ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ต.ค. 2024
- A lot of fighting games in the past felt like they were gatekept because of how hard it was to break in if you weren't there from the start. But with games becoming more and more prevalent with rollback, locals, and overall engaging volatile gameplay, there has been a shift. So let's talk about what games in the FGC history have the most volatility and gatekeeping behind them.
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#iDom #iDomFGC #StreetFighter6 #SF6 #StreetFighter #Manon
7:00 how is mkx more gated than sf5 and 6 , strive and tekken 8. I play kitana and kano in mkx and the only somewhat hard thing to do is dash canceling. Where is the gate that I missed?
I wish zoning was more punishing on block so the game isn't as focused on neutral skip
In SF6, I like the idea of Ex moves doing chip damage, so characters would have more win conditions than just driverush
My problem with new fgs is that they are trying to punish you for blocking and forced situations.
I mean, minus Tekken and absolutely minus DBFZ imo, all currently have lots of defensive options and optimisation for both offensive and defensive. SF6's drive meter is the best piece of depth for these since Burst and Tension.
@@Megaman231122 tekken, guilty gear, SF the. If three games are all games that punish you for blocking. Guilty has risk, SF now forces you to do something because your meter is getting depleted and burnout is checkmate 90% of the time. I get wanting to cater to new players but defense should NOT be punished in the process for that
I actually disagree. There should be a consequence and a potential punish for every thing you do. Not saying it should take 45% life on every bad chose though.
Because Alpha didn’t have a block gauge, and SF2 didn’t have absurd chip damage.
This isn’t a “new game” problem. It’s just a design choice they’ve been making for years. Honestly I feel like SF4 is one of the only SF games that doesn’t punish blocking harshly, and even that game still has chip (and it pauses stun recovery).
@@ZachHenke there’s a difference between chip, and actually being PUNISHED for blocking. Know the difference
9:39 “I’m not taking a class in Falco edge guard flowchart” yo that was hilarious 😂😂😂
Strive introduced me to Xrd which in turn gatekept my ability to enjoy Strive.
Did he juts call sf5 low volatility
V Trigger can ruin someone's whole flow lol
My theory is similar, but I argue the axes as Low vs. High Damage, Low vs. High Execution (although I factor Knowledge into this department as well).
Low Damage/Execution is fine. High Damage/Execution is good, but your learning curve is STUPID STEEP (this is where Marvel 3 and KoF goes). Low Damage/High Execution is where I'd put 3rd Strike, Marvel 2, similar Golden Age Retro FGs; and it's also okay because there's this tension of like, "WILL THEY DROP THE COMBO" and sometimes they DO.
But these newer games all feel Low Execution/High Damage where higher skilled players ARE EVEN MORE CONSISTENT. While there's less gatekeeping to learning, there's also significantly less *opportunity to do that learning* against the higher-level opponents because they can one- or two-touch you to death while you're still figuring out how the game plays.
What volatility means in fighting games, i dont get it
From context as i understood it, is whether the game is fair or not i.e. no clear op characters.. but maybe i got it wrong, i do consider sf6 to be somehow well balanced at least for the average playerbase. But gatekeep, yeah sf4 is a hell of a mountain to climb as a new player
I think he’s referring to dynamic gameplay
how i understood it was things like comeback mechanics, or things that suddenly swing the match another way. Drive Rush into Critical Art lvl 3 super is a lot easier than some 50 button touch of death combo. both are volatile because they win you the match all of a sudden, but the 50 button combo is knowledge/practice that gatekeeps you from doing it.
High damage/swing potential.
Unpredictability. Like in Marvel 3, Dark Phoenix and X factor can end the enemy team in about ten seconds even though the Dark Phoenix player might have been in a bad situation with one character left.
Some of these are hard to compare. Like Melee and Marvel where pretty much NA only with a few top international players, so if you compare that to SF6, Punk is about as dominant within NA as any of those top players were.
i dont know if this is intentionally the funniest video I've ever seen or not but i cant stop laughing at that chart man.
I was hoping my favorite games would all be in the 'evil' tier
Virtua Fighter is so high volatility and high gatekeep that it's off the charts
Holy shit what are you talking about with that graph at the start. My god I have zero clue what you are saying.
im sorry this is hilarious but basically he is explaining his logic behind categorizing different fgs based on a Easy/Difficult vs Chaotic/Calm plot. Admittedly he was mashing words at the beginning but its easier to understand if you have played the games he is talking about.
Tekken 8 is the perfect example of why gatekeeping is a good thing. No hate to new fans but the devs get ahold of the rise in popularity and start to value dynamic appeal over legacy gameplay, and essentially end up just merging elements of other genres into a fighting game, fighting against most of the cast in Tekken 8 feels like fighting a dark souls boss lmao
New fgs just aren't as fun to me. I want to like sf6 so badly but I just loathe drive rush as a mechanic which is odd because I played strive a ton. If they made sf6 with no drive rush I feel like the volatility would be solved easily since so many problems stem from it.
They key is to "gatekeep" the right stuff, keep certain other stuff not gatekept, and keep the game at a healthy level of volatility. (A lil bit, but not too much)
Old games just had a better balance.
Sf4 and melee have a great balance but could use slightly less gatekeeping. Id say the sweet spot is just to the left of those 2.
The fact that Melee players can't change their control schemes to this day is just... lmao 😅
@@coltranebartlett590 ist off, they can now. But its actually a good thing they couldn't. The game is balanced around how the controls are. Up tilts and aerials are balanced around how slow or precise the inputs are, like special moves on traditional fighters. It's an important element. Not a bad thing at all.
@@SuperLemonfish Wait, does Slippi allow you to change your control scheme yet?
People forget the years of player knowledge and skill, melee and marvel where not full of killers at the start
@@finnmarr-heenan2397 exactly. If a new game came out like melee or marvel, everyone would start at zero together. It wouldn't be the same as trying to get into an old highly optimized game.
That DK tangent was incredible.
my goat in his schizo arc 💔
Is gatekeep axis skill ceiling or skill floor?
Skill ceiling, knowledge checks, execution leniency
@@TonyTheTGR so basically how overall hard a game is
Yes, but in more distinct ways.
1. How hard is the game, systemically, to learn? What's the knowledge checks you need to be prepared for?
2. How hard are the (relevant) characters to learn? Anyone who can WATCH can see WHO to play, but for example, there's a BIG difference between Cable/Sentinel/CapCom and Magneto/Storm/Psylocke in inputs-per-second on MvC2.
3. How hard is it to find average-leveled players to play/learn with, versus just being one-touched forever? I'd argue that MMPR: BFG is a relatively simple game to pick up and learn where execution is concerned, but if you're going directly online, you're getting ToD'd before you can probably execute if you're new to FGs altogether.
4. How forgiving of mistakes is the game? Because when you're new, you're making them.
BlazBlue is my favorite EVIL-type game
Finally someone says it, MKX is truly the perfect fighting game
Does lower gatekeep scale mean those games would be solved quicker? Do they have little depth and not much room for experimentation?
Gatekeep here seems synonymous with skill floor or like the requirement on the player to be good so kinda but it's more about a low technical skill player being able to jump in and do well relatively quickly vs needing to practice insane 1 frame link combos and shit to be able to keep up even if with low/mid players
My thing is…SF6 is racist cuz they made all the ethnic characters weak
Rashid?
This is a joke... right?
@@weaponx8263bro nobody would just post this if they weren't serious.
@@MrShinTensei Wanted to give them the benefit of the doubt
Being French is ethnic now 😂
The boomers suck at them?
@@apophis7712 to be fair these days the newer gen has so much to help them now💀😭 and even that being said no one still has some of the results as the old gen so
I'm just waiting for a company to have the balls to make a game that rewards players with a better execution and reactions. They are too busy catering to all these babies who don't want to get so every interaction is a dice roll.
Go play cs2
OMG lol I forgot about this janky ass graph 😂😂😂
"The marvel players, blazblue players, skullgirls players are old and have no friends and evil".
I will shank u if you keep hitting me with these shots 😂😂
U cookin though 😂
Fiest
iDom, come to melee
Marvel 3 Tutorial When?
They're all dogshit?
Fiest
Fiest