I really like the idea of old calibers loaded under a modern doctrine. Like putting a Coyote V8 in a 60’s Mustang. Like back when 45LC was invented, the basic idea was “more lead in that dude over there = better” But now the idea is, “there are teenagers with body armor and switches on their Glocks, so i need to set off a small explosion in their chest, all while blasting ‘Big Iron’ by Marty Robbins in my headphones!” What a time to be alive
Great video as always. I imagine if you were an Emergency Room surgeon and a gun shot case came in where this round was used…it would be a long procedure.
The way I actually learned about Civil Defense ammo was from an emergency room surgeon.. someone had used the 9mm on a guy in a defense situation and he said it was the worst wound tracks he had seen in a shooting state side and had no idea how he was even still alive when they brought him in...There was nothing he could do to save the guy so he had to find out what in the world the rounds were, then he started using them in his EDC ...and knowing this surgeon was a combat medic with multiple tours under his belt who had seen a lot of messed up stuff his word is legit...So every time I watch test videos of civil defense I always think of being told about that.
Those will not frag on many dry barriers and will whip through many walls, they are promoted as a barrier blind bullet, the hydraulic pressure from fluid medium initiates fragmentation.
My mother selected a Ruger Vaquero in 45 Colt when I had her at the range to select a ‘hurricane gun’. She didn’t mind the big recoil as it wasn’t ‘sharp’. We selected a 225 grain lead semi-wadcutter hollowpoint out of it’s 5 1/2’ barrel. So not a concealed carry gun, but you spend a lot of time outside after a hurricane and I would at least wear mine. She probably intended it more for the looters that come at night. I haven’t shot the Libertys in 45 Colt, but have shot most of the other calibers and found them to have less recoil, shoot accurately and to point of impact in all the calibers and in several platforms and always fed and cycled the autoloaders. Super impressed - the old Glasers and MagSafes do not compare. While I generally like a deep penetrating hollowpoint, the Liberty rounds are in my Shield as my EDC concealed. Back in the eighties if my PACT 2 chrono struggled, I would put a paper target in front of the skyscreens to keep little particles or shockwave from giving false readings. My 22-250 had a tiny 40 grain bullet over 4000 ft/sec and the readings were low deviation.
Regardless of what anyone says, 45lc is a no joke fight finisher. There’s a reason it’s still around and being tested like never before! Look up the stats on how many wars and cowboy shootouts the 45lc has been involved in.Pretty damned wild.✌️
The variations on the velocity, it could be muzzle blast getting in the way. You might try using a piece of cardboard in front of the chronograph. This should prevent the muzzle blast from passing through the chronograph and effecting the readings. It may not help, but it might. Worth trying.
Good grief that wind was whipping. As soon as saw the title I said dang I forgot to look at 45 Colt yesterday and I had the judge with me. Good video!!
Thank you sir. That wind made this probably the most miserable test day I have ever had. If I didn't already have all my stuff setup, I would have just called it for the day.
Those projectiles are so light weight makes sense to me the extreme velocity differences in slight barrel length changes, idk. lol! I dont really care for those light bullets myself, just too inconsistent. May try to shoot revolvers through a target so the cardboard will keep the unburnt powder from messing up the crono, just thinking out loud! Interesting stuff! Happy Friday! 💥💥🪶
I have shot those out of a 3" 9mm in milk jugs full of water and against steel plate, since Liberty claims them to be armor piercing. Soft armor, sure, but you do what you gotta do. I knew that it fragmented big time, so I put three jugs wide and 4 jugs deep. The first 3 in front were all busted...naturally, the middle one that actually got the actual shot had the most damage, and it was WRECKED! But the little base, like a watch battery, barely put a dent in the second jug in the center. That thing just EXPLODED! Against the steel plate, about 1/8th thick, the liberty did knock a deeper dent than the 115 FMJ that I shot as a comparison. It would be devastating against coyotes, but that lack of penetration did not float my boat at all. But MAN! I have never seen a round go as deep, or even deeper sideways as it did in straight line penetration. It would WRECK the insides of a bad guy, but I don't think it's a 100% chance that it would make it to the vitals if there was something in the way, like something in a shirt pocket, without exploding into shrapnel. But it sure was impressive seeing how it treated those front jugs! It was the closet thing to a rifle shot in a pistol caliber that I have seen! I thought I HAD me something!... until I saw how super-shallow that devastation was! But that's what testing is for, right?! Keep 'em comin', Tools!
From what I can tell, the listed velocities end up being pretty close with this stuff. Sometimes even over box velocity. The 10mm said 2400 FPS, but was getting 2500 in the Glock 20. Id say ~1650 in the 2" & ~2k in the 6.5" is probably accurate.
Thank you for the constructive and consistent testing. Even when things don’t go according to plans, you provide clear accurate information about the load and results.
Bought my first SAA in .45 colt and the salesman was nice enough to bring out a Henry lever action in .45 colt to go with it , had to dig a little deeper in the old pocket but I left with both , awesome caliber
These are some speedy rounds. I have seen the Liberty Civil Defense channel on some of them. I have them in my EDCs. My 9mm and my 45acp. Thanks for the testing.
That was entertaining! Wish you could include a ‘blooper reel’ at the end of your video! That would be hilarious, I’m sure!!😉😂 Thanks for sharing! Stay safe!🇺🇸👍🏻
I've inquired about that ammo recently but this test has changed my mind. I also checked out the Defiant Munitions ammo you tested recently and dear god!!!! That stuff is $81.00 per box
Boy O Boy this was a cluster of a test wasn't it? Between that wind blowing like crazy & the chrono not liking the Judge to begin with, but you got er done. Have a good one brother see you on the next one.
The results are surprising. In the past I've seen Liberty Civil Defense fragment very nicely, but the core of the bullet would fail to reach the 12" mark. Perhaps in the larger calibers it does better.
Hey Brian been a few. I recently tested these rounds with my Garmin Xero C1 Pro. My Pietta Californian 5.5 was 2005fps and my Blackhawk 7.5 was 2098fps. Inside range ,very loud, very fast
Nice test Tools, even if you did edit the "frustration" out. These are just like those R. I. P. rounds. Pedals breaking off and going different directions while the core continues on trucking. They tend to cause significant tissue damage to the intended target. I have no desire to be on the receiving end of any of these rounds. TGIF and have a great weekend. Be vigilant and always be safe my friend.
I can't think of any aim points anywhere near center-mass that wouldn't be a surgeon's nightmare to fix. Assuming the patient made it that far. That disk is spinning on one axis (from the grooved barrel) - then it hits body, loses its petals, still rotating, and obviously it isn't going to stay that way - it's going to be face differential pressures and be deflected and spin on a second axis - akin to a tumbling round. If it stays in the block/body, it eventually settles into a frisbee-like alignment - the shape of least resistance.
As a video recommendation, I know you've been doing caliber head to heads and I am hoping that maybe you can test .45colt buffalobore deer grenades to 44magnum out of a henry or rossi lever action Or even doing the 2 out of ruger blackhawks would be really neat to watch.
@ToolsandTargets well so I got a henry .45colt and I've been shooting differnt rounds out of the standard loads seems to shoot high out of my henry compared to the faster shooting stuff the deer grenades though have some recoil supposedly pushing 1860fps
Talk about timing...I was just pondering some light-bullet/high-velocity 45 Colt testing while looking at an old package of 45 Colt MagSafe frangibles on my desk. 96 grain rated at 1,700 FPS from a 6" S&W Model 25. Bullets are a jacket- looks like an XTP- with #2 copper plated shot in an epoxy matrix, so basically a Glaser Safety Slug sans nose cone and with much larger pellets for better penetration. My test will not be practical like yours (since this ammo is no longer available), but should make for some mega gel destruction!
I don't know why, but I'm just not sold on this Civil Defense ammo in general. In something like this it did a great job compared to other stuff out of these judges, but there are just too many other good options in the more commonly used calibers.
@@ToolsandTargets I really wish Speer would bring back the 45 Colt 200 grain Gold Dot load (they actually used to do the "flying ashtray" in aluminum Blazer cases). I've loaded the new-style 45 ACP Gold Dots in 45 Colt at standard pressures, and they're soft enough to obturate and grab the rifling, so accuracy is acceptable. Velocity with the 200 grain virtually guarantees expansion, at least down to a 3 1/2 inch barrel.
I've seen these tested in 9mm, and they are not even close to something I'd consider using, but if you like them, that's all that matters, THX Randy & Brian, You guys have a great weekend! 🇺🇸
Gimmick round just like the RIP ammo. You calibrate gel by firing a .177 steel BB at 590 fps +/-15 fps into the gelatin; it should penetrate 2.97 to 3.75 inches. So the pieces that break off are basically equivalent to being shot with a BB gun a few times, neither would get past any bone and you are left with a FMJ. Just buy HST's in whatever caliber you carry and be done. Each to their own.
@@Catgat37 I don't either and I swear I have some somewhere lol. I do have Underwood loaded with XTP though, and I would take that over this any day, but each to their own.
@@37gdog I would too. I mainly just run federal semi jacketed soft point 225 GR. Got some Grizzly hollowpoints and some hornady critical defense recently that I have not tested. I don't have a Judge, but am considering carrying my Ruger Vaquero on occasion 🤔
@@Catgat37 I just got back from the range shooting the new Judge Home Defender. I have a Holosun 407 and a Crimson Trace rail laser on it. It's accurate enough to do the job. At 7 yards shooting Nobel Sport Law Enforcement 3" 4 ball .40 buck, it's about a 3-4 inch hole in the target after firing all five shots. I like that with just the laser. I sighted in a bit high at 25 with some 45LC and was shooting 8 inch plates at 50yds consistently. It's a fun gun to play with, not every gun has to serve a purpose lol.
@@37gdog yeah, I have a 7.5 inch BFR in 45 Colt/410. It groups about a 5 inch spread with 3 inch 4 pellet 000 buck without choke installed. I have not tried groups with the choke. Definitely a fun gun.
MY GRANDMOTHER WOULD GET ON TO MY GRAND DAD ABOUT CUSSING ..... !!!!!!! HE WOULD SAY .... !!!!! IT'S WORTH EVER WORD MAM .... !!!!!!!! GREAT VIDEO ... !!!!! THANK YOU TOOL ...!!!!!! DOUBLE G. HERE ...!!!!!
🇦🇺😎👍Crazy science my friend…did you say the f word 🤣?….man it’s ripped the ass out of the jelly contraption….just judging the results I’d call that a reckless death ☠….I’d say 100% dangerous 🙈🏁…. Thankyou Sir
Good test, but I am not keen on these bullets. I like to hit what I aim at, and if those bullets curve in tissue the way they do in gel it might miss vital structures. I'll stick to more conventional ammo.
Brother tools you did a fantastic job testing these freedom seeds. I enjoy your videos and you have definitely showed me more options on freedom seeds.
FRAGTASTIC. Good test enjoy the Judge testing. Bring out the Circuit Judge. I think you would really have the splinter maximum effect. Lol. Civil Defense is for real. Don’t have any of that around here. So question how do you like the Circuit Judge? Still performing good for you? Be safe and thanks for sharing. 🇺🇸👍⭐️🇺🇸
I think you may find the forckng cone has an extremely high polish and that is making bullets burnish to matching extremely high polish as they jump the cylinder gap . So they would be mirror like and reflect light as they pass the shadow sensor of the chronograph. They read by how long the it takes the shadow to pass over one sensor and reach the second. If the light is reflecting off of the rifling engraved areas, which is more compression than cut engraving ,the bullet would be reflecting light in all directions including down as it spins . I'm not sure how else a particular type of gun could repeatedly have the same issue with such a system . Light HAS to be involved in some way.
Yeah, it is without a doubt something with these Judges causing some sort of issue. It happens with them almost every time with all types of ammo or distance I put between them and the chrono.
Thanks for the hard work!!!! The jelly looks like about 1600-1800 fps. Great for blowing up musk melons!!! But I'd take a 3" .357 with 125s. These .410s are too big.
Glad I don't have to clean that jelly. Your High School Teacher was right about you becoming a Disruptive Person 😂. Start with first shot in pelvic region & go up. Don't know on this one. Stubby Snubby is at least 20dcb louder than 6.5in.
In my experience with my BAD in 45/410, the 45 keyholes somewhat often, leading me to believe this wouldn't starburst as intended. Perhaps due to only 1 inch of the derringer being rifled.
When a chrony does not like a pistol it may be the muzzle blast. Next time you shoot a Judge, try backing up a bit. I found that I need 15 feet (or more) to get 100% results.
Yeah, it's definitely something to do with the blast from these Judges in particular. It happens nearly every time. I've stood far enough back that I was worried about the accuracy of these things hitting the chrono, and still get crazy errors from them.
Man I love these Civil Defense rounds for my home defense handguns in 40cal and wife's 9mm. Seems like they'd make anyone change their prior plans immediately.. thanks for the info be safe
@@ToolsandTargets my ccw is a shield n 40cal and they definitely hit hard from that size tool but I use them in my full size M&P pro series 40cal for home defense. Wow are they loud as hell though
Love the channel bro! Maybe invest in a better chrono in the future, or perhaps put it on its side, since I've noticed that seems to mitigate some inaccurate measurements. Electronics are super cool, when they work lol! Keep up the awesome videos!
So are those defensive rounds you're shooting in this video are they standard pressure for just your standard pressure 45 Colt pistol? With a lightweight slug obviously?
Wow, difficult test. I guess you’d need a giant jelly block to get the whole picture. Interesting, though. It would be great if you could settle the chrono issues, then compare those judges to an ordinary .45 Colt revolver. 👍
Never have had to use it, hope I never do. But I have some in .357 magnum for my S&W 686 as well as .45 long colt for my Bond Arms Derringer with a 3" barrel
That looks like an absolute mess for a surgeon. Not sure what they accomplish with such shallow penetration with respect to the shedding of the petals, but it definitely looks brutal. I really like segmented rounds for small game, but I am not sold on them for larger animals or self defense. Thanks for the video. It looked very frustrating, and I appreciate your work.
It was already absolutely miserable with the wind and then this. I knew it was coming though. It happens with the Judges almost every time. no matter what round or distance I try to stand.😆😆😆
Those 2" were not exactly impressive although Im not with those people who say that would only be a flesh wound minus the core, But the 6" was a different story, that extra fps seemed to really wake them up as that whole track looked nasty, Id like to see if going even longer like a 16" or 18" would do better, Also this explosive fragmentation round could be great if the company made a heavy version say 200gr to 250gr like a sjhp with the hollow point almost to the base with some internal slices inside to round to weaken it in a calibre like 45+p+/45 super/460 Rowland or a bit lighter with say a full power 775fpe 180gr to 225gr fragmenting 10mm or 357 mag or sig of 158gr to 180gr, If they had a heavy round from the start and got the whole round to detonate with high fpe you wouldn't need the base for penetration as the waight and fps plus the larger pieces a heavy round would produce would get it there and the wounding on the way would be incredible, Imagine this 78gr but much more power and 3 to 5 times the weight, maximum damage no over penetration.
Is there any chance you can re-test these and the .357 Magnum Civil Defense with your new chronograph? I'd really like to see some accurate velocity readings. It seems hard to find some tests with these two calibers in particular with the Civil Defense stuff. Seems like the only Liberty Ammo stuff most people care about is the 9mm and 10mm. Also, it'd be great (and kinda funny) to see this stuff tested out of a Colt Single Action Army (or a clone).
Imagine it ported & having to pull the trigger with that ammo in it about 3:00AM in your home. Be AC/DC time "The Walls Were Shaking All Night Long" Concussion would shake Granny's dentures off the nightstand. 😂😂
I think these rounds are doing what they are designed to do! If I was defending myself in a populated area,I wouldn't worry about over penetration & when it dumps the energy,I don't think the bad guy would get very far...& the doctor would have a hard time getting all the fragments out! Maybe the coroner! I definitely would not like to get shot with those " mini grenade" type hollow points!
IMO the Judge is just a novelty that can, with the right ammo, possibly defend a person. The guns are huge when compared to the performance they offer. Any S&W, Ruger or Colt in 357 Mag with a 2'', 3'' or 4'' barrel is a far superior self defense revolver. Likewise any decent quality mid sized semiauto 9mm, 357 Sig, 40 S&W or 45 ACP is also a far better choice than a Judge. I'd even rather carry my Ruger LCPII 380 than a Judge
@@ToolsandTargets I am referring to replica copies of the 1873 colt army revolver. This gun was carried by troopers and many civilians. Think of the guns use by A Baldwin to shoot his colleague on a movie set. I did look it up and there was a claim that they were ok to shoot in such thin cylinder walled revolvers.
I have a lot to say on this one. my sympathies to you if you are going to reuse that block. Good luck to any surgeon that tries to remove those from someone. Do the fragments travel far enough to be effective even if it is a chest shot? Is that disc much bigger than a 22 round? This bullet is not one I could judge by the gel test. ( pun not intended but it fits) Good test though.
I'm not completely sold on these Civil Defense rounds. Looks like another good option in this case but I personally prefer conventional stuff in my main use calibers and guns.
I really like the idea of old calibers loaded under a modern doctrine.
Like putting a Coyote V8 in a 60’s Mustang.
Like back when 45LC was invented, the basic idea was “more lead in that dude over there = better”
But now the idea is, “there are teenagers with body armor and switches on their Glocks, so i need to set off a small explosion in their chest, all while blasting ‘Big Iron’ by Marty Robbins in my headphones!”
What a time to be alive
🤣🤣🤣🤣💀
Truly an insane time to be alive
i mean, in a revolver strong enough to handle it, 45 colt can be loaded to 44 magnum equivalent power
🦍 teenagers
I like the review brah cover
I have a couple of versions of the judge, really like the 45 colt testing. Appreciate all of your videos. Keep them coming 👍.
Thank you sir. Pretty crazy stuff here.
Do you have any 9mm revolvers and what do you prefer?
Great video as always. I imagine if you were an Emergency Room surgeon and a gun shot case came in where this round was used…it would be a long procedure.
Pray that you happen to be on lunch break when it comes in.😆
The way I actually learned about Civil Defense ammo was from an emergency room surgeon.. someone had used the 9mm on a guy in a defense situation and he said it was the worst wound tracks he had seen in a shooting state side and had no idea how he was even still alive when they brought him in...There was nothing he could do to save the guy so he had to find out what in the world the rounds were, then he started using them in his EDC ...and knowing this surgeon was a combat medic with multiple tours under his belt who had seen a lot of messed up stuff his word is legit...So every time I watch test videos of civil defense I always think of being told about that.
All calibers of this ammo seem to perform about the same. Gotta get some for the governor. Nice job and keep safe.
Yep. Thank you sir.
Remington 185 grain 45 acp
As far as a 45 Long Colt, that's a very nice home defense round. Wonder what it would do out of a Bond Arms Derringer?
Probably very similar to this 2" Judge. 😎👍
Those will not frag on many dry barriers and will whip through many walls, they are promoted as a barrier blind bullet, the hydraulic pressure from fluid medium initiates fragmentation.
Jeff H!
@Pauls Country I had a Bond Arms derringer 9mm and could not get rid of it fast enough.Well made just not for me.
@@steveelbert6996 Derringers look cool and in the Wild Wild West he had one up his sleeve with a contraption to drop it to his hand.
My mother selected a Ruger Vaquero in 45 Colt when I had her at the range to select a ‘hurricane gun’. She didn’t mind the big recoil as it wasn’t ‘sharp’. We selected a 225 grain lead semi-wadcutter hollowpoint out of it’s 5 1/2’ barrel. So not a concealed carry gun, but you spend a lot of time outside after a hurricane and I would at least wear mine. She probably intended it more for the looters that come at night.
I haven’t shot the Libertys in 45 Colt, but have shot most of the other calibers and found them to have less recoil, shoot accurately and to point of impact in all the calibers and in several platforms and always fed and cycled the autoloaders. Super impressed - the old Glasers and MagSafes do not compare. While I generally like a deep penetrating hollowpoint, the Liberty rounds are in my Shield as my EDC concealed.
Back in the eighties if my PACT 2 chrono struggled, I would put a paper target in front of the skyscreens to keep little particles or shockwave from giving false readings. My 22-250 had a tiny 40 grain bullet over 4000 ft/sec and the readings were low deviation.
These Civil Defense are definitely some soft shooters, but boy are they loud.😆😆😆
This is gonna be completely random but those background clouds look painted on perfect.
It's funny you say that because they stuck out to me when I was editing too. 😎👍
This guy could talk about anything from taking out the trash to what time of day it is, I like his southern accent. Great stuff keep up the great work
Appreciate that!😎👊
Regardless of what anyone says, 45lc is a no joke fight finisher. There’s a reason it’s still around and being tested like never before! Look up the stats on how many wars and cowboy shootouts the 45lc has been involved in.Pretty damned wild.✌️
I can just imagine all the cussing. Probably sounded like me working on my cars. 😆 🤣 😂
😆😆😆
You must own Fords, Adam.
@410m no, but I've cussed a few Fords in the past.
@@Adam-nv9zo hahahha!
@@alm9951 Ford was starting to get better for a bit..then right back to the trash. With all this electronic crap in cars now they cant figure it out
The variations on the velocity, it could be muzzle blast getting in the way. You might try using a piece of cardboard in front of the chronograph. This should prevent the muzzle blast from passing through the chronograph and effecting the readings.
It may not help, but it might. Worth trying.
It hates these Judges. Chrono is a gun snob.
Good grief that wind was whipping. As soon as saw the title I said dang I forgot to look at 45 Colt yesterday and I had the judge with me. Good video!!
Thank you sir. That wind made this probably the most miserable test day I have ever had. If I didn't already have all my stuff setup, I would have just called it for the day.
Another great jelly test Brotha , I wish you could have posted the unedited version ..
😂😂😂 Thank you sir.😎👊
Those projectiles are so light weight makes sense to me the extreme velocity differences in slight barrel length changes, idk. lol! I dont really care for those light bullets myself, just too inconsistent. May try to shoot revolvers through a target so the cardboard will keep the unburnt powder from messing up the crono, just thinking out loud! Interesting stuff! Happy Friday! 💥💥🪶
They are some speedy boys. I'm with you though. Still not really fully on board with these type rounds.
Nutty!
I have shot those out of a 3" 9mm in milk jugs full of water and against steel plate, since Liberty claims them to be armor piercing. Soft armor, sure, but you do what you gotta do. I knew that it fragmented big time, so I put three jugs wide and 4 jugs deep. The first 3 in front were all busted...naturally, the middle one that actually got the actual shot had the most damage, and it was WRECKED! But the little base, like a watch battery, barely put a dent in the second jug in the center. That thing just EXPLODED! Against the steel plate, about 1/8th thick, the liberty did knock a deeper dent than the 115 FMJ that I shot as a comparison. It would be devastating against coyotes, but that lack of penetration did not float my boat at all. But MAN! I have never seen a round go as deep, or even deeper sideways as it did in straight line penetration. It would WRECK the insides of a bad guy, but I don't think it's a 100% chance that it would make it to the vitals if there was something in the way, like something in a shirt pocket, without exploding into shrapnel. But it sure was impressive seeing how it treated those front jugs! It was the closet thing to a rifle shot in a pistol caliber that I have seen! I thought I HAD me something!... until I saw how super-shallow that devastation was! But that's what testing is for, right?! Keep 'em comin', Tools!
Yeah, they act a lot like a varmint round for sure in that first few inches.😎👍
You are one of the few channels that actually test 45 out of the judge. So many other videos act like its not a thing
Love this! Would especially enjoy a .38 and/or .357 Civil Defense/Overwatch test!
From what I can tell, the listed velocities end up being pretty close with this stuff.
Sometimes even over box velocity.
The 10mm said 2400 FPS, but was getting 2500 in the Glock 20.
Id say ~1650 in the 2" & ~2k in the 6.5" is probably accurate.
Yeah, I actually noticed that testing some more today.😎👊
@@ToolsandTargets I wonder what this would do out of a 8.38" barrel.
@@mattsoares608Or a 20" barrel?
Greatest cartridge of all time. 250 grain with 2400 under it is just magic
😎👊
Thank you for the constructive and consistent testing. Even when things don’t go according to plans, you provide clear accurate information about the load and results.
Bought my first SAA in .45 colt and the salesman was nice enough to bring out a Henry lever action in .45 colt to go with it , had to dig a little deeper in the old pocket but I left with both , awesome caliber
These are some speedy rounds. I have seen the Liberty Civil Defense channel on some of them. I have them in my EDCs. My 9mm and my 45acp. Thanks for the testing.
Never thought about these in the judge but they look pretty nice.😎👍
That was entertaining! Wish you could include a ‘blooper reel’ at the end of your video! That would be hilarious, I’m sure!!😉😂
Thanks for sharing! Stay safe!🇺🇸👍🏻
It would be a reel full of beeps because if I didn't, YT would demonetize everything.😆😆😆
@@ToolsandTargets I know brother, just couldn’t resist after your comments during the video!😂👍🏻
@@jeffray6197 It was something. Good thing I was in the middle of the woods or cops might have show up!😆😆😆
I can only imagine the agrivtion going on during this test. Thanks for doing the test though. Great job as always!
Thank you sir. It was somethin.😆
I've inquired about that ammo recently but this test has changed my mind. I also checked out the Defiant Munitions ammo you tested recently and dear god!!!! That stuff is $81.00 per box
😎👍
Was a bit a trial, surely messed up that gel. These will be one more choice for my Judge. Have great weekend thanks Brian
Thank you sir. Appreciate you sending these!😎👊
Those public defender rounds absolutely fantastic in any caliber
They definitely make a mess.
Good test THANKS , wonder what they would do out of a 7.5" 460 .
I almost used that.
Boy O Boy this was a cluster of a test wasn't it? Between that wind blowing like crazy & the chrono not liking the Judge to begin with, but you got er done. Have a good one brother see you on the next one.
I can't even begin to describe the rage that went on out there.🤣🤣🤣
I love watching you test all these interesting rounds. That being said, I know it's poison, but I love lead. Especially in the form of HST.
I'm a fan of lead myself.😎👍
Clean up on isle 45. 😂👍👍
😂😂😂
Absolutely love Liberty Civil Defense ammo.
Little grenades.💥💣💥
The results are surprising. In the past I've seen Liberty Civil Defense fragment very nicely, but the core of the bullet would fail to reach the 12" mark. Perhaps in the larger calibers it does better.
Tested some more today.😎👍
Hey Brian been a few. I recently tested these rounds with my Garmin Xero C1 Pro. My Pietta Californian 5.5 was 2005fps and my Blackhawk 7.5 was 2098fps. Inside range ,very loud, very fast
They are some speedy boys.😎
Alot of ppl in forums say these are gimmick rounds. Those did some serious damage. Love rounds with massive energy dump early
Great test and great video. I really like that 2 in barrel judge, i think i might pick one up, thanks .
Thank you sir. These Pachmayr grips are an absolute must with it. Night and day difference from the stock ones.😎👍
@@ToolsandTargets your welcome and thanks for the tip about the grips. 👍👍👍
Pac grip on mine, my favorite
Nice test Tools, even if you did edit the "frustration" out. These are just like those R. I. P. rounds. Pedals breaking off and going different directions while the core continues on trucking. They tend to cause significant tissue damage to the intended target. I have no desire to be on the receiving end of any of these rounds. TGIF and have a great weekend.
Be vigilant and always be safe my friend.
Thank you sir. You too!😎👊
Would like to see you try this in a Colt Peacemaker clone. I would like to see how much power those guns really did have.
I can't think of any aim points anywhere near center-mass that wouldn't be a surgeon's nightmare to fix. Assuming the patient made it that far. That disk is spinning on one axis (from the grooved barrel) - then it hits body, loses its petals, still rotating, and obviously it isn't going to stay that way - it's going to be face differential pressures and be deflected and spin on a second axis - akin to a tumbling round. If it stays in the block/body, it eventually settles into a frisbee-like alignment - the shape of least resistance.
Yep, it's a very interesting bullet if nothing else.
As a video recommendation, I know you've been doing caliber head to heads and I am hoping that maybe you can test .45colt buffalobore deer grenades to 44magnum out of a henry or rossi lever action
Or even doing the 2 out of ruger blackhawks would be really neat to watch.
I've actually been looking to grab a .45 Colt lever gun for quite a while now.
@ToolsandTargets well so I got a henry .45colt and I've been shooting differnt rounds out of the standard loads seems to shoot high out of my henry compared to the faster shooting stuff the deer grenades though have some recoil supposedly pushing 1860fps
Damb, hits like an explosive rd!
Yeah, it would scramble some guts.
Talk about timing...I was just pondering some light-bullet/high-velocity 45 Colt testing while looking at an old package of 45 Colt MagSafe frangibles on my desk. 96 grain rated at 1,700 FPS from a 6" S&W Model 25. Bullets are a jacket- looks like an XTP- with #2 copper plated shot in an epoxy matrix, so basically a Glaser Safety Slug sans nose cone and with much larger pellets for better penetration. My test will not be practical like yours (since this ammo is no longer available), but should make for some mega gel destruction!
I don't know why, but I'm just not sold on this Civil Defense ammo in general. In something like this it did a great job compared to other stuff out of these judges, but there are just too many other good options in the more commonly used calibers.
@@ToolsandTargets I really wish Speer would bring back the 45 Colt 200 grain Gold Dot load (they actually used to do the "flying ashtray" in aluminum Blazer cases). I've loaded the new-style 45 ACP Gold Dots in 45 Colt at standard pressures, and they're soft enough to obturate and grab the rifling, so accuracy is acceptable. Velocity with the 200 grain virtually guarantees expansion, at least down to a 3 1/2 inch barrel.
I've seen these tested in 9mm, and they are not even close to something I'd consider using, but if you like them, that's all that matters, THX Randy & Brian, You guys have a great weekend! 🇺🇸
I'm not sold on em in general either. Not sure what it is but something.🤷♂️
@@ToolsandTargets If I remember correctly, It was on who-tee-who's channel, in 9mm, either way, I enjoy all of your videos, THX Again! 👊 😎
Gimmick round just like the RIP ammo. You calibrate gel by firing a .177 steel BB at 590 fps +/-15 fps into the gelatin; it should penetrate 2.97 to 3.75 inches. So the pieces that break off are basically equivalent to being shot with a BB gun a few times, neither would get past any bone and you are left with a FMJ. Just buy HST's in whatever caliber you carry and be done. Each to their own.
Except I don't see anywhere listed that federal makes HST in 45 Colt.
@@Catgat37 I don't either and I swear I have some somewhere lol. I do have Underwood loaded with XTP though, and I would take that over this any day, but each to their own.
@@37gdog I would too. I mainly just run federal semi jacketed soft point 225 GR. Got some Grizzly hollowpoints and some hornady critical defense recently that I have not tested. I don't have a Judge, but am considering carrying my Ruger Vaquero on occasion 🤔
@@Catgat37 I just got back from the range shooting the new Judge Home Defender. I have a Holosun 407 and a Crimson Trace rail laser on it. It's accurate enough to do the job. At 7 yards shooting Nobel Sport Law Enforcement 3" 4 ball .40 buck, it's about a 3-4 inch hole in the target after firing all five shots. I like that with just the laser. I sighted in a bit high at 25 with some 45LC and was shooting 8 inch plates at 50yds consistently. It's a fun gun to play with, not every gun has to serve a purpose lol.
@@37gdog yeah, I have a 7.5 inch BFR in 45 Colt/410. It groups about a 5 inch spread with 3 inch 4 pellet 000 buck without choke installed. I have not tried groups with the choke. Definitely a fun gun.
I have quite a bit of this civil defense and pilgrim ammo. It's not one of my carry ammos but I do have it as a backup ammo.
It's definitely different.
Taurus = Judge
Tools = Jury
💥👨⚖️💥
MY GRANDMOTHER WOULD GET ON TO MY GRAND DAD ABOUT CUSSING ..... !!!!!!! HE WOULD SAY .... !!!!! IT'S WORTH EVER WORD MAM .... !!!!!!!! GREAT VIDEO ... !!!!! THANK YOU TOOL ...!!!!!! DOUBLE G. HERE ...!!!!!
😂😂😂 Thank you sir!
Thumbs Up T&T 👍
Please test these Liberty Civil Defense
in your Bond Arms Grizzly 🐻
🇦🇺😎👍Crazy science my friend…did you say the f word 🤣?….man it’s ripped the ass out of the jelly contraption….just judging the results I’d call that a reckless death ☠….I’d say 100% dangerous 🙈🏁…. Thankyou Sir
I made up my own compound F words!🤣🤣🤣
Good test, but I am not keen on these bullets. I like to hit what I aim at, and if those bullets curve in tissue the way they do in gel it might miss vital structures. I'll stick to more conventional ammo.
Thank you sir. Not sold on them in general either.😎👍
Brother tools you did a fantastic job testing these freedom seeds. I enjoy your videos and you have definitely showed me more options on freedom seeds.
Thank you , my friend!😎👊
FRAGTASTIC. Good test enjoy the Judge testing. Bring out the Circuit Judge. I think you would really have the splinter maximum effect. Lol. Civil Defense is for real. Don’t have any of that around here. So question how do you like the Circuit Judge? Still performing good for you? Be safe and thanks for sharing. 🇺🇸👍⭐️🇺🇸
I really like it. Very unique gun to have in the collection.😎👍
Great 45LC test out of those judges. 🇺🇸👊
Thank you sir. Looks like a good round for these.😎👍
I think you may find the forckng cone has an extremely high polish and that is making bullets burnish to matching extremely high polish as they jump the cylinder gap . So they would be mirror like and reflect light as they pass the shadow sensor of the chronograph. They read by how long the it takes the shadow to pass over one sensor and reach the second. If the light is reflecting off of the rifling engraved areas, which is more compression than cut engraving ,the bullet would be reflecting light in all directions including down as it spins . I'm not sure how else a particular type of gun could repeatedly have the same issue with such a system . Light HAS to be involved in some way.
Yeah, it is without a doubt something with these Judges causing some sort of issue. It happens with them almost every time with all types of ammo or distance I put between them and the chrono.
Thanks for the hard work!!!! The jelly looks like about 1600-1800 fps. Great for blowing up musk melons!!! But I'd take a 3" .357 with 125s. These .410s are too big.
Definitely take a .357 over these for anything serious. These are more for "hey look at this thing!" for me😎👍
Great ammo test I will have to pick up a box for my judge
Another good Jelly Test Tools Really enjoy watching them Stay Safe Stay 2A Strong 🇺🇸
Thank you sir. Have a great weekend!😎👊
These sure are good for killing jelly blocks. I think I would pass as my carry round. Thanks T&T.
Jelly monster doesn't stand a chance!😎👊
I wish more companies manufactured conventional revolvers in .45 Colt.
That would be nice. Most stuff is either a novelty like these Judges or derringers, or single actions.
Glad I don't have to clean that jelly. Your High School Teacher was right about you becoming a Disruptive Person 😂. Start with first shot in pelvic region & go up. Don't know on this one. Stubby Snubby is at least 20dcb louder than 6.5in.
Yeah, it was a loud one for sure. I started to clean em for the batch of tests I did today, but I just unwrapped some new ones instead. 😆😆😆
@@ToolsandTargetsKinda like cleaning out a birdshot load? 💥🙏
Would love to see what these rounds would do out of your Bond Arms derringer. Thanks for the great videos!
😎👊
In my experience with my BAD in 45/410, the 45 keyholes somewhat often, leading me to believe this wouldn't starburst as intended. Perhaps due to only 1 inch of the derringer being rifled.
When a chrony does not like a pistol it may be the muzzle blast. Next time you shoot a Judge, try backing up a bit. I found that I need 15 feet (or more) to get 100% results.
Yeah, it's definitely something to do with the blast from these Judges in particular. It happens nearly every time. I've stood far enough back that I was worried about the accuracy of these things hitting the chrono, and still get crazy errors from them.
Man I love these Civil Defense rounds for my home defense handguns in 40cal and wife's 9mm. Seems like they'd make anyone change their prior plans immediately.. thanks for the info be safe
Got a .40 test of them coming next week.😎👍
@@ToolsandTargets my ccw is a shield n 40cal and they definitely hit hard from that size tool but I use them in my full size M&P pro series 40cal for home defense. Wow are they loud as hell though
Love the channel bro! Maybe invest in a better chrono in the future, or perhaps put it on its side, since I've noticed that seems to mitigate some inaccurate measurements. Electronics are super cool, when they work lol! Keep up the awesome videos!
So are those defensive rounds you're shooting in this video are they standard pressure for just your standard pressure 45 Colt pistol? With a lightweight slug obviously?
Wow, difficult test. I guess you’d need a giant jelly block to get the whole picture. Interesting, though. It would be great if you could settle the chrono issues, then compare those judges to an ordinary .45 Colt revolver. 👍
It always fights me with these Judges. It hates em.😆
Never have had to use it, hope I never do. But I have some in .357 magnum for my S&W 686 as well as .45 long colt for my Bond Arms Derringer with a 3" barrel
This confirms my decision to stick to using heavy .45 Colt rounds & avoiding the entire class of Taurus Judge revolvers.
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Great video...but I have question is it safe to shoot.45 colt civil defense in my cimarrón pistolero single action
That looks like an absolute mess for a surgeon. Not sure what they accomplish with such shallow penetration with respect to the shedding of the petals, but it definitely looks brutal. I really like segmented rounds for small game, but I am not sold on them for larger animals or self defense. Thanks for the video. It looked very frustrating, and I appreciate your work.
Agreed. These look like another good option in something like this Judge, but not for my main stuff.
What the heck was all of that? That was a rough one. Made you work extra hard. Any test after that one has got to be a breeze now. 😁👍🇺🇸👊
It was already absolutely miserable with the wind and then this. I knew it was coming though. It happens with the Judges almost every time. no matter what round or distance I try to stand.😆😆😆
Awesome ammo and test! Wonder what it would do out of a lever gun...
Thank you sir. I need to get me a .45 Colt Henry to go with the collection.
@@ToolsandTargets I've got an old Rossi 92 that's been a nice rifle.
Those 2" were not exactly impressive although Im not with those people who say that would only be a flesh wound minus the core,
But the 6" was a different story, that extra fps seemed to really wake them up as that whole track looked nasty,
Id like to see if going even longer like a 16" or 18" would do better,
Also this explosive fragmentation round could be great if the company made a heavy version say 200gr to 250gr like a sjhp with the hollow point almost to the base with some internal slices inside to round to weaken it in a calibre like 45+p+/45 super/460 Rowland or a bit lighter with say a full power 775fpe 180gr to 225gr fragmenting 10mm or 357 mag or sig of 158gr to 180gr,
If they had a heavy round from the start and got the whole round to detonate with high fpe you wouldn't need the base for penetration as the waight and fps plus the larger pieces a heavy round would produce would get it there and the wounding on the way would be incredible,
Imagine this 78gr but much more power and 3 to 5 times the weight, maximum damage no over penetration.
Yeah, I would love to see all of these Civil Defense with some more weight to em.
Is there any chance you can re-test these and the .357 Magnum Civil Defense with your new chronograph? I'd really like to see some accurate velocity readings. It seems hard to find some tests with these two calibers in particular with the Civil Defense stuff. Seems like the only Liberty Ammo stuff most people care about is the 9mm and 10mm.
Also, it'd be great (and kinda funny) to see this stuff tested out of a Colt Single Action Army (or a clone).
Wow !!! That would be messy...
😂 i had a similar day of words...
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Love your content been going back over a year watching videos and binge watching 😂 great video as usual
Appreciate that, brother!😎👊
That new Judge Executive model is pretty sharp looking for a chunky carry revolver. 👍
Local shop has one in stock. I really like how they used a brass rod in the front sight.
Imagine it ported & having to pull the trigger with that ammo in it about 3:00AM in your home. Be AC/DC time "The Walls Were Shaking All Night Long" Concussion would shake Granny's dentures off the nightstand. 😂😂
@@billdye3530 🤣🤣🤣
Fancy stuff! Thanks for the video.
Appreciate ya!😎👊
Perhaps if you backed up to 10-15 feet and what if you used a Black Sharpie and colored the projectile black then fired it maybe???
Tried it on this one. It's always this way with the Judges for some reason.😆😆😆
Fine example of a "sit yer ass down" round.
Yes indeed.😎👍
I have Bondarms 2 1/2” shooting Barnes all copper 45LC…it’s a beast…Hate it too death because the Daringer itself feels like a brick in my pocket 😂
I think these rounds are doing what they are designed to do! If I was defending myself in a populated area,I wouldn't worry about over penetration & when it dumps the energy,I don't think the bad guy would get very far...& the doctor would have a hard time getting all the fragments out! Maybe the coroner! I definitely would not like to get shot with those " mini grenade" type hollow points!
Are the barrels rifled in them Judge pistols Tools
Yessir.
The liberty civil defense ammunition will definitely stop a threat
Messy stuff.😎👍
I have that ammo in 38spl for my RIA snubnose. I'll probably just use it at the range.
It's impressive in the gel, but I'm not sold on it for my main calibers.
I'm not sure what other offerings are in 45 LC, but at least they would cause a heck of a mess.
Mhmm
Good testing. Thorough, appreciate it.
Thank you sir.😎👍
IMO the Judge is just a novelty that can, with the right ammo, possibly defend a person. The guns are huge when compared to the performance they offer. Any S&W, Ruger or Colt in 357 Mag with a 2'', 3'' or 4'' barrel is a far superior self defense revolver. Likewise any decent quality mid sized semiauto 9mm, 357 Sig, 40 S&W or 45 ACP is also a far better choice than a Judge. I'd even rather carry my Ruger LCPII 380 than a Judge
I was with you until the end!😆😆😆
Thanks for the video. Another good test.
Thank you sir. Appreciate you!
I had to play this at 1/2 speed to understand anything you said.
As long as you watch!😆
You need a Garmin Chronograph.. spendy, but accurate and gives you ft pounds of energy
I use a Labradar now. It gives you all the info you want all the way out to 100 yards. The Garmin only reads at the muzzle.
Howdy Tools 🔧 😎 how bad was the recoil between the two? Older arthritis hands handle that beast? Just curious 🤔 Thank you sir.
Really didn't notice much difference between the two. They were lighter recoil than a standard 9mm round, just pretty loud.😎👍
impressive. I wonder if that ammo is safe to use in an Italian copy of the .45 colt single action army revolver.
Not familiar with that gun. These are very light recoiling rounds but I'm not sure what kind of pressures they run.
@@ToolsandTargets I am referring to replica copies of the 1873 colt army revolver. This gun was carried by troopers and many civilians. Think of the guns use by A Baldwin to shoot his colleague on a movie set.
I did look it up and there was a claim that they were ok to shoot in such thin cylinder walled revolvers.
out of my 2inch taurus i get 1894fps in 357 mag.
Speedy stuff.😎👍
See you soon Tools
Thank you, brother!
I can see that they all went in straight and then dove down.
Yeah once they get out of balance, they get crazy.😎👍
You said it right “stupid thing”. Back to the drawing board! 🤣😂
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That crono testing was very confusing lol nice video tho
Confusing to say the least.😂😂😂
Great performance IMO ffor the good old revolvers!
Yeah, it would be good up close from these.😎👍
I have a lot to say on this one. my sympathies to you if you are going to reuse that block. Good luck to any surgeon that tries to remove those from someone. Do the fragments travel far enough to be effective even if it is a chest shot? Is that disc much bigger than a 22 round? This bullet is not one I could judge by the gel test. ( pun not intended but it fits) Good test though.
I'm not completely sold on these Civil Defense rounds. Looks like another good option in this case but I personally prefer conventional stuff in my main use calibers and guns.