Thanks to Moonlight Ruin and AoiYozora for the help with dataming and general modding, Lokey Lore for the help with the translations and TKGP for uploading the DS2 network test params twitter.com/Moonlight_Ruin twitter.com/aoi_yozo twitter.com/Lokey_DS twitter.com/TKGP_
Covetous Demon is Jabba The Hut, Captured magician is Princess Leia They're pyromancers/magicians serving the Queen, playing the role of entertainment. Probably referencing Ray Harryhausens' films; this is frequently referenced throughout Dark Souls 2.
I’m still convinced Pate noticed that Cale recognized him and so introduced himself as Creighton. Cale is ambiguous in his declaration if the *Killer* was named Cray-something or the man he recognized *AS* the Killer was named Cray-something. Creighton keeps his face covered with the helmet so how could Cale recognize _him_ as the Killer?
@@GuardianOwl exactly my thoughts. The moment Cale said "seen familiar face" I realized Pate is lying. Pate's set description only convinced me further. Also Creighton losing his memory which means he's afflicted by curse (and it explains his presence in Drangleic) while Pate is pretty healthy. Pate's PvP ring is the icing on top.
@@GuardianOwl Makes no sense. “Familiar face” is a pretty vague term, not to mention Dramgleic is in ruins. Neither of that couple had a reason to hide their names (let alone SWAP them for one another’s), and DSIII further established that Creighton was the serial murderer AND the knight of Mirrah, and he invades us in the exact same outfit he is wearing here. Again, I see no reason for him to switch clothing.
@@anton.chigrinetc.96 DS III lore has nothing to do with what DS2 lore at the time of release. He shit all over DS2 characters (ruining Creighton’s ambiguity and tarnishing Vendrick’s legacy), stole the origin of the dope ass Ruin Sentinel armor set, and practically erased Aldia, one of the most important NPCs is the series. edit: Anyway, Cale's exact lines are: "Mirrah is also the home of an infamous killer, a 'knight' in name alone. He was locked in the dungeon for multiple murders. But shortly before his execution, he managed to escape. And the other day… I saw a fellow with a striking likeness! And then! And then…Wait… Well…I think he looked rather similar… N-no, it's true! I saw just such a man, I swear! I believe *HIS* name was…Cr…Cr…err Cray-something…I believe… They shared…some resemblance, I…I think…" Now for the million dollar question who does *"HIS"* refer to? The Killer or the man he recognized as the Killer? As I said in the original post, Cale uses he and his too much to definitely determine whether the Killer of Mirrah was named "Cray-something" or if the man Cale saw in Drangleic with a "striking resemblance" was named "Cray-something" based on the structure of that sentence. Maybe it is more clear in the original Japanese script. DS III establishes that Creighton was a deserter and then likely became an invader for Rosaria's Fingers based on the ring he wears. That does not fit with his history given the armor he wears in DS2 is a high quality forgery, he likely never was a knight of Mirrah in the DS2 timeline.
Some NPC also have different internal names depending on the param file they appear in, for example in EnemyParam Lucatiel is called 女騎士アーケルティーラ (Knightess Aquertilla or something along this line), while in WeaponParam Gilligan's Melu Scimitar is 奴隷商人の曲剣 (Curved Sword of the Slave Trader), which to me links back to dropped plot of the Bearer of the Curse travelling in the past and rescuing young Shanalotte from such a character; Lenigrast mentioning Gilligan's sordid past could be an inside-joke from the develeports about his initial more sinister nature.
It's because in japanese his name is completely different, he's "the accursed one" (呪縛者, "the one binded by a curse") and the design work interviews talk about the bundle of weapons he carries on his back as hunt trophies, so he likely channels the spirits of those he murders within himself, seen how grudgeful spirits are always depicted as screaming skulls even up to Sekiro and Elden Ring; the boss variant, after grabbing the player with his sword, buffs up and gains a new attack where these dark spirit projectiles erupt from his chest.
“Forgotten Sinner” is probably a more appropriate name for the boss. She has been down there in Sinner’s Rise since long before the Bastille was overrun by the undead.
2:39 actually, it is true that the word '亡者' generally means the dead or the deceased, but in the Dark Souls series, this word corresponds to the Hollow.
i would guess it is because, just like hollows, the king of the giants also is dead spiritually and mentally after his defeat in our hands. in buddhism, mouja also refers to souls who have lost their way nirvana and so cant rest in peace imagine failing to avenge your people, massacred by some king who came out of nowhere in your country and captured your people like animals. that would surely for me at least cause me mental or spiritual death. "why keep going on?" kinda stuff u know? though humans and the giants of ds2 are different races, it is nice that this aspect of spiritual death is implied at least to be something they have (technically all races can have that but u get what i mean i think)
The fact that Velstadt is labeled Queen's Knight B while Throne Watcher and Defender were A and C gives me chill. It means at some point the developer intended to have us fight 3 late game bosses at once. A 3 human sized gank squad was bad enough, but 3 giant bosses each with complete moveset would be absolutely stupid. Also Veldstadt originally being a knight for his queen rather his king might've been the actual reason why Nashandra clone in the DLC can summon shadow Veldstadt out of nowhere, they were remnant of a discarded concept.
Maybe we met Bernhart in the past and then some time in the interim Patches kills him with a trap (perhaps for the sword). Then we meet Creighton in the present and that’s the original reason he was hunting Patches, not to get the ring and the loot like the final game, but revenge for his father.
Sea Solaire makes a lot of sense since she is pretty much the same; a tragic story about finding themselves, they can both be summoned for important bosses. She's also dressed up as a pirate. Jabba the Hutt is probably the best though.
00:04 Ryu no Miko can also be translated as Dragon Priestess 00:42 Something neat about the term jujutsu in Japanese is that it's more like witchcraft/black/cursed magic, but in the Souls series is indeliably linked to Pyromancy. A practioner of jujutsu, a jujutsushi would be like a shaman 1:12 As much as I love an alliteration, bearish is a weird adjective here? Yowaki is more timid or fainthearted 1:44 I'm seeing in places that the official pronunciation of firekeeper in Japanese is himorime (although a lot of Japanese call them Kabotan as a nickname). Didn't realize the Maiden in Black from Demon's Souls is officially Firekeeper in Black in Japanese. 3:54 Sea Solaire is very funny 5:40 That's very weird that Benhart was Creighton's father?
Avengingwarrior, Benhart was originally intended to be the father of Creighton the wanderer; Even having the same Mirrah insignia!? Banshee: (meaning fairy-mound woman) is from Gaelic (Irish) Mythology: seeing this ghost is a bad omen, typically she is the spectator of a person who experienced a great misfortunate, he presence foreshadows a person's death, oftentimes the family or relations of those that see her are cursed to suffer similarly terrible misfortunate often passing away. Wailing, screaming or keening before disappearing. Durahan: (Gan Ceann meaning one lacking head) is a Gaelic word. It's Irish Folklore. Emerald herald: A Celtic/Gaelic woman, she's possibly druidic?
The Darklurker was originally Agdayne's stand? maybe Agdayne was originally going to be a boss. That would explain why he has a whole unique moveset complete with spells and anime flips. Suppose they ended up reusing the stand idea with Sully in DS3.
There are so many implications that can be drawn from this that will just fall flat based on how the game turned out. Saulden was supposed to have a story arc where he gains back his courage? Or maybe that would have been him in the past before he lost his nerve. Benhart and Creighton were father and son yet in the final game they have no connection other than the seal on their chest pieces? Maybe the two blacksmiths would have been the same person just one is in the past and still human? Darklurker is a jojo reference but he has literally no connection to Agdayne in game? I don't particularly enjoy DS2 but that just makes me wonder if this game would have been great had it not been rushed to development. Great stuff Crest!
Looking Glass Knight was called Mirror Knight in a pre-release English build of the game. For whatever reason, the English translation team changed it to sound more archaic.
Holy shit; that's a lot of lore! So, Lucatiel is literally a female Solaire, Pate really IS Patches playing 4d chess, Adgayne is a powerful fuck who can summon the hardest boss in the base game, and Ben is Creighton's DAD? I also can't believe I just clued in that the desert sorceresses are really just a bunch of Slave Leias!
4:18 so the translation team decided to name it "Lost SInner", but it's not a sinner that got lost, but a sinner that was lost by someone? someone forgot the sinner, thus a lost sinner and not a sinner that got lost by themselves
4:46 - 6:34 what's a "NPC for multi"? And is it possible to replicate this characters appearance on a in-game character or is it a unique model? because she's really pretty (for dark souls character creation typical standarts)
So Sellsword Luet has the same model as Crestfallen in Majula, huh? This must be just reusing the model rather than something with lore implications, since Luet doesn't take off his helmet anyway...
NPC cooperators and invaders have four face variants for men and four for women, so a lot of them are actually Saulden under the helmet strictly speaking, even Maldron.
Cut content. At some point in time DS2 was going to be more focused on time/memory travelling. After a while she was going to be just for a cutscene or another. Ended up completely scrapped. Like DS1 had a kid Witch Beatrice that got cut too.
damn so many npcs, never thought they were so many, no wonder l loved this so much. then theres people saying DS has no story xD lmao they dont even know how to play he game or what is DS about l guess.
Ah, what a shame :/ By the way, I've been watching your videos since like 2019, Crest, and you were the first channel about Souls cut content and such that I ever watched. So, thank you for still being here :D Will there ever be a video like this for DS3 and Bloodborne as well? ^^
Thanks to Moonlight Ruin and AoiYozora for the help with dataming and general modding, Lokey Lore for the help with the translations and TKGP for uploading the DS2 network test params
twitter.com/Moonlight_Ruin
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My girl Lucatiel was just a Sea Solaire?
Always has been 🔫
And here I thought the Jabba the Hutt thing was just a community made joke.
Covetous Demon is Jabba The Hut, Captured magician is Princess Leia
They're pyromancers/magicians serving the Queen, playing the role of entertainment. Probably referencing Ray Harryhausens' films; this is frequently referenced throughout Dark Souls 2.
Literally everyone: Pate is a good guy, Creighton is a liar
Developers: Patches
It's because creighton is hot, and he being dangerous makes him even sexier
I’m still convinced Pate noticed that Cale recognized him and so introduced himself as Creighton. Cale is ambiguous in his declaration if the *Killer* was named Cray-something or the man he recognized *AS* the Killer was named Cray-something. Creighton keeps his face covered with the helmet so how could Cale recognize _him_ as the Killer?
@@GuardianOwl exactly my thoughts. The moment Cale said "seen familiar face" I realized Pate is lying. Pate's set description only convinced me further.
Also Creighton losing his memory which means he's afflicted by curse (and it explains his presence in Drangleic) while Pate is pretty healthy.
Pate's PvP ring is the icing on top.
@@GuardianOwl
Makes no sense.
“Familiar face” is a pretty vague term, not to mention Dramgleic is in ruins. Neither of that couple had a reason to hide their names (let alone SWAP them for one another’s), and DSIII further established that Creighton was the serial murderer AND the knight of Mirrah, and he invades us in the exact same outfit he is wearing here. Again, I see no reason for him to switch clothing.
@@anton.chigrinetc.96 DS III lore has nothing to do with what DS2 lore at the time of release. He shit all over DS2 characters (ruining Creighton’s ambiguity and tarnishing Vendrick’s legacy), stole the origin of the dope ass Ruin Sentinel armor set, and practically erased Aldia, one of the most important NPCs is the series.
edit: Anyway, Cale's exact lines are:
"Mirrah is also the home of an infamous killer, a 'knight' in name alone. He was locked in the dungeon for multiple murders. But shortly before his execution, he managed to escape.
And the other day… I saw a fellow with a striking likeness! And then!
And then…Wait…
Well…I think he looked rather similar…
N-no, it's true! I saw just such a man, I swear!
I believe *HIS* name was…Cr…Cr…err Cray-something…I believe…
They shared…some resemblance, I…I think…"
Now for the million dollar question who does *"HIS"* refer to? The Killer or the man he recognized as the Killer? As I said in the original post, Cale uses he and his too much to definitely determine whether the Killer of Mirrah was named "Cray-something" or if the man Cale saw in Drangleic with a "striking resemblance" was named "Cray-something" based on the structure of that sentence. Maybe it is more clear in the original Japanese script.
DS III establishes that Creighton was a deserter and then likely became an invader for Rosaria's Fingers based on the ring he wears. That does not fit with his history given the armor he wears in DS2 is a high quality forgery, he likely never was a knight of Mirrah in the DS2 timeline.
Some NPC also have different internal names depending on the param file they appear in, for example in EnemyParam Lucatiel is called 女騎士アーケルティーラ (Knightess Aquertilla or something along this line), while in WeaponParam Gilligan's Melu Scimitar is 奴隷商人の曲剣 (Curved Sword of the Slave Trader), which to me links back to dropped plot of the Bearer of the Curse travelling in the past and rescuing young Shanalotte from such a character; Lenigrast mentioning Gilligan's sordid past could be an inside-joke from the develeports about his initial more sinister nature.
Cat
makes sense
2:58 I just now noticed that the Pursuer’s armor has screaming faces on it
thanks
It's because in japanese his name is completely different, he's "the accursed one" (呪縛者, "the one binded by a curse") and the design work interviews talk about the bundle of weapons he carries on his back as hunt trophies, so he likely channels the spirits of those he murders within himself, seen how grudgeful spirits are always depicted as screaming skulls even up to Sekiro and Elden Ring; the boss variant, after grabbing the player with his sword, buffs up and gains a new attack where these dark spirit projectiles erupt from his chest.
Dude literally has Doom 2's end level screen on his armour
wtfdr
“Forgotten Sinner” is probably a more appropriate name for the boss. She has been down there in Sinner’s Rise since long before the Bastille was overrun by the undead.
The name's always been that in japanese, translators simply decided to go for "lost" instead.
2:39 actually, it is true that the word '亡者' generally means the dead or the deceased, but in the Dark Souls series, this word corresponds to the Hollow.
i would guess it is because, just like hollows, the king of the giants also is dead spiritually and mentally after his defeat in our hands. in buddhism, mouja also refers to souls who have lost their way nirvana and so cant rest in peace
imagine failing to avenge your people, massacred by some king who came out of nowhere in your country and captured your people like animals. that would surely for me at least cause me mental or spiritual death. "why keep going on?" kinda stuff u know?
though humans and the giants of ds2 are different races, it is nice that this aspect of spiritual death is implied at least to be something they have (technically all races can have that but u get what i mean i think)
So happy to know that the devs see lucatiel as solaire
The fact that Velstadt is labeled Queen's Knight B while Throne Watcher and Defender were A and C gives me chill. It means at some point the developer intended to have us fight 3 late game bosses at once. A 3 human sized gank squad was bad enough, but 3 giant bosses each with complete moveset would be absolutely stupid.
Also Veldstadt originally being a knight for his queen rather his king might've been the actual reason why Nashandra clone in the DLC can summon shadow Veldstadt out of nowhere, they were remnant of a discarded concept.
DS2 is still one of my favorites, flaws and all. Loved your work over the years Crest, thank you.
So in game files, benhart is the father of creighton? Odd
It explains why an unused model of Creighton wields the fake Moonlight.
Maybe we met Bernhart in the past and then some time in the interim Patches kills him with a trap (perhaps for the sword). Then we meet Creighton in the present and that’s the original reason he was hunting Patches, not to get the ring and the loot like the final game, but revenge for his father.
Sea Solaire makes a lot of sense since she is pretty much the same; a tragic story about finding themselves, they can both be summoned for important bosses. She's also dressed up as a pirate. Jabba the Hutt is probably the best though.
She's a Don Quixote and the little bell-bitch is a Sancho Panza. This concept was intended for an unnamed FS game, but was rethought for DS2.
imagine that, someone drops an item in another world and a Pursuer Vagrant appears in yours xD
00:04 Ryu no Miko can also be translated as Dragon Priestess
00:42 Something neat about the term jujutsu in Japanese is that it's more like witchcraft/black/cursed magic, but in the Souls series is indeliably linked to Pyromancy. A practioner of jujutsu, a jujutsushi would be like a shaman
1:12 As much as I love an alliteration, bearish is a weird adjective here? Yowaki is more timid or fainthearted
1:44 I'm seeing in places that the official pronunciation of firekeeper in Japanese is himorime (although a lot of Japanese call them Kabotan as a nickname). Didn't realize the Maiden in Black from Demon's Souls is officially Firekeeper in Black in Japanese.
3:54 Sea Solaire is very funny
5:40 That's very weird that Benhart was Creighton's father?
Look at benhart's armor and Creighton's. They're near identical. They were meant to be related somehow but that plan was scrapped
LUCATIEL BEING NAMED SEA SOLAIRE WARMS MY HEART
“Older brother looking for his sister” bruh 😢
Avengingwarrior, Benhart was originally intended to be the father of Creighton the wanderer; Even having the same Mirrah insignia!?
Banshee: (meaning fairy-mound woman) is from Gaelic (Irish) Mythology: seeing this ghost is a bad omen, typically she is the spectator of a person who experienced a great misfortunate, he presence foreshadows a person's death, oftentimes the family or relations of those that see her are cursed to suffer similarly terrible misfortunate often passing away. Wailing, screaming or keening before disappearing.
Durahan: (Gan Ceann meaning one lacking head) is a Gaelic word. It's Irish Folklore.
Emerald herald: A Celtic/Gaelic woman, she's possibly druidic?
5:54: should add that dullahan are mythical headless warriors
The Darklurker was originally Agdayne's stand? maybe Agdayne was originally going to be a boss. That would explain why he has a whole unique moveset complete with spells and anime flips. Suppose they ended up reusing the stand idea with Sully in DS3.
He WAS a boss of at some point, no question about it. It is known for quite some time.
Armor Seller: Swaggish (final form)
I wonder if the Queen Knights A, B, and C names means the Throne of Want boss fight was originally a Trio instead of a Duo.
I'm glad that velstadt has his own fight it's one of my favourites and seeing vendrick right after defeating velstadt was an amazing moment
i think the dragonriders name is interesting, really shows the dragonless rider was perhaps supposed to have a dragon.
concept art shows them riding a drake like the one leading to ornstein
Very interesting to see how the developers thought
There are so many implications that can be drawn from this that will just fall flat based on how the game turned out. Saulden was supposed to have a story arc where he gains back his courage? Or maybe that would have been him in the past before he lost his nerve. Benhart and Creighton were father and son yet in the final game they have no connection other than the seal on their chest pieces? Maybe the two blacksmiths would have been the same person just one is in the past and still human? Darklurker is a jojo reference but he has literally no connection to Agdayne in game? I don't particularly enjoy DS2 but that just makes me wonder if this game would have been great had it not been rushed to development. Great stuff Crest!
Not necessarily for Saulden, it could be “heartbroken” is the internal descriptor for all the crestfallens in the Souls series.
@@GuardianOwl It would be kind of weird if there were two different crestfallen warriors in the game
@@Slayer_of_Demons well, DS1 has two, since the crestfallen merchant in Sen’s fortress is in knight attire
@@dungeaterfancam True, I just figured because they look alike it could be a remnant of the time travel meme in early DS2 development
Luet having Saulden's face is just a coincidence. Jester also has his face but I ended up not adding him to the video.
4:44 holy cute
Looking Glass Knight was called Mirror Knight in a pre-release English build of the game. For whatever reason, the English translation team changed it to sound more archaic.
Jabba the hutt
Always love a new Crest upload 😊
7:24 bro is mogging the bearer of the curse, looks like that one meme 😂😂😂😂
That was magnificent!
Thank you Yodaman!
Darklurker originally being Agdayne's stand clears up a bit
Would it be a better translation for ryu no miko as "dragon priestess"?
Game: Shalquoir, also she knows speak French
Devs: Cat
Nice.
Originally she was just a cat that once lived in Drangleic Castle. You would need a special ring to talk with her.
She might still be. She does know the king's scent.
BENHEART IS CREIGHTON'S FATHER? WHAT?!
Holy shit; that's a lot of lore! So, Lucatiel is literally a female Solaire, Pate really IS Patches playing 4d chess, Adgayne is a powerful fuck who can summon the hardest boss in the base game, and Ben is Creighton's DAD? I also can't believe I just clued in that the desert sorceresses are really just a bunch of Slave Leias!
Super cool dude!
4:18 so the translation team decided to name it "Lost SInner", but it's not a sinner that got lost, but a sinner that was lost by someone? someone forgot the sinner, thus a lost sinner and not a sinner that got lost by themselves
I think was meant in a "lost to time" sense.
Best Soles 2
4:46 - 6:34 what's a "NPC for multi"?
And is it possible to replicate this characters appearance on a in-game character or is it a unique model? because she's really pretty (for dark souls character creation typical standarts)
NPC for Multiplayer. And yes it's possible to make a character look the same as her
8 months late but they're the AI summons
Sea Solaire 🥺 like i've always felt this way
I like your channel. SUBSCRIBED!
Armor Seller : Bullish is what I look like when I go all in SP500 with max leverage
So Sellsword Luet has the same model as Crestfallen in Majula, huh? This must be just reusing the model rather than something with lore implications, since Luet doesn't take off his helmet anyway...
NPC cooperators and invaders have four face variants for men and four for women, so a lot of them are actually Saulden under the helmet strictly speaking, even Maldron.
very cool
Ironic Gillian is ladder seller considering he says he only makes miniatures
loli Emerald Herald uoh 😭
What is the child maiden about? Never saw anything about her
Cut content. At some point in time DS2 was going to be more focused on time/memory travelling. After a while she was going to be just for a cutscene or another. Ended up completely scrapped. Like DS1 had a kid Witch Beatrice that got cut too.
cat
lucatiel being called sea solaire just makes you think
Nagas are semi-divine, supernatural half serpent / half human creatures.
Patches confirmed
4:44 Oh she is very cute
jabba
damn so many npcs, never thought they were so many, no wonder l loved this so much. then theres people saying DS has no story xD lmao they dont even know how to play he game or what is DS about l guess.
People who say that probably skip all the dialogue and want to boss rush. 😅
GUTHRY IS A WOMAN?!? WHAT???
By the way, there are npcs missing, like Maldron, for example :/
Maldron was added in Scholar so his name wasn't leaked
Ah, what a shame :/
By the way, I've been watching your videos since like 2019, Crest, and you were the first channel about Souls cut content and such that I ever watched. So, thank you for still being here :D
Will there ever be a video like this for DS3 and Bloodborne as well? ^^
@@Wormerizzator Thanks! DS3 yes, BB only if it comes out to pc/emulator
I never could really get interested in this cartoon spin-off.
Then why did you watch a video about it?
are you serious that the darklurker is a jojo reference
lmao yeah what
always has been