Your information about avoiding a double crossover just made my basic HT go from mediocre to amazing, i had no idea i was making this error, i've not seen it explained so clearly. As someone with very little audio knowledge you make this information easy to process!
I've been listening to a lot of videos on this subject but I felt no one was answering my exact questions and you explained everything I needed answered! Great informational video! Thanks.
New sub here brother! Ive been doing home theater setups for over 25yrs and this was still a treat to listen to...very well explained and solid advice..love this channel and look forward to viewing more of ur episodes
I thought I had my bass management set up properly until I watched your video. Wow was I wrong. Thank you for this extremely thorough video and your crystal clear explanations. I especially appreciate your attention to "setting
I really appreciate your info about settings such as subwoofer phase and LFE plus main (Extra Bass for Yamaha), that other videos totally ignored!!! Thanks for an outstanding video!
For years I've been running 80hz Sub cross in my LFE and missing out...went up to just 100hz and my 4K Blu-rays have the house exploding!! That extra data is tremendous, at 120hz LFE the power of the Bass production at even lowest listening levels!! So I went down to 100hz its still just such a profoundly new experience I wish you could go up in 5-10hz increments, its that significant. Thank you
@@hometheatergurus yeah I put that LPF right back to 120hz!! Its just too much information in that 80-120 hz!! It was the equivalent of having an RCA Interconnect unplugged!! I don't even know how to "Drive" my system anymore! I used to be able to gauge how an explosion or blast would sound, now Dynamics terrify me! I have to rewatch Every Movie I own...if you owned a Ferrari for two years,thought it was amazing...then your buddy gets in driver seat and tells you "Bro you are in Valet Mode...did you know that?" Then he switches it off..200Hp goes to 600Hp....and you can't handle your own car!
Now let's throw a curve ball. My Yamaha receiver doesn't let me adjust the subwoofer crossover. When I set the main crossover to 80hz the bass is anemic. Adjusting the main crossover to 100hz made the bass come ALIVE. Couple that with the adjustments to "volume" gain on my plate amp, & now I can shake the house.
Glad I found your channel. Watched many videos and read many pages about this stuff in the past, especially for Sub crossover, and you hit it out of the park in one video. Almost every video in this series is relevant to me so far as well. Great info and more importantly, usable info. Keep it up!
Fantastic video. Only recommendation I am not sure about is turning Dynamic Equalisation on as this will basically compress the sound - and so if you have proper insulation, you would not need to worry about bass travelling throughout your house.
Most of your videos have multiple subs. If you have just one, how do you go about placing it and do you have to do anything else than matching it to the mains for smooth transition?
Fantastic video! I just want to make sure I understand… I have 2 subs. I have the hz knobs cranked all the way to LFE. And then in my crossover settings on my Integra, I have the LPF of LFE set to 120hz. All my other speakers (set to small) are at 80hz. Am I on the right track?
Very informative. I bought my amplifier 14y ago and I did not know these. I've been using setting on my sub amp and the main amplifier in the wrong way. Luckily that main amplifier is broken and I had to buy new one and I checked this video and couple others from you. Now I think I get more out from my system. Thank you sir! 🤝
At 29:30 you mention audessy asking you to adjust the sub gain. But what if you did the gain match steps beforehand? You should just skip the step in audessy, right?
I had my 2 subs in the front corners originally and was definitely sitting in a cancel mode position. So I took one of them and placed it in my listening position and crawled around the room and found the perfect position for placement which was on the left wall (if the screen was up), directly across from the recliner set about 2' towards the back...the crawl test is awesome IF YOU USE IT PROPERLY...meaning you use a sweep and not music. And yes, you can absolutely "hear" phase shift. Remember, this your system and based on your room dims, there may be a difference between "good sound" and "sounds good". Since no one is coming in to test the professionalism of my system, I'll go with "sounds good". I had to think about your explanation on the subwoofer gain knob because yes, there is an amplifier in an active sub...but you are absolutely right, the signal is either higher on the front end, or the back end...If I may be so bold to make a recommendation, turn your subwoofer gain knob high, that way the signal from the AVR is low...low power means cooler running and longer life.
Hi. Love the content and I’m quickly learning how to built my new atmosphere setup my watching mostly your videos. Thanks! About your explanation of crossover overlap. When I used to design the crossover points for my car audio installs, we would underlap the two crossovers. For example, if it was a 12db per octave crossover we would make sure, at the crossover point, that the high and low pass frequencies would be down 6db where they overlap. That would give a flat response at the crossover point. If I set my active crossover point in my car at 80hz for both crossovers they will be playing same volume right up to those points and there will be a large hump at the crossover point. Back in the 90’s phoenix gokd would send out instructions with their amps on how to build passive crossovers. It really helped to understand how they worked.
Great video, I have my subs one front, one back opposite corners about 1/3 way against the wall, one sub phase is 0 and the other is 180, Subs are set to 120 and AVR is set to 60 and my front speakers have Subs built in. I’m going to try all your suggestions and listen, I’m sure my Home Theater will sound better, a update coming soon and let you know my results
I have a 21X17 family room with vaulted ceilings, angled fireplace, 2 large glass doors, and open on ⅔ of the other walls. Therefore my placing options are very limited. I have a TV that is angled at 30 degrees at a corner and a sofa that is also angled at 30 degrees 11 feet away. The left speaker has a 36 degree separation from the center but due to space limitations, the left speaker has only a 19 degree separation from the center. I have a 14" Velodyne sub which I can either place either behind the TV cabinet, or on the right side of the cabinet. I surmise that placing the sub behind the cabinet will cut off some of the sound, but it will allow me to move the cabinet 7" to the left and create 3 degrees more separation of the RF speaker (22) and reduce the LF to 33 degrees. Since everything in sound is a tradeoff, do you think placing the sub behind justifies the separation?
Thanks for this info great work. I am using the Audyssey pro kit and am using my Marantz 8802 to set my subs crossover. On my Velodyne DD15+ sub I have a line level control setting and a speaker level control setting and also a high pass crossover setting 100 or 80 hz. What would I set these to BEFORE running my room correction. I know to set my low pass crossover to the highest setting on my sub but the other 3 settings I don’t know about. Thank
Yesss finally in simply terms explained. Thank you !!!, awesome bass response here since I've used this tutorial. Made an setup with an svs PCI 20-39 (12 inch vented) and an MJ acoustics pro 50 (8-inch closed) and believe it or not it works awesome !!! Tight fast and deep extension for music and HT. 🙏🙏
I have SVS Ultra Towers, Centers and surrounds, and Audyssey always sets the towers to full range, I'm guessing due to room gain from a low ceiling. When I go in after RC has done its thing, and set them back to small with an 80hz crossover, I've got a big sub alignment issue. I've been correcting this by changing the distance setting in a positive value until the hole in the response is gone via REW measurements. Is this the proper way? Or is there a better way?
Great video. I was hoping to figure out why my CT-150 Velodyne (yeah it's pretty old but hasn't been used in years in my warm living room as a table for my receiver. lol) I turned it off permanently because occasionally I'll get a loud boom even when not in use. When I get close to the woofer there's an occasional static. I've replaced the cable. Still an issue. Is my expensive seldom used subwoofer just a table now?
I'm worried I'm going to have problems in my (15X16X9.6") room. Its 3 walls and then opens into the rest of the house. Is it possible to overcome this with brute force alone? I don't have many sub placement options. And buying two of these subs might cause my neighbors to want to shoot me. Lol.
If i do dirac meassurement,i should Take the Subwoofer phae which is best to my taste or should it be 0? I have my two Klipsch reference behind my Seat.
Hi. How to deal with modal frequencies in stereo listening through stereo amplifier which has no crossover built-in? And my front L/R speakers are going down to 32Hz. Want to use miniDSP and 3subs which I use for home theatre. In that case I need to align in addition 2 speakers L/R as they are acting like "subwoofers" and add a crossover in miniDSP? Please give a tip! :)
Hi! Thanks for this great video. I have one problem with my sub settings though. I have a sub that has fixed LPF at 90 Hz. Now you say that never use the LPF for LFE on receiver side. But even if I try to push whole 15-120 Hz LFE channel to my sub I am still loosing 90-120 Hz from it. Is there any way in the receiver to direct that 90-120 part of LFE to my main L and R towers? If not then I think I have one option. My sub also has fixed HPF for L+R. So the one option would be to set in the receiver no sub at all and instead direct the LFE to main L+R. I am using separate power amp for main L+R. Then take the main L+R line out signal to sub input and from sub output to main power amp. But then my receiver's audyssey can't phase aling my sub correctly or can it? I have my sub behind MLP. The sub has phase control with 45 deg steps. Then I would need to use REW measurements to align my sub with my mains, right?
Just to clarify. LFE + main only matters (only activates) when your speakers are set to large, right? I know that Denon lets you set LFE + main even when speakers are set to small, but as I understand, that doesn't change anything.
That’s correct Isak. If you set the speakers to small, then LFE or LFE+Main makes no difference. Only when the speakers are set to Large does LFE+Main activate.
Do you recommend using two different brands of subs over two matching pair of subs? I have an HSU VTF-1 sub that is amazing and two RSL Speedwoofers which are great but the HSU is better. So should I mismatch my subs or keep using the two identical subs?
I have been watching your videos for awhile and have your REW and other videos saved for reference. I do have a question about this one though. Does driver orientation mean anything? If so, how much? For example, my 123" screen is 62cm from back wall, which means my svs pb-2000 can't be on the front wall with drivers pointing forwards. And with my bedlayer LR 60 degrees apart they can't be frint corners,which also gives me a really bad response at mlp. I have a weird room with half slanted walls and a stairwell. At present i have 1 sub behind/below the screen with driver pointing left, and 1 sub behind mlp a bit to the side also with driver pointing left, this gives me a pretty good response with only a 3db lowered response between 65-80hz, but placement isn't ideal. Thank you for all your help and very easy to follow videos.
Thanks! I'll definitely be doing manipulation of reflections (room acoustics) but it won't be based on rew but based on analysis of off axis responses and determining how we want to treat different reflections to achieve a desired goal. Rew would be used afterwards just to make sure you didn't have any major issues still left to deal with. It won't be used for a treatment plan.
Great Channel, Is it better to use different heights with multiple subs? So one at 10cm from the ground the other at 30cm for example. Saw that in a tutorial, what's your opinion? gr Dan
If you watch the room mode episode you'll see there are modes between all parallel surfaces so height is important. It's a good idea to center the cone at head level.
One more question - if the AVR has 2 sub outs (but they are only the splitter), one sub is by the TV and another sub is closer to the listening position (on the right of the sofa), will Audyssey align them? I don't have to tweak the Phase (set to 180)?
I have a Dayton MX15-22 sub in a DIY enclosure tuned to 19hz, but lacks in the higher freq. Should I set my fronts to small but xover at 40hz (Polk Audio RTi A9) to handle the higher freq? There are only two seats in my room, side by side. 7.1.4 Thank you for all your videos, been a tremendous help in setting up my dedicated HT room!!
btw I just added a Dayton bass shaker to my recliner, boy oh boy did i ever laugh the when i first set it up I turned on Avatar 2 and a chopper was flying over hahah
Nice overview. One thing regarding LFE and crossovers, the LFE is a dedicated channel that is separate from other low frequency content. The LFE should be unaffected by the crossover setting, which will filter the other audio channels only but preserves the LFE content as-is. At least this is how it is on my Yamaha A1080. So even if you use a typical 80hz crossover, your sub would still receive 120hz LFE content.
Yes I'm not sure if you watched the whole video but this is explained in detail in the video. Sound like you may have skipped quite a bit as bass management and LFE is a good chunk of the video. But you are correct mostly and that's how how all avrs work. Low frequency content is the lfe channel so its not separate. It stands for low frequency effect. Bass management is the process of routing to the sub using speakers set to small and a crossover. Bass management is separate from LFE as one is a channel the other is stripped from other channels.
@@hometheatergurus I went back and re-watched, my comment was in reference to the discussion at the 25:32 mark. Somehow I totally missed that you were referring specifically to the LFE low pass filter and not the general crossover setting. I don't think my receiver even has a LPF setting for the LFE, not sure why you would even want to set this as LFE content only goes to the sub-out as you stated.
@@aaronarchy11 yeah it's an odd setting. I know some big wigs in the industry that think it's just because people like settings and if one has it the others want it. It shouldn't exist.
@@hometheatergurus That makes sense, sometimes I feel like I need a Ph.D to understand all the settings on my receiver. Honestly I wish they would simplify everything. At least now a lot of receivers are adding onscreen descriptions to each setting which helps.
Great video as usual. Question: I have two subs, of 3 total, connected by Y connector. When I run audussy can I calibrate with those 2 subs on? Or should I disconnect one? Ty
That might be the best subwoofer class I’ll ever watched..you don’t know how much that helps me out!..question bud..can I hook 4 satellite heigh speakers to one surround sound hookup..(left/right). Can I Hook them up in parallel?..I have a 7.2 avr..thanks again..joe
Thanks Joe! Yes you can hook them in parallel and it will cut the ohms in half. If the speakers are 8 ohms it'll be 4 ohms in parallel. Some avrs are fine with this some will not be.
@@joelane4670 you're welcome. I should add for anyone else reading this that a speaker rated at 8 ohms isn't 8 ohms at all frequencies but often can have dips much lower so in parallel they'll dip below 4 ohms in places. Just something to be aware of.
great tutorial. I have questions. I am using emotiva XMC-2 processor which I can assign bass management and LFE to separate subwoofer. What happened if my setting like this: 1. I have 4 dedicated subwoofer in each room corner for bass management ( all speaker set as small, crossover at 80hz, so all freq lower than 80hz will go to these 4 subs). of course all these 4 subs time align. 2. I have another dedicated 4 subs in each room corner for LFE only (stacked on top of bass management subs). again all LFE subs time align. my questions is, will my setting worst than just use 4 subs ( LFE and bass management using the same subs)? The signal for Bass management and LFE is different right?
My subs run on the same signal..I have 2 sub hookups,but just 1 output..Should subs be set differently phase wise? Like one on 0.and one and 180?thanks ..joe
if my avr has 2x sub outs, do i use input 1 and 2 on the mini dsp or should i just have sub 1+2 into dsp input 1&2 BUT have the output signal coming out being feed from 1 input basically make it a y splitter ?
Your videos are outstanding. Thank you. I do have a placement question. Room is 16x30 with screen on short wall. I have four 15" Klipsch subs. Would like to try one in each corner, but have a problem with one. The back right corner has a door on the side. I would have to move the back right speaker about 36" forward from the rear wall. Thoughts?
Absolutely. Bass is bass. This video isn't about music VS theater it's just proper setup when using a sub in any system when using the lfe output of the processor.
Love the channel 5 stars. My processor only has single LFE going into a Rane THX44 PEQ and out into 2 subs. Should I measure both subs together or individually?
Yeah, my AVR7706 wants me to turn my subs up to about 72. I take it as they have week amps so it needs it almost 3/4 the way up. They are Elac SUB3010s. Now I understand it better I know that is not the case. Plus I also know they have 400w amps with 200w continuous
Just became fan of your channel. I got two svs sb3000. If gain/volume does not matter much - what is the best way to feel more bass? I am using Marantz Sr 8012 Avr.
Thanks! The Gain is used to set the voltage from the avr. See the calibrating for Reference video. For more bass I'd make sure dynamic is on with an offset of 0. If you still want more boost it some. Also see the video on chest kick and make sure you have a good dip free response.
Thank you so much for your videos! One question, why can't you time align Mains to the sub(s) in the sub region as well? It's like adding additional subs, when you enable LFE+Main mode, so it should give you more consistency in the bass response, if they all are aligned. Am I wrong?
LFE+MAIN allows the LFE and the low frequencies from all speaker channels to be output to the subwoofer. You would normally choose this setting when decoding PCM based audio or playing back from an analog source.
@@Junglemama0 What I asked is why nobody recommends to play sub frequencies from both the main speakers (if they are capable to do it) and the separate subwoofer at the same time. I guess the effect should be like having several subwoofers playing at the same time, if they all aligned in the sub region.
Great video! I also have the Def Tech 9080s.. Just to clarify. I should set them to "small"? And 'LFE" only on the AVR setting as well? Not "LFE + MAIN"? I have an older Revel B15a 1000w sub with a 3 band eq with a low pass filter switch (on/off) and a low pass filter that toggles between 24 and 48 db, a high pass freq knob that goes from 30-80 and a high pass filter switch that toggles between 12 and 24 db. How will movie settings affect music listening? If I switch to "stereo" will it bypass those settings? I am running a Denon X4200W and am driving my Def Techs through an Emotiva preamp/amp
I thought only setting mains to large and LFE+main will mess things up. Are you saying that Small and LFE+Main is also messing up the bass? I was of an impression is that Small and LFE+Main has no effect on multichannel stuff (because - SMALL + crossover). What this setup actually does is it engages the subs when I am listening to stereo music with pure direct.
Thanks for another guru level video. I will be adding a mini DSP to my dual sub setup soon and I’m looking forward to that. Once I’ve dialed things in as best as possible, I am going to revisit the bass when I use multi channel stereo. The bass is always so much worst than 2 channel. I’m planning to mess with different house curves to address this. (I bought a mini DSP remote to use a different settings). Are there any known issues before I attempt the multichannel stereo thing? What frequency is the bass thump? I really want to emphasize this while listening to 2 channels. Thanks
Ok, so what I do with left and right mains that are powered amplified 1,600 watts built in with inputs for the LFE cable that comes from preouts from AVR. Still set them small? How would you set them if you want to use the AVR lfe preouts and set subwoofer alignment on a minidsp4hd?
This is actually specifically covered in this video towards the end. You treat them as subs so you'd set to small and align them to the rest of the subs.
Awesome video. Could you please help some of us that just have 1 subwoofer? Most people don't have the luxury or room space for multiple subs. But we are armed with REW. So whats the best we can do to setup our sub?
@@hometheatergurus everything: how to find the best spot using REW (not sub crawl), how to align sub to mains, how to find the best crossover for our rooms response, etc. Basically hownto get the flattest response with 1 sub for the main seat.
@@KurtCocainOriginal episode 7 covers rew and placement. 9 does as well without rew as well as setup for single or multiple subs. The next video will show a method I've come up with that doesn't require rew to confirm placement but isn't blind like the sub crawl. As for one sub there are known good spots to help and I'll soon cover it. The upcoming room mode episode will also be helpful.
@@hometheatergurus I second the request for more content geared towards single sub owners. I have a pair of robust towers, but only one sub and I can't add another. Any videos you can provide to optimize placement, crossover points, and integration with the main speakers would be appreciated.
Is a mini DSP HD only useful for parallel sub outputs? How will a mini DSP work with 2 independent sub outputs. I own 4 SVS PB-2000’s and I want to be able to properly integrate them. I always thought the a mini DSP HD worked best with a parallel connection.
What a great set of videos... Well Thought out and Very Informative... Thank You so much for these!!!! Had a question that maybe you can answer for me I have a PB16 Ultra and 2 Klipsch KSW 12 subs is it possible to align these or should i even bother?
Hello I’m confused- I have 3 subwoofers and each subwoofer I max out the crossover and all 3 sub with the gain at 50% - on my receiver is it to set at 80hz or 120hz ?
120hz is likely your hpf which is a filter for the Lfe channel (. 1 content). The crossover is set to whatever frequency you or room correction chooses. Often 80hz but not ways.
You mentioned something about not changing the distances on your speakers after the calibration but what if the auto cal gets the distances wrong on all channels?
That would be rare but if it does happen I'd run it again. If it's still off set the loudspeakers to actual distance and the sub distance will be set to have a most positive summation across the crossover point to the mains.
Home Theater Gurus thank you so much for the quick reply. So you’re saying if it’s still off set distance for mains and then leave the sub alone, distance wise at what the receiver sets it at or set that manually as well?
Home Theater Gurus ok, I thought you meant that. Anyway, thank you so much for taking the time to answer my questions. I love and am obsessed with your channel since coming across it the other day. So informative, Thank you again
Nice video like always! . I'm running two JBL es250p subwoofers that have a port underneath the sub instead of the front like most subs do. They're at the quarter and 3 quarter width like you instructed. How far away should I keep them away from the front wall?
Wanted to check on something about sub placement. The Harmon report seemed to say the the best configuration was 2 subs on opposite walls at the mid-way point. This was followed by 4 subs either on in the corners or at the mid-way point on the walls, which were really a toss up. So why go with 4 subs?
4 is the point of demonishing returns. 1 to 2 is of course the biggest improvement with 2 to 4 being a smaller improvement. For most 2 subs are plenty although 4 can make seating a little easier as more modes can be fixed so especially with more than one row its helpful.
I just stumbled upon your channel as I am about to upgrade from a 5.1 to a 7.1.4 Great info! Most of your stuff deals with 2 or more subs and I only have 1. You say that more subs give better results and you should not use double bass as it throws everything out the window. But what if I do set my receiver to double bass and do the measurements to find the best spot for my sub like that? Then I´m getting multiple sources of low frequencies and "faking" multiple subs (of course I know that the mains don´t compare to a sub). Is this complete gibberish or could this work?
I wish you was a stereo guy (: I started to watch your videos because I wanted to learn REW for building a house curve for my stereo setup. I am going to export the filteres to Roon that has a build in DSP engine. I have a 7.4.1 setup Marantz AV8805, 2 x Emotiva XPA-5 gen2 and a Primaluna HP Integrated tube amp with passthrough for the fronts. So this is a combined setup for stereo and surround
@@hometheatergurus Yes, I know that. But, check this. The Subwoofer signal is a mono signal. The subwoofers response is between 10 and 80 Hz. That means, from 10 to 80 Hz, we have a mono signal. IT does not matter if a thunder sounds on the Left speaker, we have a mono signal from 10 yo 80 Hz right. So, If I put my crossover to 120 Hz, the mono signal will be between 10 to 120 Hz. Right? And the signal between 120 Hz and 20 kHz will be stereo. So, imagine this. I have 3 subs, sweeping from 20 to 80Hz. But I hace a problem on 150 Hz or Maybe 180 Hz. Can I use another DSP to eq this signal and improve it a little bit and these Hz could be mono (as a sub) or should I use two outputs for stereo? Hahaha sorry, but I'm confused
@@KneyerLand the sub channel (Lfe) is mono because it's one channel. There is no stereo unless it's a 2.1 or 2.0 system. It's multi channel. So If you have an issue above the subs see the episode on room modes as we address it there and also sub to main integration video we also touch on it. But yes you could use mid bass modules to to what you're proposing. That would actually be the only time I'd recommend them. Assuming no other solutions worker or could be done. 180hz could be playing from any one or any combination of the loudspeakers in the room.
Thanks for this excellent video serie. One question. Can my full range front speakers act as subs? I only have one real sub but can I use the trick I learn from the video align subs?
You're welcome! The problem with aligning a mains bass frequency to a sub is that when you run full range sometimes you'll have just the mains playing those Frequencies and other times the sub via lfe. So the response will not be consistent as different speakers are playing the same notes at different times. This is why we want only the subs to be allowed to play those lower Frequencies. Remember the mains and the lfe channel are two different channels.
@@hometheatergurus Great Video! Adding to your response- How about if we setup full large front speakers as Large but then use LFE+Mains feature available in my Denon AVR to send low frequency signals to both Main speakers and subwoofer?
Instead of THX standard of 80hz, how about setting each speaker 20hz above its lowest frequency response? Eg 80 may not work for surrounds or smaller speakers.
It's important to understand why 80hz is the "starting point". It's not the goal but you don't want to go lower for the reasons explained. There's a few videos covering this and explaining why you'd go higher from speakers that won't go to 80hz to a higher crossover giving a better transition to the subs.
I'm planning on running subwoofer rca cable in plex tubing (pvc) with hdmi cable and front speaker wire (14awg) and ethernet cable it's about a 30ft run. Will I get interference running them all together or should I separate the runs? And advice would be appreciated. Thanks
@@hometheatergurus thanks I thought as much but wanted expert advice. I'll run subwoofer rca and speaker wire thru 1 plex (pvc) and hdmi and ethernet in another plex tube. Thanks for your help.
Man wish you was making these videos sooner! Lol but like they say better late than never. So it seems like I have to go check my set up again cause with my extra bass feature (Yamaha rx-a2070) it does sound better bass wise. And also I thought using the ypao volume introduced more problems with certain frequency response?
It should sound more full and realistic with YPAO volume engaged. Honestly a flat response is boring. I've had people think they needed more subs and we looked at their response and as soon I see it's flat we set a house curve or turn on loudness compensation and they realize they had plenty of subwoofage.. They were just using a flat target response. The science behind loudness compensation is solid and based on human perception of low frequencies. It shouldn't have any negative effects at all. Now I do personally like to limit eq to only the modal region (300hz or so and down). As for a bass boost YPAO volume should boost it enough but if you like more there's nothing wrong with that. Here's some info on it. hub.yamaha.com/ypao-volume-guarantees-fantastic-audio-at-all-volumes/
@@hometheatergurus ok thanks for the link, I will run it with ypao engaged, and as for the extra bass it makes the bass more Fuller but with it of it kinda sounds more natural non bloated. I will continue to experiment with content and the settings. Keep the video and knowledge coming!
@@hometheatergurus one more question, so I'm using 4 subs in my room. When I'm calibcalibrating them with an spl meter do I do one at a time to achieve 75db? Or do each individually?
@@Night_Watch413 once the subs are aligned they're never again treated as one sub but as a single group. You'll adjust for reference by using the mindsp input gain adjustment as seen in episode 7 or the avr subwoofer level adjustment.
@@deanhawk4511 just so you know a passive radiator is similar to a ported sub in that it tunes the Enclosure but it's different in that below tuning the driver is controlled and has a gentle slope like sealed. It's the best of both worlds. The passive radiators don't actually have output but it is an awesome design. Just pricey as the radiators aren't cheap.
svs subs have -10 -5 and 0, Is it okay to run at -5 or even max amp on the sub 0 as long as post calibration the avr set it to anything negative in the avr say -6
The sub levels are just voltage adjustments to get the subs setup right. They don't represent a level of power or sub output. You just don't want to max the trims out on the avr so high they clip the signal. Watch ep 8 as well you'll have a good understanding of how to set the sub levels.
Great info! Do you happen to have a vid on setting up Marantz/Denon receivers? I've got my Marantz set up pretty well, but always looking for more ideas/thoughts.
Thanks. I will soon. If you've seen the recent videos I sold a house and all my gear with it. I'm building a sub on the channel and afterwards will use it will show how to use the audyssey editor app.
@@clintyoung9902 other than confirming main to sub integration or looking at the sub response no. Now at a more advanced level sure you can just see issues that may need addressing.
G'day mate, greetings from Australia, I've watched nearly all you have produced here, I've learnt a lot, it's been very good, you do very well at making it easy to understand for the average Joe blow audiophile. In base management you show placement of dual subs diagonally across the room, front to left and rear right, is it optional and work just as well, to have the front right and rear left?, this would suit my room better, I've just upgraded my old trusty Kenwood KRF-V5100D-S running a 5.1 set up, it's been great for 11 years now, but now it's time for atmos and rears, so I dug deep and bought the Yamaha RX-A3070b, plus a pair of Polk Signature S60's, 20-300w, 8ohm, 90db, 26Hz-40Hz, for my fronts, I also bought second hand, 2 matching bookshelf speakers to go with my other bookshelf speakers, I had to buy second hand as the owners wife become very sick and they closed down unfortunately, she's now passed away, it's very sad, but I got lucky with a great pair, they are Australian made Accusounds Reference 8.6XD, 200w, 8ohm, 90db, 45-25k Hz, Centre has same specs with tweeter and twin drivers, subs are 200w, crossover 50Hz to 150Hz, variable phase 0-180, I'm setting up 7.2.2, could you please give me some idea on what you would set speakers to, particularly my polks, large is obvious, but what about crossover? Plus my accusounds would be small, but what would you set crossovers to for them too? Keep up the great work! Stephen
Glad you're liking the channel. I'd run auto setup and see where it sets crossovers for the smaller speakers. If it sets them at or below 80 I'd set them 80 as well as the towers . I'd set them small and 80 as well. Check out some of my other sub videos as to why. I think this one explains it too but basically one source of bass means every seat gets a different response so for quality sake we roll off to subs as soon as possible. That will always sound better and give a similar seat to seat response unless the sub set up needs help.
@@hometheatergurus Thanks man, I'm learning, I just watched your sub clip #10, with using spectroid app, which is going to be a great way of setting my subs right, my lounge room has a open kitchen off to the side of it, with small dividing walls, so it has a odd shape, it's quite a big area too, so using this spectroid app, that looks easy to use and read, I'll get my subs spot on. Cheers Stephen
@@hometheatergurus G'day HTG again, as I previously mentioned, I bought the yamaha rx-a3070 avr and polks s60's for my fronts, I'm thinking of using my old kenwood krf-v5100d-s as well in my set up, being 11.2 then, I seen a bench test on the yamaha rx-a3070, at 5 channels it's pumping 107w to each channel and a peak of 128w, then at 7 channels it takes a big drop , with 57w per channel, my kenwood with 5 channels is 100w per channel, or two channel stereo 120w per channel, what do you think I should configure my speakers to? , I was thinking kenwood powers centre, fronts and front atmos speakers, so my entire front stage, then yamaha would power the remaining 6 channels, where I might have around 80w per channel, if you think there's a better configuration please let me know, or what do you think of my idea for running both amps in my system and speaker set up? Cheers. Stephen
Wait.. can you please clear this up for me. I’ve always had LFE+main as my setting.. that’s how I’ve been told to set it but this video is telling me not to do this? Speakers are set to small (they are small in walls so not butthurt lol) and LFE set to 120. The video is confusing me. I thought you had to have it at LFE+ main so that when listening to any source without the ‘ .1 ‘ the subs would also play the bass frequencies and the EQ was done by your AVR even if you have EQ on your subs thru DSP & REW.
There's a lot of bad info out there. My advice is to do a complete brain dump and then come here for accurate information. Lfe+mains does what I explain in the video. Anyone who's told you different is well... Wrong and spreading bad information. Subs are the most confused part of this hobby. Ask 10 people what exactly is Lfe and what should the lpf be and you'll be lucky to get one right answer.
If you crossover your main speakers it doesn't mean that each spot will change, each spot will still hear both mains just as equal as before no mater if the speakers are set to small or large.
incorrect. Setting a speaker to small sends the low end (based on your xover freq) to the sub. This drastically improves the seat to seat consistency of the bass response if it's setup correctly. Keeping a main large will yield a different bass consistency across the seats. If you'd like to understand how bass behaves in room see ep 11.
Your information about avoiding a double crossover just made my basic HT go from mediocre to amazing, i had no idea i was making this error, i've not seen it explained so clearly. As someone with very little audio knowledge you make this information easy to process!
That's awesome!! Really glad it made a difference for you. I like to explain the why's vs just spewing stuff.
After 13 years of using my sub, I never thought of this either and disabling the crossover made a clearly audible difference. Great video!
I've been doing this for 30 years and I haven't read or watched anything as well put together and informative as this. Great work!
I've been listening to a lot of videos on this subject but I felt no one was answering my exact questions and you explained everything I needed answered! Great informational video! Thanks.
Thanks Dakota, Yes I think subs confuse so many that try to help and they end up spreading that confusion.
New sub here brother! Ive been doing home theater setups for over 25yrs and this was still a treat to listen to...very well explained and solid advice..love this channel and look forward to viewing more of ur episodes
I thought I had my bass management set up properly until I watched your video. Wow was I wrong. Thank you for this extremely thorough video and your crystal clear explanations. I especially appreciate your attention to "setting
I really appreciate your info about settings such as subwoofer phase and LFE plus main (Extra Bass for Yamaha), that other videos totally ignored!!! Thanks for an outstanding video!
Thanks and I'm glad you've found the videos helpful!
For years I've been running 80hz Sub cross in my LFE and missing out...went up to just 100hz and my 4K Blu-rays have the house exploding!! That extra data is tremendous, at 120hz LFE the power of the Bass production at even lowest listening levels!! So I went down to 100hz its still just such a profoundly new experience I wish you could go up in 5-10hz increments, its that significant. Thank you
Awesome man! great feedback!
@@hometheatergurus yeah I put that LPF right back to 120hz!! Its just too much information in that 80-120 hz!! It was the equivalent of having an RCA Interconnect unplugged!! I don't even know how to "Drive" my system anymore! I used to be able to gauge how an explosion or blast would sound, now Dynamics terrify me! I have to rewatch Every Movie I own...if you owned a Ferrari for two years,thought it was amazing...then your buddy gets in driver seat and tells you "Bro you are in Valet Mode...did you know that?" Then he switches it off..200Hp goes to 600Hp....and you can't handle your own car!
Now let's throw a curve ball. My Yamaha receiver doesn't let me adjust the subwoofer crossover. When I set the main crossover to 80hz the bass is anemic. Adjusting the main crossover to 100hz made the bass come ALIVE. Couple that with the adjustments to "volume" gain on my plate amp, & now I can shake the house.
If I could I would give it 2x thumbs up. Thanks!
Thank you!
Love your videos,!!
spend hours watching your videos learning stuff every day thanks
Glad I found your channel. Watched many videos and read many pages about this stuff in the past, especially for Sub crossover, and you hit it out of the park in one video. Almost every video in this series is relevant to me so far as well. Great info and more importantly, usable info. Keep it up!
Thanks and really glad you're enjoying them.
I don't know English . I just watch many your clip and i see you are master
Thanks for throwing in the comment about Def Tech speakers setting/connections. That's what I've been waiting to hear.
thank you, you schooled me today.... what i a have learned here is a great help!
Fantastic video. Only recommendation I am not sure about is turning Dynamic Equalisation on as this will basically compress the sound - and so if you have proper insulation, you would not need to worry about bass travelling throughout your house.
Most of your videos have multiple subs. If you have just one, how do you go about placing it and do you have to do anything else than matching it to the mains for smooth transition?
Fantastic video! I just want to make sure I understand… I have 2 subs. I have the hz knobs cranked all the way to LFE. And then in my crossover settings on my Integra, I have the LPF of LFE set to 120hz. All my other speakers (set to small) are at 80hz. Am I on the right track?
Very informative. I bought my amplifier 14y ago and I did not know these. I've been using setting on my sub amp and the main amplifier in the wrong way. Luckily that main amplifier is broken and I had to buy new one and I checked this video and couple others from you. Now I think I get more out from my system. Thank you sir! 🤝
Thanks and really glad my videos have improved your system!
If you have a single sub, would LFE+Main be useful or still a detriment?
At 29:30 you mention audessy asking you to adjust the sub gain. But what if you did the gain match steps beforehand? You should just skip the step in audessy, right?
Very nice info sir, I am definitely Sub(woofer)scribing.
I had my 2 subs in the front corners originally and was definitely sitting in a cancel mode position. So I took one of them and placed it in my listening position and crawled around the room and found the perfect position for placement which was on the left wall (if the screen was up), directly across from the recliner set about 2' towards the back...the crawl test is awesome IF YOU USE IT PROPERLY...meaning you use a sweep and not music. And yes, you can absolutely "hear" phase shift. Remember, this your system and based on your room dims, there may be a difference between "good sound" and "sounds good". Since no one is coming in to test the professionalism of my system, I'll go with "sounds good". I had to think about your explanation on the subwoofer gain knob because yes, there is an amplifier in an active sub...but you are absolutely right, the signal is either higher on the front end, or the back end...If I may be so bold to make a recommendation, turn your subwoofer gain knob high, that way the signal from the AVR is low...low power means cooler running and longer life.
Check out ep 10.
th-cam.com/video/giG7mQ0QJdM/w-d-xo.html
@@hometheatergurus LOL, ahh, yep! I had not gotten that far yet. Thanks!
@@mohare134 you're welcome. 😉
Hi. Love the content and I’m quickly learning how to built my new atmosphere setup my watching mostly your videos. Thanks! About your explanation of crossover overlap. When I used to design the crossover points for my car audio installs, we would underlap the two crossovers. For example, if it was a 12db per octave crossover we would make sure, at the crossover point, that the high and low pass frequencies would be down 6db where they overlap. That would give a flat response at the crossover point. If I set my active crossover point in my car at 80hz for both crossovers they will be playing same volume right up to those points and there will be a large hump at the crossover point. Back in the 90’s phoenix gokd would send out instructions with their amps on how to build passive crossovers. It really helped to understand how they worked.
Thanks best info on youtube about HT! no marketing crap just pure facts and science.
Thanks. That was the goal! 😁
Great Info. One of my favourite HT tube.. is You. TQ. Great Work. Malaysia.
I love the music at the end, what is the title, PLEASE. GREAT VIDEO. I learned so so much. Thank you.
Love your content and appreciate your talent to teach so well, Thanks.
Great video, I have my subs one front, one back opposite corners about 1/3 way against the wall, one sub phase is 0 and the other is 180, Subs are set to 120 and AVR is set to 60 and my front speakers have Subs built in. I’m going to try all your suggestions and listen, I’m sure my Home Theater will sound better, a update coming soon and let you know my results
I have a 21X17 family room with vaulted ceilings, angled fireplace, 2 large glass doors, and open on ⅔ of the other walls. Therefore my placing options are very limited. I have a TV that is angled at 30 degrees at a corner and a sofa that is also angled at 30 degrees 11 feet away. The left speaker has a 36 degree separation from the center but due to space limitations, the left speaker has only a 19 degree separation from the center. I have a 14" Velodyne sub which I can either place either behind the TV cabinet, or on the right side of the cabinet. I surmise that placing the sub behind the cabinet will cut off some of the sound, but it will allow me to move the cabinet 7" to the left and create 3 degrees more separation of the RF speaker (22) and reduce the LF to 33 degrees. Since everything in sound is a tradeoff, do you think placing the sub behind justifies the separation?
Hey bud, nice work. Crazy informative. Keep it up!
Thanks Jerry!
Hey HTG, thoughts on having a nearfield subwoofer? Do you think if I have just one subwoofer that is a good way to go?
Thanks for this info great work. I am using the Audyssey pro kit and am using my Marantz 8802 to set my subs crossover. On my Velodyne DD15+ sub I have a line level control setting and a speaker level control setting and also a high pass crossover setting 100 or 80 hz. What would I set these to BEFORE running my room correction. I know to set my low pass crossover to the highest setting on my sub but the other 3 settings I don’t know about. Thank
Yesss finally in simply terms explained.
Thank you !!!, awesome bass response here since I've used this tutorial.
Made an setup with an svs PCI 20-39 (12 inch vented) and an MJ acoustics pro 50 (8-inch closed) and believe it or not it works awesome !!!
Tight fast and deep extension for music and HT.
🙏🙏
I have SVS Ultra Towers, Centers and surrounds, and Audyssey always sets the towers to full range, I'm guessing due to room gain from a low ceiling. When I go in after RC has done its thing, and set them back to small with an 80hz crossover, I've got a big sub alignment issue. I've been correcting this by changing the distance setting in a positive value until the hole in the response is gone via REW measurements. Is this the proper way? Or is there a better way?
Great video.
I was hoping to figure out why my CT-150 Velodyne (yeah it's pretty old but hasn't been used in years in my warm living room as a table for my receiver. lol)
I turned it off permanently because occasionally I'll get a loud boom even when not in use. When I get close to the woofer there's an occasional static. I've replaced the cable. Still an issue.
Is my expensive seldom used subwoofer just a table now?
Do you need a line of sight to to the subwoofer from the MLP? If I put mine in the corner it’s going to go behind my front speakers
You are so good at what you explain.👍🏿👍🏿
Thanks Matt!
Amazing video. Love these!
Thanks Paul!
I'm worried I'm going to have problems in my (15X16X9.6") room. Its 3 walls and then opens into the rest of the house. Is it possible to overcome this with brute force alone? I don't have many sub placement options. And buying two of these subs might cause my neighbors to want to shoot me. Lol.
If i do dirac meassurement,i should Take the Subwoofer phae which is best to my taste or should it be 0?
I have my two Klipsch reference behind my Seat.
Hi. How to deal with modal frequencies in stereo listening through stereo amplifier which has no crossover built-in? And my front L/R speakers are going down to 32Hz. Want to use miniDSP and 3subs which I use for home theatre. In that case I need to align in addition 2 speakers L/R as they are acting like "subwoofers" and add a crossover in miniDSP? Please give a tip! :)
Hi! Thanks for this great video.
I have one problem with my sub settings though. I have a sub that has fixed LPF at 90 Hz. Now you say that never use the LPF for LFE on receiver side. But even if I try to push whole 15-120 Hz LFE channel to my sub I am still loosing 90-120 Hz from it.
Is there any way in the receiver to direct that 90-120 part of LFE to my main L and R towers?
If not then I think I have one option. My sub also has fixed HPF for L+R. So the one option would be to set in the receiver no sub at all and instead direct the LFE to main L+R. I am using separate power amp for main L+R. Then take the main L+R line out signal to sub input and from sub output to main power amp. But then my receiver's audyssey can't phase aling my sub correctly or can it? I have my sub behind MLP. The sub has phase control with 45 deg steps. Then I would need to use REW measurements to align my sub with my mains, right?
Just to clarify. LFE + main only matters (only activates) when your speakers are set to large, right? I know that Denon lets you set LFE + main even when speakers are set to small, but as I understand, that doesn't change anything.
That’s correct Isak. If you set the speakers to small, then LFE or LFE+Main makes no difference. Only when the speakers are set to Large does LFE+Main activate.
@@beyondonethousand Thank you
What about in a square living room and you have 3 subs and 1 row of seats what’s the best option their
See episode 11
Do you recommend using two different brands of subs over two matching pair of subs? I have an HSU VTF-1 sub that is amazing and two RSL Speedwoofers which are great but the HSU is better. So should I mismatch my subs or keep using the two identical subs?
I have been watching your videos for awhile and have your REW and other videos saved for reference.
I do have a question about this one though.
Does driver orientation mean anything? If so, how much?
For example, my 123" screen is 62cm from back wall, which means my svs pb-2000 can't be on the front wall with drivers pointing forwards. And with my bedlayer LR 60 degrees apart they can't be frint corners,which also gives me a really bad response at mlp. I have a weird room with half slanted walls and a stairwell.
At present i have 1 sub behind/below the screen with driver pointing left, and 1 sub behind mlp a bit to the side also with driver pointing left, this gives me a pretty good response with only a 3db lowered response between 65-80hz, but placement isn't ideal.
Thank you for all your help and very easy to follow videos.
Very informative video...If possible Please try to make a video on Room Acoustics based on different REW results.
Thanks! I'll definitely be doing manipulation of reflections (room acoustics) but it won't be based on rew but based on analysis of off axis responses and determining how we want to treat different reflections to achieve a desired goal. Rew would be used afterwards just to make sure you didn't have any major issues still left to deal with. It won't be used for a treatment plan.
@@hometheatergurus Thank you...that too will be good
Great Channel,
Is it better to use different heights with multiple subs? So one at 10cm from the ground the other at 30cm for example. Saw that in a tutorial, what's your opinion? gr Dan
If you watch the room mode episode you'll see there are modes between all parallel surfaces so height is important. It's a good idea to center the cone at head level.
One more question - if the AVR has 2 sub outs (but they are only the splitter), one sub is by the TV and another sub is closer to the listening position (on the right of the sofa), will Audyssey align them? I don't have to tweak the Phase (set to 180)?
I have a Dayton MX15-22 sub in a DIY enclosure tuned to 19hz, but lacks in the higher freq. Should I set my fronts to small but xover at 40hz (Polk Audio RTi A9) to handle the higher freq? There are only two seats in my room, side by side. 7.1.4
Thank you for all your videos, been a tremendous help in setting up my dedicated HT room!!
btw I just added a Dayton bass shaker to my recliner, boy oh boy did i ever laugh the when i first set it up I turned on Avatar 2 and a chopper was flying over hahah
Nice overview. One thing regarding LFE and crossovers, the LFE is a dedicated channel that is separate from other low frequency content. The LFE should be unaffected by the crossover setting, which will filter the other audio channels only but preserves the LFE content as-is. At least this is how it is on my Yamaha A1080. So even if you use a typical 80hz crossover, your sub would still receive 120hz LFE content.
Yes I'm not sure if you watched the whole video but this is explained in detail in the video.
Sound like you may have skipped quite a bit as bass management and LFE is a good chunk of the video. But you are correct mostly and that's how how all avrs work.
Low frequency content is the lfe channel so its not separate. It stands for low frequency effect. Bass management is the process of routing to the sub using speakers set to small and a crossover. Bass management is separate from LFE as one is a channel the other is stripped from other channels.
@@hometheatergurus I went back and re-watched, my comment was in reference to the discussion at the 25:32 mark. Somehow I totally missed that you were referring specifically to the LFE low pass filter and not the general crossover setting. I don't think my receiver even has a LPF setting for the LFE, not sure why you would even want to set this as LFE content only goes to the sub-out as you stated.
@@aaronarchy11 yeah it's an odd setting. I know some big wigs in the industry that think it's just because people like settings and if one has it the others want it. It shouldn't exist.
@@hometheatergurus That makes sense, sometimes I feel like I need a Ph.D to understand all the settings on my receiver. Honestly I wish they would simplify everything. At least now a lot of receivers are adding onscreen descriptions to each setting which helps.
@@aaronarchy11 agreed. Small vs large is kinda dumb and misleading too. It has absolutely nothing to do with what it's purpose is.
Great video as usual. Question: I have two subs, of 3 total, connected by Y connector. When I run audussy can I calibrate with those 2 subs on? Or should I disconnect one? Ty
That might be the best subwoofer class I’ll ever watched..you don’t know how much that helps me out!..question bud..can I hook 4 satellite heigh speakers to one surround sound hookup..(left/right). Can I Hook them up in parallel?..I have a 7.2 avr..thanks again..joe
Thanks Joe!
Yes you can hook them in parallel and it will cut the ohms in half. If the speakers are 8 ohms it'll be 4 ohms in parallel. Some avrs are fine with this some will not be.
Home Theater Gurus probably won’t end up doing that away.but,just was wondering..thank you!
@@joelane4670 you're welcome.
I should add for anyone else reading this that a speaker rated at 8 ohms isn't 8 ohms at all frequencies but often can have dips much lower so in parallel they'll dip below 4 ohms in places. Just something to be aware of.
Buy another amp , if you current amp has pre outs, it must. Hook 4rca cables to height and then hook 4 satellite speakers to amp .
great tutorial. I have questions. I am using emotiva XMC-2 processor which I can assign bass management and LFE to separate subwoofer. What happened if my setting like this:
1. I have 4 dedicated subwoofer in each room corner for bass management ( all speaker set as small, crossover at 80hz, so all freq lower than 80hz will go to these 4 subs). of course all these 4 subs time align.
2. I have another dedicated 4 subs in each room corner for LFE only (stacked on top of bass management subs). again all LFE subs time align.
my questions is, will my setting worst than just use 4 subs ( LFE and bass management using the same subs)? The signal for Bass management and LFE is different right?
My subs run on the same signal..I have 2 sub hookups,but just 1 output..Should subs be set differently phase wise? Like one on 0.and one and 180?thanks ..joe
if my avr has 2x sub outs, do i use input 1 and 2 on the mini dsp or should i just have sub 1+2 into dsp input 1&2 BUT have the output signal coming out being feed from 1 input basically make it a y splitter ?
Your videos are outstanding. Thank you. I do have a placement question. Room is 16x30 with screen on short wall. I have four 15" Klipsch subs. Would like to try one in each corner, but have a problem with one. The back right corner has a door on the side. I would have to move the back right speaker about 36" forward from the rear wall. Thoughts?
Would these setting also be correct for a system that you also use for music playback.
Absolutely. Bass is bass. This video isn't about music VS theater it's just proper setup when using a sub in any system when using the lfe output of the processor.
Can i put my mains on top of my 2 subs infront? Space is kind of limited.
Of course!
Love the channel 5 stars. My processor only has single LFE going into a Rane THX44 PEQ and out into 2 subs. Should I measure both subs together or individually?
Thanks. Yes during placement confirmation and alignment you'll need individual responses. See Ep 7 for the procedure.
@@hometheatergurus Thanks Steve appreciated help.
How do i set my arcam avr31 as i cant find a sub setting on it, ?
I have 2 x polk subw, mxt12 (50rms)and hts12(200rms) .Wich one to put în front/back
Yeah, my AVR7706 wants me to turn my subs up to about 72. I take it as they have week amps so it needs it almost 3/4 the way up. They are Elac SUB3010s. Now I understand it better I know that is not the case. Plus I also know they have 400w amps with 200w continuous
Just became fan of your channel.
I got two svs sb3000. If gain/volume does not matter much - what is the best way to feel more bass? I am using Marantz Sr 8012 Avr.
Thanks! The Gain is used to set the voltage from the avr. See the calibrating for Reference video.
For more bass I'd make sure dynamic is on with an offset of 0. If you still want more boost it some. Also see the video on chest kick and make sure you have a good dip free response.
Home Theater Gurus thanks!!! So tempted to buy the mic and dsp and learn this whole process. Seems intimidating
Can I use my Anthem ARC mic with REW?
Thank you so much for your videos! One question, why can't you time align Mains to the sub(s) in the sub region as well? It's like adding additional subs, when you enable LFE+Main mode, so it should give you more consistency in the bass response, if they all are aligned. Am I wrong?
LFE+MAIN allows the LFE and the low frequencies from all speaker channels to be output to the subwoofer. You would normally choose this setting when decoding PCM based audio or playing back from an analog source.
@@Junglemama0 What I asked is why nobody recommends to play sub frequencies from both the main speakers (if they are capable to do it) and the separate subwoofer at the same time. I guess the effect should be like having several subwoofers playing at the same time, if they all aligned in the sub region.
Great video! I also have the Def Tech 9080s.. Just to clarify. I should set them to "small"? And 'LFE" only on the AVR setting as well? Not "LFE + MAIN"? I have an older Revel B15a 1000w sub with a 3 band eq with a low pass filter switch (on/off) and a low pass filter that toggles between 24 and 48 db, a high pass freq knob that goes from 30-80 and a high pass filter switch that toggles between 12 and 24 db. How will movie settings affect music listening? If I switch to "stereo" will it bypass those settings? I am running a Denon X4200W and am driving my Def Techs through an Emotiva preamp/amp
I thought only setting mains to large and LFE+main will mess things up.
Are you saying that Small and LFE+Main is also messing up the bass?
I was of an impression is that Small and LFE+Main has no effect on multichannel stuff (because - SMALL + crossover). What this setup actually does is it engages the subs when I am listening to stereo music with pure direct.
What are your thoughts on the SVSOUND AS-EQ1 Subwoofer Equalizer? Is it worth the cost?
Thanks for another guru level video. I will be adding a mini DSP to my dual sub setup soon and I’m looking forward to that. Once I’ve dialed things in as best as possible, I am going to revisit the bass when I use multi channel stereo. The bass is always so much worst than 2 channel. I’m planning to mess with different house curves to address this. (I bought a mini DSP remote to use a different settings). Are there any known issues before I attempt the multichannel stereo thing? What frequency is the bass thump? I really want to emphasize this while listening to 2 channels. Thanks
If you have a MiniDSP, would you advise only using one sub out even if you have 2?
Yep. It's explained in this video and in ep 7 we actually go more in depth. Never use both sub outs out of the processor.
@@hometheatergurus awww thx that answered my question
Ok, so what I do with left and right mains that are powered amplified 1,600 watts built in with inputs for the LFE cable that comes from preouts from AVR. Still set them small? How would you set them if you want to use the AVR lfe preouts and set subwoofer alignment on a minidsp4hd?
This is actually specifically covered in this video towards the end. You treat them as subs so you'd set to small and align them to the rest of the subs.
One of the best explanation.... thanks a million 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
Awesome video. Could you please help some of us that just have 1 subwoofer? Most people don't have the luxury or room space for multiple subs. But we are armed with REW. So whats the best we can do to setup our sub?
You mean placement wise?
@@hometheatergurus everything: how to find the best spot using REW (not sub crawl), how to align sub to mains, how to find the best crossover for our rooms response, etc. Basically hownto get the flattest response with 1 sub for the main seat.
@@KurtCocainOriginal episode 7 covers rew and placement. 9 does as well without rew as well as setup for single or multiple subs. The next video will show a method I've come up with that doesn't require rew to confirm placement but isn't blind like the sub crawl.
As for one sub there are known good spots to help and I'll soon cover it. The upcoming room mode episode will also be helpful.
@@hometheatergurus I second the request for more content geared towards single sub owners. I have a pair of robust towers, but only one sub and I can't add another. Any videos you can provide to optimize placement, crossover points, and integration with the main speakers would be appreciated.
Is a mini DSP HD only useful for parallel sub outputs? How will a mini DSP work with 2 independent sub outputs. I own 4 SVS PB-2000’s and I want to be able to properly integrate them. I always thought the a mini DSP HD worked best with a parallel connection.
Use just one, output you don’t the second one.
azzy mazzy thanks for the info... can I use REW to level match the sub or do I have to use an SPL meter?
DaDevastator24_7 yeah check episode 8
What a great set of videos... Well Thought out and Very Informative... Thank You so much for these!!!!
Had a question that maybe you can answer for me I have a PB16 Ultra and 2 Klipsch KSW 12 subs is it possible to align these or should i even bother?
You're welcome!
As for the subs absolutely they can be used together. See episode 8 and then 7 to make it happen!
@@hometheatergurus Will do and thank you so much for the feedback
Hello I’m confused- I have 3 subwoofers and each subwoofer I max out the crossover and all 3 sub with the gain at 50% - on my receiver is it to set at 80hz or 120hz ?
120hz is likely your hpf which is a filter for the Lfe channel (. 1 content). The crossover is set to whatever frequency you or room correction chooses. Often 80hz but not ways.
You mentioned something about not changing the distances on your speakers after the calibration but what if the auto cal gets the distances wrong on all channels?
That would be rare but if it does happen I'd run it again. If it's still off set the loudspeakers to actual distance and the sub distance will be set to have a most positive summation across the crossover point to the mains.
Home Theater Gurus thank you so much for the quick reply. So you’re saying if it’s still off set distance for mains and then leave the sub alone, distance wise at what the receiver sets it at or set that manually as well?
@@bensb166 no you'll need to set sub distance yourself too. Ep 26 covers that.
Home Theater Gurus ok, I thought you meant that. Anyway, thank you so much for taking the time to answer my questions. I love and am obsessed with your channel since coming across it the other day. So informative, Thank you again
@@bensb166 you're very welcome!
Nice video like always! . I'm running two JBL es250p subwoofers that have a port underneath the sub instead of the front like most subs do. They're at the quarter and 3 quarter width like you instructed. How far away should I keep them away from the front wall?
Wanted to check on something about sub placement. The Harmon report seemed to say the the best configuration was 2 subs on opposite walls at the mid-way point. This was followed by 4 subs either on in the corners or at the mid-way point on the walls, which were really a toss up. So why go with 4 subs?
4 is the point of demonishing returns. 1 to 2 is of course the biggest improvement with 2 to 4 being a smaller improvement. For most 2 subs are plenty although 4 can make seating a little easier as more modes can be fixed so especially with more than one row its helpful.
I just stumbled upon your channel as I am about to upgrade from a 5.1 to a 7.1.4 Great info! Most of your stuff deals with 2 or more subs and I only have 1. You say that more subs give better results and you should not use double bass as it throws everything out the window. But what if I do set my receiver to double bass and do the measurements to find the best spot for my sub like that? Then I´m getting multiple sources of low frequencies and "faking" multiple subs (of course I know that the mains don´t compare to a sub). Is this complete gibberish or could this work?
Thanks! Double bass doesn't allow Lfe to play in mains so any content on the Lfe channel is only sent to the one sub.
“Sleep with some KY jelly”. 😂
I wish you was a stereo guy (: I started to watch your videos because I wanted to learn REW for building a house curve for my stereo setup. I am going to export the filteres to Roon that has a build in DSP engine. I have a 7.4.1 setup Marantz AV8805, 2 x Emotiva XPA-5 gen2 and a Primaluna HP Integrated tube amp with passthrough for the fronts. So this is a combined setup for stereo and surround
I will be going over whole speaker house curves and eq down the road a little.
@@hometheatergurus The stereo community really need a good video about REW.
At what Hz the mono signal is now turn into Stereo Signal?
Stereo means two, mono means one. Not sure exactly what you're asking.
@@hometheatergurus Yes, I know that. But, check this. The Subwoofer signal is a mono signal. The subwoofers response is between 10 and 80 Hz. That means, from 10 to 80 Hz, we have a mono signal. IT does not matter if a thunder sounds on the Left speaker, we have a mono signal from 10 yo 80 Hz right. So, If I put my crossover to 120 Hz, the mono signal will be between 10 to 120 Hz. Right? And the signal between 120 Hz and 20 kHz will be stereo. So, imagine this. I have 3 subs, sweeping from 20 to 80Hz. But I hace a problem on 150 Hz or Maybe 180 Hz. Can I use another DSP to eq this signal and improve it a little bit and these Hz could be mono (as a sub) or should I use two outputs for stereo? Hahaha sorry, but I'm confused
@@KneyerLand the sub channel (Lfe) is mono because it's one channel. There is no stereo unless it's a 2.1 or 2.0 system. It's multi channel. So
If you have an issue above the subs see the episode on room modes as we address it there and also sub to main integration video we also touch on it.
But yes you could use mid bass modules to to what you're proposing. That would actually be the only time I'd recommend them. Assuming no other solutions worker or could be done. 180hz could be playing from any one or any combination of the loudspeakers in the room.
Thanks for this excellent video serie. One question. Can my full range front speakers act as subs? I only have one real sub but can I use the trick I learn from the video align subs?
You're welcome!
The problem with aligning a mains bass frequency to a sub is that when you run full range sometimes you'll have just the mains playing those Frequencies and other times the sub via lfe. So the response will not be consistent as different speakers are playing the same notes at different times. This is why we want only the subs to be allowed to play those lower Frequencies. Remember the mains and the lfe channel are two different channels.
@@hometheatergurus Great Video! Adding to your response- How about if we setup full large front speakers as Large but then use LFE+Mains feature available in my Denon AVR to send low frequency signals to both Main speakers and subwoofer?
Instead of THX standard of 80hz, how about setting each speaker 20hz above its lowest frequency response? Eg 80 may not work for surrounds or smaller speakers.
It's important to understand why 80hz is the "starting point". It's not the goal but you don't want to go lower for the reasons explained. There's a few videos covering this and explaining why you'd go higher from speakers that won't go to 80hz to a higher crossover giving a better transition to the subs.
Thanks I never knew this was how it when... Thanks again.
I'm planning on running subwoofer rca cable in plex tubing (pvc) with hdmi cable and front speaker wire (14awg) and ethernet cable it's about a 30ft run. Will I get interference running them all together or should I separate the runs? And advice would be appreciated. Thanks
No you can run audio cables together just fine. You don't want to run audio and signal cables parallel to electrical though.
@@hometheatergurus thanks I thought as much but wanted expert advice. I'll run subwoofer rca and speaker wire thru 1 plex (pvc) and hdmi and ethernet in another plex tube. Thanks for your help.
@@gadgetguy5871 you're welcome!
Man wish you was making these videos sooner! Lol but like they say better late than never. So it seems like I have to go check my set up again cause with my extra bass feature (Yamaha rx-a2070) it does sound better bass wise. And also I thought using the ypao volume introduced more problems with certain frequency response?
It should sound more full and realistic with YPAO volume engaged. Honestly a flat response is boring. I've had people think they needed more subs and we looked at their response and as soon I see it's flat we set a house curve or turn on loudness compensation and they realize they had plenty of subwoofage.. They were just using a flat target response. The science behind loudness compensation is solid and based on human perception of low frequencies. It shouldn't have any negative effects at all. Now I do personally like to limit eq to only the modal region (300hz or so and down). As for a bass boost YPAO volume should boost it enough but if you like more there's nothing wrong with that.
Here's some info on it.
hub.yamaha.com/ypao-volume-guarantees-fantastic-audio-at-all-volumes/
@@hometheatergurus ok thanks for the link, I will run it with ypao engaged, and as for the extra bass it makes the bass more Fuller but with it of it kinda sounds more natural non bloated. I will continue to experiment with content and the settings. Keep the video and knowledge coming!
@@hometheatergurus one more question, so I'm using 4 subs in my room. When I'm calibcalibrating them with an spl meter do I do one at a time to achieve 75db? Or do each individually?
@@Night_Watch413 once the subs are aligned they're never again treated as one sub but as a single group. You'll adjust for reference by using the mindsp input gain adjustment as seen in episode 7 or the avr subwoofer level adjustment.
Mine is an older bowers and Wilkins asw 500 just a gain volume.
Thanks again for a great video.
Onkyo says velodyne va1012 is 24 feet away . It's only 10 feet away . What's your thoughts .
As mentioned in the video sub distance is never actual distance. It's an timing (delay) setting used to align the lcr to subs.
@@hometheatergurus wasn't sure if the passive radiator woofer was confusing the avr . Thanks for the fast response .
@@deanhawk4511 just so you know a passive radiator is similar to a ported sub in that it tunes the Enclosure but it's different in that below tuning the driver is controlled and has a gentle slope like sealed. It's the best of both worlds. The passive radiators don't actually have output but it is an awesome design. Just pricey as the radiators aren't cheap.
Excellent information!!!
Thanks!
svs subs have -10 -5 and 0, Is it okay to run at -5 or even max amp on the sub 0 as long as post calibration the avr set it to anything negative in the avr say -6
The sub levels are just voltage adjustments to get the subs setup right. They don't represent a level of power or sub output. You just don't want to max the trims out on the avr so high they clip the signal. Watch ep 8 as well you'll have a good understanding of how to set the sub levels.
Great info! Do you happen to have a vid on setting up Marantz/Denon receivers? I've got my Marantz set up pretty well, but always looking for more ideas/thoughts.
Thanks.
I will soon. If you've seen the recent videos I sold a house and all my gear with it. I'm building a sub on the channel and afterwards will use it will show how to use the audyssey editor app.
@@hometheatergurus Great! Will you be using REW in conjunction with Audyssey?
@@clintyoung9902 other than confirming main to sub integration or looking at the sub response no. Now at a more advanced level sure you can just see issues that may need addressing.
@@hometheatergurus Great. I just got the app downloaded. Looking foward to the video.
I have an sw 110 klipsch sub. With gain...loudness...phase.
I have an iNuke instead of mini-dsp. Is Invert in the mini-dsp the same as phase in iNuke?
Yep. The software looks different but it has the same functions. If I remember right it's in the configuration tab.
@@hometheatergurus Thank you.
G'day mate, greetings from Australia, I've watched nearly all you have produced here, I've learnt a lot, it's been very good, you do very well at making it easy to understand for the average Joe blow audiophile. In base management you show placement of dual subs diagonally across the room, front to left and rear right, is it optional and work just as well, to have the front right and rear left?, this would suit my room better, I've just upgraded my old trusty Kenwood KRF-V5100D-S running a 5.1 set up, it's been great for 11 years now, but now it's time for atmos and rears, so I dug deep and bought the Yamaha RX-A3070b, plus a pair of Polk Signature S60's, 20-300w, 8ohm, 90db, 26Hz-40Hz, for my fronts, I also bought second hand, 2 matching bookshelf speakers to go with my other bookshelf speakers, I had to buy second hand as the owners wife become very sick and they closed down unfortunately, she's now passed away, it's very sad, but I got lucky with a great pair, they are Australian made Accusounds Reference 8.6XD, 200w, 8ohm, 90db, 45-25k Hz, Centre has same specs with tweeter and twin drivers, subs are 200w, crossover 50Hz to 150Hz, variable phase 0-180, I'm setting up 7.2.2, could you please give me some idea on what you would set speakers to, particularly my polks, large is obvious, but what about crossover? Plus my accusounds would be small, but what would you set crossovers to for them too?
Keep up the great work!
Stephen
Glad you're liking the channel. I'd run auto setup and see where it sets crossovers for the smaller speakers. If it sets them at or below 80 I'd set them 80 as well as the towers . I'd set them small and 80 as well. Check out some of my other sub videos as to why. I think this one explains it too but basically one source of bass means every seat gets a different response so for quality sake we roll off to subs as soon as possible. That will always sound better and give a similar seat to seat response unless the sub set up needs help.
@@hometheatergurus Thanks man, I'm learning, I just watched your sub clip #10, with using spectroid app, which is going to be a great way of setting my subs right, my lounge room has a open kitchen off to the side of it, with small dividing walls, so it has a odd shape, it's quite a big area too, so using this spectroid app, that looks easy to use and read, I'll get my subs spot on.
Cheers
Stephen
@@stephenfrancisvoros382 good luck. If you feel like taking the next step eq 7 is it. Using spectroid is like an intro to 7.
@@hometheatergurus
G'day HTG again, as I previously mentioned, I bought the yamaha rx-a3070 avr and polks s60's for my fronts, I'm thinking of using my old kenwood krf-v5100d-s as well in my set up, being 11.2 then, I seen a bench test on the yamaha rx-a3070, at 5 channels it's pumping 107w to each channel and a peak of 128w, then at 7 channels it takes a big drop , with 57w per channel, my kenwood with 5 channels is 100w per channel, or two channel stereo 120w per channel, what do you think I should configure my speakers to? , I was thinking kenwood powers centre, fronts and front atmos speakers, so my entire front stage, then yamaha would power the remaining 6 channels, where I might have around 80w per channel, if you think there's a better configuration please let me know, or what do you think of my idea for running both amps in my system and speaker set up?
Cheers.
Stephen
If i have 2 subwoofer in rear corners, is it the same thing as front corners?
Yes it is however the subs may become localized lower in frequency if they're all behind you.
Gold ❤
Thanks!
Wait.. can you please clear this up for me. I’ve always had LFE+main as my setting.. that’s how I’ve been told to set it but this video is telling me not to do this? Speakers are set to small (they are small in walls so not butthurt lol) and LFE set to 120.
The video is confusing me. I thought you had to have it at LFE+ main so that when listening to any source without the ‘ .1 ‘ the subs would also play the bass frequencies and the EQ was done by your AVR even if you have EQ on your subs thru DSP & REW.
There's a lot of bad info out there. My advice is to do a complete brain dump and then come here for accurate information.
Lfe+mains does what I explain in the video. Anyone who's told you different is well... Wrong and spreading bad information. Subs are the most confused part of this hobby. Ask 10 people what exactly is Lfe and what should the lpf be and you'll be lucky to get one right answer.
If you crossover your main speakers it doesn't mean that each spot will change, each spot will still hear both mains just as equal as before no mater if the speakers are set to small or large.
incorrect. Setting a speaker to small sends the low end (based on your xover freq) to the sub. This drastically improves the seat to seat consistency of the bass response if it's setup correctly. Keeping a main large will yield a different bass consistency across the seats. If you'd like to understand how bass behaves in room see ep 11.