@@MadScientistBBQ I was waiting in line for Jirby's and I had a perfect view into their fires and could see the smoke they were burning throughout the cook as I waited.. he's got it dialed down. the smoke flavor on his birsket and beef ribs was incredible
I noticed EVERYONE in the bbq community was singing the praises of aaron franklin. then I came across a podcast with Jirby as the guest, and he basically said that franklin was overrated. everyone was doing the same thing as everyone else. f#ck that. Jirby gained my respect for being different, and just being himself, and speaking his mind. and He has a video on his channel on how to build an offset smoker out of cinder blocks for less the $200😆 Jirby is legend just for staying true to himself. the quality of his food is a reflection of that
@@lobsterbisque7567 When he was starting his offset he squirted a bunch of lighter fluid in there and he said he didn't have all day to wait. I was like... I like this guy.
Excellent stuff Jeremy. I have been messing with my smoke as well and have found similar results. I bit of a "dirty" fire in teh beginning has been giving me a better final product.
Best compliment I ever had on my bbq pulled pork was, "I don't think you can do much better." That was very encouraging. Thanks for passing on your experience and wisdom.
I have a low budget smoker and it just does this. At first it has a dirtier smoke because it does not hold heat well and the fire is somewhat hard to manage. As time goes by it finally get's hotter and the fire cleans up. I love my smoke flavour and it seems to cook just like you describe (with some "dirty" smoke at the first few hours) ... 🙂
Try preheating a little longer. I also saw a trick that I am about to try: bricks wrapped in foil as thermal mass in the bottom of the smoke chamber. Water pan also helps even things out.
I've always struggled with getting smoke flavour onto my meat in the offset! Was just thinking about playing with a smokey first hour to see if it helped! Glad you've validated my idea! Thanks Mate.
@@MadScientistBBQ When you did a collab. with Harry Soo, there was the following teaching moment, that has just come to fruition: th-cam.com/video/xi89UCoaTl4/w-d-xo.html
So many videos tell you WHAT they did, I really enjoy the Mad Scientist because he EDUCATES me. At this point in my smoking journey I’m a sponge. Thanks Jeremy!!
Hey Jeremy. Well like you it took me quite some time to figure this out as well. I totally agree with the "dirtier" smoke early on and the clean to finish. Thanks for all of the BBQ knowledge you and many others have contributed to me and others to up our BBQ game.
Really impressed with what Jirby has shared, now I put my brisket on the pit, start the fire, and add tallow to the fire. Very happy with the results on brisket and ribs thus far.
I have kicked this idea around for a bit, I think it would be like the flavor you get from the meat dripping onto the fire. can you taste the difference ? How are you adding the tallow and how much? also are you using new tallow or are you taking it from your drippings can? @Mad Scientist BBQ please test this out!!!!!!!
I recently watched a video on the Eater TH-cam channel on Lavaca BBQ in Port Lavaca, TX, which made the Texas Monthly Top 50. It was interesting to see the pitmaster reveal that she deliberately runs dirty smoke at the beginning of the cook in order to enhance the flavor. In fact, she does not even start the fire until after she puts the briskets on the pit. Thank you for exploring this subject and having the courage to challenge the conventional wisdom of cooking BBQ.
thank you. I've been searching for someone to explain it to me just as you have. more air, higher temps, cleaner smoke. less air lower temps level 3 smoke. perfect!!!
Thank You Jeremy!! You have confirmed what I was wondering about. I have been working my way towards more visible smoke myself lately 👍. In fact some of my best ribs were when I was learning fire management and was “screwing up” with greener wood. Lol. Thanks again!
Really appreciate your humble nature and admitting doing something wrong along the way. I don't have an offset but an electric 40" Masterbuilt and the smoke is always heavier at the beginning (20 minutes- half hour), then none the rest of the time. Turns out excellent- salmon and pork. Don't have the funds to do a brisket so I couldn't say for beef. All the best to you and I watch every one of your vids. Have learned so much!
Great to see someone saying this. 'Dirty' smoke is needed for good BBQ. Since I've added a cold smoke generator to my pellet grill the difference is night day. Getting alarmingly close to stick burner flavor on my ez-bake-oven.
Thanks for the video Jeremy. In the future, would you consider doing one about using the damper on the stack? For a while I thought the best way was ‘always wide open’ but I recently watched a video from a guy who makes smokers who said that running the stack damper 1/2 or 1/3 shut would cause smoke to back up in the cook chamber (rather than just rushing straight out because the draw is so good with a fully open stack), which would help increase smoke flavour on the meat. I tried my last cook like this, and it did seem to make a bit of a difference. What was surprising was that it also caused my temp at the stack side of the cook chamber to equalise to what it was on the firebox side - this meant that my wood consumption was reduced a fair bit. I’m still very much an offset beginner, but it seems to me like there’s some mileage in experimenting with / commenting on how to use the stack damper and why.
I lived with wood heat for the first twenty years of my life. Balancing the dampers, cold air into the fire and hot smoke up the chimney, was always key to extracting heat from the wood. In the case of making heat, you don't want smoke because that means you didn't get complete combustion. But, if you whack open the air intake and the damper to clean up the smoke, all the heat goes up the chimney. With wood heat, you do want to get the chimney hot to avoid creosote and get your draft going, then throttle that back. You balance that by watching for vacuum in the firebox, if the chimney damper is closed too much there won't be any and there will be smoke leaking from the stove. When smoke is what you want, and you need a certain amount of heat, your smoke damper holds back smoke and heat. The fresh air damper controls the combustion by holding back atmospheric pressure. Obviously if this is throttled too much the fire will smoulder more, but not all smoke is good smoke. Just like distilling whisky, the first part through the condenser is no good, and the same at the end. There are things coming out that either don't result in good tastes or make for headache fuel. As your wood is burning down and smoking less intensely, you can close the smoke damper to hold back some of that good smoke, and you may see a temperature rise and smoke coming out around the door. If you close the air damper, that smoke coming from the door will stop and the fire will cool off. If the fire temperature drops too much, you will get into the smoke flavors you may not want. This is why people just say to run the smoke damper wide open, then control their fire with the fresh air. But: if you're running a clean finishing fire, your food has already absorbed all the smoke it can take and you've wrapped it up to keep it moist, closing up the smoke damper and balancing the air damper to hold the heat in the right range can really stretch out the life of a load of fuel. Especially on a smaller smoker running charcoal in the firebox.
Funny story. Just this past weekend I smoked 2 butts. One for my famiily and one for my neighbors. I followed your 2 videos going back b4 this video. I didn't see this video until today, 4 days after the cook. One video was on how to smoke a boston butt and the other one was on fire management. I had always cooked with level 2 smoke without any thought and the butts seemed decent for me in terms of smoke flavor level.On this last smoke though I thought the smoke flavor was lacking. My wife liked it though just fine and the neighbors raved about it but I thought some of that smoke flavor was missing as I burned a level 1 smoke almost the entire time. Now I know why. Thanks for the update!!
I intuitively stumbled on this method. I usually put my proteins on at Smoke: lv-2. Really, just because I’m too impatient to wait until until I have a completely Smoke: lv-1. As the cook progresses the fire burns cleaner. Thanks for confirming what I just chocked up as “my process.”
I've had my Pit-boss for about 3 years now. I have come to start smoking a brisket at 160° for about 3 to 4 hours before I turn it up to 225°. It takes way longer, but it makes for an awesome cook. Just something I've found that works. Love your videos, you are definitely the best!!!
Love the methodology of shaping your coals for you starting coal bed. Question: where did the ash go and how did you separate the coals from loose ash? Shovel with holes in it?
I’m glad you brought this up. I was at a backpackers lodge in Alaska over a decade ago. The owner smoked some Salmon. I remember a whole lot of smoke coming out of his smoker. He had a smoke shed. The fire was in the ground about ten feet away. Their was a pipe that carried the smoke from the fire to the smoke shed. ( I just watched your video from 8 months ago about cured smoked salmon) The salmon from that smoke ; along with his seasoning was the best. I was so drunk and high when I first tasted it. Everything taste good when under the influence. The next morning when I woke up; I decided to taste it again ( considering it was my first time the previous day). I cannot explain how good it was. It made every body that stayed at the lodge go to the salmon run and fish. Everybody over fished that day. I had 17 salmon. Their was another 35 people who did the same thing. We over ate the following day. Good times. Wish I had that recipe. I also believe that your level one smoke is the best way to do it for the whole cook. Just when I thought I had everything dialed in. You pull me back in to experimenting. LOL I know this is long response but; if you are reading this and smoke salmon? Tell us your favorite seasoning. Mine is spice world salmon rub and spice world Pacific seafood mixed together with old bay. I first layer the salmon with butter and add the seasonings.
I've got both a Weber smokey mountain and a pellet grill. Next brisket I do I might try building the bark and smokiness for the first half or so in my weber. Then I'll finish it off in my pellet with a cleaner burn. I wonder how that'll turn out.
I've heard in general the same thing, colder stuff absorbs smoke only until the product reaches a certain temperature. I think it was ~135 where the outside doesn't take much more. I could be wrong on that number but it's interesting that clean/ dirty fires are also a factor... I'll have to do some serious testing 😎
I have an Brinkman offset smoker and coverted the firebox to a burner with propane, I added a charcole basket which I fill with my favorite wood chunks, I light the bunner and dial in the perfect temperature. I get all the smoke I want, i also put a try of water inside the cook chamber. It works for me everytime.
Always one to strive for clear heat I’ve always freaked out when the stack started producing visible smoke, level 2, and when looking in the firebox the culprit is always the end of the stick that’s not quite as lit as the central portions. The reaction was always to move stuff around to heat up the end of the stick and stop the smoke. Now I don’t think I’ll worry so much about it. Thanks!
I’ve found we stress it because of the emphasis on not producing bad smoke. When I do long cooks there are periods of heavy smoke but not for long periods of time.
@@TheBond4574 The truth is, most cooks can stand "level 3" smoke for 10-15 minutes and have it not significantly effect the protein. Running "level 3" for an entire cook is a different issue.
I have the same reaction as you to seeing pillows of smoke. If I have to throw water on the fire or open/close vents? I would move the food until the smoke is at a level I consider safe to smoke at.
Hi Jeremy, Long time viewer. I don't post a lot but decided to post my first question. We talk about a longer stack for better air flow and that produced cleaner smoke. At least it did for me. Once I did that I have the cleanest burning smoke. You cant even see it. That said I have noticed less smoke flavor. The questions are. Are we looking to shorten the stack now maybe to produce less clean smoke? Are we looking at leaving the long stack but maybe closing the stack more instead of keeping it wide open like Franklin suggests? Do we maybe use a longer stack and run that clean fire and then maybe pop in a few chunks to smolder in the beginning? Maybe we dont pre heat the logs so it can smolder a bit more? I just believe there might be so many ways of doing this instead of using the greener split or even chocking off the fire. Your thoughts?
I would leave the stack height. The draw is important for the second stage in cooking when you are trying to render fat. The initial portion is where we want greener wood and denser smoke. The draw is salary’s good. We just modify with the kind of wood, wood stacking, and positioning of the door/damper to achieve the right level of smoke
@@MadScientistBBQ thank you for your quick response. I have learned so much from your videos! Keep up the great work. I will certainly follow that advice on my next cook to get that perfect amount of smoke.
Jeremy, I've been watching your content for years and I'm glad I did; I learned a ton over time either directly or indirectly by questioning things, or wondering how to do things differently. You were not the only one recommending a clean fire at all times, so that's what I tried to do to my best of my capabilities and I was able to after getting familiar with my offset. Although, I must admit, while the food tasted great (clean or dirty, you can't beat the flavor an offset gives to the food) managing the fire was becoming a stressful chore rather than a nice, chill activity. I happened on Jirby's channel and tried his relaxed approach to things, letting the fire do its thing without necessarily doing a ton of micromanagement to ensure a clean burn-not only did the food improve in flavor, but every cook became much more enjoyable with zero stress. The same happened last year once I dropped digital probes and relied on the Tel-Tru exclusively instead of chasing temps all day. Truth to be told, I tried one turkey breast cook with the dirtiest fire I could muster: the turkey turned out just fine, but maintaining such a dirty smoke for hours required much more effort than just letting it be and do its thing where the first few minutes of combustion are smokier, then it becomes thin-blue, then transparent. The smoke profile from letting this three-stage process happen naturally is just beautiful. That also means that it's best to let the fire die down and build another on the coal bed, rather than adding splits as it goes to maintain temps as constant as possible. If you haven't, give it a try!
this one really helpful cuz I've noticed with my Tritips on mt offset that there are times it has no smoke flavor (or very little) and I was was burning pure history wood and making sure the fire was as clean as possible. then the times I couldn't get it to burn clean and thought I ruined the TriTip it was amazing smoke flavor. so this makes a lot of sense. thank you
Jeremy. You've finally addressed an issue I've had with all of the advice on clean smoke. I've used "level 2" smoke and I've always enjoyed the taste better Thanks.
Here's another reason I'm an advocate for using mesquite. You can burn a fairly clean fire using mesquite. But it's not hard to get great smoke flavor. When I first started taking smoking a little more seriously. Following most of the suggestions provided here on TH-cam. Using post oak. I wasn't completely happy with the smoke flavor. Here in south Texas we use a lot of mesquite. I went to what my Dad, Mom, Uncles ext, used when I was growing up. Mesquite. And that's what I was missing. Good ol great mesquite smoke flavor. I suggest giving it a try. You don't have to change much of what you've been doing. Just change your fuel source. My 2 cents. Hope it works for you as well.
Great point, mesquite is pretty good when running a very clean fire. However It is a bit more arduous to achieve clean fire with mesquite. It takes using smaller logs, being fed more frequently. That is part of the fun of playing with fire. At times I cook with mesquite alone, other times I start with mesquite, then switch to something else after couple hours, introducing just a slight dirtier smoke, if using lighter tasting wood. Jeremy makes it sound like there is right and wrong. Cooking is an art, and one has to tweak and adjust to fit their liking. It ain't about right and wrong. It is more about one's cooking skills.
Nuke, in Florida, we mostly use oak or Pecan. I run a very clean fire, I get the smoke flavor but it's not as strong as I like. I'm gonna try mesquite and run it clean. Thanks for the tip
I'm in south Texas and I've heard bad things about mesquite, but I think it's misinformation. Next time I smoke some meat, I'm trying mesquite for sure. Thanks for the encouragement
This is the content I have been desiring from MSBBQ! Next we need a more comprehensive fire building video, the last one you did at Fatstack focused more on starting the fire then maintaining it. We need in depth take on wood selection, sizing, when to add wood, where you place the wood, etc.
I still consider myself a novice even though I’ve been smoking food for a couple of years now. I have experimented with chunks at different temps in my Chargriller offset. I have learned how to start cold with the right amount of wood chunks and fuel. Especially with my ribs that have become out of this world. Everything you’ve said is spot on. Love the videos.
I'm not even close to being on your level but I recently started running lower temps with more wood chunks early for smoke then bumping temps up with great results. I'm limited to a masterbuilt gravity smoker but it has been a great new process. Keep up the great vids. Helping a lot of of 👍
Was going to comment the same. I started adding a lot more wood chunks lower in the chute on my Masterbuilt, right on top of the first few coals, then adding greener chunks into the ash hopper. Last brisket I did came out fantastic.
I wouldn’t call this a “BBQ Mistake”, hell I wouldn’t even say that you were wrong. You have a good and informative channel with what seems to be a sizable following. At the end of the day, good Q comes down to 2 things (3 if you have a business): How we were taught, what we are still willing to learn, and preference of your customers. My grandfather taught me one rule for the burn and it seems to work for me with either a stick or pellet burner. If you can’t see your smoke, just put it in the oven but if you can’t see THROUGH your smoke, just eat the wood instead (with the exception of a cold smoke of course)😂😂. And I learned something from you when I found your channel. Just like you, I prefer the salt and pepper but some of the clientele like the rubs and It had never even occurred to me to add the salt separately when doing a rub and that was a MASSIVE game changer in the seasoning. Love your channel brother and Cook On!!!
Cooked a pork loin today and part way through I wrapped it in butcher paper with smoked lard. You taught me that trick for ribs but works great on loins as well! However my fire was to clean at the start so the ring wasn’t very prevalent. Love all your experiments and thanks for sharing !
Agree 💯. Got obsessed with chasing TBS & discovered I lost ALOT of smoke flavor doing so. Smoked Salmon one day, busy in the yard, lost track & smoke was mainly “level 2” every time I’d look accross the yard at it…probably the best Salmon I’ve ever had 🤣. This is absolutely the way I go now…not awesome clean smoke until later 👊🏻
Thanks for this video. I learned this by accident. I was doing a brisket on a CharGriller 980 and after over an hour the smoke would not clear up. After putting my hand by the exhaust and smelling it I noticed it wasn’t bitter like I expected so I threw the brisket on. It eventually cleared up (I think the chunks of post oak I used were to large) but I noticed it had the best smoke flavor of anything I had cooked on the 980 up to that point. Since then I use the same method to determine when it’s time to put my food on.
It was the last thing I put time into learning - should've been the first. Fire management is so much more important than what's in your shaker bottle. I'm just now getting there - self taught for nearly four decades. Thankfully TH-cam has some great info and has helped me take it to the next level. I wish I'd learned early: Start with the fire and salt and pepper. Build your flavors after you figure that out.
So I have been cooking beef ribs correctly according to your methods in my bge xl. Semi dirty smoke in beginning w ribs a little cold then thin blue smoke after 3/4 hours.
I think a lot of this will be when the meat has enough surface moisture to be tacky, not wet, not dry. I remember learning this from a sausage short course at the ISU meat lab. Later in the cook you'll have a crust forming and a dry surface so that's why you can't get the smoke to penetrate.
This was from a company that makes liquid smoke extracts. He said the moisture level on the surface of the meat was the most important thing to smoke penetration and flavor.
I run lump charcoal in a serpentine pattern in my Hasty Bakes fire grate. It gives a burn time enough for a full brisket cook. In the first half of the coal pattern I place large fist size hickory chunks. Meat turns out phenomenal. The second half only gets lump for clean smoke to finish cook.
I do the same kind of method on a Weber Kettle. Snake briquette method with wood chunks for the first half of the cook and then none for the last half. Lower temps to start and working up to 270F for ribs, for example. I get great smoke flavor without overdoing it.
But doesn't that make dirty smoke? Chunks on charcoal for me on my grill has made puffy white smoke. Or is that OK if it burns one chunk at a time, i.e. not overwhelming? I haven't ruined anything, and I get smoke flavor, but my brain's paralyzed with the notion of perfect smoke. Maybe good is good enough.
@@tonybernard4444 Jeremy does a great job on wood pyrolysis. Green or “wet” wood takes time and btus to ignite. That lag time produces the heavy puffy “bad” smoke. You don’t want wood that’s kindling dry, you want wood that’s around 20% measures with a moisture meter. And you don’t want to smother the fire causing smoldering.
Thanks!!! Your videos are great. I have burned too clean of a fire recently and my briskets dont have much smoke flavor. Im going to try to go more smokey next time!
This video is on point. I have been waiting on my Weber Summit Charcoal for the smoke to be transparent to put meat on, and have had very lacklustre smoke flavour. I will try putting the meat on when it's still a bit dirty since it inevitably will go clean and remain that way.
I love your videos. Glad you actually tried it. Ppl fall into the trap of how things need to be bc some one says so. Everyone jumps on the band wagon. I didn't know about "dirty smoke" when i started cooking years ago. Ive tried both after learning about dirty vs clean. I can say ppl have picked the heavier smoked "dirty smoked" food over the other every time! It's a winner by a landslide . I get is personal preference, but ppl need to experiment and do their own thing. Learn on your own, don't be afraid to mess up. I glad you put this out there for those that want a little push. Growing up in South Texas, i never really heard of these terms to later on life and after moving from that area. Have fun enjoy grilling/smoking. Don't be afraid to get a lil "dirty"!
I have a WSM, but the majority of my smoking is in a Weber kettle. I start the charcoal, and almost immediately put the meat on. The smoke is the dirty smoke. As the meat is cooking, more of the coals ignite, and the smoke goes blue. For the last 1/3 of a cook, all the coals are lit, and burning clean, and I get no smoke. My chicken thighs and tri-tip always come out awesome. I agree with what you’re saying, some dirty smoke up front, some blue smoke in the middle, and clean burning at the end has worked for me.
Thanks for this and all your videos, which have been a huge help to me. One question though: What do you do if your wood is too dry? Is there any way to "up" the moisture content?
Since at the wrapping stage you're not looking to add anymore smoke, I'd like to know how much of a taste difference there is (ribs/brisket) if you finish it off in the oven where you have a better control of temp. I wonder this because I have a cheapo smoker then does great adding smoke but lousy at high temp control for finishing.
Thank you so much for getting right to the point. I don’t always have a lot of time, and typically consume most of my TH-cam in the bathroom now… I also typically don’t comment on videos… Thank you. 🍖❤️
i have a memphis elite and i see smoke billowing out of it often.. seems to go in cycles, as you would expect as more fuel is added. i know that cooking on an offset is more OG and imparts more flavor than a pellet grill. but removing 1 aspect from the equation has really helped me not ruin food. thanks for the awesome vid as usual Jeremy.
I’ve always wanted to try mesquite in the beginning and then transitioning to a lighter hard wood such as oak/hickory/pecan to finish out. Same concept as starting out low and smokier to start out but you skip some of the acrid flavors of low combustion
For briskets, I always start out throwing an oak log on a bed of coals to get the pit up to temp, then use mesquite for this first four hours (protein won't take more than 4 hours of smoke). After that I transition back to oak, wrap at 170 and continue to fuel the fire with oak unless I have something else I'm throwing on that needs flavor. Regardless of the "smoke levels" I always look for thin blue smoke coming out of my stack, that way I'm not feeding acrid tasting food to my guests, and most importantly - I'm not burping smoke the next few days.
Would love to see some videos on the cold smoking and cooking some other items (like the salmon or cheese)… also have you found a difference in using ‘green’ wood versus dried out wood that you wet?
Thanks, I’m doing my research before my first cook. I think I have an idea on how to make my propane smoker… smoke.. as good as it can. This is useful; I’ve heard many people say the smoke is important for the first three or four hours then you can finish it with clean fire. I recon wood chips will go farther than I had thought.
Great video! I completely agree with burning a dirtier fire at the beginning… the whole “maintain blue smoke the entire cook” isn’t ideal. I disagree that you use less wood with smoke level 1… more efficient combustion means you’re burning the wood faster. If you choke the fire more the wood will last quite a bit longer than a more open firebox door
i prefer the clean burns, ive found my offset is too small to get a good fire going and i always get a slightly acrid taste. always get great results on the old Timberline pellet grill. Also im in the UK and we cant get decent wood easily
I own a BGE and you totally nailed it. A reasonable amount of chunks will do the job. In my first cooks I added like 6-7 chunks and it was way too smokey and bitter. Now I learned that 3 to 4 chunks strategically placed are plenty.
The issue with pellet smokers is the volume of smoke produced. The firebox is typically tiny compared to the firebox of an offset so the amount of smoke produced is less. Newer programming in the nicer pellet grills are producing more smoke now when using higher quality pellets but people are still having to use smoke tubes or placing wood chunks on the heat deflector to get the desired level of smoke
I have a Cabelas pellet grill/smoker, I've learned that I have to cold smoke for about 4hrs 160-180 Degrees before going up to 220-225. If I don't I get little smoke flavor because whatever I'm smoking gets skinned over and wont let in any smoke. Thinking about trying a pan of water to keep things from skinning over.
You might look into creosote formation when burning wood. It is the bane of chimney sweeps and fire departments but also causes bitter flavors in smoked meats.
Would love to see a video on how you manage the fire and air intake to control the smoke to the levels that you’re talking about. I have a brazos and have a hard time keeping the temperature from getting too hot.
@@MadScientistBBQ I recently purchased an Oklahoma Joe Bronco Pro and it was a bit odd taking tips from other TH-camrs 😂 Thanks for your spreading your knowledge with us!
An interesting experiment I did on my last bacon smoke was to set my chimney in the firebox with hot coals and put 1 log over the top of the chimney that burned at level 2 and dropped it in the chimney when the coals we’re burning down. I’ll go back to this method on smoking I wasn’t under 200 again! Of course new log on when the other goes down.
Appreciate the humility! That is a rare trait these days. Along similar lines, although I currently cook on the Brazos for the backyard and a 288 gallon with 3/8 inch steel for large events, I’ve produced some better quality BBQ on a cheap offset with flimsy metal because of the inefficiency. Essentially you have to burn more fuel and there is poor quality intake but if you tend the fire well, it is amazing. When is the modified Brazos comparison video coming out?
This is also a LARGE part of the reason pellets don't produce the same type or amount of smoke you would get from a traditional smoker. I run a Woodwind Pro as my primary smoker, and I've found that using wood chunks with a bit of bark still on them makes a HUGE difference. There's more lignin in the bark, so you get a dirtier smoke than backless, but if you keep it burning instead of smoldering, it has excellent flavor. I spent a long time running offsets with my dad as a kid, and even running pellet grills, that fire management still has its uses. Great video.
I’d like to add that the whole smoke color thing, as presented here, applies very largely to a particular type of cooker/cooking: offset - whether in an offset pit or in the Weber kettle/egg type coals offset to one side (I.e. where meat is not above fire). For folks smoking in elevated pits (boxes or brick structures) or barrels (PBC, OKJ Bronco, Gateway, Hunsaker, etc.) or even, but to lesser degree, reverse flow offsets, maintaining this blue or clear ideal is not possible. Rendered fat burning in the coal bed of an open-style pit is part of the flavor and experience and will, definitely, generate visible smoke. The only way to avoid it is a shelf with a drip pan (like stock WSM - but not Harry Soo WSM method which is more barrel/open style).
You are absolutely correct, I smoked some chicken last night on my okj broncho, and my smoke was clean for about 30 mins, then it always changes once the fat starts dripping off your food. It never fails, thankfully on mine it usually doesn’t affect flavor too much
In most cases, Harry Soo uses the water pan but empty in the WSM. However, there is a video, Harry cooking a brisket hot and fast at 400 F with the water pan removed.
Agreed- I also had a problem with Hickory as a novice until I started making hotter smoke. I was getting a sour/bitter flavor with it until I got my rig making hotter smoke you need a little fire sometimes but not so much you go up in temp and "cook" the meat.
And, here I thought I was letting you down by letting my fire burn a little dirty, because it was still an open flame and it was easier to let it go than to keep messing with things that may or may not cause temperature spikes and the like. It still always turned out good, and now I know why. 👍
I have a pet barrel which is where I start my brisket on a low smoky heat for the first three hours then I move it over to my pellet smoker for the rest of the cook and it’s perfect.
I made the same discovery a few years ago good to know I'm not crazy I start and a smoke level of 2.5 "according to you demonstration witch in amazing might I add" and and gradually clean it up as the cook goes ending at a level one.
When u say moderate amount of smoking wood in the wsm how many chunks deck of card sized would u use.... Thank you for this video majority of barbecue places I eat at have way too much smoke flavor I thought it was just me being over picky almost gives it a creosote flavor in my opinion
Thanks for this...I thought my taste buds were broken. As much as I wish I could do an offset, just not doable right now. I use a Weber natural gas with a smoker box using wood chucks...Indirect heat..and have created some great chicken, pork shoulder and ribs...too afraid to do brisket yet.
I’m using a wsm and I have trouble getting the heat once I put the pan in the temp drops hugely. But I’ve had huge success with dirty smoke especially with hickory.
I find that as long as you cook with dry wood chunks, you should be ok. I produce lots of white smoke with little problem. Only time I ever oversmoked was some extreme humidity screwed over my fire management and I had wild temperature swings.
The trick is that you need to "cook" the dirty smoke on the meat for a few hours to remove the bitterness. So always add the new wood at the beginning. At least that's my experience. Smoke added at the end is bitter.
Good stuff. I'm not at the point of getting an offset smoker just yet. I've been using an SNS Kettle. To get the smoke flavor I want, I have to run it somewhere between level 2 and level 3 for the first 4 hours (give or take). Doing this, I've never had one turn out bitter or too smoky.
Yes I've noticed this with my pellet smoker, I'll make sure to just smoke it a few hours at the lowest setting and then do the rest of the cook like normal. Produces a very deep smoke ring and flavor.
Wouldn’t a slather and or rub also effect smoke absorption? Such as, if you use a slather of oil or an oil based product along with a rub higher in sugar, you are creating a barrier to good, deep smoke absorption. Wasn’t mentioned in the video, but it does bear some consideration when starting the smoke process.
Honestly, I've never noticed a difference in smoke flavor due to binders or rubs. The starting temperature of the protein makes a much bigger difference. Cold surfaces at the start of a cook attract smoke more than warm(er) ones.
Awesome information as usual. Jeremy, I'm interested in your thoughts on that Pitts & Spitts pellet grill in the back. Can't wait to see some content on that!!
OMG Thank You Sir! I've been thinking that smoke and fat combine to make an umami flavor that's what's so desirable about bbq. This particular video has me so excited about what I can make on my pit. I also need to look into cold smoking with my offset.
I caught your show with Knotty Wood Products and the cookoff, and I have to "Thank you" for opening the recommendation to what I say was a absolutely fantastic. My first smoke cook was with Knotty Wood Plum pellets and my wife and I could not believe the flavor and the juiciness of the chicken, just heaven. My next smoke cook was on my wife's birthday, actual day, when she and I were surprised, by a super surprise visit from her son and his family that flew in from Colorado and her sister from Claremont, CA., on her actual birthday. That evening I smoked two of the juiciest and most tender whole chickens with that plum pellet taste and the reviews were so fantastic and the compliments went on and on the next couple days. I also have cooked, watching your videos on Pork Butts, many of them wanting more and more anytime I can, hint, hint, hint. from the refuse man , next door neighbors and even the guy that repairs my radiators. Thanks Again. Woody of Woody's Urban Forestry Products Sacramento ,CA
I use lumpwood charcoal for my fuel and to get that smoke flavour I have a smoke tube that I fill with wood chips...One fill of it produces enough smoke at the beginning of the cook to be perfect everytime...
Thanks 🙏 I Learning a lot form you :) May GOD bless you :) That’s exactly what I was doing in the pellet smoker is the same way :( I was smoking for a couple hours on one 160-180 for a couple hours then run to 235 - 245 :) My offset smoker it’s not finished yet so I’ll try it see how it works
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love the jirby shout out, jonny is the goat and his techniques are awesome - his approach is "do whatever you want" and it always works
Haha well it’s hard to argue with #1 in Texas
@@MadScientistBBQ I was waiting in line for Jirby's and I had a perfect view into their fires and could see the smoke they were burning throughout the cook as I waited.. he's got it dialed down. the smoke flavor on his birsket and beef ribs was incredible
I noticed EVERYONE in the bbq community was singing the praises of aaron franklin. then I came across a podcast with Jirby as the guest, and he basically said that franklin was overrated. everyone was doing the same thing as everyone else. f#ck that. Jirby gained my respect for being different, and just being himself, and speaking his mind. and He has a video on his channel on how to build an offset smoker out of cinder blocks for less the $200😆 Jirby is legend just for staying true to himself. the quality of his food is a reflection of that
@@lobsterbisque7567 When he was starting his offset he squirted a bunch of lighter fluid in there and he said he didn't have all day to wait. I was like... I like this guy.
@@TheBradleyd1146 I prefer the flamethrower method, same principle, more fun.
Excellent stuff Jeremy. I have been messing with my smoke as well and have found similar results. I bit of a "dirty" fire in teh beginning has been giving me a better final product.
Same thing I found out, just did some drumsticks!
Best compliment I ever had on my bbq pulled pork was, "I don't think you can do much better." That was very encouraging. Thanks for passing on your experience and wisdom.
Much respect Jeremy for admitting you were wrong. Your passion for the best product is why I am a Yuge fan!
I'm glad you did this. I noticed little to no smoke flavor as I burn cleaner fires. Also had a theory that the smoke could be too clean...
I have a low budget smoker and it just does this. At first it has a dirtier smoke because it does not hold heat well and the fire is somewhat hard to manage. As time goes by it finally get's hotter and the fire cleans up. I love my smoke flavour and it seems to cook just like you describe (with some "dirty" smoke at the first few hours) ... 🙂
Try preheating a little longer. I also saw a trick that I am about to try: bricks wrapped in foil as thermal mass in the bottom of the smoke chamber. Water pan also helps even things out.
I've always struggled with getting smoke flavour onto my meat in the offset! Was just thinking about playing with a smokey first hour to see if it helped!
Glad you've validated my idea! Thanks Mate.
I definitely wasn’t the first one to figure it out. I was wrong for years 😂
@@MadScientistBBQ When you did a collab. with Harry Soo, there was the following teaching moment, that has just come to fruition: th-cam.com/video/xi89UCoaTl4/w-d-xo.html
I watched this video 2 years ago and it changed my life😂 you’re 100% correct. Thanks for sharing this!
So many videos tell you WHAT they did, I really enjoy the Mad Scientist because he EDUCATES me. At this point in my smoking journey I’m a sponge.
Thanks Jeremy!!
Hey Jeremy. Well like you it took me quite some time to figure this out as well. I totally agree with the "dirtier" smoke early on and the clean to finish. Thanks for all of the BBQ knowledge you and many others have contributed to me and others to up our BBQ game.
Really impressed with what Jirby has shared, now I put my brisket on the pit, start the fire, and add tallow to the fire. Very happy with the results on brisket and ribs thus far.
I have kicked this idea around for a bit, I think it would be like the flavor you get from the meat dripping onto the fire. can you taste the difference ? How are you adding the tallow and how much? also are you using new tallow or are you taking it from your drippings can? @Mad Scientist BBQ please test this out!!!!!!!
I recently watched a video on the Eater TH-cam channel on Lavaca BBQ in Port Lavaca, TX, which made the Texas Monthly Top 50. It was interesting to see the pitmaster reveal that she deliberately runs dirty smoke at the beginning of the cook in order to enhance the flavor. In fact, she does not even start the fire until after she puts the briskets on the pit. Thank you for exploring this subject and having the courage to challenge the conventional wisdom of cooking BBQ.
thank you. I've been searching for someone to explain it to me just as you have. more air, higher temps, cleaner smoke. less air lower temps level 3 smoke. perfect!!!
Thank You Jeremy!! You have confirmed what I was wondering about. I have been working my way towards more visible smoke myself lately 👍. In fact some of my best ribs were when I was learning fire management and was “screwing up” with greener wood. Lol. Thanks again!
Do you know what your moisture was m trying to figure this offset out before I sell it to many cooks with no smoke flavor
Really appreciate your humble nature and admitting doing something wrong along the way. I don't have an offset but an electric 40" Masterbuilt and the smoke is always heavier at the beginning (20 minutes- half hour), then none the rest of the time. Turns out excellent- salmon and pork. Don't have the funds to do a brisket so I couldn't say for beef. All the best to you and I watch every one of your vids. Have learned so much!
Great to see someone saying this. 'Dirty' smoke is needed for good BBQ. Since I've added a cold smoke generator to my pellet grill the difference is night day. Getting alarmingly close to stick burner flavor on my ez-bake-oven.
Thanks for the video Jeremy. In the future, would you consider doing one about using the damper on the stack? For a while I thought the best way was ‘always wide open’ but I recently watched a video from a guy who makes smokers who said that running the stack damper 1/2 or 1/3 shut would cause smoke to back up in the cook chamber (rather than just rushing straight out because the draw is so good with a fully open stack), which would help increase smoke flavour on the meat.
I tried my last cook like this, and it did seem to make a bit of a difference. What was surprising was that it also caused my temp at the stack side of the cook chamber to equalise to what it was on the firebox side - this meant that my wood consumption was reduced a fair bit.
I’m still very much an offset beginner, but it seems to me like there’s some mileage in experimenting with / commenting on how to use the stack damper and why.
I lived with wood heat for the first twenty years of my life. Balancing the dampers, cold air into the fire and hot smoke up the chimney, was always key to extracting heat from the wood. In the case of making heat, you don't want smoke because that means you didn't get complete combustion. But, if you whack open the air intake and the damper to clean up the smoke, all the heat goes up the chimney. With wood heat, you do want to get the chimney hot to avoid creosote and get your draft going, then throttle that back. You balance that by watching for vacuum in the firebox, if the chimney damper is closed too much there won't be any and there will be smoke leaking from the stove.
When smoke is what you want, and you need a certain amount of heat, your smoke damper holds back smoke and heat. The fresh air damper controls the combustion by holding back atmospheric pressure. Obviously if this is throttled too much the fire will smoulder more, but not all smoke is good smoke. Just like distilling whisky, the first part through the condenser is no good, and the same at the end. There are things coming out that either don't result in good tastes or make for headache fuel. As your wood is burning down and smoking less intensely, you can close the smoke damper to hold back some of that good smoke, and you may see a temperature rise and smoke coming out around the door. If you close the air damper, that smoke coming from the door will stop and the fire will cool off. If the fire temperature drops too much, you will get into the smoke flavors you may not want. This is why people just say to run the smoke damper wide open, then control their fire with the fresh air. But: if you're running a clean finishing fire, your food has already absorbed all the smoke it can take and you've wrapped it up to keep it moist, closing up the smoke damper and balancing the air damper to hold the heat in the right range can really stretch out the life of a load of fuel. Especially on a smaller smoker running charcoal in the firebox.
Funny story. Just this past weekend I smoked 2 butts. One for my famiily and one for my neighbors. I followed your 2 videos going back b4 this video. I didn't see this video until today, 4 days after the cook. One video was on how to smoke a boston butt and the other one was on fire management. I had always cooked with level 2 smoke without any thought and the butts seemed decent for me in terms of smoke flavor level.On this last smoke though I thought the smoke flavor was lacking. My wife liked it though just fine and the neighbors raved about it but I thought some of that smoke flavor was missing as I burned a level 1 smoke almost the entire time. Now I know why. Thanks for the update!!
I intuitively stumbled on this method. I usually put my proteins on at Smoke: lv-2. Really, just because I’m too impatient to wait until until I have a completely Smoke: lv-1. As the cook progresses the fire burns cleaner.
Thanks for confirming what I just chocked up as “my process.”
I've had my Pit-boss for about 3 years now. I have come to start smoking a brisket at 160° for about 3 to 4 hours before I turn it up to 225°. It takes way longer, but it makes for an awesome cook. Just something I've found that works. Love your videos, you are definitely the best!!!
Just got a pit boss on July 4th myself! Excited to try some cooks. Do you have a pellet preference?
@@BFMwithStackhouse traeger pellets for me, it's just convenient. I get them through my job. The quality is undeniable though.
Love the methodology of shaping your coals for you starting coal bed. Question: where did the ash go and how did you separate the coals from loose ash? Shovel with holes in it?
This explains so much! My 1000 gallon likes to produce clear smoke, so it's no wonder I've had some trouble producing enough smoke flavor!
Just use green wood and you’re 90% there
I’m glad you brought this up. I was at a backpackers lodge in Alaska over a decade ago. The owner smoked some Salmon. I remember a whole lot of smoke coming out of his smoker. He had a smoke shed. The fire was in the ground about ten feet away. Their was a pipe that carried the smoke from the fire to the smoke shed. ( I just watched your video from 8 months ago about cured smoked salmon) The salmon from that smoke ; along with his seasoning was the best. I was so drunk and high when I first tasted it. Everything taste good when under the influence. The next morning when I woke up; I decided to taste it again ( considering it was my first time the previous day). I cannot explain how good it was. It made every body that stayed at the lodge go to the salmon run and fish. Everybody over fished that day. I had 17 salmon. Their was another 35 people who did the same thing. We over ate the following day. Good times. Wish I had that recipe. I also believe that your level one smoke is the best way to do it for the whole cook. Just when I thought I had everything dialed in. You pull me back in to experimenting. LOL I know this is long response but; if you are reading this and smoke salmon? Tell us your favorite seasoning. Mine is spice world salmon rub and spice world Pacific seafood mixed together with old bay. I first layer the salmon with butter and add the seasonings.
Makes sense (which explains why my pellet smoker has a low temp smoke mode). Thanks for sharing your knowledge Jeremy
I've got both a Weber smokey mountain and a pellet grill. Next brisket I do I might try building the bark and smokiness for the first half or so in my weber. Then I'll finish it off in my pellet with a cleaner burn. I wonder how that'll turn out.
I've heard in general the same thing, colder stuff absorbs smoke only until the product reaches a certain temperature. I think it was ~135 where the outside doesn't take much more. I could be wrong on that number but it's interesting that clean/ dirty fires are also a factor... I'll have to do some serious testing 😎
It seems to me that that is true but I think a lot more testing and 💰 has to be thrown at the problem
I have an Brinkman offset smoker and coverted the firebox to a burner with propane, I added a charcole basket which I fill with my favorite wood chunks, I light the bunner and dial in the perfect temperature. I get all the smoke I want, i also put a try of water inside the cook chamber. It works for me everytime.
Always one to strive for clear heat I’ve always freaked out when the stack started producing visible smoke, level 2, and when looking in the firebox the culprit is always the end of the stick that’s not quite as lit as the central portions. The reaction was always to move stuff around to heat up the end of the stick and stop the smoke. Now I don’t think I’ll worry so much about it. Thanks!
I’ve found we stress it because of the emphasis on not producing bad smoke. When I do long cooks there are periods of heavy smoke but not for long periods of time.
@@TheBond4574
The truth is, most cooks can stand "level 3" smoke for 10-15 minutes and have it not significantly effect the protein. Running "level 3" for an entire cook is a different issue.
I have the same reaction as you to seeing pillows of smoke. If I have to throw water on the fire or open/close vents? I would move the food until the smoke is at a level I consider safe to smoke at.
Me too man i agree!!!
Hi Jeremy, Long time viewer. I don't post a lot but decided to post my first question. We talk about a longer stack for better air flow and that produced cleaner smoke. At least it did for me. Once I did that I have the cleanest burning smoke. You cant even see it. That said I have noticed less smoke flavor. The questions are. Are we looking to shorten the stack now maybe to produce less clean smoke? Are we looking at leaving the long stack but maybe closing the stack more instead of keeping it wide open like Franklin suggests? Do we maybe use a longer stack and run that clean fire and then maybe pop in a few chunks to smolder in the beginning? Maybe we dont pre heat the logs so it can smolder a bit more? I just believe there might be so many ways of doing this instead of using the greener split or even chocking off the fire. Your thoughts?
I would leave the stack height. The draw is important for the second stage in cooking when you are trying to render fat. The initial portion is where we want greener wood and denser smoke. The draw is salary’s good. We just modify with the kind of wood, wood stacking, and positioning of the door/damper to achieve the right level of smoke
@@MadScientistBBQ thank you for your quick response. I have learned so much from your videos! Keep up the great work. I will certainly follow that advice on my next cook to get that perfect amount of smoke.
Jeremy, I've been watching your content for years and I'm glad I did; I learned a ton over time either directly or indirectly by questioning things, or wondering how to do things differently. You were not the only one recommending a clean fire at all times, so that's what I tried to do to my best of my capabilities and I was able to after getting familiar with my offset. Although, I must admit, while the food tasted great (clean or dirty, you can't beat the flavor an offset gives to the food) managing the fire was becoming a stressful chore rather than a nice, chill activity.
I happened on Jirby's channel and tried his relaxed approach to things, letting the fire do its thing without necessarily doing a ton of micromanagement to ensure a clean burn-not only did the food improve in flavor, but every cook became much more enjoyable with zero stress. The same happened last year once I dropped digital probes and relied on the Tel-Tru exclusively instead of chasing temps all day.
Truth to be told, I tried one turkey breast cook with the dirtiest fire I could muster: the turkey turned out just fine, but maintaining such a dirty smoke for hours required much more effort than just letting it be and do its thing where the first few minutes of combustion are smokier, then it becomes thin-blue, then transparent.
The smoke profile from letting this three-stage process happen naturally is just beautiful. That also means that it's best to let the fire die down and build another on the coal bed, rather than adding splits as it goes to maintain temps as constant as possible. If you haven't, give it a try!
this one really helpful cuz I've noticed with my Tritips on mt offset that there are times it has no smoke flavor (or very little) and I was was burning pure history wood and making sure the fire was as clean as possible. then the times I couldn't get it to burn clean and thought I ruined the TriTip it was amazing smoke flavor. so this makes a lot of sense. thank you
Jeremy. You've finally addressed an issue I've had with all of the advice on clean smoke. I've used "level 2" smoke and I've always enjoyed the taste better
Thanks.
Can you make a video on the same subject with a pellet grill. I'm expecting a smokefire gen 2 next week
Here's another reason I'm an advocate for using mesquite. You can burn a fairly clean fire using mesquite. But it's not hard to get great smoke flavor. When I first started taking smoking a little more seriously. Following most of the suggestions provided here on TH-cam. Using post oak. I wasn't completely happy with the smoke flavor. Here in south Texas we use a lot of mesquite. I went to what my Dad, Mom, Uncles ext, used when I was growing up. Mesquite. And that's what I was missing. Good ol great mesquite smoke flavor. I suggest giving it a try. You don't have to change much of what you've been doing. Just change your fuel source. My 2 cents. Hope it works for you as well.
Great point, mesquite is pretty good when running a very clean fire. However It is a bit more arduous to achieve clean fire with mesquite. It takes using smaller logs,
being fed more frequently. That is part of the fun of playing with fire. At times I cook with mesquite alone, other times I start with mesquite, then switch to something else after couple hours, introducing just a slight dirtier smoke, if using lighter tasting wood. Jeremy makes it sound like there is right and wrong. Cooking is an art, and one has to tweak and adjust
to fit their liking. It ain't about right and wrong. It is more about one's cooking skills.
Nuke, in Florida, we mostly use oak or Pecan. I run a very clean fire, I get the smoke flavor but it's not as strong as I like. I'm gonna try mesquite and run it clean. Thanks for the tip
I like mesquite cooked with an open flame like a campfire. If I'm using my off set smoker I like Pecan.
I'm in south Texas and I've heard bad things about mesquite, but I think it's misinformation. Next time I smoke some meat, I'm trying mesquite for sure. Thanks for the encouragement
But man is mesquite my least favorite wood of all
This is the content I have been desiring from MSBBQ!
Next we need a more comprehensive fire building video, the last one you did at Fatstack focused more on starting the fire then maintaining it. We need in depth take on wood selection, sizing, when to add wood, where you place the wood, etc.
I still consider myself a novice even though I’ve been smoking food for a couple of years now. I have experimented with chunks at different temps in my Chargriller offset. I have learned how to start cold with the right amount of wood chunks and fuel. Especially with my ribs that have become out of this world. Everything you’ve said is spot on. Love the videos.
One of the most informative videos you have done to date - Thank You!
I'm not even close to being on your level but I recently started running lower temps with more wood chunks early for smoke then bumping temps up with great results. I'm limited to a masterbuilt gravity smoker but it has been a great new process.
Keep up the great vids. Helping a lot of of 👍
Was going to comment the same. I started adding a lot more wood chunks lower in the chute on my Masterbuilt, right on top of the first few coals, then adding greener chunks into the ash hopper. Last brisket I did came out fantastic.
I wouldn’t call this a “BBQ Mistake”, hell I wouldn’t even say that you were wrong. You have a good and informative channel with what seems to be a sizable following. At the end of the day, good Q comes down to 2 things (3 if you have a business): How we were taught, what we are still willing to learn, and preference of your customers. My grandfather taught me one rule for the burn and it seems to work for me with either a stick or pellet burner. If you can’t see your smoke, just put it in the oven but if you can’t see THROUGH your smoke, just eat the wood instead (with the exception of a cold smoke of course)😂😂.
And I learned something from you when I found your channel. Just like you, I prefer the salt and pepper but some of the clientele like the rubs and It had never even occurred to me to add the salt separately when doing a rub and that was a MASSIVE game changer in the seasoning. Love your channel brother and Cook On!!!
Cooked a pork loin today and part way through I wrapped it in butcher paper with smoked lard. You taught me that trick for ribs but works great on loins as well! However my fire was to clean at the start so the ring wasn’t very prevalent. Love all your experiments and thanks for sharing !
Agree 💯. Got obsessed with chasing TBS & discovered I lost ALOT of smoke flavor doing so. Smoked Salmon one day, busy in the yard, lost track & smoke was mainly “level 2” every time I’d look accross the yard at it…probably the best Salmon I’ve ever had 🤣. This is absolutely the way I go now…not awesome clean smoke until later 👊🏻
I had read about this on Amazing Ribs but it's certainly nice to have a more visual reference, great work.
Thanks for this video. I learned this by accident. I was doing a brisket on a CharGriller 980 and after over an hour the smoke would not clear up. After putting my hand by the exhaust and smelling it I noticed it wasn’t bitter like I expected so I threw the brisket on. It eventually cleared up (I think the chunks of post oak I used were to large) but I noticed it had the best smoke flavor of anything I had cooked on the 980 up to that point. Since then I use the same method to determine when it’s time to put my food on.
It was the last thing I put time into learning - should've been the first. Fire management is so much more important than what's in your shaker bottle. I'm just now getting there - self taught for nearly four decades. Thankfully TH-cam has some great info and has helped me take it to the next level. I wish I'd learned early: Start with the fire and salt and pepper. Build your flavors after you figure that out.
So I have been cooking beef ribs correctly according to your methods in my bge xl. Semi dirty smoke in beginning w ribs a little cold then thin blue smoke after 3/4 hours.
I think a lot of this will be when the meat has enough surface moisture to be tacky, not wet, not dry. I remember learning this from a sausage short course at the ISU meat lab. Later in the cook you'll have a crust forming and a dry surface so that's why you can't get the smoke to penetrate.
That sounds like something I should test
This was from a company that makes liquid smoke extracts. He said the moisture level on the surface of the meat was the most important thing to smoke penetration and flavor.
@@Bradimus1 This is accurate. The smoke flavour compounds are water soluble, so if there's no moisture, you'll get little to no flavour.
I run lump charcoal in a serpentine pattern in my Hasty Bakes fire grate. It gives a burn time enough for a full brisket cook. In the first half of the coal pattern I place large fist size hickory chunks. Meat turns out phenomenal. The second half only gets lump for clean smoke to finish cook.
Sounds like the same principle on a different smoker
I do the same kind of method on a Weber Kettle. Snake briquette method with wood chunks for the first half of the cook and then none for the last half. Lower temps to start and working up to 270F for ribs, for example. I get great smoke flavor without overdoing it.
But doesn't that make dirty smoke? Chunks on charcoal for me on my grill has made puffy white smoke. Or is that OK if it burns one chunk at a time, i.e. not overwhelming? I haven't ruined anything, and I get smoke flavor, but my brain's paralyzed with the notion of perfect smoke. Maybe good is good enough.
@@tonybernard4444 Jeremy does a great job on wood pyrolysis. Green or “wet” wood takes time and btus to ignite. That lag time produces the heavy puffy “bad” smoke. You don’t want wood that’s kindling dry, you want wood that’s around 20% measures with a moisture meter. And you don’t want to smother the fire causing smoldering.
Thanks!!! Your videos are great. I have burned too clean of a fire recently and my briskets dont have much smoke flavor. Im going to try to go more smokey next time!
So using a smoke tube in a pellet grill for just the first few hours may provide more smoke flavor without getting bitter?
This video is on point. I have been waiting on my Weber Summit Charcoal for the smoke to be transparent to put meat on, and have had very lacklustre smoke flavour. I will try putting the meat on when it's still a bit dirty since it inevitably will go clean and remain that way.
I love your videos. Glad you actually tried it. Ppl fall into the trap of how things need to be bc some one says so. Everyone jumps on the band wagon. I didn't know about "dirty smoke" when i started cooking years ago. Ive tried both after learning about dirty vs clean. I can say ppl have picked the heavier smoked "dirty smoked" food over the other every time! It's a winner by a landslide . I get is personal preference, but ppl need to experiment and do their own thing. Learn on your own, don't be afraid to mess up. I glad you put this out there for those that want a little push. Growing up in South Texas, i never really heard of these terms to later on life and after moving from that area. Have fun enjoy grilling/smoking. Don't be afraid to get a lil "dirty"!
I have a WSM, but the majority of my smoking is in a Weber kettle. I start the charcoal, and almost immediately put the meat on. The smoke is the dirty smoke. As the meat is cooking, more of the coals ignite, and the smoke goes blue. For the last 1/3 of a cook, all the coals are lit, and burning clean, and I get no smoke. My chicken thighs and tri-tip always come out awesome. I agree with what you’re saying, some dirty smoke up front, some blue smoke in the middle, and clean burning at the end has worked for me.
Saying hey from across the 64 bridge in Indiana! My coworkers love the BBQ I've been bringing in thanks to your vids!
Thanks for this and all your videos, which have been a huge help to me. One question though: What do you do if your wood is too dry? Is there any way to "up" the moisture content?
Since at the wrapping stage you're not looking to add anymore smoke, I'd like to know how much of a taste difference there is (ribs/brisket) if you finish it off in the oven where you have a better control of temp. I wonder this because I have a cheapo smoker then does great adding smoke but lousy at high temp control for finishing.
Thank you so much for getting right to the point. I don’t always have a lot of time, and typically consume most of my TH-cam in the bathroom now… I also typically don’t comment on videos… Thank you. 🍖❤️
i have a memphis elite and i see smoke billowing out of it often.. seems to go in cycles, as you would expect as more fuel is added. i know that cooking on an offset is more OG and imparts more flavor than a pellet grill. but removing 1 aspect from the equation has really helped me not ruin food. thanks for the awesome vid as usual Jeremy.
I’ve always wanted to try mesquite in the beginning and then transitioning to a lighter hard wood such as oak/hickory/pecan to finish out. Same concept as starting out low and smokier to start out but you skip some of the acrid flavors of low combustion
For briskets, I always start out throwing an oak log on a bed of coals to get the pit up to temp, then use mesquite for this first four hours (protein won't take more than 4 hours of smoke). After that I transition back to oak, wrap at 170 and continue to fuel the fire with oak unless I have something else I'm throwing on that needs flavor.
Regardless of the "smoke levels" I always look for thin blue smoke coming out of my stack, that way I'm not feeding acrid tasting food to my guests, and most importantly - I'm not burping smoke the next few days.
My go to lately has been small handful of peach chips and one small piece of mesquite. Best way I can describe it is bourbon.
@@Barndoor98 I have a few peach slivers and just bought a long butt ton of mesquite, will have to give this a go.
Would love to see some videos on the cold smoking and cooking some other items (like the salmon or cheese)… also have you found a difference in using ‘green’ wood versus dried out wood that you wet?
Thanks, I’m doing my research before my first cook. I think I have an idea on how to make my propane smoker… smoke.. as good as it can. This is useful; I’ve heard many people say the smoke is important for the first three or four hours then you can finish it with clean fire. I recon wood chips will go farther than I had thought.
Great video! I completely agree with burning a dirtier fire at the beginning… the whole “maintain blue smoke the entire cook” isn’t ideal. I disagree that you use less wood with smoke level 1… more efficient combustion means you’re burning the wood faster. If you choke the fire more the wood will last quite a bit longer than a more open firebox door
Agreed. It takes more fuel to burn hotter (which translates to consuming wood faster) to achieve "clear smoke."
Can you do a video on resting times/temps for a mix of proteins, never sure what's best for each, thanks!
i prefer the clean burns, ive found my offset is too small to get a good fire going and i always get a slightly acrid taste. always get great results on the old Timberline pellet grill. Also im in the UK and we cant get decent wood easily
I own a BGE and you totally nailed it. A reasonable amount of chunks will do the job. In my first cooks I added like 6-7 chunks and it was way too smokey and bitter. Now I learned that 3 to 4 chunks strategically placed are plenty.
Wood chips is also another thing to experiment and learn just like wood chunks.
Most honest and real bbq video in a while.
The issue with pellet smokers is the volume of smoke produced. The firebox is typically tiny compared to the firebox of an offset so the amount of smoke produced is less. Newer programming in the nicer pellet grills are producing more smoke now when using higher quality pellets but people are still having to use smoke tubes or placing wood chunks on the heat deflector to get the desired level of smoke
I have a Cabelas pellet grill/smoker, I've learned that I have to cold smoke for about 4hrs 160-180 Degrees before going up to 220-225. If I don't I get little smoke flavor because whatever I'm smoking gets skinned over and wont let in any smoke. Thinking about trying a pan of water to keep things from skinning over.
You might look into creosote formation when burning wood. It is the bane of chimney sweeps and fire departments but also causes bitter flavors in smoked meats.
Would love to see a video on how you manage the fire and air intake to control the smoke to the levels that you’re talking about. I have a brazos and have a hard time keeping the temperature from getting too hot.
Good afternoon Jeremy! Can you do a video on cooking in drum smokers for us that have them? Thanks in advance man!
I would love to but I need to get one first!
@@MadScientistBBQ I recently purchased an Oklahoma Joe Bronco Pro and it was a bit odd taking tips from other TH-camrs 😂 Thanks for your spreading your knowledge with us!
An interesting experiment I did on my last bacon smoke was to set my chimney in the firebox with hot coals and put 1 log over the top of the chimney that burned at level 2 and dropped it in the chimney when the coals we’re burning down. I’ll go back to this method on smoking I wasn’t under 200 again! Of course new log on when the other goes down.
Appreciate the humility! That is a rare trait these days. Along similar lines, although I currently cook on the Brazos for the backyard and a 288 gallon with 3/8 inch steel for large events, I’ve produced some better quality BBQ on a cheap offset with flimsy metal because of the inefficiency. Essentially you have to burn more fuel and there is poor quality intake but if you tend the fire well, it is amazing.
When is the modified Brazos comparison video coming out?
This is also a LARGE part of the reason pellets don't produce the same type or amount of smoke you would get from a traditional smoker. I run a Woodwind Pro as my primary smoker, and I've found that using wood chunks with a bit of bark still on them makes a HUGE difference. There's more lignin in the bark, so you get a dirtier smoke than backless, but if you keep it burning instead of smoldering, it has excellent flavor. I spent a long time running offsets with my dad as a kid, and even running pellet grills, that fire management still has its uses. Great video.
I’d like to add that the whole smoke color thing, as presented here, applies very largely to a particular type of cooker/cooking: offset - whether in an offset pit or in the Weber kettle/egg type coals offset to one side (I.e. where meat is not above fire). For folks smoking in elevated pits (boxes or brick structures) or barrels (PBC, OKJ Bronco, Gateway, Hunsaker, etc.) or even, but to lesser degree, reverse flow offsets, maintaining this blue or clear ideal is not possible. Rendered fat burning in the coal bed of an open-style pit is part of the flavor and experience and will, definitely, generate visible smoke. The only way to avoid it is a shelf with a drip pan (like stock WSM - but not Harry Soo WSM method which is more barrel/open style).
You are absolutely correct, I smoked some chicken last night on my okj broncho, and my smoke was clean for about 30 mins, then it always changes once the fat starts dripping off your food. It never fails, thankfully on mine it usually doesn’t affect flavor too much
In most cases, Harry Soo uses the water pan but empty in the WSM. However, there is a video, Harry cooking a brisket hot and fast at 400 F with the water pan removed.
Agreed- I also had a problem with Hickory as a novice until I started making hotter smoke.
I was getting a sour/bitter flavor with it until I got my rig making hotter smoke you need a little fire sometimes
but not so much you go up in temp and "cook" the meat.
And, here I thought I was letting you down by letting my fire burn a little dirty, because it was still an open flame and it was easier to let it go than to keep messing with things that may or may not cause temperature spikes and the like. It still always turned out good, and now I know why. 👍
I learned a lot from you and jirby love the bbq community 🍻
I find my best smoke flavor occurs most in the spring and in the fall, winter is too cold here and summer is pretty hot so everything burns up quick.
That totally makes sense. I cold
Smoked a brisket and it turned amazing!
I have a pet barrel which is where I start my brisket on a low smoky heat for the first three hours then I move it over to my pellet smoker for the rest of the cook and it’s perfect.
Makes sense that colder meat would absorb more smoke. Never really thought about until I saw this video. Thank You for getting me to think about it
I made the same discovery a few years ago good to know I'm not crazy I start and a smoke level of 2.5 "according to you demonstration witch in amazing might I add" and and gradually clean it up as the cook goes ending at a level one.
When u say moderate amount of smoking wood in the wsm how many chunks deck of card sized would u use.... Thank you for this video majority of barbecue places I eat at have way too much smoke flavor I thought it was just me being over picky almost gives it a creosote flavor in my opinion
Thanks for this...I thought my taste buds were broken. As much as I wish I could do an offset, just not doable right now. I use a Weber natural gas with a smoker box using wood chucks...Indirect heat..and have created some great chicken, pork shoulder and ribs...too afraid to do brisket yet.
I’m using a wsm and I have trouble getting the heat once I put the pan in the temp drops hugely. But I’ve had huge success with dirty smoke especially with hickory.
I find that as long as you cook with dry wood chunks, you should be ok. I produce lots of white smoke with little problem. Only time I ever oversmoked was some extreme humidity screwed over my fire management and I had wild temperature swings.
I use a Webber kettle, usually burns kinda dirty, then throughout the cook, it's a level 2. Only when I add charcoal or wood, it gets dirty...
The trick is that you need to "cook" the dirty smoke on the meat for a few hours to remove the bitterness. So always add the new wood at the beginning. At least that's my experience. Smoke added at the end is bitter.
Good stuff. I'm not at the point of getting an offset smoker just yet. I've been using an SNS Kettle. To get the smoke flavor I want, I have to run it somewhere between level 2 and level 3 for the first 4 hours (give or take). Doing this, I've never had one turn out bitter or too smoky.
Yes I've noticed this with my pellet smoker, I'll make sure to just smoke it a few hours at the lowest setting and then do the rest of the cook like normal. Produces a very deep smoke ring and flavor.
Yeah it seems the same principle applies
Wouldn’t a slather and or rub also effect smoke absorption? Such as, if you use a slather of oil or an oil based product along with a rub higher in sugar, you are creating a barrier to good, deep smoke absorption.
Wasn’t mentioned in the video, but it does bear some consideration when starting the smoke process.
That’s actually a good point. I love rubbing the brisket with a little bit of tallow. Good oil/fat.
Honestly, I've never noticed a difference in smoke flavor due to binders or rubs. The starting temperature of the protein makes a much bigger difference. Cold surfaces at the start of a cook attract smoke more than warm(er) ones.
Awesome information as usual. Jeremy, I'm interested in your thoughts on that Pitts & Spitts pellet grill in the back. Can't wait to see some content on that!!
Love your informative videos. This one blew my mind. Trying this method next time I smoke 🇳🇿
Would love to see some WSM videos from you. It’s not as good as an offset but would be interested to know the tips and tricks to getting it close
Great video about different smoke levels. Very informative and I have a WSM so it was helpful!
OMG Thank You Sir! I've been thinking that smoke and fat combine to make an umami flavor that's what's so desirable about bbq. This particular video has me so excited about what I can make on my pit. I also need to look into cold smoking with my offset.
I caught your show with Knotty Wood Products and the cookoff, and I have to "Thank you" for opening the recommendation to what I say was a absolutely fantastic. My first smoke cook was with Knotty Wood Plum pellets and my wife and I could not believe the flavor and the juiciness of the chicken, just heaven. My next smoke cook was on my wife's birthday, actual day, when she and I were surprised, by a super surprise visit from her son and his family that flew in from Colorado and her sister from Claremont, CA., on her actual birthday. That evening I smoked two of the juiciest and most tender whole chickens with that plum pellet taste and the reviews were so fantastic and the compliments went on and on the next couple days. I also have cooked, watching your videos on Pork Butts, many of them wanting more and more anytime I can, hint, hint, hint. from the refuse man , next door neighbors and even the guy that repairs my radiators. Thanks Again. Woody of Woody's Urban Forestry Products Sacramento ,CA
I use lumpwood charcoal for my fuel and to get that smoke flavour I have a smoke tube that I fill with wood chips...One fill of it produces enough smoke at the beginning of the cook to be perfect everytime...
I think you've created a new scale for types of smoke! Excellent concept and explanation!
Thanks 🙏
I Learning a lot form you :)
May GOD bless you :)
That’s exactly what I was doing in the pellet smoker is the same way :(
I was smoking for a couple hours on one 160-180 for a couple hours then run to 235 - 245 :)
My offset smoker it’s not finished yet so I’ll try it see how it works
This video changed everything for me last year when I watched it. I was making the same mistake without realizing it.