Thanks for this it clarifies things well. This brought back memories, I remember torquing my SBC head bolts to 60 and 65 ft-pounds and the guys with the small Mopar engines were going to 85 ft-pounds and they really are similar engines except the Chev had 5 bolts around each cylinder to the Mopar's 4. Much like your LS example.
Brilliant presentation! Great content to illustrate the dynamics of bolt fastening for those who don't understand the full importance of engine fasteners.
Excellent video, Allan. If we were using a 5-star rating system I'd give you six stars for the quality of this video. I think it's wonderful that guys like yourself are willing to give back to the young up-and-comers by passing along some of your knowledge and expertise. I also appreciate the videos you produce because it allows us older guys to continue learning as well. Thanks!
Mr Gold, it's good to learn some more about you. The presentation you made at Foresight college class of 2024 was awesome. Thank you for sharing the presentation . Thank your son for running the camera so you could share the knowledge about fasteners.
You are amazing !! Thank you for your knowledge!! (Love the hat tip to Cutters performance, too!!!) I am a subscriber, and follow all your amazing vids!! Thanks!
Great explanation one thing do not use a grade 8 bolt where a 5 was used and only torque to grade spec. You will not have proper spring/ stretch and any compression of the gasket will cause clamping to go away. When rebuilding and using different gaskets dbl check proper torque
We used SPS bolts from Direct Connection for MOPAR about $20 wholesale $32 Retail BTW a common root cause of bolt failure is the rebuilders practice of angle cutting the rods to squeeze the sides together before rebuilding/ rehoning round. This angles the bolt faces and yes you can spotface flat but most do not. The angle from flat under the bolt head puts lots of strain on one side of the head and bolt cheers Incidently using studs with more torque than bolts can distort cylinder bores so you use torque plats then you find you have pulled the threads in the block deck. See this most in Cummings but watch for it anywhere BVVC with studs sometimes the cure is worse than the disease We tried studs in the 210 cu in Rambler Indy project but stayed with stock head bolts even when we got thicker deck blocks, also used the 1/2 inch stock head bolts on the 7 mains with steel straps. Worked fine to 1200 hp and 60 lbs of boost (LA Champion Spark plug dyno with Dick Jones at the throttle)
Excellent video! It has been my understanding the torque to angle is used to prevent excessive variation in the clamping force due to increased friction during the last bit of rotation in the bolt. Or as you pointed out x degrees of rotation = y bolt stretch. This is an improved method and not the same as torque to yield. Please correct me if i'm wrong!
Thanks for the question David. An ASTM or SAE certified 4340 is a high carbon steel with specified amounts of chrome and molybdenum, as well as other alloys. In industry for critical applications, small samples would be analyzed in a lab to verify the content, tensile strength and Rockwell or Brinell hardness. All of these qualities can be substantially improved by heat treating, so typically in the design phase, tensile strength and hardness would be specified. I can't speak for what happens overseas or anywhere else, but unless you have the ability to test, you don't really know. Hope this helps. AG
If everyone accepts the torque specs given for a main or head fastener then why do they not accept the torque specs of a rod fastener? Rod bolt stretch requires you to exceed the torque specs which know would ever do with a head or main fastener.
Good observation. The difference it there is no practical way to measure stretch in main bearing or head bolts. You are correct, use the torque specifications and you will be fine.AG
@goldsgarage8236 or during cruise with strong exhaust and some axle gear . My car cruised 80 mph at 3800 rpm. Pontiac 455. It might have had an oiling problem, such as rods side clearance too tight. Cruising long distance was a repetitive death sentence.
I concur. If I was paying tuition for this class, I would want my money back. The presenter rambled all over the place with irrelevant information and war stories, redundant content and never made a cogent story nor explanation for how the fastener really works. To do this, one must illustrate how the clamping load of the fastener creates compression in the parts that are fastened and then how the clamping load varies as the joint is loaded. The presenter also did not explain the real reason why a torque to yield fastener should not be reused. By his own diagram of load vs elongation, once the elastic limit (a term the presenter should have used, but failed to) is exceeded and the fastener permanently stretches, it will still come down on the same slope with same Young's Modulus (BN: the presenter never mentioned either "slope" nor "Young's Modulus"). If that fastener were to be reused, it will be longer than it was originally, but when it is tensioned again, it will go back up the same curve with the same slope it did originally before. But will it achieve the same clamping load at the same torque value and why? He did not even get close to explaining this. He never answered the question about why the fastener is not to be reused. The presenter would have done well to prepare and practice a cogent, succinct presentation with illustrations and demonstrations. A bunch of show and tell props did not add anything to the presentation. I am a MS-degreed, Mechanical Engineer with a PE license, who practiced nearly 40 years during which time I have designed and specified countless bolted joints that were sound and reliable.
@@jamesclaeys3192You should have watched the video. At 9:36 he mentions modulus of elasticity. You do realize this is the same thing as Young’s modulus, don’t you?
Thanks for this it clarifies things well.
This brought back memories, I remember torquing my SBC head bolts to 60 and 65 ft-pounds and the guys with the small Mopar engines were going to 85 ft-pounds and they really are similar engines except the Chev had 5 bolts around each cylinder to the Mopar's 4. Much like your LS example.
Right on, glad you got my point. AG
Is it nit nopar 1/2 inch and chevy 7/16?
that lead off with "don't just study to pass a test; understand it to own it forever is spot on!!!
Thanks Patrick, AG
That will stick with me forever!
Brilliant presentation! Great content to illustrate the dynamics of bolt fastening for those who don't understand the full importance of engine fasteners.
Thanks' very much Dean> AG
It's like having better than minimum coverage insurance.
It helps me sleep at night.
Good point, thanks for the comment.AG
ARP stands behind their product, and I know by experience.
Been waiting for this one, many thanks!
Thank you Christopher, glad you enjoyed it. AG
Excellent video, Allan. If we were using a 5-star rating system I'd give you six stars for the quality of this video. I think it's wonderful that guys like yourself are willing to give back to the young up-and-comers by passing along some of your knowledge and expertise. I also appreciate the videos you produce because it allows us older guys to continue learning as well. Thanks!
Thanks Todd, we are all still learning. AG
Much respect for you sir.
Very nice compliment, thank you David. AG
Mr Gold, it's good to learn some more about you. The presentation you made at Foresight college class of 2024 was awesome. Thank you for sharing the presentation . Thank your son for running the camera so you could share the knowledge about fasteners.
Thanks for the nice compliment Joel. I will pass it on to Mike, we had a fun trip together. AG
My brain hurts. Thank you!
Thanks Less, I will take that as a compliment.AG
I like ARP head bolts ! Do not let anyone tell you they cannot be reused ! Cause you can !
Thanks Scotty, unless they have been torqued to the yield point, all bolts can be reused. AG
I think it was Smokey Yunick that said stock Chevrolet rod bolts were made out of hardened mud.
Thanks Truth, never heard that one before. AG
You are amazing !! Thank you for your knowledge!!
(Love the hat tip to Cutters performance, too!!!) I am a subscriber, and follow all your amazing vids!! Thanks!
Nice!, thanks Dave. AG
Exelent info!! Thank you mr Gold, the netherlands.
Hello and welcome the Netherlands. AG
Good video sir!!! I enjoyed it. Alot of information.
Thanks for watching Hugh.AG
Great explanation one thing do not use a grade 8 bolt where a 5 was used and only torque to grade spec. You will not have proper spring/ stretch and any compression of the gasket will cause clamping to go away. When rebuilding and using different gaskets dbl check proper torque
Thanks JM. AG
Thank you for covering this subject, AG. Fasteners are one thing that I’m not up to snuff on and your presentation was excellent!
Thanks Robert. AG
We used SPS bolts from Direct Connection for MOPAR about $20 wholesale $32 Retail
BTW a common root cause of bolt failure is the rebuilders practice of angle cutting the rods to squeeze the sides together before rebuilding/ rehoning round. This angles the bolt faces and yes you can spotface flat but most do not. The angle from flat under the bolt head puts lots of strain on one side of the head and bolt
cheers
Incidently using studs with more torque than bolts can distort cylinder bores so you use torque plats then you find you have pulled the threads in the block deck. See this most in Cummings but watch for it anywhere BVVC with studs sometimes the cure is worse than the disease
We tried studs in the 210 cu in Rambler Indy project but stayed with stock head bolts even when we got thicker deck blocks, also used the 1/2 inch stock head bolts on the 7 mains with steel straps. Worked fine to 1200 hp and 60 lbs of boost (LA Champion Spark plug dyno with Dick Jones at the throttle)
Thanks for the info Jm. We are all learning. AG
@@goldsgarage8236 going back and watching your shows, all GOOD
Thanks for doing that, AG
I should have added that the rod drill holes are no longer parallel, bending the bolts
Excellent video! It has been my understanding the torque to angle is used to prevent excessive variation in the clamping force due to increased friction during the last bit of rotation in the bolt. Or as you pointed out x degrees of rotation = y bolt stretch. This is an improved method and not the same as torque to yield. Please correct me if i'm wrong!
Correct Ray, torque to yield and torque to turn are two separate concepts. Thanks for the question. AG
An american crank manufacturer said the 4340 material used domestically is different than overseas. I question that , what do you say?
Thanks for the question David. An ASTM or SAE certified 4340 is a high carbon steel with specified amounts of chrome and molybdenum, as well as other alloys. In industry for critical applications, small samples would be analyzed in a lab to verify the content, tensile strength and Rockwell or Brinell hardness. All of these qualities can be substantially improved by heat treating, so typically in the design phase, tensile strength and hardness would be specified.
I can't speak for what happens overseas or anywhere else, but unless you have the ability to test, you don't really know. Hope this helps. AG
Nice presentation! Reminds me of shop class years ago. Miss those days. Take care!
Thanks you U. AG
I really enjoy you videos. I've built a few engines but I still learn many tricks watching your channel. Where are you located? I'm near Montréal.
Thanks Clark. I am in London Ontario. AG
A good example is Gale Banks video on Duramax head bolts. Do you want the bolt break first tor the Block?
Thanks for the info Don.AG
I hope that there was a test at the end of the lecture.
Thanks for commenting Bill.AG
If everyone accepts the torque specs given for a main or head fastener then why do they not accept the torque specs of a rod fastener? Rod bolt stretch requires you to exceed the torque specs which know would ever do with a head or main fastener.
Good observation. The difference it there is no practical way to measure stretch in main bearing or head bolts. You are correct, use the torque specifications and you will be fine.AG
Did you used to race the soft seal 66 chevelle ,yellow and blue, 730.s. 175 mph?
I wish I did, but no. AG
You mentioned tension on the connecting rod due to scavenging. People fail to recognize the potential of this dynamic. It is profound, in some cases.
Thanks for the comment Scott. That is why the engine is more likely to fail when you lift off the throttle. AG
@goldsgarage8236 or during cruise with strong exhaust and some axle gear . My car cruised 80 mph at 3800 rpm. Pontiac 455. It might have had an oiling problem, such as rods side clearance too tight. Cruising long distance was a repetitive death sentence.
Any grade 8 bolt will hold,-dough 😂
Correct, thanks Eli.AG
Well mopar says you can reuse the nuts and bolts. Not had any problems.
Yes you can, as long as you don't over torque them. AG
Fasteners are fastinating 😂😂😂
Yes they are. Thanks, AG
Thank you for your knowledge and videos USA 🇺🇸 TRUMP
Thanks for your comment Patrick.AG
so much incorrect info in the Presentation.
Please share.
@jkdwayne
i see useful information in the original post; I see no useful information in your comment
Your comment is incorrect
I concur. If I was paying tuition for this class, I would want my money back. The presenter rambled all over the place with irrelevant information and war stories, redundant content and never made a cogent story nor explanation for how the fastener really works. To do this, one must illustrate how the clamping load of the fastener creates compression in the parts that are fastened and then how the clamping load varies as the joint is loaded. The presenter also did not explain the real reason why a torque to yield fastener should not be reused. By his own diagram of load vs elongation, once the elastic limit (a term the presenter should have used, but failed to) is exceeded and the fastener permanently stretches, it will still come down on the same slope with same Young's Modulus (BN: the presenter never mentioned either "slope" nor "Young's Modulus"). If that fastener were to be reused, it will be longer than it was originally, but when it is tensioned again, it will go back up the same curve with the same slope it did originally before. But will it achieve the same clamping load at the same torque value and why? He did not even get close to explaining this. He never answered the question about why the fastener is not to be reused. The presenter would have done well to prepare and practice a cogent, succinct presentation with illustrations and demonstrations. A bunch of show and tell props did not add anything to the presentation.
I am a MS-degreed, Mechanical Engineer with a PE license, who practiced nearly 40 years during which time I have designed and specified countless bolted joints that were sound and reliable.
@@jamesclaeys3192You should have watched the video. At 9:36 he mentions modulus of elasticity. You do realize this is the same thing as Young’s modulus, don’t you?
i'm not commenting on your videos any more. you're too far above me to admit you're wrong on some things.