This channel is gold. I discovered it by accident when I was desperately looking for a video about writing that would help me out of my art block, and then I found Mr. Glenn Gers and almost cried because he expertly discussed all my pain poins. I cannot express how much watching these videos helped me handle my suffering, frustration and resignation. I love writing, it's my passion even though I do it for fun. I want to do it, it's my happy place and yet sometimes I feel at loss and toss around the scenes not knowing what is not working and why it's not working. Thanks to Mr. Glenn I know it now so THANK YOU!! You helped me heal my inner artist :)
My first draft of my script is my treatment (I don’t write treatments). It usually comes in around 40 pages. On the second draft, I outline and write the script from memory. I create the feeling of already writing a script. Of course, I don’t remember everything but I do recall major points that propelled the story forward. I learned this technique when my computer wiped out my first draft and had to start all over again. I also decided to abandon my old notes. I start off fresh.
Glenn, I watch and learn all the time from all of your videos - and many many many are repeat watchings. But I'm a lurker, so THANK YOU for so much that has helped me keep on track. I'm concentrating on fiction with a sideline of scripting. Thank you. (The outlining with making a scene list, and Thinking in Scenes are among my favorites.)
Thank YOU for lurking! Lurking is a completely legitimate mode of behavior here and I welcome it. And thank you even more for letting me know you do it, and that it helps you!!
This video is amazing because it shows us that rewriting is not just about deleting and rewriting but also about testing and experimenting. There's another thing that could help you writers, is to try to write the scene or the short story multiple times in different pages or Word files, so you have more scenarios in front of you that you can choose one that is good for the story you want to tell, or take the good things from every one of them and combine them in one story. Now Go Write something! Thank you for this amazing video.✨
Again, you're batting a thousand. When I started out, I was unaware how much rewriting is necessary. 90% of the work I do is rewriting, and 10% is drafting. That was a surprise, something I never would have expected. Drafting is sort of allowing your unconscious mind (which is where 100% of all creativity comes from) to tell you (your conscious mind) what to write in real time, off the cuff. It's a little like being a stenographer. Some voice, somewhere, is instructing you on what to put on the page. It feels like it's coming from outside of you (it isn't). Even so, it's a blast, much more fun than rewriting. Rewriting means you have to put your editor hat on and view things from your conscious mind while also trying to impersonate the objective POV of 'the reader'. Rewriting is actually editing. You have to master the skill of editing to help you master the skill of writing. You can try to reject that idea, but the truth is, that IS the truth. There are no shortcuts. Screenwriters typically plot. They use outlines. If you do, it might seem to you that starting without an outline and only making outlines after the drafting phase, would be putting the cart before the horse. But I'm a pantser at heart. I approach everything that way, and it keeps my creativity from being corralled and hemmed in by previous conscious choices and concepts. I also fix things as I go. It's true that fixing things that will eventually be cut will not contribute to the finished product, but I've found that doing that does help you get better at writing and fixing what will eventually be in the finished product, so I think of that as road work, meaning it does have value. It's just part of the hard work needed to be done to learn how to get better at writing. But while I approach things from the POV of a pantser and begin there, much of what I do is what a plotter does, only it's done after the fact, which is a way of verifying what is written and a way of holding a larger portion of the story in my head, seeing things from the 10,000-ft level rather than from the myopic vision I have while in drafting mode. I just do it after the drafting, rather than before. So I'm a 'reverse plotter'. It works. It works for me, and there's no reason that can't work for everyone.
I'm glad it works for you! I'm also glad you've shared it. Maybe it will work for some, maybe not for others. That's okay. That's the whole method of this channel: try things out and see if they work for you.
This channel has helped me immensely. He called out my bad habits and gave me solutions. Thank you. I hope this helps someone else. I always felt like a failure if my outline wasn’t filled in completely. Nothing ever got done. Now, I bounce around and it’s fun. Like, a big word puzzle. Then the scenes pop in your head randomly. The characters start demanding things. I had never had that. I stopped and didn’t give them a chance. Completely changed my life. The passes thing gave me permission and helped me figure out what to focus on each pass. He took all the structure gave me a game-plan. I will be forever grateful. Also, NOW GO WRITE SOMETHING
Oh, gosh - this is so wonderful for me to read! Exactly what I dreamed someone would get from my work. Thank you so much for sharing it here. Let's both go write something!
I agree with you 99% of the time, Glenn. That is almost unheard of. This vid is one we should watch over and over. I don't actually disagree with you on one little point that I'm going to mention, but I'm concerned that certain people might not really understand. Buried in tons of really good information, you said something to the effect of, 'then you're just polishing'. Two days later, that made my ears perk up. I know you don't mean anything negative by that. And you're right: From the point of view of a screenwriter, polishing is really not all that important. Plot and character are much more important than the exact line-by-line wording in dialogue, or even in narrative. Polishing might still be important, but most of the polishing is done by head writers, showrunners, rewriters, directors, producers, sometimes even by actors themselves. Typically by people other than those who drafted the original script version, who regardless of how well-polished the line-by-line writing might be, think they know better than the writer (and some do), and have the power to exert their own ideas over those of the screenwriter. So to rub nine layers of carnauba wax on a screenplay regarding the exact wording might be no more effective than rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. Your channel is entitled 'Writing for Screens', and while primarily directed at screenwriters, some of us are novelists who may never desire to be screenwriters, but who realize that we can learn a lot from you. You are a novelist yourself, and I'm sure you understand things the way we do. Walking in those shoes is how we all learn these things. But about polishing … Story Grid Publishing stopped accepting submissions a couple years ago. They'd created rigid hoops for writers who submitted to them to go through based on craft, technique, structure, order, and closely following their concepts of story creation, including that submissions also required detailed spreadsheets and X-Y diagrams created by the writer, proving they were following their instructions-a bar to entry to even get the manuscript looked at. Their thinking was sound, and I've learned tons of things from them regarding craft, technique, structure, and order. There are some really talented, creative, smart folks in that family. But the dozens of submissions they got were still not good enough to publish, we were told sometime back (I have yet to submit), even if crafted precisely the way they prescribed. Accepting submissions then came to a screeching halt. Today it was candidly revealed that the reason they stopped taking submissions was that while writers were following their instructions regarding craft and technique to the letter, THE LINE-BY-LINE WRITING WAS JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH. Line-by-line writing is not really something that pertains to craft or technique. Line-by-line is more in the domain of art and the unconscious mind, a place where words or conscious explicit thinking have little or no impact, so it's difficult to put in words or to teach. Maybe impossible. And Story Grid never really attempted to teach it. That's fine, and it makes sense. What this underlines is something very important to fictional writing which is different than scriptwriting, and what that is, is polishing. Good line-by-line writing is one of the most important things in written fiction, because we are tasked with creating the entire movie in the theater of the mind of the reader. We are the last 'creative' force before hand-off so they can read a story in written fiction and see that movie in their mind. And since there is no concrete visual expression that is tangible or viewable like an actual movie, how it will be perceived is highly dependent on the quality of the line-by-line writing. Anyone who has ever read a novel instinctively knows this (as do publishers). Polishing is just one more necessary thing among the many that contribute to the quality of the line-by-line. Some of us have the ability, some of us don't, some of us acquire it. It can be learned, but it's not really something that can be taught, or mimicked. Some will do the hard work necessary to learn it, some won't. It can take numerous editing passes to get things the way they ought to be. And as I continue to say, there really are no shortcuts. You must do the hard work to get there. For a novelist, that includes polishing. It can never be 'one and done' or 'three passes then paint it and ship it'. I don't want to swerve too far from what your viewers expect. Please disagree with or ignore or remove this comment if you feel it doesn't belong here. I think it's good information for both screenwriters and novelists to understand, and I hope you'll see it in the spirit of it being a contribution. But that's just me.
No need to remove your opinion - it's a fine opinion. I don't disagree. It's just not what I meant. I just meant there's a slightly different type of writing one does when one is just messing with ("perfecting") the language or making small changes. You get to apoint where you have decided the big issues, and then you're just making that better. The Industry definition of "polish" is an entirely different thing...which no one can really define. It means "a small rewrite" but exactly what is or is not included in that is always just a matter of who has the power to demand more changes and who has the power to refuse.
@@writingforscreens Okay. Sometimes communication is hard due to words not always having clear definitions. Writers are not typically happy about that, but it's just the way it has to be, because language is not perfect. 'Polishing' is a pretty precise word in most circumstances, and is more precise than its synonyms. But it also has an inborn negative connotation, that 'to polish' might be sometimes the wrong path to take and might be sort of useless to do. When words are like that, the best choice is still to choose that more precise word to achieve clarity, but connotations in a word can work against that, regardless how good our intentions for clarity might be. I do think I got your message in the video with the clarity you intended. I just hoped everyone did. And I do consider you very adept at clarity, which is one of the strengths of your videos that give them value.
Thanks, Glenn. It is a very important message. They're judging your work, not you. If I had known any better, I would've reacted a lot better to the criticisms. It's gold, Glenn.
Thank you very much for this video. I recently sent in some work with someone and got some feedback which shocked me. Not to get into it, I knew it had problems, but the severity of those problems took me. How you reframed rewriting actually gives me the confidence to undertake this process. For rewriting is that; a part of the creative process. I need to learn that works in their outlining/ creative phrases are flexible and are subject to change during the process. And that is ok. I also adore how you say to take things one step at a time and break up tasks. I'm a web developer and that's something within tech we always say; for large projects you need to stay organized and break things down. Make tangible goals that you can hit. My process on reflection was messy and I'm hoping the next time it will be smoother. All in all, thank you for the video and I hope you have a wonderful father's day weekend.
A piece of advice that has stuck with me, is to wait at least 48 hours after getting feedback before making any changes. The idea was to just sit with that disappointment or frustration, and let yourself experience it (not suppress emotions) and create a little distance from your first response to the feedback. Maybe the feedback is just from a perspective that doesn't 'get' what you wrote?
"Don't be afraid to kill your darlings" is how I've heard the phrase. I have done. It sucked. I think it's supposed to. That's good. I think. P.S. The bloopers are great! 😂
Awesome - thanks Glenn! I used to view rewrites as akin to getting up on stage and talking for an hour - with the same sense of dread. But thanks to you, and lots of rewriting, I feel it's the chance to really dive into the juice of the work and make it the best it can be. One quick question - do you ever get that sense of urgency with writing - like "Oh, I'd better get this done fast, or I might die before I get to share it with the world"?
"It's done when everything you need to fix you can't fix yet." - I'm not sure about that one. Sometimes you can't fix it in that moment, and then you sleep on it, go work on a different project, or take a vacation, and you come back to the work with fresh eyes, more insight, or a better idea. So maybe even when you can't fix something yet you're not really done. Maybe a work is never really done, but you could get to a stage where you can let it go, or have to let it go, and move on... maybe to later come back to it after all.. or maybe not.
Yes, I agree! That's what "yet" is all about: maybe you can't see anything wrong with it and you have to set it aside for a while and see it with fresh eyes...or maybe you know something's wrong but can't figure out what to do at the moment. So: I think "can't fix yet" is just a another way of saying exactly as you said.
Great wisdom; you always provide different ways to approach a subject, and tactics to prevent us from tripping ourselves up or getting frustrated! After looking at the 'Story Grid' principle of rewriting, I got into the habit of making spreadsheets with every single scene. That way I can see the whole story on one page, make changes, and then go into my manuscript document and shuffle scenes around or make notes on what to add, or where I'm repeating myself. I think recording yourself reading your work and listening to it can be really helpful. It's much easier to notice when something is dragging or out of place, and it can spark new ideas. What do you do (apart from persevere) when you've made multiple revisions or passes and you feel conflicted between what you wanted it to be initially and what you have now? I mean to say, is there a way to test if you've made things needlessly complex or bloated? I wonder if I'm actually losing emotional impact and making things less cohesive.
You have to let go of what you wanted it to be - thought it was going to be - wish it was. You have to work with and love what it is. That's an inevitable step in creating anything, I believe. Sometimes that means not looking at it for a while, maybe - even setting it aside and throwing yourself into a different project. That's usually how I am able to look at something and see what it is: when I have given up on it for a while. As far as needlessly complex: well that's a whole different question. The issue is "needlessly." Maybe it needs to be complex. BUT: you can lose emotional impact if it's so complex that people can't track the characters' stories, remember or understand their desires and problems. Once again: all I can say is - for me, setting it aside and coming back is how I see that. (Of course, I'm working on a novel I started 30 years ago so maybe I'm not a good advisor on this...) That and: asking the right questions, which it seems like you're doing. If you're worried about it being emotionally weaker - examine it in those terms. The biggest problem then is: do you feel upset or unhappy when you have to make changes based on your "new" priority (in this case, emotion and clarity). If so: are you clinging to some idea of what it is "supposed" to be, at the expense of what it is? Just keep asking, and trying out different ways to solve it. That's all I can advise.
@@writingforscreens Thanks, Glenn! That's what I needed to hear. I think I've accepted it's never going to totally satisfy me, or feel finished. To some extent, I have slowly let go of many preconceptions about what it 'should be', and I want to be bold with it, not scared, whatever direction that is (or at least I tell myself that I want to...). It is really personal, which is part of the problem. And I think I'm envisioning something that's beyond my actual technical capability and a little uncomfortable, but if I were to scale it back, I don't think that would be any fun for me to write. I do have multiple different directions I can take it, with plenty of potential, IMO. I really want it to be distinctive (even weird in a way) and have strong voice, but I don't think that's something I need to let go of, is it? That to me seems more like an overarching career aspiration, than an expectation. I think the answer is to write more, grow as a writer, and then return to this. At the same time, it doesn't need more perspective. I want it as raw as it can be, not filtered or distant. I think I have to prioritise emotional impact. No point in being clever if the reader doesn't care. I suppose I should prioritise entertainment and connection and let how 'clever' it is take care of itself, and let the reader find it clever, or not..... depending on what they are looking for in a story. Hmm, that's a great question... I suppose I feel unhappy, or certainly frustrated, by the idea of playing it too safe. I wrote a synopsis and outline for an editor to get feedback, which was largely negative in fundamental ways, which was crushing. But OK, I probably needed that. I kept refining the synopsis, to the point it was quite a different thing to the last draft (not that it bothered me). I don't really know if the problem is the inability to express the ideas in my head in the manuscript, or the just the synopsis changes didn't get it across clearly, or the editor just didn't get it. Or all of the above. I do feel confident that whole experience is going to ultimately help. It was rather meandering, but then it was 'supposed' to be that (although the prose itself is intended to be taut and witty, if that makes sense). It's around 70k words, so it's not a problem of being too long per se, but perhaps too many separate ideas not fully explored. I suppose ultimately I want to find a way to keep that meandering spirit, but in more grounded scenes and clearer momentum. And I think perhaps the way to do that is weave backstory and exposition into the core scenes and remove redundant scenes. I think even if I aim to make it taut and grounded, it's probably still going to end up with some tangental charm. So I suppose I answered my own question. I'm thinking about writing 3 short stories in different styles, and then returning to this project.
A side question Is it common that I don't enjoy writing TV series as much as screenplays? A good eligible screenwriter should be good at both, shouldn't they?
If you don't enjoy it, you probably shouldn't do it. Yes: currently there seems to be more work in series than features. But there's even more work in something like home health care nursing, and you're not considering that. Just do what you believe you do well.
Hey! So I have a BIG problem. I have written 2 screenplays (both written last year). I haven´t even dare to open them again. I did send them to a couple of friends to read it so I can have some fresh eyes and perspective and they haven´t done so. I am a bit terrified of opening it and working on them. I am better trying to think of a new story to write, maybe a short film so I can shoot. The second part of the problem is I live in Mexico, not even Mexico city and I have zero connections, so even if I get the script to a good point (that IF they are any good) I wouldn't know what to do with them. SO I am very stuck. Any advise?
Okay, that's definitely two separate problems. So let's look at them separately: Re: Mexico - if you are trying to find a way to work in Hollywood, then that's a whole series of steps for you. You'd have to be willing to move there. There are many many websites and online magazines and videos about "making it" in the American film biz, I am not really a good advisor for that because my advice would be: don't. Work where you are, find out what kind of work can be done as an indie in your own reality. Technology allows ANYONE ANYWHERE to make films or series, and get them out to the public - on their own or through festivals, contests, etc. Study that. If you want to shoot a short - you can do that, wherever you are! Start learning how. Look into "indie film" and "no-budget." The reality is: you need to do the work, over and over, where you are - before you can really think much about making money at art. Okay, so that's one side of the story, and that's a good one: you CAN do this. Small steps. Work with what you have, as who you are, right now. Then there's the question of not-looking at your own work: you do need, sooner or later, to just plunge in and do it. But sure, if it will help to start something else first: do that! It's a good idea. Just don't take forever. And when you do look at your work: don't make it all-or-nothing. Plan on giving yourself some space to feel confused, upset, disappointed, excited - who knows what. Everyone handles it differently. But whatever those feelings are, they are just a part of the work - which is to see if you need to do any rewriting. Obviously, I think this video talks a lot about that - so maybe watch it again? It sounds to me like in BOTH of your problems: you are over-hyping this moment. Your life does NOT depend on one script, or even two. It's a PROCESS. Keep doing it, keep working on making your work better - small steps, bit by bit. CONGRATULATIONS on writing scripts! That's amazing! If you can do that, you are DOING WELL. Keep doing it. Show your stuff to people. Work within your reality. Keep working. Keep having fun.
@@writingforscreens Thank so very much for taking the time to write such a thourough answer. I agree with all you said. And just clarifying I am not particularly interested in "making it" in Holliwood and if I did, I think maybe "making it" in Mexico or anywhere else as an indie screenwriter or director might draw attention from the right eyes though. My doubt was a bit more of a: and now what? Not only in the aspect that for some reason I keep putting off the rewrites. BUt also let say I have done 20 rewrites hehe and then what? That part is very haunting and intimidating for me. Maybe it´s a matter of thinking f screenplay very "cheap" to produce and maybe doing a something about that. I will keep watching your content which it´s really good and we learn SO much. Again thank you. And yes, will watch it again
@@ricardourroz9322 Yes - exactly: I do think if you want a path for "now what" that you control - something that doesn't wait on permission or support from strangers: think in terms of "no-budget" and "micro-budget" indies. There is a LOT of info out on TH-cam and the internet on how to make this sort of thing. Forget about making money, for the moment. The goal is to make art, to get good at it, to have fun with it, to learn and build your skills and connections and audience. Those steps are very small, and very important. Then you can go from there to "how do I get a bigger audience, and some money?"
@@writingforscreens Definitely. First things first. It´s not smart to pretend to make money of a craft/ Art when one can even doit perfectly. Re focus on what is important and the first and second steps :)
“You are judging the WORK, not your talent or future.” Precisely what I needed to hear today. Thanks a ton, Glenn.
I have to keep telling myself this one :)
@@writingforscreens Yes Glenn. We have to keep reminding ourselves of this.
This channel is gold. I discovered it by accident when I was desperately looking for a video about writing that would help me out of my art block, and then I found Mr. Glenn Gers and almost cried because he expertly discussed all my pain poins. I cannot express how much watching these videos helped me handle my suffering, frustration and resignation. I love writing, it's my passion even though I do it for fun. I want to do it, it's my happy place and yet sometimes I feel at loss and toss around the scenes not knowing what is not working and why it's not working. Thanks to Mr. Glenn I know it now so THANK YOU!! You helped me heal my inner artist :)
I'm so moved to hear that these ideas were helpful and supportive! Keep writing, keep loving it.
"It may not be perfect ... but it's a thing. People can read it."😊
There ya go: the answer!
I'm always grateful for your ability to articulate concepts for writing. 🎉
Thank you so much!
came here to rewatch the rewrite video! was struggling with this - i have a palm full of scripts that need "rewrit"
peace!
Yay! Welcome!
My first draft of my script is my treatment (I don’t write treatments). It usually comes in around 40 pages. On the second draft, I outline and write the script from memory. I create the feeling of already writing a script. Of course, I don’t remember everything but I do recall major points that propelled the story forward. I learned this technique when my computer wiped out my first draft and had to start all over again. I also decided to abandon my old notes. I start off fresh.
If that works for you, do it!! I likewise have written many 60-70 page first drafts to discover what I have.
Glenn, I watch and learn all the time from all of your videos - and many many many are repeat watchings. But I'm a lurker, so THANK YOU for so much that has helped me keep on track. I'm concentrating on fiction with a sideline of scripting. Thank you. (The outlining with making a scene list, and Thinking in Scenes are among my favorites.)
Thank YOU for lurking! Lurking is a completely legitimate mode of behavior here and I welcome it.
And thank you even more for letting me know you do it, and that it helps you!!
This video is amazing because it shows us that rewriting is not just about deleting and rewriting but also about testing and experimenting. There's another thing that could help you writers, is to try to write the scene or the short story multiple times in different pages or Word files, so you have more scenarios in front of you that you can choose one that is good for the story you want to tell, or take the good things from every one of them and combine them in one story. Now Go Write something! Thank you for this amazing video.✨
Thank you, that's a good suggestion!
Rewring is now much less of a nightmare to me after this video. Thanks a million, Glenn ❤
I'm SO happy to hear that this was helpful, thank you for sharing here!!
Again, you're batting a thousand.
When I started out, I was unaware how much rewriting is necessary. 90% of the work I do is rewriting, and 10% is drafting. That was a surprise, something I never would have expected.
Drafting is sort of allowing your unconscious mind (which is where 100% of all creativity comes from) to tell you (your conscious mind) what to write in real time, off the cuff. It's a little like being a stenographer. Some voice, somewhere, is instructing you on what to put on the page. It feels like it's coming from outside of you (it isn't).
Even so, it's a blast, much more fun than rewriting. Rewriting means you have to put your editor hat on and view things from your conscious mind while also trying to impersonate the objective POV of 'the reader'. Rewriting is actually editing. You have to master the skill of editing to help you master the skill of writing. You can try to reject that idea, but the truth is, that IS the truth. There are no shortcuts.
Screenwriters typically plot. They use outlines. If you do, it might seem to you that starting without an outline and only making outlines after the drafting phase, would be putting the cart before the horse.
But I'm a pantser at heart. I approach everything that way, and it keeps my creativity from being corralled and hemmed in by previous conscious choices and concepts. I also fix things as I go. It's true that fixing things that will eventually be cut will not contribute to the finished product, but I've found that doing that does help you get better at writing and fixing what will eventually be in the finished product, so I think of that as road work, meaning it does have value. It's just part of the hard work needed to be done to learn how to get better at writing.
But while I approach things from the POV of a pantser and begin there, much of what I do is what a plotter does, only it's done after the fact, which is a way of verifying what is written and a way of holding a larger portion of the story in my head, seeing things from the 10,000-ft level rather than from the myopic vision I have while in drafting mode. I just do it after the drafting, rather than before.
So I'm a 'reverse plotter'. It works. It works for me, and there's no reason that can't work for everyone.
I'm glad it works for you! I'm also glad you've shared it. Maybe it will work for some, maybe not for others. That's okay. That's the whole method of this channel: try things out and see if they work for you.
This channel has helped me immensely. He called out my bad habits and gave me solutions. Thank you. I hope this helps someone else.
I always felt like a failure if my outline wasn’t filled in completely. Nothing ever got done. Now, I bounce around and it’s fun. Like, a big word puzzle. Then the scenes pop in your head randomly. The characters start demanding things. I had never had that. I stopped and didn’t give them a chance. Completely changed my life.
The passes thing gave me permission and helped me figure out what to focus on each pass. He took all the structure gave me a game-plan. I will be forever grateful.
Also, NOW GO WRITE SOMETHING
Oh, gosh - this is so wonderful for me to read! Exactly what I dreamed someone would get from my work. Thank you so much for sharing it here. Let's both go write something!
This is a practical, simple rewriting method that I had not considered before. Thank you for sharing!!
You're entirely welcome!!
I agree with you 99% of the time, Glenn. That is almost unheard of. This vid is one we should watch over and over.
I don't actually disagree with you on one little point that I'm going to mention, but I'm concerned that certain people might not really understand. Buried in tons of really good information, you said something to the effect of, 'then you're just polishing'. Two days later, that made my ears perk up.
I know you don't mean anything negative by that. And you're right: From the point of view of a screenwriter, polishing is really not all that important. Plot and character are much more important than the exact line-by-line wording in dialogue, or even in narrative. Polishing might still be important, but most of the polishing is done by head writers, showrunners, rewriters, directors, producers, sometimes even by actors themselves. Typically by people other than those who drafted the original script version, who regardless of how well-polished the line-by-line writing might be, think they know better than the writer (and some do), and have the power to exert their own ideas over those of the screenwriter.
So to rub nine layers of carnauba wax on a screenplay regarding the exact wording might be no more effective than rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.
Your channel is entitled 'Writing for Screens', and while primarily directed at screenwriters, some of us are novelists who may never desire to be screenwriters, but who realize that we can learn a lot from you. You are a novelist yourself, and I'm sure you understand things the way we do. Walking in those shoes is how we all learn these things.
But about polishing …
Story Grid Publishing stopped accepting submissions a couple years ago. They'd created rigid hoops for writers who submitted to them to go through based on craft, technique, structure, order, and closely following their concepts of story creation, including that submissions also required detailed spreadsheets and X-Y diagrams created by the writer, proving they were following their instructions-a bar to entry to even get the manuscript looked at. Their thinking was sound, and I've learned tons of things from them regarding craft, technique, structure, and order. There are some really talented, creative, smart folks in that family.
But the dozens of submissions they got were still not good enough to publish, we were told sometime back (I have yet to submit), even if crafted precisely the way they prescribed. Accepting submissions then came to a screeching halt. Today it was candidly revealed that the reason they stopped taking submissions was that while writers were following their instructions regarding craft and technique to the letter, THE LINE-BY-LINE WRITING WAS JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
Line-by-line writing is not really something that pertains to craft or technique. Line-by-line is more in the domain of art and the unconscious mind, a place where words or conscious explicit thinking have little or no impact, so it's difficult to put in words or to teach. Maybe impossible. And Story Grid never really attempted to teach it. That's fine, and it makes sense.
What this underlines is something very important to fictional writing which is different than scriptwriting, and what that is, is polishing. Good line-by-line writing is one of the most important things in written fiction, because we are tasked with creating the entire movie in the theater of the mind of the reader. We are the last 'creative' force before hand-off so they can read a story in written fiction and see that movie in their mind. And since there is no concrete visual expression that is tangible or viewable like an actual movie, how it will be perceived is highly dependent on the quality of the line-by-line writing. Anyone who has ever read a novel instinctively knows this (as do publishers).
Polishing is just one more necessary thing among the many that contribute to the quality of the line-by-line.
Some of us have the ability, some of us don't, some of us acquire it. It can be learned, but it's not really something that can be taught, or mimicked. Some will do the hard work necessary to learn it, some won't. It can take numerous editing passes to get things the way they ought to be. And as I continue to say, there really are no shortcuts. You must do the hard work to get there. For a novelist, that includes polishing. It can never be 'one and done' or 'three passes then paint it and ship it'.
I don't want to swerve too far from what your viewers expect. Please disagree with or ignore or remove this comment if you feel it doesn't belong here. I think it's good information for both screenwriters and novelists to understand, and I hope you'll see it in the spirit of it being a contribution. But that's just me.
I agree. It’s the author
that must determine. It’s part of writing.
No need to remove your opinion - it's a fine opinion. I don't disagree. It's just not what I meant. I just meant there's a slightly different type of writing one does when one is just messing with ("perfecting") the language or making small changes. You get to apoint where you have decided the big issues, and then you're just making that better.
The Industry definition of "polish" is an entirely different thing...which no one can really define. It means "a small rewrite" but exactly what is or is not included in that is always just a matter of who has the power to demand more changes and who has the power to refuse.
@@writingforscreens Okay. Sometimes communication is hard due to words not always having clear definitions. Writers are not typically happy about that, but it's just the way it has to be, because language is not perfect.
'Polishing' is a pretty precise word in most circumstances, and is more precise than its synonyms. But it also has an inborn negative connotation, that 'to polish' might be sometimes the wrong path to take and might be sort of useless to do. When words are like that, the best choice is still to choose that more precise word to achieve clarity, but connotations in a word can work against that, regardless how good our intentions for clarity might be.
I do think I got your message in the video with the clarity you intended. I just hoped everyone did. And I do consider you very adept at clarity, which is one of the strengths of your videos that give them value.
Thanks, Glenn.
It is a very important message. They're judging your work, not you. If I had known any better, I would've reacted a lot better to the criticisms.
It's gold, Glenn.
Yay! Thanks!
I'm always motivated to finish my writing after watching these
Hooray! Thanks!
Thank you very much for this video. I recently sent in some work with someone and got some feedback which shocked me. Not to get into it, I knew it had problems, but the severity of those problems took me. How you reframed rewriting actually gives me the confidence to undertake this process. For rewriting is that; a part of the creative process. I need to learn that works in their outlining/ creative phrases are flexible and are subject to change during the process. And that is ok. I also adore how you say to take things one step at a time and break up tasks. I'm a web developer and that's something within tech we always say; for large projects you need to stay organized and break things down.
Make tangible goals that you can hit. My process on reflection was messy and I'm hoping the next time it will be smoother. All in all, thank you for the video and I hope you have a wonderful father's day weekend.
Every time you work, your process gets "cleaner". Keep doing it. I'm really glad this encourages you to keep going. And thank you!
A piece of advice that has stuck with me, is to wait at least 48 hours after getting feedback before making any changes. The idea was to just sit with that disappointment or frustration, and let yourself experience it (not suppress emotions) and create a little distance from your first response to the feedback. Maybe the feedback is just from a perspective that doesn't 'get' what you wrote?
@@Ruylopez778 Yes, definitely.
I'm rewriting/revising my novel right now and appreciate this video so much! It's excellent. Thank you!
Great, congratulations! You've come far, already! I'm really glad that this is helpful. Keep going!
Thank you. I listened while I worked out. I have a fresh direction.
I'm so glad! Plus: good that you're getting exercise too. I have to get on that more :)
It's very true! I didn't know what I wrote when I did 😊. But I do like the rewrite process because finally I understand.
Isn't that just the most fun, when that happens and you discover what you've done?
"Don't be afraid to kill your darlings" is how I've heard the phrase.
I have done. It sucked. I think it's supposed to. That's good. I think.
P.S. The bloopers are great! 😂
Thank you! Yes, that's a really good way to phrase that.
Awesome - thanks Glenn! I used to view rewrites as akin to getting up on stage and talking for an hour - with the same sense of dread. But thanks to you, and lots of rewriting, I feel it's the chance to really dive into the juice of the work and make it the best it can be. One quick question - do you ever get that sense of urgency with writing - like "Oh, I'd better get this done fast, or I might die before I get to share it with the world"?
Yes, I think that all the time. But then I discover I can't write as much or as fast as I think...so I just have to live with getting SOMEthing done.
@@writingforscreens thanks, yes - as you say "Go write something!" is definitely better than writing nothing!
"It's done when everything you need to fix you can't fix yet." - I'm not sure about that one. Sometimes you can't fix it in that moment, and then you sleep on it, go work on a different project, or take a vacation, and you come back to the work with fresh eyes, more insight, or a better idea.
So maybe even when you can't fix something yet you're not really done. Maybe a work is never really done, but you could get to a stage where you can let it go, or have to let it go, and move on... maybe to later come back to it after all.. or maybe not.
Yes, I agree! That's what "yet" is all about: maybe you can't see anything wrong with it and you have to set it aside for a while and see it with fresh eyes...or maybe you know something's wrong but can't figure out what to do at the moment.
So: I think "can't fix yet" is just a another way of saying exactly as you said.
Great video as always!
Thank you!
Really good video. I love the practical tips that you gave. Thank you!!
Thank you, so glad to hear it's giving you things to try!
More great info, Thanks Glenn.
You're welcome, Lesanda!
SOme really needed advice! It can be so hard to revisit your work and make changes... But it definitely helsp improve the script.
Thank you!
Great wisdom; you always provide different ways to approach a subject, and tactics to prevent us from tripping ourselves up or getting frustrated! After looking at the 'Story Grid' principle of rewriting, I got into the habit of making spreadsheets with every single scene. That way I can see the whole story on one page, make changes, and then go into my manuscript document and shuffle scenes around or make notes on what to add, or where I'm repeating myself.
I think recording yourself reading your work and listening to it can be really helpful. It's much easier to notice when something is dragging or out of place, and it can spark new ideas.
What do you do (apart from persevere) when you've made multiple revisions or passes and you feel conflicted between what you wanted it to be initially and what you have now? I mean to say, is there a way to test if you've made things needlessly complex or bloated? I wonder if I'm actually losing emotional impact and making things less cohesive.
You have to let go of what you wanted it to be - thought it was going to be - wish it was. You have to work with and love what it is. That's an inevitable step in creating anything, I believe. Sometimes that means not looking at it for a while, maybe - even setting it aside and throwing yourself into a different project. That's usually how I am able to look at something and see what it is: when I have given up on it for a while.
As far as needlessly complex: well that's a whole different question. The issue is "needlessly." Maybe it needs to be complex. BUT: you can lose emotional impact if it's so complex that people can't track the characters' stories, remember or understand their desires and problems.
Once again: all I can say is - for me, setting it aside and coming back is how I see that. (Of course, I'm working on a novel I started 30 years ago so maybe I'm not a good advisor on this...)
That and: asking the right questions, which it seems like you're doing. If you're worried about it being emotionally weaker - examine it in those terms.
The biggest problem then is: do you feel upset or unhappy when you have to make changes based on your "new" priority (in this case, emotion and clarity). If so: are you clinging to some idea of what it is "supposed" to be, at the expense of what it is?
Just keep asking, and trying out different ways to solve it. That's all I can advise.
@@writingforscreens Thanks, Glenn! That's what I needed to hear. I think I've accepted it's never going to totally satisfy me, or feel finished. To some extent, I have slowly let go of many preconceptions about what it 'should be', and I want to be bold with it, not scared, whatever direction that is (or at least I tell myself that I want to...). It is really personal, which is part of the problem. And I think I'm envisioning something that's beyond my actual technical capability and a little uncomfortable, but if I were to scale it back, I don't think that would be any fun for me to write. I do have multiple different directions I can take it, with plenty of potential, IMO. I really want it to be distinctive (even weird in a way) and have strong voice, but I don't think that's something I need to let go of, is it? That to me seems more like an overarching career aspiration, than an expectation.
I think the answer is to write more, grow as a writer, and then return to this. At the same time, it doesn't need more perspective. I want it as raw as it can be, not filtered or distant. I think I have to prioritise emotional impact. No point in being clever if the reader doesn't care. I suppose I should prioritise entertainment and connection and let how 'clever' it is take care of itself, and let the reader find it clever, or not..... depending on what they are looking for in a story.
Hmm, that's a great question... I suppose I feel unhappy, or certainly frustrated, by the idea of playing it too safe. I wrote a synopsis and outline for an editor to get feedback, which was largely negative in fundamental ways, which was crushing. But OK, I probably needed that. I kept refining the synopsis, to the point it was quite a different thing to the last draft (not that it bothered me). I don't really know if the problem is the inability to express the ideas in my head in the manuscript, or the just the synopsis changes didn't get it across clearly, or the editor just didn't get it. Or all of the above.
I do feel confident that whole experience is going to ultimately help. It was rather meandering, but then it was 'supposed' to be that (although the prose itself is intended to be taut and witty, if that makes sense). It's around 70k words, so it's not a problem of being too long per se, but perhaps too many separate ideas not fully explored.
I suppose ultimately I want to find a way to keep that meandering spirit, but in more grounded scenes and clearer momentum. And I think perhaps the way to do that is weave backstory and exposition into the core scenes and remove redundant scenes. I think even if I aim to make it taut and grounded, it's probably still going to end up with some tangental charm. So I suppose I answered my own question. I'm thinking about writing 3 short stories in different styles, and then returning to this project.
Really enjoyed this video!
Thank you!!
A side question
Is it common that I don't enjoy writing TV series as much as screenplays? A good eligible screenwriter should be good at both, shouldn't they?
If you don't enjoy it, you probably shouldn't do it. Yes: currently there seems to be more work in series than features. But there's even more work in something like home health care nursing, and you're not considering that. Just do what you believe you do well.
@@writingforscreens Haha exactly! Thanks.
Hey! So I have a BIG problem. I have written 2 screenplays (both written last year). I haven´t even dare to open them again. I did send them to a couple of friends to read it so I can have some fresh eyes and perspective and they haven´t done so. I am a bit terrified of opening it and working on them. I am better trying to think of a new story to write, maybe a short film so I can shoot. The second part of the problem is I live in Mexico, not even Mexico city and I have zero connections, so even if I get the script to a good point (that IF they are any good) I wouldn't know what to do with them. SO I am very stuck. Any advise?
Okay, that's definitely two separate problems. So let's look at them separately:
Re: Mexico - if you are trying to find a way to work in Hollywood, then that's a whole series of steps for you. You'd have to be willing to move there. There are many many websites and online magazines and videos about "making it" in the American film biz, I am not really a good advisor for that because my advice would be: don't. Work where you are, find out what kind of work can be done as an indie in your own reality.
Technology allows ANYONE ANYWHERE to make films or series, and get them out to the public - on their own or through festivals, contests, etc. Study that. If you want to shoot a short - you can do that, wherever you are! Start learning how. Look into "indie film" and "no-budget."
The reality is: you need to do the work, over and over, where you are - before you can really think much about making money at art.
Okay, so that's one side of the story, and that's a good one: you CAN do this. Small steps. Work with what you have, as who you are, right now.
Then there's the question of not-looking at your own work: you do need, sooner or later, to just plunge in and do it. But sure, if it will help to start something else first: do that! It's a good idea. Just don't take forever.
And when you do look at your work: don't make it all-or-nothing. Plan on giving yourself some space to feel confused, upset, disappointed, excited - who knows what. Everyone handles it differently. But whatever those feelings are, they are just a part of the work - which is to see if you need to do any rewriting. Obviously, I think this video talks a lot about that - so maybe watch it again?
It sounds to me like in BOTH of your problems: you are over-hyping this moment. Your life does NOT depend on one script, or even two. It's a PROCESS. Keep doing it, keep working on making your work better - small steps, bit by bit.
CONGRATULATIONS on writing scripts! That's amazing! If you can do that, you are DOING WELL. Keep doing it. Show your stuff to people. Work within your reality. Keep working. Keep having fun.
@@writingforscreens Thank so very much for taking the time to write such a thourough answer. I agree with all you said. And just clarifying I am not particularly interested in "making it" in Holliwood and if I did, I think maybe "making it" in Mexico or anywhere else as an indie screenwriter or director might draw attention from the right eyes though.
My doubt was a bit more of a: and now what? Not only in the aspect that for some reason I keep putting off the rewrites. BUt also let say I have done 20 rewrites hehe and then what? That part is very haunting and intimidating for me.
Maybe it´s a matter of thinking f screenplay very "cheap" to produce and maybe doing a something about that.
I will keep watching your content which it´s really good and we learn SO much.
Again thank you. And yes, will watch it again
@@ricardourroz9322 Yes - exactly: I do think if you want a path for "now what" that you control - something that doesn't wait on permission or support from strangers: think in terms of "no-budget" and "micro-budget" indies. There is a LOT of info out on TH-cam and the internet on how to make this sort of thing.
Forget about making money, for the moment. The goal is to make art, to get good at it, to have fun with it, to learn and build your skills and connections and audience. Those steps are very small, and very important. Then you can go from there to "how do I get a bigger audience, and some money?"
@@writingforscreens Definitely. First things first. It´s not smart to pretend to make money of a craft/ Art when one can even doit perfectly. Re focus on what is important and the first and second steps :)
Took it through 10 draft
Wow! Congratulations :)
The very end of this video 😂
:)