Are Helix users missing out?! The Tonemaster Pro is supposed to be the new king of the user interface, but is it really? I wanted to compare the old bull to the young calf side by side to see which is easier to build and edit a preset on...
Not for me - I program my sounds using software - the device on the table is rather inconvenient as you then have no foot interaction - and constantly bending down to adjust something on the touchscreen is really not my thing anymore... I'm closed old for that sh.. - so I'll definitely stick with Line6, especially since the sound from the Fender isn't really a quantum leap
No, you are right, Heli UI is way better even i am not a fan of the symbols or lines that show parameters, i prefer nubers, but Fender's UI is not great at all.
My only criticism would be that you have 10 years of experience using the helix interface and a week or so using the fender interface… of course familiarity will make the modifications much quicker on the unit you know better… only time will tell if fender will put the weight of their company behind this device because if they do, we could see some amazing things in the future
I think its more the Helix has 8 years of seasoning and fine tuning. The TMP can easily get to the same level within a few updates (hopefully not 8 years) and could potentially run off with the title. Only time will tell!
Your video was the final push that helped me decide between the TMP and Helix Floor; I went Helix. The user interface on the Fender seemed to be the answer as I'm not fond of deep-dive units. But you're absolutely right-- the Helix is simple & straight forward. The only thing missing is pictures of the units in the signal flow. Your video, and the fact that Line6 has continued to support the Helix (and Pod, etc) for many years. After spending a few weeks with the Helix I'm really glad I passed on the Fender. Thanks for the excellent videos!
Here is a comparison I'd like to see: Setlist Mode and Song Mode with and without Gigview on the TMP vs what Helix has to offer in that space. I'm looking at this comparison through the lens of a live performance on stage, rolling from song to song. No tweaking on stage, no building last minute patches in a panic, just live performance workflow. I don't think any TH-camr has really showcased a deep dive into these features.
Well, that was indeed an eye opener. The Helix UI looks so outdated and we take so much of it for granted, but it's really shocking to get to the newest kid on the block just to find out it still can't do what Helix do in a fast and reliable way. Even the QC, which evidently copied the Helix UI to a great extent, can't be compared to it when it comes to a well thought out real use scenario.
Fender seems to have borrowed greatly from IK Multimedia's Amplitude plugin product. Skeuomorphics is fine when you're doing a straightforward signal path, but starts to break down when you need to do more complex abstract signal routing.
As a Helix user, I couldn't agree more. The UI on the Helix is spartan and simple, but it really gives you all the information you need with very easy access. However, I dont build patches on stage at a live show or while my band mates are waiting during rehearsal. Minor tweaks at rehearsal, but nothing during a live show. My concern with "how swiftly" I do stuff on the Helix vs TMP is less of an issue, but rather how good is the LIVE PERFORMANCE workflow on the unit. Setlist and Song modes with their corresponding Gigviews on the TMP are very interesting to me, and so far, no TH-camrs have really dug into those features.
@@jaredadam1691I was thinking along th3 same lines as you. I'm not so much concerned with a 'what's the absolute fastest time I can build a preset' as this is a more considered process anyway, really building the sound you want rather than racing through with arbitrary values. Performance in use once you have your presets bedded in is what I'd be more interested in.
Not completely sure about this comparison. I know you’ve been a Helix user for years and really know how to navigate. I think it would be much better to get someone who is new to *both* units and try and make a preset. Then we could see the real differences ;) I think I may ask my wife to try this to see how far she gets with each modeler. Enjoyed the video showing the differences! Definitely different workflows for different types of users. 👍🏻
And just for the record - I like both modelers. Just a different workflow experience really. For example, when you changed the multiple parameters on the Helix. I didn’t even know that you could hold down the parameter knob to assign. I always had to do that in the software because I was just unaware. But, when I was working with the TMP, I discovered how to do that on day 1. But, this was definitely a good video.
Thanks Steve, you made me realise (again) that buying the Helix LT over 5 years ago was the smartest thing I ever did, gearwise 😊 Never will a badly responding touchscreen be able to compete with a set of well thought-out, solid knobs.
I have used the Helix for years, and I feel I know it very well. Yet, so very often I learn something new about it watching your videos. It's awesome. It was cool to see such a deep dive on the Tonemaster. I bet it's a great device, but I dunno . . . I know she's getting up there in years, but I still don't feel like jumping ship on the ole Helix girl.
I hope they come out with helix 2 in a smaller size with a few newer features next year.. I’d like a touch screen for naming things and probably some other stuff. The built in Bluetooth on the TMP is pretty useful too. More processing power would be great. They don’t need to reinvent the wheel. I think now they have seen what everyone has done they just need a refresh.
Thank you Steve. I have had my Tone Master Pro for a few days, and have used the Helix for years. I was also disappointed with the limitations of path layout, and I agree with your observations on the touch-screen workflow. However the touchscreen operation is better than the QC, though I haven't really got into the QC desktop editor yet. I have today done some sound comparisons with my Axe-Fx3. I put my guitar into a switcher, and set up TMP presets with amp-head only at default settings for most of the Fender amps, an AC30, and a Plexi. I did the same on the Axe-Fx and copied across the settings. Both went in to my PowerCab, and I also used the PowerCab for speaker emulations so that both units got the same cab. I could switch between them just by hitting the button on the switcher whilst I was playing. There were some very slight differences, but really not much in it.
It is absolutely wild that a decade later Helix is still the king. I don't know what or when Line 6 will go next gen on the Helix but to improve on this unit will be a task. They should bring you in as a consultant when they do!
Helix, a piece of gear from 2015 (!), showed us a GOOD platform is all that matters. You can keep developing it for years. I want to see if Fender does the same, or if they kill this version in two years and come up with a new device.....And yes, a touch screen as long as it is a hybrid design, may be a cool thing, but will never replace actual, tactile buttons and encoders
My concern is Fender is killer with a lifetime purchase Technology isn’t really their game…there’s a history of bailing if it isn’t making $$ right now
Many thanks for pointing out real stuff that a user would need to know. Instead of gushing how great and 'powerful' the tone master is. You stand out amongst other reviewers. Most of what you show can be fixed. Like temp scrolling to show an off screen pedal light up, then scroll back to original view. All assigned switches should light up dimly showing the assigned color unless changed by the user. Unassigned = no light. This is the difference from a mature unit vs a new born. In 5 years all this should be either fixed or abandoned by Fender. (More money in releasing a new model than fixing the old). Helix should update their icon set and make them bigger if possible. But I'll take an ugly UI that works logically than a photogenic mess.
Love this guy and love this video. I can definitely appreciate the comparisons. Sure…in all fairness…he has far more hands on experience with navigating through the Helix than the Fender. Familiarity = speed at times. But all in all…this was a great video to give anyone who’s entertaining that idea of jumping ship…a bit more to think about before doing so. 👍🏼
Thanks for the kind words! I tried to keep it to the day 1 basics on Helix. Surely you have to know and learn those quick things, whereas TMP there really is no learning curve. But Helix with minimal learning is still faster
Also for the TMP you assign a foot switch everyone off them defaults to the red color instead of the efx type coloin the Helix. (Green for delays, orange for odd, blue for phasers types, etc etc ) this facing you time to have to go back and change the color to what you want it to be later
About the bypass/lit status; if you have two blocks assigned to the same switch, one can be off and the other on, and the led will indicate one or the other. Useful if you switch from one drive to another, you just have to remember which one corresponds to the lit led. Setup for this involves assigning both to a switch, then select one block, and bypass using the bypass button. Now the footswitch will swap between one and the other.
They’re both great, I love Line 6 and Helix but too many people on here are showing their age not Helix’s lol ,people get used to certain gear I understand , but I think Fender did a good job with this unit , svelte size , good sound , and I like touch screen,I’d buy it,great video Steve as always 👍
It's preset spillover vs. none with more DSP in a single preset. It really comes down to how you prefer to organize. there is something orderly about cramming everything you want for one song within one preset with scenes on the Helix. The Tone Master's song mode can function much like having scenes. The best part is that its songs are like playlists of presets. So if you have say a go-to edge of breakup sound with a particular lite delay and touch of reverb that you use a lot, you can include that preset in many Songs. If you edit that preset, it's edited for all the songs that use it. This has a lot of live advantages. When you feel the need to tweak that go-to preset that you'll use in mosts songs, you don't have to go to each and every song and edit it and hit save over and over again.
I am pretty happy that I own a Helix. I agree that that realistic graphics would be great, but the functionality of the Helix appears to be a slam dunk winner. Also, I have more confidence in Line 6 support as they have proven that they can and will keep making the unit better.
Thanks Steve. Helix set the standard for UI 10 years ago. There is no excuse for new equipment to not be at least as good as the Helix UI in 2023. I was waiting for the part where you spilled a beer on them and then compared how easy they are to use!
Steve you forgot to show how easy it is on the Helix to switch the location of 2 pedal assignments just by using the cap-touch buttons !! Super fast on the Helix
Great video. So this shows us just how good Helix was from the get-go. The only improvement would be to add text or pictures instead of the existing icons/blocks. But who plays while looking at the Helix screen. The Fender isn't bad - its just not as good (yet) for work flow. I imagine they'll make changes when the yahoos start playing these in the wild.
Respectfully Steve, I think you're missing that on the TMP pedal blocks have THREE states (pedal on, pedal off, and bypassed), and that a pedal could still impart tone even in its "pedal off" state. (the memory man is a good example of this). BTW, not my discovery, Leon Tood uncovered this, to be fair.
Good review thank you. But surely seeing the "lame" icon turning on and off on the helix is the same as seeing the pedal switch light on and off on the TM Pro. It seems more what you're used to than a real drawback?
thank you for this vid. Just as a comment, for a non helix user, the interface is simple horrible and hard to follow. I did not knew what you were doing even do you were explaning it. While in the Fender Tone Master I felt right at home ... This is most likely a non regular user perspective.
Wish more people could see this. I love my Helix LT. Use it everyday... Sometimes I just build presets for fun and use different mic placements/cab-amp combos. Super powerful unit.
I managed to not lose this one! I cover snapshots and seamless preset switching later in the vid. I think its a wash to be fair. Just depends if u want 1 big preset or 8 smaller presets
Would agree with many of the commenters here that the Helix despite its age is still faster and easier to program than the TMP. I have never really liked touch screens for a UI in general. That being said, the TMP does look cool while adjusting parameters on the amp and affect's that look on the screen like the real thing. Fender may sort some of the issues with updates and new features which may prove better than how it works now as far as workflow etc. I have both an HX Stomp and an fractal FM9 so not really looking at replacing them but still interested in new modeler developments.
@15:30 when you created the footswitch assignments, you manually bypassed the blocks, which put them out of sync with the footswitch LEDs. Also, you can touch the virtual footswitches on the pedal to bypass them.
The UI for me is not as big a deal, only because I rather use my computer to make my presets. Very rarely will I use the unit to make major changes and bilutton assignments beside volume or mix. Since I don't like doing the pedal dance, I'm a big fan of the Helix Snapahot mode, does the tonemaster offer something related to that?
You’re proving to me what I thought The TMP is a good home tool for a hobbyist …on desk for easy pretty amp pics and preset changes The Helix is designed for programming for shows and making quick adjustments on the fly…actual floor use I love the solo boost explained I wasn’t aware of that. But it make’s perfect sense! All Jessie heard was you’re not a trusting person lol
Great content. I have been gigging exclusively with a Helix since 2018 and done many many gigs since then. I would like to point out that although I am convinced newer units like a QC, TM or FM9 have better/different amp sounds, the useability and functionality of a modeller is equally important. A far as that AND having an all-in-one package (including the expression pedal and a great desktop editor) is concerned, the Helix is a well designed product and still suits my needs best. But I must confess that conclusion is a bit disappointing, because some of these units really sound great... 😅
The Helix’s UI is extremely solid because they have someone on their team who is an expert in UI design and takes it very seriously. The TMP looks cool, but it’s going to be years before it can be compared to all the capability and numerous models of the Helix.
I get where you're at and I agree the Helix is the standard by which others are measured, but Helix is like 8 years in and we haven't even had one update for ToneMaster yet. I'd love to compare TM now with the first release of Helix just to see if all the Helix things are still all ahead. I always create basic presets then copy it and just add the stuff that would change (different reverb, delay, chorus to rotary etc.)
If Line 6 made a Helix LT in the size of the TMP, and dropped the built-in expression pedal, I’d buy one today. Some of your criticisms could easily be adjusted in future patches, so it’s not exactly a fair comparison (given one device came out a few weeks ago, and the other is 10+ years old). It also feels like an Apple v. Android debate, LOL.
Definitely apple vs android. I look at it 2 ways. Yes, helix has 8 years of seasoning to it, but TMP has also seen what it and what all the others on the market can do already at this point in time... If it came out in 2015 with Helix, we would def have a different conversation!
@@SteveSterlacci Indeed, but still appreciate the effort to put it through its paces! I'm an AG player in the worship space, and I'm very interested in this world of modeling (even though I probably won't use it to its limits, like EG players). Thanks for the content!!!
I think touchscreen devices have to be handheld so you can easily adjust the viewing angle. I have a helix and headrush looper - the touchscreen on the looper looks nice, but my hand is so often in the way when I want to make an adjustment. ! I think the helix UI has been so carefully thought out and tested it is hard to beat. Thanks for the video as always
Tranquila Helix… los que de verdad te conocemos y sabemos lo mucho que te has esforzado por adaptarte a los nuevos tiempos y a darnos todo tu potencial no te vamos a dejar por la nueva/o de la clase y que encima llega a mitad de curso… Fiabilidad, compromiso con el cliente y resultados esos puntos solo se consiguen con tiempo, así que relájate Fender :) " él movimiento se demuestra andando "
i have a helix LT - not even close. i am not going to use a touch screen that much anyway. Helix has better amps, cabs, reverbs and delays by a long shot
The one thing I wish the interface did was allow drag and drop of modules. You can do this in the PC editor but it's not intuitive how to do it on the board. I also wish there was access from the patch interface to Command Center functions rather than that being on a completely separate page. I also feel like the global settings aren't completely intuitive with many parameters a few page scrolls deep. Otherwise, if you know what you're doing, the Helix is extremely flexible. I feel like the comparison is a lot like the difference between a CLI Unix command line and a windowing interface like MacOS. If the next iteration of the Helix floor can integrate the intuitiveness of a touch screen with good skeuomorphism and keep it's current flexibility, it will have the killer board to beat.
Hi Steve Hope you and the family are well. - I’m keeping my Helix’s. Can’t see anything earth shaking enough with the Tonemaster Pro to make a switch or purchase one.
In terms of how well the UI is made, Helix is unbeatable. Almost the same on UX. I think the Tone Master Pro may appeal to the same people atracted to the Headrush Prime because of the looks and the touch screen but i think the Headrush might be better right now because of the voice effects and the capture system. Also, you can see the whole signal path. This video might be enlightening for a lot of people. The Helix LT should look exactly like the Tone Master Pro. Scribble scripts, no expression pedal. 1000 euros. That i would buy for sure
I make full use of the fact you can use the Helix favourites on effects, cabs, etc. It means you can quickly swap in different options to a patch really quickly. I just wish there was a global setting that meant if you update a favourite then any patch using that also gets updated with the new settings
The difference is really glaring. It seems like at Fender someone on top of the food chain decided they wanted to have a slice of the modelling market pie and made the engineers figure it out, so the UI doesn't build on years and years of UI experience but instead tries to emulate the best of the current modelling market. They tried to skip the learning curve and imitate their competitors but by doing so they seem to have failed to understand how Line6 for example came up with the UI of the Helix. Pod 500 family also had a very similar grid like the Fender Tonemaster Pro. But they switched the pretty pictures for something that pros can handle. We need a new helix that is on par with the sound quality of the QC. Honestly the Quad Cortex is the first modelling device that "does it" for me completely. I've played Kemper for years, helix, tried the fm3. Before that pod 500, Pod X3. So I have witnessed the evolution of these products and the QC is the first one I put beside a tube and go "yeah, this is a suitable replacement for gigs and rehearsals" Helix, while being the most convenient one so far, is not yet quite there when it comes to sound. And I'm talking specifically about the amp models. You can use the same IRs in all these devices. But the amp models is where it is at imo. When Line6 releases the next product line and hopefully provides the same power and tone as QC then I'll gladly play line6 again. I imagine the "helix 2" will be just as great of a device as helix is now.
Hardware wise the only thing missing on the Fender for me is the capacitive footswithces. Helix's UI is very well thought out, but they've also had quite a while to improve it and hone it to what it is now. I imagine it wasn't quite as good when it was released. I'd hope some of these things will improve on the Fender as it matures.
I agree 100000% don't get suckered in by the pretty pix. Touchscreen on TMP is laggy and not reliable. Helix is still the king 7 yrs after launch. Helix 2.0 will be even better. Love my LT
Thank you for the very true to life use demo. Agreed on many points One thing I've not seen yet on the new ToneMaster, and the manual doesn't touch on in detail, is MIDI integration How simple is it to set up footswitch controls to send midi ccs/pcs to outboard gear?
Yes, encoders need to stay. The way we can assign it and touch to bring details to see them is so smart. Well done whoever came up with this. Holds true in 2023. I do not think Line6 can skip touch in the future though, market has it. It needs to be done for guitarist so no back/confirm buttons in corners. Imagine dusty or wet setting. TMP has issues with software and all that can be changed by a version so they will eventually get it (or move on :))
Sooo Steve, help me out here 😅 As a long time Helix user, what should I get next to backup/replace my Helix LT for gigging.. Headrush Prime, QC, Tonex, Tonemaster Pro? You seem to have tested them all. I really wouldn’t know what’s the next step for me.😊
I have been really impressed with the sounds I have heard from numerous TH-cam demos on the fender pro think layout of helix is better fender looks quite small don't really care about the pictures on screen maybe line 6 will bring a new helix replacement with better icons one thing no one has hit on does the fender offer preamp models to use with valve amp which is my preferred method with helix
I wish it had a gig view like QC and Helix LT, but i wish Helix floor had that too, scribble strips are useless in daylight, and with the words spread out it takes longer to read everything, which in the middle of a fast is really important
I have a Helix Floor for the 6 years. Never fail and Line 6 keeps adding amps, effect, models, cabs etc during all this years. I still feel Helix is way better.
I put this comment on the other video, but it is a user interface question, so may belong here instead: If you have an expression pedal connected, can you configure the "wah block" to turn on when the expression pedal toe goes past 5% like you can on the Helix? I like that with the Helix because then you don't have to turn the wah on or off with a button, just start using it, and return to heel down to turn it off
@@SteveSterlacci That would definitely be the deal breaker. My expression pedal is a volume pedal on most presets, but on a few it's the wah. I like the TMP, but the more I watch about it, the more I appreciate my HX Stomp board.. like others have said, crazy how good the Helix holds up compared to the others trying to copy it.
Don't know Steve....I think I'll maybe put 2500 euros in "helix 2" instead of 1900 in a fender tmp... I still think that helix workflow is unbeatable even without touch screen...and I just can't imagine what will new line 6 future unit be like
Really interesting video. One observation though, it's going to be impossible for you to unprogram your years of Helix experience. You clearly know your way around it, so things you take as being obvious or simple likey wouldn't be for a less experienced/new user. Not a criticism though, just testament to the level of experience you have with one platform. I'd love to see a video of a new user trying this exact process with TMP, QC, Helix, Kemper, Fractal, etc. I suspect the TMP would fare better. Kudos to Line 6 though, they got a lot right with a lower level of tech, the Helix replacement should have a supreme UI with what they will have available this time around.
Think my TMP is going back tomorrow . The way it gains is not correct can’t stop hearing aliasing on all models, not as good as QC OR helix loads of high end and clarity but when you really listen … Doesnt seem take pedals well not as good as QC .. FUZZ sound rubbish in the front , terrible flexibility, really basic tuner pathways very limited in some ways. I think I’ll give it a year it looks beautiful, and the headphone out is glorious. 4 days now keep telling myself it’s great then just plugged my QC through a power stage and real cab and put it up against the TMP. Can’t keep them both and the QC won today, try again tomorrow..(edit) in addition found my 3.5 aux in is wobbly/glitchy and decided to test the line in …sent line out of ox box into line / mic in and even with the ox at full belt and my 45 watt amp running 2/3 up headphone out nearly all the way up couldn’t get great level on a straight through pathway with no effects. There is no input gain on mic/ line or instrument so you can’t boost or cut input at input stage .. you have to put a literal boost pedal so no cut. Aux in has no volume control , can’t put fx loops on mic / line pathway so no external effects wanted to plug a beat buddy in line level but you can’t put stereo in the front as isolated mono instrument or line… can’t plug anything into the effects return line level as you can’t put fx loops on the mic/ line channel … aux in volume is super loud when I can get it to work and I can’t match the volume in the mixer … it goes on …my first few hours where great with then I updated and since then all I can here is aliasing I thought I had fixed it by reinstalling the firmware but it’s still there in the very upper midi and 10k range. Excitement is slowly turning to … what have I got into here. I contacted fender support they were great I told them I thought I had fixed aliasing by reinstalling but nope. It’s more than a Aiding actually it’s hard to explain in words . Fender told me to get it back to supplier so I think that’s what I’ll do. I don’t know wether to ask them to replace and see if another unit has the same issues or run for the hills and come back when the dust settles. Anyway got most of it off my chest in this here diatribe
I’m with you on the touch screen. I think they are overrated and also think the Helix is super well though out and easy to use. Tonemaster definitely needs to display 2 paths on their screen. I like to see everything.
supplemental touch screen is key. It's nice to have the option, but nothing is better than physical knobs and buttons. Having to solely rely on a touchscreen is not great.
As I don't own a Tonemaster, I'm unaware if it has the same facility as the Helix, whereby you can adjust parameters on the fly using just the footswitches and the expression pedal. This, to me, is an incredibly useful facility and one that can be an absolute lifesaver. Can anyone tell me if the Tonemaster Pro is capable of this?
From what I can make out the mustang gtx100 has the same modelling (actually more amps ) and user interface (with a tablet connected) as the tone master but like 1000 pounds cheaper and an actual cabinet. Therfore use that with your helix and you have everything? My LT still feels new!
2 things I don't like about the Helix... 1) It's f-in gigantic, and I prefer units without the expression pedal. 2) I always accidently touch one of the foot switches while doing something, and it messes other stuff up. Then I have to go back and figure out what I just messed up.
#1 The Tonemaster's GUI is great - but I wouldn't call it an innovation like I've heard. BIAS FX has had that "same" skeuomorphic GUI for almost a decade now #2 I didn't see you press Save? Did you press Save? Ah ok ok, you did... PTSD activated haha Thanks man!
with all my respect the ToneMaster Pro looks like a toy versus Helix. Helix its a 2015 tech and its even better than a "new" pedalboard of 2023. And the price of the TMP its a joke for me.
I think that the Fender is one of the most overpriced modelers on the market. In fact it was so expensive that I thought that maybe Gibson had bought out Fender.
@@SteveSterlacci True, the Fender price has already dropped here in the UK. I guess my bitching on the gear page has added to the mountain of voices calling out it's high price. 😂
I might be in the minority here, but I actually think the graphics on the Fender TMP are super corny. The Helix and QC look cleaner, more minimalistic and abstract. And underrated feature of the oft-maligned Helix UI aesthetic is that it conveys the most useful information more clearly from a distance. I can always see where the parameters are set, but I'd have a hard time seeing the settings on the little Deluxe Reverb knobs on the Fender when I'm standing over the unit at a gig.
My dream scenario would be helix making a new unit similar in size to the QC, with a combination of the best feature sets from all the modern modeling options as well as Helix’s tried and trues. The UI is better for Helix by leaps and bounds
So in a nutshell, you've been using the helix for years, are not very familiar with the interface of the Fender, But when you have an issue with the foot switch it's Not user error. I know plenty of people who own a helix, that when they first got there unit were having all types of problems adjusting to the interface. On actually brought it back. If they were to use the same standard as you, they would be crapping all over the helix when it wasn't really the problem. There are fair criticisms, but then there is just petty.
What specifically are you even talking about here? I didn't blame the pedal for anything unless I am forgetting something. The only issue that I ran into was the bypass thing where I said its because I bypassed on the unit, but the lights still werent in sync. What user errors did I blame on the unit?
@@SteveSterlacciI found an EU retailer selling a brand new QC right now for about $1500. Good enough deal you think? I live in the EU,and my last modeler was the OG HD500.
I think for people who haven’t experienced the helix, they won’t know. I mean I think it’s a good unit but has a lot of growth to go. In the end, I care about my interaction on stage with my pedal-not the graphics. Look at the Axe FX, zero graphics but you have everything you need. Line 6 realized that was a factor to not highlight as a guitar player. Really, in the end who sees the graphics? When you’re playing and in the moment…no don’t care. No one can see them on stage, so in the end…it’s not that important.
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Are Helix users missing out?! The Tonemaster Pro is supposed to be the new king of the user interface, but is it really? I wanted to compare the old bull to the young calf side by side to see which is easier to build and edit a preset on...
Not for me - I program my sounds using software - the device on the table is rather inconvenient as you then have no foot interaction - and constantly bending down to adjust something on the touchscreen is really not my thing anymore... I'm closed old for that sh.. - so I'll definitely stick with Line6, especially since the sound from the Fender isn't really a quantum leap
No, you are right, Heli UI is way better even i am not a fan of the symbols or lines that show parameters, i prefer nubers, but Fender's UI is not great at all.
It's not
Can't kick my Helix to the curb. It's mind blowing how intuitive the HX system is still after 10 years.
My only criticism would be that you have 10 years of experience using the helix interface and a week or so using the fender interface… of course familiarity will make the modifications much quicker on the unit you know better… only time will tell if fender will put the weight of their company behind this device because if they do, we could see some amazing things in the future
I think its more the Helix has 8 years of seasoning and fine tuning. The TMP can easily get to the same level within a few updates (hopefully not 8 years) and could potentially run off with the title. Only time will tell!
@@SteveSterlacci how intuitive is double tap to bypass? Cmon this is a biased comparison
@@algorithm007ify huh?
How about no keyboard for preset names?
I think it goes without saying on that one...
Your video was the final push that helped me decide between the TMP and Helix Floor; I went Helix. The user interface on the Fender seemed to be the answer as I'm not fond of deep-dive units. But you're absolutely right-- the Helix is simple & straight forward. The only thing missing is pictures of the units in the signal flow. Your video, and the fact that Line6 has continued to support the Helix (and Pod, etc) for many years. After spending a few weeks with the Helix I'm really glad I passed on the Fender. Thanks for the excellent videos!
Here is a comparison I'd like to see: Setlist Mode and Song Mode with and without Gigview on the TMP vs what Helix has to offer in that space. I'm looking at this comparison through the lens of a live performance on stage, rolling from song to song. No tweaking on stage, no building last minute patches in a panic, just live performance workflow. I don't think any TH-camr has really showcased a deep dive into these features.
Even though I don't have the Tone Master, l learned a few new things about the Helix by watching this video 😊. Thanks again, Steve
Gale 👍
Well, that was indeed an eye opener. The Helix UI looks so outdated and we take so much of it for granted, but it's really shocking to get to the newest kid on the block just to find out it still can't do what Helix do in a fast and reliable way.
Even the QC, which evidently copied the Helix UI to a great extent, can't be compared to it when it comes to a well thought out real use scenario.
Fender seems to have borrowed greatly from IK Multimedia's Amplitude plugin product. Skeuomorphics is fine when you're doing a straightforward signal path, but starts to break down when you need to do more complex abstract signal routing.
As a Helix user, I couldn't agree more. The UI on the Helix is spartan and simple, but it really gives you all the information you need with very easy access. However, I dont build patches on stage at a live show or while my band mates are waiting during rehearsal. Minor tweaks at rehearsal, but nothing during a live show. My concern with "how swiftly" I do stuff on the Helix vs TMP is less of an issue, but rather how good is the LIVE PERFORMANCE workflow on the unit. Setlist and Song modes with their corresponding Gigviews on the TMP are very interesting to me, and so far, no TH-camrs have really dug into those features.
@@jaredadam1691I was thinking along th3 same lines as you. I'm not so much concerned with a 'what's the absolute fastest time I can build a preset' as this is a more considered process anyway, really building the sound you want rather than racing through with arbitrary values. Performance in use once you have your presets bedded in is what I'd be more interested in.
Not completely sure about this comparison. I know you’ve been a Helix user for years and really know how to navigate. I think it would be much better to get someone who is new to *both* units and try and make a preset. Then we could see the real differences ;) I think I may ask my wife to try this to see how far she gets with each modeler. Enjoyed the video showing the differences! Definitely different workflows for different types of users. 👍🏻
And just for the record - I like both modelers. Just a different workflow experience really. For example, when you changed the multiple parameters on the Helix. I didn’t even know that you could hold down the parameter knob to assign. I always had to do that in the software because I was just unaware. But, when I was working with the TMP, I discovered how to do that on day 1. But, this was definitely a good video.
Wow, not even close. Super clear. Thanks Steve.
Years on Helix vs Less than 2 weeks on TMP - Learning curve is quicker on TMP but still missing some things here and there
Of course and fair point to bring up. I feel like I did very basics with Helix and was fair in doing this comp...
Thanks Steve, you made me realise (again) that buying the Helix LT over 5 years ago was the smartest thing I ever did, gearwise 😊 Never will a badly responding touchscreen be able to compete with a set of well thought-out, solid knobs.
I have used the Helix for years, and I feel I know it very well. Yet, so very often I learn something new about it watching your videos. It's awesome. It was cool to see such a deep dive on the Tonemaster. I bet it's a great device, but I dunno . . . I know she's getting up there in years, but I still don't feel like jumping ship on the ole Helix girl.
Bottom line is if you like what you're getting out of it, no need to change just to do it.
I hope they come out with helix 2 in a smaller size with a few newer features next year.. I’d like a touch screen for naming things and probably some other stuff. The built in Bluetooth on the TMP is pretty useful too. More processing power would be great. They don’t need to reinvent the wheel. I think now they have seen what everyone has done they just need a refresh.
Thank you Steve. I have had my Tone Master Pro for a few days, and have used the Helix for years. I was also disappointed with the limitations of path layout, and I agree with your observations on the touch-screen workflow. However the touchscreen operation is better than the QC, though I haven't really got into the QC desktop editor yet. I have today done some sound comparisons with my Axe-Fx3. I put my guitar into a switcher, and set up TMP presets with amp-head only at default settings for most of the Fender amps, an AC30, and a Plexi. I did the same on the Axe-Fx and copied across the settings. Both went in to my PowerCab, and I also used the PowerCab for speaker emulations so that both units got the same cab. I could switch between them just by hitting the button on the switcher whilst I was playing. There were some very slight differences, but really not much in it.
I feel like Fender took a cue from Headrush with their UI and the specific paths and stuff.
It is absolutely wild that a decade later Helix is still the king. I don't know what or when Line 6 will go next gen on the Helix but to improve on this unit will be a task. They should bring you in as a consultant when they do!
Thanks! I would love to be on the team for that. I unfortunately have no tie to them at all lol
You would think that they would have seen your content by now! lol @@SteveSterlacci
Fender now taking notes for the next firmware update... once again, Helix is an old unit and many many years later is still relevant unit.
Helix, a piece of gear from 2015 (!), showed us a GOOD platform is all that matters. You can keep developing it for years. I want to see if Fender does the same, or if they kill this version in two years and come up with a new device.....And yes, a touch screen as long as it is a hybrid design, may be a cool thing, but will never replace actual, tactile buttons and encoders
My concern is Fender is killer with a lifetime purchase
Technology isn’t really their game…there’s a history of bailing if it isn’t making $$ right now
I had the Mustang Floor ages ago and I didn't care for it. Sounds were good enough, but workflow wasn't.
Great comparison, Steve. Very helpful, as always
Many thanks for pointing out real stuff that a user would need to know. Instead of gushing how great and 'powerful' the tone master is. You stand out amongst other reviewers. Most of what you show can be fixed. Like temp scrolling to show an off screen pedal light up, then scroll back to original view. All assigned switches should light up dimly showing the assigned color unless changed by the user. Unassigned = no light. This is the difference from a mature unit vs a new born. In 5 years all this should be either fixed or abandoned by Fender. (More money in releasing a new model than fixing the old). Helix should update their icon set and make them bigger if possible. But I'll take an ugly UI that works logically than a photogenic mess.
Love this guy and love this video.
I can definitely appreciate the comparisons.
Sure…in all fairness…he has far more hands on experience with navigating through the Helix than the Fender. Familiarity = speed at times.
But all in all…this was a great video to give anyone who’s entertaining that idea of jumping ship…a bit more to think about before doing so. 👍🏼
Thanks for the kind words! I tried to keep it to the day 1 basics on Helix. Surely you have to know and learn those quick things, whereas TMP there really is no learning curve. But Helix with minimal learning is still faster
@@SteveSterlacci couldn’t agree more !
Also for the TMP you assign a foot switch everyone off them defaults to the red color instead of the efx type coloin the Helix. (Green for delays, orange for odd, blue for phasers types, etc etc ) this facing you time to have to go back and change the color to what you want it to be later
About the bypass/lit status; if you have two blocks assigned to the same switch, one can be off and the other on, and the led will indicate one or the other. Useful if you switch from one drive to another, you just have to remember which one corresponds to the lit led. Setup for this involves assigning both to a switch, then select one block, and bypass using the bypass button. Now the footswitch will swap between one and the other.
They’re both great, I love Line 6 and Helix but too many people on here are showing their age not Helix’s lol ,people get used to certain gear I understand , but I think Fender did a good job with this unit , svelte size , good sound , and I like touch screen,I’d buy it,great video Steve as always 👍
It's preset spillover vs. none with more DSP in a single preset. It really comes down to how you prefer to organize. there is something orderly about cramming everything you want for one song within one preset with scenes on the Helix. The Tone Master's song mode can function much like having scenes. The best part is that its songs are like playlists of presets. So if you have say a go-to edge of breakup sound with a particular lite delay and touch of reverb that you use a lot, you can include that preset in many Songs. If you edit that preset, it's edited for all the songs that use it. This has a lot of live advantages. When you feel the need to tweak that go-to preset that you'll use in mosts songs, you don't have to go to each and every song and edit it and hit save over and over again.
Great hands on content for us to see. Thanks! I own a helix floor so this was very interesting.
I have a feeling we'll be seeing a Helix replacement from Line6 soon. TMP will get there this is only the initial release.
Yeah, I feel like every product's first release has hurdles to overcome.
I am pretty happy that I own a Helix. I agree that that realistic graphics would be great, but the functionality of the Helix appears to be a slam dunk winner. Also, I have more confidence in Line 6 support as they have proven that they can and will keep making the unit better.
Thanks Steve. Helix set the standard for UI 10 years ago. There is no excuse for new equipment to not be at least as good as the Helix UI in 2023. I was waiting for the part where you spilled a beer on them and then compared how easy they are to use!
Steve you forgot to show how easy it is on the Helix to switch the location of 2 pedal assignments just by using the cap-touch buttons !! Super fast on the Helix
Great video. So this shows us just how good Helix was from the get-go. The only improvement would be to add text or pictures instead of the existing icons/blocks. But who plays while looking at the Helix screen. The Fender isn't bad - its just not as good (yet) for work flow. I imagine they'll make changes when the yahoos start playing these in the wild.
Respectfully Steve, I think you're missing that on the TMP pedal blocks have THREE states (pedal on, pedal off, and bypassed), and that a pedal could still impart tone even in its "pedal off" state. (the memory man is a good example of this).
BTW, not my discovery, Leon Tood uncovered this, to be fair.
Intersting! Definitely worth knowing. Idk if that fits into the user interface, but can consider it in my next comparison. Thanks!
Good review thank you. But surely seeing the "lame" icon turning on and off on the helix is the same as seeing the pedal switch light on and off on the TM Pro. It seems more what you're used to than a real drawback?
thank you for this vid. Just as a comment, for a non helix user, the interface is simple horrible and hard to follow. I did not knew what you were doing even do you were explaning it. While in the Fender Tone Master I felt right at home ... This is most likely a non regular user perspective.
Your opinion is perfect for this then. That's a great perspective for people looking into either unit. You can definitely use the TMP without a manual
Wish more people could see this. I love my Helix LT. Use it everyday... Sometimes I just build presets for fun and use different mic placements/cab-amp combos. Super powerful unit.
You set up your stuff same as me haha... I always "save as" on the amp.
The Helix floor sounds superb and has it all...period
Great video again Steve! Any plans on a Fender FR speaker review? 😊
Hey Steve, hit save 😅😅😅 Also, snapshots are the MOST POWERFUL function of the Helix.
I managed to not lose this one! I cover snapshots and seamless preset switching later in the vid. I think its a wash to be fair. Just depends if u want 1 big preset or 8 smaller presets
You don't need snapshots on the Fender unit. It has seamless switching. Helix needed snapshots in order to do smooth switching.
TM PRO TIP: When you're editing the parameters for any block, you can swipe left/right through your signal path.
Yes thats a great feature to have if you're editing block by block!
Would agree with many of the commenters here that the Helix despite its age is still faster and easier to program than the TMP. I have never really liked touch screens for a UI in general. That being said, the TMP does look cool while adjusting parameters on the amp and affect's that look on the screen like the real thing. Fender may sort some of the issues with updates and new features which may prove better than how it works now as far as workflow etc. I have both an HX Stomp and an fractal FM9 so not really looking at replacing them but still interested in new modeler developments.
@15:30 when you created the footswitch assignments, you manually bypassed the blocks, which put them out of sync with the footswitch LEDs.
Also, you can touch the virtual footswitches on the pedal to bypass them.
The UI for me is not as big a deal, only because I rather use my computer to make my presets. Very rarely will I use the unit to make major changes and bilutton assignments beside volume or mix. Since I don't like doing the pedal dance, I'm a big fan of the Helix Snapahot mode, does the tonemaster offer something related to that?
Excellent video Steve!!
You’re proving to me what I thought
The TMP is a good home tool for a hobbyist …on desk for easy pretty amp pics and preset changes
The Helix is designed for programming for shows and making quick adjustments on the fly…actual floor use
I love the solo boost explained I wasn’t aware of that. But it make’s perfect sense!
All Jessie heard was you’re not a trusting person lol
Great content. I have been gigging exclusively with a Helix since 2018 and done many many gigs since then. I would like to point out that although I am convinced newer units like a QC, TM or FM9 have better/different amp sounds, the useability and functionality of a modeller is equally important. A far as that AND having an all-in-one package (including the expression pedal and a great desktop editor) is concerned, the Helix is a well designed product and still suits my needs best. But I must confess that conclusion is a bit disappointing, because some of these units really sound great... 😅
This was really awesome! Thanks for making this video.
Would you do a follow up where you compare tones?
I would love to hear your thoughts on the Fender FRFRs 😊
The Helix’s UI is extremely solid because they have someone on their team who is an expert in UI design and takes it very seriously. The TMP looks cool, but it’s going to be years before it can be compared to all the capability and numerous models of the Helix.
I get where you're at and I agree the Helix is the standard by which others are measured, but Helix is like 8 years in and we haven't even had one update for ToneMaster yet. I'd love to compare TM now with the first release of Helix just to see if all the Helix things are still all ahead.
I always create basic presets then copy it and just add the stuff that would change (different reverb, delay, chorus to rotary etc.)
If Line 6 made a Helix LT in the size of the TMP, and dropped the built-in expression pedal, I’d buy one today. Some of your criticisms could easily be adjusted in future patches, so it’s not exactly a fair comparison (given one device came out a few weeks ago, and the other is 10+ years old). It also feels like an Apple v. Android debate, LOL.
Definitely apple vs android. I look at it 2 ways. Yes, helix has 8 years of seasoning to it, but TMP has also seen what it and what all the others on the market can do already at this point in time... If it came out in 2015 with Helix, we would def have a different conversation!
@@SteveSterlacci Indeed, but still appreciate the effort to put it through its paces! I'm an AG player in the worship space, and I'm very interested in this world of modeling (even though I probably won't use it to its limits, like EG players). Thanks for the content!!!
I think touchscreen devices have to be handheld so you can easily adjust the viewing angle. I have a helix and headrush looper - the touchscreen on the looper looks nice, but my hand is so often in the way when I want to make an adjustment. ! I think the helix UI has been so carefully thought out and tested it is hard to beat. Thanks for the video as always
Tranquila Helix… los que de verdad te conocemos y sabemos lo mucho que te has esforzado por adaptarte a los nuevos tiempos y a darnos todo tu potencial no te vamos a dejar por la nueva/o de la clase y que encima llega a mitad de curso…
Fiabilidad, compromiso con el cliente y resultados esos puntos solo se consiguen con tiempo, así que relájate Fender :) " él movimiento se demuestra andando "
Super informative Steve.. great job on the comparison…Hey Audrey.
i have a helix LT - not even close. i am not going to use a touch screen that much anyway. Helix has better amps, cabs, reverbs and delays by a long shot
The one thing I wish the interface did was allow drag and drop of modules. You can do this in the PC editor but it's not intuitive how to do it on the board. I also wish there was access from the patch interface to Command Center functions rather than that being on a completely separate page. I also feel like the global settings aren't completely intuitive with many parameters a few page scrolls deep. Otherwise, if you know what you're doing, the Helix is extremely flexible. I feel like the comparison is a lot like the difference between a CLI Unix command line and a windowing interface like MacOS.
If the next iteration of the Helix floor can integrate the intuitiveness of a touch screen with good skeuomorphism and keep it's current flexibility, it will have the killer board to beat.
We need a HeadRush Prime vs the Fender Tone Master Pro shoot out. The HR Core would be a closer match but believe you have a Prime.
Hi Steve Hope you and the family are well. - I’m keeping my Helix’s. Can’t see anything earth shaking enough with the Tonemaster Pro to make a switch or purchase one.
In terms of how well the UI is made, Helix is unbeatable. Almost the same on UX.
I think the Tone Master Pro may appeal to the same people atracted to the Headrush Prime because of the looks and the touch screen but i think the Headrush might be better right now because of the voice effects and the capture system. Also, you can see the whole signal path.
This video might be enlightening for a lot of people.
The Helix LT should look exactly like the Tone Master Pro. Scribble scripts, no expression pedal. 1000 euros. That i would buy for sure
The Helix UI is very well designed. Did you determine if you can save Effect settings as "Favorites" on the TMP for instant recall?
Great question. I see we can favorite presets, but I do not know about specific blocks and have not read anything about it yet
I make full use of the fact you can use the Helix favourites on effects, cabs, etc. It means you can quickly swap in different options to a patch really quickly. I just wish there was a global setting that meant if you update a favourite then any patch using that also gets updated with the new settings
The difference is really glaring. It seems like at Fender someone on top of the food chain decided they wanted to have a slice of the modelling market pie and made the engineers figure it out, so the UI doesn't build on years and years of UI experience but instead tries to emulate the best of the current modelling market. They tried to skip the learning curve and imitate their competitors but by doing so they seem to have failed to understand how Line6 for example came up with the UI of the Helix.
Pod 500 family also had a very similar grid like the Fender Tonemaster Pro. But they switched the pretty pictures for something that pros can handle.
We need a new helix that is on par with the sound quality of the QC. Honestly the Quad Cortex is the first modelling device that "does it" for me completely. I've played Kemper for years, helix, tried the fm3. Before that pod 500, Pod X3. So I have witnessed the evolution of these products and the QC is the first one I put beside a tube and go "yeah, this is a suitable replacement for gigs and rehearsals"
Helix, while being the most convenient one so far, is not yet quite there when it comes to sound. And I'm talking specifically about the amp models. You can use the same IRs in all these devices. But the amp models is where it is at imo. When Line6 releases the next product line and hopefully provides the same power and tone as QC then I'll gladly play line6 again. I imagine the "helix 2" will be just as great of a device as helix is now.
Hardware wise the only thing missing on the Fender for me is the capacitive footswithces. Helix's UI is very well thought out, but they've also had quite a while to improve it and hone it to what it is now. I imagine it wasn't quite as good when it was released. I'd hope some of these things will improve on the Fender as it matures.
Agree
So I’ll revisit the TMP for sure after a few updates
I would be happy if helix desktop editor looked like IK’s amplitube. Having Tonex in my Helix loop is going to be hard to beat
I agree 100000% don't get suckered in by the pretty pix. Touchscreen on TMP is laggy and not reliable. Helix is still the king 7 yrs after launch. Helix 2.0 will be even better. Love my LT
Thank you for the very true to life use demo. Agreed on many points
One thing I've not seen yet on the new ToneMaster, and the manual doesn't touch on in detail, is MIDI integration
How simple is it to set up footswitch controls to send midi ccs/pcs to outboard gear?
Yes, encoders need to stay. The way we can assign it and touch to bring details to see them is so smart. Well done whoever came up with this. Holds true in 2023.
I do not think Line6 can skip touch in the future though, market has it. It needs to be done for guitarist so no back/confirm buttons in corners. Imagine dusty or wet setting.
TMP has issues with software and all that can be changed by a version so they will eventually get it (or move on :))
Sooo Steve, help me out here 😅 As a long time Helix user, what should I get next to backup/replace my Helix LT for gigging.. Headrush Prime, QC, Tonex, Tonemaster Pro? You seem to have tested them all. I really wouldn’t know what’s the next step for me.😊
I have been really impressed with the sounds I have heard from numerous TH-cam demos on the fender pro think layout of helix is better fender looks quite small don't really care about the pictures on screen maybe line 6 will bring a new helix replacement with better icons one thing no one has hit on does the fender offer preamp models to use with valve amp which is my preferred method with helix
Great demo, thanks Steve.
I wish it had a gig view like QC and Helix LT, but i wish Helix floor had that too, scribble strips are useless in daylight, and with the words spread out it takes longer to read everything, which in the middle of a fast is really important
I prefer the Helix icons; I've always thought that pictures of the pedals looked a little cheesy. Just my opinion, of course.
Totally valid opinion! It does now that you mention it
Thanks for this Steve!
Why did you put adhesive tape on the helix knob?, excellent video by the way
I have a Helix Floor for the 6 years. Never fail and Line 6 keeps adding amps, effect, models, cabs etc during all this years. I still feel Helix is way better.
I put this comment on the other video, but it is a user interface question, so may belong here instead:
If you have an expression pedal connected, can you configure the "wah block" to turn on when the expression pedal toe goes past 5% like you can on the Helix? I like that with the Helix because then you don't have to turn the wah on or off with a button, just start using it, and return to heel down to turn it off
I would think that it is able to, but have not confirmed it first hand...
@@SteveSterlacci That would definitely be the deal breaker. My expression pedal is a volume pedal on most presets, but on a few it's the wah. I like the TMP, but the more I watch about it, the more I appreciate my HX Stomp board.. like others have said, crazy how good the Helix holds up compared to the others trying to copy it.
@@SteveSterlacci And thanks for the videos!
Don't know Steve....I think I'll maybe put 2500 euros in "helix 2" instead of 1900 in a fender tmp... I still think that helix workflow is unbeatable even without touch screen...and I just can't imagine what will new line 6 future unit be like
"touch screens are overrated". Nail on the head.
Really interesting video. One observation though, it's going to be impossible for you to unprogram your years of Helix experience. You clearly know your way around it, so things you take as being obvious or simple likey wouldn't be for a less experienced/new user. Not a criticism though, just testament to the level of experience you have with one platform. I'd love to see a video of a new user trying this exact process with TMP, QC, Helix, Kemper, Fractal, etc. I suspect the TMP would fare better. Kudos to Line 6 though, they got a lot right with a lower level of tech, the Helix replacement should have a supreme UI with what they will have available this time around.
I do acknowledge this and tried to stick to "day 1" basics for the helix stuff. Looking forward to seeing what the future holds!
Think my TMP is going back tomorrow . The way it gains is not correct can’t stop hearing aliasing on all models, not as good as QC OR helix loads of high end and clarity but when you really listen …
Doesnt seem take pedals well not as good as QC .. FUZZ sound rubbish in the front , terrible flexibility, really basic tuner
pathways very limited in some ways. I think I’ll give it a year it looks beautiful, and the headphone out is glorious.
4 days now keep telling myself it’s great then just plugged my QC through a power stage and real cab and put it up against the TMP. Can’t keep them both and the QC won today, try again tomorrow..(edit) in addition found my 3.5 aux in is wobbly/glitchy and decided to test the line in …sent line out of ox box into line / mic in and even with the ox at full belt and my 45 watt amp running 2/3 up headphone out nearly all the way up couldn’t get great level on a straight through pathway with no effects.
There is no input gain on mic/ line or instrument so you can’t boost or cut input at input stage .. you have to put a literal boost pedal so no cut.
Aux in has no volume control , can’t put fx loops on mic / line pathway so no external effects wanted to plug a beat buddy in line level but you can’t put stereo in the front as isolated mono instrument or line… can’t plug anything into the effects return line level as you can’t put fx loops on the mic/ line channel … aux in volume is super loud when I can get it to work and I can’t match the volume in the mixer … it goes on …my first few hours where great with then I updated and since then all I can here is aliasing I thought I had fixed it by reinstalling the firmware but it’s still there in the very upper midi and 10k range.
Excitement is slowly turning to … what have I got into here.
I contacted fender support they were great I told them I thought I had fixed aliasing by reinstalling but nope. It’s more than a
Aiding actually it’s hard to explain in words .
Fender told me to get it back to supplier so I think that’s what I’ll do. I don’t know wether to ask them to replace and see if another unit has the same issues or run for the hills and come back when the dust settles. Anyway got most of it off my chest in this here diatribe
Good and helpful video. Thanks:)
Glad it was helpful!
22:39 Fender, if you’re reading this, give us an option to make it so the path scrolls to the block that’s being enabled or disabled.
I’m with you on the touch screen. I think they are overrated and also think the Helix is super well though out and easy to use. Tonemaster definitely needs to display 2 paths on their screen. I like to see everything.
supplemental touch screen is key. It's nice to have the option, but nothing is better than physical knobs and buttons. Having to solely rely on a touchscreen is not great.
As I don't own a Tonemaster, I'm unaware if it has the same facility as the Helix, whereby you can adjust parameters on the fly using just the footswitches and the expression pedal. This, to me, is an incredibly useful facility and one that can be an absolute lifesaver. Can anyone tell me if the Tonemaster Pro is capable of this?
can you lock the touch screen somehow to avoid any unwanted setting changes if touching the device (by me or someone else)?
The Tonemaster is like a toy next to Helix. In my not so humble opinion.
😂the helix is hella outdated
@@serafinrazo4097 ok pal 🍻
Thank you for that first hand demonstration of why the Helix is *still* far ahead of the competition.
set the standard and still is... I am curious to see where TMP winds up in 8 years
From what I can make out the mustang gtx100 has the same modelling (actually more amps ) and user interface (with a tablet connected) as the tone master but like 1000 pounds cheaper and an actual cabinet. Therfore use that with your helix and you have everything? My LT still feels new!
2 things I don't like about the Helix... 1) It's f-in gigantic, and I prefer units without the expression pedal. 2) I always accidently touch one of the foot switches while doing something, and it messes other stuff up. Then I have to go back and figure out what I just messed up.
Flavor of the month loses out to well-established veteran of the market. I'm not surprised 😎
#1 The Tonemaster's GUI is great - but I wouldn't call it an innovation like I've heard. BIAS FX has had that "same" skeuomorphic GUI for almost a decade now #2 I didn't see you press Save? Did you press Save? Ah ok ok, you did... PTSD activated haha Thanks man!
with all my respect the ToneMaster Pro looks like a toy versus Helix. Helix its a 2015 tech and its even better than a "new" pedalboard of 2023. And the price of the TMP its a joke for me.
Helix is more expensive in Australia
How about the Tonemaster pro vs the Headrush Prime?
They absolutely could have used your input when developing this. Could have been a much more attractive unit
I think that the Fender is one of the most overpriced modelers on the market. In fact it was so expensive that I thought that maybe Gibson had bought out Fender.
I think the helix and the Tonemaster is the same price
😅🤣
Helix has way more to offer in its 8th year of life. I think if fender had a more "caught up" unit, it'd be a different conversation
@@SteveSterlacci True, the Fender price has already dropped here in the UK. I guess my bitching on the gear page has added to the mountain of voices calling out it's high price. 😂
I got a used fender for $1200 instead of $1700. Considering that it only came out a month ago, I think it is a steal~!
I might be in the minority here, but I actually think the graphics on the Fender TMP are super corny. The Helix and QC look cleaner, more minimalistic and abstract.
And underrated feature of the oft-maligned Helix UI aesthetic is that it conveys the most useful information more clearly from a distance. I can always see where the parameters are set, but I'd have a hard time seeing the settings on the little Deluxe Reverb knobs on the Fender when I'm standing over the unit at a gig.
The TMP is for a noodler not trying to offend anyone. For desktop noodling it’s awesome.
Fender Tonemaster Pro is a new device, Helix is very old. I'm more interested in the sound because the Helix has a weak sound for me.
My dream scenario would be helix making a new unit similar in size to the QC, with a combination of the best feature sets from all the modern modeling options as well as Helix’s tried and trues. The UI is better for Helix by leaps and bounds
maybe sound battle wit hthe seme units? :) cheers
So in a nutshell, you've been using the helix for years, are not very familiar with the interface of the Fender, But when you have an issue with the foot switch it's Not user error. I know plenty of people who own a helix, that when they first got there unit were having all types of problems adjusting to the interface. On actually brought it back. If they were to use the same standard as you, they would be crapping all over the helix when it wasn't really the problem. There are fair criticisms, but then there is just petty.
What specifically are you even talking about here? I didn't blame the pedal for anything unless I am forgetting something. The only issue that I ran into was the bypass thing where I said its because I bypassed on the unit, but the lights still werent in sync. What user errors did I blame on the unit?
I'm dilemma, should i get helix or qc hmmmm
Tough call right now! Both are great
For tone = QC, for conveniency = helix
@@SteveSterlacciI found an EU retailer selling a brand new QC right now for about $1500. Good enough deal you think? I live in the EU,and my last modeler was the OG HD500.
@@AYAiYaiYaiYai you'll be happy with the upgrade I think!
TMP or Kemper would be better
I think for people who haven’t experienced the helix, they won’t know. I mean I think it’s a good unit but has a lot of growth to go. In the end, I care about my interaction on stage with my pedal-not the graphics. Look at the Axe FX, zero graphics but you have everything you need. Line 6 realized that was a factor to not highlight as a guitar player. Really, in the end who sees the graphics? When you’re playing and in the moment…no don’t care. No one can see them on stage, so in the end…it’s not that important.