How far can Kia EV6 GT drive at 200 km/h?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ส.ค. 2024
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This car is equipped with 2 inverters for the rear motor. One is "efficient one" and the other one is made to push as much juice as possible. When the car is in GT mode it uses both inverters for the rear motor. In other modes it is using only the efficient one that can at most push juice that is enough for roughly 480HP. Another thing is that in GT or any sporty mode, decoupler on front motor is disabled, so both front and rear motor are used. In eco it can actually decouple front motor and improve efficiency by roughly 6-8%.
Fixed! Thanks, @@SniperSnake50BMG
But how's myp compared to this?
I would love you to try Model Y at 200KM/hr test, just to see how good the efficiency is compared to EV6 GT.
It's a real shame these 200kmh tests don't get as many views as they should, because they're super interesting!
Because? Its only interesting for Germany.
They don't get many views because: how many people drive at 200km/h for about 40 minutes straight, illegally or even legally?
@@LuonFoto Which is a shame because fast travelling between cities late or early is one of the best use cases for a motor vehicle imho, makes much more sense than driving for a few kms inside cities.
23:00 Model Y test would be awesome indeed!
Guten Tag Björn! I appreciate your high efforts testing the cars on Autobahn, please keep up! If you ever get a chance, make this run with a BMW i4 for a comparison.
Thank you very much :)
@@bjornnyland Hi Bjorn, another contender could be the Hyundai Ioniq 5N. Same base architecture but different "tuning". Could be interesting...
@@andschaeespecially interesting because of the even more aerodynamic body shape compared to the EV6 or ioniq5
The company that does this battery is Korean, Sk On. This battery, Sk On "SF" has 384 NMC 811 pouch cells, 200wh each, 32 modules (12 cells). 800 volt is not the only trick of it. A very low internal resistance has 2 consequences. A really slow degradation, Sk On talked about the guaranty to charge 1000 cycles, at high speed only! The annoying consequence is that in winter, with no battery preconditioning, the pack's temp drops fast, because normal driving (even pretty fast) doesn't generate any heat. And even when the battery heater works, it is pretty slow. The peak speed is barely possible in winter conditions. That is not a big issue, since those packs can charge at 110-130 kw, sometimes more, up to 80%, slower in the beginning, faster at high SOC. Good pack, for sure but very too expensive. Those cars (non GT), aren't able to compet with Tesla, far cheaper. Really good test ! Thx Nyland.
Do you know if this pack is also in the RWD/AWD cars as well?
I've changed my Tesla model 3 for this. As a car it looks better, is more comfortable and it is much better quality, the only area Tesla wins is the interface and media/entertainment.
I don't know if I was more taken with the sound of the engine at high speed or the outside wind but that ride along was so dang smooth and so relaxing, I almost felt like I wanted to sleep. Thanks for this video.
Very interesting! Would be great to see the 200 km/h test with a luxury, streamlined car like the Lucid Air 😊
This would be interesting. It's possible that Lucid haven't had much chance to run such a test.
I've done the lucid air gt with good outside Temps and my range was about 240miles with similar speeds but not on cruise control.
I think it is the form factor of the Pouch cells leads to better heat dissipation as more surface area is available for the cooling system and that might be also be the reason for the reduced heat loss in combination with the high-voltage mains wiring (the higher voltage reduces heat loss in the mains wiring, from battery pack to inverter / inverter to motor). Never a dull moment looking at results of these high speed road tests!
Nope, more cooling is less efficiency. Tesla invests far more than Hyundai/Kia in cooling, because they use cheaper cells with more heat loss. However, there is two sides to this. Hyundai's more advanced cells provide the ability of longer sustained power delivery (such as cruising at absurdly high speed or towing a heavy trailer over a mountain) and, more importantly, faster charging. They also save money on the cooling side of things and thereby help with the great serviceability of the pack (repairing a current generation Tesla battery pack is prohibitively difficult by comparison). So more heat loss requires more cooling, is less efficient among other disadvantages, yes, those are some of the downsides of Tesla's aproach. But it also means less preheating for preconditioning before charging, for example, and the more complex to build, more expensive internal and external cooling system provides a somewhat smoother user experience, cost savings in the build overall, etc. It's not an inferior aproach per se, from an entire car point of view. The shape of the cells most likely has an influence on efficiency and also on cooling, but I dont have sufficient knowledge to have an opinion on this topic, let alone to make a fact based statement. But that is clearly not the defining mechanism at play here. Electrode technology, cell construction engineering and chemistry are. These are cutting edge cells, that come at a price. Tesla's are far more basic. As for the 800V system, it obviously has nothing, or at least naglectably little to do with power delivery efficiency. It is a cost saving and above all charging time related feature. Charging 10-80% in 18 minutes couldn't be acheived with Teslas cheap cells, except theoretically with a gigantic, not sensibly feasible buffer. In theory, Hyundai/Kia could get away with 20-ish minutes with the 77kWh battery, or 18 minutes with a larger buffer, but that would increase cost for cars with up to 80kWh somewhat. Cars with larger than roughly 80kWh batteries can't charge at this speed with current technology, unless they sport 800V architecture. Since Hyundai/Kia clearly intend to make eGMP cars with up to at least 100kWh, it would be completely idiotic to stretch 400V to its limits for their less than 80kWh cars and then still make 800V cars at a prohibitive price on the same platform.
@@adrianguggisberg3656 There are two strategies for motor make more power.
First is increasing motor inductance,
Second is using higher voltage.
800v has definite meaning; with higher voltage same motor can make more power(with smaller loss).
Maybe KIA thought this wasn't enough. EV6GT has 2stage-inverter, so when driver demands power, it boosts voltage by 1200v to make motor running more power.
If you see the torque-rpm graph, higher voltage extends constant-torque period of rpm.
@@hwanju94 Yes, but this isn't about motors, it's about batteries. Heat loss and other inefficiencies in the motors and inverters comes on top of the loss in the battery. The monitored temperatures and energy turnaround was from the battery only and the motors are thus irrelevant. It's obvious that 800V has many advantages in many places.
The battery pack voltage does not have any impact on individual cells current.
Imagine you have 2 1.5V batteries and draw 3W of power. If you connect them in series to get 3V pack voltage, you need 1A of current and in series it translates to 1A per cell. If you connect them in parallel, so 1.5V pack voltage you need 2A per pack, but again it is 1A per cell...
The only advantage of 800V is charging due to lower current and resistance on the charging cable. On cell level it has no diference.
And maybe slightly lighter cables from battery to the motor inside the car.
Compare the peak currents of the S Plaid and Kia EV6 GT test. There was 2300A, here if I remember correctly 700A at a similar speed. This must translate into heat losses. The charging process is symmetrical to the discharging process, so it can be assumed that at a given voltage and power input or output, the losses will be similar. Therefore, an 800V platform will be thermodynamically more efficient than a 400V platform, as thermal losses are current dependent, so a lower current will be required at higher voltage.
@@tomasznowicki1735 That sounds logical. I would say that current means heat = losses unless superconductors are installed. Am I right?
@@tomasznowicki1735Thermal losses are resistance dependent, not current, you can have twice the current on twice the wire diameter and heat losses would be same.
@@czNemesis Yes, but in our case we have the same resistance during charging and drive, cause it's intristic factor of the battery/cable/inverter system. So, if resistance is constant, heat is proportional to amperage. Higher voltage = lower current = lower heat loses.
@@tomasznowicki1735What charging losses have to do with internal losses when driving? The difference between 800V and 400V system starts after the electricity exits the battery cells themselves and depends on how the batteries output is joined (paralel or series) and continues to the inverter, up to that point the differences are negligible. It is after the inverter, where 800V or 400V are. And between inverter and the motor, we are talking of 1m of copper cable at most. Possibly more for the front motor, which is mainly used when full throttling only. So what I am trying to say is that the 800V architecture would make a negligible difference regarding the heat losses when driving and it can be erased by simply doubling the diameter of that cable from inverter to motor.
Degradation on these will be interesting
Thanks Bjørn for your effort. I love the 200 km/h Test. They should get more views 🙏. Would love to see the test with a BMW i4 as well as the revised 2024 Polestar 2 LRSM 🙂
Great video! 👍👍 High speed tests give us viewers a feel of what the car is capable of doing. Sadly I cannot do a high speed test in Canada. 🇨🇦
My 'ordinary' EV6 GT-Line RWD is able to cruise at around 190km/h - almost the same as this test. At that speed it consumes approximately 45 kWh/100km (CW is 0.28 - a fraction better than the GT which is 0.297). However, I don't know if it can sustain the speed for as long as the GT - even though the 800V battery appears to be the same in both versions.
But of course, driving the pure GT is much more fun 😊
You know of course, that your car has a limited topspeed of 185 km/h. The speedometer probably indicates 190 km/h then.
@@larsenpetterI know, but the speed limiter is not based on what's shown on the speedometer. The indicated top speed was 194 km/h - so probably 190-ish in the real world. Will compare it with GPS speed next time😉
Just for info Björn the EV6 has adaptive matrix lights. So if you put it in auto high beam it will put high beam on all the while but adjust the lights automatically so it doesn’t blind on coming traffic or cars in front of you. I find it works really well and makes a difference especially at those speeds. 👍
You are the only one who makes thorough reviews
Hi Bjorn, great test as always. I would love to see a battery degradation test with the Porsche taycan. Because its the car with very high charge speeds at high end charge percentage. Does it hurts the battery? Porsche gives the possible to limit the charging speed, so i wonder.
Excellent, and it seems a very good GT.
Oh my! You went passed Flensburg and did not visit me! You could have tested my Kona 😂😂😂
Hi, nice test I m waiting for ZEEKR 001 same test
400/800V should not have any impact on the heat loss inside the battery.
Whatever is the way the cells are organised, each cell has to pass the same current anyway to give off or accept the same total power. Whether they are more in series (for 800V) or with double the number of shorter parallel branches (for 400V), it's only the outside the pack where the difference is seen - due to half the current being needed at double voltage for same power level. So motors, inverters and cables benefit from it, but the pack internally does not.
The 7% waste heat calculation for the Plaid probably wasn't correct. You seemed to make an error in the calculation, but the data from the app was also very unreliable, so I don't know if it was passible to make an accurate calculation. However, based on the data from Plaid video, I'll give it a shot.
The data on the app showed an available battery capacity at the start of 88.8 kWh at 100% SOC and at the finish it was 5.56 kWh at 6.26% SOC. So, according to the app, the car used 88.8 -5.56 = 83.24 kWh.
The app showed an average consumption of 380 Wh/km and you drove 225 km. So, energy used to drive was 380 x 225 = 85.5 kWh. But this is more than the 83.24 kWh used that was shown on the app, so there must be something wrong with data from the app.
Now let's assume that the real value at 100% SOC was 92.1 kWh, as shown by your previous tests. If the value at the finish really was 5.56 kWh, then the total energy used was 92.1 - 5.56 = 86.54 kWh. So, while this might not be accurate, at least it is more than the 85.5 kWh from the consumption-distance calculation. Based on these two values, the thermal efficiency of the battery would have been: 85.5/86.54 = 98.8%. So this would be a 100% - 98.8% = 1.2% loss. However, since the 88.8 kWh at 100% SOC value was probably wrong, I don't have a lot of faith in the accuracy of the 5.56 kWh (6.26% SOC) value. So, I doubt the accuracy of the 1.2% loss value.
In your summary at the end of the Plaid video, you recorded that the real consumption was 410 Wh/km. If this was the average consumption over the same 225 km, then the energy used would have been 410 x 225 = 92.25 kWh, which is larger than the battery's net capacity of 92.1 kWh. So that consumption value would not improve the calculation unless it was for a distance much less than 225 km.
Please, do the same test with model 3 and ioniq 6 rear drive
Nice test, Bjoern, but let me point one technical note: your final tables shown after the test dive under youtube's timeline and buttons when viewer pauses the film to read data from the table, so some key numbers are not visible. Maybe you would place them at the top of the window?
You can make a screenshoot will the video is running to avoid this issue.
@@nihongobenkyoshimasu3190 sure, but even better use TB excel sheet. Not in two second I need to take a look at one or two numbers during watching the film.
Or watch it on mobile, where the controls fade out. (don't they also do that when you click next to the player in the browser? I thought they did..)
You can use the up arrow on the TV remote for my setup. You pause the video then press the up arrow twice to get to full screen. (My TV is a Sony running some sort of Android.)
Super useful test, and main reason why I’m still not in EV. When there will be an option for 2hr+ 200km/h below 50k usd I will reconsider. Gearboxes can vastly improve high speed efficiency but I guess nobody cares. It’s that I’m always driving 200( though I definitely did if I could) but I’m never below 140 on highway.
Yes less current means less heat losses, so 800v is defined helping .
Less heat losses, but only on same wire diameter, you can actually double the wire diameter and have the same heat losses (resistance) as with half the current in 800V architecture. It's not that simple.
@@czNemesis doubling wire diameter is expensive and heavy
@@GreenDriveIndiaWe are talking few meters at most here, from battery pack to motors, nothing else.
@@czNemesis That is correct. But the heat losses do not primarily occur in large diameter cabling. They occur primarily in batteries, motors and inverters.
The heat losses in battery are determined by its internal resistance. The heat losses in motors and inverters are primarily determined by heat losses in their coils which are typically made of tiny diameter wire. Those wires cannot be made wider without making the whole motors or inverters larger. I assume that the manufacturers have made these considerations already. And what they came up with should be a reasonable compromise between the size, usability and acceptable heat losses.
@@pbasista800V architecture doesn't have to do anything with cells internal resistance nor voltage. And so as we are talking about 800V architecture, then the things you mentioned are irrelevant. Or, what I have been trying to prove, the 800V architecture is quite irrelevant when dealing with internal heat losses. Only thing it changes, is the voltage in thick cable between inverter and motors and that's it.
Did you do similar test with 2022 Tesla Model Y performance?
I think the 800V at least doesn't hurt. It may help a little bit ‒ you have half the current on all the cables and connectors to the battery, which (with the same-sized connectors) would mean 4 times less resistance on these. So I guess it's not just one factor, it's combination of everything.
They are hyping the 800V a bit too much and kind of taking the attention away from all the other things, but I guess the marketing department doesn't like to say „We have done 27 different things which together make the charging & discharging fast“ and saying „We are the best because of 800V“ is much more media friendly 😇
Tires make a huge difference on this vehicle. The Eagle F1 Asymmetric5 SUV tires aren't very efficient at all. I swapped out the Eagle F1 for Hankook Ion Evo SUV and now see similar range and efficiency to our Model Y LR AWD on 19" wheels.
Also, if you drive in normal mode using the accelerator pedal (not cruise control) over 73mph (117km/h) the front motor engages and uses considerably more energy. In Eco or cruise the front motor is decoupled even at those speeds and energy consumption is much better. On the Hankook tires I'm averaging around 305wh/mi (around 190wh/km) at 75mph (120km/h).
You should test the taycan or e-tron gt, or in the future the A6 e-tron, because they are aerodynamic and have that 2 speed gearbox
Sorry if this was covered elsewhere, is the battery in the EV6 GT the same as in the other shared architecture Kia and Hyundai?
The first ioniq5 had a smaller battery but the my23 should have the same battery.
Depends on the model year. It's not confirmed, but the EV9 and Ioniq 5N are supposed to have major changes compared to present models.
@@Dqtube thanks. Does the GT have the same battery as the rest of the current EV6 large battery models, the current Ioniq 5 and Ioniq 6?
My understanding is that it’s exactly the same pack as in most other E-GMP cars today.
Its amazing you have place to drive 200
As usual, according to the vehicle's consumption meter, these are only indicative values, because we don't know exactly how it calculates consumption and what it counts.
That appears to be stressful and tough to travel at these speeds for 40 minutes straight, sad how we the people are limited in our possibilities to analyze fast changing conditions. I can't imagine myself going at these speeds for such a long time, especially when I need to do another 200-300 kilometers to my destination
You get used to it. I find it much tougher to drive at slow speeds on an empty Autobahn for a long time.
also the Pilot Sport 4S are most likely much less efficient as it is a track capable tire
Must be 800v architecture since uses half amps for the same power translates in less heat therefore less power loses. Anyway that car is very efficient I noticed it uses only 129kw to maintain 200km/hr speed.
19:52... it sure isn't a relevant test for me, as I've never spent more than just 1-2 minutes at or above 200km/h in my whole driving life.
But it was interesting as a stress test to know how a modern EV behaves at such speed... and it exceeded my expectations, I really thought it would drain the battery way faster!
12:20 better check the gopro night capabilities before you go for that. Might be too crappy for dark driving..
have you testet that the ev6 run 200 at eco-mode?
32:00 Don’t you have auto high beams with matrix projector headlights in this?
Etron GT at high speeds? 800V and not a brick design? And 800V requires les amps with the same power, therefore less heat loss. Did you think about that Bjørn?
Heat loss in cells are still the same regardless of 400 V or 800 V.
in the table at the end, are losses accounted for in those consumption values of wh/km?
Yes
Power = Voltage * Current
Hi Bjorn be aware of DJi action cam over heating when not used external environment
Let's Go make it with a Model 3 Performance. Come on
These are good tests are fun but of limited practical use for the rest of us. You can't legally drive for this distance at these speeds without having to go back and forth.
It does show that police highway pursuits need ICE cars for a few years yet. After half an hour near top speed almost any electric car needs to recharge.
Can you do a similar test of ice vehicle and let us know the results , 100 kmph vs 200 kmph, how much efficiency suffers
Once I drove an Opel Astra in this way, it is true that it is not a sports model, even approximately, and it allowed me to drive only 200 on the odometer, no GPS, but a full tank dried on a distance of about 200 km. So BEVs are not bad in this competition. Of course, some diesel monster with a 100-liter tank will go a bit further.
@@tomasznowicki1735 how much litre is fuel tank?
E60 530i
100 - 9-10l
200 - 15-16l
Why would we care? No one is interested in ICE efficiency. BEV are already more efficient.
@@UrCheckMate Don't remember, 'bout 40L
We request such test with Ice car for similar comparisons
Most cars will drive at least 300× Km.
Somewhere between 14-18l Benzin.
German Auto Magazin AutoBild did that a few years ago. Max. Efficient is the Passat TDI with 12l Diesel at 200km/h. Incredible range of 583km!
Does anyone know how much would an ICE (like Porsche) consume per 100km in a test like this? I can only find VE car tests on this. But I think an ICE would not have a lot much more range at this speed.
There’s is a big difference between ICE and EV at high speed. My former Passat TDI took 12l/100km at 200 - with 70l you can still drive 580km! Even a VW Golf just needs 14l/100km petrol = 357km range with 50 l. Tested by German car magazine AutoBild.
Consumption seems high to me. An ICE car with 100 kw power maxes out at slightly over 200 kph.
After about 10 minutes the MaxPower started to drop from 481kW
Bjorn flying so low or driving so fast? 200 km/h are a crazy speed and make the car inefficient because of air resistance...
SO much more sound at 200kmh than an E-tron
Of course - it's half the price😉
Duhhh 🤦🏽♂️ also dubble consumption
Definitely less “fish like”
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well, EV6, and ionic5 battery management systems are way better than Tesla. remember, Tesla is not a traditional car company. they are lack of big data yet. BMS is the best in the world.
More, more, more tests like that. Biggest limitation of EVs is fast driving for long distances. If you need to be somewhere 300 km away in less than 2 hours, you can't do it.
@@wilhelmtell3427 it depends on the part of the day. You can do an average of 150 with almost constant 170 kmh at night. And it is doable with some of EVs.
For this kind of things the e-tron gt and taycan are good
This is also very difficult to do with a fossil car in real world situations. If you include the onramp , offramp and all other obstructions the average speed really suffers for any little slowdown. We have come to a point were most BEV`s can outlast any sensible driver.
@@wilhelmtell3427are you sure about your numbers? What car takes 7 at 200? I would say super effective diesel will take about 12, gas about 15-20l
@@wilhelmtell3427which car does 7litres per 100km at 200km/hr
126 km @ 200 km/h. I'll stick with petrol.
who cares
@@daemigeo1 Anyone who likes a car with a decent range. EVs don't cut the mustard.
and continue to destroy our planet by using those fossil bullshit
It's fine, if you go to family a little further away, halve the travel times. On roadtrips 200kmh doesn't make any fucking sense at all, it's also burning a lot of energy. But your dinosaur does that anyways, even at 80kph really inefficient
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