. Ford is not calling these alternators "Smart," but they could still be tied into the vehicle computer and have some kind of variable-voltage technology to save fuel or reduce the alternator's load on the engine during acceleration. In short though, if this voltage is varying then that could be tripping the Sterling on and off. Check the voltage as described and the Sterling's settings, perhaps adding the ignition wire if you can't fix it with adjusting the settings alone. Hope that helps!
Great teaching video. Is there a system training video that explains how a solar charger, a DC-DC charger and a shore power charger might work in concert? Assuming the do not know of each other and may overlay charging stages for the Lithium batteries?
Hi Ross, could you explain why you'd choose this option over a victron argofet charge splitter or visa versa? I use a 3 output argofet on my boat to use my alternator to charge 3 battery banks, but this would work also.
On a boat application, should I ground the victron directly to my engine AGM battery or on the negative bus bar ( witch is also connected to my engine battery)? Should I get the isolated version of the victron?
Hi Michel, for boats, you might ask Peter Kennedy at PKYS (Peter Kennedy Yacht Services). pkys@pkys.com He's a major Victron dealer in North America and has worked on boat power systems since the 1990's. He may tell you to use the isolated version. How you ground the unit to your engine battery depends on whether the unit is isolated or non-isolated. I use non-isolated in most cases, but it may not be right for boats. Not sure.
@3:49 Why is that fuse there? What wire is it protecting? It looks to be on a ? #6 wire? Shouldn't the fuses be near the source of power? In this case, shouldn't the fuse be near the vehicle battery? Or would it go between the LiFePo4 battery and the buss bar? I'm confused. Please clarify and educate on the purpose of fuses.
Okay, after @9:30 you somewhat indicate we've wasted our time learning how bad the relay system is. You did also note a fuse at the vehicle battery (that can blow under non-fault conditions), and that the small wire is a #4. And yet, my main query stands. Why is that fuse there?
Might be a stupid question, but here goes. Shouldn't one also be concerned about the charge-curve from the alternator to the starter battery? It seems that most of the diagrams I can find connects the alternator more or less directly to the starter battery.
Hi Henrik, I think this is a good question. My answer is no, you don't need a charge curve because the load on the alternator never ends when the engine is running, because the engine has to fire the spark plugs, run the vehicle computer, etc. So you would never have a multi-stage charge curve or algorithm, because if you reduce the power going to the battery and vehicle, the starter battery would immediately begin to deplete. The house batteries are a different story because they don't have loads on them 100% of the time. At some point they're full and the charge rate should be dropped. The scenario with the starter battery is different, as the alternator is connected to it, but also to everything else requiring power while the vehicle is in operation. If you change the output of the alternator, it affects the operation of the vehicle and engine. Hope that helps, great question!
I want one of these for my lithium. But noone seems to be able to give me a straight answer. I have a boat yanmar engine with a 35amp alternator.. But some say i shouldn't get a 30 amp charger because of alternator overheating issues that could occur
It makes sense that it might overheat, as these units tend to pull their full rating (i.e. this unit will pull a full 30 amps from your alternator when bulk charging a battery). It would be like having a 35 horsepower engine, and putting an extra load on it requiring 30 horsepower. It would overload it. Victron makes some smaller 9-amp and 18-amp DC-DC converters that have a constant voltage output (not multi-stage chargers). However they would limit the charging current, and since normal alternators are single-voltage output, it would be like charging right off of the alternator, but you could set the charging voltage, and it would limit the current to protect the alternator. Here they are: shop.pkys.com/Victron-Energy-ORI121222110-Orion-TR-1212-18A-Isolated-DC-DC-converter_p_6687.html shop.pkys.com/Victron-Energy-ORI121210110-Orion-Tr-1212-9A-110W-Isolated-DC-DC-converter_p_6996.html Hope that helps!
30a charger would work on off grid application as well? Main battery bank is connected to solar panel with Mppt charger and I’m trying to charge different bank from main bank. Is it possible that way? Thanks
Hi Thomas, yes it would work to charge your second bank, with the first bank being charged by solar. Unless they are the same type/age of battery, then just link the banks and let the solar do its thing.
I just installed a 220-Amp Power Bastards alternator. I intend to charge (6) 100-Amp hour LiFePo4 batteries. Does anybody have any real world experience on what would be a practical maximum amperage draw my new alternator can handle without seriously affecting its lifespan? It does not use an overdrive pulley, by the way.
The victron actually outputs 37. or 38 amps, more than it is rated, and sucks about 45 amps out of the alternator. Really do not want to go much higher for most alternators, at low rpm, they WILL OVERHEAT.
Hi, I have the same question I just really want to know ASAP: Is there a DC-DC Battery Charger that's good for more like 400 or 800 amps instead of just 20 or 40 amps at 12 volts? Because what If you ran it with mechman aftermarket 400a alternators?
Hi Vince, they have a new one from Sterling Power that does 200 amps, but that's the biggest I've seen. You can double or triple any of these chargers up and wire them in parallel to multiply output. You typically have to have loads or batteries that need that much power though, and that's not the case for most people. You also have to look at the torque on the engine. The more amps you pull out of these alternators, the more resistance on the engine and that will drop mileage slightly. Hope that helps.
@@rosslukeman Yes. That definitely helps a lot. Thank you so much. My engine is modified to help with this purpose. The alternators peak output at 1850 rpms which isn't very high for the engine. The components typically powered by the crank pulley on the fan belt are now all electric run including the engine fan, water pump, power steering pump, and A/C compressor. The engine itself cranks out 403/417 hp/trq stock, but I've added the previously mentioned upgrades, as well as a cold air intake, high flow exhaust system, and an upgraded tune on the ECU for better efficiency so I'm sure those things help to combat the drag from alternator resistance.
@@vincenzopromedia wouldn't it be difficult to find wire thick enough to handle that kind of amperage for something like that? I'm baffled by the 800amps you mentioned.
I have a 24V, 600 amp hour lithium iron phosphate bank that I would like to charge from the alternator. Victron makes a 12 to 24 V DC to DC charge,r but I think it's limited to 15 Amps. Would take a very long time to charge at that rate. I see that sterling has some larger ones, but the reviews are horrible on Amazon. Do you know of any other alternatives with higher output?
@@Deltro61 That's understandable, should work fine. I would just leave some space around them, these DC-DC chargers run at their rated amperage and they get toastier than other components.
Thanks for the heads up Wolf, there seems to be a problem connecting to the server. I've got tech support helping, hopefully it will be back soon. I appreciate it!
@@rosslukeman I'm planning on doing exactly this for my work van. Adding a couple batteries in the back for charging tools. Wish 12v tool chargers were not 3 times the cost of a regular charger! 🤦🏼♂️
@@Wolf-xi4if Sounds like a good idea, I always thought work vans needed a power system for charging and running tools like that. I understand on the chargers, once you get away from 110v everything goes way up in price. Hope this video helped with your plan!
I'm still looking for pros/cons of running the Victron off the start battery v. off the alternator which the instructions seem to recommend. Any insight from anyone?
Hi Victor, I can see what you mean about the instructions seeming to indicate a direct alternator connection (especially their diagram in the data sheet for the Orion). You are fine doing that if you find a lug to connect to on the alternator. However, since the engine battery is on the same circuit as the alternator, you are just connecting to a different location of the same loop. It is not necessary to connect at the physical alternator or the physical engine battery, you just want to tie into the circuit they are on. This is easy done at the driver's seat, and most van manufacturers provide hookups there for you to tie into the alternator/battery circuit.
Its because the alternator is the energy source so you don't get a voltage drop, shorter cable length is better,you want your victron and battery near to the alternator as possible .
I'm so disappointed. You told us you were going to show us the watts in the smart shunt. That would give us apple to apple comparison. You did that for the relay, then fummmmmmmmmmmble for the Victron DC-DC . I didn't make it any farther. What happened?
So if you wind up in a scenario where the battery bank is depleted to the point where it causes the fuse to blow, what’s the solution for charging back up? An external charger?
Usually these vans will have at least one other charging source. I have had two vans with relays blow fuses like this, and they both had solar. One of them also had shore power. You could also use a battery charger as you mentioned. Thanks for the great question!
Time to look at Sterling Power's new line of DC/DC Charge Controllers. Their 40A model features bi-directional charging to keep the start battery topped off. Way way more efficient than Victron... th-cam.com/video/5IEdNzRq68o/w-d-xo.html
After using a Sterling for a year now, I actively recommend people NOT use their products. I’ve had nothing but trouble with their product. I plan to replace our Sterling with a Victron unit. I’ll look at the video, but it would have to do something amazing for me to even consider it.
@@srira7910 I have the BB1260 with Green Stripe (latest version as of 2020) It worked well for approximately six months. Now, without any settings being changed, it will only charge at idle or when there is no power applied during a downhill descent. And only at a max of 38 amps, usually closer to 20 amps. It's connected via CCP2 on the Ford Transit, which outputs 175amps if required from my 2x250AMP alternators.....
@@briannorwick Are you open to contacting their support person in England? He is super on it with issues, and actually cares about their line of products. Just sayin.
Ha! Moo! ;-) Too busy trying to figure out all the tech oddities, such as a ground wire that leaves the screen instead of going to the ground buss bar, and the ? 100a fuse placement.
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Sterling all day long baby. Ben Sterling is awesome. Always there to answer your questions. I have bought £10,000 worth of their systems. Today a Vulcan PV inverter with battery charger all built in. Systems are good.
You really can tell these things in a very simple way which encourage people to know more about the system. Your tutorials are hands down the best I know. Thank you so much!
Thanks for the kind words! I appreciate it, great to know you are getting a lot out of these tutorials! Thanks for tuning in-
Good info, Luke. I've been running a relay charger on my wife car to keep her 2nd battery for her freezer battery charging. But both batteries are gel batteries, and now I'm upgrading my Class A RV to solar and lithium batteries. I upgraded the engine chassis alternator to 250 amps, so I'll dedinitly be applying this mppt charging system to the mix. Already have 4 of them to control the solar panels. Using a Victron 12/ 3000 / 120 for the old girl.
It's been fun learning this stuff from you guys.
Hey there, thanks for tuning in! Great to hear these videos have been helpful to get you prepared for the Class A upgrade!
Sterling do a 12-48v DC-DC now which is very handy for the new 48V systems people are installing 👍
Your fuses should be within 7 inches of the battery and most definitely before any bus bars etc. plus the fuses are there to protect the cables.
Can I ask a question, my sterling b2b charger will only allow the sealed option to he selected, I've tried to select agm 2(which is whays needed with my battery) but it won't allow this..any advice
Even better use a fused distribution block for positive, such as those sold by KnuKonceptz or Stinger.
What’s the path to ground for your Lithium battery? You moved the ground off the shunt to the charger.
Having 1st fitted a VSR i soon upgraded to the Sterling and then had problems even after ringing Sterling, i soon replaced the Sterling for a Orion and its been 100% reliable, battery is a 220ah AGM, fitted to a ford Transit then swapped over to my Mercedes Sprinter, Orion and Victron products all day long, they are just fit and forget and the App is pure 1st Class.
Thanks for sharing your experience! May I ask what the issue was with the Sterling?
Hi Ross. Great video. Love the clarity of this. I have a 2022 F350 with dual alternators and dual batteries from factory. I want to use alternator charging on a slide in camper I’m making.
My question is “does it matter which battery in the engine bay I pull a red (+) cable back to the DC to DC?”
Hidden in my question is my lack of knowing how Ford hooked up those two batteries up front. I ASSUME (yikes!…) that they are in parallel and I ASSUME the two alternators work in tandem and split the workload? Both alternators are 390A alternators.
Last is “what size DC to DC charger would you think is best if I have alternators that are 390A?”
Hey there, thanks for tuning in. I would have to dig into this to determine the setup for your specific vehicle. I have data on other vehicles but not that one. If you would like to get consulting on this, I would be glad to dig into it with Ford to help you solve this. My consulting service is available here: www.rosslukeman.com/offers/Au4HykMc Thanks again for tuning in!
I also love the way and time you spend with the displays to show us in the easiest way how to understand
Good to know you get a lot out of those explanations. I'll keep them coming!
Just FYI the blue sea ACR is NOT COMPATIBLE with lithium as the voltage connect setting is too low at 13.1v ! Therefore the house and start will almost always be connected due to the high voltage of the lithium (idle at 13.25v) you need to use a Victron LICT if you want this same setup with a VSR
Bad experience with Sterling, took a crap after mild use over two years and they only offered a small discount on a new unit.
Wow! Finally a great teacher to help along the way! I was just about to install my sterling on my boat. What timing! Getting my engine rebuilt. The mechanic is installing a 55amp charger. Any recommendation on the right size alternator to use? I’m completing a 600 lithium battle born system with almost 1500watts of solar. Was using 400amps bank for awhile Thanks!
The Orion shows no Output voltage, because no ground connection from battery to the orion exists. The ground has to be connected to the orion too.
I saw that too, he screwed up big time.
Very interesting episode I would like an episode on hybrid battery storage AGM/LITHIUM as well and how to go about fitting from a costs safety installation aspect with the different charging inputs.
Excellent information Ross, Thank you for explaining why you chose the components you did. This is Truly helpful.
Thanks Jonetta! I'm glad you found it helpful!
I happen to use the Renogy DCC30S (but that adds a solar input)
thanks for the video!
That's a good unit, thanks for tuning in.
Great teaching video. Is there a system training video that explains how a solar charger, a DC-DC charger and a shore power charger might work in concert? Assuming the do not know of each other and may overlay charging stages for the Lithium batteries?
Yessir, please check out my other video on that: th-cam.com/video/x7U9oZfoJpw/w-d-xo.html
New subscriber here and very impressed with your presentation . Question..... I just purchased 2 Vitrer 460ah lithium batteres for my custom build . I have a new 140amp alternator . I also purched a L- BIM 226 to cferent charger ?.
Thank you Sir.harge my batteries off the alternator. Now I am having second thought after watching your videos and thinking about ditching the BIM and buying the Orion smart charger like you show in this video. Will the Orion safetly charge my two 460ah batteries or should I go with a dif
I'm confused - for the relay (device One) - you had a black cable going off screen to your chassis and then ties to the chassis side of the Victron shunt. I'm happy.
For the other two devices - there was no longer a link from the Victron Shunt to the Chassis - so how do they charge the Lithium battery???
If the "U" shaped bus bar on the top of the shunt is connected directly to your chassis - then you never needed the black chassis cable for the relay.
If not - then the Lithium battery would not have charged with the B2B charger.
Good catch Mark, a mistake during filming. You must connect to the chassis to complete the charging circuit. To be updated soon.
Me too, I was looking at part two - victron - and part three - sterling - and asking myself where is the negative/ground/chassis for the li battery...?
The Sterling should be connected close to the starter battery. It shouldn't be at the back of the van. It states that in the installation instructions. I think the same applies to the Orion as well? In an ideal situation you want the B-B mounted under the seat close to the starter battery.
What page does it say that on?
How have you connected to the fuse...what is a fuse tap?
I connected to the fuse with a fuse tap. Fuse tap let's you connect electrically to a fuse.
There are 2 issues b2b chargers solved. Initially as eco alternators appeared, where starter battery is maintained at 80% and boosted while braking. Obviously this is not great if you have a house battery which is lead acid, lithium not so much as alternator voltage can go to 16v briefly while braking. I hava a basic voltage sensing relay with my setup with lithium battery, my solar panels maintain my house battery, and i have the fuse out mostly in my vsr, i can plug it in when needed and run the engine.
Thank you for the time and effort put into your content. For a first time skoolie builder, it will be a great help. I have a question though. Our shuttle bus that we recently purchased, already has two alternators. I am pulling the engine for a rebuild and would like to make any upgrades to the alternators process. Is it a good idea to dedicate one alternator for the starter batteries and the other for the house batteries? What should the set up look like with a dedicated house battery alternator? Should I stay with 12 V or go to 24 or 48? I have so many questions lol, but any advice you can give would be greatly appreciated. Thank you so much
Hey there, yes I think it's a decent idea to dedicate each alternator to the two different areas. This will reduce the load on each one. The voltage of the 2nd alternator depends on the voltage of your rear system and batteries. The higher the voltage, the lower the current in the lines, so you can use smaller cables. I have done 12V second alternators only and the lines are 2/0 running to the back. Just a positive red cable running through a fuse. The negative conducts through the alternator body itself, running through the chassis and engine block as well. So there is no negative cable to the 2nd alternator typically. You just have to bond your rear system negative to the chassis, using the same large 2/0 cable. If you would like more info, I have a course on all of this here: www.rosslukeman.com/vanpower
I use a switch connected to the Victron Orion DC-DC sharger.to turn this off with shorepower connected. I have another charger (shorpower connected) for the lead acid statrerbattery. it will sharge the Lithium battery with the wrong voltage if this switch is turned on. Use it only when driveing down the road and shargeing the the LITHIUM batterybank
Thanks for all your information....if more people about you somehow, your comments should be off the charts Jack
Thanks for tuning in and for the kind words Jack!
Please make a video using the REDARC complete system. That is the tech of the future for van life it appears.
Is the Winnebago Revel just a freak in having a stand-alone alternator for charging the house batteries? While I get that the belting and fixturing for adding an alternator to the MB engine isn't trivial, if it's such a bad idea that no one does it, is it something that Revel owners should seek to abandon?
It's just a matter of cost. It's about $3k to add that to a Sprinter. It takes the load off of your factory alternator, but most DIY builders don't want to spend that. If you throttle down the load, your factory unit can handle it. The Winnebago Revel is for the semi-luxury buyer. So it's in the budget. The ARV units out of Cleveland also have 2nd alternators, but those vans are over $300k. So it's not a bad idea, it just has to be in the budget.
@@rosslukeman ARV seems to think that solar is bogus 🤷♂️ Yeah their attention to interior detail is out of this world, and I don't begrudge those who want to pay for it. They are the EarthCruiser of the Sprinter realm. Pretty, but too pretty. This weekend, heavy overcast all weekend, our revel boiled water in our oxo kettle both mornings. The inverter complained about it the second morning, but didn't give up until just as the water came to a boil. So I guess it's getting the job done.
Great video Ross! Thanks for reviewing all the details on these options.
Thanks Larry! Glad you got something out of it!
Well, you forgot to show how much current the Victron & Sterling units charged at. Anyone can read the spec but some real numbers are always good.
Awesome video. How to determine what fuse to use for both sides of dc to dc ?
Thanks! Fuse sizes are all over the place, the manual for whatever you buy will specify what rating to use.
Fuse if based on maximum current the wires are rated for. Fuses protect your wires, not your devices.
Nice video. it would be great if you made a video for programing the Sterling
Thanks for the idea Scott, I may have to do a video for each of these going more in depth. I appreciate you tuning in!
Ross. When I fit the Victron DC 2 DC charger do I need to disable the VSR , or just leave it as is. Rgds Steve
Hi Ross
I have a Toyota Verso car with caravan behind - Knaus Sport 500 FDK ,what would your recommendation for alternator charger as I think I wood have to run a seperate large wire from under the hood where battery and alternator are located? I already have 100/30 Victron attached to my 340w of solar to my current 2 x 105ah AGM’s soon to be 300ah lithium x1. Also have BMV Victron 712, & battery protect. Also attached 2000w pure sine wave inverter (not Victron yet🙏cost) I don’t think I can run this via the normal caravan / Car hookup plug!! Thanks for your assistance in advance cheers Chris “The Aussie living in The Netherlands “ 🇦🇺🍾😎
Sterling seems to be the best way to go for 12-24v applications, but the reviews on Amazon are atrocious. Any thoughts?
I've never heard a good thing about Sterling. An engineer friend of mine pointed out a design flaw to Sterling and they threatened to sue him if he made it public....
As a Sterling user, I’d recommend to avoid using Sterling. I’m planning on replacing the unit with Victron because we are having performance issues.
@@Bahcrie they can threaten, but they can't sue for that. They'd get laffed out of court.
I am upgrading a class b+, class C RV. It already has a generator and I would like to keep it for extra redundancy. That being said how do I include the generator in my system?
Will have solar, alternator and shore power
The best is a dc to dc charger, it having a relay that takes the starting battery out of the system for a short time would work much better with at least 4gauge cable, running back to the battery,. With a heavy duty relay or contactor, disconnecting the starter batt, from the alternator, while keeping a battery connected, have both connected after starting, disconnecting the front battery, until the voltage has risen to a near equal , maybe running a wire back to sense the voltage, a couple on 200-250 amp relays and micro controller, programmed to sense voltage , maybe add a relay and scroll dc buck boost, to allow the alternator to charge the rear bank, and charge the front batt , and power things done what, with about 20 amp buck boost to prevent killing the battery, with lights and engine accessories, with near 100 amps charging the rear bank it should not take long to get to about 12.9-13.4 so both can be connected together, and charged to 14.4,, but doing the opposite would probably be best, just use a dc to dc to charge the rear battery, just shut it off when full, 20 amps isn't that much, but that con be Doubled or tripled, but would likely require a larger or double alternators, a micro controller, programmed to switch on dc boost converters, for more current, with a current sensor on the vehicle main pos, to detect current load, if it's low, charge at full power, careful to not wire it up to sense its own current load, connect directly to the alternator. With pod+ and neg- a larger gauge from alt to batt, and ground from alt case, to body/frame and battery, because the stock is on the limit, 100-130a plus amps I like to go with 6ga for very short runs, and 4gauge over 3' adding a ground, from the case to body/frame to battery, and alt pos to battery, connecting the original alt wire to the battery, if it doesn't come from there, I have seen some go to the main fuse box pos, with another 8 ga going to the battery, especially if going to a higher current alternator, 200 amps 2gauge or 1/0, or 250+2/0 cables pos and neg, from alt to battery and body, if the ground isn't replaced, it's going to burn that tiny ground strap or 8 gauge pos cable, some may be 10 gauge, I started out in car audio, pulling tons of power, killing the battery completely with the car running, with a 130amp alternator! Partly because the tiny wiring couldn't handle the extra 80-90 amps , I went to a 140 amp alt, from 105a alt, the amp was fused at 80a each, so with lights , it wasn't enough, it's not a constant 160 amps, can easily be close to 200amps in short peaks, inverters are more constant load compared, if possible adding a second 24v alt, going to a 24v bank, and equipment, with doctor dc dropping to 12/13.8v for 12v loads, probably 20a +/-, maybe use the doctor dc to charge another small 12v bank 50ah for 12v loads and 24v for the inverter, a bit complex more for large rv and campers, connected camper to the tow vehicle by 175a Anderson is not a bad idea, using the vehicle to power it , with solar as a main charging system, but you can only get so much solar, and ppl hate running low on power, having the ability to full charge the batts in about an hour is awesome, I have a slightly complex 2vank system in my off grid house, 12v for lights, cameras security system, and emergency power, 2kw inverter, for the fridge and freezer, and 12vdc for lighting, along with 120v lights, but not from 12v, a second small well pump 12vdc, to keep some water Incase of a low main bank voltage, another reason for the 12v backup system, I can connect jumper cables to a car and charge it if needed, I'm building a 100amp dc generator, to charge it to 13.8v, when needed, and another capable of charging and powering the main inverter, while putting about 150a in the batteries! I'm thinking about adding a inverter to it making it also a inverter generator, also a dc generator, just add about 50 ah lead acid battery to start it, and as a buffer keeping the inverter happy!!. Sorry to ramble!! Have an awesome day!!
We had Renogy 50A DC DC charger in our Ford Transit but we heard you mention we can connect 2 DC DC charger to get double the amperage to charge house battery bank.
How can we wire them?
Thank you for all your gray helpful videos 😊
Q
I have a 7 pin plug on my van
I know it changes the battery for the brake away on the trailer
I am going to have battery powered for both with inverter
The van is for work
Butt I can Have 2 trailers
1 is RV
The other is Fiber optic test and repair lab
I want to change both when working
I use the isolated because of ham radio use plans.
Thanks David, makes sense.
If I have 300 watts litium batteries, can I use the Vitron Orion 30 amp?
8:10 we have this issue in car audio and fixed it with a “battery” made from super capacitors.
Interesting, thanks
Ross, this is great info! We have a 2020 Ford Transit with heavy duty alternator connected with a Sterling 1260 charger going to 600ah lifepo4 battery bank. We have not yet installed the ‘ignition on’ wire.
We’ve had six months of great charging, but recently we’ve had issues where the house batteries only seem to get power from the Sterling during idle, or when the van is moving but only during periods when the gas is not being applied.
Any ideas? Thanks☺️
Hi Krysta, great question. It sounds like the voltage coming from your alternator is varying under different conditions (idling, accelerating, etc) and the Sterling is reacting to that. A lot of these chargers have "engine-on detection" settings and if they are not dialed in correctly, this can happen. The ignition signal wire may bypass a lot of that and give the charger more of an "on-off" functionality without having to detect whether the engine is running.
Personally if I were to troubleshoot this, I would measure the DC voltage between the "IN" and "GND" terminals of the Sterling with a multimeter, and have someone drive around or at least vary the engine RPMs while I took this measurement. Ford is not calling these alternators "Smart," but they could still be tied into the vehicle computer and have some kind of variable-voltage technology to save fuel or reduce the alternator's load on the engine during acceleration. In short though, if this voltage is varying then that could be tripping the Sterling on and off. Check the voltage as described and the Sterling's settings, perhaps adding the ignition wire if you can't fix it with adjusting the settings alone. Hope that helps!
Great teaching video. Is there a system training video that explains how a solar charger, a DC-DC charger and a shore power charger might work in concert? Assuming the do not know of each other and may overlay charging stages for the Lithium batteries?
@@liveslowsailfastonlanier1374 the stages are voltage defined- each charger will apply a charge based on the voltage it finds.
hi I think to make it better you should discharge the house battery down 25 % before each test than the charger have a equal load
Thanks, great suggestion. I'll look to do that in the next one.
Can we connect DC DC Charger positive cable directly to engine battery Post ? What is pro and con?
Hi Ross, could you explain why you'd choose this option over a victron argofet charge splitter or visa versa? I use a 3 output argofet on my boat to use my alternator to charge 3 battery banks, but this would work also.
On a boat application, should I ground the victron directly to my engine AGM battery or on the negative bus bar ( witch is also connected to my engine battery)?
Should I get the isolated version of the victron?
Hi Michel, for boats, you might ask Peter Kennedy at PKYS (Peter Kennedy Yacht Services). pkys@pkys.com He's a major Victron dealer in North America and has worked on boat power systems since the 1990's. He may tell you to use the isolated version. How you ground the unit to your engine battery depends on whether the unit is isolated or non-isolated. I use non-isolated in most cases, but it may not be right for boats. Not sure.
@3:49 Why is that fuse there? What wire is it protecting? It looks to be on a ? #6 wire? Shouldn't the fuses be near the source of power? In this case, shouldn't the fuse be near the vehicle battery? Or would it go between the LiFePo4 battery and the buss bar? I'm confused. Please clarify and educate on the purpose of fuses.
Okay, after @9:30 you somewhat indicate we've wasted our time learning how bad the relay system is. You did also note a fuse at the vehicle battery (that can blow under non-fault conditions), and that the small wire is a #4. And yet, my main query stands. Why is that fuse there?
Might be a stupid question, but here goes. Shouldn't one also be concerned about the charge-curve from the alternator to the starter battery? It seems that most of the diagrams I can find connects the alternator more or less directly to the starter battery.
Hi Henrik, I think this is a good question. My answer is no, you don't need a charge curve because the load on the alternator never ends when the engine is running, because the engine has to fire the spark plugs, run the vehicle computer, etc. So you would never have a multi-stage charge curve or algorithm, because if you reduce the power going to the battery and vehicle, the starter battery would immediately begin to deplete. The house batteries are a different story because they don't have loads on them 100% of the time. At some point they're full and the charge rate should be dropped. The scenario with the starter battery is different, as the alternator is connected to it, but also to everything else requiring power while the vehicle is in operation. If you change the output of the alternator, it affects the operation of the vehicle and engine. Hope that helps, great question!
I want one of these for my lithium. But noone seems to be able to give me a straight answer. I have a boat yanmar engine with a 35amp alternator.. But some say i shouldn't get a 30 amp charger because of alternator overheating issues that could occur
It makes sense that it might overheat, as these units tend to pull their full rating (i.e. this unit will pull a full 30 amps from your alternator when bulk charging a battery). It would be like having a 35 horsepower engine, and putting an extra load on it requiring 30 horsepower. It would overload it. Victron makes some smaller 9-amp and 18-amp DC-DC converters that have a constant voltage output (not multi-stage chargers). However they would limit the charging current, and since normal alternators are single-voltage output, it would be like charging right off of the alternator, but you could set the charging voltage, and it would limit the current to protect the alternator. Here they are:
shop.pkys.com/Victron-Energy-ORI121222110-Orion-TR-1212-18A-Isolated-DC-DC-converter_p_6687.html
shop.pkys.com/Victron-Energy-ORI121210110-Orion-Tr-1212-9A-110W-Isolated-DC-DC-converter_p_6996.html
Hope that helps!
Can I replace this item to my front under hood agm batteries and keep relay systems and change back agm batteries to lithium batteries?
Hey there, no, if you use lithium batteries in the back, then relays are not a good idea. You would use a DC-DC charger.
What happened to the last charger' blue sea?????
The Blue Sea relay was the first demo in the video.
30a charger would work on off grid application as well?
Main battery bank is connected to solar panel with Mppt charger and I’m trying to charge different bank from main bank. Is it possible that way? Thanks
Hi Thomas, yes it would work to charge your second bank, with the first bank being charged by solar. Unless they are the same type/age of battery, then just link the banks and let the solar do its thing.
If I have Balmar external alternator controller do I still need victron Orion dc to dc to charge lithium?
No you would typically just need one or the other.
I just installed a 220-Amp Power Bastards alternator. I intend to charge (6) 100-Amp hour LiFePo4 batteries. Does anybody have any real world experience on what would be a practical maximum amperage draw my new alternator can handle without seriously affecting its lifespan? It does not use an overdrive pulley, by the way.
The victron actually outputs 37. or 38 amps, more than it is rated, and sucks about 45 amps out of the alternator. Really do not want to go much higher for most alternators, at low rpm, they WILL OVERHEAT.
Thanks Charly
Having fun b2b’s for 16 years, I gave up on alternator temp monitoring after they never overheated.
Hi, I have the same question I just really want to know ASAP: Is there a DC-DC Battery Charger that's good for more like 400 or 800 amps instead of just 20 or 40 amps at 12 volts? Because what If you ran it with mechman aftermarket 400a alternators?
Hi Vince, they have a new one from Sterling Power that does 200 amps, but that's the biggest I've seen. You can double or triple any of these chargers up and wire them in parallel to multiply output. You typically have to have loads or batteries that need that much power though, and that's not the case for most people. You also have to look at the torque on the engine. The more amps you pull out of these alternators, the more resistance on the engine and that will drop mileage slightly. Hope that helps.
@@rosslukeman Yes. That definitely helps a lot. Thank you so much. My engine is modified to help with this purpose. The alternators peak output at 1850 rpms which isn't very high for the engine. The components typically powered by the crank pulley on the fan belt are now all electric run including the engine fan, water pump, power steering pump, and A/C compressor. The engine itself cranks out 403/417 hp/trq stock, but I've added the previously mentioned upgrades, as well as a cold air intake, high flow exhaust system, and an upgraded tune on the ECU for better efficiency so I'm sure those things help to combat the drag from alternator resistance.
@@vincenzopromedia how big is the battery bank you are charging?
@@chachi5975 about 20kwh. 4x tesla model s battery modules. 5.1 - 5.3kwh each.
@@vincenzopromedia wouldn't it be difficult to find wire thick enough to handle that kind of amperage for something like that? I'm baffled by the 800amps you mentioned.
Thank you
Thanks for checking out the video!
I have a 24V, 600 amp hour lithium iron phosphate bank that I would like to charge from the alternator. Victron makes a 12 to 24 V DC to DC charge,r but I think it's limited to 15 Amps. Would take a very long time to charge at that rate. I see that sterling has some larger ones, but the reviews are horrible on Amazon.
Do you know of any other alternatives with higher output?
You can put multiple Victron DC-DC chargers in parallel if required
Sterling has a new high-amperage 24-12 model coming out in January which has been redesigned. It's on their UK website: sterling-power.com
Thank you. The new charger from Sterling is crazy expensive. I will go with two Victron's.
@@Deltro61 That's understandable, should work fine. I would just leave some space around them, these DC-DC chargers run at their rated amperage and they get toastier than other components.
Can't use the link to your website, "Connection not secure"
Thanks for the heads up Wolf, there seems to be a problem connecting to the server. I've got tech support helping, hopefully it will be back soon. I appreciate it!
@@rosslukeman I'm planning on doing exactly this for my work van. Adding a couple batteries in the back for charging tools. Wish 12v tool chargers were not 3 times the cost of a regular charger! 🤦🏼♂️
@@Wolf-xi4if Sounds like a good idea, I always thought work vans needed a power system for charging and running tools like that. I understand on the chargers, once you get away from 110v everything goes way up in price. Hope this video helped with your plan!
I'm still looking for pros/cons of running the Victron off the start battery v. off the alternator which the instructions seem to recommend. Any insight from anyone?
Hi Victor, I can see what you mean about the instructions seeming to indicate a direct alternator connection (especially their diagram in the data sheet for the Orion). You are fine doing that if you find a lug to connect to on the alternator. However, since the engine battery is on the same circuit as the alternator, you are just connecting to a different location of the same loop. It is not necessary to connect at the physical alternator or the physical engine battery, you just want to tie into the circuit they are on. This is easy done at the driver's seat, and most van manufacturers provide hookups there for you to tie into the alternator/battery circuit.
Its because the alternator is the energy source so you don't get a voltage drop, shorter cable length is better,you want your victron and battery near to the alternator as possible .
I'm so disappointed. You told us you were going to show us the watts in the smart shunt. That would give us apple to apple comparison. You did that for the relay, then fummmmmmmmmmmble for the Victron DC-DC . I didn't make it any farther. What happened?
Great point Mike, I will be sure to do that in the next version of this video.
So if you wind up in a scenario where the battery bank is depleted to the point where it causes the fuse to blow, what’s the solution for charging back up? An external charger?
Yes.
Usually these vans will have at least one other charging source. I have had two vans with relays blow fuses like this, and they both had solar. One of them also had shore power. You could also use a battery charger as you mentioned. Thanks for the great question!
Time to look at Sterling Power's new line of DC/DC Charge Controllers. Their 40A model features bi-directional charging to keep the start battery topped off. Way way more efficient than Victron...
th-cam.com/video/5IEdNzRq68o/w-d-xo.html
Thank you!
After using a Sterling for a year now, I actively recommend people NOT use their products. I’ve had nothing but trouble with their product. I plan to replace our Sterling with a Victron unit. I’ll look at the video, but it would have to do something amazing for me to even consider it.
@@briannorwick Which model did you have specifically?
@@srira7910 I have the BB1260 with Green Stripe (latest version as of 2020)
It worked well for approximately six months. Now, without any settings being changed, it will only charge at idle or when there is no power applied during a downhill descent. And only at a max of 38 amps, usually closer to 20 amps.
It's connected via CCP2 on the Ford Transit, which outputs 175amps if required from my 2x250AMP alternators.....
@@briannorwick Are you open to contacting their support person in England? He is super on it with issues, and actually cares about their line of products. Just sayin.
So no one is going to acknowledge the cow? Lol
Ha! Moo! ;-) Too busy trying to figure out all the tech oddities, such as a ground wire that leaves the screen instead of going to the ground buss bar, and the ? 100a fuse placement.
Running a car or van , truck after 5 minuets standing still motors won’t last …
oscillating
Sterling is overpriced in my opinion