I agree with you about it's visuals, as i am am just re painting my own stuff in my own house, but at least 3 coats is not to bad, but not as good as oil based glossed.
Oil based paint won't be around in a few years time, when they reduced the VOC content in it a few years back it started going yellow in (some cases) a matter of days, there will be another round of reductions coming and then I reckon oil based products will be phased out after a few years and will only be available as specialist primers.
The crown stuff is crap. with water based you get what you pay for the cheap crappy crown stuff isn't in the same league as your tikkurilla,isomat and Benjamin moore...but being in new builds the material used will always be a low standard to maximise profit.
When I first used water based gloss, I thought I had lost my touch because I couldn't get the brush marks to disappear. After 3 coats on a job I gave up.
I agree with what you say about the MDF...recently used the fastflow gloss and undercoat over my doors at home which were a pale grey/beige acrylic eggshell.. they were oil yrs before but wet n dry then zinsser them up.. this time I prepped them up washed down and left till next day..over course of 4 days 2 undercoat and 4 glosses.. ridiculous.. never use it again.. lucky didnt have to adjust my door hinges amount of layers..!!! I've used the satin on jobs which isnt anywhere as bad... crown were useless when I complained.. get in touch where I got it from.. wasnt going to take it out on brewers as they've been good to me over the years.. think I'll take brewers advice and try little greene. . But so many companies have poor covering with white trim paints .. Great vid mate..
I don't like water base ,I put it on and it's too much like hard work worrying if it covers or not .just put oil on and you can always get a good finish ,technology will improve it in time ,
I cant see how it makes any difference to the environment, think of all the water you use washing brushes and how it goes back round again being recycled. on a plus note,It does smell nice !
Firm I worked for tried it when voc regs 1st changed, lasted about 4weeks with various lads on different sites having nothing but problems with it, it was winter and it was flaking off, absolutely shite, tbh lots of crown stuff is, but somehow it's all we get on new builds!!!!
Water based paints especially Dulux satin finish i find looks amazing on doors and skirting boards It's not as shiny But it will definitely last longer meaning it will look whiter than oil based paints as oil based will go yellow very soon. Last thing you want is doing all the house and skirting boards and staircase and banisters all white again costing you a packet
I’ve used this stuff a few times in the past although eventually it’ll leave a decent enough finish it’s not cost effective and time consuming to use, it’s not for me but each to their own. I’ll stick to the tried and tested old school methods . Cheers for the video. Good job .
We Have oil gloss on 3 years now its all turnded yellow... I am going to re do advice is use water base if you dont want it to yellow again... any advice..
This Vid has appeared in my feed the very night before I'm about to paint the trim on an office using Crown paint (Spooky!). Fortunately for me the client has bought solvent/oil based Crown trade undercoat and gloss. So hopefully, it'll produce a good finish.
Tbh water based undercoat and gloss is good but it’s all about the paint. I’d stay well away from shit like Trade, Leyland Macpherson or Crown. Stick with Dulux. It’s a bit pricey but you can’t go wrong in terms of finished quality
Hi Mate, I'm a Decorator with 30plus years experience and cannot stand this crazy fast flow acrylic base u/c and gloss bullshit is pointless and its just about being environmental friendly. I got out of new build because the prices are hard enough to make it worth it,then they throw acrylic in the works and hinders your hard earned graft trying to get a great finish and get paid fair. Keep oil base and satinwood or gloss anyway but saying this they use this crap armstead products on site jobs too. For me redec jobs is what I'm mainly doing nowadays simply because the money isn't a lot in it on site work, plus not so much pressure to hit your target in new build. Hence why I prefer day work now also. Thats my personal preferences in this trade.Even the money is getting worse on price jobs. Maybe I am wrong now. Keep up your posts they are honest and I like you revealing how shite this industry is becoming and don't start me on site foremen pen pushers bollox lol who thrive on snagging the tradesman and holding this £100 per plot too is a joke. 🤣
MDF sucks, period! As soon as water hits the bottom like in a laundry flood it bulks up and there goes the door frame all bulged out. They are building housed with shit. Oil is the only way to go really on crap like that or full strength acrylic if already pre undercoated and not scuffed. But who are we to say?
Thanks for sharing. I have used the Leyland acrylic undercoat and gloss. It is also water based and requires multiple coats to achieve anything like a decent finish. Of course, as you say, it will never be as good a finish as oil based, but it does dry very quickly and the clean up is easy. Personally, I always prime mdf - even the good stuff - with BIN or Blockade before applying undercoat. One thing is for sure, I'd never use water based on woodwork outdoors. I've done so in the past, and it just isn't capable of withstanding the elements.
Used the Dulux undercover and gloss over previously painted oil based paint. Different technique and initially patience tester, but managed to get excellent finish. Hopefully brilliant white will stay brilliant white!
The only water based stuff is use is when they want it brilliant white. Old white yellows too much these days. If there's any tint in the paint I go oil. Johno's stuff is the best I found so far. But as you say, coat of acrylic then the undercoat then the top....or acrylic then two satin on top. Basically all new paint is shit.
crown undercoat and primer is a good product. Crown contract gloss is good too if you know how to use it. Coarse both products are not the ones used in this video 🤪😄
Thank you for sharing your hard-earned experience and know-how with us!! Excellent content and commentary on the video, including your replies in text. Truly nice work. Many thanks.
It’s not a true water based product, if you read the tin it contains a percentage of oil based product. On bare MDF coat it first with emulsion... then undercoat then top coat...the satin version is the worsed one in my opinion. Johnstone is the best... but you can only do what is in the spec
Give it 1 u/c and 2 gloss it comes up a lot better than you'd think Wallington that's what I do with the crown and deluxe water based gear,like you say it's never going to look like a oil gloss finish but it's the way the house builders are going with the water based stuff nowadays
Hey candleman gerry here frm belfast ive tryed the fastflow like you i agree hard to beat the oilbased but fastflow in colours for front doors which you do alot black blue red great stuff & quick drying give it ago.
I've recently bought a water based Johnstons gloss, which states that it's suitable for indoor and outdoor use!. I always find it difficult to believe that a water based gloss could be any good, when used in an outdoor environment where it's exposed to rain, snow and frost!. Am I right, or is water based gloss OK to use outdoors!?
it's a 4 coat system on new wood or that MDF shit, two undercoats and two top coats (always need two top coasts regardless) but it flows so much better than oil it really makes the jobs easier and faster. Probably more suitable to domestic re-decs and not house bashing.... hence crown has a paint for new builds.. basically you're using the wrong product.
@RAVEN AK47 i only use oil for outsides and rentals, everyone else is WB, and i've been uing the Fastflow stuff for 3 years and i love it, it will turn yellow, but that's not the reason i switched. A good stand down or a bit of PX or bulles eye if needed and it's alright, I don't mind if it yellows eventually or scuff a bit as it keeps us in work ;)
@RAVEN AK47 haha.. lucky you, you're about 15 years ahead of me.. but there's no way i'' be able to retire, and i'll probably be cribbed before then anyway. i'm already falling apart it's ridiculous
@@MephProduction Try the Johnstones Aqua gloss and Aqua Undercoat, absolutely streets ahead application and finish. Spot floall in all water based helps.
Yeah it rubbush m8 cant beat oil superdec good gear for outsides no opacity water based no quality these days on new builds cheap n nasty not lke the old days also trdesman especially painters the good ones not paid what they worth never liked hiuse bashing hard work messy sites etc better iff domestic iff you can do things properly no respect iff gaffers on site they jyst want make money not bothered about you etc slags
As a DIY'er I think water based Gloss is brilliant. So easy to use. Main advantage is you can wash bushes in water ( or cling film for next day use). And no stirring. Admittedly the finish isn't Glossy but can improve it using a synthetic brush ( Hamilton) and a little spray of water ( may be a miniscule amount of detergent ) on the surface before applying.
I wouldn't work on jobs that specify crap mdf frames etc, I like johnstones acrylic gloss, as good as any!
I agree with you about it's visuals, as i am am just re painting my own stuff in my own house, but at least 3 coats is not to bad, but not as good as oil based glossed.
Oil based paint won't be around in a few years time, when they reduced the VOC content in it a few years back it started going yellow in (some cases) a matter of days, there will be another round of reductions coming and then I reckon oil based products will be phased out after a few years and will only be available as specialist primers.
I agree the upside to water based it does stay white longer, oil based yellows in no time
Can't beat oil based anyone who says different is talking out there arse.
The crown stuff is crap. with water based you get what you pay for the cheap crappy crown stuff isn't in the same league as your tikkurilla,isomat and Benjamin moore...but being in new builds the material used will always be a low standard to maximise profit.
When I first used water based gloss, I thought I had lost my touch because I couldn't get the brush marks to disappear. After 3 coats on a job I gave up.
@RAVEN AK47 Thanks for the advice.
Johnstones aqua guard best water based undercoat and gloss
As in one of your previous videos the Dulux acrylic undercoat/primer filled all the imperfections and is the best out there
Water based is rubbish.
No lasting power on busy areas ..
Need to wash area down periodically .
Also you never get away with one hit
To be honest I've never used the crown water based but I use the Johnstones water based quite alot and find it OK
@@jackwardley3626 Agreed the Johnsones aqua gloss undercoat is the best mainstream brand by some distance. Dulux take note
..
Johnstone's aqua gloss and satin best of the lot even better when sprayed.
2 coats of the primer undercoat. Then 2 top coats and it's fine. Not exactly ideal for house bashing though.
I use undercoat with every waterbased paint even satin and eggshell. Johnstones do the best I would say.
Water based not as good but will not yellow, also will not burn so quick in a fire !!!!!!
Keep the reviews coming 👍🏻
I agree with what you say about the MDF...recently used the fastflow gloss and undercoat over my doors at home which were a pale grey/beige acrylic eggshell.. they were oil yrs before but wet n dry then zinsser them up.. this time I prepped them up washed down and left till next day..over course of 4 days 2 undercoat and 4 glosses.. ridiculous.. never use it again.. lucky didnt have to adjust my door hinges amount of layers..!!!
I've used the satin on jobs which isnt anywhere as bad... crown were useless when I complained.. get in touch where I got it from.. wasnt going to take it out on brewers as they've been good to me over the years.. think I'll take brewers advice and try little greene. . But so many companies have poor covering with white trim paints ..
Great vid mate..
I use an mdf sealer first,it seems to be good for the first undercoat.
I like the dulux trade satin with bullseye primer but all the glosses are shizar 👊🏻
Amsted qickdry satin. good water base pajnt
Johnstones aqua undrcoat and gloss is the best water based I've used the others disappointing
I don't like water base ,I put it on and it's too much like hard work worrying if it covers or not .just put oil on and you can always get a good finish ,technology will improve it in time ,
I'm with you on this I've uesd this and you don't get the shine like a oil base gloss
I cant see how it makes any difference to the environment, think of all the water you use washing brushes and how it goes back round again being recycled. on a plus note,It does smell nice !
You ever used zinsser 123 wallington?. I use that then water based u c and gloss and it works for oil the same
Firm I worked for tried it when voc regs 1st changed, lasted about 4weeks with various lads on different sites having nothing but problems with it, it was winter and it was flaking off, absolutely shite, tbh lots of crown stuff is, but somehow it's all we get on new builds!!!!
Brolac primer undercoat was my choice some years ago - I wouldn't use water based gloss, ever.
It's hard work
crown water based and oil based paints have got shit
Water based paints especially Dulux satin finish i find looks amazing on doors and skirting boards
It's not as shiny
But it will definitely last longer meaning it will look whiter than oil based paints as oil based will go yellow very soon.
Last thing you want is doing all the house and skirting boards and staircase and banisters all white again costing you a packet
Leyland undercoat primer, one coat of dulux undercoat and two coats of dulux gloss all water based. You can’t go wrong.
I’ve used this stuff a few times in the past although eventually it’ll leave a decent enough finish it’s not cost effective and time consuming to use, it’s not for me but each to their own. I’ll stick to the tried and tested old school methods . Cheers for the video. Good job .
Totally agree what a load of shit
We Have oil gloss on 3 years now its all turnded yellow... I am going to re do advice is use water base if you dont want it to yellow again... any advice..
Sikkens satura
MDF ugh nuff said.
its shyte
This Vid has appeared in my feed the very night before I'm about to paint the trim on an office using Crown paint (Spooky!). Fortunately for me the client has bought solvent/oil based Crown trade undercoat and gloss. So hopefully, it'll produce a good finish.
Can u suggest what white to do ! For passage and stairways wife wants it all white ! And doors and trims ! Vi yl silk or matt
Crown 👑🕯🐝🍯🫙
@@wallingtonfilming crown ! Matt or vinyl same all over the house
i like the way you slashed in the flooor lmfao
This is the best to use on doors trimp Dulux 4L 1-Step Oil Based Primer Sealer Undercoat and top coat Super Enamel™ High Gloss
Tbh water based undercoat and gloss is good but it’s all about the paint.
I’d stay well away from shit like Trade, Leyland Macpherson or Crown.
Stick with Dulux.
It’s a bit pricey but you can’t go wrong in terms of finished quality
between each coat thanks
Hi Mate,
I'm a Decorator with 30plus years experience and cannot stand this crazy fast flow acrylic base u/c and gloss bullshit is pointless and its just about being environmental friendly. I got out of new build because the prices are hard enough to make it worth it,then they throw acrylic in the works and hinders your hard earned graft trying to get a great finish and get paid fair. Keep oil base and satinwood or gloss anyway but saying this they use this crap armstead products on site jobs too. For me redec jobs is what I'm mainly doing nowadays simply because the money isn't a lot in it on site work, plus not so much pressure to hit your target in new build. Hence why I prefer day work now also. Thats my personal preferences in this trade.Even the money is getting worse on price jobs. Maybe I am wrong now. Keep up your posts they are honest and I like you revealing how shite this industry is becoming and don't start me on site foremen pen pushers bollox lol who thrive on snagging the tradesman and holding this £100 per plot too is a joke. 🤣
most water based undercoat and gloss are crap , and leave brush marks, only good thing about M D F is no knots in it
what grade sandpaper do you use too knip the doors & skirting boards pls
@RAVEN AK47 Fresh piece of P40 everytime....:)
MDF sucks, period! As soon as water hits the bottom like in a laundry flood it bulks up and there goes the door frame all bulged out. They are building housed with shit. Oil is the only way to go really on crap like that or full strength acrylic if already pre undercoated and not scuffed. But who are we to say?
I'm using fast flow now on new builds and totally agree with you also snagging is a nightmare as it marks so easy
It "cripples" your brushes as well,no matter how often you wash them out.
wash ya brushes out in warm soap and water ,tap em out,wash out with turps then soap and water,sounds fuckin nuts but try it😉
mal3689 effort
Wash out with cold water first ,then warm water trust me 👍
Water base gloss ,mdf ,I feel sorry for you. These plumbs who order all these crap products should try to slap it on!
The finish is not as good no doubt .It stays white though and the oil base goes yellow these days in 3 months .
Thanks for sharing. I have used the Leyland acrylic undercoat and gloss. It is also water based and requires multiple coats to achieve anything like a decent finish. Of course, as you say, it will never be as good a finish as oil based, but it does dry very quickly and the clean up is easy. Personally, I always prime mdf - even the good stuff - with BIN or Blockade before applying undercoat. One thing is for sure, I'd never use water based on woodwork outdoors. I've done so in the past, and it just isn't capable of withstanding the elements.
the best place for that shit is buried in the plot garden with all the broken bricks
Used the Dulux undercover and gloss over previously painted oil based paint. Different technique and initially patience tester, but managed to get excellent finish. Hopefully brilliant white will stay brilliant white!
No what u need parma white zinnzer zinnzer gloss thats it mate
The gloss isn't too bad if that's what they want, just acrylic and 2 gloss.., undercoat is shite
The only water based stuff is use is when they want it brilliant white. Old white yellows too much these days. If there's any tint in the paint I go oil. Johno's stuff is the best I found so far. But as you say, coat of acrylic then the undercoat then the top....or acrylic then two satin on top. Basically all new paint is shit.
crown undercoat and primer is a good product. Crown contract gloss is good too if you know how to use it. Coarse both products are not the ones used in this video 🤪😄
Thank you for sharing your hard-earned experience and know-how with us!! Excellent content and commentary on the video, including your replies in text. Truly nice work. Many thanks.
It’s not a true water based product, if you read the tin it contains a percentage of oil based product. On bare MDF coat it first with emulsion... then undercoat then top coat...the satin version is the worsed one in my opinion. Johnstone is the best... but you can only do what is in the spec
Fleetwood best waterbased undercoat and gloss
all water based undercoat and gloss is garbage
The fastflow is shit, the new build accy uc and gloss is better.
Hi mate, what do you think of the Graco Ultra and ultramax handheld sprayers what's your opinion cheers russell.
Give it 1 u/c and 2 gloss it comes up a lot better than you'd think Wallington that's what I do with the crown and deluxe water based gear,like you say it's never going to look like a oil gloss finish but it's the way the house builders are going with the water based stuff nowadays
Couldn't agree more candleman.
Correct this stuff is absolute pish
great stuff as usual. Thanks
Tried water based paint on the woodwork in new builds in winter it just didn't dry . Good in summer .
water based great to clean up after, but needs multiple coats to cover.
Hey candleman gerry here frm belfast ive tryed the fastflow like you i agree hard to beat the oilbased but fastflow in colours for front doors which you do alot black blue red great stuff & quick drying give it ago.
I used it its totally shit
I've recently bought a water based Johnstons gloss, which states that it's suitable for indoor and outdoor use!. I always find it difficult to believe that a water based gloss could be any good, when used in an outdoor environment where it's exposed to rain, snow and frost!. Am I right, or is water based gloss OK to use outdoors!?
I hear 👂 you, I don’t think 🤔 I would use it outside 🕯☕️🚬
Water based is fine. Just use decent stuff like zinsser allcoat. And prep everything to death.
You are really giving points the workers
i would just refuse to use it
Hi,I’m doing the landing,stairs and hallway and don’t no whether to use water based or solvent based paint.Need your help
Ricky 1234
Use what you like, statin finish will stay white longer.
Common sense at the end of the day😂🕯☕️🚬
Zinnzer only
Crap crap crap crap crap crap crap crap crap crap
Its crap
it's a 4 coat system on new wood or that MDF shit, two undercoats and two top coats (always need two top coasts regardless) but it flows so much better than oil it really makes the jobs easier and faster. Probably more suitable to domestic re-decs and not house bashing.... hence crown has a paint for new builds.. basically you're using the wrong product.
@RAVEN AK47 i only use oil for outsides and rentals, everyone else is WB, and i've been uing the Fastflow stuff for 3 years and i love it, it will turn yellow, but that's not the reason i switched. A good stand down or a bit of PX or bulles eye if needed and it's alright, I don't mind if it yellows eventually or scuff a bit as it keeps us in work ;)
@RAVEN AK47 haha.. lucky you, you're about 15 years ahead of me.. but there's no way i'' be able to retire, and i'll probably be cribbed before then anyway. i'm already falling apart it's ridiculous
@@MephProduction Try the Johnstones Aqua gloss and Aqua Undercoat, absolutely streets ahead application and finish. Spot floall in all water based helps.
Dont like water based satins and gloss yet to try it with flotrol though
simon bowes a little water does the same thing as flotrol.
REALPATRIOTHAWAII the coverage is dhit enough would the water effect that
Dont rub your frames down till after you apply your first undercoat or acky primer.Dead easy..
Great.... This is definitely the BEST UK decorating channel.
THE DR. FEELGOOD
I know but thanks anyway 🤣🕯☕️🚬
Hi candle man so true mdf aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh it does not like paint 😩 bill taylor trade ,
👍 nice one
Yeah it rubbush m8 cant beat oil superdec good gear for outsides no opacity water based no quality these days on new builds cheap n nasty not lke the old days also trdesman especially painters the good ones not paid what they worth never liked hiuse bashing hard work messy sites etc better iff domestic iff you can do things properly no respect iff gaffers on site they jyst want make money not bothered about you etc slags
I can emulsion 3 bedrooms in a day
It's site work lad, rub fuck all give it a light tickle 😂
As a DIY'er I think water based Gloss is brilliant. So easy to use. Main advantage is you can wash bushes in water ( or cling film for next day use). And no stirring. Admittedly the finish isn't Glossy but can improve it using a synthetic brush ( Hamilton) and a little spray of water ( may be a miniscule amount of detergent ) on the surface before applying.