Phil Schreier joins John Popp on NRA News Curator's Corner for a new series, February Fakes. This week's fake is the Colt Dragoon. Air date: 3-3-2014. nramuseums.com
its not really a fake, in the factory they used to cobble together guns from parts lying around. look it up, colt had so many spare parts he started cobbling together guns
Could very well be a 3rd Model Dragoon w certain custom / personalized parts, ie. fluted cylinder and square trigger guard. It could happen. Sweet looking piece.
It's hard for Philip to explain fakery as detecting fakery takes experience, patience, and is close to an art (as is the faking) with few people really good at it, and Phil has just about seen it all. Again, as John points out, fakery was done to make a firearm appear to be a rarity, a real temptation for someone with money but little knowledge. This was a real issue in the 50's and 60's as there were few references for those affected with the I want it now before it gets away disease. I have a bout of this about once a week but fortunately don't have the money to get me into deep trouble. I remember even in the seventies at the Houston gun show (I was young but always had a table) where this fast talker was taking a "rare" version of an 1849 pocket around asking an exorbitant price for it (many, many thousands of dollars). The pistol had some features that were very real and normal and there was no question the frame and cylinder were original , but it was the barrel that somehow made it rare, if I remember correctly it was a very short little barrel-to me it didn't look right (the barrel looked shop made) and I knew nothing about them. Maybe he was arguing it was an experimental model. He was trying to get someone to bite or trade him a valuable gun. Some of the table holders were laughing behind his back, but they could not tell if he sincerely thought he had something very rare or was trying to rip off someone.
I wonder if that was originally made to purposely fool someone, or if some one had originally made for their own use as their version of the idea Dragoon.
From the fit an finish. It's entirely possible it was made by a gunsmith or machinist working for Colt at that time. For himself on the side no doubt, without Colts knowledge or approval.
So is it pieces of a real Dragoon cobbled together or did they actually make the gun from scratch? It's a third gen they were trying to pass off as a first gen? What the hell does old cloth mean?
my humble opinion. the serial number was way off to set it apart from colt's production guns to draw attention to it; perhaps not a regular production gun but an experiment - fluted cylinder gives it a unique look, but is also would not be "safe" by colt standards for powder charge. no doubt craftsmanship is superb, but to say it is a "fake" may never be known. serial numbers do not always tell the story ask chevy guys what COPO means and if anything is possible.
Deliberate Fake? De Farbed Modern? Custom Gunsmith made from Left Over Parts Old Stock? Could be any number of those. The finish looks too good for one thing. It would have had to have been unfired or fired very little and stored in perfect conditions. Just getting the Colt proofing marks correct would have taken a ton of research besides the Serial #.
its not really a fake, in the factory they used to cobble together guns from parts lying around. look it up, colt had so many spare parts he started cobbling together guns
Could very well be a 3rd Model Dragoon w certain custom / personalized parts, ie. fluted cylinder and square trigger guard. It could happen. Sweet looking piece.
It's hard for Philip to explain fakery as detecting fakery takes experience, patience, and is close to an art (as is the faking) with few people really good at it, and Phil has just about seen it all. Again, as John points out, fakery was done to make a firearm appear to be a rarity, a real temptation for someone with money but little knowledge. This was a real issue in the 50's and 60's as there were few references for those affected with the I want it now before it gets away disease. I have a bout of this about once a week but fortunately don't have the money to get me into deep trouble.
I remember even in the seventies at the Houston gun show (I was young but always had a table) where this fast talker was taking a "rare" version of an 1849 pocket around asking an exorbitant price for it (many, many thousands of dollars). The pistol had some features that were very real and normal and there was no question the frame and cylinder were original , but it was the barrel that somehow made it rare, if I remember correctly it was a very short little barrel-to me it didn't look right (the barrel looked shop made) and I knew nothing about them. Maybe he was arguing it was an experimental model. He was trying to get someone to bite or trade him a valuable gun. Some of the table holders were laughing behind his back, but they could not tell if he sincerely thought he had something very rare or was trying to rip off someone.
The loading lever release is also wrong for the Dragoon series.
I wonder if that was originally made to purposely fool someone, or if some one had originally made for their own use as their version of the idea Dragoon.
The gun in True Grit is a Colt Walker.
Yes it is a Colt Walker in True Grit but to his credit, I believe John Wayne did quote the gun as a "Colt's Dragoon".
+sjr341 it was meant to be a dragoon, but they felt with Mattie's small frame, a Walker would look more impressive
From the fit an finish. It's entirely possible it was made by a gunsmith or machinist working for Colt at that time. For himself on the side no doubt, without Colts knowledge or approval.
So is it pieces of a real Dragoon cobbled together or did they actually make the gun from scratch? It's a third gen they were trying to pass off as a first gen? What the hell does old cloth mean?
😇😰
my humble opinion.
the serial number was way off to set it apart from colt's production guns to draw attention to it; perhaps not a regular production gun but an experiment - fluted cylinder gives it a unique look, but is also would not be "safe" by colt standards for powder charge.
no doubt craftsmanship is superb, but to say it is a "fake" may never be known.
serial numbers do not always tell the story ask chevy guys what COPO means and if anything is possible.
Deliberate Fake? De Farbed Modern? Custom Gunsmith made from Left Over Parts Old Stock? Could be any number of those. The finish looks too good for one thing. It would have had to have been unfired or fired very little and stored in perfect conditions. Just getting the Colt proofing marks correct would have taken a ton of research besides the Serial #.
Amazingly stupid. Why would you go to all that trouble and not get the serial number right for the correct model. Dumb, dumb, dumb!
Its not fake