Can You Identify All 10 of These Door Handle Type? (Categories of Door and Latch Functions)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 พ.ค. 2024
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Sometimes educational list videos / categorization explainers are boring and sometimes they're fun. What do you think this one is?
I honestly find the minutia of industry-specific arcane knowledge fascinating a lot of the time. If you're like me, maybe you'll dig on this. Enjoy! 👍😁👍
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![[1503] Police Handcuffs: Flawed, But Good Enough](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/49l8hQZO5gE/mqdefault.jpg)
The institutional lock reminded me of this story a few years back.
"An elderly couple briefly escaped from a secure memory care unit at an assisted living facility in Tennessee.
The man, upon the couple returning safely to the facility, said he used his military experience with Morse code to memorize the code to an electronic keypad that locked the door to the unit."
I think I read about that!
@@DeviantOllam An old guy pulling out James Bond skills is pretty cool but it's also a lesson to the makers of key pads in my opinion.
Can you elaborate? What does Morse code have to do with a keypad - does it beep the Morse of each letter upon each press or something?
@@henrikoldcorn As a skilled CW(Morse) operator his ear was trained to recognize dits and das. Some trained operators get so good they recognize the identity of other CW operators just by the way they key even if they don't identify themselves. That's all to say he was very skilled at recognizing patterns in sounds. You or I would probably need a recording to compare the sounds and decode the pin. With his trained ear he was able to recognize the different beeps of the keys that were pushed. They were slightly different tones like a touch tone ohone. Some of the phone phreakers could do the same thing with touch tone phones. One phone phreaker was even said to be able to recreate the tones by whistling but that's another story. If you have an audio recorder and a keypad wasn't designed properly it can be a valid attack.
@@jmr It takes a very well trained or abnormally sensitive ear, but if you've got the hearing for it it's entirely doable on almost any keypad. Not that kind of electronics guy, but my guess is it has to do with the different amount of electrical resistance between the key, and the little button speaker that makes the tone. One of the little corner cuts that goes into the manufacturing of those keypads.
I don't think I've ever seen a door handle with an integrated lock in europe. We just always have a separate door handle and locking mechanism.
Only place where I've seen locking door handles is windows actually. Usually its a button you push in to lock it, and then a key to release the button. Sort of works like a locking e-stop button.
Yes, your door hardware and even the form factor of most of your lock cylinders is quite different than what we have here on our side of the pond 👍
Came here to comment this. Sometimes there are interesting interactions between locking mechanism and handle. For example on some emergency exit doors, the interior handle can retract the deadbolt in order to allow fast egress.
It would be great if you could do a similar video for European door hardware. Watching from England and found it very interesting but not particularly useful.@@DeviantOllam
I've seen door knobs with centre locks here in uk
I've never been to the UK, are they more common than your usual door handle with euro cylinder(I think that's what the cylinders are called) underneath?@@chasejdmartin
I guess the UK is known for using metric and imperial, so I guess they use NA and EU locks too, lol.
Awesome video! I was a locksmith for a huge school district for 15 years. You aren't kidding about the abuse those locks get. We actually had "prison grade" door hardware get destroyed by middle school kids. Every day was another case of "how did they manage to break that?"
PS I'm the locksmith whose reddit post you quoted at DEFCON seven years ago regarding the commonality of the Diebold voting machine C415A key. I chanced across that video last week, and it's a strange experience to randomly hear your own words quoted back to you 14 years after the fact!
Wow, so cool to see you pop up on my screen yet again!
Also, a good point here is that some "prison grade" door hardware are actually DESIGNED to break sooner in case of abuse, as a "broken, but locked" function. In the same way cotter pins on safe handles are designed to snap off if too much force is put on the safe handle, before any locking hardware breaks if an attempt is made to break open the safe by for example using a long cheater bar on the safe handle.
Because, you would rather have a handle break and become unuseable, rather than inmates escaping to a possibility sensitive location.
So maybe, "prison grade" is not the right door hardware. You more want some "industrial option" grade locks, with beefier components designed to handle lot of abuse, not neccessarly absue coming from someone trying to break in, but rather general rough handling and abuse. Like handles that can tolerate someone climbing up on a open door, or abuse by colliding a forklift into the handle if you understand what I mean.
Thats not what a "prison grade" handle is designed to tolerate, as inmates don't climb up on a open or unlocked door (by using the handle as a ladder) just to play and have fun, they will take that open door as a chance to escape.
When I worked as a ropes course/climbing wall builder, our annual conference would have a table of damaged or broken gear in the exhibition hall with a challenge to identify the mechanical forces that caused the damage to a piece of gear that, if used correctly, should be within a 7:1 or 10:1 safety factor.
Do locksmiths have the same little game? I assume it would be surprising to show a sheared "prison grade" cylinder/latch and hear that a 60lb 12 year old was the cause.
@@delphic464 You must also understand what "Prison grade" really means. You might have a super strong rope, but with the warning "Not for climbing", which means the rope is not designed for abrasive forces, so it will wear down quickly if used in climbing restraints or being run against stone.
So even if that rope could carry 3ton, it would still not be safe for climbing since after a week that rope might be wore down so much theres only a few strands left and would snap at next use.
Thats why you must understand what a rating really means. Not just "wow, prison grade, that sounds strong if it can keep criminals at bay" but what you are buying is something super flimsy that is designed to break first (like a fuse in a electrical circuit) so other components in lock are protected and thus fulfilling the goal of keeping criminals on the right side of that door..
Thats why you need to understand the goal of each rating or "grade". "Industrial grade" for example are very strong, but not so secure. It can handle lots of bad enviroments and heavy abuse, but when it reach the limit, it will expose the whole lock and allow it to be opened with a screwdriver.
So as I said, if you want something that can handle the abuse of kids, then industrial grade which will be stronger than prison grade. If you however want something secure that will keep someone outside (or inside) regardless of amount of force they put on handle/door, then "prison grade", which is intentionally weaker to give a break point that will keep the door shut.
@@sebastiannielsen Are you answering my question regarding professional trade groups enjoying and learning from the strange and humorous ways our equipment gets destroyed, or are you attempting to show your "mastery" of a topic by patronizingly describing the minutiae of industry-specific terms that those who study physical security are already familiar with?
Great video! I'm a locksmith and have seen every one of these locks in use (including asylum/institution) except for communicating. The terms definitely switch around a lot (I usually see classroom by storeroom instead of classroom security) and many brands have combined features such as adding the coffee shop auto unlock to their entry sets. This is definitely a good video to send to people with a timestamp when I'm trying to explain.
I'm so glad it's helpful! Keep up the great work out there for others, both explaining and installing!
I'm a gray beard locksmith that runs a builders hardware installation company and I have ran into them all except the classroom security function. I've seen communicating locks in hotels so rooms can be shared as well as interior communicating mortise locks on Jack and Jill bathrooms in early 1900's homes.
Freaking great video. So many different ways to make things work, or not. I learned a bunch.
I've actually encountered all of these over the years. The institutional locks creeped me out the most. I was working at the local prison after a fire, so the outside door was always propped open for us to come and go. Someone bumped the prop, and the door shut. Locking us in. And of course they had cell jammers running, so we couldn't call security to open it remotely. It was a very strange feeling being litteraly locked in. I guess i will continue being a decent human and stay out of jail, because i did not like that feeling whatsoever. Lol
As someone who frequently has to specify doors for architectural projects, this is very enlightening and I will definitely pay more attention to what I’m specifying. Up until now I just kept them generic because I never knew how in depth this can be
Standard front door lock in the UK is always locked when the door closes, you always need the key if you're outside. We have latches to keep them unlocked if we want to pop out for a quick second but we have to enable them ourselves.
What's weirder is my home. Every place I've been, even one that uses uPVC doors and non-"Yale" locks - the internal handle works but the external handle doesn't without the key. In some - notably the uPVC doors with the european style cyilinders - you can "double lock" the door so that the inside handle doesn't work either, and the extra little levers swing down in the multi-point-locking frame.
My door uh? Doesn't lock from the outside unless it's fully locked. There's no "Oh the outside is still locked but you can quickly egress in an emergency" option. Not that I particularly mind - I get nervous about bypasses and I have multiple pre-practiced escape options depending on where I am in my home should an emergency occur - but it's unusual enough that other people comment about worrying that I might get trapped in a fire.
Thank you for the cool perspective on some of the norms and standards outside of the USA... I should have definitely mentioned that my video was rather specific to North America
@@DeviantOllam Of course! It was interesting to see the NA standard. I spent about six weeks in Omaha of all places, the difference in lock standards is actually one of the things that gave me culture shock, so watching this was very informative and a lot of fun.
We really don’t have ‘standard’ domestic exterior door lock in the UK. The only real regulations are for rental properties (where egress must be achievable without the key).
The first lock you’re describing would be a “Yale night latch.” The standard models will meet the rental requirement (though you can get variants that need a key to operate the deadlock function from the inside), and most will meet the minimum security standards imposed by insurance companies (BS:3621 - though some older models don’t). You don’t tend to see these much, except for the entrances to individual flats (which tend to still use wooden fire doors).
The second lock you’re describing sounds standard for rental properties (other than flats). Night latch plus multi-point locking function, fitted with a euro-cylinder. On rentals the euro-cylinders should be thumb-turn (not keyed) on the inside. I’ve not seen it before, but an owner-occupier could use this system with a double keyed euro-cylinder. Though FWIW most manufacturers advise always to throw the multi-point bolts (whether you’re double locking the door or not) to keep the door-set in plumb.
The their lock you’re describing (your lock) sounds like the standard for an owner-occupied house. (Non-locking) spring-latch with multi-point locking, fitted with a euro-cylinder. Most common is with a double keyed euro-cylinder, though (provided it still meets the insurance requirements) you could easily swap it for a key outside thumb-turn inside cylinder. Less security (risk of letterbox, rather than under door, attack), but easier egress. Same advice about throwing the multi-point bolts applies.
@@positivelyacademical1519 Ooh thank you for the more informed technical info! I was just going off what I've seen growing up.
Weirdly I live in a housing asoc flat as a council tenant? So, hypothetically I should be having the middle kind, the uPVC door with the renters thumb turn, but, what I have is a keyhole both sides and, like I said - and like you specified - the owner's door that doesn't lock. Wouldn't be the first time the company that owns this property have done something very weird and atypical - some of it has been definitively illegal, so.
I did consider a thumb-turn but, like you said, letterbox attack. I could always get a more secure letter box system but, to be fair, I have an ABUS bar lock across my bedroom door if there's a fire the planned escape is through the window rather than trying to negotiate all that.
Years ago you'd see what is now a passage/closet function sold as distinct "passage" and "closet" products. The "passage" version would have two handles or knobs while the closet version would have a thumb turn for the inside of the closet, which was more compact and less likely to snag on stuff when there was little clearance on the inside. My old late-50s house back in Dallas had the "closet" variant on all of the closet doors.
Great topic. I remember doing a psych rotation during my residency at Creedmore Hospital, where most floors had patients that were violent or otherwise not compos mentis. The only way in or out was through two sets of reinforced metal doors sporting a peep hole window with imbedded chicken wire, and locks that used rather large brass skeleton keys. It was sort of an airlock type system which protecting the medical staff from bum rushes or push-ins. When I returned months after my rotation had ended to pick up some evaluations, I no longer had a key so another staff member who recognized me let me in to go to the Attending Psychiatrist’s office, but upon discovering he wasn’t there that day, I realized I had no way out. I ran up to the innermost door and started tapping on the glass yelling “I have to get out, im a doctor” as staff just passed by first giving a side eye glance and then quickening their pace. Clearly I would have gotten the same reaction if I said I was Napoleon. What began to really scare me though was the zombie-like inpatients approaching me from down the long institutional green hall with that Thorazine shuffle. I’ve seen bloodshed over a refusal to give a cigarette, and worse, during my rotation, so I conflated a suitably horrid outcome for myself. As a last gasp, I began loudly reciting the 12 cranial nerves through passageway every time I saw a figure lining up between the chicken wire viewports. A fellow walked past but then I heard the clanking of the locks, one and then the other just barely escaping the horrible end I convinced myself I would succumb to. The doctor that rescued me said the cranial nerve trick was what convinced him to come investigate. Needless to say he admonished my decision to go on the ward without a key. I suspect they’ve modernized a bit in the 40 years since I’ve been there.
And that’s my lock story.
My friend in high school (mid 80's) had an office style lock on the front door of his house, needless to say that's where I started/needed to learn my physical pen-testing skills...
"I am the door" ... You're the most informative and entertaining door I've ever seen!
My mom was a teacher for many years and when they had a lock down she would have to go outside to lock the door and she mentioned how that was not ideal. Not sure if it was ever upgraded after she retired, but I hope so.
I was a school district locksmith for 15 years. Ever since about 2011, most states have required new classroom lock installs to be lockable from the inside. Unfortunately, already existing classroom locks that only lock from outside number in the millions, and the modification to lock from inside is often expensive, so it'll be quite some time before we see the issue fully addressed.
I put in privacy locks on all my inside doors, including my closets. Not for security, but they were cheaper than the closet locks.
Sometimes it can be useful to have a locking closet. For example, if you have guests with children visiting and don't want them rummaging around in your underwear.
@2:30 -- Where the door handle is rigid when locked... I worked at an convention/entertainment venue which had locks like this. When we couldn't get ahold of a key we needed, we learned that we could gain access to the room in about 20 seconds of pulling up and down hard a few times, shearing the pins. Fortunately, the locksmith was a good friend of the building and often hung out in our on-site gym and didn't mind re-keying them after we'd done our deed.
Nice overview for US-style door handles. You might want to consider adding an international version at some point. There is certainly more out there. E.g. here in Germany it is extremely rare (can't remember having seen one here at all) to have a lock cylinder inside a handle. For non electronic locks the lock cylinder is about 10cm below the handle center. I also consider this to be safer as there's no easy way to get the lock cylinder out of the door whereas a sledge hammer should solve that for all handles you've shown. But I'm sure there are pros and cons for both approaches.
@@lightcycler4806 Properly installed the cylinder is flush with the solid metal cover plate (not sure if that's the proper wording; the big more or less rectangular thing) which itself sits flush on the door (and there are no screws on the outside). If its installed badly and the cylinder sticks out, yes you have a problem.
Cold storage is an edge case latch. Typically the outside is a lever pull handle and can be locked with a padlock. The inside usually has a knob that when properly installed, can be unscrewed and will drop the entire assembly, padlock and all so you can't be locked in.
Another one that I've seen in schools, etc. here in Australia (although, only on mortice locks, not tubular locksets) is the Vestibule Lock setup. Where the outside lever handle is always dead (or missing, in favour of a vertical fixed handle), inside handle is always free, key on the outside retracts the latch, unless the lock has been locked from the inside, typically with a key, but sometimes a thumb-turn. Most of the time these have anti-lockout as well
Love this video! For years this has been my understanding. Store room function = Always locked outside with always unlocked inside. Asylum function = Always locked inside and always locked outside. Vestibule function = can lock outside with interior key. Classroom function = always unlocked inside and outside locked or unlocked with exterior key. Here's a fun one. Ever hear of "Time Out" function? Inside is locked as long as outside button is held.
You are correct about storeroom function and asylum function. Source: some one who actually works in this industry not youtube.
I work in an ER, and while our locks are all electronically based, these are still similar to the locking protocols we have, and we have a protocol that turns all of the doors into an odd no special security to open it from the inside but then also no possible way to open it from the outside (which really only works if the space is always going to be occupied).
Also, that oddity reminds me of the fact that until somewhat recently, Denny's locations used to have passageway handles on their main doors because they were 24/7 and just never needed a lock. It was only when they decided to close one Christmas that they got locks
12:51 it's the small details that are so good, thanks Ollam, the editor, or who chose that picture.
that is one of several images i photoshopped, yeah =)
From my experience standard "classroom" function as still quite common as many school have not upgraded to the newer "classroom security" function types. The main difference is the lack of a key cylinder on the inside to lock the outside handle without having to open the door and use the outside key cylinder.
Also from what I have run into "storeroom" function usually do not have a key cylinder on the inside, just the outside. You always need a key to open from the outside but can freely egress from the inside with out the key, and there is no way to leave the outside unlocked.
From a British perspective, I find it a bit weird to see keyholes incorporated into the handles. Pretty much every lockable door I've seen here has the locking barrel in the main door body, just below the handle, and turning the key sets a deadbolt. In residential settings, thumb-turns are quite common, or even locking using the key on the inside. Bathroom stall locks are typically a slider on the door frame.
That’s very common here too, generally we might have two locks on a door (deadbolt above/below handle with thumbturn on inside), however in public environments the code gets more strict and thus it gets integrated into the handle (though occasionally you might have a key cylinder above the handle that is part of the handle locking mechanism.
It's funny that I remember the first time I encountered a clutched handle, and I was definitely confused. I was trying to enter my dentist's office, but they were still on their lunch break and hadn't unlocked the door yet.
Even more fun is the fixed handle where the door latch can only be operated by the key. The handle stays fixed while you turn the key to open the door!
Here in Sweden the mechanisms that the handles and lock cylinder interacts with live together in a steel box in the door. You pick either latch for handle and fixed (deadbolt?) for the lock or double latches. The locking latch can usually be disabled by either moving a little knob just above the latch or sometimes by a key going into a hole in the same place as the knob. Then you set up the behaviour of the door by placing handles, lock cylinders and thumbturns appropriately. The toilets get a special little cover plate instead of the locking cylinder that shows if it is occupied or not.
I find the way you Americans do it really wierd and complicated.
I've seen those coffee shop doors where closing the door causes the button to pop out and unlock the door, definitely, and recently.
A long time ago, 20+ years at least, I remember seeing two variations on a theme at hotels or motels for do not disturb locks. The outside handle or knob was always locked and never operated, but the inside had a button you could push which did two things: it caused a small pin to extend from the front of the lock that was visible to someone on the outside (like housekeeping), and caused another pin to intrude into the keyway that would physically prevent a key from being inserted. I remember in one hotel the outside knob was big enough it had a second key cylinder next to it that I expect was for a hotel override key. The other motel had a separate keyed deadbolt lock which wasn't operated by the room key, so maybe that was internally coupled to the handle lock in a way that allowed for an override key, but I'm not sure. Opening the door from the inside definitely disengaged this mechanism, and I think closing the door may have as well, like the coffee shop door, so you couldn't leave the room with this engaged.
Given how metal keys (for guests) have largely disappeared from hotels and motels I'd be surprised to see something like this today.
Yes! That was also a mechanism that the Schlage company specifically referred to as a communicating lock... With the little pin that would protrude outward front.
@@DeviantOllamI have seen that pin surprisingly often!
I'm a janitor so definitely familiar with the janitor locks, couple of odd cases I've seen are the doors of the loading dock that bar re-entry to everyone and nobody has a key and the office style lock on the bathroom at the laundromat i go to which makes it prone to lock outs.
Are you saying the loading dock door has a lock facing the outside but no one has a key for it, or it doesn't have a lock at all? What's on the inside of that loading dock door? A conventional handle or some sort of panic hardware?
@@DeviantOllam inside is a push bar and a lock outside but I've never seen anyone use a key and people constantly have to put something in the door to hold it open or go around to another door.
Your red team teachings help me be a better blue team provider. Thank you so much!
It's great to hear that!
In 1950s in hotels there were doors between suites that could be locked on either side . They were normally locked both ways. Both sides had to be unlocked for the door to open.
my old school had a few doors where you could lock or unlock the outside handle by flipping a switch underneath the latch on the edge of the door
I’ve seen a communicating lock in the exact scenario you described at my Grandparents old house.
Upstairs bathroom was attached to the hallway as well as the guest bedroom, so although the bathroom was primarily for the guest bedroom it was all the only bathroom upstairs so it also had a hallway door, which made sense as often the guest bedroom wasn’t occupied and it was beneficial to have a convenient bathroom on the second floor where my grandfathers office was among other things.
Proper nomenclature is the key to precise communication.
I remember a "communicating" lock arrangement in a 1950s "motor court." Adjoining units would share a bathroom - presumably for economy of construction. The bathroom had two doors directly opposite each other. There was an eye-bolt on each door and a light chain with two hooks that would be used to connect the two doors by the bathroom occupant. Thus keeping both doors locked when in use. But when you left you could not lockout the other guest room because you had to unhook the chain when you left. There were slide latches on the bedroom side of the doors to prevent your neighbor from entry into your sleeping space.
I watch a lot of Lockpicking Lawyer... but he never talks about this kind of stuff that pen testers would be interested in. Thank you.
His videos used to align better with Deviants. Sadly he changed his format for wider appeal. I'm subscribed but rarely watch his content. Occasionally he has something interesting. If you have the opportunity to see one of his talks those are good.
@@jmr I'm not sure what you mean by LPL's videos aligning better with Deviants.
The thing I get from LPL is about ways to defeat specific locks - mostly by attacking the lock itself.
Deviant has a broader scope. He could care less about picking or attacking a lock if he's able to gain entry. So it's a different perspective.
@@RealRickCox His old videos were very different from what he does now.
wow I didn't know what they were called but I have seen them all. The communicating locks we had in our shared passthrough bathroom between mine and my sisters room.
I've seen what you referred to as exit locks sold at the big box stores as classroom latches. I but then often because they're my favorite thing to put on offices with electronically locking latches.
Yes they are very popular in that context, with electric strikes
I've encountered every one of these types, but never knew the nomenclature or specific purposes of a few. Thank you for making this.
I remember when I was in middle school and they changed all the door handles from the ones that had a lock on the inside to lock to the door to a regular button lock. While they were in the process they changed out all the locks from the ancient Schlage number keyways to Schlage Everest. Funny thing was that all the locks were Schlage Everest but they gave the teachers Everest Primus keys so to prove a point that the locks weren’t actually Everest Primus I got ahold of one of my teachers keys, took my key gauge out of my bag measured the key and gave my teacher the key back. I had my mentor locksmith cut me a key on a standard C123 Everest blank and sure enough it worked. I destroyed the key after I was done like a good boy so there wouldn’t be any trouble.
Must've had everest primus on the perimeter/outside doors
When i was a youngling, i encountered several of those "Communicating Locks". Thanks for bringing up some cool memories!
I was recently locked out of our new house because of the newer handles that still allow egress while locked (but didn't unlock the lock) and I quickly and with mixed feelings when found that I couldn't get back in without some lockpicking tools or breaking a window. I had not run into one of these in the wild before that day.
Also, how are the institutional locks different from storeroom lock? Are they functionally the same but with different names for different use cases?
That "communicating lock" sounds interesting, that would solve the bathroom problem I've seen like you describe where they just put "normal" privacy locks and pick who gets an awkward experience.
The “maintenance shop” at the company I work for is one of the rare exception that I fined a fixed handle/knob. It’s rather annoying as everything else in our company is not. Great point of discussion and thought for this video
I have all of Jimmy's current line, except for his new top of the keyway turning tool. They are awesome pics.
House I grew up in as a kid had the same exact communicating lock setup for my bathroom with two doors, one to the hall and one to my room.
16:06 😂 “clean and working “
My old office had what sounds like an outdated, not code compliant lock. The front door was all glass and was just open most of the time. It didn't have a latch set at all. But the deadbolt that locked it at night needed a key on the inside as well as outside instead of a thumb turn.
A cool category would be locks who have different functionality based off the doorframe they are in. A single door can attach itself to multiple different door frames so for different door frames it may make sense to operate differently. There could be a mechanism in the lock to keep track of which door frame the door was in to make it behave differently.
Awesome video! The "communicating lock" #3 situation is exactly how I encountered one before myself! Bathroom at grandparent's house with 1 door to the hallway and 1 door on other side of the bathroom to the master bedroom! Haven't thought about that in a long time thanks!
I love how his descriptions of serious threats includes burritos, poltergeists, and deranged axe murderers and all are treated as equally threatening.
Thanks for this. Today I learned what I wanted for my home office exists.
My main concern was small kids locking the door with themselves inside. I don’t expect to lock the door with myself inside but a classroom lock sounds perfect.
If you don’t often expect to lock yourself inside, the residential handle that unlocks when the inside handle is turned sounds fine for this use case I think
Seen the communicating lock both on the as-described bathroom situation, and once in hotel rooms where the room can be opened to an adjecent hotel room.
The other instances of shared hotel rooms had just two back-to-back doors with the handle on the room side and nothing on the inbetween side, makes the locking situation much more obvious and transparent to the user, and probably better noise insulation as a free bonus.
Fun fact (from France), my home's door is a storeroom lock. I actually really like it, because it means I can't lock myself out or anything. (And, as in the other comments, since I'm in Europe the lock isn't in the handle but under it.)
So, yeah, I was kinda surprised when you said that code would never allow something like that in the U.S.. Although, maybe it just was more allowed ~28 years ago when my parents moved in.
But, yeah, interesting video, as usual.
@@lightcycler4806 Oh, that makes sense.
yeah!! I've seen those communicating locks on a shared bathroom before also!
There was a communicating lock in my grandparents home for the same reason, but they replaced it with one that had a key to pop the privacy lock, but to do so you had to remove/move(I am not sure) the lock shield. After the second time of the EMTs fighting with the door and going around (Grandpa had Parkinson's) Grandma had the doors changed.
I order door hardware all day everyday. This video is super helpful
In other countries, the key retract latch always locked exterior and interior always free is called store room. This prevents lock ins.
Keyed both side is called glass door and is used to separate adjoining corridor spaces. Like the back hallways of a mall.
Been under door attacking for a long time, it never gets old, always a hoot, and under door security is always lax.
Communicating Lock,,, seen a few in random homes when using the bathroom over my 40 years, typically in nice subdivisions around Halifax or Toronto, fancy people and their extra doors to their bathrooms.
Communicating latches, I lived at several work camps that were set up with two small rooms sharing a bathroom, I've also been in one hospital suite that had a similar setup, although a little different, but basically, you could lock either side of the door to the bathroom. In the case of the work camps, I think they assumed you wouldn't lock your own side, so one side should always be unlocked in case of emergency, but I do think they also had a master key. The hospital had a secondary keyed unlock system as well, but I don't recall how it was set up.
"you can imagine me made of solid oak wood" - I have to be honest, I already thought you were made of solid oak. Because you're so rugged yet beautiful!
😊👍🪵
A gas station I used to work at had what looked like a corridor lock, but anything that could get into the keyhole could pop it. It was done that way so in an emergency we're not juggling the 12 or so keys and can just insert any one of them to pop it open
I've had a Spam key on my keychain since, well, since Spam used to require a key to open.
It's the perfect key for the vast majority of privacy locks. I recommend getting one if you can find it.
I am a chemical engineer and live in Philadelphia. I love any information that has to do with pen testing. As a matter of fact I am going to get in touch because I am about ready to change professions. Eventually I am starting a garage that specializes in pre-WW1 race cars. I believe I am starting a mobile locksmith company in the next few weeks. I'll be in touch.
Right on right on, if there's any training that RTA could offer which would help, we're always here for you 👍
10:32 it is interesting to see that different countries operate differently. in the UK, majority of house locks will close shut in this "oh the wind shut the door" scenario, and what we would do is turn the handle up when the door is open to stick out the latch so that the door doesn't close
We have an inside entrance to our condo pool. The insurance company told us we need to have a lock on the door away from the pool side. We also open large pool doors in the summer so this door needs to also lock from the pool side, so this door can function as an exterior door. We need the door to close with a closer and be self locking so that it isn’t accidentally left open.
So we need a self locking storeroom or institutional lock. Thank you for explaining all the options.
I saw the communicating lock on doors to a Jack&Jill bathroom at my aunt's house which was built in the late 1960s. The bathroom was shared between two bedrooms.
Jimmy picks are great. Just ordered a set and OMG they're a near perfect balance between price and finish.
German classrooms have a special type of thumbturn cylinder. The thumbturn allows you to lock the door and unlock from the inside. But when using the key on the outside, it has priority over the thumbturn. The idea is if there is a bad guy running around, the kids can lock themselves in the classroom. But if the bad guy locks himself in, the authorities can always unlock the door from the outside.
"...somebody had burritos for lunch..." LOL
Another function: Outer knob locked,key retracts deadlatch. Inner knob always unlocked key in inner knob unlocks outer knob. I saw this at a marina where each individual shower/toilet was normally locked, but during large events all restrooms were unlocked. all slip holders were issued the outside key, but only staff had the inside key.
I have seen them all. The communicating lock I have seen on military base dorm/apartment for temporary housing for trainees where two units back to back shared the same bathroom.
As a locksmith just want to make a note here......Some of these terms change depending on the manufacturer and/or supplier, especially when switching between residential and commercial/industrial hardware.... because lock nomenclature is a HUGE PITA leading to sentences like "You need to cut a CB key on an FG blank".
For example Schalge and many other commercial and industrial (grade 1/2 locks) series the "gas station lock" is just called "storeroom" (always open on the inside, always locked on the outside, requiring a key) and what you refer to as "storeroom" is called "institutional" (always locked on both sides requiring a key). The "Office" function (lock can be left unlocked, locked from outside by pushing interior button, until inside is turned or key is used, OR can function as a storeroom, by the previous definition, if the button is pushed and then turned) is often not separated from a residential "Entry" (lever can be locked, always opens from inside, and always must be relocked upon exiting). Also there is a difference between "Classroom" (always open both sides UNLESS locked with a key from the OUTSIDE, at which point it will stay locked from the outside until unlocked with the key from the outside) and "Security Classroom" (which works as you described)
Then to make it even MORE confusing in terms of nomenclature, some exit device trim will ALSO use the terms differently. For example, Sargent describes their "entry" trim for their 88 series exit devices as (always open from both sides via inside crash bar or exterior lever, UNLESS exterior is locked with a key, at which point it will remain locked from the outside unless unlocked with a key) which would be the the standard definition of "Classroom function".... HOWEVER, if you order Corbin Russwin exit trim to replaces a tubular lock with an exit device, the "Classroom function" once again become "Always open on inside via panic bar, open on outside until locked from outside, once unlocked from outside it will remain unlocked" which would be the traditional "classroom function"...
I once lived in a house which had a two mode entry lock set. Knobs though. The house was built a long time ago. The knobs were made by National Lock Company. Normally when you unlock the door from the inside or the outside, door is unlocked. Push the button in and turn it with a coin or some such and the door stays locked even after you pass through. I really liked the security it provided. Unfortunately I was the only one, but once I was big and strong enough, I was able to keep actuating the feature without fear of physical retribution and eventually my will one out.
The name 'communicating lock' seems to be used in a different sense nowadays, though I believe its roots are exactly what you described.
The application for what I've seen called a 'communicating lock' (ANSI F79) is between adjacent hotel rooms that one might rent together as a suite. The one doorway will actually have two separate doors, one for each side, each with a knob facing the room, and a thumbturn facing the other door. The knobs have either a key cylinder or a turnbutton which you can set to disable the thumbturn preventing other side coming in. If you want free passage between rooms, you unlock both doors, with the option of leaving one or both doors wide open.
Communicating locks exist in various hotels where two rooms can be optionally opened to each other, e.g. Parents renting one room with an adjoining room for their children. I've seen them in everything from cheap murdery motels to $500/night hotels.
I believe that I used to have a door that would open and stay locked when turned one direction (down) and open and unlock when turned the other (up).
A big hospital near me uses the institution locks at the E.R. areas doors. In my travels, I've seen almost all of the different lock sets you showed except the "school room" locks. Many have exemptions due to the locations even.
At my work we have outdoor bathrooms. Card swipe to enter. Interior has a thumb turn dead bolt. When thrown the exterior handle is rigid but the interior handle will unlatch the dead bolt.
I've actually seen communicating handles once before, in my college dorm bathroom. The dormitory was a 10 story cylindrical building with the rooms around the circumference, and each pair of rooms sharing an en suite bathroom. (Pretty wild to see on the inside, each dorm had a door, but between each dorm was a smaller door about half as wide with a deadbolt and not handle for plumbing access. Just the endless circle of doors)
The en suite bathrooms had doors on each side that went to each dorm room, with two pushbutton handles on each side. When you pushed the button in, on either side, the door could still be opened by either handle. If you pushed in the button on the inside of the bathroom for privacy, twisting the outside handle would pop it back out and open the door and vice versa.
This perplexed me for so long because I had never seen a handle like it before. It wasn't until I finally caught one of the maintenance guys and asked them if it was broken, and he explained how they originally worked, (Like you described) and that they had to disable ALL of them to comply with fire code.
Never knew what they were called until this video though! I honestly never even thought they existed outside of such a niche application.
This is why I always love watching your videos!
While I've at least seen these, this must be the most concise explanation of these 10 in existence. Understanding the operation makes it easier to mix and match especially for the edge case.
I'll be downloading this vid for reference.
May I make use of those slides for my QRH?
Thanks again!
Sure, feel free to share with others as long as the original credit is in there somewhere since basically all of my stuff is released Creative Commons for non-profit educational use 👍
@@DeviantOllam will do.
I'll email you If I come up with something worth sharing.
I would like more info on deadbolt locks, including commercial, incorporated into handle latch (like the ones with the 'occupied indicator' for restrooms, and residential. For example, double keyed deadbolts for windowed doors. What's allowed, what used to be allowed, and what should be removed, again, both commercial, and residential.
I'm trying to remember. I might have seen the institutional lock at one of the more secure rare book rooms I've been in. I know they buzzed me in, and I suspect that they had to buzz me out (because that's the actual threat direction), but it had to lock up and allow staff access somehow. Could have just been a deadbolt and push plates with no handles, though.
My dad hated thumb turn deadbolts when i was a kid. He said they were less secure. And yeah, sure, but like, not in a meaningful way in our house. We only had deadbolts that lock on both sides. I should ask him why he wanted this.
There was a communicating lock in the downstairs "in-law" suite bathroom of my Grandparents place. Not sure if its still there, the place has not been in my family's possession for more then a decade. I believe it was installed by my Grandpa in the late 60s.
Possible subtitle: “Help, I ordered the wrong door hardware!” 😂 Very helpful, thank you for making this 🙏
We have a "storeroom" type lock on our patio door. The idea seems to be that you shouldn't be able to enter through a window and then carry the TV out the door. The front door has a lever that makes using the key disable the interior thumb latch (but is still unlockable with a key from either side of the door). Not sure if the code is different here in Sweden or if the patio door just doesn't count as an escape path.
Hey I'm not that old. I did live in an older house, though, and it had communicating locks. It was a duplex unit, two bedrooms, 1 bath. Between the bedrooms was the restroom, one entrance on each side. Each door had communicating locks.
Interesting video. I'd not seen a 'communication lock before'. I think as a little kid I understood why it was desirable to have a bathroom door unlock itself if closed with the button pushed in. It just seemed obvious to me.
I have only seen one communicating lock. It was in an old house I used to visit. We used exit locks on our network closets. We had other items in place to prevent under door attacks.
Thanks for the tour of the many lock sets.
At my last job, the bathroom doors had office locks with push/turn buttons on the inside. Lockouts were fairly frequent. It was only one of the things wrong with that place.
very good video about door handles! thanks for explaining😁
I had a house with two kids/guest rooms that shared a bathroom. It was built in 2004. I'm pretty sure both doors were like normal bathroom doors and we had to yell to next room to unlock the door they forgot to unlock when they were through.
I worked in a building where one particular door had a turn-style know with a keyhole that remained rigid even when the door was unlocked. I believe it was originally mechanically locked, but switched to magnetic RFID-access locks. They didn't bother changing the knob hardware. It confused a lot of guests in the building who believed the door was locked because it appeared turnable, but was rigid.
The same floor of the building had a very awkward corridor which only had a handful of feet between magnetically locked doors with nothing else in there. I have no idea what the purpose of that "room" was, but I suspect the original occupants wanted added security and had to arrange doors in series like that to not violate code. I can't remember if those doors had mechanical locks on them or not.
Interesting that I actually encountered the communicating locks in two different houses growing up. Both were the scenario that you described with a bathroom with an entrance from both a bedroom and from a hallway. Never know that's what they were called. Cool video, thanks.
It's so neat to see all the people here in the comments who have experienced communicating doors in older homes
didn't know I needed this until I saw the thumbnail!
When I was in college, my dorm room shared a bathroom with the dorm room next door, and we had communicating locks. My senior year, we had neighbors who were, well, they were freshmen business majors. Without fail, every single weekend, they would get completely hammered, go into the bathroom, lock the door to our room, puke their guts out, then stagger to bed without unlocking the door. And, as you say, there was no way to unlock it from our side, so we had to walk to another nearby building for any bathroom needs.
Eventually, I got tired of the situation. During the day while everyone else was at class, I removed one of the screws from the strike plate and used it to anchor a small aluminum shim that would block just the part of the strike plate where the deadbolt for their lock would normally go. Then, to make sure that they weren't able to fix it, my roommate and I made a policy of keeping our side locked at all times.
This did have the side effect that they weren't able to lock us out when they were using the bathroom, and I do recall that the police eventually got involved when they called and left threatening messages on my answering machine, though there were plenty of other reasons they might have been angry and they didn't specify. But it solved the problem of not having reasonable access to a bathroom in the middle of the night.
(Adding for demographic reasons: this was in Texas in the early nineties, but I believe the buildings dated from the early 20th century.)
Oh that's so hard... yeah, people not respecting shared spaces can cause real friction and I'm glad you were able to come up with some solutions but it's a shame you had to resort to those extra measures.
the 2 that stand out to me are
- the push button that unlocked when the door shut
- the handle that swings even when remaining locked
both were curious to me but after walking away left my thoughts since there wasn't a way to find out what was "wrong with the handle"
you solved 2 cold cases for me 😊
Very interesting! I love Jimy picks! He is testing tensioners that are fun!
On a couple of work bathrooms, they installed a lock that had a key on the outside and on the inside it had both twist lock and push button capability. If you pushed it in, it would pop out when you operated the handle to leave, but if you twisted it, the door would stay locked after you left. After about a month of constant lockouts, they went back to the pushbutton only on the inside. Not sure how or why it happened and I've never seen that kind of function before or since.
In the u.k. it is perfectly normal to have a locking handle on the inside and outside of residential house doors because we have a letter box inset into our front doors,it prevents someone using tools through the letter box to obtain entry vithout the householders permission.
Very well put-together video, A few functions I wasn't aware of. Thanks for the education !