Why LeBron James Isn't The GOAT (or even second-best)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ต.ค. 2023
- Who's the NBA GOAT? Everyone has their opinions, but what do the stats say? In today's video, I review some popular GOAT candidates and reveal who is number 1 and 2 on the list!
Do you agree? disagree? Share your GOAT and why below. - กีฬา
Pretty dismissive of Kobe in my opinion. He put up huge numbers during one of the slowest if not the slowest pace and league history. The lack of MVPs was purely political. Everyone knows it. No one was putting up numbers like he was. While winning titles in two different decades with two different iterations of his teams. He put Wilt Chamberlain #s just in a guard's body .The closest thing to MJ is him and no one else.
Thank you and beat the most 50 win teams out of anybody on this list including without Shaq
4 in a row for 3 years straight (the jazz were 48-34 in 2009* but still...) and went 2-3 with Pau only@@terricarter9435
yeah its like literally everyone has been brainwashed by the media and cant see the true greatness of Kobe. Bunch of casuals imo
Kobe never let USA team got bronze in international championships. Scoring when other guys cannot score is what a leader should do. That is why we need to watch whole games rather than Excel tables
@@alisa2284 💯 TRUTH!
Every strong team has a window of 4 or 5 seasons when their stars are in their prime & healthy and ready to contend. Jordan used 1 window to win 6. Kareem used 1.3 window (.3 being Oscar) to win 6. Magic used 1 for 5. Duncan used 1.3 (.3 being DRob) for 5. Kobe used 2 for 5. Shaq used 2 for 4. Bird used 1 for 3. Olajuwon used 1 for 2.
Lebron OTOH had to used 3 to only produce 4. He needed way more help than everyone else. That's just not a sign of dominance. He's no better than the guys listed above.
Jordan had help all that time, Pippen in 6 titles, Rodman in last 3 and the Bulls were the better team in general and favourites in all 6 Finals they'd been to. LBJ's teams were all underdogs except for 2020
You had me in the first part, then you lowered your head into your own shit filled toilet in the second half.
Jordan had 2 stacked teams, with the best number 2 in the league, the absolute best coach in the league, in the softest Era of basketball, against the most mediocre competition EVER.
You MJ cum guzzling fan boys are something else. MJ had a losing record before Phil Jackson and scottie and Rodman. Bron has never finished a season under .500 except for his rookie year.
You got alot of balls and delusion going on 😂
@@xlr0gd205you're saying that miami team are underdogs makes you sound foolish.. we're not saying MJ had no help, of course he had, basketball is a team sport and he acknowledges pip every chance he gets and you are right.. the bulls were the better team because of one reason, MJ.. they weren't feared because of pippen or rodman or jackson.. and lebron, however talented he is, he has a weak mentality, always choosing the easy way out(team hopping) and he always gets himself in trouble like when he said they were not gonna have just not 1, not 3...... not 8.. he can't evenback his word up.. and the two times he won in miami, one of them he barely squeezed by..
@@userjlj foolish are the people who never understood the greatness of that Dallas team. They didn't sweep LAL for no reason, neither did they gent-sweep OKC for no reason
Then we have 2012 OKC who literally led 1-0 in the finals. They were quintessence of a team like 04 Pistons, but more offensively. Counting them out would be stupid. And the Spurs are the Spurs lol. Popovich is a HOF coach, big 3 were still great despite age plus young Kawhi Leonard who was coming to stardom. He did just that in 2014 when they won as Wade and Bosh ran out of gas
Very good analysis. I can get with your conclusion. I too rank Magic higher than most. But I'm a little surprised you didn't mention the guy who won 3 straight MVPs during the 80's with Magic in the league while also winning 2 titles during that span (one of them in a classic win over Magic's Lakers where he won Finals MVP). Maybe you think the injuries that slowed him down in the late 80's knocked him down a peg or two in the GOAT conversation but at his best, Bird was absolutely as good as anyone who has ever played the game.
Oh...like I said, loved the analysis. Better than the superficial arguments most put out there. And you're not afraid to go against he grain. Subscribed. Looking forward to more videos.
Hey, thanks for that great assessment…really good perspective…the main reason I didn’t include Larry Bird was his Finals efficiency dropped more significantly than the others. He’s 49.6% FG for his career, but drops to 45.7%FG in Finals games…and with 2 Finals MVP’s, and only 3 titles,(still amazing though), it drops him ever so slightly…but I agree that at his best, he’s right there with the greatest ever.
Bird won 3 titles not 2!
@@dennissheehe Your overreliance on "MVPS" is a big weakness. Too political. No set criteria. MJ should have the most MVP awards of all time and the fact MOST PEOPLE AGREE WITH that notion, but he does not, PROVES MY POINT.
MVPs are highly political. Nash was never the most VALUABLE player in the NBA.
MICHAEL JEFFEREY JORDAN>THE REST 😳
Hey hey , it's og loc homie
Exactly. Forget about the number of rings and other accomplishments. Let’s talk about basic skill, or rather, the lack thereof in LeFraud's case. It's clear as day that both MJ and Kobe were lightyears ahead of LeBronze in terms of sheer basketball prowess.
LeQueen can only score most of his points by driving to the rim. It's like watching a one-trick pony in action. Sure, he's got the build of a freight train, but when it comes to actual skill, he falls way short.
Let's start with the basics: shooting. While Jordan and Kobe were draining silky smooth jumpers from all over the court, LeChoke struggles to hit a mid-range shot without looking like a deer caught in headlights.
And let's not forget about footwork and finesse. Jordan and Kobe had the grace of ballet dancers combined with the precision of surgeons. Their footwork was a work of art, allowing them to create separation from defenders and hit those jaw-dropping shots. But LeFlop? Well, he's more like a bull in a china shop, finesse is a foreign concept to him.
But hey, at least LeBronze can dish out some flashy passes, right? Well, let's not get carried away, his passing is more about brute force than finesse. It's like watching a quarterback throw a Hail Mary pass every time he makes a play. Sometimes it works, but more often than not, it's just a reckless display of power. He can't hold a candle to Magic Johnson. Magic's artistic flair, court vision, and ability to control the game through his passing set him apart as the greatest playmaker in the game.
Not to mention defense, while LeQuit is often praised for his physicality on the court, his defensive prowess completely falls short when compared to the likes of MJ and Kobe. When it comes to lockdown defense.
Let's start with Jordan, who was a defensive juggernaut. His tenaciousness on the defensive end was legendary, earning him numerous NBA All-Defensive Team selections. Jordan's ability to shut down opponents was unparalleled. He possessed lightning-quick hands, exceptional footwork, and an uncanny ability to anticipate his opponents' moves. Whether it was stealing the ball, blocking shots, or simply suffocating his matchups, Jordan was a terror on defense.
Kobe too known for his relentless work ethic, he had the mindset of a tiger on the court. He took pride in shutting down his opponents and embraced the challenge of guarding the opposing team's best player. Kobe's footwork, combined with his defensive instincts and competitive fire, allowed him to frustrate and disrupt even the most skilled offensive players.
Now, let's turn our attention to LeSoft James. His defensive lapses, lack of consistent effort, and questionable decision-making on that end of the court have been evident. Unlike MJ and Kobe, who embraced the challenge of guarding the opposing team's best player, LeFrozen has often shied away from such assignments. His defensive contributions have mostly revolved around chasing down opponents for highlight reel blocks, rather than consistently locking down his man or being a disruptive force.
It's important to note that defense is not solely about individual accolades or highlight plays. It's about consistently making a significant impact on that end of the court, shutting down opponents, and being a leader on defense. Once again, LeBronze falls short compared to the defensive legacies left by Jordan and Kobe
So, when it comes to skill alone, LeFrozen is like the kid who brings a water gun to a paintball match. He may have some "impressive" numbers and highlight reels, but when you break it down, it's clear that Jordan and Kobe were on a completely different level. LeBronze's reliance on brute force and lack of finesse make him the odd one out in this conversation about who’s the GOAT or all time great.
@@Zagirusyes but like in Kobe's case he didn't get the most out of his skills. What's more valuable?
As a Knicks fan, I hated him. He truly was the GOAT.
@@keithjoseph128 kobe Bryant is overrated
I also got Bird over LeBron.
lol
Yeah sure😂😂
LeBron walked off the court before the game was over because the team was losing, that will Always and forever count LeBron out as the goat
a goat would’ve stayed with his team and took that L
@@GAME-zo8qg Lebron: most playoff loses all-time ✔, most committed turnovers all-time ✔, most shots taken all-time (but he's pass 1st?) ✔, most missed shots all-time ✔, only player to be Swept in 3 finals series ✔ 7th worst +/- in NBA finals history -86 ✔ 2nd worst NBA finals record all-time 4-6 ✔ that's not a top 5 player all-time
@@thecall0utthe 2011 finals
We all know that but for the rape allegation and the media backlash against Kobe, he would have at least 4 MVPs. As for citing Magic as a finals MVP as a rookie, everyone knows it was Kareem dominating that series, and Magic (along with Jamal Wilkes) had an iconic game 6 to close out the series. Brent Musberger and the media could not give the MVP to Kareem who didn't make the trip so Magic benefited. As one NBA player has said, "If Jordan is #1, Kobe is 1a." And give Bird and Wilt their props. Greatest player is the discussion, not most accolades..
This comment is more facts than this dumb video. Kobe is number 2. That’s facts
very much agreed. Kobe would have as much media attention as for Lebron if not for the rape allegation. that would be a total different career story. you could literally see the resources pulled out from Kobe and to Lebron. without the help of the league, Lebron would just be some all star level of player.
well, thats life. kobe had his personality and belief. Lebron has ambitions.
Facts
Thanks for mentioning Jamaal Wilkes' outstanding game in that close out game. Career high 37 points, with 10 rebounds.
Greatness is measured by accolades and results. Not stats... wilt isn't even top 10. He is like 12
Lebrons skills are obviously not the same as jordans. Just look at jordans footwork, turnaround jumpers, and drives to the bucket. To be honest I dont know if I would rather have lebron on my team or Hakeem. Prime Hakeem was absolutely insane. How he doesnt get mentioned with the other guys is beyond me. Wilt in terms of physical speciman was double the speciman freak factor of lebron and if he had modern game play techniques I dont know who would be able to stop him. I really dont know if I would even have lebron over shaq if it was the 90s. You could make an argument steph curry might be better to build a team around in the modern era.
Kobe too.
Lebron in 2007 GOT SWEPT by the Spurs.
Kobe in 2008 WCF GENTLEMAN SWEEPS those same EXACT Spurs 4-1 with Pau averaging 13 ppg on 40% shooting, something LEBRON COULD NEVER DO IN 2 LIFETIMES: Beat the Spurs in the playoffs with his NEXT BEST PLAYER averaging 13 ppg on 40% shooting.
Lebron in 2009 gets dusted by Hedo and Howard 4-2.
Kobe in 2009 Finals GENTLEMAN SWEEPS those same EXACT Magic 4-1 without a single 20ppg scorer.
Lebron in 2010 gets dusted AGAIN by the Celtics (can't even take it to 7 games) 4-2 and runs to Miami to take notes from Wade on how to win a ring.
Kobe in 2010 Finals COMES BACK from 3-2 with a partially fracture knee that required multiple off-season knee surgeries and platelet treatments in Germany a few weeks later, as well as TWO BROKEN FINGERS IN HIS SHOOTING hand. No excuses. BEATS the same Celtics 4-3.
Head to Head, according to Next Gen Stats Kobe shoots 52% for his career when guarded directly by Lebron; Lebron shoots 27% for his career when guarded directly by Lebron. Didn't the ALL STAR GAME show you all you needed to know? Lebron was SCARED of playing Kobe directly hahaha.
"Kobe Bryant is the best player in our league" - Lebron James (after he won back to back MVPS).
Prime Hakeem is the GOAT center. Gimme PRIME Hakeem over Lebron ANY DAY. I'd even take Prime Hakeem over Duncan. Duncan may have the better CAREER but Hakeem IMHO was the better PLAYER.
@@feynmanschwingere_mc2270 crazy to think how hakeem doesnt even get mentioned. Dude was unguardable at one point and he is one of the best defenders in the paint to ever live. Not sure why this dude is not regarded in the same light as someone like lebron, shaq, karl malone, magic, wilt, kareem etc. Footwork wise no center comes even close.
If Magic is on my squad I'll take Bird at my 3. If LeBron on my squad, I'll take Curry at the 1.
All time squad I'll put Hakeem as my 4 and probably Shaq at 5.
I respect you for saying Kareem is not the leading force for the Showtime Lakers.
i mean its overtly obvious that he wasn't since they team didn't start winning until Magic joined... yeah Kareem was gr8 but ppl just don't acknowledge things... LIKE, him only having titles when he has a Legendary point GOD plying with him... i wish ppls memory wasn't so selective
@@billybadass3056 Actually, the stats and awards at least show Kareem to be significantly better than Magic.
@@DanTarrant1 THE STATS AND AWARDS dont mean the ACTUAL GAME. Pay attention. People like you think Sports is just a series of EXCEL SPREADSHEETS.
WATCH THE GAME. Without the Big O and Magic Kareem WON NOTHING and actually struggled from time to time.
Every big shot during the shot time era went through Kareem. He is the goat by a wide margin.
@@DanTarrant1 no, just look at Kareems absolute prime of his prime in the 70s , from the title in 1971 to 1980 he won nothing and sometimes missed the playoffs.. in 1980 Magic was able to win without him, as he was hurt... so really it was from 1971 to 1982 in his absolute prime that he won nothing... and in his last 5 titles he wasnt even the best player he was often the 3rd or 4th best player particularly late in his career. And in 1971 title you could make a strong case that he was tied with Oscar as best player much in the way that Kobe and Shaq were usually tied particularly on their 2nd and 3rd championships together.
With all the superteams and ducking competition I don't know how people have him in their top 10 much less in any sort of a GOAT conversations.
Jordan only had one all star teammate ever.
He played with 2 hall of famers
@@FederalYuter LMFAO. True he had 2 hall of famers. But Rodmans best days were past. Rodman wasnt even an all star during his years with the bulls. Pippen was the only Player MJ had on his teams that was an all star at the time.
Eh. Rodman was indispensable, meshing really well with the Jordan/Pippin duo, and with Jordan's defense. @@jca4343
@@jca4343 You go in HOF after your career is over. He played with only one all star.
@@HiawathaNenad umm yeah. That's pretty much what I said.
Lebron is such an eyesore being placed next to all the greats.
He is the second greatest player after Mj
@@luffy5859lebron is barely top five
@@smartguy360 how is a persons not top 2 when all nba fans and players always compare to him the greatest player of all time mj and they say he is the closet to getting the title
@@luffy5859 the fans are mostly idiots or young people who never saw Larry, magic or mj play, lebron is a stat padder, he is the most physically gifted athlete I have ever seen in the NBA but he lacks the heart and killer instinct of the all time greats, that intangible is why I place people like magic and bird above him
@@smartguy360 wrong Bron had the killer instinct since a while I mean look the Boston he was down 3-2 everyone was ready to come at him he this unleashed his killer instinct and killed the Boston and warriors the raptors the knicks the 2000 piston
I’ll add the league closed Kobe’s potential 3rd iteration with the CP3 trade. Kobe was the best player on the floor in the semi’s against OKC in 2012. If he has CP on that team. They win & meet MIA in the finals - & win.
Fuck cp3, I'm so happy he never came to my mob, he been a regular season player his whole career. Plus he will nut up, & fuck up in clutch moments mane, he needs to retire, nicca 1 of the dirtiest players in the league. Us Lakers fans want lebron ass outta here too. We want mfz wit heart, dawgz mane, fuck these overrated super stars.
Facts Kobe did not win more MVPs because of the league liking him
kobe was barely the best player in that 12 series, and if he gets cp3, is that gonna win 3 games? and that okc team got gentlemen swept by the heat.
@@crystalizedExposed Yes it's going to win him 3 games absolutely it will, you must forgot the younger CP3 a dog also they would still have Bynum and Artest. They would get another PF and hypothetically I believe Odom would have ended up back with the Lakers. And you just admitted he is the best with an MVP candidate such as CP3. Who would gaurd CP3? No one is the answer. Lakers in 6.
Plus, he wouldn't have torn his Achilles with all the extra movement he did that year. Cp3 would have taken some of that offensive load & also facilitated for Bryant. Plus if they were in the same team, CP3 wouldn't have stayed ringless & Kobe would have had atleast 6 or 7 rings.
Completely disagree with your take on Kobe. It's a casual take. You can't just tell Kobes percentages without context. Kobe definitely on that level. NBA players say it. I'm saying it.
To mention LBJ in the same sentence with Jordan is 😂
For real lmao
Stats are great only to a point. But then you gotta ask the players that played with or against those players.
Their opinions are the only ones that matter. Many of them say Kobe is the closest player to MJ,
who is the GOAT. Kobe also has 12 time all defensive team honors, which is overlooked.
Then there's the gold medal Kobe helped many stars in that era, win.
Your analysis of Kobe was lacking woefully
It was. You have to give Kobe credit for dragging that weak team to three finals, wininng two of them in that 2008-10 run. Gasol was very good. Everyone else was a role player or less than that.
For sure. Certainly lacking proper context in a myriad of ways.
This is a well produced video! And though I both agree and disagree with your conclusion (mainly placing Lebron over Kobe), I do appreciate the thoughtfulness with which you laid it out. One point of contention, you can't state that "stats need proper context" and then plainly state Kobe only having 1 MVP without providing context. We all know why Kobe only received 1 MVP award.
You contradicted yourself.
How could it be a well-produced video with such glaring inconsistencies and CONTRADICTIONS such as "stats need proper context" only for him to FAIL TO PROVIDE CONTEXT on how MVPS are voted on (probably because "MVP"s give him a nice way to lauder his biases into the GOAT conversation without him having to explain it away).
The only thing that has improved drastically are shoes , workouts and medical related stuff, we are 99. Percent the same physically, I mean we’ve probably evolved a little
It's a TEAM GAME. To win a Championship you'll NEED a Guy that has all the qualities these guys had.
Unlike a lot of today's NBA Players, The Former NBA Legends (Wilt Chamberlain, Larry Bird, "Magic" , M.J, etc) didn't whine and cry to the Media about "Needing Help", they just played the game with whom they had!
Holy crap I thought I was the only person who thought Magic was better than Bron. Magic was a straight out winner. And for the GOAT it’s no contest - MJ was on a whole other level. That man never broke when the lights were brightest (or ever for that matter - a mind of steel).
The only thing that is better today vs. yesterday are all the advantages available to todays players....which tells us just how much better yesterdays players were.
What you're leaving out is in the 80s Eastern Division was a lot better than the West and it wasn't even close ,and it was more physical !
MJ is by far the GOAT in my opinion. I don't have lebron in my top 5. I don't want him in my top 10. Because i saw the way he got his rings. But his achievements and accomplishments put him in the top 10.
I hear that. I have him in the 6-8 range myself. Definitely not top 5.
@@Randomnoobi this way you guys are 🤡. You don't judge who is better by rings if that was the case then there are a couple peole ahead of Mj but skills and overall and overall Lebron is a better scorer and shoooter then almost all players he is the second greatest
This is just stupid, “how he won his rings”. You’re just using this to discredit him. It’s easy to say this when Michael was given a team that fitted him like a glove. Imagine if he didn’t get Scottie or Dennis, we would be having a much different conversation 😂
@jamarplunkett3283
What you said is just stupid. You have no idea what you're talking about. And you act like Scottie pippen was better than most of the all-stars lebron played with. Lebron has 4 rings in 21 seasons. On mostly superteams. That's awful.
@@jamarplunkett3283 ikr these guys do anything to discredit him, when he loses one game they immediately came after him they can't accept he is the second greatest oat
Michael Jordan said there is no goat I'd rather Listen to him. He knows more basketball knowledge than I do.
Its strange that this post mentioned. That other leagues or sports, honour the predecessors, but not the NBA. Yet, Bill Russell, not only, is the only player who won 11 rings, with the same organization. He was the main reason, why the organization won 11 rings.
Russell is also in the same breath with Wilt Chamberlain, as the greatest rebounder of all time, just like Jordan is in the same breath with Wilt, as the greatest scorer of all time (although there are records that Wilt accomplished, that may never be broken). Russell avg 22 rebs and 25 rebs per game career in the regular season and playoffs respectively (the same avgs as Wilt Chamberlain). Bill Russell also holds the most total rebound record total in the playoffs, playing one less year in the NBA than the great Wilt Chamberlain. Russell avg 13 shots per game, as opposed to Jordan's 22 shots per game avg. Yet Russell was able to add 15 pts per game to his team. Choosing to concentrate on the defensive end, with rebs, blocks, steals and starting the fast breaks. Russell in the importance of a team game, along with individual accolades, with titles. Since 8 rings in a row beats 6 rings in total (and 7 of those 8 rings in a row, was when Wilt was playing). LeBron who? I still have Russell as the GOAT.
well said! Russel was also a freak athlete: he was a US Olympic high jumper and had like a 7 foot something wingspan, freak athlete and the ONLY player to kind of contain Wilt.
By eras i would say Kobe , Shaq , and Tim Duncan are the greatest players of the 2000's. Followed by Tracy Mcgrady , AI , Vince Carter , and Jason Kidd.
"LeBron isn't close to Jordan because Jordan is responsible for Rodman and LeBron is responsible for JR Smith" is a stretch not even Wemby's wingspan could contain. I don't even think Skip Bayless could make such a wild claim.
Fr
I agree with mostly everything you said but the Kobe dismissal is disrespectful to the game of basketball
MJ is unquestionably the GOAT. But I could easily argue the 2nd best player of all time is Larry Bird. As far as Lebron is concerned, he isn't even top 5.
We all by Jordans because of Jordan simple as the ..GOAT sneaker too😢
I agree with everything besides the Kobe situation, in the mid 2000’s after Shaq left he had absolutely no help, No all stars, nothing until The lakers picked up Paul Gasol. They eventually went on to 3 straight finals winning two back to back. Put some respect on Kobe name!!!
....MJ, Magic, Bird...top 3....they knew what it took to create a winning culture. LeBron for all his natural athletic ability did not have what these 3 men had....LeBron is NOT a natural leader.
Jordan once punched Steve Kerr in practice and now Kerr has 9 titles. Coincidence? I think not.
They didn't win rings because he punched his teammates he punched Kerr cause he was an asshole straight up
They won rings because they the best team in the nba with the best player in the league simple
To fix NBA game they need to make dunk a 4 points score that way everyone will go back and shoot in the paint and everyone will protect the paint/defense, 3 points is 50/50 chances to make so everyone will think about it twice before making that attempt because going in the paint and dunk is more rewarding.
Fun Fact about LeOverrated:
Lebron only beat 1 All NBA first team player his entire time in the Eastern Confrence playoffs......the solo Derrick Rose when he had THREE HOFERs in Miami (not to mention Ray Allen, Shane Battier, Mike Miller, Rashard Lewis, and excellent role players like Haslem).
It's not brons fault if the other eastern conference teams sucked
2:10 This is a realization I’ve come to only recently, and I’ve been a Lakers fan since they drafted Magic. Magic was also the Finals MVP in both 1980 and 1982. He started at center in the title-clinching game six AT Philadelphia as a rookie, going off for 42-15-7 and playing all five positions, while Kareem stayed in LA after being injured in game 5. His last two championship seasons he averaged about 13 and 5, and probably would have retired sooner absent a title chance. It’s more than a little likely that Kareem never wins even a second ring without Magic.
Kareem, imo, is overrated. No way is he ahead of Magic imo OR Kobe imo.
@@feynmanschwingere_mc2270 Having Magic on the team probably extended his career by 3-4 years and 3-5,000 points.
This was a good case. But I can’t help but to think u had so much left in the tank to make an even more compelling argument.
Hey, thank you…you’re so right, because virtually all per game stats and awards point to Jordan over LeBron, but so many videos already reference a lot of them, and I really wanted people to remember the unique story that separates them in this video, without diluting it with the other info…but, good call, and I’ll be diving into their differences more in the future!
Indeed. Making up stuff to dethrone the goat of basketball. And you can make the argument. They just don’t want people to do it cause when they do one name comes out on top every time. It’s mj.
Im just here for the comments section 😂
Also... Kareem is the Goat for basketball in general... that includes high school and college... MJ is the NBA GOAT
I agree on Jordan ( many reasons), but you never even mentioned Wilt.
The second you say " if you rank lebron less than number 2 all time you're hating" you lose any reason to communicate with you. You obviously can't be reasoned with. I have no problem with people thinking Bird, Magic, Kobe, Kareem is the goat. It's just not lebron. Too many glaring holes on his game.
THANK YOU.
In fact, THE MINUTE i hear that refrain, I go off on a tangent about "IQ" lol.
Low IQ: pick Lebron (you'll spend 99% of the time excuse-making and explaining away his putrid finals record)
High IQ: pick any NUMBER of top 10 geniuses who weren't perennially accused of taking PEDs
Bird would ROAST Lebron. Dominique Wilkins was every bit as ATHLETIC as Lebron and Bird TORCHED Dom.
Legit Achievements and awards defines the GOAT.. who got the most of it... Chip, MVP, fmvp, dpoy, scoring. Title, steals award, 1st NBA all defensive team, only one.man top those categories.. Jordan
In additions of the superlitives the more you look into Michael Jordan's per game the statistics, the more of an absolute fucking alien he becomes.
Most of these acronyms didn't even exist when he played and he's still bodying people that literally play to inflate them. 😂
FACTS. Even as a huge Kobe fan. I deep down believe Kobe is the GOAT but OBJECTIVELY?
Mj is the KING and after that the real debate starts (just not with Lebron, please leave out that insufferable, PED-injecting diva).
IF we create, a priori, a HIGH IQ criteria for who the GOAT is, and we weight each category with a fixed scoring method, MJ is the GOAT.
Eye test? MJ is the GOAT.
Influence? MJ is the GOAT.
DOMINANCE? Wilt over MJ, but MJ over everybody else.
SKILL? Kobe and Pistol Pete (yes, I said it), and then MJ, and then everybody else.
MJ is the GOAT and he was NOT A STAT-PADDER (which Lebron is). MJ DID NOT play for Stats and SOMEHOW he still has so many of them!
Changing rules changes the game and changes variables. You can only fairly compare players that play under the same rules
Only problem that I dont get is why Kobe has Shaq for 3 rings, but Magic has Kareem his entire championships career and is not the same ?
There’s a ton of nuance to it, but the basic reason is Shaq won all 3 finals MVP between them, and Magic won 3 out of 5 finals MVP to Kareem’s 1. Magic was the driving force of the showtime era.
@@dennissheehe first: final mvp is not the whole pict, example of that is Iguadala. 2nd : Kobe won 2 without Shaq, how many Magic has without Kareem ????
You’re 100% right Finals MVP isn’t everything…it’s just one piece of the info…Look at Kaeem’s career. He’s in the league 10 years, and won 1 title,(beat a 42-40 Baltimore Bullets team), the moment Magic’s drafted, he wins 5 more titles, while going to 4 other Finals. Without any other hall of famer, Magic wins BOTH Finals MVP’s over Kareem. Magic never won less than 54 games in a season before he retired, while Kareem had losing seasons in his prime with Bucks and Lakers…Kobe’s truly amazing, but he had a losing record in his prime. How a player’s talent effects winning, and titles is the name of the game. Can a player be in the goat conversation if, in their prime, they cannot secure 42 wins in a season? Magic’s game specifically enhanced, every one of his teamates performance. He was the active ingredient, that lead to those wins, and titles…he won 74% of every game he played in(highest % ever), was an incrediblely efficient shooter throughout his career, while Kobe, while truly amazing, he was a below avg league shooter multiple years in his prime…add 3 MVP’s to 3 Finals MVP’s, and I’ve gotta go Magic.
One adjustment, Kareem wasn’t on Magic’s 91 Finals team that lost to the Bulls
also I need to give credit to Jamaal Wilkes, who is in HOF…I hate when I respond off top of my head
From 2000-2010, nobody in the NBA scored more points than Kobe. Kobe also has played (and beat) more 50 win playoff teams in NBA history. Kobe also is one of three players to score 60+ points on 50/40/90 shooting (Melo & Steph) and Kobe did it three times, and is the only player to win back to back titles without another top 75 player on his team. He is also the only player to finish top 5 in MVP voting 10 or more times with LESS than 3 MVPs (we all know why).
How do you do those red lower third banners? Is there a plugin i can download for editing? Like the red titles with your name
There's no such thing as the Goat. Otto Graham won 7 NFL championships in 10 years while Tom Brady won 7 in over 20 years.
Those 2.guys on the left are certified ball huggers!
the one on the right is an idiot narcissist.. MJ can average triple double if he wanted to.. there was a point in his career where he averaged triple doubles when he was assigned as a PG..
well said i have the same order which i dont give the ring chaser team chaser top 4 Larry Legend bird should be over labron because of the mental effectiveness
Kobe is in the top 3. If you've played the game on a supremely competitive level, you know stats are VERY incomplete pictures of a player's effectiveness, and they almost always need context to fully make use of them. Kobe's impact on winning is as high as any player in the modern era, save for MJ. And this includes Magic.
Kobe The Goat
Kobe’s prime was in a tougher defensive era that was much slower paced then the 90s and today, for him to average points in the high 20s & 30s should be talked about more, that and the Western Conference being at its most competitive. Also we all know he was robbed of the 2006 MVP, the stink of the Colorado incident was still on him and his roaster was garbage. He was a big facilitator while also being heavy on defence well still averaging 35 a game with a few all time great scoring performances. He might not be everyone’s GOAT or in their top 5 but he shouldn’t be seen as a lower tier from Jordan and LeBron.
Kobe is at best 6th
@@Madterchiseflover Not according to 90% of nba players. They always say MJ then Kobe.
@@Madterchiseflover Even Magic himself said Kobe is the greatest Laker.
1. MJ
2,3. Kobe + Larry Bird (in any order you prefer)
4. Magic
5-8 Kareem, Russel, Wilt, Hakeem (in any order you prefer)
9. Shaq
So this means that LEbronze is 10th All Time, which is not bad at all. Being top-10 All time is awesome in any sport!
Yeah bro the all time leader in scoring and that also has 10k rebounds and 10 assists. With insane efficiency and a top 4 ppg of all time, totally
@@devinmartinez7705 Failed miserably twice with team USA (hence the nickname Lebronze) and had Kobe save his ass (after Kobe made him his bitch in the training camp).
Joined another top-5 player twice in D-Wade and AD.
1st in turnovers all time.
Played the LEAST 50-win teams in the playoffs, out of any top-10 player.
Not bad Id probably have Dr J , Tim Duncan ahead of Lebron too just for being stabilizing forces and doing things the right way. If people start looking at Dirk getting robbed by the Mafia/ refs of the 2006 title you could make a compelling argument for putting Dirk ahead of him too (I look at Dirk has having two championshps after Tim Donaghy went to jail) and ahead of Shaq too ..and I aint joking.. then when you factor in how the league has tried to unfairly help Lebron for years you start looking at guys who never got this kind of help more closely as being better than him..
U state kobe isn't close cause of stats then say your decision isn't based on stats.
I can only imagine what would have happened if JR Smith would have done that on Jordan or Kobe's teams. Oh Lord!!
Gotta give it to big Bill. People lie Rings don’t lie.
Kobe has a HIGHER CAREER TRUE SHOOTING PERCENTAGE than TIM DUNCAN:
.555
To
.551
OUCH. So if Kobe is "inefficient" then so is Duncan. And Duncan takes most of his shots closer to the rim so what's his excuse?
Kobe got robbed of at least 2-3 MVP's so stop the dumb "he only got 1 MVP." He may not necessarily be the GOAT but over a 10-year run he was the most "skilled" player ever. He was a better overall scorer and shot-maker than anyone. This guy also never mentions the DEFENSE. Kobe was 1st team all NBA D several times. LeBron never was. Kareem got robbed of at least 3 more MVP's and had to play 4 seasons of College. Imagine his numbers had he came out of HS like LeBron?? Jordan retired twice. Once in his prime and missed 18 months. He doesn't take a hit for that? Kareem played till he was 42. Kobe played 20 seasons with a stupid amount of injuries. The NBA game is offense and defense. Only Jordan, Kareem and Kobe stack up. I think the real GOAT will be forever a debate.
100% BUT i think Magic kinda carried Kareem bro, NGL.
I have Magic in there instead of Kareem. IMO, the three best ever are: MJ, Kobe, Magic.
>>Kobe was 1st team all NBA D several times. LeBron never was.
Also Kareem was winning MVPs when players were voting for it. We all know played would have Kobe as the mvp over Nash
In fact, you deserve some money and an award for stating these truths some people don't want to hear. MJ's mentality alone makes him the GOAT. He wouldn't have chased Shaq out of the Lakers. He certainly wouldn't have lost 6 finals( in fact he won 6, if l remember). I also place Magic above Kareem, for he was the Brain, engineer and doctor of the Showtime Lakers. He even went to the finals in 91 without Kareem. LeBron couldn't stand the fact that Kobe was winning the title, and him not( D-Wade confessed). Even with the stacking of his teams, he still manages to lose. How could he lose like that against the Mavs, choking? MJ never choked, even in his early years. MJ was resillient, LeBron is not. He's hailed for toping the scorers board, but against which opposition. Today's NBA is a defenseless League. How many great defenses has LeBron faced ( except the Spurs, the Warriors, the Celtics, Dwight Howard's Magic, and maybe D-Rose and Joakim NOAH's Bulls)? The list of the great defenses MJ faced is endless. Besides, LeBron was never better than Kobe. When it comes to the science of the game, Magic was undoubtedly, magically better than LeBron. And let's not even talk about Bird. So, l think LeBron is top 10, but he doesn't make my top 5. I put MJ, Magic, Kobe, Kareem, and Russell above him. I even put Bird above. If l were to pick a team to win, there's no way l would make him my leader. He would be in the team, but not the leader
3:15 I completely disregard any voted awards now. The media is so biased. It has been forever. I don’t trust MVPs, all stars, all NBA or any of those anymore. It’s not even a new problem, just made extra glaring. Especially when you find out the people voting for these awards, don’t even watch all the games. That should be a minimum requirement to vote.
Great video. Greatness is about those who transcend the game and also dominate. Michael transcended the game to it's highest level. LeBron has not transcend anything. Steph Curry has had more of an impact on today's game than LeBron. (Not saying Steph is greater than LeBron).
Magic and Larry Bird transcended the game, especially Magic with his imaginative creativity which is the foundation of how the game is played today.
One does not simply stumble into a three-peat, and then another one shortly thereafter, all while staying completely within one team/organization with very little player/roster changes.
All this while completely showing everyone that you are the number one player, the "go to guy", on each and every one of those championships.
Having great teammates surely helped, but without Michael Jordan, there would be no Chicago Bulls double three-peat. He knows it, most non-delusional basketball fans know it, and even average people from most walks of life know it.
Love, love, love the video! Everything you said about Magic, I have said! He is arguably #2 on this list. I switch between him and Kobe. But my top 5 looks like this.. Jordan, Magic, Kobe, Lebron, Bird.
I honestly have those same guys in the thumbnail as the the top 5
Jordan
Kareem
Kobe
Magic retired at 31
Lebron at 5th but Duncan could have a argument for that spot
Where did u get the beats playing in background
I am surprised there is no mention of Wilt Chamberlain. Superb ball player, and superb athlete. The NBA changed the rules, because of Wilt Chamberlain. Wilt scored 100 pts in one game. Wilt led the league in assists one year AS A CENTER. Of course, he blocked a ton of shots. Jordan was a good defender, as well as scorer. I cannot take that away from him, but he surely did not block the shots that Wilt did.
I am not saying that Wilt is the GOAT. I am saying that it is either Wilt or Michael as GOAT. Everyone else pales in comparison. Lebron is not the GOAT, simply because he only plays offense. Kareem played better D than Lebron.
Thanks for the comment…it’s wins…a player’s ability must translate to wins, and when judging greatness, Wilt wasn’t able to win on the level of other elite players.
Forget all the percentages, awards and all that. Kobe is literally, actually and totally a better basketball player and could beat everyone on this list 1 on 1 except Jordan. But he would get some wins over on Jordan and even Jordan says that.!
This was a great vid. My only critique is that we have to factor in competition. Kobe faced the stiffest conference competition in comparison to the other all-time greats mentioned. I think that warrants a reconsideration of him and Magic’s position (who had Kareem and played in a conference with lesser competition than Kobe). Excellent video!
Thank you, for the great comment…my next video’s gonna be all about Kobe, who’s rightfully loved for a variety of reasons.
KOBE THE GREATEST LAKER. END OF DISCUSSION
Facts
People who always say, "Well MJ had Pippen and Rodman" were probably not watching basketball in the early/mid 90s when Rodman was so toxic of a player that having him on your team was not worth the rebounds and the defense he brought. Only a man with the force of will that MJ had was able to corral Rodman and keep him in line enough to contribute to a winning environment and not blow up the locker room.
Evolution is not a myth. Put wemby in Bill Russell era..no disrespect to Mr Russell but that’s just how the game goes and it’s thanks to all the players before that we have the players we have now
Players referred to MJ as Black Jesus. That's because he was/is basically like a Jesus Christ-esque figure. That's how revered and popular MJ was/is. NBA viewership was the highest in the 90s. He has 10 scoring titles. He would have more scoring titles and championships if he didn't miss a bunch of years due to retirement and a broken foot. He didn't get outplayed in the playoffs. LeBron got outplayed by Dirk, KD etc. MJ broke Bryon Russell's ankles in the finals, and then he drained the game winning shot to win the title which no other player has had the talent/skill to do. At 40, he dunked on Jermain O'neal, and he scored 40 on Ron Artest who was a DPOY. That's after being retired for 3 1/2 years. There's no doubt in my mind that Michael Jordan is the GOAT. Magic and other players believe he is. I think the debate is silly. Wilt said players should have to give MJ 10% of their salaries because of his impact on basketball, sports, TV, endorsements, culture etc. People just pretend that none of these things happened.
An example of the myth that athletes are “better” now is exposed with track and field when you consider the huge advantage modern track surfaces and shoes confer. You can calculate the times and they are very close.
Lebron hasn’t even won the most titles since his Debut…
Steph has the the same number of Titles in less years and he’s played 6-7 less seasons…
The longevity hurts your GOAT argument (if you are pro lebron) when he has been at this level for say 25 years and you still have 4 titles !
Larry Bird had a higher peak than LeBron.. therefore I got Larry Bird as the #1 SF All Time
I do agree that MJ is the goat and it’s not even close. But personally I wouldn’t be putting LJ in the top 3. To me the best 5, would be MJ than, Bird, Magic, Kobe and Lebron
Nick saying "if its about accomplishments, its Kareem" is hilarious and proves he knows nothing
You cannot tell me that in a one on one game Wilt wouldn’t dominate period.
Kareem and Magic, two in the goat conversation in the same team
You could hv just said Magic retired no need to mention his desease/sickness.😮
Its crazy that day by day the truth is being exposed.
More people are coming out with data and statistics to show why it isnt close in the goat debate.
Since 2016 they been force feeding Lebron as the goat, and just recently he passed kareem in pts....."that made him the definate goat" how? Was it 2016 when he beat the 73-9 warriors who lost 9 games in the playoffs and went to two! Game 7s.....yet they were the greatest team of all time.
When we had the
86 Celtics
89 Pistons
96 Bulls
87 Lakers
17 Warriors
But to fit the Narrative we got to make it look like that warriors team had a perfect run and it was impossible.
And lastly the fact that Lebron only beat 1 All NBA first team player his entire time in the Eastern Confrence playoffs......the solo Derrick Rose when he had the Heatles.
Trash Can.
They should change MVP to most outstanding season because it's a regular season award, then it wouldn't be such a joke.
In a 1 on 1 game Lebron wouldn’t dominate Kobe, so how do you think he’ll dominate Jordan?
KOBE BEATS LEBRON 100 times out of 100 times if they play 1 on 1.
I would literally bet my life on it.
Even when he’s not playing Jason Terry is still kryptonite to LJB 😂
The Kobe disrespect is real. Did you not see the fg% of players in that era?? Name a mid range jump shooter that was putting up more points than Kobe? Half of Kobe points cane from 12 out. On top of the super athletes and some of the strongest defenses, and some of the most competitive teams ever assembled in 1 conference.
The league blocked Chris Paul from joining the Lakers and Kobe, but let LBJ join up with fmvp Dwayne Wade, and Chris Bosh in the weakest conference in nba history.
But you knock Kobe for fg%???? In that era...
Hey there…really glad you commented…okay, so Kobe was BELOW league avg FG% in 11 of his 20 seasons. Dwayne Wade, Tony Parker, Steve Nash all put up FG% significantly ABOVE league average consistently. Scoring without efficiency is a killer. A common refrain is that Kobe had no help, well, if someone’s in their physical prime, and wants to be in the GOAT convo, they cannot post losing records(Kobe 05). Magic was above league AVG FG% every single year of his career, and never won less than 53 games…ever. His awards, winning percentage, and the way he IMPROVED his teammates(check out how Worthy, Scott, Divac’s fg% all dropped the moment Magic retired) had a dramatic effect on winning. Kobe’s an absolute monster, but the number one thing that people forget, is that stats without wins are just not the same.
@@dennissheehe 1. Wade took a preponderance of his shots from WITHIN 12 feet of the basket.
2. Nash and Parker were shooting higher %s on MUCH LOWER volume and against LESS CONCENTRATED DEFENSES (because their teams were so good they had other offensive outlets to create spacing, both played with TWO other all-stars).
3. WHY are you using FG% and NOT True Shooting Percentage? It's some an infantile way of looking at shooting/scoring when FREE THROWS are literally 1/4th MINIMUM of scoring output.
4. IF we take TSP Kobe miraculously has NO SEASONS below league average.
5. Magic had KAREEM HIS WHOLE PRIME so he isnt going to have a losing season season in his prime. That argument is silly.
So if Magic was playing with Kwame Brown, Chris Mihm, Lamar Odom, and Sash Vujacic in the early 2000s West he would have still won 54 games? Magic had the Rockets to worry about; the rest of the west was GARBAGE. The 80s Eastern Conference had a winning record vs the West EVERY SINGLE YEAR OF THE DECADE.
Let that sink in.
Kobe also has the greatest era-adjusted scoring season in NBA HISTORY (2006, 35ppg) and accounted for a HIGHER PERCENTAGE of his teams total scoring than any player in post-merger history.
CHERRY PICKING statistical categories doesn't make an argument.
Lebron MISSED the playoffs in his prime 2019 and again in 2 seasons later, but he doesn't get docked for it?
And DEFENSE is half the game, why isnt that as weighted as highly as FG%?
Kobe won as many rings as Magic on teams that weren't as stacked as Magic's teams against BETTER COMPETITION.
AGAIN, and you love to ignore this stat because it DEBUNKS part of your argument: Kobe beat MORE 50+ WIN teams in the playoffs than Magic and KAREEM COMBINED.
Kobe even beat more 50+ win teams in the playoffs than Lebron and Magic COMBINED.
Not even a mention of Larry Legend
Spitting nothing but facts.....I agree. Magic is arguably 2nd on the GOAT list when you break it down to the details. As far a Lebron, he's not close to being the GOAT and not in my Top 20 of All-Time.....and THAT is a fact !
You blew your argument in your opening. Bobby Orr is best player to ever play in the NHL but didn’t play long enough to be considered goat. Same as Jordan.
1v1 game Lebron vs Jordan , 1st bounce lebron does its a steal. Jordan just needed a jumper to go on him. Was doing that at 40 , and he had a very good percentage. Not to mention clutch, etc. He was faster, and way more determined. Better basketball IQ I think too. Btw you forgot Bird. Jordan was rating him above Lebron (considering Kobe and not Bird is kinda lame, both Magic and Kareem rated him as the best player they ever played against: and they played against Jordan "rising").
There is no way I've ever putting Lebron before Magic.
This one of the best demonstration MJ is the Goat. MJ had in less time ten scoring titles while Lebron had 1 in about two full decades of playing. If anyone compares the best ten years from each of them, MJ ends up on top on every category. (comparing the worst part of their carriers would not make sence if we want to know who is the GOAT)
Everyone in Kobe's era has lower field goal percentage and Kobe was one of the more efficient scorers of his era. The field goal argument is more nuanced than it seems.
It is…Dwayne Wade, Dirk, Tony Parker, Steve Nash, operated with higher FG% in that era…in terms of FG%, Kobe’s 41.2 career Finals FG% over 7 trips, 20 games, and 11 years is especially low…he’s amazing, just not quite where some other elites are.
This video has more than a few contradictions. This video, like SOOOO many other videos just like it, suffer from one GLARING problem above all else:
the post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy.
In plain English, the post hoc fallacy is when you start with the conclusion you already want, and then you find arbitrary ways to justify that conclusion.
The video creator would have been more INTELLECTUALLY honest if he started with a FIXED, but REASONABLE, criteria that most "common sense" people would agree upon. And then once you have a criteria of values you believe are important, you can assess which players satisfy that criteria.
I actually think Magic is a GREAT choice for #2 all time. I personally have Kobe #2 all time behind only MJ but I can accept Magic as the #2 all time, he was a true WINNER and he made NO EXCUSES. For him to make the Finals in the early 90s WITHOUT Kareem was amazing and showed his GOAT bonafides. If not for MJ, Magic would have retired with 6 rings in 9 seasons. AMAZING.
However, context is important. Magic's Western Conference was like Lebron's Eastern Conference (actually Lebron's Eastern Conference was even worse): BAD. Kobe beat MORE 50+ win teams in the playoffs from 2009 to 2010 than Magic did in his ENTIRE CAREER).
I say that to say this, how can you JUSTIFY excluding Kobe from the list by citing MVPS even though, as you've shown, CONTEXT is everything. Kobe is the only player to finish TOP 5 in MVP voting at least 10 times and never won it more than once. The MVP, as Joel Embid winning it over Jokic proved, is PURELY POLITICAL.
Steve Nash won back to back MVPs but when the Phoenix Suns played the Lakers in the first round Kobe was CLEARLY the better, more valuable player (Kobe was up 3-2 on a garbage team vs a team with 4 all stars).
Lastly, Kobe took Pau Gasol, a player who never averaged even up to 20 ppg to THREE STRAIGHT FINALS IN THE WEST against the best intra-conference competition in NBA history while winning BACK TO BACK RINGS without a single All-NBA first team or second team teammate, nor a teammate that averaged 20 ppg, nor a teammate who made ALL NBA DEFENSE.
NO PLAYER IN NBA HISTORY has ever done that. So to dismiss Kobe based on FG% (you didn't even use a more comprehensive "efficiency" metric like True Shooting Percentage or ADJUSTED Shooting Percentage)) is idiotic while IGNORING Lebron's abysmal turnover numbers. Also, why no mention of Kobe's 12 all nba DEFENSE selections since you're going to cherry pick which accolades to focus on and which not to.
MVPS should NOT be considered sacrosanct. IF you are going to CONTEXTUALIZE Bill Russell's rings in their proper historical milieu then do the same thing for EVERY aspect of the GOAT criteria.
Kobe has a near identical CAREER True Shooting Percentage to TIM DUNCAN. SO if Kobe is "inefficient" then so is Duncan.
Lastly, the efficiency metric is DUMB when you consider Kobe played in the most defensive, inefficient, compressed-spacing era in NBA HISTORY.
He won the West 7 times in 10 years, something no player in Western Conference history has come close to except for Magic.
Kobe > Lebron. Kobe is #2 ALL TIME imo. What he did from 2007 to 2010 is more impressive than anything Curry or Lebron or even Duncan did. Only player i'd put over Kobe is MJ. End of story.
You should do more research on Kobe. His mvp situation was because of the rape allegations. It took years for him to recover his reputation. All while being the best player in the league putting up numbers
to me kobe is better than magic. he helped the lakers get the same amount of titles in a time where almost every year all the title contenders were in the west. during the 80s the west was weaker than the east. i would not compare it to lebron's 8 straight finals because the lakers won more than they lost. but aside of the houston rockets in 81 and 86 the lakers had no threat in the west while in the early 80s you had boston and Philly in the east and as the years progressed you had thephilly, pistons, jordan, hawks, and Celtics again. i know stats matter, but I don't agree with your kobe bryant ranking. and eventually learning about stat padding and how lebron james is a master on it. i make an assessment based on eye test, and winning. stats do have value. but context needs to be addressed. kobe bryant played with shaq and is penalized for it. about lebron: since about 2016 lebron james have been playing one side of the ball most games to save himself for the post season--nice strategy, but I penalize him. to me that is cheating when compared to guys like kobe and mj, who played both sides of the ball to the end. stat chasing can give the illusion of impact when in reality may hide the weaknesses of the player in question. my top 5 is: MJ, jabbar, bill russell, kobe, and curry. then I have 6-magic, 7-shaq, 8-bird 9-duncan 10-lebron. in terms of natural gifts lebron is top 3 fluidly. but basketball players who impact winning. I think that is the list. my opinion.
6-0 and the Eyes Test Beats any Debate…. Period!.. I’m a NBA Fan. Died Hard Laker Fan.. 23 Shown the 🌎 why he is the Goat.. Longevity Don’t Mean Shyt.
Thank You For Doing Your Job for that long in your Career sir.
In That Case; What Would Jordan Numbers Be Like?
Not Mentioning his Dominance in his Craft of the Game..
Count the whole career not just 6 years
@@chickenuzumaki1771 I said, the Eye Test… 😂
@@chickenuzumaki1771the whole career makes the gap bigger
I always thought kareem was 2nd because he has won at every level of basketball, has 6 rings rings, and had a long career and set that insane scoring record. But if i say kareem is the goat you dont get MJ stans being butthurt and in thier feelings. Its weird.
Why is it only in Basketball there is ONE player that is the best. You don't say that in football, or baseball. It's too many great players to call someone the in that sport. Except for Pele. 😆 I think it's more logical to say Jordan is the best Shooting Guard ever; Magic is the best Point Guard; Duncan the best Power forward; Larry Bird, as the best Small Forward, and best Center is Russell, Wilt or Kareem. Sorry, LeBron don't even make it in the top 10. Top 15 for sure.
has anybody realized at this point the only argument LeFlunky Shannon Clutch Sports Mark Sharp has is that he talks VERY Loudly and proceeds to brow beat you into saying james is the best plyer???? doesn't ANYBODY see this?????
It goes mj then Kobe. All I know is Lebron is after them