A few points: 1. The comfort oriented low end boats are really motorsailors. The windward performance is such that they will mostly motor upwind. 2. They will not sail better in any direction than a monohull of the same cost. 3. A major difference between a low end Leopard or Lagoon and a boat like an Outremer is not just performance but build quality. An Outremer is built by boatbuilders not factory workers. It's far less likely to suffer from the well documented problems that Leopards and Lagoons have had: bulkhead failures, inadequate structural glasswork, windows falling out(!), generally poor standard of construction and QC. 4. The performance boats will motor better with lower fuel consumption as lower drag.
Everyone wants to talk about production as a con....but yet they are driving Fords and Chevys all day long....There is a lot more room for error in a one off boat than a production boat. I worked in large scale construction and can tell you not a single person skins the cat the same way when it comes to building. There is a reason why production line and SOPs are developed. Have you seen the Leopard and Lagoon owners FB pages these groups are worth there weight in GOLD.
@@adventurecrewsyes, and seeing leaks and shoddy production quality on the Leopards in particular are stunningly bad. You just responded to one of my comments that you were learning in public. Now you’re putting out videos that would really require experience.
Performance doesn't just stand for "faster". These boats are made from better, stronger materials and are more often custom built. The HH boss said it right, if you want to sail oceans safely, be able to sail to windward, turn off the engines and enjoy the sailing then youre not going to get that with a Lagoon, Leopard, FP, Bali or another boat built for the charter market. Putting a carbon mast on a boat with big fat hulls doesn't magically turn it into a performance boat. It all works out though as the people who enjoy the anchoring/cruising/social side of it have a lot of boats to choose from. 2nd hand performance boats though are very hard to find.
Nice video & definitely a hotly debated topic indeed! Like you said, it really depends on your mission with the boat and your budget. In our research to buy a boat and talking to couples who were successful and those who gave up the lifestyle, a reoccurring theme was having a boat that was too slow and having to motor all of the time. Now if you are a power boater type, then who cares just put the hammer down, but that HH (and Balance to a lesser degree) you toured will actually be sailing at 8 kts in 8 kts of wind, were on the comfy boats you don't even put the sails up unless you have 12-15kts of wind, and then you are doing 6.5kts and maybe can point to 55AWA. Now is paying hundreds of thousands of dollars more for a performance boat worth it to save $4k/yr on diesel, nope, but it sure is a hell of a lot more fun. Performance boats are about the ability to sail in light wind & the autonomy it gives you, not top end speed.
IMO, the biggest compelling feature of a performance catamaran is the ability to perform in light air where you would be motoring on a lagoon or leopard. And the ability to sail close hauled. 20degrees AWA. It really isn't about the top speed. It's about versatility within a variety of wind conditions.
Great point and I agree light air is a big deal! It take every bit of 10knts to really move our boat...but light air means you need a light boat...and they means I do not get my Ice Maker LOL
Getting older and it's cruising and comfort all the way. My thrills are looking for the best dive site and spending time underwater. I'd rather be comfortable and take a little longer to enjoy the trip. You do need enough to get away from storms - but that seems mostly planning over performance. Donate for a Dream
@@allynonderdonk7577 any monohull that costs the same $$$$?. If you ignore any full keel nonsense, most fin keel moderate displacement monohulls will, dollar for dollar sail at least as well as most condomarans, and upwind the mono will be faster, much faster. I have a relatively quick cruising monohull and it will outperform nearly all multihulls until you get to about twice the price I paid at least.
Performance does not necessarily fast. Performance means the ability to go where you want as fast as YOU want, Performance is all about the boat doing what you want, how you want ti. However every manufacturer wants you to buy their product, so they will try to get you to see their way. Its like buying a house. Do you want a green stylw house or just a plain hgouse to live in.
Loved seeing these beautiful boats, just wow!😯 I know you guys had a great time seeing old friends and making new ones at this show...😉what a difference a year makes, right!? Next year 🥰I will volunteer to be your personal camera crew so we can record all the feels as you live in the moment so to speak. 😁😊
Great vid Cole, allot of great info in a short time. Found your channel today thru KYoungs, and am happy to see you married, and doing what you Want to do, it’s been awhile since we spoke but Congrats, Jesse
I am new to your channel. I started watching You Tube videos with Odd life crafting, then Ran sailing and finally sailing Yaba. All of them Mono hull boats. My question why the emphasis on catamarans at the boat show.
My guess would be the relative stability both on passage and on anchor. And also speed when it comes to performance cruising multihulls. But that of course comes at a cost... If you try going on sailing on a mono vs a cat you can decide for yourself.
Most likely for the same reason pontoon boats are popular. It is like a floating apartment or in the case of a pontoon a floating porch. You have a lot of space to hang out and do whatever. The cost is quite a bit higher than a monohull of the same length and the marina costs are also quite a bit higher. In addition they are not considered true blue water boats and the general idea is not to be present when a storm or rough seas arrive so you note the impending weather and use that speed to get out of the way. I'm not sure that is a valid strategy but that is the strategy. For most people island hopping in fair weather this is probably a good choice and therefore the future for the consumer market.
@@danielboughton3624 Lots of cats have circumnavigated. But yeah... there are performance cruising multihulls that have flipped. Sailing will never be risk free regardless of what kind of boat you're on. Sailing La Vagabonde, The Sailing Family, Cat Greatcircle and Young Barnacles here on Y-tube seem to have done fine this far though...
@@angela1984a La Vagabonde and others are very very careful about when and where they go. If there is even a sniff of a storm they are headed for a lee shore or marina. I'm not saying that you can't do these things in a cat. People do crazy things in little 16 foot wayfarers and in boston whalers but it is much riskier. Cats do however have a lot of flat space that is great living space where a blue water monohull does not have that kind of space. I suppose another comparison would be an expedition boat v.s. a blue water boat. If you are going into ice or around the horn you might want one of those.
Hey hey! Thanks so much for checking in! We've taken some time off from YT to catch up on a massive amount of projects and working on other parts of our business. We'll be back to posting in the New Year! Merry Christmas and thanks for checking on us!
It’s not that they are worried about fuel costs, it’s about the autonomy you gain by not using so much fuel you aren’t worried about where your next fuel stop is going to be. Think of it like range anxiety when driving an electric vehicle…but the opposite from a “being green” perspective. Burn way less fuel because you can sail while the other boats are motoring.
@@adventurecrews There no real info or knowledge here - just talking from mostly salesmen - so it comes down as noice. If you have no interest of sailing, have useless sails and weights it down the boat will sail like shit - whatever the design. If you like and try to learn and actually sails, has good sails and keep the boat as light as possible almost anything will move. I know Lagoon 380 owners that outsails bigger performance monos at windward bec the can sail, keep their boat reasonable light and clean and has good sails.
Hey TRIPLEWHOPPER, no quitters here. Just taking some time off to strategize and plan for season 2. We’re just getting started, be watching out for us in 2024.. it’s gonna be epic 💪🏼
A few points:
1. The comfort oriented low end boats are really motorsailors. The windward performance is such that they will mostly motor upwind.
2. They will not sail better in any direction than a monohull of the same cost.
3. A major difference between a low end Leopard or Lagoon and a boat like an Outremer is not just performance but build quality. An Outremer is built by boatbuilders not factory workers. It's far less likely to suffer from the well documented problems that Leopards and Lagoons have had: bulkhead failures, inadequate structural glasswork, windows falling out(!), generally poor standard of construction and QC.
4. The performance boats will motor better with lower fuel consumption as lower drag.
Great points!
Everyone wants to talk about production as a con....but yet they are driving Fords and Chevys all day long....There is a lot more room for error in a one off boat than a production boat. I worked in large scale construction and can tell you not a single person skins the cat the same way when it comes to building. There is a reason why production line and SOPs are developed. Have you seen the Leopard and Lagoon owners FB pages these groups are worth there weight in GOLD.
@@adventurecrewsyes, and seeing leaks and shoddy production quality on the Leopards in particular are stunningly bad. You just responded to one of my comments that you were learning in public. Now you’re putting out videos that would really require experience.
Performance doesn't just stand for "faster". These boats are made from better, stronger materials and are more often custom built. The HH boss said it right, if you want to sail oceans safely, be able to sail to windward, turn off the engines and enjoy the sailing then youre not going to get that with a Lagoon, Leopard, FP, Bali or another boat built for the charter market. Putting a carbon mast on a boat with big fat hulls doesn't magically turn it into a performance boat. It all works out though as the people who enjoy the anchoring/cruising/social side of it have a lot of boats to choose from. 2nd hand performance boats though are very hard to find.
Well said!
@@TheSailingFamily absolutely nailed it.
Nice video & definitely a hotly debated topic indeed! Like you said, it really depends on your mission with the boat and your budget. In our research to buy a boat and talking to couples who were successful and those who gave up the lifestyle, a reoccurring theme was having a boat that was too slow and having to motor all of the time. Now if you are a power boater type, then who cares just put the hammer down, but that HH (and Balance to a lesser degree) you toured will actually be sailing at 8 kts in 8 kts of wind, were on the comfy boats you don't even put the sails up unless you have 12-15kts of wind, and then you are doing 6.5kts and maybe can point to 55AWA. Now is paying hundreds of thousands of dollars more for a performance boat worth it to save $4k/yr on diesel, nope, but it sure is a hell of a lot more fun.
Performance boats are about the ability to sail in light wind & the autonomy it gives you, not top end speed.
IMO, the biggest compelling feature of a performance catamaran is the ability to perform in light air where you would be motoring on a lagoon or leopard. And the ability to sail close hauled. 20degrees AWA. It really isn't about the top speed. It's about versatility within a variety of wind conditions.
Great point and I agree light air is a big deal! It take every bit of 10knts to really move our boat...but light air means you need a light boat...and they means I do not get my Ice Maker LOL
Great channel! Nice to see Seth again - miss his and his family's channel!
Awwww. We miss YT too!
Come back to the dark side lol
This was awesome, I went to the show but missed tours of the HH and Balance. And thanks for mentioning the elephant in the room, the price!
Of course, thanks for watching!
It was great meeting you guys in person!
Hey you guys as well!
Getting older and it's cruising and comfort all the way. My thrills are looking for the best dive site and spending time underwater. I'd rather be comfortable and take a little longer to enjoy the trip. You do need enough to get away from storms - but that seems mostly planning over performance.
Donate for a Dream
Cruising all the way. Bang for the buck and all the conveniences.
Yeah I like cruising cats. A lot of comfort more affordably priced. It was nice meeting you at the show!
They just sail so badly....I just can't
@@deerfootnz I have a monohull pretty much any catamaran would be a huge speed upgrade anyway.
@@allynonderdonk7577 any monohull that costs the same $$$$?. If you ignore any full keel nonsense, most fin keel moderate displacement monohulls will, dollar for dollar sail at least as well as most condomarans, and upwind the mono will be faster, much faster. I have a relatively quick cruising monohull and it will outperform nearly all multihulls until you get to about twice the price I paid at least.
@@deerfootnz I hear you. I am an opportunist and would go for either at an excellent...I mean groundbreaking rock bottom cost.
Performance does not necessarily fast. Performance means the ability to go where you want as fast as YOU want, Performance is all about the boat doing what you want, how you want ti. However every manufacturer wants you to buy their product, so they will try to get you to see their way. Its like buying a house. Do you want a green stylw house or just a plain hgouse to live in.
Awesome video guys thanks for asking the big question how much help people know what this life could cost to get in to
Thanks Neil!
Loved seeing these beautiful boats, just wow!😯 I know you guys had a great time seeing old friends and making new ones at this show...😉what a difference a year makes, right!? Next year 🥰I will volunteer to be your personal camera crew so we can record all the feels as you live in the moment so to speak. 😁😊
Great interviews!!🥰
Great vid Cole, allot of great info in a short time. Found your channel today thru KYoungs, and am happy to see you married, and doing what you Want to do, it’s been awhile since we spoke but Congrats, Jesse
Welcome aboard! Thanks Jesse!
I am new to your channel. I started watching You Tube videos with Odd life crafting, then Ran sailing and finally sailing Yaba. All of them Mono hull boats. My question why the emphasis on catamarans at the boat show.
My guess would be the relative stability both on passage and on anchor. And also speed when it comes to performance cruising multihulls. But that of course comes at a cost... If you try going on sailing on a mono vs a cat you can decide for yourself.
Most likely for the same reason pontoon boats are popular. It is like a floating apartment or in the case of a pontoon a floating porch. You have a lot of space to hang out and do whatever. The cost is quite a bit higher than a monohull of the same length and the marina costs are also quite a bit higher. In addition they are not considered true blue water boats and the general idea is not to be present when a storm or rough seas arrive so you note the impending weather and use that speed to get out of the way. I'm not sure that is a valid strategy but that is the strategy. For most people island hopping in fair weather this is probably a good choice and therefore the future for the consumer market.
@@angela1984a They are also more stable upside down than right side up!
@@danielboughton3624 Lots of cats have circumnavigated. But yeah... there are performance cruising multihulls that have flipped. Sailing will never be risk free regardless of what kind of boat you're on. Sailing La Vagabonde, The Sailing Family, Cat Greatcircle and Young Barnacles here on Y-tube seem to have done fine this far though...
@@angela1984a La Vagabonde and others are very very careful about when and where they go. If there is even a sniff of a storm they are headed for a lee shore or marina. I'm not saying that you can't do these things in a cat. People do crazy things in little 16 foot wayfarers and in boston whalers but it is much riskier. Cats do however have a lot of flat space that is great living space where a blue water monohull does not have that kind of space. I suppose another comparison would be an expedition boat v.s. a blue water boat. If you are going into ice or around the horn you might want one of those.
Great episode, and very informative. Thank you, Adventure Crews! #mattdv
Glad you enjoyed it!
Just checking in haven't heard from you guys in a while! Hope everything is OK
Hey hey! Thanks so much for checking in! We've taken some time off from YT to catch up on a massive amount of projects and working on other parts of our business. We'll be back to posting in the New Year! Merry Christmas and thanks for checking on us!
I think Wiley is Chris Farley's twin brother.
It amazes me that people that spend well over a million worry about fuel costs.
It’s not that they are worried about fuel costs, it’s about the autonomy you gain by not using so much fuel you aren’t worried about where your next fuel stop is going to be. Think of it like range anxiety when driving an electric vehicle…but the opposite from a “being green” perspective. Burn way less fuel because you can sail while the other boats are motoring.
It’s also a matter of how fast you can get from one place to another as comfortable as possible
Great point Catherine!
..after hearing 2 min of this Ive had it.... just BS....
Would you like to explain?
@@adventurecrews There no real info or knowledge here - just talking from mostly salesmen - so it comes down as noice. If you have no interest of sailing, have useless sails and weights it down the boat will sail like shit - whatever the design. If you like and try to learn and actually sails, has good sails and keep the boat as light as possible almost anything will move. I know Lagoon 380 owners that outsails bigger performance monos at windward bec the can sail, keep their boat reasonable light and clean and has good sails.
Another dead sailing channel. They cranked out tons of videos, thought it would be easy, realized its not then quit.
Hey TRIPLEWHOPPER, no quitters here. Just taking some time off to strategize and plan for season 2. We’re just getting started, be watching out for us in 2024.. it’s gonna be epic 💪🏼