sometimes chess videos make me feel dumb because they're difficult to follow as a relative beginner, this one is clear and easily followed/explained, very well done.
doesnt matter if he did beat him fair and square, the fact that he has be caught cheating multiple times in the past will forever put in doubt any achievements he makes. He has already ruined his career before the match took place.
It does matter. I would say the ethics surrounding the smear job on Hans is just as problematic as his youthful indiscretions. Magnus made errors in that game and he threw a hissy fit. I would argue, right now, Magnus and the chess world are cheating but in a way that is socially more acceptable - it's called cancel culture. Because Hans cheated when he was in his early teens, he will forever be labelled as a cheater and other cheaters will abuse that to their advantage. The sickness here isn't hans. It's our culture.
@@Segkee wasn’t Hans unable to explain the reasoning behind most of his moves after the game? The theory was that somebody in Magnus camp leaked his opener, which is why he prepared an opening he never plays. When Hans was prepared for an opening his opponent never played over the board as deep as he was I think common sense can takeover.
Should’nt feel that way any which way there always going to be better and worse players in chess I give respect to those that give their effort more than the arrogant ones that are boisterous because they’re maybe a bit better just don’t give up trying to get Better
I really appreciate both the clarity and accessibility of your analysis, and your responsible choice to refrain from editorializing about the controversy. Very good video. Looking forward to checking out your other material and likely subscribing :)
Thanks for the feedback appreciate it! Glad to hear you enjoyed and yeah I hope you like the other stuff, I try and get a balance between entertainment and education, that’s what I’m going for anyway and learning lots myself along the way as I’m simply a chess fan first and foremost myself who is also aspiring to improve as so many of us are! Nice name btw lol, one of the more unusual ones I’ve seen haha
@@epicchess2021 Hey right on dude, I'd say you're succeeding at that balance! Already playlisted a few vids and subbed to you right after my previous comment :) And thanks! Haha I just changed from my real name to this goofy one a couplefew months back and I'm absolutely loving the responses 😁 Love popularizing silly neologisms lol. I'm excited for the linguists 200+etc years from now to look back at the early post-internet world and examine how, far more often than in previous eras, pure silliness has become a primary factor influencing language evolution 😆
@@ItsAsparageese ah cool thanks a lot. Haha yeah the amount of new words I've learnt since I started this channel. For example yesterday someone called Magnus a 'sperg' in a comment and went on to then explain that one to me when I asked about it...!
@@epicchess2021 Oof haha, I can hear their casual ableism from here. Isn't growing an audience fun? 😂 Lol. But I'm glad you're attracting such engaged and opinionated chess community members! That can only reflect well on and be good for your channel 😊
@@ItsAsparageese ableism, another one I never heard before. The awkward moment when your Enlgish degree was for nothing...and yeah it's great to engage with so many people, I really enjoy runningthe channel and chatting with everyone, just getting tougher as it grows to keep up withthe comments
Dang. I didn't realize you had a few videos that broke the million-view barrier. Well done. This is a fantastic video and so are the cheating scandal parts 1 and 2 videos too. Here's the main thing I need to make you aware of: the videos you're making right now, in mid-December, 2023, are a huge improvement over the not-even-bad videos you were making just one year back. I'm not disparaging this video in any way, shape, or form-- my comment is meant as a huge compliment. The way that you shoehorn irreverent comedy into your analyses these days is amazing. I remember you referring to agadmator as "the goat" in one of your videos. He's not. He's a clown. His channel is just older than yours. You may not be at the level of Gotham Chess yet, but I'm putting you in the #2 slot on the chess video creator board. Give it time because your subscriber count and views haven't yet caught up to your brilliance. Don't worry about that lag. It happens to every talented video maker. I can promise you that you'll be able to quit your day job by the end of 2025. If not sooner (y'know-- if you want to, anyway). I realize how gay this comment makes me seem but I can promise you that I'm only into women and only telling you the truth right now. Another thing that's better now than 15 months ago is your hair. That's a superficial observation, but looks sadly matter in the TH-camr arena. Keep getting trimmed every 3-4 weeks and you'll have enough money to hire darknet market hit men to eradicate the people who leave you nasty comments in no time. Just remember us little folks after you've paid your house off with TH-cam checks. Edit: also, make sure you shave before recording a video. Again-- this is a non-factor in terms of what matters to me; I am just rooting for you to settle in on Easy St. so you have more time to devote to your TH-cam channels.
Thanks a lot really appreciate it! And yeah agree with all said , I don’t recall ever referring agad as goat and doubt I would because I don’t think that and never have, years ago I stumbled on his channel as a fan and never like it personally, just rattled through moves no real insight. So Danny king was always my favorite over last decade tho he’s a bit slow going at times etc but yeah thanks again, defo making progress yeah the longer I do it
Thanks a lot really appreciate it! And yeah agree with all said , I don’t recall ever referring agad as goat and doubt I would because I don’t think that and never have, years ago I stumbled on his channel as a fan and never like it personally, just rattled through moves no real insight. So Danny king was always my favorite over last decade tho he’s a bit slow going at times etc but yeah thanks again, defo making progress yeah the longer I do it
@@epicchess2021 Indeed you are improving. I usually see your videos on my TH-cam homepage suggestions, so I only just now realized that you're offering memberships. I signed up for the $9 tier because you didn't have a one month free promotion for the $20 membership. I'm going to set a calendar reminder to switch to your highest tier on January 18, but reply to this comment if you don't see a new sign up that day because my job hits me with a billion notifications per day and I want to make sure I'm supporting your channel as much as possible. Keep up the great work.
the difference in temperament between fischer and carlsen could not be more stark - fischer was driven to paranoia by the CIA - carlsen will never be anything other than hyper rational - if he thinks the guy is cheating then the gigantic likelihood is that he is cheating
Many small children have some amount of photographic memory, which they gradually lose. An extremely small number of individuals have very strong photographic memory, called eidetic memory, and keep it longer into adulthood. These people can memorize thousands of chess positions and games. All the top chess players have eidetic memory, same as top basketball players are all extremely tall. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if Niemann memorizes the strongest computer responses to Carlsen's previous games. Niemann then would try to transform every game into a position where Carlsen in the past made a misstep. Niemann more than anyone else understands how much his memory has degraded since he was a child prodigy. Other than that, Niemann strikes me as an ordinary sociopath who can't understand how others think and feel.
Recently coming back to chess after 10+ years of not playing, was never good but i was in a chess club as a kid briefly. First time your video came up on my home page and i love it, definately subscribing and looking forward to more great videos like this one, thank you
I think it's worth noting that Magnus thought about withdrawing from the tournament even before it had started when he heard that Hans was replacing Richard Rapport not long before the event was due to start. Hans is suspected of cheating on several occasions recently (more than he's admitted publicly).
learning plays from ai is cheating? or is the theory wilder; does carlsen think theres an embedded chip in his opponents brain receiving data instructing him on optimal plays? Please enlighten me what is involved in this cheating accusations , im very curious!
@@gummixx6885 Hans' accuracy prior to the tournament has been unprecedented. In Magnus' career he's had 100% accuracy in two matches. Hans has had five recently. Hans' performance has been higher than Magnus, Bobby Fischer, Kasparov ... Etc. All in their prime.
@@Hustwick and how do you think he achieves this? By imitating ai, is that it? He did his homework, doesn't look like cheating to me tbh but I'm all ears
@@gummixx6885 Have you never had a girlfriend? There are apps people can use to send signals to a "embedded" device that turns those signals into vibrations. Their partner would be watching the match (which was livestreamed) and then feeding Magnus's moves into a website or program that would in return display a list of the best moves to make. It would be somewhat like, "bzt bzt bzt bzt . . . bzt bzt bzt . . . . . bzt bzt bzt . . . bzt bzt bzt bzt bzt" with practice you'd be able to "recieve" and understand moves that were transmitted in under the span of a second.
Glad to find this channel I have no idea how to play chess and you broke the logic behind each move what is normally played and really brought great closure to the situation. Thank you
When I heard about this story I wasn't sure I'd be able to understand a game of chess played at the highest level but your video made it really clear, thanks, it was enjoyable to watch and to listen to. Is it a rule that top chess players have to have kind of crazy looking hair?
The “trap” to instigate the check and then pick up the rook with the knight king/rook fork, to be able to have an advantage with a knight and a better pawn structure is so different to how Hans has been playing up to now. This move is so different to w”how he has been playing at the start of the game.
Too much change is weird. I'm not claiming that I'm good at chess analysis. But, That is an idea. I can see Calsen could have checked Opponent's gameplays before going into match, which is why he managed to pick something from Hans in the game, since Calsen have quite good memory. Then, again, they need many match analysis to determine this part, whatever that how much his gameplay changed in the board and previous gameplays. In general sense, you can detect from his growth, I suppose. But, the judgement would be bias. Since Hans had cheated in the past and it will be additional problem for judges, which can't be helped. As for my thinking, Hans plays perfectly, even the lost pieces feel like it is calculated to lost. Magnus play has some missing play in this game. Although, he seems slightly better or worse to other top players in the game I see. This game, he looks like pretty crushing from start to end. But, that is just me. I could probably bias as well, since I have watched Calsen's play online more than Hans'.
@@InnocentC0 I wouldn't call it changing your game play i would call it reacting to the board either way it not cheating. it just what magnus did 15 years ago before he got bored
@@mattysoczynski6650 It's jsut strange. How could someone have the best counter for an opening and after this have the best counter for a variation of that opening? He had the best answers for the default and for the not default. It's just unlikely to happen. It really could just be luck (yeah, it's not skill, since he couldn't even explain his moves after the game) but it's just unlikely to be just luck. Chess is not a game you can count on luck.
@@eatjjca yeah, but there are differences. Magnus repeatdly did that. Magnus could explain everything he had done. Hans explanation was: "by a miracle I had studied that opening the night before the match" and when asked about the moves that didn't follow the default opening he just couldn't explain. Look for the post-game interview.
incredibly brilliant game by black , not surprised they thought he had help. Some of the best moves were very difficult to see and unintuitive, its possible that Magnus had an off day and slightly miscalculated the end game but black was clearly dominating form the mid game onward.
Fischer vs Spassky (1992) round 3 in isolated Ping Pong Room... Fischer did not withdraw. It is a good idea that the tournament moved to an isolated room that Block Radio waves (Signal Proof). It is not good that Carlsen withdrew like that...
Yeah agreed, there were better ways to clear the air on this and work towards resolution rather than just withdrawing. I suspect Carlsen now regrets it but needs to manage his next step very carefully
@@EveryoneFlops They should have EVERY high-level match in a Faraday cage, then there's no question or suspicion, except for the wire coming out of the pants leg and leading to another room...
You provided an objective approach to this game. Well done. You are on your way to having a following akin to Agadmator--certainly something to be proud of and look forward to. I know a lot of additional information has come out since this video, but still no evidentiary proof of OTB cheating has been provided. Regardless of his connection with Dlugy, his admitted past online actions, or any other information, none of it provides proof he did anything nefarious during his games OTB with Magnus or the other players. All that to say your video will age well.
Thanks Kasey appreciate it! Yeah I’m trying to give an overview that moves along quite quickly but also unpack some of the positional ideas along the way. And yeah there is a lot of reasons to be suspicious no doubt but I’m personally yet to be convinced that he is indeed cheating OTB
I think it’s interesting that Magnus is pretty infamous for making odd moves, taking people out of book, playing unprincipled moves, dragging opponents into endgames etc, and a 19 year old kid plays solid, plays great pawn moves much like an engine, and beats him soundly in the endgame. Sounds a lot like Tyson Douglas; cocky super talented monster vs a man who focused on fundamentals, and fought like he had nothing to lose. Good job Niemann.
The justifiable reasons for criticizing Hans is his admitted history of cheating online as well as his awful analysis (compared to his otb rating) and nervousness in interviews. There is a reason he is suspected, and it’s not solely because Magnus implied it.
@@ryanmatthews5771 Well that's my point. There's this insinuation of cheating--and then no suggestions on how that could have happened. It's like that's where the logic stops, and people seem ok with that. Let's say he cheated--okay, so how COULD that have been done? What feasible options exist that are both above the strict security measures taken by those in charge, and feasible to do in real time, such to the point that it beats the best chess player in the world, while under video recording, and the scrutiny of tens of thousands of people? Nothing. That technology doesn't exist. And if it did exist, it wouldn't be in the hands of some poor 19 year old kid. You're suspect of cheating and don't even know what kind of cheating it might be? Is the logic so weak that you can't even imagine what it could be? It's just logically weak.
The online cheating was when he was 12 and it was once, out of thousands of online games. His opening moves matched moves from two previously played games in the databases. The relevant pawn structure, with plausible transpositions into Carlsen v Niemann, had already occurred in a previous well-known Carlsen game against England’s Michael Adams in 2006. Niemann said he asked himself what ideas Carlsen might produce to divert him from his planned Catalan with … Bb4+ and decided to check 5 Nc3, a rare transposition to the Nimzo-Indian. There was also Niemann’s own very recent game against Le Quang Liem at Miami, where 5 g3 (instead of 5 e3 d5 as played) d5 6 a3 could easily transpose into Carlsen v Niemann. And why aren't people looking at the fact that Magnus played so badly, if you watch GM video analysis of the game Magnus made bad moves, entering a bad endgame, with many pawn weaknesses. An ending that most GMs would win. No evidence of cheating here, just evidence of a bad loser!
Niemann himself admitted to cheating when he was an adult as well. And these are just the two times he admitted. Do you really think you cheat once when you are 12 and once when you are 18, but never again in between or afterwards? These two times were just when he got caught. If you are willing to cheat once, then you are willing to cheat again. As easy as that.
@@adamlarue2131 th-cam.com/video/oU6UJz_X8DU/w-d-xo.html I couldn't find the interview, but this is one of those "reaction" videos of the interview. Here he admits that he cheated in multiple games both when he was a kid and an adult.
"The online cheating was when he was 12 and it was once, out of thousands of online games." 2 times caught cheater in online games, how many times did he actually cheat to get his rank is unknown to all of us. If you are willing to cheat in your career than im 100% sure Hans has more cases of this cheating behavior, thats why MANY dont like him and many dont believe him. I find it hilarious that people are pointing out his bad interview and analysis and there are people like you, who are defending without having any doubts that hans is sus.
Moves doesn't feel engine like. Niemann's interview explains that he prepared for catalan transpositions, which is quite reasonable. Magnus was inacurate, and Niemann played good both strategical and tactical. In the end, Magnus it doesn't look so good for Carlsen. He is withdrawing form the world championship, withdrawing from the Grand Tour, and he is making a fuss because he got beaten with black in the endgame ... There no super AI moves in this game ... There is no evidence, and there is no proof that Niemann cheated. It is quite shocking to see how Carlsen and Hikaru are attacking the credibility of this young player, while trying to appear as they didn't do nothing... Quite disgusting and unfair
@@adamgardener8624 yeah, when he was 12 and 16. I think we can forgive him for a mistake made at such a young age, before you have the wisdom to think through the implications.
I was taught by a Middle Eastern Champion when I was in my late teens ..we must have played over 10,000 games over the last 40 years. My level is 2700. I can’t go any higher . I’ve been stuck here for about 10 years. These guys are out of my level . I might beat them one in a hundred games .
Please correct me if I'm wrong. If your level is 2700, for you to beat them once in a hundred game would mean they are +677 = 3377 elo. (source: wikipedia page about Elo)
After watching this game, I've to agree that it is a prepared variation than cheating. These are rare nowadays as most GMs use engine to analyse opening variations. Carlsen played some imprecise moves unlike him normally and walked into a prepared variation. These were common in the 50s-90s when Soviet Bloc dominate the Chess world.
@@jyutzler Obscure in GM data base. Not in Blitz or similar. I've played similar many time with white. Magnus was too complacent with c4 pawn. Even a club level player knows that after trading dark square Bishop, black will try and hold onto c4 pawn and only let go when he is in a better position. Be6 wasa good move though.
Makes no sense, that would mean HAns orepared for games with several bad carlsen moves in advance, why would he plan or waste ressources on that. No sense at all. Sorry trump logic to me, thats the things i suspect a cheater maybe really
@@herzkine You don't play before Engines Chess mate, sorry. You don't have a clue what I was talking about ? You must be Gen Z who has never seen the days Chess games are adjourned. Hans did not prepared Carlsen's bad moves but his optimal moves in obscure line. Your logic is more of Biden Harris built back bad.
I mean if thats the case, why dont they do a bo3 rematch make 100% sure there is noway to cheat, lets see if he holds up, easy way to find out if he cheated.
@@whycomes9562 He might've just perfected the art of playing perfect games vs certain openings. Why is it impossible? Because nobody else has achieved it? If that were the case then nothing would ever be achieved and no record would ever be broken. If there is so much paranoia in chess that one cannot accept the possibility that the 'impossible' might be possible, it means the game has been officially 'beaten' and the design/rules should be changed as Bobby Fisher advocated. This whole debacle is only proving Fisher correct. With a randomized system a computer couldn't figure that out for at least for the next 100 years. I'm sure even Magnus Carlsen wouldn't even object to revolutionizing chess as he could still transfer his old skills to the new game and the game would become fun and interesting for him again.
@@SmartDumbNerdyCool Ok, 15, 20 moves. But over 30, 40? Not buying it. These were beyond opening moves. This continued into the endgame through the middle game. As for changing the rules. Not necessary because unlike computers, humans are not perfect, unless your name is Hans neimann of course. Maybe he should play with other computers.
@@SmartDumbNerdyCool The 100% accuracy is now in question. The method for the computation is faulty. She used multiple chess engines. As long as one engine found it to be a number one move it was counted as the best move. But other engines did not find that to be a good move. Just that one engine.
Are you willing to bet your life on that? His previous 'indiscretions' suggest that doing such a thing wouldn't be the most sensible or logical of actions.
Magnus really needs to clarify his insinuations asap as it’s not fair on Hans. Also Hikaru is nothing short of disgraceful in his jumping on the bandwagon against Hans. I really feel sorry for Hans as there is no tangible evidence yet.
Know this. Their analysis far better than yours. They know what they are talking about. They can tell something is very fishy with hans explaination in the game
Certainly there’s been a few factors that have fuelled things against him but it’s a classic circumstantial witch hunt in my view, thankfully his interview has shifted the narrative on that though
@@epicchess2021 totally agree. He went though all the security protocols as everyone else, and he has had a consistent rise through the FIDE rankings. I think people want the king to stay the king and can't wrap their head around the idea that it's possible their idol has legitimately lost to someone else. Unless concrete evidence exists, this is clearly a witch hunt.
Hans is responding in the way an honest person would respond--I'm not sure if you're familiar with body language analysis, but people who are lying and know it don't have emotional responses to things that would normally bother people. Hans is clearly upset by these accusations and doesn't look like Amber Heard.
White plays the losing move at 7:33. Here is my two cents about how White lost -- with g4 White quickly goes down a pawn -- the g4 pawn. White is already down a pawn, though, so put it this way: 'now down 2 pawns'!! This is the key move, White's g4, played in the endgame, an endgame that could easily have been drawn. And, Magnus played it putting that pawn en pris, yet thinking it wasn't as simple as that. It was, though, as simple as that, he goofed up. Probably he didn't realize that Black's knight on the rim could so easily be make it to the center, from which it is much more useful, defending four of Black's pawns. Black's f7 pawn is defended, Black's e4 and b7 pawn, Black's f5 pawn, they're defended. White simply loses, having invested a pawn of his own in breaking Black up somehow. The g4 pawn was supposed to be disruptive -- if Black repies with ...f5xg4 then White attacks the e4 pawn or *at least*, White gains a pawn *somewhere*. This didn't happen, oops.
Yeah all good points and not Magnus' best game, his first poor move was Rfd1 though, walking into Be6, and then he was always struggling after that! thanks for watching, Daniel
I think the database shows a draw because Magnus retired from the tournament early enough so that the games he played before didn't count. I saw an interview with a member of the tournament organisation on the day it happened and he said that IIRC
@@gummixx6885 The claims of cheating are not because of Hans learning from AI, if that learning was done before the match. The claims of cheating are based upon Hans supposedly getting AI moves signaled to him in some way during the match. To be clear, I’m not saying any cheating has been proved, but just clarifying that the claims or suspicions are based upon moves somehow being signaled to Hans during the match, not because Hans may have used AI to prepare for the match.
@@dorothygale1104 He was referring to Carlsen. Not a terribly good argument IMO, but... it should at least be cleared up. There have been a lot of articles about "What Magnus has learned from AlphaZero", which I think is what poster was referring to.
Excellent video and channel. I have subscribed. Your video could be improved by listing the players' ratings (on the screen) at the time the game was played.
Thanks Henry, glad you enjoyed and cheers for subscribing. Yeah interesting point actually, I always do that when using the chess.com analysis board but it doesn't list it by default on LiChess. I'll have to look at how I get that back in if I'm using LiChess.
Why do they say this is cheating? I mean, "They Say" it's against the odds for such a new player. "They Say" Hans and his mentor have cheated before. Magnus complained Hans was too relaxed? I don't think that's proof of anything. Is Hans a cyborg with a chess engine implanted in his head? Hans was practicing a similar game earlier that day, WHICH MAGNUS PLAYED BEFORE! Both Magnus and Hans use chess engines to prepare for games. Drama... IMHO
looks like Hans just beat him, to be honest. Before I saw this I thought, Hans and Magnus had made just one or two moves and then Magnus saw some strategy far ahead that was clear he was cheating. But after watching this it looks like it was a prolonged game, where you can't really memorize that many moves, and hans just outplayed him on the fly.
As a classified idiot, chess is incredibly difficult for me to follow. Most channels go so deep that I lose the ability to follow what's happening pretty much instantly. This is the first channel I've come across where it's all drawn out so clearly I can actually understand wtf is happening 😂 I appreciate that
OMG - Thank you. I don't play or follow chess but, I do know the rules and moves for pieces. Your explanation was so clear and makes sense to layman like me. Awesome video. I just became a subscriber.
These days some higher rated GM's dont accept defeat from lower rated GM's, you end up cheating if you do upset them. Accusing someone without proven evidence is so unfair
this game was crazy very, thanks for analysis and making simple. i do not think hans cheater, magnus make a big blunder when he leave his queen unprotected and allow hans to counter with the bishop 3:37
Cheers mate - very great explaining. You do make it sound easy when in fact this game was highest level posible :D I think most people who watch this will think Niemann wasnt cheating - but this is soooo next level, and without giving in much thought in toughest places makes cheating sound as only way to do it
Thanks a lot glad you enjoyed! Yeah it’s one thing analysing moves it’s another then trying to make the same good decisions haha. That’s where most of us struggle! Yeah I don’t believe he cheated in this game, nothing really to support that
IMHO the win grants redemption. I've participated in countless tabletop games where cheating is rife, but those players always loose to the best thought process. Creativity is a part of every game and always rewards those that seek to break the mould with more dynamic play and bespoke playbooks that know how to offset other strategies. Without the thrill of personally crafted strategy paying off there's little point in participating.
First of all, this is an excellent video and commentary. Very enjoyable to watch. I rarely ever watch chess videos because they either bore me silly or infuriate me. What a refreshing experience this was. Thank you very much for making it. What doesn't compute with me is the whole supposed cheating thingy flowing around. Can anyone explain that to me? I don't play any digital forms of chess and therefore might miss something.
1:26 is the blunder that lost the game for White. I've been in this position a MILLION times as white. In THIS position I like B-d2. If black wants to swap his DARK square bishop for my knight I gladly take that trade because now I can advance my pawns on the Queen side while supporting them with my bishop AND my Queen. I may even castle queen side and work my King side pieces over to the queenside to concentrate my firepower on one side of the board with the imminent goal of queening a pawn. After I can add a queen, victory is all but assured. Eventually I play H4 to have some pawn structure on the King side and protect my flank. Black played a good game here. I wouldn't say you need a super computer to capitalize on such a blunder.
@@epicchess2021 Thanks for your response. I'll expand a bit more on my thinking behind b-d2 at 1:26. With this opening you're inviting black to run his bishop to where he did in this game. Since this is an aggressive queen side opening I'm willing to give up my pawn to stay ahead on Tempo (development/time). In my mind if I can stay ahead in Tempo, I have more options to attack and I'll get that pawn back eventually because the capturing pawn is vulnerable anyway.
Let's look at the game between Niemann and Carlsen. 13. Rfd1 instead of the correct Bxf6 21 c4 - sacrificing a pawn for very little compensation 28 g4?? 30 a4 instead of Bxc4 Niemann also didn't play the most accurate moves to bring home the point. Carlsen lost because he played badly in this game and not because of any computer-like brilliance from Niemann.
Defo get your pov altho I wouldn’t go so far as to say Carlsen played badly, some inaccuracies yday but I thought it was more just exceptional prep and then technique from hand to grind out the small edge. Thanks for watching, Altruism
@@showlottathings I write them all individually tbf, usually am replying off my mobile for one thing! I like to get back to everyone but it's getting harder to stay on top of them all
He IS cheating. He had 5+ games that showed a 100% correlation to a program. The best players in the world show a 70 percent correlation on a good day. The previous record for such correlation was 98% by someone who was later found guilty of cheating. He also has an extensive record of cheating online. How gullible can people be??
As a chess enthusiast for 15 years, like many others, I found your analysis easy to follow yet comprehensive. Well done especially when it comes to a game that has garnered so much attention over the past few weeks. I appreciate you leaving out comments about what happened as a result of this game. After reading the statement Magnus released regarding his withdrawal from the tournament your analysis makes it easier to understand why he felt that way and believed what he did. Whether or not Hans cheated is less of the point. It relates more to Magnus reservations when Hans was offered a spot to play in the tournament just days before and his concerns about Hans history of cheating before this game was even played. Your clear and concise analysis was a great help! New subscriber and looking forward to future videos from you! Well Done!
@@epicchess2021 That is indeed what is in his statement, but it is not an accusation. The statement isn't about the game. It is about his history of cheating, and cheating in general. Anyhow, there is an official FIDE investigation now.
For me it doesn’t really matter if he cheated on this particular game or not. He’s known to have cheated in the past, so he should NEVER be given the benefit of the doubt. Of course he’s going to SAY that he prepared that variation. Why should we believe him?
Cheating is a threat to the integrity of the foundation of chess. In this information age, online chess cheating is often a concern. Sometimes, it is obvious when you see it. Other times it is a suspicion based on unusual activity that indicates assistance from others or devices causing a bad feeling of unfair play that can cause a loss of concentration resulting in a distraction or less motivation to continue playing the suspect. There needs to be more prevention of chess cheating tactics and strategies of unfair play to protect the rules and integrity of chess.
If Carlson is wrong in his accusation, he will be reprimanded but his career will continue. If Niemann is wrong in saying he didn't chest, his career will be over, forever. No more chances, no more comebacks. Place your bets!
Guys, no one cheated. Hans is a very strong chess player with unorthodox style. Watch his interview after beating Carlsen. Not an ounce of suspicion arises. We are only looking for one with confirmation bias ONLY AFTER el Magnito himself withdrew. Let's give Hans a break.
@@Thomas-xe3ce Fact is, Carlsen played with unusually low accuracy in this game. And Niemann was wrong when he talked about the "miracle" of his preparation of this opening. This game was not won because of Niemann's superhuman moves in the opening, it was lost because of Carlsen's two or three mistakes later on.
This post it hysterical...... Great Reference..... however, in fairness, Montell Griffin was an established Elite Boxer who was undefeated & had just defeated the great James Toney 2x & was seen as a threat to the Great Roy Jones - who rarely lost a Round.... Griffith fought a great fight & was even on the scored when Jones was DQ'd for hitting Griffin while taking a knee...... In the rematch Jones just destroyed Griffin...... I respect everyone's opinion but Hans came out of nowhere & IMO capitalized on Magnus' mistake & won fair & square...... Magnus sore loser routine may seriously hurt his chances in the rematch b/c the aura of invincibility is gone & poor sportsmanship is going to seriously dent Magnus' status w/ the public No shame in losing - not accepting it however is really difficult to overcome - either way Great post!
It's hard to judge from just watching this game, one game. Niemans and Carlsons games has been analyzed and from this it's pretty obvious that Nieman has been cheating. How? Well somehow. Probably some sophisticated technology so small they cant detect it.
Hans may well have cheated in the past, but it is unlikely he did so here, in which case we have a new era in chess. For all his accomplishments, Magnus has never played with the panache we now see from Hans. In the same way that, when Magnus first came onto the scene, Kasparov suddenly seemed a little staid. This is the cycle of life, and Magnus ought show some dignity.
Niemans awesome preparation for that opening threw Carlsen.....but of course if he escaped with a win or a draw nothing would have been insinuated....winning streak over and pride hurt me thinks.
@@jhutfre4855 It is only because Hans cheated a couple of times 'online'.....and of course Carlsens defeat ended his 54 winning streak OTB and took him further away from 2900 ELO.
yeah it is pretty complex, I thought that too when analysing, it really was superbly played, reminded me so much of what Magnus usually does to his opponents
In all honesty that game could have flowed that way regardless. Magnus made a mistake sacrificing to get to the end game. Some days even the top dog can pull a wrong strategy
@@shanewhitehouse3116 Except there is an abundance of circumstantial evidence that suggest he did cheat. Moreover, he's not a newcomer; he's competed professionally and has admitted to cheating multiple times in the past. Most people tend to believe he did cheat, especially in the upper echelon chess world, because of his past and the current circumstantial evidence.
At 9:37 Rc1 isn’t checkmate as the rook can block. The threat is to trade rooks and fork the king and bishop :)
Whoops oh yeah! I’ll pin this one thanks
I was wondering that too..how is this checkmate..:)
yeah thats what i saw too and came to comments! why did he move the King? he could threaten knight with bishop in D2!
Yes it's not a checkmate but black will trade rooks and get a whole new queen for free...checkmate will be better than that 🙂
So where was the cheating ?
sometimes chess videos make me feel dumb because they're difficult to follow as a relative beginner, this one is clear and easily followed/explained, very well done.
Thanks Rhumos, glad you enjoyed and appreciate the feedback!
I second that. Well explained.
Literally just got into chess yesterday, so I agree with this comment haha.
Look up warhammer 40k battle reports, chess is a kids game compared to that.
He explained everything on point, especially about the defensive octopus knight.
Nothing brings me more joy and interest, like drama in a specific niche field.
Yeah and I have to say that modern chess is way more fascinating than in the old days, I love it
What about a non specific niche lol
@@thakurv1 Sounds like an pleonasm, niches are inherently specific.
not Christian behaviour. we should not be a stumblingblock for others salvation
@@maxxsee ?
doesnt matter if he did beat him fair and square, the fact that he has be caught cheating multiple times in the past will forever put in doubt any achievements he makes. He has already ruined his career before the match took place.
It does matter. I would say the ethics surrounding the smear job on Hans is just as problematic as his youthful indiscretions. Magnus made errors in that game and he threw a hissy fit. I would argue, right now, Magnus and the chess world are cheating but in a way that is socially more acceptable - it's called cancel culture. Because Hans cheated when he was in his early teens, he will forever be labelled as a cheater and other cheaters will abuse that to their advantage. The sickness here isn't hans. It's our culture.
@@67377cbbbsb learn to read
Cheaters suck 🎉
@@Segkee wasn’t Hans unable to explain the reasoning behind most of his moves after the game?
The theory was that somebody in Magnus camp leaked his opener, which is why he prepared an opening he never plays.
When Hans was prepared for an opening his opponent never played over the board as deep as he was I think common sense can takeover.
@@Segkee wow cringe fresh off the boat!
It really just sounds like the guy was too proud to accept a loss. :(
I don’t feel so dumb anymore with your explanations as a beginner. You’re very good. I am always so lost with the other channels sadly.
Oh thanks a lot, S M! Yeah trying not to over complicate but still give a bit of depth to it. Cheers for watching
Should’nt feel that way any which way there always going to be better and worse players in chess I give respect to those that give their effort more than the arrogant ones that are boisterous because they’re maybe a bit better just don’t give up trying to get Better
You explain everything so clearly and make the complex very accessible. Good work.
Cheers Jamie appreciate it and thanks for watching
Thanks dog I do what I can.
This will be one of the most analized chess matches of all time.
Yeah defo! Thanks for watching
Well played
Or perhaps ANALized chess matches of all time
I see what you did there
@@tristanfogle1680 Haha - that took me longer than it should've. 🤣🤣
I really appreciate both the clarity and accessibility of your analysis, and your responsible choice to refrain from editorializing about the controversy. Very good video. Looking forward to checking out your other material and likely subscribing :)
Thanks for the feedback appreciate it! Glad to hear you enjoyed and yeah I hope you like the other stuff, I try and get a balance between entertainment and education, that’s what I’m going for anyway and learning lots myself along the way as I’m simply a chess fan first and foremost myself who is also aspiring to improve as so many of us are! Nice name btw lol, one of the more unusual ones I’ve seen haha
@@epicchess2021 Hey right on dude, I'd say you're succeeding at that balance! Already playlisted a few vids and subbed to you right after my previous comment :)
And thanks! Haha I just changed from my real name to this goofy one a couplefew months back and I'm absolutely loving the responses 😁 Love popularizing silly neologisms lol. I'm excited for the linguists 200+etc years from now to look back at the early post-internet world and examine how, far more often than in previous eras, pure silliness has become a primary factor influencing language evolution 😆
@@ItsAsparageese ah cool thanks a lot. Haha yeah the amount of new words I've learnt since I started this channel. For example yesterday someone called Magnus a 'sperg' in a comment and went on to then explain that one to me when I asked about it...!
@@epicchess2021 Oof haha, I can hear their casual ableism from here. Isn't growing an audience fun? 😂 Lol. But I'm glad you're attracting such engaged and opinionated chess community members! That can only reflect well on and be good for your channel 😊
@@ItsAsparageese ableism, another one I never heard before. The awkward moment when your Enlgish degree was for nothing...and yeah it's great to engage with so many people, I really enjoy runningthe channel and chatting with everyone, just getting tougher as it grows to keep up withthe comments
I'm not knowledgeable in any way about Chess but your commentary makes me think I understand it really well :) Really easy to understand explanation
Thanks a lot Genghis! Glad you enjoyed cheers for watching
Dang. I didn't realize you had a few videos that broke the million-view barrier. Well done. This is a fantastic video and so are the cheating scandal parts 1 and 2 videos too. Here's the main thing I need to make you aware of: the videos you're making right now, in mid-December, 2023, are a huge improvement over the not-even-bad videos you were making just one year back. I'm not disparaging this video in any way, shape, or form-- my comment is meant as a huge compliment. The way that you shoehorn irreverent comedy into your analyses these days is amazing. I remember you referring to agadmator as "the goat" in one of your videos. He's not. He's a clown. His channel is just older than yours. You may not be at the level of Gotham Chess yet, but I'm putting you in the #2 slot on the chess video creator board. Give it time because your subscriber count and views haven't yet caught up to your brilliance. Don't worry about that lag. It happens to every talented video maker. I can promise you that you'll be able to quit your day job by the end of 2025. If not sooner (y'know-- if you want to, anyway). I realize how gay this comment makes me seem but I can promise you that I'm only into women and only telling you the truth right now. Another thing that's better now than 15 months ago is your hair. That's a superficial observation, but looks sadly matter in the TH-camr arena. Keep getting trimmed every 3-4 weeks and you'll have enough money to hire darknet market hit men to eradicate the people who leave you nasty comments in no time. Just remember us little folks after you've paid your house off with TH-cam checks. Edit: also, make sure you shave before recording a video. Again-- this is a non-factor in terms of what matters to me; I am just rooting for you to settle in on Easy St. so you have more time to devote to your TH-cam channels.
Thanks a lot really appreciate it! And yeah agree with all said , I don’t recall ever referring agad as goat and doubt I would because I don’t think that and never have, years ago I stumbled on his channel as a fan and never like it personally, just rattled through moves no real insight. So Danny king was always my favorite over last decade tho he’s a bit slow going at times etc but yeah thanks again, defo making progress yeah the longer I do it
Thanks a lot really appreciate it! And yeah agree with all said , I don’t recall ever referring agad as goat and doubt I would because I don’t think that and never have, years ago I stumbled on his channel as a fan and never like it personally, just rattled through moves no real insight. So Danny king was always my favorite over last decade tho he’s a bit slow going at times etc but yeah thanks again, defo making progress yeah the longer I do it
@@epicchess2021 Indeed you are improving. I usually see your videos on my TH-cam homepage suggestions, so I only just now realized that you're offering memberships. I signed up for the $9 tier because you didn't have a one month free promotion for the $20 membership. I'm going to set a calendar reminder to switch to your highest tier on January 18, but reply to this comment if you don't see a new sign up that day because my job hits me with a billion notifications per day and I want to make sure I'm supporting your channel as much as possible. Keep up the great work.
Carlsen lost the game by his unorthodox opening. He gave up too much position.
Thank you for showing the moves in the game and your great analysis. I appreciate it.
No worries thanks for watching, Nick
Very unbiased analysis. Not like many other jumping right to conclusions.
thanks Beenam
Great analysis/video, spot on to the point, makes one appreciate many of the cool subtleties in this game
Thanks a lot glad you enjoyed! Cheers for watching
I know nothing about chess, but I have learned the accused isn't known for his honesty.
Yeah correct! Thanks for watching all the same
Lol Carlsen felt like his opponents feel when they play against him 🤣
@Warrior No one cheated in this particular game
@@KemosabeTBC how can you know that? Or u are being ironic?
@@patogordo1385 Just my feeling. Obviously I don't know
@@KemosabeTBC well, if you're fairly inexperienced who don't really know much about both of their plays before, I'd see why you think that way.
@@KemosabeTBC Really, no one...!?
Can't we just skip this part and fast forward to when Magnus grows a giant beard and emigrate to Iceland?
Go grow some hair. And who the hell wanna move to a tiny island where no one lives anyways.
the difference in temperament between fischer and carlsen could not be more stark - fischer was driven to paranoia by the CIA - carlsen will never be anything other than hyper rational - if he thinks the guy is cheating then the gigantic likelihood is that he is cheating
I saw this same comment that n Hikaru’s video with a million likes 🤣 good work haha. Thanks for watching Joakim
Yeah interesting point norman!
@@epicchess2021 Thanks! I posted here first but then Hikarus video came out and I posted a copy (and it got very popular!🙂).
Many small children have some amount of photographic memory, which they gradually lose. An extremely small number of individuals have very strong photographic memory, called eidetic memory, and keep it longer into adulthood. These people can memorize thousands of chess positions and games. All the top chess players have eidetic memory, same as top basketball players are all extremely tall. Wouldn't surprise me one bit if Niemann memorizes the strongest computer responses to Carlsen's previous games. Niemann then would try to transform every game into a position where Carlsen in the past made a misstep. Niemann more than anyone else understands how much his memory has degraded since he was a child prodigy. Other than that, Niemann strikes me as an ordinary sociopath who can't understand how others think and feel.
Recently coming back to chess after 10+ years of not playing, was never good but i was in a chess club as a kid briefly. First time your video came up on my home page and i love it, definately subscribing and looking forward to more great videos like this one, thank you
Thanks a lot, samuel glad you enjoyed!
welcome back. you missed some juicy stuff. hope ur not trying to quit red camels.....
I think it's worth noting that Magnus thought about withdrawing from the tournament even before it had started when he heard that Hans was replacing Richard Rapport not long before the event was due to start. Hans is suspected of cheating on several occasions recently (more than he's admitted publicly).
learning plays from ai is cheating? or is the theory wilder; does carlsen think theres an embedded chip in his opponents brain receiving data instructing him on optimal plays? Please enlighten me what is involved in this cheating accusations , im very curious!
Cheaters suck
@@gummixx6885 Hans' accuracy prior to the tournament has been unprecedented. In Magnus' career he's had 100% accuracy in two matches. Hans has had five recently. Hans' performance has been higher than Magnus, Bobby Fischer, Kasparov ... Etc. All in their prime.
@@Hustwick and how do you think he achieves this? By imitating ai, is that it? He did his homework, doesn't look like cheating to me tbh but I'm all ears
@@gummixx6885 Have you never had a girlfriend? There are apps people can use to send signals to a "embedded" device that turns those signals into vibrations. Their partner would be watching the match (which was livestreamed) and then feeding Magnus's moves into a website or program that would in return display a list of the best moves to make. It would be somewhat like, "bzt bzt bzt bzt . . . bzt bzt bzt . . . . . bzt bzt bzt . . . bzt bzt bzt bzt bzt" with practice you'd be able to "recieve" and understand moves that were transmitted in under the span of a second.
People who are sorry for something are usually sorry because they got caught
Glad to find this channel I have no idea how to play chess and you broke the logic behind each move what is normally played and really brought great closure to the situation. Thank you
Great to hear and thanks for watching!
Why?? 😂
Chess is so goddamn hard! But damn it’s the best game on earth
@@epicchess2021 yeah, this was great work. it gave me such a sense of clarity i found myself thinking, why would he need to cheat, it's so obvious!
Nieman got caught cheating twice. He brought this suspicion on himself.
Certainly that has fuelled things! Thanks for watching, Adam
Your analysis and commentary is cool. Thanks.
@@adamgardener8624 thanks a lot! Glad you're enjoying
And yet he was here. I would say, the organizers brought this suspicion on their event, blame them, not Niemann
Superb analysis. Clear as glass, comprehensive, and not a word wasted.
Thanks a lot Gregory
When I heard about this story I wasn't sure I'd be able to understand a game of chess played at the highest level but your video made it really clear, thanks, it was enjoyable to watch and to listen to. Is it a rule that top chess players have to have kind of crazy looking hair?
Chess can get really complicated and indepth as the better you become the deeper you look and the farther ahead you plan.
Thanks a lot I’m glad to hear! Yeah and talk awkwardly in interviews after 😆
Jack Harlow looks so pissed in the thumbnail.
The “trap” to instigate the check and then pick up the rook with the knight king/rook fork, to be able to have an advantage with a knight and a better pawn structure is so different to how Hans has been playing up to now. This move is so different to w”how he has been playing at the start of the game.
changing your gameplay is cheating how?
Too much change is weird. I'm not claiming that I'm good at chess analysis. But, That is an idea.
I can see Calsen could have checked Opponent's gameplays before going into match, which is why he managed to pick something from Hans in the game, since Calsen have quite good memory.
Then, again, they need many match analysis to determine this part, whatever that how much his gameplay changed in the board and previous gameplays.
In general sense, you can detect from his growth, I suppose. But, the judgement would be bias. Since Hans had cheated in the past and it will be additional problem for judges, which can't be helped.
As for my thinking, Hans plays perfectly, even the lost pieces feel like it is calculated to lost. Magnus play has some missing play in this game. Although, he seems slightly better or worse to other top players in the game I see. This game, he looks like pretty crushing from start to end.
But, that is just me. I could probably bias as well, since I have watched Calsen's play online more than Hans'.
@@InnocentC0 I wouldn't call it changing your game play i would call it reacting to the board either way it not cheating. it just what magnus did 15 years ago before he got bored
@@mattysoczynski6650 It's jsut strange. How could someone have the best counter for an opening and after this have the best counter for a variation of that opening? He had the best answers for the default and for the not default. It's just unlikely to happen. It really could just be luck (yeah, it's not skill, since he couldn't even explain his moves after the game) but it's just unlikely to be just luck. Chess is not a game you can count on luck.
@@eatjjca yeah, but there are differences. Magnus repeatdly did that. Magnus could explain everything he had done. Hans explanation was: "by a miracle I had studied that opening the night before the match" and when asked about the moves that didn't follow the default opening he just couldn't explain. Look for the post-game interview.
incredibly brilliant game by black , not surprised they thought he had help. Some of the best moves were very difficult to see and unintuitive, its possible that Magnus had an off day and slightly miscalculated the end game but black was clearly dominating form the mid game onward.
It's also possible Magnus is a sore loser?
@@cesco1990 When a known pickpocket bumps into you and your wallet goes missing, it's not really a stretch to think they probably stole it.
@@TreantmonksTemple But then again... how do you know someone's a pickpocket?
@@cesco1990 If they admit to picking pockets in the past, that's a good start
@@cesco1990 Well, if they've been caught pickpocketing before and admit to pickpocketing in the past, I would say that's a pretty strong indicator.
Fischer vs Spassky (1992) round 3 in isolated Ping Pong Room... Fischer did not withdraw. It is a good idea that the tournament moved to an isolated room that Block Radio waves (Signal Proof). It is not good that Carlsen withdrew like that...
Yeah agreed, there were better ways to clear the air on this and work towards resolution rather than just withdrawing. I suspect Carlsen now regrets it but needs to manage his next step very carefully
even if the guy cheated its not a good idea i do not believe he cheated but he did bruise a hugte ego Ben Finegold makes some good points about this
They should have the next match in a Faraday cage. No signals in or out.
@@EveryoneFlops They should have EVERY high-level match in a Faraday cage, then there's no question or suspicion, except for the wire coming out of the pants leg and leading to another room...
You provided an objective approach to this game. Well done. You are on your way to having a following akin to Agadmator--certainly something to be proud of and look forward to.
I know a lot of additional information has come out since this video, but still no evidentiary proof of OTB cheating has been provided. Regardless of his connection with Dlugy, his admitted past online actions, or any other information, none of it provides proof he did anything nefarious during his games OTB with Magnus or the other players.
All that to say your video will age well.
Thanks Kasey appreciate it! Yeah I’m trying to give an overview that moves along quite quickly but also unpack some of the positional ideas along the way. And yeah there is a lot of reasons to be suspicious no doubt but I’m personally yet to be convinced that he is indeed cheating OTB
Great succinct analysis. Thanks for keeping it professional.
Thanks Gort cheers for watching
I think it’s interesting that Magnus is pretty infamous for making odd moves, taking people out of book, playing unprincipled moves, dragging opponents into endgames etc, and a 19 year old kid plays solid, plays great pawn moves much like an engine, and beats him soundly in the endgame. Sounds a lot like Tyson Douglas; cocky super talented monster vs a man who focused on fundamentals, and fought like he had nothing to lose. Good job Niemann.
The justifiable reasons for criticizing Hans is his admitted history of cheating online as well as his awful analysis (compared to his otb rating) and nervousness in interviews.
There is a reason he is suspected, and it’s not solely because Magnus implied it.
@@ryanmatthews5771 but how could he have cheated?
carlsen never has been and will never be "cocky" - he gets people out of book and plays unprincipled moves only in bullet and blitz
@@neepers if I knew that don’t you think everyone else would?
@@ryanmatthews5771 Well that's my point. There's this insinuation of cheating--and then no suggestions on how that could have happened. It's like that's where the logic stops, and people seem ok with that.
Let's say he cheated--okay, so how COULD that have been done? What feasible options exist that are both above the strict security measures taken by those in charge, and feasible to do in real time, such to the point that it beats the best chess player in the world, while under video recording, and the scrutiny of tens of thousands of people?
Nothing. That technology doesn't exist. And if it did exist, it wouldn't be in the hands of some poor 19 year old kid.
You're suspect of cheating and don't even know what kind of cheating it might be? Is the logic so weak that you can't even imagine what it could be?
It's just logically weak.
The online cheating was when he was 12 and it was once, out of thousands of online games. His opening moves matched moves from two previously played games in the databases. The relevant pawn structure, with plausible transpositions into Carlsen v Niemann, had already occurred in a previous well-known Carlsen game against England’s Michael Adams in 2006. Niemann said he asked himself what ideas Carlsen might produce to divert him from his planned Catalan with … Bb4+ and decided to check 5 Nc3, a rare transposition to the Nimzo-Indian. There was also Niemann’s own very recent game against Le Quang Liem at Miami, where 5 g3 (instead of 5 e3 d5 as played) d5 6 a3 could easily transpose into Carlsen v Niemann. And why aren't people looking at the fact that Magnus played so badly, if you watch GM video analysis of the game Magnus made bad moves, entering a bad endgame, with many pawn weaknesses. An ending that most GMs would win. No evidence of cheating here, just evidence of a bad loser!
Niemann himself admitted to cheating when he was an adult as well. And these are just the two times he admitted.
Do you really think you cheat once when you are 12 and once when you are 18, but never again in between or afterwards?
These two times were just when he got caught. If you are willing to cheat once, then you are willing to cheat again. As easy as that.
Couldn't read because your first sentence is inaccurate. Please edit to reflect all instances of cheating.
@@adamlarue2131 th-cam.com/video/oU6UJz_X8DU/w-d-xo.html
I couldn't find the interview, but this is one of those "reaction" videos of the interview. Here he admits that he cheated in multiple games both when he was a kid and an adult.
"The online cheating was when he was 12 and it was once, out of thousands of online games." 2 times caught cheater in online games, how many times did he actually cheat to get his rank is unknown to all of us. If you are willing to cheat in your career than im 100% sure Hans has more cases of this cheating behavior, thats why MANY dont like him and many dont believe him.
I find it hilarious that people are pointing out his bad interview and analysis and there are people like you, who are defending without having any doubts that hans is sus.
(…)once he got caught 🤘🏻
Very nice coverage & commentary on this highly controversial game.😊👍🎉🍷👏
Thanks Martin glad you enjoyed!
Excellent breakdown. Thoroughly enjoyed it. you've gained a subscriber.
Thanks a lot Carlos appreciate it, glad you enjoyed
Moves doesn't feel engine like. Niemann's interview explains that he prepared for catalan transpositions, which is quite reasonable. Magnus was inacurate, and Niemann played good both strategical and tactical. In the end, Magnus it doesn't look so good for Carlsen. He is withdrawing form the world championship, withdrawing from the Grand Tour, and he is making a fuss because he got beaten with black in the endgame ... There no super AI moves in this game ... There is no evidence, and there is no proof that Niemann cheated. It is quite shocking to see how Carlsen and Hikaru are attacking the credibility of this young player, while trying to appear as they didn't do nothing... Quite disgusting and unfair
Maybe Carlsen has lingering covid brain fog
Could not agree more with you! Hans deserves an apology from Carlson and Hikaru. He has been unfairly wronged.
US people is always honest people.
Nieman has been caught cheating 2 times previously.
@@adamgardener8624 yeah, when he was 12 and 16. I think we can forgive him for a mistake made at such a young age, before you have the wisdom to think through the implications.
Chess novice here. I enjoyed that analysis. Subscribed.
Thanks Mark glad you enjoyed and cheers for the feedback and subscribing!
I don't think many people care about a chess game, I mean sure chess is big but it's not a thing the whole Internet talks about and discusses.
I think you’re right there, all the stranger how it took down the internet
I was taught by a Middle Eastern Champion when I was in my late teens ..we must have played over 10,000 games over the last 40 years. My level is 2700. I can’t go any higher . I’ve been stuck here for about 10 years. These guys are out of my level . I might beat them one in a hundred games .
Please correct me if I'm wrong. If your level is 2700, for you to beat them once in a hundred game would mean they are +677 = 3377 elo. (source: wikipedia page about Elo)
After watching this game, I've to agree that it is a prepared variation than cheating. These are rare nowadays as most GMs use engine to analyse opening variations. Carlsen played some imprecise moves unlike him normally and walked into a prepared variation. These were common in the 50s-90s when Soviet Bloc dominate the Chess world.
A prepared variation on such an obscure line? Could just as easily be plausible deniability.
@@jyutzler Obscure in GM data base. Not in Blitz or similar. I've played similar many time with white. Magnus was too complacent with c4 pawn. Even a club level player knows that after trading dark square Bishop, black will try and hold onto c4 pawn and only let go when he is in a better position. Be6 wasa good move though.
Makes no sense, that would mean HAns orepared for games with several bad carlsen moves in advance, why would he plan or waste ressources on that. No sense at all. Sorry trump logic to me, thats the things i suspect a cheater maybe really
@@herzkine You don't play before Engines Chess mate, sorry. You don't have a clue what I was talking about ? You must be Gen Z who has never seen the days Chess games are adjourned. Hans did not prepared Carlsen's bad moves but his optimal moves in obscure line. Your logic is more of Biden Harris built back bad.
I mean if thats the case, why dont they do a bo3 rematch make 100% sure there is noway to cheat, lets see if he holds up, easy way to find out if he cheated.
Looks like Magnus just tries to make obvious exchanges and Hans never obliges
Might have been just cheating
Hans also plays games, over 30 moves and in some cases over 40 moves perfectly with 100% accuracy. Bobby Fisher didnt have one 100% game.
@@whycomes9562 He might've just perfected the art of playing perfect games vs certain openings. Why is it impossible? Because nobody else has achieved it? If that were the case then nothing would ever be achieved and no record would ever be broken. If there is so much paranoia in chess that one cannot accept the possibility that the 'impossible' might be possible, it means the game has been officially 'beaten' and the design/rules should be changed as Bobby Fisher advocated. This whole debacle is only proving Fisher correct. With a randomized system a computer couldn't figure that out for at least for the next 100 years. I'm sure even Magnus Carlsen wouldn't even object to revolutionizing chess as he could still transfer his old skills to the new game and the game would become fun and interesting for him again.
@@SmartDumbNerdyCool Ok, 15, 20 moves. But over 30, 40? Not buying it. These were beyond opening moves. This continued into the endgame through the middle game.
As for changing the rules. Not necessary because unlike computers, humans are not perfect, unless your name is Hans neimann of course. Maybe he should play with other computers.
@@SmartDumbNerdyCool The 100% accuracy is now in question. The method for the computation is faulty. She used multiple chess engines. As long as one engine found it to be a number one move it was counted as the best move. But other engines did not find that to be a good move. Just that one engine.
Anyone who suddenly starts crushing is 100% cheating. Applies to anything. Online shooter games, poker, chess, hell even in sports.
But what about all the other kids then, firouzja, Gukesh, Pragg etc?
I like the explanations on future possibly moves. Keep up the great work!
Thanks a lot!
I analyzed this game too... Hans didn't cheat. He committed a lot of mistakes and inaccuracies. The same with Magnus , he made a losing move .
Are you willing to bet your life on that? His previous 'indiscretions' suggest that doing such a thing wouldn't be the most sensible or logical of actions.
Magnus really needs to clarify his insinuations asap as it’s not fair on Hans. Also Hikaru is nothing short of disgraceful in his jumping on the bandwagon against Hans. I really feel sorry for Hans as there is no tangible evidence yet.
Yeah agreed
I agree also. Disgusting Hikaru.
I agree as well. well said
Okay but if Hans did cheat and Magnus knows it he has no reason to explain.
Know this. Their analysis far better than yours. They know what they are talking about. They can tell something is very fishy with hans explaination in the game
Let this be clear, just because one acts like a jerk, it doesn't make one a fraud.
And let’s make this clear proven by facts, once a cheater always a cheater.
I thought he like cheated years ago that too in online does that even matter
Hans isn’t helped by the fact he couldn’t look more sus if he tried.
I'd look sus too if I was being accused publicly of something...whether I did it or not.
Certainly there’s been a few factors that have fuelled things against him but it’s a classic circumstantial witch hunt in my view, thankfully his interview has shifted the narrative on that though
@@Iliketordles exactly ... that's why we should not accept accusations without evidence
@@epicchess2021 totally agree. He went though all the security protocols as everyone else, and he has had a consistent rise through the FIDE rankings. I think people want the king to stay the king and can't wrap their head around the idea that it's possible their idol has legitimately lost to someone else.
Unless concrete evidence exists, this is clearly a witch hunt.
Hans is responding in the way an honest person would respond--I'm not sure if you're familiar with body language analysis, but people who are lying and know it don't have emotional responses to things that would normally bother people. Hans is clearly upset by these accusations and doesn't look like Amber Heard.
This was beautifully done. Love it!
Yeah brilliant game! Thanks for watching, Edward
White plays the losing move at 7:33. Here is my two cents about how White lost -- with g4 White quickly goes down a pawn -- the g4 pawn. White is already down a pawn, though, so put it this way: 'now down 2 pawns'!! This is the key move, White's g4, played in the endgame, an endgame that could easily have been drawn. And, Magnus played it putting that pawn en pris, yet thinking it wasn't as simple as that. It was, though, as simple as that, he goofed up. Probably he didn't realize that Black's knight on the rim could so easily be make it to the center, from which it is much more useful, defending four of Black's pawns. Black's f7 pawn is defended, Black's e4 and b7 pawn, Black's f5 pawn, they're defended. White simply loses, having invested a pawn of his own in breaking Black up somehow. The g4 pawn was supposed to be disruptive -- if Black repies with ...f5xg4 then White attacks the e4 pawn or *at least*, White gains a pawn *somewhere*. This didn't happen, oops.
Yeah all good points and not Magnus' best game, his first poor move was Rfd1 though, walking into Be6, and then he was always struggling after that! thanks for watching, Daniel
Subscribed! I am just a casual novice, but I enjoy the even-paced and clear summary of each move. Looking forward to more. :)
Thanks a lot! Glad you enjoyed and cheers for watching
I think the database shows a draw because Magnus retired from the tournament early enough so that the games he played before didn't count. I saw an interview with a member of the tournament organisation on the day it happened and he said that IIRC
Makes sense in a way because then you can leave with something intact then- like your reputation or your streak if you happen to have one.
Ah so Magnus got lucky that he resigned early, I would've loved to see him with the L, because he truly got outmatched
@@pedestrian_0 lost some class by calling cheater without any evidence at all. Btw learning plays from AI shouldn't be called cheating , right?
@@gummixx6885 The claims of cheating are not because of Hans learning from AI, if that learning was done before the match. The claims of cheating are based upon Hans supposedly getting AI moves signaled to him in some way during the match. To be clear, I’m not saying any cheating has been proved, but just clarifying that the claims or suspicions are based upon moves somehow being signaled to Hans during the match, not because Hans may have used AI to prepare for the match.
@@dorothygale1104 He was referring to Carlsen. Not a terribly good argument IMO, but... it should at least be cleared up. There have been a lot of articles about "What Magnus has learned from AlphaZero", which I think is what poster was referring to.
Excellent video and channel. I have subscribed. Your video could be improved by listing the players' ratings (on the screen) at the time the game was played.
Thanks Henry, glad you enjoyed and cheers for subscribing. Yeah interesting point actually, I always do that when using the chess.com analysis board but it doesn't list it by default on LiChess. I'll have to look at how I get that back in if I'm using LiChess.
You’re only allowed to play high-level chess if you look like you got slapped in the head with a wet towel.
Why do they say this is cheating? I mean, "They Say" it's against the odds for such a new player. "They Say" Hans and his mentor have cheated before. Magnus complained Hans was too relaxed? I don't think that's proof of anything. Is Hans a cyborg with a chess engine implanted in his head? Hans was practicing a similar game earlier that day, WHICH MAGNUS PLAYED BEFORE! Both Magnus and Hans use chess engines to prepare for games. Drama... IMHO
looks like Hans just beat him, to be honest. Before I saw this I thought, Hans and Magnus had made just one or two moves and then Magnus saw some strategy far ahead that was clear he was cheating. But after watching this it looks like it was a prolonged game, where you can't really memorize that many moves, and hans just outplayed him on the fly.
I agree
Hi. I disagree. niemann is a cheater using an engine.
@@marzipanhunt2870 0 prove
You do realise Hans made 45 perfect moves in a row. Carlsen knew he was up to something suspect
It was clear that Hans was using a computer engine when you plug in the moves. He played at 100% accuracy which is impossible, even for Magnus.
As a classified idiot, chess is incredibly difficult for me to follow. Most channels go so deep that I lose the ability to follow what's happening pretty much instantly.
This is the first channel I've come across where it's all drawn out so clearly I can actually understand wtf is happening 😂 I appreciate that
Oh awesome haha really glad to hear. Thanks for watching
You may be a grandmaster if you started playing at 4 years old with coaching (like most GM's) don't sell yourself short.
Just look at him. Looks like every kid in school that got caught stealing.
Younger people obviously have never heard of Bobby Fischer vs Boris Spasky during the Cold War 😳
Yeah those documentaries are so entertaining ! thanks for watching
OMG - Thank you. I don't play or follow chess but, I do know the rules and moves for pieces. Your explanation was so clear and makes sense to layman like me. Awesome video. I just became a subscriber.
Thanks a lot, PM Raul, great to hear and glad you enjoyed! Thanks for watching and subscribing
These days some higher rated GM's dont accept defeat from lower rated GM's, you end up cheating if you do upset them. Accusing someone without proven evidence is so unfair
You were very easy to understand you make Gotham chess look like an inadequate teacher
Thanks James ! I think Gotham is great though just a different style. He’s especially good for people brand new to chess
“You don’t need proof when you’ve got instincts” - Joe Cabot, _Reservoir Dogs_
What a film!
Amazing result from Hans, that he found all those moves so fast almost impossible!
Chess speaks for itself..
this game was crazy very, thanks for analysis and making simple. i do not think hans cheater, magnus make a big blunder when he leave his queen unprotected and allow hans to counter with the bishop 3:37
Thanks Richi glad you enjoyed and thanks for watching. Yeah be6 was a great move and Magnus was just always struggling after that!
Nothing like this dude telling magnus how to play chess 😂
I was wondering why my internet broke that day.
🤣 mystery solved aye 😁 thanks for watching!
So Magnus lost fair and square and then cried like a little baby? Got it!
😆
Cheers mate - very great explaining. You do make it sound easy when in fact this game was highest level posible :D I think most people who watch this will think Niemann wasnt cheating - but this is soooo next level, and without giving in much thought in toughest places makes cheating sound as only way to do it
Thanks a lot glad you enjoyed! Yeah it’s one thing analysing moves it’s another then trying to make the same good decisions haha. That’s where most of us struggle! Yeah I don’t believe he cheated in this game, nothing really to support that
IMHO the win grants redemption. I've participated in countless tabletop games where cheating is rife, but those players always loose to the best thought process.
Creativity is a part of every game and always rewards those that seek to break the mould with more dynamic play and bespoke playbooks that know how to offset other strategies. Without the thrill of personally crafted strategy paying off there's little point in participating.
i like your perspective
“Hans was empowered by the beads to be unbeadable, but alas they ran out of juice.” - Hans’ Glands
😆
Niemann finally squeezed in a win against Magnus.
He cheated u can see that easy
First of all, this is an excellent video and commentary. Very enjoyable to watch. I rarely ever watch chess videos because they either bore me silly or infuriate me. What a refreshing experience this was. Thank you very much for making it.
What doesn't compute with me is the whole supposed cheating thingy flowing around. Can anyone explain that to me? I don't play any digital forms of chess and therefore might miss something.
There've been talks of anal beads. A device that is connected to a computer which analyzes the game and gives advice via vibrations.
@@suicidism Ahhhh, ok? I guess it takes its very own talents and skills to learn morse code up ones bum.
What a brave new world.
Thanks a lot! Check out my how to cheat video, it can be very subtle
I dont understand anything about chess, but here i am watching chess drama
haha I hope you enjoyed, check out the explained documentary about the cheating scandal if it helps at all!
1:26 is the blunder that lost the game for White. I've been in this position a MILLION times as white. In THIS position I like B-d2. If black wants to swap his DARK square bishop for my knight I gladly take that trade because now I can advance my pawns on the Queen side while supporting them with my bishop AND my Queen. I may even castle queen side and work my King side pieces over to the queenside to concentrate my firepower on one side of the board with the imminent goal of queening a pawn. After I can add a queen, victory is all but assured. Eventually I play H4 to have some pawn structure on the King side and protect my flank. Black played a good game here. I wouldn't say you need a super computer to capitalize on such a blunder.
Oh thanks for sharing really interesting, I don’t play this line so don’t know the details so much. Cheers for watching
@@epicchess2021 Thanks for your response. I'll expand a bit more on my thinking behind b-d2 at 1:26. With this opening you're inviting black to run his bishop to where he did in this game. Since this is an aggressive queen side opening I'm willing to give up my pawn to stay ahead on Tempo (development/time). In my mind if I can stay ahead in Tempo, I have more options to attack and I'll get that pawn back eventually because the capturing pawn is vulnerable anyway.
Let's look at the game between Niemann and Carlsen.
13. Rfd1 instead of the correct Bxf6
21 c4 - sacrificing a pawn for very little compensation
28 g4??
30 a4 instead of Bxc4
Niemann also didn't play the most accurate moves to bring home the point.
Carlsen lost because he played badly in this game and not because of any computer-like brilliance from Niemann.
Defo get your pov altho I wouldn’t go so far as to say Carlsen played badly, some inaccuracies yday but I thought it was more just exceptional prep and then technique from hand to grind out the small edge. Thanks for watching, Altruism
How many hundreds of times have you copied and pasted that same response?
@@showlottathings I write them all individually tbf, usually am replying off my mobile for one thing! I like to get back to everyone but it's getting harder to stay on top of them all
@@epicchess2021 oops, that was meant for @Altruism, who has been spamming the same message all over the place?
@@showlottathings ohhhhh 😁
You know you are best player in chess when the best players accuse you of cheating.
He IS cheating.
He IS cheating. He had 5+ games that showed a 100% correlation to a program. The best players in the world show a 70 percent correlation on a good day. The previous record for such correlation was 98% by someone who was later found guilty of cheating. He also has an extensive record of cheating online. How gullible can people be??
@@blank-jo1xp lmao hes just better tha the guy who resigned after playing 2 moves lmao🤣
he beat Carlson in 2 moves
@@missteslaknutsen4421 how do you know that he cheated OTB?
He made a big mistake , should played that little horse on g3,then that little castle A1,then pick the board up and crown him with it 😤
Magnus reminds me of someone, I'm thinking of oranges and cheetos here.
As a chess enthusiast for 15 years, like many others, I found your analysis easy to follow yet comprehensive. Well done especially when it comes to a game that has garnered so much attention over the past few weeks. I appreciate you leaving out comments about what happened as a result of this game.
After reading the statement Magnus released regarding his withdrawal from the tournament your analysis makes it easier to understand why he felt that way and believed what he did. Whether or not Hans cheated is less of the point. It relates more to Magnus reservations when Hans was offered a spot to play in the tournament just days before and his concerns about Hans history of cheating before this game was even played. Your clear and concise analysis was a great help! New subscriber and looking forward to future videos from you!
Well Done!
Indeed. Magnus is not saying Hans cheated in this game. Magnus is talking about Hans's history and almost impossible accuracy track record.
Thanks Scott appreciate it! Cheers for watching
No he does suspect cheating in this game! Specifically references it in his statement saying he felt hans played and acted weird etc
@@epicchess2021 yes and hans did not appear nervous (or intimidated) which is irrelevant
@@epicchess2021 That is indeed what is in his statement, but it is not an accusation. The statement isn't about the game. It is about his history of cheating, and cheating in general. Anyhow, there is an official FIDE investigation now.
I mean I used to cheat yah, but I swear I didn't cheat this time.
For me it doesn’t really matter if he cheated on this particular game or not. He’s known to have cheated in the past, so he should NEVER be given the benefit of the doubt. Of course he’s going to SAY that he prepared that variation. Why should we believe him?
Yeah fair point! But still the presumption of innocence until proven is important I think
Cheating is a threat to the integrity of the foundation of chess.
In this information age, online chess cheating is often a concern.
Sometimes, it is obvious when you see it. Other times it is a suspicion based on unusual activity that indicates assistance from others or devices causing a bad feeling of unfair play that can cause a loss of concentration resulting in a distraction or less motivation to continue playing the suspect.
There needs to be more prevention of chess cheating tactics and strategies of unfair play to protect the rules and integrity of chess.
Doubt itself is a threat. Fully agree, in this world of physics there must be something to do.
Magnus did not expect to lose to Niemann and he cant accept it.
imagine all the chess kids who now just learned it's Okey to cheat 100 times when aiming for the top
Lol I hope not!
If Carlson is wrong in his accusation, he will be reprimanded but his career will continue. If Niemann is wrong in saying he didn't chest, his career will be over, forever. No more chances, no more comebacks. Place your bets!
White privilege! Oh, wait- they’re both white. Force of habit, sorry.
Sensible level-headed presentation.
Thanks mizofan glad you enjoyed. Cheers for watching
Guys, no one cheated. Hans is a very strong chess player with unorthodox style. Watch his interview after beating Carlsen. Not an ounce of suspicion arises.
We are only looking for one with confirmation bias ONLY AFTER el Magnito himself withdrew.
Let's give Hans a break.
Yeah I also don’t think he cheated and I think the majority of the chess world think that too now. I’d like to hear Magnus speak on this soon
is that unorthodox style come from cheating only a few years ago?
@@epicchess2021 🙂
Not an ounce of suspicion? He literally didn't understand the positions in the post game analysis.
@@Thomas-xe3ce Fact is, Carlsen played with unusually low accuracy in this game. And Niemann was wrong when he talked about the "miracle" of his preparation of this opening. This game was not won because of Niemann's superhuman moves in the opening, it was lost because of Carlsen's two or three mistakes later on.
I have a feeling that the rematch is going to look like Roy Jones Jr extracting revenge on Montell Griffin after his loss.
Did he beat the crap out of him or something? I had to google that one as I don’t know detailed boxing stuff!
It definitely won't be a Roy Jones vs calzaghe rematch, there can only be one winner.
This post it hysterical...... Great Reference..... however, in fairness, Montell Griffin was an established Elite Boxer who was undefeated & had just defeated the great James Toney 2x & was seen as a threat to the Great Roy Jones - who rarely lost a Round.... Griffith fought a great fight & was even on the scored when Jones was DQ'd for hitting Griffin while taking a knee...... In the rematch Jones just destroyed Griffin......
I respect everyone's opinion but Hans came out of nowhere & IMO capitalized on Magnus' mistake & won fair & square......
Magnus sore loser routine may seriously hurt his chances in the rematch b/c the aura of invincibility is gone & poor sportsmanship is going to seriously dent Magnus' status w/ the public
No shame in losing - not accepting it however is really difficult to overcome - either way Great post!
If you get caught cheating you should never be aloud to compete again. Ever.
If this game was presented to someone without any context, it wouldn't look suspicious at all...
It's hard to judge from just watching this game, one game. Niemans and Carlsons games has been analyzed and from this it's pretty obvious that Nieman has been cheating. How? Well somehow. Probably some sophisticated technology so small they cant detect it.
Hans may well have cheated in the past, but it is unlikely he did so here, in which case we have a new era in chess. For all his accomplishments, Magnus has never played with the panache we now see from Hans. In the same way that, when Magnus first came onto the scene, Kasparov suddenly seemed a little staid. This is the cycle of life, and Magnus ought show some dignity.
Hi. It is certain that he cheated in this game using an engine.
Or the known cheater is cheating, cause, you know, cheater.
Niemans awesome preparation for that opening threw Carlsen.....but of course if he escaped with a win or a draw nothing would have been insinuated....winning streak over and pride hurt me thinks.
Yeah you’re right I think !
agree!
Carlsen did lose in the past and never accused nobody till now.
@@jhutfre4855 It is only because Hans cheated a couple of times 'online'.....and of course Carlsens defeat ended his 54 winning streak OTB and took him further away from 2900 ELO.
The evil look on Hans' face screams deception
He certainly has an evil look that’s true!
This is the kind of game that bears looking at several times. I'm on my third viewing now, here.
yeah it is pretty complex, I thought that too when analysing, it really was superbly played, reminded me so much of what Magnus usually does to his opponents
great explanations. much more enjoyable to follow than a lot of pundits.
Thanks glad you enjoyed! Cheers for watching
10:25 Magnus should have taken the knight. He then had at least one of the connected pawns, maybe both.
Certainly could have been one of his better tried but was all so tough really! Thanks for watching
Infinitely better than the Gotham chess video. He didn’t even cover this game!!
Thanks Austen glad you enjoyed! I like Gotham's videos but different style to mine defo
In all honesty that game could have flowed that way regardless. Magnus made a mistake sacrificing to get to the end game. Some days even the top dog can pull a wrong strategy
Yeah I don't see cheating here, I see 3 blunders and a well prepared newcomer who frustrated Magnus comfort zone.
@@shanewhitehouse3116 Except there is an abundance of circumstantial evidence that suggest he did cheat. Moreover, he's not a newcomer; he's competed professionally and has admitted to cheating multiple times in the past. Most people tend to believe he did cheat, especially in the upper echelon chess world, because of his past and the current circumstantial evidence.
Except this guy has a long history of cheating. Dude cheated
Cheat how thow.?
you can only get that much attention for a match of chess, doesn't matter if a player spoke to the Holy Trinity