Great video as always Ken! Glad I could help out by providing a good magneto candidate for showing common and uncommon problems! It will be nice to have back on the tractor!
Kenny Kizzle Happy to support the business! Can’t go wrong with how good the work is! Although the only problem is I’m out of magnetos needing rebuilt (good for me bad for you)!!
i love your test bench with the spark gap tester. i gave away the ones i have built lately.. i use 8, autolite 45 spark plugs.. i lay them on the welding table. adjust the rotation so the gaps are all facing the same way.. weld them together at the tips of the hexes. flip them over and weld the tips of the hexes on the other side.. some times i do 4 at a time and make a bank of 2 rows of 4. i use 45s as i can usually get spark plug wires on them.. especially when i weld the hexes tip to tip.. i weld a bracket with a small hole to attach a ring terminal and a piece of wire with a gator clip to hook to the engine ground.. now i can unplug all the spark plug wires at the installed spark plugs and move them all to this rack of spark plugs.. i can then position it so i am NOT HOLDING it.. and get somebody to crank the engine.. i can now check spark at the ends of all the wires.. i have welded them to brackets to make them up for late model ford six coil packs and dodge V6 coil packs. i usually widen the gap on these or use spark plugs that have .060" gaps.. as individual coil segments can fail on DIS coil packs that are waste spark setups. did you know that in cases of emergency.. you can seal cracks in distributor caps with Clear silicone gasket maker. i blew a hole in my toyota with integral coil distributor cap.. put some clear on it.. forgot about it for 15,000 miles. nothing can beat a new cap.. but if you have to coat the inside of a cracked or corroded cap with some clear silicone RTV.. you are ahead of the game..
Sounds like a great amount of "engine-uity" here! Thanks for sharing the ideas! Rudy actually has several test benches in his shop, along with many other testing devices (coil testers, magnet recharging, etc.). In a pinch, a little silicone can go a long ways! Thank you for sharing this with us, Wayne!
I have been curious about this very subject, and REALLY enjoyed this instruction video. If/when I ever get one of these engines...my mag is going to YOU to rebuild!
i was fortunate enough to work for an IH dealer in the 70s that had a sun mag distributor tester it could test distributors and mags i was taught how to use it. it was so old it used D batteries it was required shop equipment for the dealers to repair mags on the old internationals and newer farmall tractors. it was the only one in my county so the shop rebuilt most of the magnetos regardless of tractor brand they came from. there was another one sitting in the corner that the tester section was worn out. ..but you could still test the mags on it for spark.
Yessir! This knowledge and the tools are VERY good to have when it comes to magnetos. Most magnetos operate on the same principles, and have somewhat similar designs. The very early magnetos (like the Edison Splitdorfs, etc.) are quite a challenge to rebuild. I try to learn as much from Rudy as I can, but he has so much knowledge that it is hard to retain it all! I'll keep learning as long as I can, though!
I have only learned how to do it with the coil test bench in Rudy's shop. I have tried to learn how to use a volt meter, but unfortunately I was never good with electrical symbols! Ha ha ha.
Yeah the thing with Rachel's videos is that they really just kinda hit a few of the highpoints and don't really show you anything. They better than nothing at times depending on what someone might be looking for. I've learned more from your channel on past projects for me, so just want to say thanks!
They have great videos, but as you stated... There are a lot of other problems that can be found and addressed that typically aren't covered in many of the videos that are out there. I try to be as detailed as I can in my videos (or at least back track and talk about things that I may have missed). Glad my channel has helped you, bud! You're welcome!
The coil has two windings, low voltage and high voltage, I have used a 6 volt battery with the points and condenser, worked points with fingers and got a spark at the plug.
You can set it up to run like a distributor, but it's much more effective to run it as it should be. Many people have installed an external coil and set it up that way, though.
That is what I call a REAL test bench setup Kenny. Thanks for all the good info. Can I assume the JI Case mag on my Case SC is very similar to what Farmall uses? My tractor runs fairly well, but suffers from an occasional miss. The valve train is in good rebuilt condition, and the carb is rebuilt, new plugs also, which leads me to suspect the magneto.
An occasional miss or pop through the exhaust is pretty normal on the old four cylinders. The Case mags are very good mags but parts can be scarce. The coils are one of the bigger headaches, they are very unique and are no longer available unless you find an NOS coil. Rudy has his methods to retrofitting a newer coil into them, though.
How do you typically bench test a magneto? I just did some work on a 10-20 in NC (my tractor is at my dad's farm in GA) and want to make sure it is working before I return. Thanks
I usually clamp the magneto in my vice. and take one of the spark plug wires and ground it to the mag body. Turn it over by hand and see what you get for spark. You can also put a drill on it and turn it over fast to see if you are also throwing spark at high RPM. At Rudy's shop we have a few devices that we mount the mag in to test them.
Hey, I’ve been working on my magneto for awhile now and still cannot figure out why it will not spark. It snaps when you spin the impulse side. I have replaced the coil and condenser. Polished everything, and set the gap at .015. I was wondering if you had any idea of what could be wrong. I was also wondering if I mailed it to you if you would be able to fix it for me. If you could, I would be curious on how much you charge. I hope you have a great day, thanks!
Hello, Justin. It could be that the magnets are weak on the rotor and they need recharging. Could be a grounding issue inside the magneto as well. You can definitely send it in to Rudy's shop and we can get it operating perfectly. Shop fee minimum is $55. Visit www.rebuiltmags.com and you can find all the information there for mailing. Make sure to put your contact information inside the box, please!
@@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch the magnets are extremely strong still as it can hold up a wrench. If it is a $55 minimum how much does it usually Cost to repair?
@@justinrhomberg7710 it really depends on what we find. We have had condensors that are bad out of the box. In rare occasions we've found faulty coils. Did you replace the cap, rotor, points, and coil cover? You mentioned cleaning things up and replacing the condensor and coil.
@@justinrhomberg7710 well, there's gotta be something going on in there. My guess would be grounding out somewhere, or either the cap or coil cover is faulty.
Thanks, Hyatt! I am no master, but I am learning FROM the master! Ha ha! I generally can do a complete restore on an H4 (including sandblasting) in about 2-2.5 hours. Connors' mag took about that simply because I had to clean it off before even opening it up. There was a LOT of grease and dirt on the outside!
It's possible, but it's likely more of an impulse spring issue, coil, points, condenser, weak magnets, or could even be a worn catch pawl pin in the flange. Does it have a tough time hand cranking or electric start, or even pull starting?
No. It should work consistently. Most likely the spring in the impulse is weak or broken, or the catch pin and pawls are worn on the impulse drive unit.
Used ones are available, but I'm not sure if new ones are. You might be able to find NOS springs. You could give Rudy a call on Monday. We have plenty of good used ones!
Not typically, but if they haven't been oiled regularly or if they've been subject to a lot of moisture they can have pitting in them and the bearing races.
Great video as always Ken! Glad I could help out by providing a good magneto candidate for showing common and uncommon problems! It will be nice to have back on the tractor!
Glad you liked the video and thanks for giving us a little more business!
Kenny Kizzle Happy to support the business! Can’t go wrong with how good the work is! Although the only problem is I’m out of magnetos needing rebuilt (good for me bad for you)!!
@@ThisOldFarm We definitely appreciate it, and are more than happy to help. We have plenty of magnetos on the shelf waiting for service as well!
i love your test bench with the spark gap tester. i gave away the ones i have built lately.. i use 8, autolite 45 spark plugs.. i lay them on the welding table. adjust the rotation so the gaps are all facing the same way.. weld them together at the tips of the hexes. flip them over and weld the tips of the hexes on the other side.. some times i do 4 at a time and make a bank of 2 rows of 4. i use 45s as i can usually get spark plug wires on them.. especially when i weld the hexes tip to tip.. i weld a bracket with a small hole to attach a ring terminal and a piece of wire with a gator clip to hook to the engine ground.. now i can unplug all the spark plug wires at the installed spark plugs and move them all to this rack of spark plugs.. i can then position it so i am NOT HOLDING it.. and get somebody to crank the engine.. i can now check spark at the ends of all the wires.. i have welded them to brackets to make them up for late model ford six coil packs and dodge V6 coil packs. i usually widen the gap on these or use spark plugs that have .060" gaps.. as individual coil segments can fail on DIS coil packs that are waste spark setups.
did you know that in cases of emergency.. you can seal cracks in distributor caps with Clear silicone gasket maker. i blew a hole in my toyota with integral coil distributor cap.. put some clear on it.. forgot about it for 15,000 miles. nothing can beat a new cap.. but if you have to coat the inside of a cracked or corroded cap with some clear silicone RTV.. you are ahead of the game..
Sounds like a great amount of "engine-uity" here! Thanks for sharing the ideas! Rudy actually has several test benches in his shop, along with many other testing devices (coil testers, magnet recharging, etc.). In a pinch, a little silicone can go a long ways! Thank you for sharing this with us, Wayne!
Happy i found this channel never too old to learn from a good teacher!
Very glad to hear you enjoy the channel - plenty here to see! I try to educate as best I can with the resources I have!
I have been curious about this very subject, and REALLY enjoyed this instruction video. If/when I ever get one of these engines...my mag is going to YOU to rebuild!
Thanks, Kent! Glad you enjoyed it! They are a GREAT magneto, very simple, but can be scary for someone who has never worked on one!
i was fortunate enough to work for an IH dealer in the 70s that had a sun mag distributor tester
it could test distributors and mags i was taught how to use it. it was so old it used D batteries
it was required shop equipment for the dealers to repair mags on the old internationals and newer farmall tractors. it was the only one in my county so the shop rebuilt most of the magnetos regardless of tractor brand they came from. there was another one sitting in the corner that the tester section was worn out. ..but you could still test the mags on it for spark.
Yessir! This knowledge and the tools are VERY good to have when it comes to magnetos. Most magnetos operate on the same principles, and have somewhat similar designs. The very early magnetos (like the Edison Splitdorfs, etc.) are quite a challenge to rebuild. I try to learn as much from Rudy as I can, but he has so much knowledge that it is hard to retain it all! I'll keep learning as long as I can, though!
I have a Rudy Calin H4 rebuilt on my 46 A, best purchase I have made in a long, long time.
Yessir! Rudy is the MAN! He is teaching me the "ways".
Nice overview Kenny. Thanks for sharing!
You're welcome, Matt! Hopefully this helps a lot of people in identifying problem areas in their H4's!
The impulse end of the magneto, just be prepared for a tight fight with disassembly . A slide hammer/ puller worked for me .
Slide hammer would work. We have a special puller that Rudy hade made. Works very well!
I have always been able the check my coils with the ohms scale on my volt meter.
I have only learned how to do it with the coil test bench in Rudy's shop. I have tried to learn how to use a volt meter, but unfortunately I was never good with electrical symbols! Ha ha ha.
Yeah the thing with Rachel's videos is that they really just kinda hit a few of the highpoints and don't really show you anything. They better than nothing at times depending on what someone might be looking for. I've learned more from your channel on past projects for me, so just want to say thanks!
They have great videos, but as you stated... There are a lot of other problems that can be found and addressed that typically aren't covered in many of the videos that are out there. I try to be as detailed as I can in my videos (or at least back track and talk about things that I may have missed). Glad my channel has helped you, bud! You're welcome!
Some really good sparkalators on that magneto.
I wish the camera frame rate could capture every spark, but you can hear it SNAPPING across those gaps!
@@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch i saw them plain as day.
@@ericcorse I could see a few but it is difficult for the camera to show every jolt.
What is the voltage that a good coil produces?
The coil has two windings, low voltage and high voltage, I have used a 6 volt battery with the
points and condenser, worked points with fingers and got a spark at the plug.
You can set it up to run like a distributor, but it's much more effective to run it as it should be. Many people have installed an external coil and set it up that way, though.
Thanks for the excellent video.
You're welcome!
That is what I call a REAL test bench setup Kenny. Thanks for all the good info. Can I assume the JI Case mag on my Case SC is very similar to what Farmall uses? My tractor runs fairly well, but suffers from an occasional miss. The valve train is in good rebuilt condition, and the carb is rebuilt, new plugs also, which leads me to suspect the magneto.
An occasional miss or pop through the exhaust is pretty normal on the old four cylinders. The Case mags are very good mags but parts can be scarce. The coils are one of the bigger headaches, they are very unique and are no longer available unless you find an NOS coil. Rudy has his methods to retrofitting a newer coil into them, though.
@@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch Thanks Kenny.
@@tigerseye73 anytime bud!
Thanks Kenny, great information 👍
Glad you enjoyed. Hopefully many find it helpful.
Awesome! I’ll have to send you mine!
We will gladly lake care of you!
How do you typically bench test a magneto? I just did some work on a 10-20 in NC (my tractor is at my dad's farm in GA) and want to make sure it is working before I return. Thanks
I usually clamp the magneto in my vice. and take one of the spark plug wires and ground it to the mag body. Turn it over by hand and see what you get for spark. You can also put a drill on it and turn it over fast to see if you are also throwing spark at high RPM. At Rudy's shop we have a few devices that we mount the mag in to test them.
Hey, I’ve been working on my magneto for awhile now and still cannot figure out why it will not spark. It snaps when you spin the impulse side. I have replaced the coil and condenser. Polished everything, and set the gap at .015. I was wondering if you had any idea of what could be wrong. I was also wondering if I mailed it to you if you would be able to fix it for me. If you could, I would be curious on how much you charge. I hope you have a great day, thanks!
Hello, Justin. It could be that the magnets are weak on the rotor and they need recharging. Could be a grounding issue inside the magneto as well. You can definitely send it in to Rudy's shop and we can get it operating perfectly. Shop fee minimum is $55. Visit www.rebuiltmags.com and you can find all the information there for mailing. Make sure to put your contact information inside the box, please!
@@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch the magnets are extremely strong still as it can hold up a wrench. If it is a $55 minimum how much does it usually Cost to repair?
@@justinrhomberg7710 it really depends on what we find. We have had condensors that are bad out of the box. In rare occasions we've found faulty coils. Did you replace the cap, rotor, points, and coil cover? You mentioned cleaning things up and replacing the condensor and coil.
@@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch I haven’t replaced those parts, but I polished the points and cap.
@@justinrhomberg7710 well, there's gotta be something going on in there. My guess would be grounding out somewhere, or either the cap or coil cover is faulty.
thanks for the info. keep up the good work.
Thanks, Bob! Will do!
Excellent
Thanks, Joel!
Enjoyed your video, Ken! You are definitely the master of magnetos. How long did it take to put Connor’s magneto back together? 🚜👍
Thanks, Hyatt! I am no master, but I am learning FROM the master! Ha ha! I generally can do a complete restore on an H4 (including sandblasting) in about 2-2.5 hours. Connors' mag took about that simply because I had to clean it off before even opening it up. There was a LOT of grease and dirt on the outside!
Can the impulse dogs being lazy, by that i mean the paul spring being weak. Can it cause problems for the tractor to start?
It's possible, but it's likely more of an impulse spring issue, coil, points, condenser, weak magnets, or could even be a worn catch pawl pin in the flange. Does it have a tough time hand cranking or electric start, or even pull starting?
It's been starting the last few times I would use it it has new points condenser,coil,cap the impulse clicks when I crank it.
It's getting spark cuz it zapped the crap out of me when I was checking 😂
But I did notice the last time I took the mag off the tractor the dog kinda moves around under the impulse coupling
Very Informative
Thank you, glad you enjoyed!
Does it make sense for the Impulse to work occasionally?
No. It should work consistently. Most likely the spring in the impulse is weak or broken, or the catch pin and pawls are worn on the impulse drive unit.
Kenny, are the impulse springs available? I have a mag that has a broken impulse spring. Thanks
Used ones are available, but I'm not sure if new ones are. You might be able to find NOS springs. You could give Rudy a call on Monday. We have plenty of good used ones!
@@KennyKizzleRustyNutzRanch Thanks
@@rollieevans6292 you're very welcome!
Are the bearings prone to going bad?
Not typically, but if they haven't been oiled regularly or if they've been subject to a lot of moisture they can have pitting in them and the bearing races.
Kenny Kizzle Rusty Nutz Ranch ok thank you, I enjoy your videos!
@@timothykoller5210 Thank you, glad you enjoy!
How much does it cost to fully rebuild one
300 outright or you can send us your core and we have them ready to go for 250 exchange.
Can u rebuild mine let me know
Yes we can. Visit us at www.rebuiltmags.com
👍
You are very knowledgeable but not good at doing videos. You should consider a script or talking over the video so do not have to talk when filming.
I try to do lists with key talking points to hit. Some videos I will do narration over the top. I appreciate the pointers.