Emporia Vue Energy Monitor - Gen 3 vs. Gen 2 - NEW FOR 2024
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- In this video, Chris compares two generations of the Emporia Vue energy monitor, installs the newest model and shows how it works.
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I LOVE LOVE LOVE my Emporia devices! I'm doing a remodel and will have a TON of circuits. I'm glad to read on their site I can do "nesting" so I can track MANY circuits beyond 16... well, if they all fit in the panel, right?!?!
Thanks I hadn’t heard that.
One thing I did on my vue 2 was combine two breaker circuits into one current clamp channel to have better coverage with only 16 channels. You get the combination sum of both circuits as a result. It sums the current. If you do this make sure you put clamp on the circuits that share the same split phase connection. If you don’t they will not add, they will cancel each other out.
I never thought of that! Thanks for the tip!
@jeffmucha So to clarify, you can install one Emporium circuit clamp over two circuits at the same time (example: two 15amp breakers next to each other - same leg) and the Vue will give you the average of both circuits?
i believe you can buy another setup and they will work together in the app.
FYI- If you need more than 16 CT's you can also install a second Vue and NEST it and get more CT's.
Thanks!
I bought the version 3 using your link below, you earned it as I wanted to know how this thing worked AND, nothing in the box really told me where to hook up the main supply wires. LOL...Install was easy, I have a 30 place box, 3 double breakers, a place to power this unit, it did get crowded, but not too bad, connecting the device to the app and network went fast and flawless, it logged in and booted up instantly. I am short a few items, but I chose the most important and don't really think I need a second kit for the last 4 things. Thanks for doing the video, this company got their money worth sending you the kit. BTW my balance is pretty good so far, I gotta crank everything up and test it out under full load! This stuff is fun to mess with!
Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for using my link. 🥰
Great video. Just ordered mine. Had a major solar system installed last year. Finally getting full monitoring between production/usage and now our main subpanel in The farmhouse. I can now monitor the barn and the individual circuits within the house. Excellent information and very much appreciate it! Keep up the good work.
Thanks so much 😊
Excited for this review! Was right on the verge of picking up one.
If gen 3 maxes at 16 circuits how many did gen 2 max at?
Same. They both can handle up to 16 branch circuits.
I use a Sense energy monitor at my house and it is slow to recognize electrical devices. The Emporia Vue is an interesting device.
It’s a different approach than Sense.
For the dryer circuit, you may want to measure both branches, since the motor tends to run on 120V and the heater on 240V.
Huh. I didn’t know that. Thanks!
Nice video! You did a really good job detailing everything. Did you end up using the ethernet cable or are you using the wifi connection?
I have strong WiFi in my garage because the router is in the laundry room adjacent.
Emporia should come up with a system that allows twice as many CT sensors! Say 32 sensors. Nowadays, many electrical panels have 40 circuits.
It would be a no-brainer from their standpoint. They already have everything developed. Just increase price by 50% to cover the extra sensors. They’d probably profit even more.
Not sure how they chose 16 as the max for one unit.
I have not done so, so I’m not sure what it looks like. But, Emporia’s website does note that you can use two smart monitors on the same panel and nest them together within the app.
Something to try, if you still have your Gen 2.
@@handydadtv I am guessing it is because of the available IO pins on an ESP32 chip that is the brains of the operation. I just ordered a kit myself! Thanks for your video. I am trying to find what is causing me to have a $600+ a month electric bill in a 2100'sqft home (guessing it is my geothermal).
@neilyboy Let me know when you get the answer!
@neilyboy I have a 2400sqft home I only pay like 28 a month due to solar but even without solar we only paid 340 with full home air-conditioning
Great video with lots of helpful infomration!
Glad it was helpful 👍🏻
Good video! I'm using off-grid solar, so I need not only power (watts), I also need volts, amps, volt-amps, and power factor. A huge concern for off-grid is start-up surges from things like refrigerators and air conditioners/heat pumps.
You are running your own power utility! Very impressive.
The additional power readings you are asking, volt-amps and power factor, can be determined by using voltage and current.
This is a very helpful video. Thanks for sharing. I just got solar panels installed on my house and am looking for a home energy monitoring solution. Have you done any research into the Sense Energy Monitor? Is it supposed to use machine learning to "detect" devices as opposed to physical wires like the Emporia? Thank you.
I never used it but some of my viewers have and they said Sense can’t detect a lot of devices.
Wish they had smart plugs that handled full 15A and maybe a 20A version as well... My freeze dryer runs for 24-48 hrs straight and can pull upwards of 1500W+ when the vacuum pump, compressor and heating elements are all running... Smart Plugs are only rated at 10A, or 15A Peak for 1 hour/day...
This is a 20-amp smart outlet (not Emporia) a.co/d/a2v8du4?tag=ha0d9f-20
Nice review. I have the Sense currently and im in the process of a renovation thinking of adding the Emporia. I like the sense web app a lot but wish it did better at device detection
They take different approaches. If Sense adds circuit CTs, it could fine tune the device detection and be a really killer product.
Best company
Thanks
do the instructions explain that if you are going to use the Ethernet connector, that the Emporia box should probably be kept outside the panel, since you aren't supposed to run Low Voltage and Line Voltage in the same enclosure, without a suitable separator of some kind?
I'm not an electrician, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, last night, and this came up when I installed a gang box with both AC, Ethernet and coax (from different conduits, but into the same box).
Makes sense but I’m not sure.
Fantastic video! Question: if there is a power cut in my house, and I am away in another city, will the Emporia app send me an alarm or any notification? Thank you
Yes. I get notifications when it’s offline.
Niceeee... vid. Well done. I have the Gen 2 and it works simply great!
I’d been using the Gen 2 for years and it was great.
Nice video. Can you use it to monitor certain circuits? Example: I have a well pump that is powered through my breaker box, and instead of installing a water monitoring device, I can just do this and monitor if the pump is operating when it shouldn't be, or for periods of time that is incorrect. If the pump isn't running, not that much water can leak, but if the pump is running continuously, regardless of where the leak is, I have a big problem. Example: can you have the program send you an alert if it runs above so many amps / hour, or runs for so many minutes? Also, if you have two breaker boxes, do you just run the wires somehow to across the two boxes, or does that create a problem. Thank you.
Yes, you can have it send notifications if usage on a circuit goes above or below a threshold over a certain period of time.
I use that feature to let me know if my electric range has been left on too long, or if my refrigerator stops running.
I wonder if they have it setup to use a gen 2 and gen 3 together. I know you could use a multiple of the gen 2 units but it was a bit clunky in the app. I would love to add a gen 3 as the main one and then use my gen 2 for all of the remaining circuits.
You can definitely use them together but it will treat them as two different houses.
Hey @handydadtv loved the video, thanks! May I ask roughly where you live and what size solar system you have installed? I am considering adding solar and the info would be greatly appreciated!!
Mine is 10kW.
Thanks for sharing your experience unboxing and installing Gen 3. Question - How did you connect your solar production to the emporia app? I didnt see any connections made in your installation part.
Just with normal CTs but the circuits are configured as solar generation in the app.
@@handydadtvDid you reverse the CT, or is there a reversal option in your app assignment for it?
No need to reverse. Configure it as solar generation in the app.
Hi! nice video :) If you want to meter the consumption per month, is it posible per each sensor? or the info is just showed in real time?
Data for each circuit can be reported by second, minute, hour, day, week, month and year.
Nice video, very informative. Does the Vue measure the total electric consumption on the main phase wires so that I can compare the total consumption to the sum of the individual sensors that are installed? Thanks
Yes, if you feel the need to retest what they’ve tested, but that will only work if you have 16 or less branch circuits. Otherwise you’ll always have more consumption on the mains than the sum of the branches.
Can you use this in Canada.
I assume so.
Interesting product and well done on the video. Does this show Watt hour in the details?
Yes depending on the timeframe. If the timeframe is “Seconds”, it shows current kilowatt consumption. If you change it to “Day”, it shows the kilowatt hours.
I want solar on my roof, Ranch house, no trees blocking my roof and the sun (when it's not cloudy) is shining down all day long. Besides, those panels might block some heat in summer... ahh but what happens in winter when it's always cloudy and snow get's on them? Great video, I think I am going to get this thing, I want to use in home assistant, just so I have one GUI to view all my stuff.
Thanks for doing this video, I just found this product and wanted some information about it (4/30/24) One more thing, I rewired a lot of my house and not 100% sure if I have each leg well balanced, this device will help with that too.
I never thought of the leg rebalancing use case! I gotta look into that. Thanks!
Good day. Thanks for sharing. I have a question. If you add the two large CT's to measure the whole house usage plus the 8 or 16 that go into separate circuits.
If you use both... Does the system know that the 16 individuals are part of the total measured by the big CT's? or does it sum 16 small loads to a big total load?
I want to make sure we won´t have information errors by using both
and the reason I ask is because I want to use it precisely on a home that have more than 16, so I am planning to measure the total, but still want to be able to measure the big loads on the home, such as AC, pool heater, etc. Thanks and great channel you have here.
It knows the branch circuits are part of the mains.
Yes that's how it comes
Very helpful video. I just got rid of a Sense system because it was (1) slow to recognize devices, if at all, and (2) could not accurately track solar input and produce the net metering values you showed with the Vue. I am curious what connections with Vue enabled extracting the solar and net metering data.
Thanks but I can’t answer.
Very good video on a subject that is of great interest to me. We have solar panels for a few months now and I couldn't figure out how you incorporated your solar production in with your home energy use in the Emporia Vue app; or was it Home Assistant? I'd love to do that. Thanks for the great video.
At that point, I was only using the Emporia app. Since then, I added the Home Assistant integration, but I still use the Emporia app.
@@handydadtv Thanks for getting back to me. How can you access your solar production from within the Emporia app? I only see the Emporia CTs connected to your electrical panel, and nothing indicating any connection to solar. I assumed the integration of grid and solar would only come with Home Assistant.
Two CTs are on the inverter lines. They are configured in the Vue as Solar/Generation.
My Vue 3 just arrived today !! one question, how the heck are you monitoring the solar generation through the app?
I’m really curious about that aspect.
Put CTs on the circuit breaker that connects to your inverter. Configure them as Circuit Type = Solar/Generation.
thanks handydad, i'm sold!
Glad it was helpful 👍🏻
Hi, thanks for all of the valuable info!
Two Questions:
Did you have to buy extra CT sensor clips for your Solar System?
Is there a way you analyze more than 16 circuits?
I gave 32 separate circuits in my electrical panel (about 8 of those are double breakers)
I don’t think you can buy CTs individually. They come with the VUE.
Pretty sure you can use multiple VUEs but they may appear as two separate houses.
Did you notice better accuracy? I have a gen 2 and they do some hand waving about what is “zero power use.” For example, many things draw tiny amounts of power just to be plugged in. I think they say if it is less than the error budget, let’s call that zero power. Did you notice higher accuracy or the ability to see tiny loads that you couldn’t before? Can you tell if a cell phone charger is using 2 watts or 1 watt?
I didn’t do a head to head test. I have to trust their data.
Have you considered or with the Gen 2 flashing with ESPHome?
I’ve considered it but I’m very happy with their app. And I can export the data to do my own analysis.
That's exactly what I did. The only thing I like about 3 that I don't about 2 is the instead of a pin it's more secure connection. But I am sure the new one probably will take time to have esphome flashed. Love esphome on the 2nd gen.
Is there a web interface for browsing from a desktop PC instead of app? (or an industrial version for offices?)
There is a browser version. Go to emporiaenergy.com and scroll all the way down. Click the Web App link.
Great Video, Gen 3 looks worth it
Thanks 😊
I see 4 circuits on the left side that are not clamped are you not monitoring those?
Correct. If you have more than 16 circuits, you can’t monitor them all. But they are still calculated in the overall usage from the mains.
I still stand by my comments for your first review :)
I guess I’ll have to go look back.
The old generation 2 was not able to measure active power and distinguish it to passive and apparent power. This gives wrang results in case of inductive loads. Do you know if gen3 is able to measure active power ?
Your knowledge exceeds my own! I suggest you contact the company and ask that question.
I'm confused. On the installation instructions on the app, it states to use two CT's ( one on each leg ) of a double pole breaker for better accuracy yet on the provided "Helpful Tips" card ( inside the box on the top when you first open it ) it states " Connect to only one lead,then use a multiplier in the app"
The only place I saw that said to use one on each leg was for solar.
@@handydadtv yes, when you are monitoring solar input(production), put separate CT for each leg for more accurate measurement. That's what i was instructed to do by the company. working well for me.
Larger Clamps - sales in UK and EU fall / complaints rise!
Can you get the data out yet? Other than CSV downloads?
CSV is the only export option I know of.
well done sir,, will buy soon.
Glad it was helpful 👍🏻
Can WE send the data on our Home Assistant.
I don't want a cloud solution (useless for domotic and useless for privaty)
Yes if you flash it with ESPHome.
Nowhere I can find shows the length of the wires for the sensors. Any way you can provide that?
Gen 2 was 39” so Gen 3 is approximately 42”.
@@handydadtv Thank you
if you want to monitor both legs of another 240v besides the main input can that be done? I have a generator 240v input that I want to monitor as well.
You can configure the generator circuit just like solar.
@@handydadtv I heard the app cant be used if the internet is down. Is that still true?
@jjay718 That’s true, but the Vue still saves the data so when the Internet comes back, no data will be missing.
Does this pass code in Florida?
I don’t know if Florida has their own electrical code, but there’s nothing in the National Electrical Code that prevents you from using it.
Can I read kwh on a monthly basis?
Yes. Second, day, week, month, and year.
Can it show the voltage measurements in 3 phase circuits ?
Yes
Can the CT's be split up with some in a main panel and some in a critical circuits subpanel, using just one Vue monitor?
I assume so, if it was close enough.
@@handydadtvThey are right next to each other. One is fed from the grid and the other from the solar panel inverter.
Hello friend, I have the gen2 and it works well. What I don't like is that when there is an interruption in the internet service, the vue does not save information about my consumption and then update it in the cloud when the internet returns again and I would like to know if they have already resolved it. This is in the new version, I don't know if you have noticed this problem.
I never noticed this issue with my Gen2 or Gen3.
Hello friend, it is very simple, leave the vue gen2 without access to Wi-Fi for 30 continuous minutes and you will see the problem, the graphics remain frozen until the Wi-Fi returns, I have already informed the brand's support about this and I would like to know if it They corrected it in the new version.
Do you know if you can install two units and run them on same app account if you more than 16 circuits? Great video thanks for taking time to make.
I’m not sure so I’m checking with the company.
@@handydadtv did you ever get an answer to this?
@@josephlee9008 @handydadtv I'd like to know this answer also. I bought two kits, and I am ready to install them this weekend. Great video by the way!
@MyVideos913 I never got a definitive answer. Try it and let us know.
@@MyVideos913 on their website it says two Gen 3’s can be used together in same panel and or sub panel. They refer to this as “nesting”
Can two of these units be used together? I have a sub panel.
Yes but they will appear as two homes.
Is the data accessed in the App cloud based? So if Emporia ever shuts down you can no longer see the use data?
Yes it is cloud-based but they freely allow you to download your data. You can do that annually or even monthly to mitigate your risk.
@@handydadtv that's better than nothing but it's more about losing access to everything permanently if they go out of business.
Is it worth upgrading over gen 2?
Not unless you really need Ethernet.
Is the 3rd Gen really that much better then the 2nd Gen if you dont have solar and just want to monitor daily usage and real time usage?
Gen2 may not be as accurate. But it doesn’t sound like a big deal for you.
@@handydadtv i was trying to wait on your reply, but I just order the gen 3 lol
@SGAOuTLaWz Still a good choice. 👍🏻
The rat's nest of wires looks like my computer case. Cable management is not my friend.
Still using eyedro, only on mains though
👍🏻
I bought one of these back in April in returned it. I found it extremely unreliable and the way it clutters up the box is just ridiculous. Also the app looks like it was written by a couple college students in 2004. Simple stuff like, after you set it up wanting to change one of the circuits to represent a 220 line couldn't be done. You had to delete the whole installation and start over. More importantly when you watch something live numbers just jumped all over the place. And that are returning it and just installed the sense unit. I've only had it for a day so it's detected all of two things, but at least the current reading makes more sense. I think this has potential but in its current state it's just junk.
Not sure why you’re not able to change the multiplier on a circuit after it’s defined. I have no issue with that.
Agree about the space it takes in the panel. It’s a lot of wires for sure but independent CTs are much more accurate than Sense’s algorithm that looks for usage patterns to identify when an appliance is running.
Does the Vue gen 3 or the app show the actual, real time voltage ? It must calculate the power consumption using a voltage measurement with the CT's but it would be nice if it provided a readout on the app of the voltage.
You can find Volts under Units of Measurement.