My God! The science behind this is amazing!! I have been looking for alternatives for the expensive pem membrane.. this is really mind blowing. And thanks a lot!
For a membrane material you can use several materials like Polyester Monofilament Mesh (works with Sodium Hydroxide, NaOH) Nylon Monofilament Mesh (works with Potassium Hydroxide, KOH) these are among the most common and best ones
Geweldig ontwerp! Voor de mensen die willen experimenteren met drycells: maak dit ontwerp en maak een extra aansluiting voor toevoer van water. Plaats dit hoger en automatisch zal de cell gevuld blijven Great design! For the people who want to experiment with drycells: try this design and add an extra hose for water. If you place the tank a little bit higher, the cell will stay topped up.
How hydrophilic a separator is as well as having small pore size helps prevent gas bubbles from crossing. Keeping a low rate of production helps the bubbles form larger bubbles before separating from the plate and the larger bubbles have a harder time pushing through the separator. I always wonder how well the tight weave on my wife's nylon stockings would work. ssshhhh dont tell her.
@@alfredharrison597 my other interest/hobby is electronics, so when I think about how to understand an electrolysis setup and considering that it is an electrical circuit I tend to mash the two together, modeling an HHO cell for better understanding using standard idealized electronic components. To that end, and considering current doesn't flow unless voltages exceed what is called a zener voltage, then electrolysis is easily modeled with a resistor and zener diode in series with the zener diode having a zener voltage of 1.24v. Tripling plate area is like three resistors in parallel whoes resistance=1/(1/r+1/r+1/r) were r is the resistance of unit plate area. Adding a clay pot separator slows down current exactly like another resistor in serries and current through a resistor generates heat, where as over time current through our model zener diode = chemical work done. That is time×i×1.24v=chemical energy. So in the name of efficency we try to minimize the effective resistance while sustaining a desired hydrogen and oxygen production. On the other hand clay does a fair job of keeping weak analytes and catholytes seperate under an electric current through the resistance of ion flow through a clay pot. So a clay pot might be a fair choice for making weak analytes and catholites when they are the desired product. For simple and efficent gas seperation, a hydrophilic seperator like nylon allows ions to easily through a nylon mesh with little resistance while the nylon holding water to its surface when combined with water's surface tension helps prevent gas bubble crossing the hydrophilic seperator. I'm not certain about the purity though and i concede that maybe despite nylon mesh being hydrophilic, might not sustain sufficent gas seperation purity, and that maybe clay would.
This is great! And I like the music :) I will try to build something similar later on. BTW - shouldn't membrane be electrical resistant? Plates are charge carriers (through water with NaOH or KOH addition) so electrolysis can work (+/-) on them. Do I understand that correctly?
Thanks! No the membrane need to be electrically conductive otherwise there wouldn't run any current and because it consists of fibers with water in between, fore the current it's like the membrane isn't even there, so no +/- change.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy wow I feel like being in school back again :) So the membrane must be conductive but... actually without generating any current on it self... Yea it somehow make sense but can be confused that's why I asked. Thanks for fast answer!
Well not generating but conducting. When the electrons go trough the solution than nothing changes in respect to how the electrons move, but when the electrons go from being conducted by the solution to being conducted by a metal plate than it creates a +/- side. And because not the fibers but the solution in between the fibers is conductive, nothing changes.
spamator12 spamator12 the Membrane is only there to hold the gases separate. We want as little electrical resistant as possible because we don’t want charges to build up at the membrane and want as little „energy loss“ as possible. Maybe imagine an air filter. You would like to have a good air flow rate but filter out any particles simultaneously.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy I think you mean "permeable" not conducting. Nylon, polyester and polypropylene are dielectric. They don't conduct. The NaOH or KOH solution permeates through, and that is where the conductivity between the plates follows. If you used a conductive mesh/ membrane it would act like a neutral plate, regardless of its permeability, and change the function of the cell. The gas membrane absolutely has to be non conductive. Good cell and demo. Keep up the awesome work. 😁
We gotta buy you a variable speed oscillating tool, hand cutting anything is so much easier! Also, kudos for giving the musicians full credit up front on your videos, it’s a classy way to give credit where it is due!
I was thinking pretty much the same thing. As I was watching him use the saw blade by hand and cut the rectangles out, I just sat here thinking... he deserves a Dremel more than I do.
Constructive criticism: It will keep it mostly separated, however as you produce 2 hydrogen for every oxygen there will be 1) a pressure difference 2) concentration difference This will force the hydrogen over to the oxygen side due through osmosis and pressure differential. Do you have solutions to these issues?
@@TheDIYScienceGuy ah! Yes, absolutely. I was getting ahead of myself, thinking further down the line. With regards to use or storage potentially restricting flow. Sorry, I start connecting dots in my head
Do you have any insights on the viability of this "membrane" in an electrolyte solution environment? I'm asking because I'm afraid the electrolyte is not neutral to this "membrane". What are your experiences in this area?
Nice video, can i ask a question, youd you know what size such a plate unit woiuld need to tp produce 2 litres of hydrogen gas per minute ? Thanks for the video.. Thom in Scotland And in hospital for the moment... Thanks.
Coat the Fabric, Anode and Cathode in platin (with heat evaporation in a vacuum). A lot more expensiv but platin should not react anymore with material and in theory should hold a lifetime :-) Thanks a lot for the Video
You never fill the cell up completely but that also means you have a bit of exposed fabric without any water on it, won't some gasses leak through the fabric above the water line?
It's very curious. I wonder if this method has been compared with the separation of gases through the influence of a magnetic field. (Since hydrogen is diamagnetic and oxygen is paramagnetic)
Amazing Video! This is the best explaination ive managed to find on how to make a cheap and simple DIY hydrogen generator! My only question is what concentration of soduim hydroxide solution do you use, and have you experimented with using different concentrations to get faster hydrogen production?
"Better" is ill defined. One can get more production if they run more amps. One can get more efficent production if they lower the voltage. Dry cells are nice if you use neutral plates allowing you to work with higher volt power supplies. Wet cells allow you to use more of the plate surface area but need voltages that are not as flexible in voltages supplied. Dry cell with a membrane is needed if you want to keep the hydrogen separate from the oxygen. Wet cell is less complicated in its construction.
Where is the next video? Do you plan to use plastic trays throughout the new dry cell plate stack, or just gaskets like before? I have everything ready and intend to replicate a dry cell by your design.
Have you experimented at all with different materials for the plates? Was reading something saying one shouldn’t use stainless steel due to potential carcinogen formation (unfortunately the reference was pretty vague and I’m not sure how much to trust)
That would than be because of chrome comming off of the plates I think? I don't think dat it's an issue because the plates aren't corroding or dissolving. And in any case don't inhale the gas because there's also a fine sodium hydroxide mist in it. So just always ventilate really well.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy The plates do dissolve !(cromium begins to react), when the rurrent and the voltage in each cell gets too high (from ~0.4A/cm3 up). Learned this from my own experients. You know this happens when the water gets strange colours like pink or brown (even slight colour changes can be significant). Dissolved Cromium salts are EXTREMLEY TOXIC so be awaware of that risk. You can use Stainless steel, but use a type that you know that it has a high Nickel content and run the cell with a relativley low current . Nickel is waaay more resistant than Cromium in a alkaline environment , so it is quite resistant. The Industry uses Electrodes with a very high nickel content or pure nickel plates. this Principle works great (industry standard must be very good when a cell lasts around 20-30 Jears) they use about a courrent density of 0.25-0.5A/cm3 Great Work by the way ;)
Thanks a lot for the info! Yes I'm going to use something else for the electrodes, but I'm not sure yet on what to use. Have a little more testing to do. I will make a video of my results. Thanks again!
your plates are to far apart. this will make the amperage you require to make this work really high...high amperage will cause the heating you are having issues with. melting plastic and all. Voltage doesn't cause heat. Amps cause heat loss. by putting the plates closer you will be able to get closer to the 11-12 volts required to optimize the gas bubbles vigorously forming on the surface of the plates.. the spacing of the plates dictates the amperage required. your sepperator is great and will still work. think about ordering some very fine micron screen from ebay. like the screen used for silk screening.. Great video ,) Forever making.
Actually, the further the electrodes are apart from should reduce the current at a given voltage. Also both hydrogen and oxygen are generated on each electrode so unless you let the ions travel in your electlolyte to the electrode with opposite charge, you won't actually separate them, and once they form gas molecules and float to the surface you get pretty much a bomb. Very dangerous stuff
I'm sorry it diden't work for you. The membranes need to be tight, not floppy and you need to make sure the outlets per section aren't swapped accidentally. I hope this helps.
Kun je me uitleggen hoe nylon 2 gassen tegen kan houden en kan zorgen dat het niet mengt? Als er druk op komt te staan zal het toch door de andere buis naar buiten gaan of niet? Goede video btw
Thanks! Ja dat klopt bij een hogere druk gaat het er doorheen. De druk verschillen waar ik mee te maken heb zijn millibars. De oppervlaktespanning die tussen de vezels heerst is sterk genoeg om die lage druk tegen te houden, elk stukje tussen de vezels is minuscuul klein en hoeft dus ook maar een hele kleine druk te weerstaan.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Bedankt! Ik ben dit aan het maken voor een schoolproject, hij zal groter worden en een brander aansturen. Mag ik vragen waar je die rvs platen vandaan hebt?
Oke cool! Gewoon bij een plaatwerkerij in de buurt gehaald. Wees je er van bewust dat als je RVS plaat gebruikt als elektrode voor de generator de vloeistof geel zal worden. Dit komt door chroom oxide die uit de plaat geoxideerd word. Dit chroom oxide is zeer giftig en kankerverwekkend! Raak het nooit aan en voer het af als chemisch afval. NOOIT door de plee spoelen! Succes!
Because the neutral plat divides the voltage in 2, the plate generates oxygen on the hydrogen side and hydrogen on the oxygen side, which causes it to have mixed gas on bought sides of the neutral plate. But good thinking! 👍
@@TheDIYScienceGuy it can also do the reverse right??? Like if u feed it with hydrogen and oxygen, you can then connect to the plates like u would in a normal battery
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Oh I see, I am making a wet cell hydrogen generator that is U shaped to split the hydrogen & oxygen gyazo.com/0beeb6b66ff2f17f64a8ec6b86ebb65c
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Hi. What would be the most efficient cell? Those with two separate negative and positive poles isolated from each other, or those with neutral plates?
We have many problems through dust pollution it's Uncontrolled area's are called by unhealthy areas so why not filters processing starte Natural ways automatically Through helped by wind's forces wind force dusting systems Township cities are have to fashionable but it's looks and working system 's balanced can easy fullfill of processing
Thanks! I know and I agree. This is an older video. Here I was still learning how to make video's. My new video's are very different from this one, though I still try to improve each new video.
Hello my colleague, I beg you to tell me which material is this tablecloth, because yesterday I took a canvas 1 mm and I solved the problem of separating gases, but I have a new problem with the fast solution of the solution in the dark blue color, the material looks not resistant to alkaline electrolysis , now I'm looking for the ideal material ???
Thanks for the reply of the friend, here I am using a material similar to your nylon blue color that I display in this piston, it is 1.5 mm thick and perfectly separates the gases, and I no longer have the problem that my nylon is rubbed in the cells. But there is a problem of another kind that the Sodium Hydroxide solution quickly blubber, and it becomes dark blue! Probably this material is in the process of electrolysis?
i have made a 60 plate cell weak Koh with a bridge rectifier, runs with a 1200 watt modified sine wave inverter makes an insane amount of gas at 4 amps
Druze ti si izgleda jedini iz Srbije da se zanimas za ove separator uredjaje, mozemo saradjivati , ako si resio da se bavis tehnologijom ovih generatora vodonika :)
Like your videos but hate the music. Also too much video of cutting smoothing. Thanks for making and sharing! Whats the gluie you are using. I am not familiar with that make. Is it flexible once set?
Thanks! However, we can't all like the same music. I agree, the shot's were to long, this was a video experiment and my newer video's don't have that anymore. The glue is Bison 2 component epoxy resin which will stay slightly elastic.
You can use nylon, polypropylene or polyester. Just go to a dollar store and by a table sheet and look at the label to now what material it is, and do some testing to se if it doesn't dissolve in sodium hydroxide.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy The DIY Science Guy Theres actually cups people will pay alot of $$ for that claim to seperate the hydrogen from the oxygen leaving the drinker with a larger output of hydrogen molecules, this helping the atoms in the body seperate for overall better flow. Its called PEM H2o technology,, should do a video on this and spill the secrets!!
Oh man! You made nice videos! Thanks for that :) Can you make easier and smaller version of hydrogen compressor. To fill smaller tanks for example the empty deodorant tank? ;) I probably will use it on camping as the fuel to the Mini gas water heater
Thank you so much! Yes that is possible. But I would use a small propane tank. Deodorant tanks are not really safe to use for that purpose so please don't do that.
Okay! Thanks for the reply and warning :) Btw. I wish you the development of the channel Can I use a 12 V compressor instead of an old compressor from the fridge? This 12 V compressor can get 100PSI (7 bar)
Thank you so much!! Don't use 12v tire compressors because you can not know if thay also suck in a bit of oxygen because of little leaks. Refrigerator compressors are closed of so thay only will compress what you give them.
Please do be aware that stainless steel contains chromium, which at the anode oxidizes to hexavalent chromium. hexavalent chromium is a carcinogen, which will cause cancer. given, the amount produced isn't large, but try substituting the stainless steel for titanium (or carbon compounds like graphite if titanium is out of your budget)
Thanks! I'v already been warned by others. I replacing my electrodes with Nickel plated copper electrodes and I'm editing the video about that as we speak.
Copper corrodes away very fast so it needs a layer of nickel to protect it. Nickel oxides only occur in solid form in alkaline solutions I've been told so it will not be absorbed by the skin like chromium oxides. Therefore only the chromium oxide dust is a problem so as long as you keep it wet you're "ok"
Hello, can someone please help me? I'm currently trying to rebuild the generator, but I think I made a mistake with buying the membrane. I bought PolyPropilen 150g/m2, which is actually for weed control. Unfortunately, the material is completely waterproof and doesn't conduct electricity. So when I apply a multimeter, there is no resistance (Ohm) measurable. Can this even work like this? Unfortunately, I have very little knowledge, so I would appreciate scientific answers. It would also be great if someone could provide an Amazon link to a more suitable membrane material (in the EU). Thank you very much in advance.
Why did you not test the oxygen side of your fuel cell? Of course we need to see whether the other side is producing pure oxygen or mix with a little hydrogen along with the oxygen, right?
You have a good point for this esperiment but it's because I already did that in this video: youtu.be/RPvuzTk and this one th-cam.com/video/Ms62lnFVGaYJ/w-d-xo.html4ik
is it safe enough to assume that the H2O doesn't give a a bang? because before compressing we wanna be sure =) got a 9 plate drycell now with 3 connections like IiiiIiiiI but to run all 8 cells to produce HHO i hookup my power to the first and last cell. should i hookup the + to the middle plate and dive the - wire to the two outer plates and put some nylon monofilament mesh fabric between each plate to separate both gases?
You always need to make sure that there is no O2 pumped in to the tank as well. Yes wire it frome the middle to the outside like you said. Yes a mesh between every plate does the tick, and the holes in the seals ofcourse. Good luck!
Good idea for separator ...must be 0ver 99.9% effective , but some gas will drift over with solution movement . Some gas is in micro bubbles , a mist of bubbles which are smaller than the holes in the fabric , so can move across.
Nice job. Regarding posting and editing youtube clips : Is it ok to mention the source of music or video on clip and is legally or we have to ask permission ? I do not know. I want to ask but I do not where to ask exactly. How we can edit an already posted video( add some notice ). thanks
Thanks! There is a library with a lot of music on youtube that you are free to use. There are video's on youtube that explane very well how to do that. Good luck!
That was very smart and interesting... Pardon my stupid question ; I just can't figure out what a hydrogen generator is meant for at home ? ... 😬 What do you do with your hydrogen ? ...
On the long term, I would suggest storing peakoverproduktion-energy of renewable sources. You know, gaspowerplants are pretty fast regulable and thus suitable for compensating powergrid-fluctuations caused by renewable sources. Or even biologically Methanate the H2 on grand scale and feed it into the heating gas grid in the winter times. This would be what I‘d do with it.
@@petergoestohollywood382 capital cost per watt hour of hydrogem generated, stored, and converted back to electricity is far more than doing it with a battery.
Keith Reynolds it sure is. And I like the way you think. So I can surely order from you a heated 800 GWh battery Bank for my city to power through winter? No problem, right? You get the point?
the diaphragm or membrane has to be also very low current resistant, did it make a difference in the electrolysis with different membrane?? was it less resistant or more resistant the felt or the nylon??
@@TheDIYScienceGuy I am attempting a small on a budget hydrogen generator, and found that there is a point under 1/2 inch of separation between the plates where resistance stops diminishing due to bubbles, is it possible to use an antibubbling agent in the alkaline water, or can you point me to a mathematical model that could give me a better understanding?
The DIY Science Guy Ah we need to obtain the oxygen from water by splitting it from hydrogen, obviously. Since we cannot find any cheap and good semi-permeable membrane. Anyway, what kind of nylon did you used? Hezhez
My God! The science behind this is amazing!! I have been looking for alternatives for the expensive pem membrane.. this is really mind blowing. And thanks a lot!
For a membrane material you can use several materials like Polyester Monofilament Mesh (works with Sodium Hydroxide, NaOH)
Nylon Monofilament Mesh (works with Potassium Hydroxide, KOH) these are among the most common and best ones
Thanks for the correct terms, makes the search much easier 👍
@@TheDIYScienceGuy yep :)
Could I ask what is the membrane for?
Avialy 18 what do you think it’s for?
Please where can one buy the Nylon Monofilament Mesh? Any online store?
I really admire both your knowledge and your ability and willingness to share it.
Thank you so much! That really means a lot to me!
This is how they run cars in Armenia. Because the Muslim country's round them won't allow them petrol!
Interesting! Do you have a link for more information?
Geweldig ontwerp! Voor de mensen die willen experimenteren met drycells: maak dit ontwerp en maak een extra aansluiting voor toevoer van water. Plaats dit hoger en automatisch zal de cell gevuld blijven
Great design! For the people who want to experiment with drycells: try this design and add an extra hose for water. If you place the tank a little bit higher, the cell will stay topped up.
How hydrophilic a separator is as well as having small pore size helps prevent gas bubbles from crossing. Keeping a low rate of production helps the bubbles form larger bubbles before separating from the plate and the larger bubbles have a harder time pushing through the separator. I always wonder how well the tight weave on my wife's nylon stockings would work. ssshhhh dont tell her.
Clay from clay pots that arent glazed work great in this way.
@@alfredharrison597 my other interest/hobby is electronics, so when I think about how to understand an electrolysis setup and considering that it is an electrical circuit I tend to mash the two together, modeling an HHO cell for better understanding using standard idealized electronic components.
To that end, and considering current doesn't flow unless voltages exceed what is called a zener voltage, then electrolysis is easily modeled with a resistor and zener diode in series with the zener diode having a zener voltage of 1.24v.
Tripling plate area is like three resistors in parallel whoes resistance=1/(1/r+1/r+1/r) were r is the resistance of unit plate area.
Adding a clay pot separator slows down current exactly like another resistor in serries and current through a resistor generates heat, where as over time current through our model zener diode = chemical work done. That is
time×i×1.24v=chemical energy.
So in the name of efficency we try to minimize the effective resistance while sustaining a desired hydrogen and oxygen production. On the other hand clay does a fair job of keeping weak analytes and catholytes seperate under an electric current through the resistance of ion flow through a clay pot. So a clay pot might be a fair choice for making weak analytes and catholites when they are the desired product.
For simple and efficent gas seperation, a hydrophilic seperator like nylon allows ions to easily through a nylon mesh with little resistance while the nylon holding water to its surface when combined with water's surface tension helps prevent gas bubble crossing the hydrophilic seperator.
I'm not certain about the purity though and i concede that maybe despite nylon mesh being hydrophilic, might not sustain sufficent gas seperation purity, and that maybe clay would.
at 9:09 you should have tested the gas at the other hose - it probably contained hydrogen as well!
Thank you so much. Safer than using hho without separate.
Indeed! Thanks for the appreciation!
What is the membrane for?
To separate the hydrogen and oxygen.
Exlant explain bro thanks meny video watching but your great tx
This is great! And I like the music :) I will try to build something similar later on.
BTW - shouldn't membrane be electrical resistant? Plates are charge carriers (through water with NaOH or KOH addition) so electrolysis can work (+/-) on them. Do I understand that correctly?
Thanks! No the membrane need to be electrically conductive otherwise there wouldn't run any current and because it consists of fibers with water in between, fore the current it's like the membrane isn't even there, so no +/- change.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy wow I feel like being in school back again :) So the membrane must be conductive but... actually without generating any current on it self... Yea it somehow make sense but can be confused that's why I asked. Thanks for fast answer!
Well not generating but conducting. When the electrons go trough the solution than nothing changes in respect to how the electrons move, but when the electrons go from being conducted by the solution to being conducted by a metal plate than it creates a +/- side. And because not the fibers but the solution in between the fibers is conductive, nothing changes.
spamator12 spamator12 the Membrane is only there to hold the gases separate. We want as little electrical resistant as possible because we don’t want charges to build up at the membrane and want as little „energy loss“ as possible. Maybe imagine an air filter. You would like to have a good air flow rate but filter out any particles simultaneously.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy I think you mean "permeable" not conducting. Nylon, polyester and polypropylene are dielectric. They don't conduct. The NaOH or KOH solution permeates through, and that is where the conductivity between the plates follows. If you used a conductive mesh/ membrane it would act like a neutral plate, regardless of its permeability, and change the function of the cell. The gas membrane absolutely has to be non conductive. Good cell and demo. Keep up the awesome work. 😁
We gotta buy you a variable speed oscillating tool, hand cutting anything is so much easier! Also, kudos for giving the musicians full credit up front on your videos, it’s a classy way to give credit where it is due!
I was thinking pretty much the same thing. As I was watching him use the saw blade by hand and cut the rectangles out, I just sat here thinking... he deserves a Dremel more than I do.
Helium light also necessary for some problems
This is very comfortable energy useing process throu actively worked
Constructive criticism: It will keep it mostly separated, however as you produce 2 hydrogen for every oxygen there will be 1) a pressure difference 2) concentration difference
This will force the hydrogen over to the oxygen side due through osmosis and pressure differential.
Do you have solutions to these issues?
Both sides are at atmospheric pressure, so no pressure problems. Bit thanks! 👍
@@TheDIYScienceGuy ah! Yes, absolutely. I was getting ahead of myself, thinking further down the line. With regards to use or storage potentially restricting flow.
Sorry, I start connecting dots in my head
Well done. What Nylon fabric did you use and did you still find any better separation foil ? I heard Osmosis foil works quite well...Many thanks.
Thanks! No haven't tried anything else yet, but I will! Thanks for the info!
Do you have any insights on the viability of this "membrane" in an electrolyte solution environment? I'm asking because I'm afraid the electrolyte is not neutral to this "membrane". What are your experiences in this area?
Polypropylene works best like I show in this video: th-cam.com/video/GOppb7jRGCc/w-d-xo.html
Nice video, can i ask a question, youd you know what size such a plate unit woiuld need to tp produce 2 litres of hydrogen gas per minute ?
Thanks for the video..
Thom in Scotland
And in hospital for the moment... Thanks.
For 2 liter per hour, you need approximately 126cm3 electrode. I hope you get well soon!
Coat the Fabric, Anode and Cathode in platin (with heat evaporation in a vacuum). A lot more expensiv but platin should not react anymore with material and in theory should hold a lifetime :-) Thanks a lot for the Video
Yes because everyone has tons of junk platinum at their disposal :D
@@alfredharrison597 you really need only a little
You can also use sodium bicarbonate, it's less corrosive.
This is so cool! JB
You never fill the cell up completely but that also means you have a bit of exposed fabric without any water on it, won't some gasses leak through the fabric above the water line?
As long as the fabric is wet, the gass can't go trough. Because of adhesion the electrolyte will always go up a few centimeters.
It's very curious.
I wonder if this method has been compared with the separation of gases through the influence of a magnetic field. (Since hydrogen is diamagnetic and oxygen is paramagnetic)
No I havent, but I think this one is simpler and has a more pure result, but that is just my intuition.
Excellent job 👍🏼
Amazing Video! This is the best explaination ive managed to find on how to make a cheap and simple DIY hydrogen generator!
My only question is what concentration of soduim hydroxide solution do you use, and have you experimented with using different concentrations to get faster hydrogen production?
Thanks! I just trow in sodium hydroxide until it stops dissolving, than it has the optimum concentration and the best conductivity.
Can hydrogen gas be compressed using a refrigerator compressor?
Sir can i use a Rubber sheet with a hole in it as a seperator?
You can but than the current can only pass through that hole so you would have much less production. Also gass bubbles could pass through the hole.
Do you think it would be better making a wet cell or dry cell?
"Better" is ill defined.
One can get more production if they run more amps.
One can get more efficent production if they lower the voltage.
Dry cells are nice if you use neutral plates allowing you to work with higher volt power supplies.
Wet cells allow you to use more of the plate surface area but need voltages that are not as flexible in voltages supplied.
Dry cell with a membrane is needed if you want to keep the hydrogen separate from the oxygen. Wet cell is less complicated in its construction.
Well said.
@@kreynolds1123 OK im gonna stick to building a Wet Cell, thank you.
i have done this experiment 35 years before when i was in 2 class as a school project..
Nice!
Where is the next video? Do you plan to use plastic trays throughout the new dry cell plate stack, or just gaskets like before? I have everything ready and intend to replicate a dry cell by your design.
This is the latest video: th-cam.com/video/xc45jylwiiU/w-d-xo.html I will keep using the gaskets. Good luck!
Use polly nylon. Swim shorts material. Very chemical resistant!!!
Have you experimented at all with different materials for the plates? Was reading something saying one shouldn’t use stainless steel due to potential carcinogen formation (unfortunately the reference was pretty vague and I’m not sure how much to trust)
That would than be because of chrome comming off of the plates I think? I don't think dat it's an issue because the plates aren't corroding or dissolving. And in any case don't inhale the gas because there's also a fine sodium hydroxide mist in it. So just always ventilate really well.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy The plates do dissolve !(cromium begins to react), when the rurrent and the voltage in each cell gets too high (from ~0.4A/cm3 up). Learned this from my own experients. You know this happens when the water gets strange colours like pink or brown (even slight colour changes can be significant). Dissolved Cromium salts are EXTREMLEY TOXIC so be awaware of that risk. You can use Stainless steel, but use a type that you know that it has a high Nickel content and run the cell with a relativley low current . Nickel is waaay more resistant than Cromium in a alkaline environment , so it is quite resistant. The Industry uses Electrodes with a very high nickel content or pure nickel plates. this Principle works great (industry standard must be very good when a cell lasts around 20-30 Jears) they use about a courrent density of 0.25-0.5A/cm3
Great Work by the way ;)
Thanks a lot for the info! Yes I'm going to use something else for the electrodes, but I'm not sure yet on what to use. Have a little more testing to do. I will make a video of my results. Thanks again!
thanks this helps a lot
your plates are to far apart. this will make the amperage you require to make this work really high...high amperage will cause the heating you are having issues with. melting plastic and all. Voltage doesn't cause heat. Amps cause heat loss. by putting the plates closer you will be able to get closer to the 11-12 volts required to optimize the gas bubbles vigorously forming on the surface of the plates.. the spacing of the plates dictates the amperage required. your sepperator is great and will still work. think about ordering some very fine micron screen from ebay. like the screen used for silk screening.. Great video ,) Forever making.
Thanks!
Actually, the further the electrodes are apart from should reduce the current at a given voltage.
Also both hydrogen and oxygen are generated on each electrode so unless you let the ions travel in your electlolyte to the electrode with opposite charge, you won't actually separate them, and once they form gas molecules and float to the surface you get pretty much a bomb.
Very dangerous stuff
I have made many attempts , with a 10 plate generator, I'm having issues every build, I keep getting mixed gas , any tips ??
I'm sorry it diden't work for you. The membranes need to be tight, not floppy and you need to make sure the outlets per section aren't swapped accidentally. I hope this helps.
Kun je me uitleggen hoe nylon 2 gassen tegen kan houden en kan zorgen dat het niet mengt?
Als er druk op komt te staan zal het toch door de andere buis naar buiten gaan of niet?
Goede video btw
Thanks! Ja dat klopt bij een hogere druk gaat het er doorheen. De druk verschillen waar ik mee te maken heb zijn millibars. De oppervlaktespanning die tussen de vezels heerst is sterk genoeg om die lage druk tegen te houden, elk stukje tussen de vezels is minuscuul klein en hoeft dus ook maar een hele kleine druk te weerstaan.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Bedankt! Ik ben dit aan het maken voor een schoolproject, hij zal groter worden en een brander aansturen.
Mag ik vragen waar je die rvs platen vandaan hebt?
Oke cool! Gewoon bij een plaatwerkerij in de buurt gehaald. Wees je er van bewust dat als je RVS plaat gebruikt als elektrode voor de generator de vloeistof geel zal worden. Dit komt door chroom oxide die uit de plaat geoxideerd word. Dit chroom oxide is zeer giftig en kankerverwekkend! Raak het nooit aan en voer het af als chemisch afval. NOOIT door de plee spoelen! Succes!
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Danke!
Heb je trouwens enig idee chroomoxide er vrijkomt en wat ik anders als electrode moet gebruiken?
Have you tried to see how much pressure your cell can generate before Hydrogen seeps over to the Oxygen side?
No I haven't but it's an interesting experiment! Thanks! 👍
Why use fabric instead of a neutral plate?
Because the neutral plat divides the voltage in 2, the plate generates oxygen on the hydrogen side and hydrogen on the oxygen side, which causes it to have mixed gas on bought sides of the neutral plate. But good thinking! 👍
THANK YOU !!!!!
So can't you also cool down the gasses and then seperate it through magnets since liquid oxygen is ferromagnetic?
Yes that is possible. You can also make fine bubbles and let them go past a magnet apparantly.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Cool, thanks :)
Bravo masters, each cast on a built-in hydrogen separator cell, where are you from, and I'm making you a cell separator, can some mail contact
What's the benefit of using sodium hydroxide instead of another electrolyte like sodium chloride? production of chlorine gas?
Yes chlorine is a big problem. It's bad for your health and it corrodes the anode very fast.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy how about pottasium carbonate?
Also works but NaOH and KOH are best.
Can this be powered with sollar cells? If so what do I need besides solar cells?
Yes it can be. You can connect it directly, the only other thing you need is..... the sun 😉
@@TheDIYScienceGuy it can also do the reverse right??? Like if u feed it with hydrogen and oxygen, you can then connect to the plates like u would in a normal battery
Not this one but I'm working on one that can.
Would potassium hydroxide be better for this?
As fare as I know it only helps to give the solution a lower freezing point which can be useful depending on where you live.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Oh I see, I am making a wet cell hydrogen generator that is U shaped to split the hydrogen & oxygen gyazo.com/0beeb6b66ff2f17f64a8ec6b86ebb65c
Hi. Is hydrogen always generated at the negative pole?
Yes.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Hi. What would be the most efficient cell? Those with two separate negative and positive poles isolated from each other, or those with neutral plates?
With neutral plates you don't need a 2 Volt 425 Amp transformer, you can just use a 12 Volt 70 Amp transformer which is easier.
We have many problems through dust pollution it's Uncontrolled area's are called by unhealthy areas so why not filters processing starte Natural ways automatically Through helped by wind's forces wind force dusting systems
Township cities are have to fashionable but it's looks and working system 's balanced can easy fullfill of processing
barber has no customer so he cut the hairs of cat..
I like your videos but wish you spent less time with the actual cutting or sanding. we get the idea without seeing every cut
Thanks! I know and I agree. This is an older video. Here I was still learning how to make video's. My new video's are very different from this one, though I still try to improve each new video.
i think the rip stop nylon doesnt allow water to flow through it not only gas? What nylon material did you use
It's a tablecloth. No rip stop wouldn't work because it's water and air tight.
Hello my colleague, I beg you to tell me which material is this tablecloth, because yesterday I took a canvas 1 mm and I solved the problem of separating gases, but I have a new problem with the fast solution of the solution in the dark blue color, the material looks not resistant to alkaline electrolysis , now I'm looking for the ideal material ???
My tablecloth is made from nylon or polyester.
Thanks for the reply of the friend, here I am using a material similar to your nylon blue color that I display in this piston, it is 1.5 mm thick and perfectly separates the gases, and I no longer have the problem that my nylon is rubbed in the cells. But there is a problem of another kind that the Sodium Hydroxide solution quickly blubber, and it becomes dark blue! Probably this material is in the process of electrolysis?
Yes that hapend with mine to, I think that is what's going on.
😀
Salve , volevo sapere se funziona al contrario immettere i due gas (H & O ) , genera corrente elettrica ??
Ciò è possibile in una cella a combustibile, ma è un po 'più difficile da realizzare a casa.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Mille grazie .
Hi is it possible to use an inverter to power the hho cell in the car or permanently wires battery charger in
If it can generate enough amps than that wouldn't be a problem I think.
Che amperaggio deve avere ĺalimentatore?
l'intensità della corrente è determinata dalla resistenza dell'elettrolita e dalla superficie degli elettrodi. mai applicare più di 2 volt.
i have made a 60 plate cell weak Koh with a bridge rectifier, runs with a 1200 watt modified sine wave inverter makes an insane amount of gas at 4 amps
Nice!
Are you going to make a bigger version again with the new material?
No I'm going to replace the membranes in the large generator as shown in the video, that one is big enough for me ;)
Druze ti si izgleda jedini iz Srbije da se zanimas za ove separator uredjaje, mozemo saradjivati , ako si resio da se bavis tehnologijom ovih generatora vodonika :)
Uhhhh what? ;p
Can you make H2 separation using PEM technology please
Maybe I will do that in the future. Thanks for the suggestion! 👍
CAN WE GENERATE ALKALINE WATER USING THIS ?....👍🕯️
Well the electrolyte is extremely alkaline. But in this experiment that is not the subject. ☺
Like your videos but hate the music. Also too much video of cutting smoothing. Thanks for making and sharing! Whats the gluie you are using. I am not familiar with that make. Is it flexible once set?
Thanks! However, we can't all like the same music. I agree, the shot's were to long, this was a video experiment and my newer video's don't have that anymore. The glue is Bison 2 component epoxy resin which will stay slightly elastic.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy thanks re glue. agreed re types music. its an individual/age thing too. I'm older generation though like the music up to 1.46 mins.
Thanks for your input! 😉👍
now i wonder where you get nylon fabric ? xD
You can use nylon, polypropylene or polyester. Just go to a dollar store and by a table sheet and look at the label to now what material it is, and do some testing to se if it doesn't dissolve in sodium hydroxide.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy do you need sodium dioxide or can you use any salt?
Like normal kitchen salt (sodium chloride)
If you use sodium chloride you will produce chlorine gass as well, which is very toxic and it will corrode your anode very badly.
enjoy your hydroxy
Thanks!
I can....drink it??
Why!........just why?
@@TheDIYScienceGuy The DIY Science Guy Theres actually cups people will pay alot of $$ for that claim to seperate the hydrogen from the oxygen leaving the drinker with a larger output of hydrogen molecules, this helping the atoms in the body seperate for overall better flow. Its called PEM H2o technology,, should do a video on this and spill the secrets!!
U need a 3d printer 😏
Would be fun, but I first need a bigger shed. 😉
It have leaks
Н2? О2?! Ты нормальный вообще? Иди химию учи. (переведите ему кто нибудь)
Che differenza c'è rispetto al sistema HHO classico ?
Spero che questo possa essere d'aiuto:it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veicolo_a_idrogeno
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Grazie tutto ok...buon lavoro..
Watching you use that hand saw made me cringe
Ok, why?
I tried this and it didn’t work!
besides nylon what other materials can I use?
You can also use polyester and polypropylene.
Oh man! You made nice videos! Thanks for that :) Can you make easier and smaller version of hydrogen compressor. To fill smaller tanks for example the empty deodorant tank? ;)
I probably will use it on camping as the fuel to the Mini gas water heater
Thank you so much! Yes that is possible. But I would use a small propane tank. Deodorant tanks are not really safe to use for that purpose so please don't do that.
Okay! Thanks for the reply and warning :)
Btw. I wish you the development of the channel
Can I use a 12 V compressor instead of an old compressor from the fridge?
This 12 V compressor can get 100PSI (7 bar)
Thank you so much!! Don't use 12v tire compressors because you can not know if thay also suck in a bit of oxygen because of little leaks. Refrigerator compressors are closed of so thay only will compress what you give them.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Okay :)
Please do be aware that stainless steel contains chromium, which at the anode oxidizes to hexavalent chromium.
hexavalent chromium is a carcinogen, which will cause cancer.
given, the amount produced isn't large, but try substituting the stainless steel for titanium (or carbon compounds like graphite if titanium is out of your budget)
Thanks! I'v already been warned by others. I replacing my electrodes with Nickel plated copper electrodes and I'm editing the video about that as we speak.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Why not pure copper? I've heard Nickel is not so good for you either.
Copper corrodes away very fast so it needs a layer of nickel to protect it. Nickel oxides only occur in solid form in alkaline solutions I've been told so it will not be absorbed by the skin like chromium oxides. Therefore only the chromium oxide dust is a problem so as long as you keep it wet you're "ok"
😀😀😀
Hello, can someone please help me? I'm currently trying to rebuild the generator, but I think I made a mistake with buying the membrane. I bought PolyPropilen 150g/m2, which is actually for weed control. Unfortunately, the material is completely waterproof and doesn't conduct electricity. So when I apply a multimeter, there is no resistance (Ohm) measurable. Can this even work like this? Unfortunately, I have very little knowledge, so I would appreciate scientific answers. It would also be great if someone could provide an Amazon link to a more suitable membrane material (in the EU). Thank you very much in advance.
Fantastic explanation, could you please tell me the material of the separation membrane?
Thanks! Polypropylene geotextile works best.
How many volts? Amps?
Around 3 volt, don't know the amps. Made this purely as a splitting demo.
Nice work dude.... I've never thought of that
Can you make efficient pure hydrogen cell
Well the big hydrogen generator as shown in the video is the most efficient I can get it for now.
LOL what's with the porno sounds for audio ?
🤣🤣🤣
Why do so few people know how to properly use a hacksaw?! The teeth only cut in one direction!
Wow! Perhaps you could now work on developing a portable power generator for homes?
Why did you not test the oxygen side of your fuel cell? Of course we need to see whether the other side is producing pure oxygen or mix with a little hydrogen along with the oxygen, right?
You have a good point for this esperiment but it's because I already did that in this video: youtu.be/RPvuzTk and this one th-cam.com/video/Ms62lnFVGaYJ/w-d-xo.html4ik
Hoi, mooie video. Zou ik als membraan ook tentdoek van polyester kunnen gebruiken?
Dankjewel! Ja, als het vocht doorlatend wel ja.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Top! Dan ga ik dat proberen.
Is it polyster or nylon
The label says nylon. But could also be polyester. A polyester tablecloth would work to.
Where did you get your nylon or what type of nylon should I use? Or is your nylon breathable?
It's a table cloth but polypropylene geo-textile is the best.
are we all to dance while this is being made 🕺💃
What act as PEM ?
No PEM just fabric.
you are amazing teacher
Fiberglas would be a good idea for this, its glas and thas realy resisten
Nice idea! Thanks for the suggestion! 👍
What is the meterial of the membrane ?
In this case, polyester but polypropylene is the best material.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy Thank you so much ✌️
i did the same as you, but i use polypropylen as separator. you can find it on my youtube-chanal
Nice! Do you have a link to that video?
@@TheDIYScienceGuy th-cam.com/video/jDiuNOLV-Jo/w-d-xo.html
at min 1:132
is it safe enough to assume that the H2O doesn't give a a bang? because before compressing we wanna be sure =)
got a 9 plate drycell now with 3 connections like IiiiIiiiI but to run all 8 cells to produce HHO i hookup my power to the first and last cell. should i hookup the + to the middle plate and dive the - wire to the two outer plates and put some nylon monofilament mesh fabric between each plate to separate both gases?
You always need to make sure that there is no O2 pumped in to the tank as well. Yes wire it frome the middle to the outside like you said. Yes a mesh between every plate does the tick, and the holes in the seals ofcourse. Good luck!
Good idea for separator ...must be 0ver 99.9% effective , but some gas will drift over with solution movement . Some gas is in micro bubbles , a mist of bubbles which are smaller than the holes in the fabric , so can move across.
That could be the case but it's not causing problems luckily. But good thinking! 👍
Hello sir
Very good idea and very good explanation.
Could we use your model for chlor alkali cell for production of naoh ?
Thanks yes I think you can.
Splitting water up results in two hydrogen and one oxygen atom. Hint: h2o. Fix the thumbnail lol
O imidiatly binds with an other O which forms O2 which is what comes out of the hose, that is why it says O2
But would it produce electricity if you insert oxygen and hydrogen and connect the two plates
No that would require a different construction and a catalist.
Nice job. Regarding posting and editing youtube clips : Is it ok to mention the source of music or video on clip and is legally or we have to ask permission ? I do not know. I want to ask but I do not where to ask exactly. How we can edit an already posted video( add some notice ). thanks
Thanks! There is a library with a lot of music on youtube that you are free to use. There are video's on youtube that explane very well how to do that. Good luck!
thank's sir,very nice video
Can anyone tell me what causes the oxygen negative or positive
Positive=Oxygen. Negative=Hydrogen
What act as PEM ?
I thought it's fulecell
Ah I see 😊👍
@@TheDIYScienceGuy ?
It's a hydrogen generator, not a fulecell. You already found that out yourself that is why I responded with, Ah I see.....
Can you provide me with the name of this cloth?
Polypropylene geo-textile is best.
If you didn't split the gases would it be possible to safely contain both gases together in a container?
No never! That is VERY dangerous! Never ever do that!
@@TheDIYScienceGuy I was pretty sure that was going to be the answer, just wanted to be 100% sure that it shouldn't be done
That was very smart and interesting...
Pardon my stupid question ; I just can't figure out what a hydrogen generator is meant for at home ? ...
😬
What do you do with your hydrogen ? ...
Thanks! I fill hydrogen balloons with it like I do in this video: th-cam.com/video/PryCxyJ8Y2Y/w-d-xo.html
On the long term, I would suggest storing peakoverproduktion-energy of renewable sources. You know, gaspowerplants are pretty fast regulable and thus suitable for compensating powergrid-fluctuations caused by renewable sources. Or even biologically Methanate the H2 on grand scale and feed it into the heating gas grid in the winter times. This would be what I‘d do with it.
@@petergoestohollywood382 capital cost per watt hour of hydrogem generated, stored, and converted back to electricity is far more than doing it with a battery.
Another example is that some home hobbyist like to do welding or jewler at home. Hydrogen generating welders can create an intensly hot flame.
Keith Reynolds it sure is. And I like the way you think. So I can surely order from you a heated 800 GWh battery Bank for my city to power through winter? No problem, right?
You get the point?
the diaphragm or membrane has to be also very low current resistant, did it make a difference in the electrolysis with different membrane?? was it less resistant or more resistant the felt or the nylon??
No it makes no difference. Electrode distance does much more.
@@TheDIYScienceGuy I am attempting a small on a budget hydrogen generator, and found that there is a point under 1/2 inch of separation between the plates where resistance stops diminishing due to bubbles, is it possible to use an antibubbling agent in the alkaline water, or can you point me to a mathematical model that could give me a better understanding?
@@TheDIYScienceGuy also, this is a great channel, and thank you for those amazing videos, good explanation and for taking your time answering.
Yes I use foam stop which is available for power washers just a few drops is enough.
👍👍👍
How about the oxygen? I like the concept and such but on our study, we need to obtain the oxygen gas :0
The oxygen flowes out of the other hose, and you can do what ever you want with it. What is your study about?
The DIY Science Guy Ah we need to obtain the oxygen from water by splitting it from hydrogen, obviously. Since we cannot find any cheap and good semi-permeable membrane. Anyway, what kind of nylon did you used? Hezhez
Just a nylon or polyester table cloth but it seems that polypropylene is the best option.
goed bezig ;)
Ja, erg interessant