A great interview; thank you Rick and Tony. I agree with the point that “Tony” made, about 18 minutes into the video. There are no people who have either taken drugs, or engaged in spiritual practices, for thirty years. Only through Grace, or natural unfolding, does the One Substance awaken to Its true Nature while in apparent form. Great work. Thank you. 🙏
Out of my own experience, it can take quite a while to embrace and really hear this message (of Tony's). With Tony Parsons (who is not a "teacher"), it is a simple message, completely uncompromising, and the guy is always acting & speaking in line with what he is saying. It is about coming to see that there is no personal choice or will. Or there is readyness to hear this or there is not. Simple as that. If there is not, the arguing will be going on forever. And the search for "experiences", "insights", "understanding" etc. Like it can perfectly be seen in the comments here.
You describe beautifully, gracefully Tony - there never were any real 'me's or anything else, just this amazing virtual thing happening........unexplanable, indescribable; always just 'this' ............you're a wonderful apparition, thanks!
Tony’s pointing used to cause feelings of distress in me but after being on this pathless path for just over 11 years, his words (which are not his) have begun resonating with me. (I still have a me sense but I understand this subject intellectually-which doesn’t help) To those who think he’s spouting unintelligible nonsense, listen longer without trying to understand anything. Something will either get intrigued and want to hear more or they’ll get angry with him and what he’s saying. In either case, feel what’s happening in the body as you listen. Watch the sensations without giving them labels. Watch without any judgment.
liberation is the freedom from identifying as a person. it cannot be forced or found by any means. It just happens at the right moment as reality has prepared it to happen. and then it is seen that it never happened. How lovely.
It is always good to be challenged in my opinion. Surely that is part of the apparent seekers path. Having watched this interview, it has made me look again and what I am trying to achieve through my practice, and why. Being on a non dualist path as I currently am, he is not saying anything so new, but he is just taking it to the nth degree. I find it stimulating, whether I agree with it or not.
Thank you both for this wonderful conversation. "I" totally resonate with what is being expressed. It is great that we live in a part of the world where we are free to partake in such conversation......what a gift. Thank you.
This interview was just hilarious--I had to watch it again! also, I am intrigued by how my body feels when listening to Tony....the expansion is palpable.
My interpretation of Tony is that he's not teaching people anything to help them become liberated, he's just talking about the topic of liberation for those who are interested in discussing and thinking about the topic. Like everyone else, he likes stating his opinion and has found a way to do that publicly.
There is nothing extra-ordinary in what Tony teaches. It is all consistent with the teachings of other masters like Nisargadatta Maharaj or Ramana Maharshi. The absolute can not change or differ from the Master to Master. It is the same for every one including the Master. Some masters rephrase it in a way to look different and make a special appeal to the seekers.
+Seshukumar Raju He is clearly talking from his mind/ego. He doesn't displace any experience of it. He doesn't help you to reach the Oneness by this verbal diarrhoea.
+Seshukumar Raju You are very wise Seshukumar. You radiate beauty and I am glad to see your comment here. Thank you for making this observation and sharing it here.
Haven't watched Tony Parsons for a few months. Nice to be rolling round the old story with him again. Good long interview, during which I drunk two cups of tea and ate three choc chip cookies. The question is 'Why do we come here?' 'No, the question is ''Who cares?''
I loved the interview. This guy is hilarious! Like, cut the crap, get to the point and realise that you are That. No mind (ego) entertainment. We grasp it with Being, never with the mind, the concept called Enlightenment. We are all naturally enlightened beings which is covered up by the concepts but we want to get out of it to seek it. Everything is That! Love is everywhere and everything is Love once we realise we are all One.
''how could people not draw meaning from their personal view being faceless/headless in appearance'' that is a very insightful way to put it, incredibly meaningful if one thinks about it.
@bossgtten Originally I just used the text on the book jacket, but then his webmaster tweaked it a bit and I replaced it with his more impersonal, tweaked version.
Tony Parsons - the only liberated being that has ever appeared in the boundless energy. sarcasm is arising from nothing here, for no one. it just happened.
Really great interview. You would think listening to Tony that his take is the ultimate. His logic is uniquely his and many love it. The downside is that if it doesn't work for you then you get trapped because there is no you that can do anything about that and a sense of hopelessness can settle in for years if not for life, The "no self " angle then becomes a nihilistic assertion with no end to the suffering only an intellectual belief that the self needs to drop somehow without intervention.
What is generally not explained is that all the stuff that appears to us moment by moment, thoughts, things, emotions, people etc. is not separate from the knowing of it. We have gotten used to focusing on the stuff and not on the inseparable knowing. There is nothing compelling us to focus on the stuff other than the habit that we trained in. Waking up is the gradual shift from the stuff to the awareness. The stuff doesn't need to change as it is already awareness and so we can let all the stuff be as it is, this includes the apparent separate self which doesn't need to be dropped in any way as it is also just another thing that is already inseparable from awareness. We don't have to wait for Being to drop the self, simply notice awareness
These are the words Tony first used to express his awakening: "We are the sole source of our own unique creation". "If we let go into simply what is, we will be in a place of unknowing." "Awareness does not divide or suppress and therby give energy to the unreal. It simply see what is and brings the light which allows that which is illusory to evaporate". "I rest in that which never comes and never goes away".
Gautam the Buddha defines truth as "that which works". This is the ancientmost pragmatic definition of truth: "that which works"! All the devices are truth in this sense: they work; they are only devices. The Buddha's work is Upaya; Upaya exactly means device. Meditation is an Upaya, a device. It simply helps you to get nd of that which you have not got in the first place -- the fly: the ego, the misery, the anguish! It helps you to get free of it, but in fact it is not there. But it is not to be told
Great Interview. For my money, Tony Parsons is the best nonduality teacher who has never existed. What more can you ask? And who could be asking anyway???
Rick, this was an amazing interview in so many ways...your second quote of his writing just made me laugh so much. I enjoyed it the "play" of it. How to put oneness into words. I don't agree with totally with Tony Parson's way of expression, but I felt resonance but he is who he is uniquely beautiful. I never agree when teachers put themselves as the ultimate teaching, saying there is no better teaching, criticizing other teachers who are actually very clear. I like him other than that.
I guess I've seen, listened to, about ten of your interviews so far and this was the best, most satisfying one. You, Rick, also seemed to enjoy it more than others. I was beginning to think it was pointless to listen to people talk about and around this subject. Not so. Well maybe now it is.......................
Rick, Always enjoy your questions and always find you ask what I am wanting to know too. I value your interviews asI know they will always be direct with no shrinking from asking 'awkward' questions. In response to comment by YouGazzaa - completely agree, which is why I won't be emersing myself in TP's stuff!
Great point. The idea of an interview where you just "let go and be" would be...frankly, boring. There's a time for talking too. :) I recently discovered your show via Adyashanti...and love your interview style. Great guests. The one with Mooji was particularly wonderful...can't wait to watch this one!
I read the arguments between Tony and Dennis Waite and lean towards Dennis especially after reading his books, "The Book Of One" and "Back To The Truth." It may be difficult for you Rick, but it would be great if you could interview Dennis.
What i don`t like is that he says that everything is perfect as it is but also emphasise on contracted energy and energetic shift. It makes me think that i am not free enough until energetic shift happen, that with it would be better and now it`s not quite good.
From a blog post by Gary Weber: "Tony Parsons, author of the outstanding As It Is, describes how hard he applied himself to “various disciplines, rituals and purifications”. Tony states that his awakening happened “almost as if by accident” in walking across a park. Isn’t it possible that his spiritual work laid the framework for the triggering event to occur? Tony Parson is popular because he tells folk what they want to hear...that all they need to do is listen to him...as religions have done for millennia. Diligent, persistent, self-inquiry is the only way to get persistent non-duality."
Pink Floyd/axe is from a wonderful film I saw a few years back, in which a lady receives an axe in the head, and responded by saying she always liked Pink Floyd! Had a few moments were everything fell away and all was One, first time when I was 18 during a 5 mile run -beyond words! But in general we are suffocating under countless layers of suffocating and fear soaked conditioning. Brought to you by Pot Noodle Moment of the Day:-)
Say what you want but he knows how to kill the ego hahaha I think the problem most people will have with this guy is the directness and simplicity of the message which other will put in a different veil. It doesn't matter. Everything is everything and nothing...it is what it is. I feel like Rick could interview him in 2 minutes:) BTW great job Rick for doing a whole hour ;)
Hello, my view is that 1. on the pretended scenario - where we interact with a shared agreement - the teacher get the pay. 2. on the absolute - nobody is paying nobody. The assumption is that we all agree with above 2 items with not much ambiguation. But if we will ask a movie goes next to us in the theater: hello, who got the money they exchanged on the movie screen? The answer could be really tricky...
All suggestions need to be made through batgap.com/future-interviews/suggest-guest/, but at the moment we're not taking new ones. We'll open it up again soon though. Thanks.
yes i actually misinterpreted what you wrote but after having done the exercises I know what you mean by faceless now, it is a nice method to become aware of what it is like to be.
OK, based on a weekend retreat I had with a contemporary spiritual "guru" six years back, I can attest to having "attained" a state of wholeness, temporary "liberation" or whatever you'd call it. But two days later it was GONE! I suspect this is precisely what happens with a number of "people" who attend Parsons' meetings(my attempts to re-experience that same transient state came to naught in the same environment which led to a feeling of it having been a waste of time and money).
Well he hasn't given himself an Indian name, so that's a good start... You can phone him if you have any questions, on weekdays If you wish..... He's a lovely chap.. If you're after a nice experience, you'd better move on to a white person with an Indian name....... If you want the cold hard truth, then give him a go.....
@@mickdubhgall check out Rupert spira or Francis Lucille or even eckhart tolle. They don't have an Indian name but give actual prescription rather than just description like these neo advaita types
I hope Rich could interview Prof. Stanley Sobottka from the University of Virginia. He agrees with Tony that everything is just energy and explains it in a very easy way in his ebook A COURSE IN CONSCIOUSNESS.
Liberation is in flowing freely even when there seems to be a contradiction. The contradiction could only be a problem for a someone, contradiction only arises in time. It´s not that you cannot perceive the world, or time. You can perceive what you are not. But you can never be what you are not.
This is the highest truth, he means what he says exactly that. The illusory mind wants to gain more understanding and liberate itself from itself yet it's struggling to accept the core principle/reality "you don't exist so you can't even ask the question!" LOL.... nothing can be more hilarious than this.
It seems to me that many spiritual seekers get attracted to spirituality looking for their own "Cinderella" story - their own "happily ever after" story - short-cut to a guaranteed happy, peaceful, fulfilled life thereafter. In this story, the "prince charming" is named "awakening", "enlightenment", "realization". They seem to think that once "enlightenment" is "achieved", the life is forever effortlessly peaceful, joyous and happy. Sadly, this story is almost as "realistic" and as "real" at the Cinderella story is. Sadly, some gurus/teachers do seem to sell/promote/encourage this my myth.
I like the Open Secret, it kinda speaks to me directly. Obviously different angles appeal to different folks! For me the OS cuts through the non-duality red tape, gives me more Pot Noodle time!!!
I greatly enjoyed and appeciate this interview you had with Tony Parson and others. No doubt he is really uncompromising with the teaching. My question to you Rick is how do u view his complete disregard for any spiritual practice, at this point after some time has past this interview? Are you able to come to some understanding of this particular view? Especially About him denying the effectiveness of Ramana's self inquiry. I am comfortable with almost everything he says except this. And what about other progressive or direct path in terms of their relation to liberation? I try to be open to the paradox but i feel a bit stuck on this. Hope u can share you perspective. Thank you!
While watching this, i was casually eating 'lovehearts'. It occurred to me that i had almost eaten the the entire packet without reading the corny words on any of the sweets. The first one I looked at said "Just Me"
Sem F Actually, there was a massive opening after going to one of TP's talks and I do agree that there is a lot of egotistical BS about (who) because u can't use that word - is more non dual that (non) who etc etc.
Sem F Hehe, Im glad somebody saw the humor (or synchronicity?). I think I follow you. Are you basically saying that pro nouns are BS cos aside from the illusion of separateness everything is one and the same? or am i just too stoned and over thinking it? : /
irSpanxx You're over thinking it - but nothing wrong with being too stoned...OTOH - I can't think therefore 'I' am not 0-: What I meant is all the discussion and analysis is BS coz it's got nothing to do with 'me'
'Energy' is used here as the primal reductionist concept, but remained 'unquestioned'. For consistency of message, it could be called "apparent energy". in the terminology of the 'apparent me' discussion.
Tony describes reality from the perspective of enlightenment, calling separation and all of the feelings associated with it the dream state. But he can't or won't acknowledge that the dream story, the self, the I, the me, and suffering are manifestations of the absolute, of that boundless energy that he speaks so fondly of. We live in paradox, and any mystic worth his or her salt knows that: the deeper one goes, the clearer it becomes that we live in the paradox of finite-infinite, contraction-expansion, energy-matter, form & formlessness. Listen carefully and you hear him admit that he longs and suffers and has the experiences of the self. But he doesn't get attached to these 'lowly' experiences then calls them part of the dream state. Sounds like zen to me. That's fine for a 70 (?) year old guy who was a seeker for years, not so fine for a younger self that is just gaining its legs. His linguistic sleights of hand resemble totalitarian, Orwellian uses of propaganda and double-speak. Ironically, at the 55:15 mark he says that he isn't giving others license to do immoral things; I expected him to say that there's no one there to have the affair, rob the bank, etc. Suddenly he gets prescriptive.
+Andrew C. Hello Andrew C. (ohen) (hopefully not lol) He offers personal enlightenment. Nothing wrong with that per se and it is awakening but just for the individual. The individual self is seen through and then whatever is left is satisfied with that and there is no further development. So its out the window with love, compassion, care and wisdom and the heart opening illuminating clarity. To me it's a shame to miss out on these but still personal enlightenment is a lot more desirable than living the usual self obsessed hellish normal life that most choose.
Sage words, Andrew C. And a breath of fresh air. I am always amazed at the double-speak used by those who hold to the perspective Tony preaches (Rupert Spira is another of this ilk, not quite so militant, absurd or obnoxious though!). If the Self is truly one and is the only thing that is real, then if there is any 'illusion' or 'dream' then that is also part of the oneness and also has a measure of reality. We can acknowledge that we are much more than simply the finite ego self without having to repress or deny the part of the whole that the ego-self occupies. Just because a wave is part of the ocean doesn't mean it does not exist - on the contrary, one might say that the infinity of the ocean is simply the conglomerate of innumerable waves. Both the ocean and the wave are real and made of the same stuff in different states (as you say, contraction/expansion). One of my favourite sayings is "denial is not transcendence". I see Tony in a massive knot of self-contradiction and denial, of which he seems completely unaware. The ultimate wholeness, as far as I am concerned, is a wholeness that does not preclude duality (a bit like a coin with two sides). Real wholeness cannot preclude anything, including selves, dreams and 'illusions', otherwise it ceases to be whole. If people are curious as to how this might actually play out and be grounded or justified, I highly recommend reading into the philosophy of 'process theism' based on the work of Alfred North Whitehead and Charles Hartshorne. Of course, the tantric cosmology also has plenty to offer on this. Sir John Woodroffe wrote some cracker tomes integrating the relevant East-West perspectives here, with a depth of rigour that is so clearly lacking in Tony's viewpoints it is almost a great cosmic joke!! But of course, if you are Tony, no one is laughing coz there is noone to laugh. Ha! *Sigh....shakes head*
I do hope there are not lots of people trying to not do what Tony Parsons says. There are ways towards liberation, the act of surrender is still an act. Meditation classes, yoga, chi kung etc are excellent ways to 'prepare' the body-mind. Don't wait for 'grace' it'll never happen.....
Neo Advaita assertions like "there is no one talking", "there is nothing to achieve", "there is no me", "there is nothing like an ego achieving awakening" is another form of subtle spiritual strategy elaborated by the ego, it is a form of spiritual bypassing, it is escapism from one polarity to the other one. The wise soul EXists FROM Awareness, it does not desintegrate that "sense of me" and sits there in Awareness but, it cloaks itself again, consciously, with the forces and energies available through the personality and prepare to manifest again. After "awakening", the shaping and adjustments of those forces and energies can take some considerable time before Awareness can smoothly operate in the sometime harsh environment on this planet. Awakening to the unity of All, to Awareness, is not the destination it is the starting point, Neo Advaita can help for that first stage but it is quite clueless about the the second stage. The new instant TH-cam gurus are very unreliable in that regard, their baby-like type of consciousness and their promises of instant awakening attract the crowd but they, generally, fall short when it comes to grounded wisdom. Neo Advaita is the seed rejecting the fruit, wisdom is inclusive because it is essentially grounded in love. Neo Advaita is not all bad, just use it as a tool as long as it serves you, feel free to jump on another boat when the obvious cracks start showing. Above all, understand that you are a piece of Absolute, no one is superior to you, no one outside of you can tell you about your essential nature, it is just about you, listening to other stories can be interesting but it is their stories. Finally be very aware that it is simply about realising that there is no need to dissolve the "sense of me", it is totally fine to keep it, just know than you are essentially Awareness operating through a sense of "I". Peace, Beauty and Harmony
Thank you for the reply. I understand that awakening is the falling away of the person we pretent to be. We stop pretending to be a person and we just be. My understanding was that spiritual practice helped with this process. Unless I am misunderstanding Tony. He seems to be saying that spiritual practice does not help. Either it happens or it does not by grace
The best question to ask non-dual teachers which no one ever does because it is somewhat taboo is; How many of the people who come to the talks get to be fully liberated? I guarantee you won't get a straight answer. You will hear something like "nobody gets enlightened" or "many are getting this" but ask for a ballpark figure and it won't be given. This is because if it was as good as 1 in 10 then this means it doesn't work for the vast majority."it is either seen or not" is another stock answer
Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to the Sanity… what food is to Nutrition. Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to the Sanity… what food and exercise are to Good Health. Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to Living Happily… is what practice is to playing well! Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to Living Happily… is what study and preparation are to doing well in the Exam!
This is the first time I've listened to Tony Parsons, but I can see why people get annoyed with him. He complains other teachers do not offer a true form of enlightenment, but when questioned about his own actions he hides behind linguistic semantics. His ego is clearly still in tact, despite his protests when questioned on matters of the ego.
That is why masters in zen tradition were always saying if you meet Buddha on your way kill him. The dropping of the identity of the seeker has to take place. This is one of the most difficult things for people. Once that has taken place all scriptures and sayings are useless. Why one does need a boat once the river is crossed.
Yes! that is the message: you can't do anything including finding a new teacher as there is no "you" and if you do find a new teacher then a "you" suddenly appears that can be taken further away. Confusing or what?
Wow! I love being a human identity! it's such a beautiful expression of life. Poor Tony is missing out! Who cares if theres nothing happening -chill out mate!
This was really funny. Rick is struggling a lot to say something that won't be refuted by Tony. Subtle message, I think it only works for those exhausted with seeking, otherwise it becomes whether a no-self fanatism or an empty theoretical discussion
A genuine question: If the apparent Tony Parsons developed an apparent serious illness would the apparent he seek an apparent cure? -- or am I getting this wrong?
A great interview; thank you Rick and Tony. I agree with the point that “Tony” made, about 18 minutes into the video. There are no people who have either taken drugs, or engaged in spiritual practices, for thirty years. Only through Grace, or natural unfolding, does the One Substance awaken to Its true Nature while in apparent form.
Great work. Thank you. 🙏
I like the way Tony is so honest and straight with those he speaks with, no mucking around.
Out of my own experience, it can take quite a while to embrace and really hear this message (of Tony's). With Tony Parsons (who is not a "teacher"), it is a simple message, completely uncompromising, and the guy is always acting & speaking in line with what he is saying. It is about coming to see that there is no personal choice or will. Or there is readyness to hear this or there is not. Simple as that. If there is not, the arguing will be going on forever. And the search for "experiences", "insights", "understanding" etc.
Like it can perfectly be seen in the comments here.
You describe beautifully, gracefully Tony - there never were any real 'me's or anything else, just this amazing virtual thing happening........unexplanable, indescribable; always just 'this' ............you're a wonderful apparition, thanks!
Definitely the most apparently illuminating of the interviews with the non existent Tony Parsons that this illusory me has watched. Thanks!
Tony’s pointing used to cause feelings of distress in me but after being on this pathless path for just over 11 years, his words (which are not his) have begun resonating with me. (I still have a me sense but I understand this subject intellectually-which doesn’t help) To those who think he’s spouting unintelligible nonsense, listen longer without trying to understand anything. Something will either get intrigued and want to hear more or they’ll get angry with him and what he’s saying. In either case, feel what’s happening in the body as you listen. Watch the sensations without giving them labels. Watch without any judgment.
Tony Parsons is magnificent. So clear and direct, plus a wicked sense of humor. Thank you for this interview!
So good interview!❤
liberation is the freedom from identifying as a person. it cannot be forced or found by any means. It just happens at the right moment as reality has prepared it to happen. and then it is seen that it never happened. How lovely.
It is always good to be challenged in my opinion. Surely that is part of the apparent seekers path. Having watched this interview, it has made me look again and what I am trying to achieve through my practice, and why. Being on a non dualist path as I currently am, he is not saying anything so new, but he is just taking it to the nth degree. I find it stimulating, whether I agree with it or not.
Thank you both for this wonderful conversation. "I" totally resonate with what is being expressed. It is great that we live in a part of the world where we are free to partake in such conversation......what a gift. Thank you.
This interview was just hilarious--I had to watch it again! also, I am intrigued by how my body feels when listening to Tony....the expansion is palpable.
My interpretation of Tony is that he's not teaching people anything to help them become liberated, he's just talking about the topic of liberation for those who are interested in discussing and thinking about the topic. Like everyone else, he likes stating his opinion and has found a way to do that publicly.
legion!!!!!!
Exactly!....thanks for your comment.
There is nothing extra-ordinary in what Tony teaches. It is all consistent with the teachings of other masters like Nisargadatta Maharaj or Ramana Maharshi. The absolute can not change or differ from the Master to Master. It is the same for every one including the Master. Some masters rephrase it in a way to look different and make a special appeal to the seekers.
+Seshukumar Raju He is clearly talking from his mind/ego. He doesn't displace any experience of it. He doesn't help you to reach the Oneness by this verbal diarrhoea.
there's no one to help and there's no where to reach hahaha
+Seshukumar Raju You are very wise Seshukumar. You radiate beauty and I am glad to see your comment here. Thank you for making this observation and sharing it here.
Tony's laughter of delight at 34:50 is deeply resonant. It is the genuine laughter of This.
Haven't watched Tony Parsons for a few months. Nice to be rolling round the old story with him again. Good long interview, during which I drunk two cups of tea and ate three choc chip cookies. The question is 'Why do we come here?' 'No, the question is ''Who cares?''
I loved the interview. This guy is hilarious!
Like, cut the crap, get to the point and realise that you are That. No mind (ego) entertainment. We grasp it with Being, never with the mind, the concept called Enlightenment. We are all naturally enlightened beings which is covered up by the concepts but we want to get out of it to seek it. Everything is That! Love is everywhere and everything is Love once we realise we are all One.
Tony Parson is LOVE incarnate! Only Truth can come out of him.
The Rickness in this video was very enjoyable. :-)
Great that you do what you do!
And many thanks to Tony Parsons!
Just wanted to say that you do a terrific job in your interviews, Rick. Thank you =)
thank you Rick!!! love your questions and talks...
I added him to the list. A friend of mine is really into him and might be able to set it up sometime. Thanks.
''how could people not draw meaning from their personal view being faceless/headless in appearance'' that is a very insightful way to put it, incredibly meaningful if one thinks about it.
THANK YOU FOR THIS INTERVIEW. MORE OF TONY PLEASEEEEEEE?!
Excellent. Enjoyed it immensely. Thank you both.
@bossgtten Originally I just used the text on the book jacket, but then his webmaster tweaked it a bit and I replaced it with his more impersonal, tweaked version.
Tony Parsons - the only liberated being that has ever appeared in the boundless energy. sarcasm is arising from nothing here, for no one. it just happened.
Really great interview. You would think listening to Tony that his take is the ultimate. His logic is uniquely his and many love it. The downside is that if it doesn't work for you then you get trapped because there is no you that can do anything about that and a sense of hopelessness can settle in for years if not for life, The "no self " angle then becomes a nihilistic assertion with no end to the suffering only an intellectual belief that the self needs to drop somehow without intervention.
Many (many) thanks!
What is generally not explained is that all the stuff that appears to us moment by moment, thoughts, things, emotions, people etc. is not separate from the knowing of it. We have gotten used to focusing on the stuff and not on the inseparable knowing. There is nothing compelling us to focus on the stuff other than the habit that we trained in. Waking up is the gradual shift from the stuff to the awareness. The stuff doesn't need to change as it is already awareness and so we can let all the stuff be as it is, this includes the apparent separate self which doesn't need to be dropped in any way as it is also just another thing that is already inseparable from awareness. We don't have to wait for Being to drop the self, simply notice awareness
Great interview Rick,must have missed this one :))
A prime candidate here for a debate show, as he evokes such strong reactions both ways - would be fascinating.
@BachTantra I don't know anything about Ian, but I added him to the list and will check him out. Thanks.
These are the words Tony first used to express his awakening: "We are the sole source of our own unique creation". "If we let go into simply what is, we will be in a place of unknowing." "Awareness does not divide or suppress and therby give energy to the unreal. It simply see what is and brings the light which allows that which is illusory to evaporate". "I rest in that which never comes and never goes away".
Gautam the Buddha defines truth as "that which works". This is the ancientmost pragmatic definition of truth: "that which works"! All the devices are truth in this sense: they work; they are only devices. The Buddha's work is Upaya; Upaya exactly means device.
Meditation is an Upaya, a device. It simply helps you to get nd of that which you have not got in the first place -- the fly: the ego, the misery, the anguish! It helps you to get free of it, but in fact it is not there. But it is not to be told
"I differ [from other teachers] in not being there." 24:55
Lol!
Great Interview. For my money, Tony Parsons is the best nonduality teacher who has never existed. What more can you ask? And who could be asking anyway???
loved this interview, best tony parsons so far. Would love to see Ian Wolstenholme interviewed on here.
Rick, this was an amazing interview in so many ways...your second quote of his writing just made me laugh so much. I enjoyed it the "play" of it. How to put oneness into words. I don't agree with totally with Tony Parson's way of expression, but I felt resonance but he is who he is uniquely beautiful. I never agree when teachers put themselves as the ultimate teaching, saying there is no better teaching, criticizing other teachers who are actually very clear. I like him other than that.
I guess I've seen, listened to, about ten of your interviews so far and this was the best, most satisfying one. You, Rick, also seemed to enjoy it more than others. I was beginning to think it was pointless to listen to people talk about and around this subject. Not so.
Well maybe now it is.......................
Tony is a minimalist. Some poeple prefer rules, exercises and incense on the way.
Rick, Always enjoy your questions and always find you ask what I am wanting to know too. I value your interviews asI know they will always be direct with no shrinking from asking 'awkward' questions.
In response to comment by YouGazzaa - completely agree, which is why I won't be emersing myself in TP's stuff!
Great interview. Thanks!
I just used the description Tony wanted me to use.
Great point. The idea of an interview where you just "let go and be" would be...frankly, boring. There's a time for talking too. :)
I recently discovered your show via Adyashanti...and love your interview style. Great guests. The one with Mooji was particularly wonderful...can't wait to watch this one!
I read the arguments between Tony and Dennis Waite and lean towards Dennis especially after reading his books, "The Book Of One" and "Back To The Truth." It may be difficult for you Rick, but it would be great if you could interview Dennis.
Thank Richard you illuminates good stuff.
Fascinating interview!!!
Beautiful interview. Appreciated. Subbed. Thanks.
Thanks for the interview. I have laughed a lot.
What i don`t like is that he says that everything is perfect as it is but also emphasise on contracted energy and energetic shift. It makes me think that i am not free enough until energetic shift happen, that with it would be better and now it`s not quite good.
Damn! This was a very good interview!
Tony is straighter than a zen teacher.
From a blog post by Gary Weber: "Tony Parsons, author of the outstanding As It Is, describes how hard he applied himself to “various disciplines, rituals and purifications”. Tony states that his awakening happened “almost as if by accident” in walking across a park. Isn’t it possible that his spiritual work laid the framework for the triggering event to occur?
Tony Parson is popular because he tells folk what they want to hear...that all they need to do is listen to him...as religions have done for millennia. Diligent, persistent, self-inquiry is the only way to get persistent non-duality."
As some Zen teacher said, "Enlightenment may be an accident but spiritual practice makes you accident-prone."
@@Batgap Yeah, that quote sums it up really well!!!🙏
wow thanks for this!`~ a good energy all over the interview
What you seek has never been lost...it's this...so in what way does that stop me from being unhappy, if I was unhappy?
Pink Floyd/axe is from a wonderful film I saw a few years back, in which a lady receives an axe in the head, and responded by saying she always liked Pink Floyd! Had a few moments were everything fell away and all was One, first time when I was 18 during a 5 mile run -beyond words! But in general we are suffocating under countless layers of suffocating and fear soaked conditioning. Brought to you by Pot Noodle Moment of the Day:-)
Say what you want but he knows how to kill the ego hahaha I think the problem most people will have with this guy is the directness and simplicity of the message which other will put in a different veil. It doesn't matter. Everything is everything and nothing...it is what it is. I feel like Rick could interview him in 2 minutes:)
BTW great job Rick for doing a whole hour ;)
Excellent excellent!
Say what you like about Tony, he's one of the few "big" teachers you can just call on the phone, without charge.
Hello, my view is that
1. on the pretended scenario - where we interact with a shared agreement - the teacher get the pay.
2. on the absolute - nobody is paying nobody.
The assumption is that we all agree with above 2 items with not much ambiguation.
But if we will ask a movie goes next to us in the theater: hello, who got the money they exchanged on the movie screen? The answer could be really tricky...
beautiful interview, would love to see an interview with Ian Wolstenholme on here. Could you arrange it?
Rick, please interview Brendan Smith.....
I too would like to suggest Brendan Smith. Very radical and clear
All suggestions need to be made through batgap.com/future-interviews/suggest-guest/, but at the moment we're not taking new ones. We'll open it up again soon though. Thanks.
yes i actually misinterpreted what you wrote but after having done the exercises I know what you mean by faceless now, it is a nice method to become aware of what it is like to be.
@bossgtten I took the description Tony's webmaster sent me and pasted it verbatim.
OK, based on a weekend retreat I had with a contemporary spiritual "guru" six years back, I can attest to having "attained" a state of wholeness, temporary "liberation" or whatever you'd call it. But two days later it was GONE! I suspect this is precisely what happens with a number of "people" who attend Parsons' meetings(my attempts to re-experience that same transient state came to naught in the same environment which led to a feeling of it having been a waste of time and money).
Well he hasn't given himself an Indian name, so that's a good start...
You can phone him if you have any questions, on weekdays
If you wish..... He's a lovely chap.. If you're after a nice experience, you'd better move on to a white person with an Indian name.......
If you want the cold hard truth, then give him a go.....
@@mickdubhgall check out Rupert spira or Francis Lucille or even eckhart tolle. They don't have an Indian name but give actual prescription rather than just description like these neo advaita types
I hope Rich could interview Prof. Stanley Sobottka from the University of Virginia. He agrees with Tony that everything is just energy and explains it in a very easy way in his ebook A COURSE IN CONSCIOUSNESS.
"Hi , my name is apparent tony parsons."
Liberation is in flowing freely even when there seems to be a contradiction. The contradiction could only be a problem for a someone, contradiction only arises in time. It´s not that you cannot perceive the world, or time. You can perceive what you are not. But you can never be what you are not.
So many words to point to the fact that we can't see our face without a mirror.
This is the funniest interview ever. :) He's not compromising no matter what lol....
Talking about going in circle like a dog chasing its own tail. It alone represents what seeking and seekers actually are. Brilliant though.
This is the highest truth, he means what he says exactly that. The illusory mind wants to gain more understanding and liberate itself from itself yet it's struggling to accept the core principle/reality "you don't exist so you can't even ask the question!" LOL.... nothing can be more hilarious than this.
And of course there is no one finds it funny and laughing either. Thank you for the realization (though no one actually realized this) :D
It seems to me that many spiritual seekers get attracted to spirituality looking for their own "Cinderella" story - their own "happily ever after" story - short-cut to a guaranteed happy, peaceful, fulfilled life thereafter. In this story, the "prince charming" is named "awakening", "enlightenment", "realization". They seem to think that once "enlightenment" is "achieved", the life is forever effortlessly peaceful, joyous and happy.
Sadly, this story is almost as "realistic" and as "real" at the Cinderella story is.
Sadly, some gurus/teachers do seem to sell/promote/encourage this my myth.
+TOA
Yes, exactly. The Western mind loves the quick and easy!
I like the Open Secret, it kinda speaks to me directly. Obviously different angles appeal to different folks! For me the OS cuts through the non-duality red tape, gives me more Pot Noodle time!!!
So, what would Tony say if asked : What are you? Would it have to be acknowledged that he has to be that which is PRIOR to any idea of anything?
I greatly enjoyed and appeciate this interview you had with Tony Parson and others. No doubt he is really uncompromising with the teaching. My question to you Rick is how do u view his complete disregard for any spiritual practice, at this point after some time has past this interview? Are you able to come to some understanding of this particular view? Especially About him denying the effectiveness of Ramana's self inquiry. I am comfortable with almost everything he says except this. And what about other progressive or direct path in terms of their relation to liberation? I try to be open to the paradox but i feel a bit stuck on this. Hope u can share you perspective. Thank you!
Transcendental Meditation
Thanks.
While watching this, i was casually eating 'lovehearts'. It occurred to me that i had almost eaten the the entire packet without reading the corny words on any of the sweets. The first one I looked at said "Just Me"
Ha ha..that's hilarious (-:
Sem F Actually, there was a massive opening after going to one of TP's talks and I do agree that there is a lot of egotistical BS about (who) because u can't use that word - is more non dual that (non) who etc etc.
Sem F
Hehe, Im glad somebody saw the humor (or synchronicity?).
I think I follow you. Are you basically saying that pro nouns are BS cos aside from the illusion of separateness everything is one and the same? or am i just too stoned and over thinking it? : /
irSpanxx
By illusion I think I mean ego...
irSpanxx You're over thinking it - but nothing wrong with being too stoned...OTOH - I can't think therefore 'I' am not 0-: What I meant is all the discussion and analysis is BS coz it's got nothing to do with 'me'
Very amusing. Amusement arises!
'Energy' is used here as the primal reductionist concept, but remained 'unquestioned'. For consistency of message, it could be called "apparent energy". in the terminology of the 'apparent me' discussion.
Tony describes reality from the perspective of enlightenment, calling separation and all of the feelings associated with it the dream state. But he can't or won't acknowledge that the dream story, the self, the I, the me, and suffering are manifestations of the absolute, of that boundless energy that he speaks so fondly of. We live in paradox, and any mystic worth his or her salt knows that: the deeper one goes, the clearer it becomes that we live in the paradox of finite-infinite, contraction-expansion, energy-matter, form & formlessness.
Listen carefully and you hear him admit that he longs and suffers and has the experiences of the self. But he doesn't get attached to these 'lowly' experiences then calls them part of the dream state. Sounds like zen to me. That's fine for a 70 (?) year old guy who was a seeker for years, not so fine for a younger self that is just gaining its legs.
His linguistic sleights of hand resemble totalitarian, Orwellian uses of propaganda and double-speak. Ironically, at the 55:15 mark he says that he isn't giving others license to do immoral things; I expected him to say that there's no one there to have the affair, rob the bank, etc. Suddenly he gets prescriptive.
+Andrew C. Hello Andrew C. (ohen) (hopefully not lol) He offers personal enlightenment. Nothing wrong with that per se and it is awakening but just for the individual. The individual self is seen through and then whatever is left is satisfied with that and there is no further development. So its out the window with love, compassion, care and wisdom and the heart opening illuminating clarity. To me it's a shame to miss out on these but still personal enlightenment is a lot more desirable than living the usual self obsessed hellish normal life that most choose.
Sage words, Andrew C. And a breath of fresh air. I am always amazed at the double-speak used by those who hold to the perspective Tony preaches (Rupert Spira is another of this ilk, not quite so militant, absurd or obnoxious though!). If the Self is truly one and is the only thing that is real, then if there is any 'illusion' or 'dream' then that is also part of the oneness and also has a measure of reality.
We can acknowledge that we are much more than simply the finite ego self without having to repress or deny the part of the whole that the ego-self occupies. Just because a wave is part of the ocean doesn't mean it does not exist - on the contrary, one might say that the infinity of the ocean is simply the conglomerate of innumerable waves. Both the ocean and the wave are real and made of the same stuff in different states (as you say, contraction/expansion). One of my favourite sayings is "denial is not transcendence". I see Tony in a massive knot of self-contradiction and denial, of which he seems completely unaware.
The ultimate wholeness, as far as I am concerned, is a wholeness that does not preclude duality (a bit like a coin with two sides). Real wholeness cannot preclude anything, including selves, dreams and 'illusions', otherwise it ceases to be whole.
If people are curious as to how this might actually play out and be grounded or justified, I highly recommend reading into the philosophy of 'process theism' based on the work of Alfred North Whitehead and Charles Hartshorne. Of course, the tantric cosmology also has plenty to offer on this. Sir John Woodroffe wrote some cracker tomes integrating the relevant East-West perspectives here, with a depth of rigour that is so clearly lacking in Tony's viewpoints it is almost a great cosmic joke!! But of course, if you are Tony, no one is laughing coz there is noone to laugh. Ha! *Sigh....shakes head*
I do hope there are not lots of people trying to not do what Tony Parsons says. There are ways towards liberation, the act of surrender is still an act. Meditation classes, yoga, chi kung etc are excellent ways to 'prepare' the body-mind. Don't wait for 'grace' it'll never happen.....
this is a good one Rick....now, how do you feel about this one today if I may ask?
Neo Advaita assertions like "there is no one talking", "there is nothing to achieve", "there is no me", "there is nothing like an ego achieving awakening" is another form of subtle spiritual strategy elaborated by the ego, it is a form of spiritual bypassing, it is escapism from one polarity to the other one.
The wise soul EXists FROM Awareness, it does not desintegrate that "sense of me" and sits there in Awareness but, it cloaks itself again, consciously, with the forces and energies available through the personality and prepare to manifest again. After "awakening", the shaping and adjustments of those forces and energies can take some considerable time before Awareness can smoothly operate in the sometime harsh environment on this planet.
Awakening to the unity of All, to Awareness, is not the destination it is the starting point, Neo Advaita can help for that first stage but it is quite clueless about the the second stage. The new instant TH-cam gurus are very unreliable in that regard, their baby-like type of consciousness and their promises of instant awakening attract the crowd but they, generally, fall short when it comes to grounded wisdom.
Neo Advaita is the seed rejecting the fruit, wisdom is inclusive because it is essentially grounded in love. Neo Advaita is not all bad, just use it as a tool as long as it serves you, feel free to jump on another boat when the obvious cracks start showing.
Above all, understand that you are a piece of Absolute, no one is superior to you, no one outside of you can tell you about your essential nature, it is just about you, listening to other stories can be interesting but it is their stories.
Finally be very aware that it is simply about realising that there is no need to dissolve the "sense of me", it is totally fine to keep it, just know than you are essentially Awareness operating through a sense of "I".
Peace, Beauty and Harmony
I Love No One Called Tony Parsons!
This guy is going to be in shock when he passes, and he is still himself!
This gave me quite a headache...but as far as experiences go...the headache was quite interesting...
Thank you for the reply. I understand that awakening is the falling away of the person we pretent to be. We stop pretending to be a person and we just be. My understanding was that spiritual practice helped with this process. Unless I am misunderstanding Tony. He seems to be saying that spiritual practice does not help. Either it happens or it does not by grace
The best question to ask non-dual teachers which no one ever does because it is somewhat taboo is; How many of the people who come to the talks get to be fully liberated? I guarantee you won't get a straight answer. You will hear something like "nobody gets enlightened" or "many are getting this" but ask for a ballpark figure and it won't be given. This is because if it was as good as 1 in 10 then this means it doesn't work for the vast majority."it is either seen or not" is another stock answer
Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to the Sanity… what food is to Nutrition.
Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to the Sanity… what food and exercise are to Good Health.
Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to Living Happily… is what practice is to playing well!
Meditation, contemplation, satsang and inquiry are to Living Happily… is what study and preparation are to doing well in the Exam!
This is the first time I've listened to Tony Parsons, but I can see why people get annoyed with him. He complains other teachers do not offer a true form of enlightenment, but when questioned about his own actions he hides behind linguistic semantics. His ego is clearly still in tact, despite his protests when questioned on matters of the ego.
Any judging is duel, if you like or don't like what someone says, your there, there is no YOU there is just listening, feeling, seeing, being...
Let me know when Tony and Mooji would meet together in some pub of London. Or why not a cappucchino at Tourbador in Old Brompton Road?
That is why masters in zen tradition were always saying if you meet Buddha on your way kill him. The dropping of the identity of the seeker has to take place. This is one of the most difficult things for people. Once that has taken place all scriptures and sayings are useless. Why one does need a boat once the river is crossed.
Once I heard Tony Parsons call Ramana 'Arrogant' i stopped taking him too seriously.
Yes! that is the message: you can't do anything including finding a new teacher as there is no "you" and if you do find a new teacher then a "you" suddenly appears that can be taken further away. Confusing or what?
Wow! I love being a human identity! it's such a beautiful expression of life. Poor Tony is missing out! Who cares if theres nothing happening -chill out mate!
This was really funny. Rick is struggling a lot to say something that won't be refuted by Tony. Subtle message, I think it only works for those exhausted with seeking, otherwise it becomes whether a no-self fanatism or an empty theoretical discussion
A genuine question: If the apparent Tony Parsons developed an apparent serious illness would the apparent he seek an apparent cure? -- or am I getting this wrong?