Tiny Tanks! Trying out the new Legion Imperialis
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ก.ย. 2024
- Turns out the new game system for Legion Imperialis is rather fun and dynamic. Let's check it out.
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I've seen a lot of people treat 30k as a historical wargame, but really legions imperialis feels much more like a real historical wargame while 30k is more suited for narrative games. I like it
That was great. Much more interactive than regular Warhammer, a lot less standing around waiting.
I could see fielding much larger armies, huge battles.
"Feel no pain" only works against light weapons, and also not in close combat. I found that out after a game in which I hilariously saved 2 stands of Astartes after they were blown up by Marauder bombs. I also don't think you can target the HQ stand specifically, because they join the detachment - I *think* the owning players decides which stands from a detachment get removed as casualties (from the ones within LoS), right?
From shooting and dangerous terrain the controlling played decides which model makes saves and possibly dies, from close combat it goes to the model in the fight.
When the table is too small and the battles are too big, just use smaller miniatures. For all your Epic needs.
So, Toward the tail end of 9th ed. 40k, a friend and I started playing with alternating activations, going phase by phase. Deploy and Roll off as normal, active play takes his command phase, then the other player. Then onto movement, He moves one unit I move one unit, back and forth until all units are moved. Same of psychic.. not that thats really a thing anymore in 10th.
The shooting and the charge phase we combined into one, that way melee skew armies like world eaters wouldn't just get auto bodied by shooting lists like tau. You could shoot then charge when you selected a unit. Melee pretty much worked exactly the same, but their was only the one phase and because both players had options to charge the fights first mechanics were much more important.
Worked out so much better. So much more engaging. It changed up not just what you targeted but the order of operations was so important. If I saw he was moving a melee threat I could just sort of back up, but at the same time im trying to bait out his movements to get line of sight and positioning. You couldn't just hide behind cover on your turn then shoot when it was safe, You had to play come out and play if you wanted to fire your guns but you had the ability to play with range and move tactically if your weapons could reach further. What you shot and charged was so important, A big unit firing first was such a huge delima - it already fired this turn, so do you put your output into whats still got shots left to minimize incoming damage or do you try to get if off the board for next turn? Their was only the one melee phase, but that kinda worked with 9ths hyper lethal melee output.
What Normally ended up happening was One player would win on the the center or one of the flanks, then the other player would use his initiative to take anther flank. It kept things very dynamic and had us thinking and going back and forth till round 4 or 5 every time. Haven't had a chance to try it in 10th (moved out of state, hard to find regular gaming partners in bum-fuck-nowhere west-texas), but should work just fine, a few strats like rapid ingress would need to be reworked and honestly it seems like it would make battleshock alot more meaningful. Highly recommend giving it a try.
Ever since I’ve started playing alternating activation games I’ve had no desire whatsoever to play traditional IGOUGO games like 40k. It’s an antiquated system that needs to be replaced.
Was feeling bad for Monkey when the Terminators materialised inside the building walls. "Commander, only half the unit has appeared. The bottom half 😬...."
Lovely painting guys!
😂😂😂
Thanks for the report guys. Great to watch. Will definitely watch any more LI reports you do. Especially keen to see mixed actions with air support etc.
Thanks for the great video!
Remember that objectives are 'sticky' in Legions so you do not have to stay on them to hold them!
I am so glad you had decided to do this, as i thought it would be right up your street. I will be looking out for any further Legions Imperialis videos as I love the grand scale and 'Epic' feel of the game, but also the much more engaging tactical nuances! More please!!!!
Love seeing it! No split fires for detachments outside of titans next time per the rules! But great bat rep!
Absolutely great battle report. Hope you continued playing as I would love to watch more LI games.
Thanks for the battle report, we wantz more.
Rules wise: there's no modifiers to hit for obscuring except for titans. When the velitarii were overwatched and failed morale they could not reach melee, they are shot before being engaged (otherwise they are engaged and pinned and cannot be shot at). You can't target a specific model in a detachment like the commander model when it is still attached to its detachment. Medicare only works against light weapons. Master Tactician can only change the order of another unit, not its own unit's order. When losing a melee while garisonning a building, you do not need to make a morale check even if you lose the fight if there are no enemies remaining in base contact with the building. You cannot split fire within a detachment even if they have different weapons (example: a detachment with missiles, plasmas and bolters, they all have to shoot at the same target) except point defence. A titan can try to destroy a building by being next to it and can still shoot all its weapons, check the titan rules. When shooting a unit you shoot everything first then defender chooses which hits to save first, it usually doesn't matter but this is important against titans, they can choose the big hits against the void shields and keep the little hits to save against.
I think that's all I remember.
But please do more battle reports especially with one or two big titans!
I was going to automatically go for Marines until I saw Sultan had Baneblades.
Fantastic LI battle report! Monkey showed that being aggressive on the objectives (even with his bad dice rolls) can carry the day. Looking forward to another LI bat rep
Love seeing Winters cover this! I think you'll like the game Winters!
I am SO in love with the return of Epic. I just don't have enough time in my life to play both 40K AND this game!!
one more little thing I think came up in the game: You flee at least once befire you check to remove Fall Back orders. Page 64, 5. End Phase, 1. Fall Back Stage : "Any Detachment currently issued with a Fall Back Order flees as described below. Then, the controlling player makes a Morale check for every Detachment that is issued with a Fall Back Order. If the check is passed, the Detachnent has rallied..."
39:36. Losing half unit morale test is for shooting only. In melee only losing side takes morale test
Great vid, Monkey's dice were diabolical :)
I would love to see Legions Imperialis featured on the channel again! Loved this battle report!
oh cool! i've seen these once before. i actually like the idea of minaturer minis... ramps up the scale of battles. 🤔
ok i legit laughed loudly when i saw the snakeeyes dread melee followed by a 3....that is hilariously bad luck man lol
13:20 Light AT weapon doesn’t reduce Armour saves of vehicles. Rhinos have a 4+
Some rules to look up for next time. 1. Objectives are "sticky" p103 Capturing Objective Markers 2. Can only engage a garrisoned building with charging infantry, a titan, or a unit with wrecker p72 Engaging Garrisoned Structures
I absolutely love this game. Me andca friend are trying out the Command token and turn sequence in a 40k game next week.
37:40 ouch with the rolling
Im normally here for the regular 40k. And have started to skip the Horus Heresy videos. But this I want more of!
Although the alternating activation became a bit confusing to follow when I listen to, more than watch the battlerapports, I still found it very entertaining as it had much faster action.
Loved it. This is a total blast. I can’t wait to pick this up.
Seems much more tactical than 40K, I liked it, it's all about play rather than bonus and ability stacking.
These look so cool. Imagine a tiny Chaos army with little (giant) demons and whatnot! Wish this wasn't just HH.
I'll look into it actually, thanks @@phandaal
If it was 40K, we'd be waiting 10 years for all the armies and units to release.
Thank you so much. I’m very exited for this.
That was awesome ! More please !
Great to see the little men in action.
That was educational and entertaining! Thank you for the video!
Nice models and table
I think only titans can split fire
Point Defense can nominate a Secondary target with 4" I think
Commanders attach to other detachments as well
Close formation Fighting is just infantry
Great battle rep. Like the format very much
Super excited about this one. Epic is back. Go Monkey! Go Sultan! Die traitors! (Good to see Sultan upgraded the weapons on his titan...!)
This was great. More of this!!
Great game, are we sure one of those 'loyal' armies was not Alpha Legion Marines?! 😉
A no bullshit battle report with great footage - is it Christmas already again? Board is a bit empty for my taste but awesome stuff anyway!
Fascinating, the sneaky stuff reminds me of the phone game
this was awesome! i'd like to see one with a bunch of planes, battle of Britain style!
Great battle, would like to see more
Out of curiosity, where did you get those neat modular road tiles?
Thanks for the demo! I’ve seen a few similar examples of play and I don’t quite understand why the armour always hangs back! In a real battle the armour would lead with the troops tucking in behind.
not really, in real battles you want your infantry to screen infront of your tanks in most circumstances. infantry useing tanks as literal cover is the exception not the rule.
@@matthiuskoenig3378 what a load of twaddle! 🤣
That was awesome i cant wait to see more epic heresy battles
37:00 solar aux caf bonus is infantry only. Tanks don't have ranks
I think they made the right choice doing it as 30K - you can collect one set of models for a large battle, or split them to face each other in a smaller one, plus you don’t get the rules bloat that comes with GW endlessly trying to balance the various factions against each other for the 0.1% of players that do competitive tournaments. I liked 8th ed 40K but haven’t enjoyed 40K since then. I just hope they’re willing to leave Legions Imperialis alone and let us enjoy a game where we know what the rules are from day-to-day, and we don’t have to check 17 different sources for the latest update.
And they’ll do mechanicum, maybe custodes, and possibly the wider Imperial Army, and there’s even a hint about chaos demons in a recent article on Warhammer Community. And while nids, tau and necrons are out, they can always do orks and eldar, so there’s plenty of room for expansion yet.
Monkey’s rolling luck was dire
Nice bat rep, a few things missed, Malcadores have 2 wounds so that would have added points turn 4. Otherwise though nice to see, keep it up
57:41 weren't you firing frag? Ignore cover ignores hit modifier and cover save. Where -2 to hit?
The new supplement where you can field 6K points of all titans and knights might be interesting. But, it'll take a while for people that weren't already playing Titanicus some time to build a maniple and household.
EDIT: I'll also add that LI does feel a bit like a board game and not very tactical. But it's early, so maybe I'm not really seeing the full scope of the game as of yet.
IMHO it's more tactical than 30K and 40K.
I agree with the other comment. I've played all of the GW games and this is one of the most tactical. I believe that Fantasy is the other at the top of that list. Dice matter a lot, so it has variance but movement, use of terrain and making sure you put the right answers against the right threats is super important in LI. Playing the mission makes a difference, as this BatRep showed.
This looked really fun and, while I enjoyed the complicated facing-arcs and hit-tables of Old Epic and the massive detachment sizes, I can see the benefit of this new, streamlined, punchier ruleset. I also like how the squishiness of the units really plays into the lore of the Heresy as this horrendously wasteful conflict which has left the Imperium, even 10000 years hence, a broken shadow of what it once was.
A bit sad that, given the Heresy setting, we wont likely be seeing any epic-scale Xenos forces any time soon. Though who knows: maybe they'll release a Megarachnid army list for us to play through the purging of Murder with XD XD XD
at the 33 min mark, the contemptors would have fought before the malcadors do their advance order, iirc
oh you guys figured it out.
Commanders are not freestanding units they are part of larger detachments.
How many of the civitas city sets are you using on this battlefield? Are the worth the price tag?
I hope you go for some more Legions Imperiales Matches on your Channel with your own army. :)
AGAIN AGAIN AGAIN! DO IT LOTS, I LOVE IT!
comment for the algorithm gods.
Remember Black Books and that scene when Bill Bailey had to remember how to use the security alarm... There was a little man!
Thought that a lot during this video. True story.
more of this teeny tiny stuff plz
Excellent Gents... great game learn much
Love it. More!!
That was Amazing!!
More, more tiny 30K! Please!
This is what 40k needs! Alternate activations! Also,would like to see what the Aeronautica stuff does in this game.
SA flyers are really strong, marauders especially.
Light AT = AP 0 against vehicles, so rhinos should have got regular saves vs vulkite
Monkey’s dice rolls. Ouch…
Best LI bat rep currently on TH-cam. Hoping you guys do more.
are they as tiny as old epic game that WG made in 1992 and 1993 where they had vortex missile of doom for it went all over board where both side hope did come there way after it was shot and land for first time. since you could shot and land back towards you from dice roll then keep going back toward you. since each play turn you to move it again. so you could fire it and miss the other person army and keep roll for it to hit your army only
Nah, they are about twice the size.
Maybe bring more adeptus titanicus to the channel?
malcador tanks have 2 wounds each
Split fire was not done properly. Detachments can only split fire with specific rules like point defense or being titans.
Ha forgotten they did mini stuff but I only bought it as a kid so we could have more than 10 vs 10 in battles as so much cheaper we’ll the old miniature stuff
Interesting game, the lack of wound roll feels weird. Some the interactions of certain units easily killing other units was also weird. But still fun to watch, the orders and "you go, I go" are interesting. Its been a long time since I played epic space marine, but I do recall the orders. What's put me off this game is lack of orks!
The wound roll is essentially combined with the hit roll, which is why the hit rolls need to be so high on average.
@@batteredwarrior oh I get that, but it means you’re wounding a baneblade the same as a guard squad!
There is a community Ork list in circulation already. Eldar and Nids as well.
@@angelolombardi769 yeah but I’m not really interested in house rules, I’d rather have official models and official rules. It’s a personal thing and entirely my thing, but to be fair it’s saved me from sinking into another game :)
Ignores Cover hits on normal value against stuff in cover...
A ton of nuance rules in this game. Please re-look at ignores cover as it also ignores hit penalties for terrain.
45:06
Better to play than to watch. But gg
This game is much better and interesting then the old world, which i'll just be ignoring)
And yes, bring more titans!
B.s Titanicus is my favorite anyway
How similar is this to epic? I was getting into gw stuff when epic was popular
Three weeks late, but this is basically a modified 2nd edition Epic (Space Marine/Titan Legions).
Man this would have been great if they kept it in the 40k era. Before the stupid 8th edition models in space marine army
Is it just me, or does this just seem like a worse version of epic? Would throughly recommend you try playing a game of epic to compare the ruleset!
GW's new epic-size models are very nice though.
It's VERY closely based on 2nd edition Epic...so no, it isn't "worse".
@@batteredwarrior The lack of blast markers is huge and really changes the dynamic and tactics of the game. So does the removal of the control zones, and the massive changes to assault. Its far too streamlined to have any tactical depth comparatively.
Sultan lovely guest
Monkey lovely guest
Winters amazing host
Army look wonderful
Winters Tier Four member. Been a subscriber of the channel since late 7th early 8th.
I subscribed and became a Pateron for WH40K.
Do not like HH but I know Winters does so keep Winters happy.
"Epic" okay we have seen it NO MORE PLEASE!!!
More WH40,000 PLEASE!!
Charles in the Colonies
Love watching your content brother, and I’ve watched your stuff, because loveliness, but have no interest in the teeny tiny stuff. Sorry
It's like Old World
GW: "What is another way we can make players buy their armies over and over again
WH40K: Ultramarine
WH30K: Ultramarines
"EPIC": Ultramarines
GW: "Well Epic did not sell enough so now we can use "Epic" to BLEED the player base for whatever they had left. Brilliant. When it starts to sell poorly we can just drop it again. We could have it like 10 years then drop it for twenty then go back again. On and on and on.
The players will never catch on."
GW: "A lot of the player base likes and buy xenos. What can we do to make them happy?"
Horus Heresy: NO xenos
"Epic" NO xenos
Games Workshop unbelievable.
Charles in the Colonies
GG
I had a blast on this one, thanks for hosting us. Also that thumbnail is superb, you should do more like it!
I felt the wall-merging pain of your Terminators 😭😭😭
As fun as the Commander-on-Commander action was, once deployed Commanders must be assigned to another (In this case Infantry) detachment so those Commanders should have been attached permanently to their detachments (Same for the other SA Commander).
Void shields and Titans are a bit weird, but you need to roll all the weapons from all models first to determine the number of hits. Then the defender chooses which hits to resolve and in which order, so the Titan could have taken that Demolisher hit on the Void shields and then resolved the lascannons.
Also generally Structures don't affect to-hit rolls, there's no being partially-in-cover thanks to a Structure unless you're a Knight or a Titan. Other units need to be within Terrain like Difficult terrain, Obscuring Terrain, etc. So couple of cases you were applying minus to-hits due to the Structure, but Structures don't do this.
Stunning looking Space Wolves, really takes me back to Epic in the 90s :)
Id love to see more games of legions guys. Been playing a few games with a friend and its been awesome. As its so tiny we've actually been playing at the pub! 😅
What a fun battle report. Monkey and Sultan are such good sports. I really like the painting on the buildings.
Yes!!!! I was hoping you would have this on your channel. Please keep bringing us this content
Engine killer(2) means it takes 2 extra damage for total of 3
Is Legion Imperialis compatible with models from Titanicus? Enjoyed these bat reps back in the day Winters!
Yes, you use the AT models for Titans and Knights.
More tiny tanks please.
28:36 Alpha legion interference! Definitely not a teleporatorium tech miscalculating elevation and teleporating the detachment into the foundation of a residential building.
Detachments only take morale tests if fired at so engaged units only check to see if they withdraw if they lose the fight. They don't need to take the morale check for losing half the stands.
32:30 was detachment commander had started died? Commanders are part of det's and point defence isn't sniper weapon able to choose target inside det
this is why we play practice rounds, theres a lot of little things that are radically different than normal 40k in this.
For one, you cant splitfire a detachment (40k terms, unit) unless a rule lets them do so. "All models in a detachment must fire at the same target, unless a special rule allows them otherwise" (This is the big point for Point Defense, as otherwise the big gun is forced to hit pathetic small guys or the small gun is forced to hit something it cant hurt)
I'm not sure why they did that, since it kinda makes adding heavy guns to basic squads really pointless outside of ablative wounds. Then again, with how fast things die, thats reason enough lol
Only massive rule flop i notice though is "Ignores Cover" fully ignores cover, as in the neg to hit is also ignored. you guys were still applying the -2 to hit.
Using the Marine commander’s feel no pain when the wound wasn’t caused by a light weapon.
LETS GO legions is my new main game
Solar Auxillia looking real good haha I definitely thought the wolves would slaughter them. Great batrep!
May have to get into this. Was nice to see the Wolves hold on to the objectives
The Rend rule makes several Solar Auxilia units absolutely ridiculous in close combat, and I mean game breakingly ridiculous.
E.g. A couple of Ogryn units can absolutely annihilate multiple units of assault marines, even when they're charged.
@@Secretgeek2012 yeah Charonites are ridiculous in the lore too they mop up space marines haha
I feel like with tiny soldiers they should be using tiny dice - those dice are as big as a contemptor!
The dice of fate should have some weight