Thank you so much again Dace this was the best!!! I’ve been chewing on so much from our conversation I forgot all the topics we touched! I think the twist is I got to “meet the player” too :) It was really rewarding to hear all your insights and I hope you viewers enjoy it too!
Put it in writing and call it a manifesto, this is a MTP chocked full of the flavors I crave in shmup adjacent media. Spiders meshes so well with the series and I can’t imagine a better candidate to speak their piece. While I could easily write an essay per topic that was discussed, I will focus in on two. My biggest perspective change in shmups was realizing that scoring in not “the next level” but rather a different journey altogether. But like many journeys, portions of the path run parallel and can be traversed in tandem. I would have never attempted the Crimzon Clover Arcade original 1CC if I hadn’t been forced to engage with the scoring system through the time attack mode. Being corralled into making score centric play viable by maximizing score potential and minimizing run length (5 minutes for CC time attack) is like a hyperbolic time chamber for understanding shmups in a different light. I highly recommend caravan style shmups to players nervous about trying to score a game they can’t clear. Low stakes due to concise run times and high reward in that your score improvements will be exponential early on. Second point regarding training and discipline. Learning to learn is something you can learn preemptively, but learning how YOU learn is something that comes with time. I know players who boot up emulators and will build out save states to practice with on their first time through a game because they know they’ll want to go back and use those established checkpoints to spring their practice off by regimenting their play to point towards success. And I know players (myself include) who have a very fluid approach to tackling shmups that still requires dedication and practice. My training model is pointed towards understanding the requests of the game, and creating training conditions that best emulate the live experience of the run. This can involve much hopping between practice modes, live runs, replay analysis, and most importantly: breaks from playing to allow your brain to decouple your time spent into usable information. But I wouldn’t have known that was my preferred style had I not tried other methods. Experiment with yourself and the game will speak to you. Absolutely phenomenal episode. Spiders is incredibly eloquent and I’m glad he was able to crack the nut of Shmuptopia and give the listeners more insight into Dace. Now we just gotta get the three of us together for a podcast haha. Thank you both for this!
Absolutely! I think part of what makes scoring initially appear to be the next step is that it's a path that is about getting better than before and to have as much room to work with for scoring. The ideal foundation would be to know how to clear a game pretty consistently so that you have the entire run to score in as opposed to only knowing the first couple of stages. It's misleading, though I can understand why many see what appears to be a natural progression pointing toward clearing, then scoring. You share a great point about how you might never have gotten into CC OG without dabbling with the scoring system. It's great how we can sometimes see that something is more approachable once we realize we have certain tools or knowledge at our disposal. Without that, an experience can often feel much more challenging. In many cases, even having a basic grasp of a system, like in your example, is enough to see significant changes when applied to the full run. Yeah, I'm totally on board for a session with the three of us at some point. I think dungeon crawlers would definitely be a solid time, but we'll see what we can cook up. Thanks so much for checking this out and sharing your thoughts!
Spider brought me here. Very fun conversation. It makes me realize that as gamers or game makers, we rarely allow ourselves to think so in depth about games outside of gameplay, about what they mean to us on a personal and even sometimes, philosophical level. Also, I like the idea of Shmups being part of our daily lives without obsessing too much over them, and that you guys acknowledge different games and genre throughout this episode. Too often, when try to access a game community (smash, for example) the players make me feel like playing anything other than that game is a waste of time. There's pressure, unease, and it brings unhappiness. I like that you both talk what they bring to you on a personal level. These days, I try to keep up with big single player releases like Silent Hill and Space Marine, while very slowly completing my second playthrough of Red Dead redemption 2(my favorite game). All throughout that, I find that short sessions of Crimzon Clover just bring a perfect balance into my game diet, providing bursts of raw gameplay and an incredible sense of accomplishment. All of that to say that shmups make me even happier. I subscribed to your channel! Looking forward to discover your content!
Thanks so much for sharing. I'm glad you enjoyed the topic and it's great to hear you're dipping into Crimzon Clover. What mode are you currently playing on? That game is such a wild time. Let me know if you need any help along the way.
@@Shmuptopia I'm playing novice and I'm getting close to 1cc the true final boss!! A few hours more and I'll get there. Then, give a crack to the regular mode. I discovered your Shmups and coffee vidéos. Such a nice concept! I love both so it's perfect!
I'm glad to see that you interviewed Spiders. He's an awesome up-and-coming personality in the shmup community and I think his channel is going to grow more over time.
It was a joy to listen from start to finish! Really insightful, I greatly enjoyed the shmups as sushi metaphor. The entire discussion makes it clear how much passion you have from the genre, and how you treat both this games and the act of playing them as an art fom. Can't wait to listen to all the other episodes, keep up the great work!
Thanks so much for dropping by and commenting as well. Always happy to hear people enjoy these discussions. It's always interesting to see what we get to dig into! Enjoy the rest of the series and thanks again.
Great interview. Now subbing to SpidersSTG, as well as finally picking up Risk System. As for me not picking Risk System up earlier, I wasn't a fan of the ship designs, not to mention a few boss designs being overall generic looking. I trust your opinions though, so im hoping the design choices will eventually grow on me. Have a good one Sir.
Nice! It's great to get the superplayer insights, but getting the thoughts of everyone, at all skill levels, can always bring up things you haven't really thought about. I think Spiders has the right attitude about approaching games, so there's potential there. Also, to note, on that orthodoxy thing that gets brought up around 25 min, that's always been a point of contention for me (and I commented on it in the Cygni video), because since late Cave and Touhou there has been a very strong distance between 90s and 16-bit horizontals (which are my main games), and more modern stuff influenced by danmaku, those games trying to take danmaku to horizontal like Battle Traverse, which I respect, but don't quite like conceptually. I actually don't really get to complain about this that often because people like these games, but I feel like there's this certain disconnect with how horizontal games have been made traditionally and the slow infiltration of bullet patterns that don't really read properly on the screen.
Thanks so much, Mot! It's always great to hear people appreciate these chats. The horizontal/bullet hell mix is definitely a tricky thing to pull off since you can't simply use the same approach you would with vertical. It poses some unique challenges, but also leaves a boatload of room for getting creative. Whether a game nails it or not is another matter, as you touched on.
@@Shmuptopia A lot of people use AKD or just Mike is fine (if you can remember 😊) While I’m here, I have to say, I gasped at almost every title you mentioned (Steredenn! One game that got me into shmups as well). Also, i totally played Risk System several years ago on Xbox and did not like it. Your interview made me want to revisit it to see how my views may have changed after a LOT more shmup experience.
@@anotherkellydown Once you get aligned with Risk System, it's very satisfying and some of the boss fights are wild - especially the final boss and TLB - which absolutely demand that you know how to take full advantage of the mechanics. Thanks so much for watching, Mike!
45:48 This segment was really inspiring. My ADHD simply will not allow me keep track of more than a few things at a time. To the point in which I will break down complex processes into a couple of core drivers and layer things on by sequence until I have kind of a checklist I can run through in real time. My attention span was chaos until probably my late 30s. I think it was age that just kind of quieted my mind so that I could better focus. I’m nowhere near the caliber of player that Spiders is and his content is far beyond anything I have the drive to create, but it was great to hear his experience. Anytime I hear stories like this it’s comforting and I feel less alone in my own struggles.
Thanks for checking this out and sharing! I'm happy to hear this could serve you in some way. It's always great to know people can connect with and appreciate these episodes.
@@Shmuptopia thanks for the reply. I really appreciate your content and insight. I especially like that you frequently spotlight titles like Risk System that are outside the mainstream bubble or are trying something unconventional. That game clicked with me and your 1cc helped me route my own. The interview with the developer was also fantastic. I felt like too many people were quick to write it off because of a few design decisions.
@@Mid-TierMechaPilot It's no problem. I always strive to respond. Solid to hear you enjoyed Risk System - I love the way you need to manage the barrier breaker during the tlb with those expanding rings that slowly move from right to left and you have to soak up enough charge. Such a blast of a game! In case you haven't listened to it yet, my in-depth review on Risk System is essentially me just digging deep into tiny details that all contribute to such a grand experience. Thanks for being here!
There’s this story I heard about Alan Watts who was comforting another speaker at a seminar they were attempting. The dude was panicking that he couldn’t do the talk. that he would be exposed as a fraud, etc. and asked Alan for advice. Alan said “You are a phony. And I am a phony. The difference between you and me is I am a REAL phony.” What your describing is EXACTLY how my attention worked, but I’m only figuring it out in my 40s!!! I think knowing yourself and your mind is the “real”, and building the bridge or interface to participate in the phony make you a “real phony” of the highest caliber!!! You fake it until you make it, but the trick is you find peace and laughter in the fact that you never actually make it, because nobody ever truly does, but also that you already did:) You might be interested in this book called Hyperfocus by Chris Bailey. It’s where I got the idea of the list and “list of the list” for the mental stack, and lots of other useful ideas. It was a helpful map for me and it sounds like it might be interesting for your brain too :)
Meeeeeeeeeeeeep, this was such a great listen! :D It's awesome that you two view shmups as a lifestyle, and it showed with everything that was talked about throughout this episode! Pardon me as I yap about stuff that resonated with me in this interview, heheh ^^; Spiders' humility at the beginning with wanting to do his appearance justice was fun to hear (and I can probably relate too, aaaaaaaaaa) I can *super* relate to drama being present within one's shmup runs, it's something I've been experiencing as of late too! Had an Eschatos [Original, Normal] 1CC attempt where I was scoring better than I thought I could score and made it to the final boss with 5 lives, but I just wiped out because I wasn't familiar enough with dealing with their attacks and now I'm like "gosh, am I going to expect myself to be on pace with my 12M PB as I continue going for my Normal 1CC? Am I gonna get thrown off my game because of this?" cause I'm so scorerun-pilled ;u; I actually thought Eschatos dished out extends based on score, but I eventually learned that it's based off of enemies killed, but I still cope with my scorerunning self and go "well a good offense is a good defense" when it comes to killing enemies quickly so I don't have to deal with dodging their patterns for longer than I need to... Granted, I mostly play for safety on Stage 3 and Stage 5 with some of their hecked sections, but I'm still thinking about that score, to the point where I sometimes go for WonderWitches I shouldn't quite be going for because I haven't built up their value in previous sections... Also learned that each extra life gives 1M points at the end in Normal, so maybe the real score strats are survival, haha! The talk about genre baggage was neat! Spiders mentioning the distrust in some developers being the reason for said baggage checks out. Somewhat related, but I liked how I didn't even consciously think about Seaside Drive in UFO 50 having inertia until some shmup peeps pointed it out several days after launch day! Might need to play it more to form a more solid opinion, but it feels like it does what it can with its patterns given the existence of inertia, and while there could always be visual effects to sell the car drifting, I guess the game's valid for having intertia! In general, the openness to new things being tried out in the genre is appreciated, and I remember also pondering about why one wouldn't always be firing all the time in shmups too (until I came up with examples like Ikaruga's color chaining and general shmups that have elements of milking and/or linking enemies together in a certain time frame to chain them, as well as optimal positioning for revenge bullets) Lastlyyy, Spiders' enthusiasm to score by any means necessary at 1:01:37 was fun and based to hear, and I liked the mention at around 1:08:27 of trying to have some kind of evaluation metric for shmups to really gauge how eventful moments can be in runs!
Thanks for such a well-rounded comment and I'm pleased to hear you enjoyed the session. These chats are always a blast to do and I'm happy to share them with the community. Thanks for checking this out! Additionally, I'll soon be releasing supporter-exclusive chats through my website (for "Plugged In" members specifically) where we revisit guests from previous episodes and get into additional topics/material - which I'm really looking forward to!
This was such a great interview, loved hearing Spiders talk about his journey (absolutely love his videos) and the grilling he gave you too Dace 😂 Both your thoughts about the mental ‘game’ are so interesting to me and I relate to so much you have to say. Super entertaining and enjoyable listening to- thank you for this 🤘
Oh man, he was digging deep into my dark and twisted past. Thanks for being here to check this one out, Scowsh! Glad this could serve you well during the commute.
Great interview! Its interesting to hear how his story has some timeline paralells with my own. A lot of the 2020-2023 shmup youtubers (like yourself) played a big role in my obsession with the genre. Seems like a good number of them have kind of fallen off the map, though.
Thanks guys that was amazing to hear! If I can put my grain of salt about the "1CC is just the beginning, you need to go further", I agree and disagree 😁. For me who is really into Shmups for less than 3 years 1CC is the perfect balance between knowing a game without passing 6 months and hundreds of hours on it! I'm very curious and still in "discovery mode" in the genre so I wish to clear a few Toaplan, Cave, Psikyo, NMK, Konami, IREM, Touhou, other Doujins, Raizing, Compile, Technosoft, etc to have a little overview of the genre and then put a lot of times in the few I really love (I already put few titles on this list that I need to go back later ^^)
I feel the same way…I really liked when Dace put it in the context of a relationship because I do feel like as a new player I am “young” and “playing the field” but in the back of my mind I’m maybe not looking but am hoping for “the one”. As excited as I am to gallivant around the genre, I’m also secretly jealous of those that can just pour thousands of hours into one game and be satisfied. C'est la vie! I think knowing that there’s more for us even if we’re done for know is okay. I also love checking out your videos of new games so keep going :)
@@SpidersSTGYep, we are in the same state of mind! I love your idea to go from first Compile Shmups to Raizing, you should share this journey to your channel with us ^^
Thanks for dropping by Vinu! Yeah, one thing I love is that the journey or experience can be many different things for people. You have a solid list and there are loads of awesome games there!
Spiders I knew you were FOR REAL after the Devil Blade review but I now I know you are FOR SURE when you say Eschatos is your favorite shmup :) mine too! so good I even did a remake of the first level in Construct 3 :D
@@SpidersSTG yes man :) I decided to remake the opening level for Eschatos in Construct 3 in order to learn how the engine works, to see how the game would function on a mobile phone, and also get a decent idea of how Eschatos works on the mechanical level: how the enemies HP are calculated, fire rates on the ship shots etc all that stuff . I got up all the way the first boss and partially created the first phase and then decided to stop (as I felt like I should work on my own Shmup instead at this point :D) I'll upload what I managed to create and post the link maybe!
Don't know much about the guy, but imo, you should try to interview your fellow ShmupTuber Chef Fitarus from Shoot em up Saturday . He's been putting out great content for years & not that he even cares, deserves way more subscribers than he has atm.
If it sounds like I jump to the next point or question too quickly, it's just due to cutting out long pauses in between parts of the talk. Enjoy!
Thank you so much again Dace this was the best!!! I’ve been chewing on so much from our conversation I forgot all the topics we touched! I think the twist is I got to “meet the player” too :) It was really rewarding to hear all your insights and I hope you viewers enjoy it too!
A fantastic session for sure, man! I cannot thank you enough for this.
Hell yes, man. Spiders deserves at least 100 times the amount of subscribers he has right now. My new favorite TH-camr.
🙏 so honored thank you!!!
Put it in writing and call it a manifesto, this is a MTP chocked full of the flavors I crave in shmup adjacent media. Spiders meshes so well with the series and I can’t imagine a better candidate to speak their piece.
While I could easily write an essay per topic that was discussed, I will focus in on two.
My biggest perspective change in shmups was realizing that scoring in not “the next level” but rather a different journey altogether. But like many journeys, portions of the path run parallel and can be traversed in tandem. I would have never attempted the Crimzon Clover Arcade original 1CC if I hadn’t been forced to engage with the scoring system through the time attack mode. Being corralled into making score centric play viable by maximizing score potential and minimizing run length (5 minutes for CC time attack) is like a hyperbolic time chamber for understanding shmups in a different light. I highly recommend caravan style shmups to players nervous about trying to score a game they can’t clear. Low stakes due to concise run times and high reward in that your score improvements will be exponential early on.
Second point regarding training and discipline. Learning to learn is something you can learn preemptively, but learning how YOU learn is something that comes with time. I know players who boot up emulators and will build out save states to practice with on their first time through a game because they know they’ll want to go back and use those established checkpoints to spring their practice off by regimenting their play to point towards success. And I know players (myself include) who have a very fluid approach to tackling shmups that still requires dedication and practice. My training model is pointed towards understanding the requests of the game, and creating training conditions that best emulate the live experience of the run. This can involve much hopping between practice modes, live runs, replay analysis, and most importantly: breaks from playing to allow your brain to decouple your time spent into usable information. But I wouldn’t have known that was my preferred style had I not tried other methods. Experiment with yourself and the game will speak to you.
Absolutely phenomenal episode. Spiders is incredibly eloquent and I’m glad he was able to crack the nut of Shmuptopia and give the listeners more insight into Dace.
Now we just gotta get the three of us together for a podcast haha.
Thank you both for this!
Absolutely! I think part of what makes scoring initially appear to be the next step is that it's a path that is about getting better than before and to have as much room to work with for scoring. The ideal foundation would be to know how to clear a game pretty consistently so that you have the entire run to score in as opposed to only knowing the first couple of stages. It's misleading, though I can understand why many see what appears to be a natural progression pointing toward clearing, then scoring.
You share a great point about how you might never have gotten into CC OG without dabbling with the scoring system. It's great how we can sometimes see that something is more approachable once we realize we have certain tools or knowledge at our disposal. Without that, an experience can often feel much more challenging. In many cases, even having a basic grasp of a system, like in your example, is enough to see significant changes when applied to the full run.
Yeah, I'm totally on board for a session with the three of us at some point. I think dungeon crawlers would definitely be a solid time, but we'll see what we can cook up. Thanks so much for checking this out and sharing your thoughts!
Spider brought me here. Very fun conversation. It makes me realize that as gamers or game makers, we rarely allow ourselves to think so in depth about games outside of gameplay, about what they mean to us on a personal and even sometimes, philosophical level. Also, I like the idea of Shmups being part of our daily lives without obsessing too much over them, and that you guys acknowledge different games and genre throughout this episode. Too often, when try to access a game community (smash, for example) the players make me feel like playing anything other than that game is a waste of time. There's pressure, unease, and it brings unhappiness. I like that you both talk what they bring to you on a personal level. These days, I try to keep up with big single player releases like Silent Hill and Space Marine, while very slowly completing my second playthrough of Red Dead redemption 2(my favorite game). All throughout that, I find that short sessions of Crimzon Clover just bring a perfect balance into my game diet, providing bursts of raw gameplay and an incredible sense of accomplishment. All of that to say that shmups make me even happier. I subscribed to your channel! Looking forward to discover your content!
Thanks so much for sharing. I'm glad you enjoyed the topic and it's great to hear you're dipping into Crimzon Clover. What mode are you currently playing on? That game is such a wild time. Let me know if you need any help along the way.
@@Shmuptopia I'm playing novice and I'm getting close to 1cc the true final boss!! A few hours more and I'll get there. Then, give a crack to the regular mode. I discovered your Shmups and coffee vidéos. Such a nice concept! I love both so it's perfect!
@@LeBeauFred23 Awesome! Enjoy the series and have a stellar time with the TLB in CC. It's a nasty fight for sure!
I'm glad to see that you interviewed Spiders. He's an awesome up-and-coming personality in the shmup community and I think his channel is going to grow more over time.
Thank you for stopping by, Psy! It's always great having you check these out. I appreciate your time!
Thanks Psy - you’re one of the best! Actually just saw I missed some videos, but now I have a nice stack to watch!!
It was a joy to listen from start to finish! Really insightful, I greatly enjoyed the shmups as sushi metaphor. The entire discussion makes it clear how much passion you have from the genre, and how you treat both this games and the act of playing them as an art fom.
Can't wait to listen to all the other episodes, keep up the great work!
Thanks so much for dropping by and commenting as well. Always happy to hear people enjoy these discussions. It's always interesting to see what we get to dig into! Enjoy the rest of the series and thanks again.
Great interview. Now subbing to SpidersSTG, as well as finally picking up Risk System. As for me not picking Risk System up earlier, I wasn't a fan of the ship designs, not to mention a few boss designs being overall generic looking. I trust your opinions though, so im hoping the design choices will eventually grow on me. Have a good one Sir.
Nice! It's great to get the superplayer insights, but getting the thoughts of everyone, at all skill levels, can always bring up things you haven't really thought about. I think Spiders has the right attitude about approaching games, so there's potential there.
Also, to note, on that orthodoxy thing that gets brought up around 25 min, that's always been a point of contention for me (and I commented on it in the Cygni video), because since late Cave and Touhou there has been a very strong distance between 90s and 16-bit horizontals (which are my main games), and more modern stuff influenced by danmaku, those games trying to take danmaku to horizontal like Battle Traverse, which I respect, but don't quite like conceptually. I actually don't really get to complain about this that often because people like these games, but I feel like there's this certain disconnect with how horizontal games have been made traditionally and the slow infiltration of bullet patterns that don't really read properly on the screen.
Thanks so much, Mot! It's always great to hear people appreciate these chats. The horizontal/bullet hell mix is definitely a tricky thing to pull off since you can't simply use the same approach you would with vertical. It poses some unique challenges, but also leaves a boatload of room for getting creative. Whether a game nails it or not is another matter, as you touched on.
The two giga-brained shmuppers together at last.! Very entertaining chat.
Ha, the months this took us to orchestrate! Thanks for watching, man!
What a wonderful episode! I was smiling the whole way through. Love ya both 💙
Always appreciate your positivity, Kell! (I've settled on this short form, let me know if you prefer something else.) Thanks as always!
@@Shmuptopia A lot of people use AKD or just Mike is fine (if you can remember 😊) While I’m here, I have to say, I gasped at almost every title you mentioned (Steredenn! One game that got me into shmups as well). Also, i totally played Risk System several years ago on Xbox and did not like it. Your interview made me want to revisit it to see how my views may have changed after a LOT more shmup experience.
@@anotherkellydown Once you get aligned with Risk System, it's very satisfying and some of the boss fights are wild - especially the final boss and TLB - which absolutely demand that you know how to take full advantage of the mechanics. Thanks so much for watching, Mike!
45:48 This segment was really inspiring. My ADHD simply will not allow me keep track of more than a few things at a time. To the point in which I will break down complex processes into a couple of core drivers and layer things on by sequence until I have kind of a checklist I can run through in real time. My attention span was chaos until probably my late 30s. I think it was age that just kind of quieted my mind so that I could better focus.
I’m nowhere near the caliber of player that Spiders is and his content is far beyond anything I have the drive to create, but it was great to hear his experience. Anytime I hear stories like this it’s comforting and I feel less alone in my own struggles.
Thanks for checking this out and sharing! I'm happy to hear this could serve you in some way. It's always great to know people can connect with and appreciate these episodes.
@@Shmuptopia thanks for the reply. I really appreciate your content and insight. I especially like that you frequently spotlight titles like Risk System that are outside the mainstream bubble or are trying something unconventional. That game clicked with me and your 1cc helped me route my own. The interview with the developer was also fantastic. I felt like too many people were quick to write it off because of a few design decisions.
@@Mid-TierMechaPilot It's no problem. I always strive to respond. Solid to hear you enjoyed Risk System - I love the way you need to manage the barrier breaker during the tlb with those expanding rings that slowly move from right to left and you have to soak up enough charge. Such a blast of a game! In case you haven't listened to it yet, my in-depth review on Risk System is essentially me just digging deep into tiny details that all contribute to such a grand experience. Thanks for being here!
There’s this story I heard about Alan Watts who was comforting another speaker at a seminar they were attempting. The dude was panicking that he couldn’t do the talk. that he would be exposed as a fraud, etc. and asked Alan for advice.
Alan said “You are a phony. And I am a phony. The difference between you and me is I am a REAL phony.”
What your describing is EXACTLY how my attention worked, but I’m only figuring it out in my 40s!!! I think knowing yourself and your mind is the “real”, and building the bridge or interface to participate in the phony make you a “real phony” of the highest caliber!!! You fake it until you make it, but the trick is you find peace and laughter in the fact that you never actually make it, because nobody ever truly does, but also that you already did:)
You might be interested in this book called Hyperfocus by Chris Bailey. It’s where I got the idea of the list and “list of the list” for the mental stack, and lots of other useful ideas. It was a helpful map for me and it sounds like it might be interesting for your brain too :)
Meeeeeeeeeeeeep, this was such a great listen! :D It's awesome that you two view shmups as a lifestyle, and it showed with everything that was talked about throughout this episode! Pardon me as I yap about stuff that resonated with me in this interview, heheh ^^;
Spiders' humility at the beginning with wanting to do his appearance justice was fun to hear (and I can probably relate too, aaaaaaaaaa)
I can *super* relate to drama being present within one's shmup runs, it's something I've been experiencing as of late too! Had an Eschatos [Original, Normal] 1CC attempt where I was scoring better than I thought I could score and made it to the final boss with 5 lives, but I just wiped out because I wasn't familiar enough with dealing with their attacks and now I'm like "gosh, am I going to expect myself to be on pace with my 12M PB as I continue going for my Normal 1CC? Am I gonna get thrown off my game because of this?" cause I'm so scorerun-pilled ;u; I actually thought Eschatos dished out extends based on score, but I eventually learned that it's based off of enemies killed, but I still cope with my scorerunning self and go "well a good offense is a good defense" when it comes to killing enemies quickly so I don't have to deal with dodging their patterns for longer than I need to... Granted, I mostly play for safety on Stage 3 and Stage 5 with some of their hecked sections, but I'm still thinking about that score, to the point where I sometimes go for WonderWitches I shouldn't quite be going for because I haven't built up their value in previous sections... Also learned that each extra life gives 1M points at the end in Normal, so maybe the real score strats are survival, haha!
The talk about genre baggage was neat! Spiders mentioning the distrust in some developers being the reason for said baggage checks out. Somewhat related, but I liked how I didn't even consciously think about Seaside Drive in UFO 50 having inertia until some shmup peeps pointed it out several days after launch day! Might need to play it more to form a more solid opinion, but it feels like it does what it can with its patterns given the existence of inertia, and while there could always be visual effects to sell the car drifting, I guess the game's valid for having intertia!
In general, the openness to new things being tried out in the genre is appreciated, and I remember also pondering about why one wouldn't always be firing all the time in shmups too (until I came up with examples like Ikaruga's color chaining and general shmups that have elements of milking and/or linking enemies together in a certain time frame to chain them, as well as optimal positioning for revenge bullets)
Lastlyyy, Spiders' enthusiasm to score by any means necessary at 1:01:37 was fun and based to hear, and I liked the mention at around 1:08:27 of trying to have some kind of evaluation metric for shmups to really gauge how eventful moments can be in runs!
Thanks for such a well-rounded comment and I'm pleased to hear you enjoyed the session. These chats are always a blast to do and I'm happy to share them with the community. Thanks for checking this out! Additionally, I'll soon be releasing supporter-exclusive chats through my website (for "Plugged In" members specifically) where we revisit guests from previous episodes and get into additional topics/material - which I'm really looking forward to!
This was such a great interview, loved hearing Spiders talk about his journey (absolutely love his videos) and the grilling he gave you too Dace 😂 Both your thoughts about the mental ‘game’ are so interesting to me and I relate to so much you have to say. Super entertaining and enjoyable listening to- thank you for this 🤘
Oh man, he was digging deep into my dark and twisted past. Thanks for being here to check this one out, Scowsh! Glad this could serve you well during the commute.
Love you both :D
Thanks for being here!
I love the discussion regarding meditation and playing shmups/stg's at around 1:13:26!
Happy to hear you enjoyed this. That part of the session is my favorite. Thanks for checking this out!
1:11:09 This analogy goes so hard!
Thanks for checking this out!
I meant to say Mark is the “heart” not the “body” lol. I’m glad you dug it!!!
Spider is onto Dace's master plan of starting a shmup cult
100%! I’ll be a recruiter :)
Great interview! Its interesting to hear how his story has some timeline paralells with my own. A lot of the 2020-2023 shmup youtubers (like yourself) played a big role in my obsession with the genre.
Seems like a good number of them have kind of fallen off the map, though.
Glad you enjoyed it, Goji! This was a blast of a session to record.
This is a fantastic interview with a lot to dissect and process! Loved the segment on skill gap and overcoming that as a new or intermediate player!
It was a fun session to do. It's always great getting to know players more and I'm eager to continue banging these out when I can.
@ you do great things for the TH-cam shmup community! I also loved how you went over mindset, which is so crucial to grow in this genre.
@@unhallowedstg I appreciate it, man! Mindset is one of the most significant factors.
Thanks guys that was amazing to hear!
If I can put my grain of salt about the "1CC is just the beginning, you need to go further", I agree and disagree 😁.
For me who is really into Shmups for less than 3 years 1CC is the perfect balance between knowing a game without passing 6 months and hundreds of hours on it!
I'm very curious and still in "discovery mode" in the genre so I wish to clear a few Toaplan, Cave, Psikyo, NMK, Konami, IREM, Touhou, other Doujins, Raizing, Compile, Technosoft, etc to have a little overview of the genre and then put a lot of times in the few I really love (I already put few titles on this list that I need to go back later ^^)
I feel the same way…I really liked when Dace put it in the context of a relationship because I do feel like as a new player I am “young” and “playing the field” but in the back of my mind I’m maybe not looking but am hoping for “the one”. As excited as I am to gallivant around the genre, I’m also secretly jealous of those that can just pour thousands of hours into one game and be satisfied. C'est la vie!
I think knowing that there’s more for us even if we’re done for know is okay. I also love checking out your videos of new games so keep going :)
@@SpidersSTGYep, we are in the same state of mind! I love your idea to go from first Compile Shmups to Raizing, you should share this journey to your channel with us ^^
Thanks for dropping by Vinu! Yeah, one thing I love is that the journey or experience can be many different things for people. You have a solid list and there are loads of awesome games there!
Spiders I knew you were FOR REAL after the Devil Blade review but I now I know you are FOR SURE when you say Eschatos is your favorite shmup :) mine too! so good I even did a remake of the first level in Construct 3 :D
I think I'll revisit Risk System too :)
Not as real as the D.L.U.K. what’s up fam!!! Tell me more about the Construct 3 remake that sounds very cool!
@@SpidersSTG yes man :) I decided to remake the opening level for Eschatos in Construct 3 in order to learn how the engine works, to see how the game would function on a mobile phone, and also get a decent idea of how Eschatos works on the mechanical level: how the enemies HP are calculated, fire rates on the ship shots etc all that stuff . I got up all the way the first boss and partially created the first phase and then decided to stop (as I felt like I should work on my own Shmup instead at this point :D)
I'll upload what I managed to create and post the link maybe!
Don't know much about the guy, but imo, you should try to interview your fellow ShmupTuber Chef Fitarus from Shoot em up Saturday . He's been putting out great content for years & not that he even cares, deserves way more subscribers than he has atm.
Can we expect Meet the player Jheng anytime soon?
I'm not familiar with Jheng. Feel free to share a few details!