I tried this recently and it definitely helps with pullout, but it also tends to make runout worse. The anti-seize has small particles of copper that push the the R8 collet around unevenly. If you are curious, you can definitely mic the grease. I suppose if you are having pullout problems, it implies large endmills and perhaps the runout isn't really an issue. Either way, it was a great video John! Thanks.
An interesting video! I have wear points at the bottom of the R8 taper on either side of the slits as well. I do not have any discoloration or wear at the top of the collet though. I attribute this wear to the R8 socket in the spindle not being accurately machined. I see my wear pattern rather well when I put layout dye on the collet. I have tried this with other collets and am pretty well convinced that the deviation is in the spindle socket rather than the collet. I also checked my old mill drill and found much better contact. In my analysis, the taper of the collet should be making contact around the entire surface of the taper in order to properly transfer the clamping force to the tool. As an example, an improperly matched Morse or Jacobs taper does not function very well. Tool slippage occurs because the clamping force is located at the very limited areas adjacent to the bottom of the slits. If I had the guts to do it, I would rework the Tormach spindle socket. Maybe the next time I have to replace a spindle, I'll give it a try (the 770 spindle cartridge is not rebuildable, according to Tormach). What anomic79 said below.
Where did you buy your Belleville washers? I knocked up a diy version of the tts for my G0704 but the washers I ordered ended up be too stiff and not springy at all! Love the channel.... Thanks for all the info over the years!
Hi. Never-Seez is great for engine threads subject to high heat such as for exhaust manifold bolts or spark plugs. It is great stuff and I use it often. Even when it dries out it leaves non-corrosive particles that prevent seizing, plus it allows nice even torquing of the bolts. But it isn't the right lubricant for any moving part on the mill. Thank you for the great videos!
Good vid i also posted on the zone recently. I was having massive pullout issues. When the anti sieze fixed all my problems perfectly!. I did notice you pulled a screw out when removing your pdb.... Do i have something installed wrong? I can remove mine just buy flipping out the bolt on the right that holdes it in posiiton and i can just lift it off of that alignthment shaft. Just making sure i didnt miss a step when installing it.
meant no disrespect,, for the money tormach,mach-3 cant be beat,, i program for a couple fadal 4020's for another group and a hurco i wouldnt trade our new tormach for either,, just done it one way for so long i wrestle with the controller a little,, i really dont have any complaints, truly the only change i think tormach could make is make the tool holder system like the mid-1990's emco pc-50 mills, didnt mean to put it down,, its awsome mill, we bought everything they make,great tool !!
I undedrstand there is a BT30 spindle for the Tormach. With that said, Don't use cheaply made R8 collets. I had problems with using cheap R8 Collets in my Bridgeport mills. I perfer the Royal brand or Lyndex R8 collets in my standard manual machines. I have no idea the quality of the Tormach collets. Recently though I have seen a older Tormach mill retrofitted with a FANUC Oi-MC control. These are really neat fairly affordable controls that are pretty easy to set up and install.
there is another type of never seize meant for stainless it is copper in color. I think Tormach now includes it (barely enough) with the drawbar kit. Do NOT mix the 2 types of never seize.
ive been debating on going to a 1inch collet and then making my own tool holders,, ive made a couple tool holders and as long as there is never more than .0002 total run out of holder its super smooth and have no problem using .050 dia MA_FORD TUFFCUT end mills down in mold cavities running 5000rpm @ 6 ipm for raised text work,, i dont care for the r-8 system or the mach 3,, im a fanuco guy all the way, i dont like how the tools set with the mach controller,, but i think a 1in collet would help!
I tried this recently and it definitely helps with pullout, but it also tends to make runout worse. The anti-seize has small particles of copper that push the the R8 collet around unevenly. If you are curious, you can definitely mic the grease. I suppose if you are having pullout problems, it implies large endmills and perhaps the runout isn't really an issue. Either way, it was a great video John! Thanks.
I had the "clunk" sound when releasing the PDB. I thought it was normal! This procedure worked like a champ.
An interesting video! I have wear points at the bottom of the R8 taper on either side of the slits as well. I do not have any discoloration or wear at the top of the collet though. I attribute this wear to the R8 socket in the spindle not being accurately machined. I see my wear pattern rather well when I put layout dye on the collet. I have tried this with other collets and am pretty well convinced that the deviation is in the spindle socket rather than the collet. I also checked my old mill drill and found much better contact.
In my analysis, the taper of the collet should be making contact around the entire surface of the taper in order to properly transfer the clamping force to the tool. As an example, an improperly matched Morse or Jacobs taper does not function very well. Tool slippage occurs because the clamping force is located at the very limited areas adjacent to the bottom of the slits.
If I had the guts to do it, I would rework the Tormach spindle socket. Maybe the next time I have to replace a spindle, I'll give it a try (the 770 spindle cartridge is not rebuildable, according to Tormach).
What anomic79 said below.
Nice. I am using TTS on a non-Tormach mill and I think this is something I'll have to do soon. Thanks for sharing!
Where did you buy your Belleville washers? I knocked up a diy version of the tts for my G0704 but the washers I ordered ended up be too stiff and not springy at all!
Love the channel.... Thanks for all the info over the years!
Hi. Never-Seez is great for engine threads subject to high heat such as for exhaust manifold bolts or spark plugs. It is great stuff and I use it often. Even when it dries out it leaves non-corrosive particles that prevent seizing, plus it allows nice even torquing of the bolts. But it isn't the right lubricant for any moving part on the mill. Thank you for the great videos!
Hi, is there an alternate link for the Tool Holding document?
Good vid i also posted on the zone recently. I was having massive pullout issues. When the anti sieze fixed all my problems perfectly!.
I did notice you pulled a screw out when removing your pdb.... Do i have something installed wrong? I can remove mine just buy flipping out the bolt on the right that holdes it in posiiton and i can just lift it off of that alignthment shaft. Just making sure i didnt miss a step when installing it.
meant no disrespect,, for the money tormach,mach-3 cant be beat,, i program for a couple fadal 4020's for another group and a hurco i wouldnt trade our new tormach for either,, just done it one way for so long i wrestle with the controller a little,, i really dont have any complaints, truly the only change i think tormach could make is make the tool holder system like the mid-1990's emco pc-50 mills, didnt mean to put it down,, its awsome mill, we bought everything they make,great tool !!
That Tormach document seems to be missing. Do you know if it has been replaced or supplemented with a newer document?
Good info. Where are you at with the CNC Plasma Table?
how would you lap the collet to the spindle without taking out the locating key / pin ?
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Link for document may be hard to find, seems to have been removed:
www.tormach.com/uploads/444/PR_whitepaper_colletslip-pdf.html
I undedrstand there is a BT30 spindle for the Tormach. With that said, Don't use cheaply made R8 collets. I had problems with using cheap R8 Collets in my Bridgeport mills. I perfer the Royal brand or Lyndex R8 collets in my standard manual machines. I have no idea the quality of the Tormach collets. Recently though I have seen a older Tormach mill retrofitted with a FANUC Oi-MC control. These are really neat fairly affordable controls that are pretty easy to set up and install.
there is another type of never seize meant for stainless it is copper in color. I think Tormach now includes it (barely enough) with the drawbar kit. Do NOT mix the 2 types of never seize.
I know this video is old already, but your bellville washers should be greases as well
I will check it out,, thanx !!
The TD31090 document is no longer available to download Could someone send me a copy
+NYC CNC It was the Tormach work-holding document, But not to worry I did find it Thanks
ive been debating on going to a 1inch collet and then making my own tool holders,, ive made a couple tool holders and as long as there is never more than .0002 total run out of holder its super smooth and have no problem using .050 dia MA_FORD TUFFCUT end mills down in mold cavities running 5000rpm @ 6 ipm for raised text work,, i dont care for the r-8 system or the mach 3,, im a fanuco guy all the way, i dont like how the tools set with the mach controller,, but i think a 1in collet would help!
toothpaste the cracks