Since the GT3 RS is not available in North America, many of us 996 GT3 owners have turned our cars into sleeper track weapons. It is a fantastic car. I do have an aftermarket exhaust and the sound is glorious.
There was no direct mention to the original reason why Kussmaul suggested a homologation version. I have only read english speaking reports of it and they all referer to wheel journals. This leaves a bit interpretation. Especially with the MacPherson unit when you lower the car the roll centers fall much more than the lowering is - typically 10 mm ride lowering falls roll centers about 27 mm. In terms of roll this difference partly negates the gain by lowering CoG. Also the MacPeherson tends to loose its camber gain when it is lowered. The Carreras were designed to have 0.25 deg/cm or 15 mins/cm camber gain but when you drop a MacPherson car by 40 mm there is hardly any gain left. Sure they is not much suspension travel either in a track car but all this really refers to the need of new set of pick up points. The journals can also refer to the hub bearings. This is the time that car industry (unfortunately) went for hub units instead of conical rollers. Hub units are ok for straight driving but hard cornering the load capacity numbers are simply too low (in F1-cars they can change the ball bearings after every start). The journalists always deal with Andreas Preuinger about the GT3s. I wish someone would make a deep interview with Kussmaul because he is actually the guy behind the 996 RS-idea and was very much in charge of the road to race conversions at Weissach. I also want to make a remark about Carrera vs. GT3. First, IMO, the real difference in the powerline. The Mezger is truly extra-ordinary good where as the Carrera engine is only good by performance and it has some reliability issues. It is definitely better than its reputation but it is no rugged race engine like the Mezger. Then when it comes to handling, the GT3 is not a very road friendly car. It is a car designed to be driven on a race track and the RS even more so. When it comes to handling on a normal worn roads with pot holes and all kinds of irregularities - the Carrera is better, hands down better. And even the Carrera suspension has been critizised to bee too harsh for theB-roads[e.g. Steve Bennett, ex-editor of 911&PW]. I have upgraded my Carrera with Bilstein B16/PSS10 and Powerflex bushes. Frankly I can not say it is better than the OEM standard suspension on a B-road. Stiffness helps some things but worseness some. Stiffness eats suspension travel and the wheels can have hard time following the irregular road. Another key difference between road and track is that at tracks you can usually have relaively stiff AR-bars where as on the road they easily make the car too warp-stiff and this upsets the corner weights on an uneven road or a twisted propeller road, cambered turn-ins. One observation about the Carrera-GT3-RS axis is that we tend to rely a lot to car journalists and they keep using words like ”ultimate 911” which I find rather misleading. Tim here used the word too but I do not really see him as a car journo but a top racing driver with touring and sports cars. The Carrera-GT3 difference: Really, it is horses for the courses. A Carrera is really a sports-GT car where as the GT3 is a sports-racing car. A Carrera is basically a daily car where as the GT3 and especially the RS are special cars for weekends and tracks. The reputation of the GT3 is there for a reason. However, a GT3 is a spcialized tool and I find it a bit unfair to compare it with a Carrera because the other one is a kettle and the other a frying pan. They are made for different purposes. And like I said, controversially, on a typical worn out B-road, the Carrera is a better tool, regardless what some chris harris’, bonvingdons and catchpoles say.
@@MagicAyrtonforeverTH-camrs and stuffy rich people on the Porsche forums counting their car as a 1 of 1 because of the color stitching their car has and why it’s so rare
Here's something of a sacrilegious question: is it possible to reversibly retrofit the headlights and front bumper of a 996.1 to a 996.2 GT3, given it's a narrowbody car? I never liked the facelift features.
Having owned a Mk1 CS with a full cage and a .2 without I would have said the extra noise is due to the transmission of noise through the roll cage from the floor.
Since you mentioned 'throttle response', I'll have to admit that I felt like my 6-3 had a rag stuck in the exhaust. Heel/toe was nary impossible due to the horrible throttle lag. Turns out it is simply solved by throttle mapping. I dropped in a Sprint Boost throttle mapper (3 levels/7 sub levels ea) and *thankfully* solved the sleepy throttle problem. Mr. Mezger sure got the rest of this one juuuuust right.
That is quite weird. Are you sure everything was ok with your engine? If your ”6-3” refers to going from 6th to 3rd - what was your starting rpm going for the change. It would be an unusually big rpm difference and certainly difficult to get perfect every time. I find two gears ok but three is a bit too big step at one time. If I look at the ratio chart (996 GT3) 3rd … 1.56:1 6th … 0.83:1 That is almost double and if your target for third is, say 4000 rpm, you would have to start with 6th at appr. 2000 rpm top start with. It will be sluggish with any ”big” engine. I think a three gear jump is too much or at least requires perfect timing. In general the ”German way” of setting gas pedal vs. throttle opening does not really promote using t&h or blip at the lower half (initial rpm)of the rpm-range. They tend to open the throttle quite a lot with the first movement of the pedal. This coupled with a heavier flywheel makes the t&h really sluggish and delicate to get perfect. You really need to start listening the revs to lift the clutch at the right time. T&H should be, IMO, just a fast act with no feathering. But once you are above 3..4000 rpm to start with both the Carrera and Mezgers blip-perfectly. I like to use t&h and blip always but Ive come to the conclusion that it is not good under 3000 rpm, too much coincidence to get it perfect, too much listening and waiting. Upper half rpm-range, no problem, but you seldom are there on the public road.
Gear ratios are the same for both GT3 and RS. I’m pretty sure the engines are identical too. Also the ex factory weight difference was more like 20kg not 50kg. 👍🏻
I think the rs had a shorter gear ratio… i used to shorten the ratios, which is the best improvement on the 996gt3. Instantly feels like 200% more torque, subjectively
At least for street play. Folks driving around full cages without a helmet on risk leaving their mind where everybody can see what they've been thinking........
Since the GT3 RS is not available in North America, many of us 996 GT3 owners have turned our cars into sleeper track weapons. It is a fantastic car. I do have an aftermarket exhaust and the sound is glorious.
There was no direct mention to the original reason why Kussmaul suggested a homologation version. I have only read english speaking reports of it and they all referer to wheel journals. This leaves a bit interpretation.
Especially with the MacPherson unit when you lower the car the roll centers fall much more than the lowering is - typically 10 mm ride lowering falls roll centers about 27 mm. In terms of roll this difference partly negates the gain by lowering CoG. Also the MacPeherson tends to loose its camber gain when it is lowered. The Carreras were designed to have 0.25 deg/cm or 15 mins/cm camber gain but when you drop a MacPherson car by 40 mm there is hardly any gain left. Sure they is not much suspension travel either in a track car but all this really refers to the need of new set of pick up points.
The journals can also refer to the hub bearings. This is the time that car industry (unfortunately) went for hub units instead of conical rollers. Hub units are ok for straight driving but hard cornering the load capacity numbers are simply too low (in F1-cars they can change the ball bearings after every start).
The journalists always deal with Andreas Preuinger about the GT3s. I wish someone would make a deep interview with Kussmaul because he is actually the guy behind the 996 RS-idea and was very much in charge of the road to race conversions at Weissach.
I also want to make a remark about Carrera vs. GT3. First, IMO, the real difference in the powerline. The Mezger is truly extra-ordinary good where as the Carrera engine is only good by performance and it has some reliability issues. It is definitely better than its reputation but it is no rugged race engine like the Mezger. Then when it comes to handling, the GT3 is not a very road friendly car. It is a car designed to be driven on a race track and the RS even more so. When it comes to handling on a normal worn roads with pot holes and all kinds of irregularities - the Carrera is better, hands down better. And even the Carrera suspension has been critizised to bee too harsh for theB-roads[e.g. Steve Bennett, ex-editor of 911&PW].
I have upgraded my Carrera with Bilstein B16/PSS10 and Powerflex bushes. Frankly I can not say it is better than the OEM standard suspension on a B-road. Stiffness helps some things but worseness some. Stiffness eats suspension travel and the wheels can have hard time following the irregular road. Another key difference between road and track is that at tracks you can usually have relaively stiff AR-bars where as on the road they easily make the car too warp-stiff and this upsets the corner weights on an uneven road or a twisted propeller road, cambered turn-ins.
One observation about the Carrera-GT3-RS axis is that we tend to rely a lot to car journalists and they keep using words like ”ultimate 911” which I find rather misleading. Tim here used the word too but I do not really see him as a car journo but a top racing driver with touring and sports cars. The Carrera-GT3 difference: Really, it is horses for the courses. A Carrera is really a sports-GT car where as the GT3 is a sports-racing car. A Carrera is basically a daily car where as the GT3 and especially the RS are special cars for weekends and tracks.
The reputation of the GT3 is there for a reason. However, a GT3 is a spcialized tool and I find it a bit unfair to compare it with a Carrera because the other one is a kettle and the other a frying pan. They are made for different purposes. And like I said, controversially, on a typical worn out B-road, the Carrera is a better tool, regardless what some chris harris’, bonvingdons and catchpoles say.
I used to daily a comfort spec GT3, back when they were "cheaper". Such a fun car.
The price is a joke now.. Not sure who can actually afford them.
@@MagicAyrtonforeverTH-camrs and stuffy rich people on the Porsche forums counting their car as a 1 of 1 because of the color stitching their car has and why it’s so rare
I must have watched this unique video more than 20 times by now, love both versions, would be thrilled to own any of them.
Excellent vid! And on what everyone knows is the best gt3 😉
I own the standard 996 GT3 since new and love it every time I drive it, last 20 years…
Great video. Very interesting. Thanks for making it.
Here's something of a sacrilegious question: is it possible to reversibly retrofit the headlights and front bumper of a 996.1 to a 996.2 GT3, given it's a narrowbody car? I never liked the facelift features.
Well done comparison of two very significant machines. One day...
Having owned a Mk1 CS with a full cage and a .2 without I would have said the extra noise is due to the transmission of noise through the roll cage from the floor.
LOVE this video! Big 996 GT3 fan. Anyone have a link to the video they mentioned about comparing all the GT3 models? Thanks!!
Thank you very very much for this comparison! Keep up the good work :)
Great vid
Since you mentioned 'throttle response', I'll have to admit that I felt like my 6-3 had a rag stuck in the exhaust. Heel/toe was nary impossible due to the horrible throttle lag. Turns out it is simply solved by throttle mapping. I dropped in a Sprint Boost throttle mapper (3 levels/7 sub levels ea) and *thankfully* solved the sleepy throttle problem. Mr. Mezger sure got the rest of this one juuuuust right.
That is quite weird. Are you sure everything was ok with your engine? If your ”6-3” refers to going from 6th to 3rd - what was your starting rpm going for the change. It would be an unusually big rpm difference and certainly difficult to get perfect every time. I find two gears ok but three is a bit too big step at one time.
If I look at the ratio chart (996 GT3)
3rd … 1.56:1
6th … 0.83:1
That is almost double and if your target for third is, say 4000 rpm, you would have to start with 6th at appr. 2000 rpm top start with. It will be sluggish with any ”big” engine. I think a three gear jump is too much or at least requires perfect timing.
In general the ”German way” of setting gas pedal vs. throttle opening does not really promote using t&h or blip at the lower half (initial rpm)of the rpm-range. They tend to open the throttle quite a lot with the first movement of the pedal. This coupled with a heavier flywheel makes the t&h really sluggish and delicate to get perfect. You really need to start listening the revs to lift the clutch at the right time. T&H should be, IMO, just a fast act with no feathering. But once you are above 3..4000 rpm to start with both the Carrera and Mezgers blip-perfectly.
I like to use t&h and blip always but Ive come to the conclusion that it is not good under 3000 rpm, too much coincidence to get it perfect, too much listening and waiting. Upper half rpm-range, no problem, but you seldom are there on the public road.
Interesting video but please drop the dreadfully intrusive background music next time!
Ah, its cool when talking. Now, when the car is running? Big no no :P
Gear ratios are the same for both GT3 and RS. I’m pretty sure the engines are identical too. Also the ex factory weight difference was more like 20kg not 50kg. 👍🏻
Only engine difference is the ram air air box. That and “allegedly” the factory put the engines that showed most power on test bench in the RS
I think the rs had a shorter gear ratio… i used to shorten the ratios, which is the best improvement on the 996gt3. Instantly feels like 200% more torque, subjectively
Great video chaps.
Great Video! Friend of mine races a modified RS in Austria. Just awesome! 🇦🇹
Very informative
I think you hear the engine more on the gt3 rs because of the rear perspex window
Hi
@@POVShotgun hi
Think I would have to have the standard gt3
Don’t like the roll cage in the rs
No
You are wrong
For road use, me too. I also don't like the graphics and colored wheels on the RS.
@@Kyle900t I find it.... interesting they got removed for the 991 GT3 RS.
At least for street play. Folks driving around full cages without a helmet on risk leaving their mind where everybody can see what they've been thinking........
Aren’t the wheels magnesium on the RS?
Anyone know if the wheels are different other than colour?
Differences between Porsche 996 GT3 MK1 and 996 GT3 MK2 ?...
Why no center console delete?
Cool!
996 GT3’s should be like $80k…these $150k cars are insane.
Narrow body 3RS ftw