A Pac-12/Mountain West "reverse merger" is complicated--but possible l Pac-12 Podcast
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
- Oregon State and Washington State are still waiting to see what their conference realignment fate will be for 2024 and beyond. One option on the table is a "reverse merger" with the Mountain West in which the latter would operate under the umbrella of the PAC. It's an option, but will have serious hurdles.
On today's episode of Locked On Pac-12, Spencer McLaughlin also gets you ready for the upcoming full week of Pac-12 Football games which will see every team in the league in action. There was more betting line movement that might be indicative of Cam Rising's health for Utah tonight.
Utah plays a massive game for the program on Thursday night when they take on the Florida Gators. But with the league's future essentially obselete, does it help other PAC schools for a resume-building win against an SEC school?
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A Pac-12/Mountain West "reverse merger" is complicated--but possible
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The PAC 12 needs to fire George K---then make the reverse merger move and name Gloria Nevarez as the new commissioner
She wouldnt leave mwc
Agree totally. Then you can operate as the PAC 12/14/16 and negotiate a media rights deal for the new PAC. It's not going to be the reported $30 million a team that they squandered but most likely better then the $5-6 Million the MWC is getting now. Honestly the remaining PAC schools would probably have a better shot at the expanded playoffs in this format then the old PAC 12. I'm a Duck fan but I would rather watch OSU or WSU play a MWC team then say Iowa vs Rutgers.
Why would George K be involved in this at all? Gloria Nevarez would be the commissioner. Pay the guy off and good bye.
Agreed. Later George.
SJSU is the problem… maybe agree to play all home games against PAC4 in Levi. Hawaii and others also are a drag and add expenses😢
I see your future! It's Locked on Pac14. Just a 2 hr. drive to Vegas to watch ORST vs UNLV in football. Better yet Gonzaga vs UNLV in basket ball. Start beating the drum and ringing that bell!!
The disrespect for the MWs top teams is getting a little ridiculous. The AAC loses their top 3 teams & somehow ppl still try to perceive the AAC as the stronger conference. Plz! Stop with the eastern biases
You won't hear such talk on this show! AAC is still a good league but it's a far cry from what it has been at the moment
Boise, Fresco, SDSU and AFA > SMU, East Carolina, Tulane & Memphis. In face, not even close
@@davidbrown386 I disagree, BSU & FSU are really good, but so is UTSA & Tulane. Memphis is pretty good as well. SDSU & AFA are fair to mid. I have been watching some of the AAC games from last year. I have been watching the MWC over the past 30 plus years. Watch some of their games first.
n
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you gotta look at the teams history & not get caught up in recent "success" which UTSA bring little to nothing... Tulane had a great season last year but over the course of eternity hasn't been much at all .... the top of the MW & the top of the AAC isn't really comparable.
Sun Belt may be better than the MWC this season.
Pre-season SP+ ratings for top teams...
Sun Belt:
54. Troy
65. James Madison
66. South Alabama
MWC:
67. Fresno St
68. Boise St
77. Air Force
the "Pac" can remain a "Power 5" Conference with a minimum of 6 schools .... if the goal is to be a "Power 5" Conference ... Mountain West schools joining the "Pac" would accomplish that ... the remaining Pac schools joining the MWC means that MWC remains a "G5" conference ..... 1) Fire George Kliavkoff 2) Gloria Nevarez should be the new commissioner ....
it wont
That's exactly what we plan on doing. Gloria will be the new Commissioner for sure. George will not only be fred, but lucky if he doesn't leave with a lawsuit too.
Don't forget the Biggest Opportunity with The Reverse Merger. The Pac-12 "After Dark" late Games that have always got really good ratings. There's currently a Big Gaping Hole that is left becayse no other Conference can realistically schedule these games every week, due to Geographic Hurdles.
So this is the Big Carrot you dangle, when negotiating a new TV Contract with new Moutain Wes Teams that are mostly in the Western & Mountain Time Zones.
Co-Commissioners if this happens. Maybe call it Pac-West and keep the tv-deal. Now with Fox and ESPN talking about helping OSU and WSU goto the Big-12. So there are more options coming out of the Wood-Work now. Which would be the best - that's a Golden question.
There's no way you let that failure Kliavkoff remain anywhere near a leadership role just purely based upon cause.
Spencer, if the Reverse Merger happened the Presidents/Chancellors of the 13 school Pac-12 would be in charge of approving things - not the Commissioner. So if the 11 old MWC schools, once a member of the Pac-12, decided to replace the Commissioner they would have the votes. They could vote to have Gloria N. replace George K. If the MWC went away then CBS and Fox would be looking for a replacement and the obvious option is the reformed Pac-12 and its 13 teams.
It would become tricky legally because those presidents had authority in the MWC and idk if it would automatically transfer over to the new PAC
@@LockedOnCollegeFootball Looking at the Pac-12 Bylaws found online, once a former MWC schools were official a member of the Pac-12 their President/Chancellor would have full voting authority. It would probably require a quick two step process done next July 1 when the 10 current Pac-12 schools (presuming Cal/Stanford head to the ACC) when only OSU and WSU are sole members, they would vote 2-0 to revised the Bylaws/Governing documents to remove the old schools and name the new 11 schools as members of the Pac-12.
“Except as otherwise provided by law or in the Conference Governing Documents, the business and affairs of the Conference shall be managed by or under the direction of the CEO Group. The CEO Group shall be the governing body of the Conference. Any request for Board action shall mean action by the CEO Group. Any reference to “director” shall refer to member(s) of the CEO Group.”
“Each member of the Conference shall have one representative on the CEO Group which shall be the President of the member (“Chief Executive Officer”), except as to the University of California, Berkeley; the University of California, Los Angeles; and the University of Colorado, Boulder, the respective Chancellor shall be considered the Chief Executive Officer.”
“The Commissioner shall be the Chief Executive Officer of the Conference and shall direct all of the activities of the Conference. The Commissioner shall be responsible for ensuring that the objectives, policies, and orders of the CEO Group are implemented. The Commissioner shall also perform such other duties incident to that office and delegated by the CEO Group or this Constitution and Bylaws. The Commissioner shall be chosen by the CEO Group. The Commissioner shall be entitled to attend all meetings of the CEO Group, the Council, and all committees of the Conference and the Council.”
They have the time to figure it out. All the other moves are done. Announce intent to merge pending figuring out at all the issues and an upgraded media deal. They could do this over the remainder of the year if needed.
Can we all agree that "2PAC" would be an amazing name or aren't ready for that conversation yet?
Yes
What needs to happen is the PAC needs to file for bankruptcy in order to get rid of the huge debt stacked on them with GK leaving. Then, the PAC will be able to merge with the MWC hopefully as a power conference. It is my belief that GK is the reason why there is no media deal for the PAC in terms of the relationship between GK and the media rights companies. Please understand! The PAC 12 is about to become a "shell" company waiting for an organization like the MWC to take over the PAC 12 with the MWC commissioner taking the controls over the PAC 12.
We should have brought the best mountain west teams on board the second the Cali schools bailed.
SDSU, SMU, Boise, Fresno. Add those 4. Take the $30M/year deal. Should have happened, and it didn't
@@LockedOnCollegeFootball Agreed. Unfortunately certain elements within the PAC12 looked down their academic noses at those additions, so it never happened. They forgot that winning programs in revenue sports are just as important (if not more so) when it comes to an athletic conference.
Sadly you're right@@jesterscorner879
If reverse merge?...for remaining Pac2 with MWC. They should invite Gonzaga Zags regardless of no football program. Just a thought? Go Seattle Mariners ⚾️
Hawaii if it was ideal and better invested would have been a good football only member.
Everyone should invite Gonzaga.
But to actually GET them, there will be a cost. And the MWC isn’t paid enough.
@@PCSPounder Reports that Big 12 is interested in Gonzaga. The current commissioner of Mountain West used to be commissioner of WCC which Gonzaga member of.
@@tylernelson3343 But the b12 ended that when the Four Corners arrived.
Gonzaga gets a pretty sweetheart deal in the WCC. The b12 sold their soul for football and won’t get paid for more mouths to feed.
@@PCSPounder yeah I always thought that Gonzaga going to Mountain West was long shot.
George needs to step down if mountain west mergers with pac 2
Facts... DROPPING SOME KNOWLEDGE on y'all.
Yeah Boise state needs to fire their coach.
The pack 12 network games needs to be aired local networks.
Great information as always. The contract lawyers can work this out under most scenarios. Oregon State and Washington State can fire GK if they want, when Stanford and Cal leave, but he may be due some money, so that may or may not be advisable. The "merger deal" can also provide for GN, as this happens all the time in merger deals. Trust me, the lawyers can take of all kinds of situations.
Lawyers will almost certainly be involved if they aren't already
There is no way that George Kliavkoff will be retained is OSU and WSU keeps the PAC alive.
Don’t see any of the three options you have proposed happening.
The MWC, doesn’t have the money needed for OSU/WSU.
Other than SDSU and Colorado St, OSU/WSU is not interested in the others. Academics do come into play which the MWC schools can’t offer.
I do agree that OSU/WSU will not give up the money they will inherit from the conference. That comes to the fourth solution that you did not even address.
OSU/WSU keeps the money and invites some of the AAC schools. The AAC dissolves and merges with the MWC. The new commissioner of the Pac is the AAC commissioner. Sound wild, maybe but so do the others. This will happen with a Pac2 or Pac4.
We will find out early Friday morning whether Stanford/Cal go to the ACC or stay in the PAC. Hopefully the latter.
Good work with the podcast thanks for keeping us updated
Time to accept the Pac 12 is.....done!!!!
Things you forgot to mention. The MWC has money coming in as well from Bowls and SDSU's basketball run. What are the costs of the MWC breaking the current TV deal with Fox & CBS? Who's paying the debt the PAC has with Comcast? Oh, and right now the remaining PAC teams need the MWC (or the American) more than the MWC needs the PAC right now.
The comcast debt will be split evenly among the 12 current PAC teams because they're the ones who benefited from the eronious payments
It wouldn’t be a matter of “breaking the current tv contract”, so much as renegotiating it. If the MWC only adds WSU/OSU, then there may not be any kind of bump in tv money. But if it’s a merger with the Pac4 and the ENTIRE MWC, then that SHOULD bring in a few more dollars and the current contract could be immediately renegotiated… and extended!
A merger would give Fox and CBS quite a bit of coveted late night programing.
Based solely off of what happened to the Big East/American Athletic Conference, there is no way that they could maintain autonomy. The other conferences (mainly the B1G and SEC) would not allow it
The move to the ACC by Stanford and California is not a done deal by any stretch. Those 4 no's are hanging pretty firmly. It would be so much better if the Pac-2 is still the Pac-4.
Depends on the outcome you want.
Stanford has very different goals than Washington State.
I like that idea. I always thought merging both conferences.
Need to fire the head guy with the pac 4.
Go M's
Loosing 8 out of 12 schools doesn’t look good for George K
San Diego State get too much credit. They are competitive but not good outside of one somewhat lucky March madness run last year. Look at their first football game in a 2nd year stadium only had 16,800 fans show up for football. How could anyone consider them a Power 5 school with attendance like that? The game looked empty and their new stadium is really small, I think with capacity for like only like 35,000. Fresno State draws better than them and I know everyone say SD TV market but that is horrible for Aztec and college sports in general as well. All the support on SD streets are Padres, just go there and you will see.
If it'd be possible it just seems like a no Brainer. Older better brand stays alive. San Diego fresno boise get two more valuable programs to up there own value. Schools like San Jose and Utah state are uping there games . Organ state can be the powerhouse of the 5th best conference. Recruit kids on a playoff route. "Go to Nebraska or ucla and get your butt wiped by 7 better programs or come here and dominate for a playoff chance. "
GK would have to be fired & hire the MWC Commissioner.
The best thing the AAC has going for it is momentum. For example, if you asked me 20 years ago who would have a bigger following today, Wyoming or North Texas I would’ve said Wyoming, based on brand, state flagship, conference, etc. 20 years later, the MW has largely stagnated.
That said, the top AAC schools are attractive candidates for ACC backfill, so maybe if you’re WSU/OSU you don’t want to hitch your wagon to Charlotte, UAB, and FAU. Given the parity between the leagues, if you side with the MW for geography, maybe rove made a league attractive enough to poach Memphis, Tulane, or whomever.
So I’d go with MW reverse merger, but you’ve got to have some degree of contribution based distribution and an easy way to swap out any members who fail to pull their weight over time.
Agreed. If anything if I was WSU/OSU I would not want to be in a Conference that the ACC could poach decent teams from. Those two programs need to think long term and the MWC is better for them in that regard than the AAC.
Fun facts. If you look at the all time win/loss records of both the MWC and AAC schools it paints a very different picture of which conference is stronger in the grand scheme of things. Here are the all time win loss records broken down by percentage.
MWC
BSU .728
Fresno .588
SDSU .571
Air Force .554
Hawaii .552
Nevada .529
Utah State .506
San Jose State .490
Wyoming .485
CSU .470
New Mexico .440
UNLV .401
AAC
Navy .550
Tulsa .549
USF .521
UTSA .514
East Carolina .508
North Texas .504
UAB .484
Temple .444
FAU .447
Charlotte .328
Memphis .493
Tulane .453
SMU .484
Rice .443
So 5 teams in the MWC have better all time records than the best all time program in the AAC.
@jesterscorner879 decades old records are meaningless. No one cares what Rice or Air Force did in the 80's.
@@jesterscorner879 I don’t know that “all time” is the relevant range if you’re trying to assess current standing and trajectory, since it ignores improvement and regression.
Honestly I think the smartest thing would be for these leagues to partner up in a way that prioritizes match ups for football and geography for everything else. That would all but ensure they have the top G5 team each year.
ESPN could jump in $$$ ? They want late night 🌙 football to televise across the country.
ESPN going broke, one of many reasons, no one in Midwest and east coast watch football games that start at 10:00 or 11:00 start times. Maybe some drunks in a bar.
@tom4600 Didn't know they weren't doing well financially$$$ ?
@@adamcompean9385 Revenues are down somewhat as people move away from cable but espn remains very profitable. Other branches of parent corp Disney are losing money but not espn.
@@adamcompean9385 There are reports that ESPN start showing ACC football games at movie theaters.
If Apple buys ESPN, wouldn’t that just beat all after everything the conference went through in the last year?
If the PAC remains @ 4 and takes most of the MW ( sorry SJSS, Hawaii and Nevada) and replaces GK with Gloria Nevárez, there is little doubt that the PAC keeps its P-5 status tor a couple of years. The only question is what about 2026 and the expanded playoff. If in 2025, they also take SMU, UTSA, Tulane and Rice ( for Academics and a lesser extent Houston), you have a pretty good Conference. The only question is it enough to keep their auto bid?
I really can't see how a league made up of mostly teams that were G5 in 2023 would be P5 in 2024
Yeesh, that does not look like a p5 conference at all. But it's a moot point anyway...SMU, Cal, and Stanford are on the verge of buying their way into the ACC.
I agree with you. But what happens if SMU, Cal and Stanford are NOT accepted into the ACC. That becomes without question the best G-5 Conference and it really is not close: They also set themselves up to possibly poach schools from the Big XII in the future ( I have little doubt Utah and possibly even ASU could actually move back to the PAC)
@@davidbrown386 Then the PAC almost certainly remains and rebuilds
@@LockedOnCollegeFootball Spencer I want your opinion on something. There been reports that ESPN is going to put ACC football games in movie theaters.
PAC-12 also needs to nationally televise their conference network ala big ten network or sec network on top of the reverse merger for spread content unless there is any downside.
Point being is that the PAC 12 Network is not on Direct TV as said conference networks.
@@justinboatwright4318 Look at what ESPN doing with ACC football. There are reports that ESPN put ACC football games on at movie theaters.
The Pac CAN get on the dishes. Probably not cable elsewhere.
But it would be a cheap add, the money generated won’t be for more than your basic G5, and the only people motivated to watch will be alums.
College athletics are for a regional audience… and if the B1G and SEC can nationalize it, then most of us are screwed. Reason: at a certain point, they’ll be more likely to pare down than expand. Ohio State and Alabama want ALL the money.
So disappointing
The MWC doesn’t need OSU/WSU. And you keep taking about the Pac12 network… the one that very few people can watch?
The MWC has the MWNetwork. We can watch any sport anytime on the MWC app. All MW schools have digital broadcasting capabilities on line right now.
And GK will not be in charge of running the MW, not gonna happen. Gloria will lead the expanded MWC into the future.
Also, you were way off about MW and Boise outside monies. The the deal that the MW and BSU made to keep them from jumping to the AAC. SDSU was just the lap dog for BSU and then jumping to the AAC. The recent event of the Aztecs staying in the MW, is SDSU’s 2nd time crawling back to the MWC.
Pac has that too. Revenue generator? Nah.
Pac-12 Network has value because of the infrastructure to produce games--distribution has to improve but in theory it perhaps could
Better option is give that to Apple
Pac-12 🏈 is here! 👍👍👏
GO Utes!
Getting ready for the Utes game right now #goutes
That was fun, wasn't it?
@@LockedOnCollegeFootball yes it was
Utah should have been #6, not USC. Utah has a D, not USC. Utah is the team to beat in the 👻 Pac 👻. Not USC. SEC fan, but it's Utah that has my respect. Not USC.
Like a Reverse Morgage...do it when you die....RIP woke PAC12
edgy post
The PAC will live on through the Mountain PAC
Go Ducks!!!
😅😅😅 the MW welcomed the flagship back w open arms ⚫🔴 cry more potato tears
The pac 12 shouldve stayed the same