Haas VF-6SS CNC Machines: Buying, Rigging, Unpacking & Commissioning!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- Two Haas VF6ss machines are coming to the shop. We'll talk about why the VF6ss machines are a good fit for SMW and why we decided not to get a VM6. First, we clear the area by moving the VF-2SS and VM3. Next, using a big forklift, we rig both 22,000lb (9979kg) machines from the delivery truck into the shop building! Plus, we'll share 4 Haas control settings that we change/disable immediately (you may want to as well). I'm extremely grateful for our team and all of their hard work. This was by far the most enjoyable rigging experience I've ever had!
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1:15 Who else expected John to break out a couple 3D printed VF6SS and start moving his miniature shop model around trying different layouts?
I was thinking the same. I kind of expected that the foam-board shop with all the 3D printed models would pop up again.
You've come a long way since that apartment in NY, John. All the best!
What excites me about this is an American manufacturing company is growing and doing well. I sure hope you are able keep it up. A bright spot in an otherwise bleak (for many reasons) landscape. Good luck and God speed to Saunders Machine Works!
I offered one of my customers $750.00 for their 96' VF-6 that had a bad CRT and something the Haas tech said might be a pricey fix for the low oil pressure fault in the spindle. It had sat for 6 years. They ran only small parts and I bet the operators bad mouthed the machine. It is big and you have to climb into it to fixture and clean it, almost. It cost more to truck it. The LCD mono chrome screen and the rubber drive coupling on the pump shaft were all that was needed to get it running. One of my best buys. Brushed D.C. axis drives but work fine.
$750.00?? What?
Isn’t scrap price more than that? I mean, that’s a lot of metal... ???
@@darkwinter6028 If he did the rigging, the cost to rig it out of a building might be more than the scrap value, depending on local pricing
NIDKID - well; yeah, if you’re trying to move it intact. Chopping it into pieces with a cutting torch would reduce that to something more movable with a common pickup truck (F150 or F250 equivalent). Not that I’m encouraging scrapping of a perfectly serviceable machine frame. 😉
7:42 "Disable the self destruct button"
Yeah, seems like a good idea.
Hey John,
Congratulations! Always fun on new machine day.
All the best,
Tom
This gets me so pumped up! I got some major orders to fill these next few weeks and if all goes to plan I will be stepping up from 18 months with a Tormach 770m to a Brother Speedio S700x1 with 4th axis, TSC, probing, and 16krpm spindle! I spoke with the rep this morning, going to stop in their showroom next week I think. So stoked! If all goes to plan from there, Datron M8cube will be coming in early next year! Been super motivational and a huge inspiration following this channel for the last 6-7 years since I started my journey with DIY CNC router back in 2014!
Brother is very motivated to sell right now.
@@jodyolivent8481 Yeah the guy from Yamazen told me they have some great deals going on! They have the machine I want there in stock with all the options, so I am going to the showroom next week to see it in person and make sure I can fit it into my garage. If things look good I will setting my plans in motion to try to get this thing in here ASAP!
Those speedios are something else. Will be our mills of choice when upgrading from our old doosans when the time comes!
@@SMCca I am really looking forward to it! It should be a massive game changer! My tormach was a game changer coming from a DIY CNC router, getting this Brother should be a similar experience
Its a pleasure to watch the team at SMW enjoy new toys. Two!
I really miss machining, wish I could go back to it, my dad taught me and was my boss for 10 years, became my best friend, passed away recently, but point being, machining was one of the greatest gifts he passed on to me, wish I could be doing what you guys are doing!!!
Awesome John! I'm actually upgrading too. My wife told me to go ahead and plan out a shop build and update my machine. I found a client that produces eye wear frames for big optical sellers like Walmart type places and has a contract with military to provide frames for pilots. So I have been nuts busy designing and building brazing fixtures for this company. I'm finally going to move out of my basement! BTW, love brass. That's what the fixtures are predominately. No coolant needed. I even went so far as to accidentally plunge a 3/32 end mill thru 1/4" brass and proceed to cut a slot a quarter inch long, because I inadvertently shut off ramp. It sounded funky, but the cutter did it twice and survived. It was as if it was cutting plastic. Good to see you expand and I look forward to catching you and Jared sometime when I pass thru again!
It's fantastic to see your company growing, well done and thanks for sharing
The tool change at start up feature 7:55 is a setting I WISH our machines had!
It basically protects your tools that shouldn't go through the warm up cycle, like large face mills or long drills and even probes.
I know a few who have started warm up before realising they have a long drill and WHAM bits of drill everywhere...
When you bought that warehouse I thought you’d never fill it. You have proven me wrong. 😂
inspiring how you've gone from small shop to big shop - im hoping to buy my first mill in the next couple years!
Just so you know the spindle grows overtime due to heat during long cycle times and the software does not comp for it. We've had HAAS working on trying to figure this out on our VF-6SS for about 6 months. We've installed a spindle cooler and everything. Just something to keep and eye on. We've noticed .003" to .004" of growth on the Z axis during a cycle.
So nice to see how far you have come and how you and your channel grew, feels like yesterday when the only content on your channel was about Tormach machines...
Congratulations John, well deserved!
Haven't stopped by in AWHILE....WOW...impressive progress.
You have really moved to the next level!
So I am not a Haas engineer, but if I remember correctly the reason why there is a tool release button on the control is if the button on the spindle gets damaged or stops working for some reason. It allows you to still run the machine and take tools in and out of the spindle if that were to occur. I will have to look into changing that parameter for the .1 jog increment, I never knew that was a thing.
I remember way back when you were setting up the first Tormach in your garage.
I was thinking back to how far you’ve come. I started watching 11 years ago when I found you building an HVAC controller. Remember how big the place was when you moved in? It’s a far cry from the old barn when you moved back to Ohio....and the Grandpop problem. :(. I was lucky enough to win a set of Easy Lap Diamond Sharpeners back when you were doing the prize thing. Still a Great Channel!
Amazing how you’ve grown.
Congrats on your business growing!
i didnt realise how big vf6s r holy shit man they make my grandpas vf2 and vfO look tinny
WOW!, Incredible, cant wait to buy mine.
Ol SMW doing pretty good these days. Those machines are not cheap!
SWEET!!! Truly hoping everything goes smoothly and NO CRASHES, EVER and show us when you start making some serious chips! :)
Man your shop is growing, Congratulations
Cool to see something different than I'm used to with vertical mill machines being installed. My company has been installing new Swiss style Star machines. Cool!
The profit margins in this business must be amazing.
Wish I knew CAD, this stuff is a dream of mine. And I live only 10 miles from the SMW shop. John and crew has it going ON in the Y-City. 👍
You don't necessarily need to now CAD to program simple programs, just some geometry and understanding of the Cartesian coordinate system. Also, with enough enthusiasm to learn, any employer would love to teach you any extra skills needed.
New toy day is the best day!
we have a HAAS OM2A and the Tool Release button is a workhorse... it's how you load tools into the spindle for transfer to the carousel, and because the machine doesn't support probing we put a dial indicator in the spindle to clock up the work every op... probably just a legacy/compatibility thing with the control panel
@NYC CNC the company I work currently work for surface grinds your fixture plates it is located in Akron Ohio the company I work for is called radial grinding we do all sizes of your fixture plates. That is cool finding a customer on TH-cam.
@NYC CNC Good for you! Endless effort, good planning and dash of luck is paying off. Keep it up.
Congrats John. Just wow!
i was waiting for him to say, this is Insane.
I would recommend going with a better machine for production work. Doosan is a definite step up. From experience, HAAS do not hold sizes like a better thermally managed Japanese machine. I’ve run a lot of different cnc’s and can say this with confidence.
You may have received HAAS incentives because of your channels exposure, that’s great if you do.
I should have made the switch to Japanese / Korean machines when I was at your stage of growth with my business.
All the best John.
It's not 2006 anymore. The differences between Haas machines and Japanese machines are getting smaller and smaller. It used to make sense to spend 2-4x on a Japanese machine, but it's getting harder to justify it. He's running parts on Haas machines as it is, and he's holding incredible tolerances, as are many other people. It's also not as much of the machine as people think. Look at John Grimsmo. He has a $1M Kern with a robot, and he's struggling to hit tolerances and SF.
ahh the trick is too get it written into contract that if machine does not produce parts to specs you can return machine..owner of last shop i was at did that with them returned machines after two years usage
If that’s possible, great idea.
The drive train is light compared to most machines. HAAS is of course evolving and getting better. I’m just going by hands on experience. Temperature has always really affected the precision of my HAAS machines.
The used Okuma just is preferred for what I do.
There are other korean manufacturers of CNCs not only Doosan.Hyundai Wia,HWACHEON,Namsun to name a few.
He's right, Haas machines are like wet noodles and move all over the place 👌👌
from what i hear, not quite as bad as tormach tho :D
@@pdxfunk depends on who pays more for sponsorship 👌
@@TheFeralEngineerlol!!
Haas should throw out the Tool release button on console(like WTF) and add a 3D graphic simulation(Its ridiculous that there is not one already.) and the feed speed potentiometer.
Tool release button on the console comes in very handy when a dumbass knocks the button off.
Having had to do a fair few ATC recoveries in my time, I can say having a dedicated button can be very usefull as normally its achieved by some obscure combination of keys that you struggle to explain to the guy at the control.
Maybe locking the button so its only active during a recovery cycle would be the best of both worlds?
But I agree 100% with the other 2 points.
If I were an engineer at Haas, the first thing I would want to do is to reprogram that button so that you would have to hold it down for a small duration. I mean you can accidentally hit the wrong button, but nobody will accidentally hold down the wrong button, considering that all other buttons require just short clicks.
The second thing I would want to do is putting the tool release button inside, close to the spindle (maybe in the form of a handle, or turnkey). Yes, I know debris, chips, coolant, etc. But when you change a tool, your hand is holding the tool and you're looking at the tool, the button/handle should be somewhere in the neighbourhood (above it).
You are absolutely right about the speed+feed dials. It's not that hard to implement, and it can save so much hassle.
@@sasjadevries But there is tool release button inside, close to the spindle in every haas that why i say why the fu#ck the second button do on console ??? I don't see this on other machines?, the theory is when machine and tool is big then one worker grabs a tool and second push the button???LOL that don't make any sense(I'm pretty weak and i carry the biggest BT50 tool on the market in one hand), And people above say that this button is handy when button above spindle gets broken, well how about replace it IP64 button cost like 10-15$ LOL and repair is very easy. The tool release button on console is waste of space and make layout more messy, that why you don't see it on other machines .
@@adriankowalski5492 Wuttt? So you're telling me they already have a button where it belongs?
I didn't think that they were THAT stupid. I thought it was a cost saving measure or so, not a 2nd button.
And I imagine how awkward it would be if you actually needed two guys to change a tool. First you need to distract a coworker form his work , then the _"so, can I push it? yeah, I think I got it, but I hold it awkwardly, let me get a better grip first... Boooom! -oops."._
If I would really really need two hands, then I would rather just jog down the tool, and let it drop on a piece of wood/rubber from a minimal height; and you can lift one end of the plank to get leverage and push it up to the tool. Or I would jig up something mechanical to lift it decently.
And I can't imagine a tool that heavy to be mounted in that tool mount (like a lathe-chuck welded to a BT50 holder, LOL).
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Do you really need 3d simulation in a machining center? I mean you can check for collisions in CAM, and for short handwritten programs you can turn down the feedrate with the turnknob (if you have one) and prevent collisions that way.
I'm curious to know what the usecase would be for the simulation feature (other than triple checking something).
Congratulations on your two new babies, and your business growth :)
Congrats guys! You totally deserve this. Well done.
Good tip on the setting to Not change to tool 1 at restart. I HATE that because it’s also at 100% rapid.
We also have to set something with mid-program restart... I forget the number, but it avoids problems.
We also set setting 335 to linear Rapids to avoid the dog legging
when i went for my first machine they had a smaller and larger used mill available. although making small parts at the time i want the rigidity and room to grow. well at 40 x 24 i thought it was big haha, might get a plate from you some day. self owned and operated so its been a struggle paying off my first machines but oddly enough managing to stay busy during these times but always looking for enough work for another machine!
i can just hoping and imagining this video become my own machine arrival... i jealous !
Time for a new shop!
Nice I’m so excited for our VF11 to be delivered in a week
have it come yet or have haas delay it
Also Setting 133 - repeat rigid tapping it’s off by default, so if you do peck tapping make sure you turn it on
Awesome! So fixture plates for SO3 XXL coming!?
YUP!
@@nyccnc Count me in for one set ;)
Toll!! viel Erfolg mit den Maschinen
happy for your purchase, but I got to vent.
The actual table size has been reduced to the travel limits in x which sucks.
2 reasons I personally don't like it
1/ you can't clamp a plate job to use the entire travel in x.
2/ a rotary axis consumes valuable table space
I would opt for a custom table, longer in x axis and t slots closer together and more of them.
You could always make a fixture plate?
If you're thinking about offsetting the rotary sure it works I've done it, however it's a pain to also adjust the height of the tail stock.
As far as a complete table plate, you'd need to buy one or have a larger machine to make it. Losing tslots in favour of tapped holes isn't very appealing either. It's just all wrong.
They cheaped out on the build by saving a little casting and freight weight.
@@Innov8cnc fair enough on the Tslots but is it that much of a pain to made 2 fixture plates, ground at the same time, to offset both rotary and tail stock the same?
Looks like we arent the only company investing in these times. they finished putting our new Kekeisen together a month ago (takes like 2-3 weeks to install on location)
Very cool! Can't wait to grow myself
John should run a f360 simulation how much force is in the corner of these forks when the forklift lifts the VF6 form the truck.
Beautiful sir nice
Congrats on the new machines! Those ones are certainly great for small part dedicated production!.We have an older one that we use for our small parts (it's all relative...). We find it isn't nearly rigid enough for our heavier machining processes, but does well with a bunch of small parts. Are they still running on linear rails, or have they upgraded to box ways finally?
I'm always surprised about how well his dog stays out of the way of everything that's going on. My dogs i would have to lock them in the office to make sure they don't get into any situations where they would hurt themselves or other people. His just moseys around like "Yeah I'm cool with all this."
only time when I need to use tool release button on the control is when the button stick or break on the spindle and need to change the tool to get a job done before we can fine the time to repair the button a couple day later
And for ATC recoveries where you will need the clamp to stay open. Used that a fair few times
8:30 I hope he did more than just that ten inch flatness check and put a ballbar on it to remove any backlash, Or is that why they have a bad rep. Love how you said they are "noodle machines" and still bought two more 🤣🤣
Simon H Ballbar is done at Factory. Not on site.
@@superbadchad45 What i am getting at is that he should of done more than that, backlash with a dial indicator even, We have always agreed to have it done on commission day, But learnt the hard way from shit machines straight from the factory.
Wet noodles was in reference to all cast iron machines... not just Hass. Cast iron will bend and flex, expand and contract. Plus the flooring can move and vibrate. All meaning that if you could compare where a machine sits on install to 10 years later, they would NOT be the same.
Thinking about it, you could apply this to any material and not just cast iron.
@@harezy ALL machines are like wet noodles. No matter what machine you buy, it will flex, settle, and distort.
Congratulations on your new machines guys! And an awesome video aswell!
Would you mind giving me the link to the song you've used at 4:36?
sounds kind of like Lil Peep Star Shopping lol
I've got a question. Which CNC control is the most common in the United States. In Germany, the major manufacturers(DMG Mori, Grob group, Niles Simmons) only have Siemens, smaller ones use Haidenhein. Machines with a Fanuc CNC control are very rare.
I'm from Romania but I think they use FANUC and Haas(which is FANUC compatible)and maybe some HURCO controls.Some high end companies may use japanese machine tools with proprietary CNC like MAZAK(Mazatrol),OKUMA,Kitamura( FANUC control copy called Arumatik).
John, if you do decide to go the route of laser aligning the new VF's, I would highly recommend Industrial Measurement Solutions. It is a smaller outfit run right out of Ohio. Dave is the founder and likely the one that will come out and do the inspection. He is the greatest guy and he has years of experience setting up machines like this. I met him through a few jobs I did for assembly line work for the automotive industry. Being that I'm also from Ohio, I like the idea of local businesses helping other local businesses. You can find more info on their website, www.ims-ohio.net/ I hope that works out, it would be very neat to see Dave in one of your videos showing what he does best!
I have a couple of questions about the install on these machines. How thick is the concrete in your building? And how are you getting your 3 phase power? Im looking at a large machine and need some help deciding what to do.
Nice proper sized machines there! 50 taper?
I am just amazed John can work with HFO Midwest. I guess it is how many machines you buy because we cannot even get the parts guys to call us back. They give us the worst customer service in the world and as a result we will not buy another HAAS machine for any reason. Literally left multiple messages for the parts guys three weeks ago and still have not heard from them. All of our parts have to come from California so either we pay crazy freight our wait a week. I'm glad someone gets good service from them I just wish I knew what we are doing wrong.
Hello fellow machinist. I have question. Do you have some special piece which you run for first time on new machine, for checking that it's working correctly?
Haas must be giving discounts on vf6ss bc we just got 2 as well
Did you try a few modeling scenarios with that mini figure setup you had?
wont be long before you have to buy horizontal or gantry too and then you have to get a new shop too
Oh the VF6SS B... that’s the one with Bluetooth right! 😆
Does Haas have a any subscription fees once a machine purchase is made?
Xmas in August Oh Yeah, But powering up before Haas Tech gets there ???
Why did u not get the gantry style machine for larger processing area and a limit to machine multiple parts at once
A question by somebody who is not a machinist but is fascinated by the industry, how much do these machines roughly cost?
I'm not sure but something like
I think those are bigger than your NYC apartment was!
I have had two really bad crashes because something went wrong in a tool change and the T and H values were different (Centroid). Did the Haas technicians say why that's not default?
Great John ! I'm looking forward to sending you back the absolutely terrible one I purchased from you for my 1100M a few years ago. Could never use it because the vises wont sit flat on it !
A few years ago... Lol
Those are some big avocados
Please, how much is the machine?
Leveling and so, with a big granite, on a mill? 🤔 Maybe it just me, but doesn't that sound strange?
Класс! Поздравляю!
Does one typical finance or buy a machine like this
Omg u baught a VF 6ss now u have 5 HAAS Machines.
You got another copy,
5+1=6
What is the brand of the machine skates you used?
I'll set the jog speed however I want
Do you still have the Tm3p? And if so how do you guys find it.
how much does a machine cost?
A nice thing about Haas is you can price them out on their website.
Craig Krueger Only in certain markets such as the USA, if it sees from your IP address you are interacting from say Europe no online pricing is available
I bought one in nov 2019 with 136k (15k spindle and a hrt 210) and one in march-apr 2020 for 108k (it was one of those in available inventory at haas cali)
Are the drives and motors the same size as the VF2?
One question the video didn't answer for me is, how do you get them big Mammer Jammers off the pallet?
forklift the casting (machine) up, pull the pallet out, lower onto skates
Disable 0.1 jog: For those who still work in inches.
Form metric - 1. mm also should be turned off ;)
Have any CNC PROGRMMER vacancy in your company for me
I hated running vf6 amd vf12 . Only because its really high and amount of walking over steps was killing me
I like your videos,
nice machine!
But i have seen a maschine, hmmm
ca 25.000mm x 10.000 x 3.500 @ 20°Celcius:-)
6D a machine form "Zimmermann" Germany
(but wos from america)
ohhh little bit thinking -> like from Space ...
Thx
Incredible I'm 70 years old can you make me a new body too?
How can I contact you?
My machine is quite "flexible" - because I keep accidentally smashing it
I guess milling machines are like kids, the first is a big deal lots of pictures and long videos. As you have more and more the five-second rule doesn't apply, they can eat off the floor. Come on, "A" and "B", you can give them better names, they're your children too, just like your first 1100 or your first Haas. Only 10:25 for two machines, that's five minutes a machine, show use you love them like your first ones. More Video!!!
I for one, don't really want the T and H codes in agreement. Sometimes, I need to tweak the blends on a tool that is doing two different Features. One offset solves nothing, because both blends move together. So instead of making changes to each individual "Z" value in the program (if there's too many of them), I home the tool and call a new "H" for that tool for that Feature. Pretty usable overall.