Funny how that works. Young, pre internet, me dreamed about having all the music in the world at my disposal, but since that's a reality music doesn't feel special any more it became a commodity. In my mind a sound system like this reflects that way of thinking.
@@joeylummox7330and Austin..thankfully..fortunately..we have many genres of great music other than so called Pop..which is unpopular to most people i know..i discovered Vocal Trance and Lounge and Chill..and there's always Classical / Soft Rock / 60's 70's 80's / Soul funk / Smooth Jazz / Acid Jazz and so on..i'd settle for Denon's new Austere grey box..does what it claims..pity it doesn't make the tea though..
It's only a grey austerity box because it's the austerity model. The Marantz version is the proper black hi-fi with metal switches and accent lighting.
@@amac203 AHHHHH!!! Are you awake now? I tend to agree with you, although I must say that nowadays the music scene is way more fragmented: back in the 90s you had MTv to dictate what was in, but nowadays where does one go to find out what's popular?
In the Netherlands we had the Firato exhibition every year from 1950 to 1998, which grew into several very large exhibition spaces in Amsterdam full of hi-fi stereo sound equipment and video equipment. From the cheapest to the most expensive, in short, the golden times, of sound and video equipment, great time to experience. Experienced this first with my father and later with good friends, marveling at a huge amount of equipment
@@anonUK The amount of visitors dropped enormously end of the 90s, so they stopped. I also enjoyed the FIRATO the couple of times I went there. I think I was there with my brother in the early 80s, perhaps even end of 70s. I recall very much the heaps of promotion material I collected for all the nice stuff I saw (I was 10 or so). I remember some brands made life-size foto-prints of some "boomboxes" so that (when you couldn't afford it) you could stick it to your wall and imagine you have one! Good times.
I'm THAT guy who NEVER experienced CDs as a full-on format! ( I have a few..) I was on cassette in 1975 (when the world was all about 8 track!) Held on to cassette until MiniDisc. Then of course, MP3. Reason? I liked to "roll my own". Yeah, I had what the hipsters call vinyl (We just called them records, many records were NYLON and not VINYL!) LOL! (I'm old, born 1962).
@@discopants68 Because your music can't really evaporate in a puff of bytes when someone decides storing your music on a server is no longer profitable when you own it on a physical object.
At this point if I like an artist's music it's just easier to buy one of their CDs. The alternatives are really only to find it on TH-cam, which is generally easy but gets you a truly appalling audio quality (pretty sure it's gotten *worse* over the last decade, somehow...), or to try and hunt it down on whatever music-focused streaming service that artist's music winds up on. Which means logging in to site after site and trying to search for the song. A rack of CDs is just... so much less of a hassle to deal with.
I'm curious to see how you could mix new tech with old this looks like a prime candidate for a stack minidisc and that sony tc-s1 deck due to their size. Also I want those sample wav ogg mp3 files by techmoan :D
I agree though I'd say spend some money on a good set of speakers and not necessarily new ones. Start with speakers, then fill in with what you can and upgrade as you feel necessary. I am a speaker hoarder though, so I am biased. I think aiming for a particular "sound" that defines some companies like Klipsch, JBL, Wharfedale etc. is a good place to start. It will also give you an idea where to go. I run a usb from my computer into a Schitt dac that then goes into a tube preamp that then feeds an integrated JVC amp from the 70's, into a pair of Klipsch KG 4's. All in I'm at or slightly over the price paid for this Denon system (not including my computer). I also have a cd/dvd player and a cassette player that I had lying around but can also be found for relatively cheap. You can easily make a better system for $500 or less.
@@theladyfingers___ If you just want 2ch stereo, then yeah, I agree. But AV receivers can be had for not much more, and will give you far more options, an FM tuner, (Some have DAB) WiFi, depending on model, and HDMI connections to connect your Blu-ray players etc. As well as 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound capability. So an AV receiver is the way to go if you want all that functionality. You can't get a dongle that will power surround sound speakers. But it all depends what you want as an individual I guess.
Same thing is with car stereos. In 2000s stereos had some cool displays with some VU-Meters animation, or some cars or dolphins. It was beautiful. And also old stereos feel like they aren't made from cheap plastic
My car stereo from 1989 shows the frequency/preset, indicates the tape direction and if the receiption is good enough for stereo. That's all. And it is perfectly fine for me. In the 2000s they had this crap and it was bad, it's just distracting. Today cars have huge 15" screens with too much stuff going on, i hate it.
@@macdaniel6029 I agree, plenty of examples from every era of good quality, bad quality, simple, flashy. There is a distinct oversimplification recent years. I can't even tell apart car brands, etc
Wonderful! Thanks for the presentation! That unit reminds me of McDonald's restaurants. In the old days, units and McDonald's used to be colorful and fun, now grey and dull. But still serve a main purpose.
I recently bought a Panasonic SC-PMX92EG-K, coupled with and audio-technica record player, as a group gift to a friend, we tested it toghether and it is a great little thing: very good audio quality and great output power (60 Watts per speaker) without distorsions, also it has as many inputs as you want for a modern hi-fi, also it looks great, great materials (metal and wood), it has its fair weight, real knobs/controls, and the grill covers of the speakers are removable
This is the perfect solution if your parent‘s old stereo from the 90s is broken. It might seen „dull“ but at least your mom does not call you on a Sunday morning at 7am and says that the radio is „broken“ because she accidentally activated a stupid EQ preset. Very well done, Denon.
I found Albrecht products to be much better for that - they even support a special mode where they lockout all controls outside the preset/volume/power ones.
@@pear7777 I would have liked a second, simplified remote, some dedicated memory buttons for the radio and a big volume dial but I guess that was cut by the cost savers.
It'd be so cool to have an interview with someone involved in designing these systems, particularly those older ones which were laiden with whimsical features. I'd love to know how those features managed to make it into the product, as my feeling is that engineers just created little features on their own and brought them to the table, and they were just thrown in.
Techmoan, you are so relatable, everytime you make a point i go "THIS, THIS IS IT". Physical buttons > touch controls, removable plugs > non removable plugs ect.
Mazda drivers in the US had their head units toasted when a radio station sent out track thumbnails in a JPG format but without the .jpg extension. This sent the head units into a permanent boot loop.
Sounds familiar to me, here in Germany we're still using FM mostly, DAB was around in the late 2000s but failed and it's scheduled for deactivation, however that date (I don't know) isn't really safe, IMHO they made DAB+ for new sold vehicles far too late mandatory (21st of December 2020). However, the FM stations ususally use RDS for station name, traffic information (my Audi MMI records these in the background) and also radio text for Song, Artist and some further informations, but around ten years ago, some public stations began to insert the songname and artist played at the moment in place of the station name (because cheap and older radios have just plain RDS but no radio text) and this idea itself tbh isn't wrong, but it messes up station lists, although I have an option in my MMI 3G to make the station names static, it's still messed up.
we need more fun! As a 66 year old geezer with "essential tremor" and radically reduced dexterity this system means very little to me! I guess what does make me hopeful is there is a growing number of younger folk who do get the appeal of older audio systems! Another great video with some thoughts to takeway! Cheers chum!🧡
Thanks for this mini-series. I've got the older Denon RDCM41DAB, and after seeing this, I'm glad I have. It's got old fashioned things (from 2019) called buttons and dials, and it's construction is that obsolete metal!
^ this. How it's even possible that such basic functionality is missing just blows my mind. I have never come across an mp3 player of any kind that can't do this. Absolute dealbreaker!
Same with Dj sets that usually 1-2 hours long, sometimes even longer. If you want to skip several minutes of one particular track you don't like - you stuffed.
Denon has created a remarkable device!! It only *_consumes_* 55 Watts of energy from the AC line, but it outputs 130 Watts of audio. 230 % efficiency!! Move over Elon Musk.
A few years ago I decided to buy the Philips TAM8905/10 system, mostly because I wanted a dedicated setup with a cd player. I must say I am still very pleased with it. It has all the modern stuff, so Spotify Connect, DAB+, Bluetooth and a usb port to read mp3's from a flash drive, but it also has a CD player and an AUX in, so I've got my record player hooked up to that as well. It looks nice, has very decent speakers for the price and with 100W they have some power as well. Just a suggestion for those looking for a nice little micro system with some capability to play cd's and hook up older gear.
¡Gracias Mat! Greetings from Mexico. Loved this series on micro HiFi systems. I bought a Denon DT-1 (30 w) from 2018 during the first months of the pandemic at a discount and although it's not as sophisticated as this one, it has physical buttons and it plays less formats (AM/FM , optical, Bluetooth, CD, mp3, analog), I am quite happy with it and mainly use it to enjoy my CDs and listen to the radio or stream music while being in my bedroom. Really appreciated your appreciation (sorry) of stereo sound, since It is one of the reasons i consider this small machine as my "main" music player in the house. Shoutout to any other DT-1 owners here! Love to read your experience with this system.
Very well done series on micro Hi-Fis. I am 100% with you when it comes to the excitement factor of the Denon device vs the older models. All that "silliness" was part of the fun of purchasing and enjoying a sound system. PS: Thank you for the years of very entertaining and enjoyable videos!!
I bought one of these (in black) with a denon turntable and some wharfadale diamond 9.1 speakers... attached a bunch of other separates (second hand) such as a tape deck, blu ray player and a tape deck.. added a mac mini and cheap monitor... couldn't be happier with the sound quality.
Uncanny. I purchased the N10 with the same speakers 2 days before this video came out. Basically my entire use-case was as an internet radio & Roon/DLNA endpoint for my home office. Been very satisfied with it so far. I wasn't after the loudest volume, or the heaviest bass. Just a nice, clear audio output whilst I work.
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Hi Mat. Just to confirm some of your comments at 13:15ish: Heart North & Mid Wales is indeed in stereo at 40kBps, using the HE-AACv2 algorithm (DAB+). Heart North West is, as you rightly mentioned, at 112kBps joint stereo using the older standard MPEG layer 2 encoding. The infrastructure for the two multiplexes is operated by two different operators, using all different equipment, so there is a likelihood the sound may be 'coloured' by the different technology used, as well as the different encoding algorithms. Both services have exactly the same audio processing applied, so should sound the same up to the point where they are encoded. Hope this helps. Keep up the good work! And look after yourself. 🙂
I just got the Denon RCD-M41 for my new micro hifi setup and so far I'm really satisfied, nice crisp sound and enough power to fill a room. This was a great video to watch!
I have the N10 version and have been overall happy with it. Still gets firmware updates. Bluetooth connection has been a bit finicky for my Android phone, but through time I've figured out how to connect quickly (for the most part). Also works with my Logitech Harmony remote. Speakers are okay, I wish the the bass was more distinctive and seperated in the sound, but I guess it's to be expected for a budget set like this. But it gets the job done for my needs :)
I too have the N10, one useful feature appears when using the Digital inputs, number 1 (TV) is that turning the TV on will wake the Amp from standby and also put it back to sleep when the TV is turned off. Putting the supplies Speakers on stands also improved fidelity.
@@andreasklindt7144 Yeah, but I'm just not interested in having one of those big woofers taking up place in my small apartment. I'll invest in some more balanced speakers one day :)
600£ is not "budget system" at all. You can easily get a really decent receiver + good shelf speakers for that price, and left with sone cash for a few months of Spotify still.
Matt, this series has been a great watch. It's great to have this kind of perspective on the history of these products. I think I have a bit of a different perspective on the color choices. The way these systems are designed is a reflection of what people want now... And that is something that disappears when they put it in their living room. They want to turn it on while they do other things: reading, cleaning, working out, or whatever. Which, oddly, happens back to where things started with the Edison phonograph, and later with hifi consoles. They were frequently designed to be pieces of furniture that blended into your living room. You'd turn them on when you wanted to listen to something, typically while you were doing something else, then turn them off and close them when they weren't in use. Anyway, it all just seems to have come full circle in my opinion.
Thank you for this great series Matt! It lets me appreciate my hifi setup more and more as time goes by and new stuff pops up. I'm using my now 24 year old Pioneer stereo amp (A-307 R) with my PC as the main sound source. It plays whatever I want in fantastic quality via the 1st generation X-Fi Xtreme Music card, has a 40" full HD colour display and I can connect almost everything to it that I want. There is also an old Pioneer tuner ( F-204RDS) and an old Yamaha tape deck (KX-390) connected to the amp, just in case. I could even connect a record player to it since the amp has a built-in phono pre-amp. I'm glad I bought this stuff over 20 years ago when you could get decent hifi equipment for a reasonable amount of money. And it still works fine!
I love my old, trash picked denon UPO-250. Crude, simple, does whatever I want. It is a bit small for my speakers (beolab penta, also trash picked) but honestly I never had it even at half volume. Never seen a better system, I love it!
So weird, the other day I was literally searching through your library on videos about modern HiFi systems like this one. It's like you saw what I wanted and responded.
"Download an APP, " the product lost me there. There are so many things you need an AAP for nowadays it is bloody annoying. I need an App to open my locker at work; what's wrong with a key? 😕
This was a great video (as always). For a Denon (and at that price), it looks remarkably cheap (plastic construction and fixed grille speakers). I've been looking at the Panasonic SC-PMX92. To me it looks much nicer, has a metal case, more traditional controls on the unit and more substantial speakers. Cheaper than the Denon as well, although I don't think the Panasonic has internet radio.
So, the smart thing to do is to buy a Bluetooth sender receiver of decent quality, and use whatever "dumb" hi-fi you want to through analog or digital and then the apps on your phone will continue to work as long as Bluetooth is around,. The hi-fi doesn't become landfill ever as you can always upgrade your phone, the device that connects to the hi-fi though RCA or digital or line in, and there are plenty of apps offering digital radio etc etc. Built in streaming reminds me a lot of iPod/phone docking hi-fi of the 2000s. As soon as something changes in the spec, it's dead. If there's a n app tied to a physical product, just say NO.
I have the "cheapest" (because it certainly wasn't cheap for me) Denon record player and it sounds great with a Polk Audio sound bar that still had an analog input. It was the closest thing in 2021 (when I bought them) to the HiFi setup we had at home when I was a kid. I actually appreciated that the Polk Audio bar doesn't force me to connect it to the Internet like a lot of modern things do.
Imagine having techmoan for like an uncle and as a kid going to his place and getting shown all the old and weird tech. Hey at the very least, I’m sure he could lend you a spare system for whatever format you like, his house must be overflowing with tech.
@41:00 lol sounds like you preferred the first two machines that caused you no end of trouble than the brand new machine that worked fine. Excellent videos as always. Thanks for making 👍🏻
I've got an older Denon from about 12 years ago that's still going strong. It doesn't have nearly as many features, which may or may not be a plus for some people. I personally prefer my stuff simple, so I like it. It's heavy and made of metal, like it's supposed to be. A subwoofer is a necessity for full sound, and the thing cranks. What I do wish it had is Bluetooth connectivity. It can connect by cable to Apple phones, which was a standard back then for all these things, but I've never been a member of that -cult- club. It's fun to see the new version, but I don't see much benefit, at least for older people like me who just want to play their CDs and listen to the radio, and who should therefore just get a great deal on a gently used old system.
I have a very nice Sony a/v reciever that has dts, dolby digital etc but no bluetooth or dab radio (just fm/am). I bought a £45 bluetooth transceiver that plugs into the optical input and lets me stream hd/aptx quality music to the old workhorse from my phone. It works very well indeed and sounds amazing so if you need bluetooth connectivity I would highly recommend getting one of these little devices. Its worth it just to stream internet radio which makes up for the lack of dab as well as adding thousands of other stations.
The DENON DM-41DAB has Bluetooth. It's the metal-cased, non-streaming equivalent to the CEOL-N11, I would say. £349 new from Currys, at the moment or second-hand on e-Bay for less. I paid £320 for it in December 2017.
I actually have a couple of these things -- older US versions. I've had an RCD-N7 that spent some number of years on display at a local appliance shop before I purchased it, and after a number of years, the remote control just stopped working. I tried getting a new remote control, but the ones that were available were slightly different versions -- which didn't switch one of the inputs I wanted to use properly. Figuring that it was the stereo system itself that wasn't working, I ordered a "new" one -- an RCD-N10. After getting that and "just trying the remote control," that worked just fine. And after trying that remote, I found that the original remote worked just fine, once again. Beats me what happened there. So, I just kept using the RCD-N7, while the RCD-N10 sits in the closet, in its original box with its original remote, waiting to take over, should it be needed. But I continue to use the RCD-N7 for the purpose I've always used it for -- as a "bedroom" system, powering a couple of modern bookshelf speakers, and switching between TV sound input and MP3 files saved on a USB drive -- plugged into the front panel. Virtually nothing external has changed all that much -- the inputs on the back have changed a bit, and of course the features have changed a bit. But I've literally used the RCD-N7 for more than a decade, and it's still going strong.
One of the possible reasons that it doesn't bring up the album covers when it is playing music locally is that it you need to play for a service that supplies them. There used to be an open source & free album cover service, but I think that died off a while back. When playing from a music service, they have the covers as part of their licensing for the music, and thus can display them.
@@Daijyobanai Nice. Thank you! The last I heard, some company had bought one of the sites and was starting to charge money for the service. I'm a Linux user myself...but tent to play most of my music from the command line...I guess old habits die hard...I've been using Linux since 1992.
Mat, you always make my Saturday breakfast better. Great video on an otherwise dull audio system. For me, I use a Yamaha 5.1 theater system for most of my sound listening, and it works fine. As my house is small enough, I don't need a dedicated HiFi. My Yamaha 5.1 will serve that purpose for 90% of the house. If I'm listening to music, like to go to bed or something, I can use the 5.1 sound bar I have in the bedroom and that will serve the purpose OK. A HiFi IMO is obsolete. If I want to add a CD or record or cassette player down the line, I have multiple RCA line line level inputs I can use to add on. I'm not saying there isn't a niche use case for one that transcends obsolescence, but just for me, I don't need to get one as my house is too small and what I have sounds leaps and bounds better than anything you can get in a bookshelf system. Yes, I have a BT speaker that I keep around, but that is mainly used for better sound from my laptop when needed or used when I'm listening out in my garden.
Thank you for taking the time w/ the mirco HiFi series. Love the older systems. The new units seem to have a sterile aestethic begging to blend into our bland everyday lives.
I really enjoyed the series. Thank you for being so creative and exploratory. Seeing the difference between the three eras, it gets clear how "flat" the humanity has become as years has gone by. The minimalism now screams out on our face in every sense. It's in the architecture, it's in the furniture, it's in the music, it's in the perfumery, it's in the electronics... So sad!
Seeing these Microsystem videos made me really feel nostalgic. In my local electronic market for the longest time they had like an audio isle with multiple micro station all around for people to sit down and prelisten to their audio CD's or LP's. Sadly they removed it a few years ago. They even removed the headphone stations at the Music area where you could scan the barcode and listen to snippets. I guess its all because of the corona situation back when. Shopping for music sucks now.
I was tempted to get one of these systems or one like it at least but once I realised most of the work would be done via an app on my phone I decided that I would be better off buying one of the last LG mobile phones (they are known for being the best phones for audio quality DACs) and just connecting that to my 20-year-old technics midi system. It is now permanently attached to the stereo and I listen to all my tunes via Deezer plus 100 or so FLAC-based albums that I have put on the hard drive.
@@darronjknight The LG V30 and V40 both had excellent DACs and headphone amps and made a great streaming solution. They also, if I remember correctly, had SD card slots so easy to load up lots of music.
Look into Fiio BTR-series DACs mate! I've a BTR5 and it's great. Got use for my old headphones again and got into IEM's because of it's capabilities. I use it on the go via BlueTooth with my phone (currently Pixel 5), at the office via USB-C with my laptop (which also works with my phone, but not really mobile that way) and often plug it into AUX inputs for the great sound quality. WIll recommend.
You CAN play the cd in a group. All you need to do is to group it in reverse to what you did. Drag the hometheater to the n11 instead. So the n11 is the master and home theater is the slave.
I'll start by praising the quality of the video and the channel, in general! Hats off! I'm not sure if anyone else mentioned it but, as I specifically tested the multimedia part of a descendant of the infotainment system from the R172, I can say a few things about the services behind the CD ID functionality. This (including covers) is provided through a generous contract with Gracenote (commercial evolution of CDDB). I'm not sure, as I only tested on connected cars, but the functionality might only be available if the car has an active internet connection. Of course, the system is rather generic in the sense it has a high probability of failing with special edition albums and such. In this day and age, when everything is a subscription, I wouldn't expect a company like Denon to keep up for free a service that constantly eats cash. Especially at this price point. Coming back to Denon, as an owner of an "ancient" AVR-X1000 receiver, I got disappointed by a similar contract as the one mentioned above. As a recently released device, the internet radio favorites could be managed for free on 3rd party site. Fast forward a few years, the said service asks for 5 $ a year (not much, but more than nothing) and, at the time I write this, radiodenon.com/ doesn't even work.
The naming might have been outsourced as Denon has never acknowledged that and might not actaully be aware! I do wonder how other countries pronounce ceol in Irish it's 'K(yee)ole' if that makes any sense.
This and the same thing by Marantz (MCR-612) are quite expensive in Australia, between $800-1000, and that’s without the speakers. It does do a lot though. The technics SA-C100 is in a world of its own though at $1800. The budget option is the Yamaha CRX-B370D at under $300
I just acquired a Sony CMT-M333NT from the UK so I had to buy a step up converter for my U.S. power supply. This thing is just fantastic. Built-in minidisc, cassette, and CD with USB for Net MD, optical and Analog inputs. I wiring it up for bluetooth in the optical port. To my ear it sounds terrific. I'm especially happy with well-made and stylish cassette mechanism. I'm installing it in my office next week. I have a weakness for these vintage systems with knob/button interfaces. No tracking, no firmware upgrades, no subscription required. My cassette, vinyl, minidisc and CD collection is a little out of hand - but its so fun.
I never seen a more boreing Hi-Fi equipment. As exciting as a washing machine or a fridge. I really admire your ability to make this as interesting as it became...
I love this! I'd love to see some Panasonic 2004-2005! I was born later 97 so in a grey area, I grew up really young with tapes but not long, then as I grew up everyone has their "xtrabass" button on and full blast with these 300+ watt systems and let me just say they sound insane to this day, pretty basic tape decks that most the time need belt replacement, but the 5 CD changer systems almost always work fine to this day! I had for a while picked up at a thrift store but got lost in moving, couldn't play a cassette without it sounding hummed every few seconds and slow, but amazing radio for the most part and fantastic CD playback with insane bass. They looked like space ships I guess that was the 04-06 vibe for looking cool and it dates them for sure haha but they live up to it! They've super heavy too, speakers can pump out some crazy loud and low bass with VERY little distortion.
Hahaha you're so right about touch controls. For some devices i don't care as much but especially for things like cars it's a nightmare. Imagine unsteadily pawing your way though arcane menus to change the channel or pair your new phone while driving... Nightmare. So glad the manufacturers are slowly moving back to more sensible controls...
I'm deaf in one ear, but I've always wanted to have good HIFI equipment for listening to music. Today, I've got what I like: a good amp, a good minidisc player/recorder connected to a good CD player and good speakers. And it all cost me just 100euro....I sometimes use Bluetooth speakers, but when my friends discover my real HIFI set-up, everyone is surprised by the quality of the sound coming from old equipment! And it's thanks to Techmoan that I've been able to do all this ;)
Modern systems haven't really forgotten stereo, people just don't buy two speakers. You can set up any Sonos, Alexa, Google speaker, etc... In stereo mode if you buy two of them. I just bought a little Walmart ONN brand $15 Bluetooth speaker for the shower - it has stereo mode if you buy two of them and link them together.
Totally agree, it is sad that much of the modern hi fi equipment doesn't appear to be very interesting! Compare this to the Sony FH-7 you covered a while ago. That was an aspirational product when it came out in the 1980s, and it still looks great now. You can plug modern gear into its auxiliary input and have the best of both worlds! I'm sure that the manufacturers could make something more interesting these days, but do they care that much? The little Denon has probably sold well enough. Then again, classic audio gear remains popular for a reason........
In 2017, my mom and i moved to a new apartment and i decided to buy myself a new audio setup for my bedroom and i chose a Denon CEOL N9 that was heavily discounted in a Hi-Fi shop nearby, back then i was only listening to spotify, i had no physical media in my possession. I was incredibly suprised by the sound of that Denon system, i was super happy with that, what i wasn't happy with was spotify connect because every 3 months it would just stop working for like a week until the Denon unit got a firmware update that would bring back the Spotify Connect for again a few months until it got down again. That made me crazy so i ended up digging in my old stuff a Chromecast Audio and connected it via TOSLINK because that had no problem with Spotify Connect. The Chromecast was not ideal either cause at some point in 2018 we got a new internet provider and a new internet box with it and that internet box would give lots of dropouts in wifi that caused the Chromecast to have lots of issues with streaming in the standard quality. So after all that streaming mess i started only using bluetooth. Years have passed since, i moved out on my own and one of the first thing i did moving out was building my own hi-fi setup with separates components i chose myself with an amp that had a lot of analog inputs so i could just connect as many things as i wanted. I still have that Denon C9 setup but, the streaming capabilities are dead to me, too unreliable, and Airplay is also limited to older specs so no multi room streaming which was my biggest motivation to start streaming music. The CD player never worked and bluetooth is too painful to use. So this C9 is just used with it's speakers on my desk for my Gaming PC and nothing else. I enjoy that it has EQ settings but that's about the only thing i like about it after only 6 years of owning it.
Good little unit. I used to have the previous models (N9 and N10). The N9 had annoying software bugs and flaky wifi connection.The binding posts on the N10 were so tiny even thinner cable I struggled to insert. I eventually switched to the marantz equivalent so I can use better cables with banana plugs. And the sound is warmer with no as harsh trebles as in Denon.
With all this type of systems, the included speakers is the limiting factor. I have seen quite good speakers going real cheap on the used market. Getting good speakers is the best upgrade on most systems.
I had an older version of this from the video. You can buy it without speakers and add any third party speakers to make the most of the system. Makes a huge difference. Now I own a similarly featured Marantz and they just come without speakers.
As a side note, as an American, I'm glad we don't have DAB. We have Satellite Radio (SiriusXM, which is going by the wayside now after almost 20 years). Its always nice and clear across the country, with the same stations anywhere. I was recently in Europe and played around with DAB for a few minutes in the rental car. It didn't seem any more impressive to me than FM with a clunky interface (but that may have been down to a Hyundai Tucson).
Found my "vintage-ish" Denon UDRA-F10 reciever at a second hand store some year ago for £20. Unfortunately not the rest of the system (neither a remote) included so it doesn't match my other units by size, but that's a hell of a beast being quite small. It needed some cleaning and a hunt for a compatible remote, although i could reach most functions from the panel.
So the system cant play a spotify track by itself you need the manufacturers app on your phone? At that point wouldnt it be easier to bluetooth from the phone?
Got a nice little Denon mini system myself, though I went with the RCD M39 without dab, mostly because a friend gave it to me. Works lovely with my record player and apple TV. Perfect for my office :) Good video series on the mini systems :)
I read a magazine today about 80s and 90s tuning, and they showed an "SGS"-Mercedes which had a full HiFi-stack in the dashboard (side by side rather than stacked) and a video recorder (with "Grundig"-stickers but allegedly panasonic-internals) in the center console. Probably not where the companies expected to find their stuff^^
About six years ago I bought a Pioneer HM-76 receiver and this Denon seems like a lower spec version of it. The Pioneer has a nice color display that shows album artwork and other information and has a physical volume knob and buttons. It's a really a shame there's not much like it other than units that cost a lot more.
Your summation was spot-on, throughout the video at various points I kept thinking: "Ironically, this is the least interesting of all the mini-systems you reviewed." Yes, it's 'functional', but even the app is "Meh". In fact, just before you finally dug into the app, I thought, "That display is boring, why did they even bother. Just have a blank box with a power button, and control the rest with the app." .... Then, the app was even less interesting with it's nearly complete lack of color. It's "seriousness" taken away too far. I miss the old hi-fi's of the 80's (which i couldn't afford at the time) and the design aesthetic with a thousand buttons and graphic foo-foo's that looked like they were up to something special, even if they were somewhat superfluous. In today's digital world, there's still no reason they couldn't build with that type of cool philosophy. The fact is: They're really just trying to produce them all as cheaply as possible, and ship them worldwide to as many department stores as well accept them. Which, as you say, is partially down to the ignorance of the modern consumer, who thinks a $25 Bluetooth speaker is good for anything more than a device you attach to your belt while rock climbing, and is likely going to last for one excursion and be done. 😅
Mat you did impossible thing - awesome entertaining video about the dull gray HiFi.
I really enjoyed the whole micro HiFi series, thank you.
How did you reply to this 4 days ago?
@@paulmurgatroyd6372 Patreon Users have early access to his videos
My old Bogen tube amplifier had stereo reverse and phasing controls too, that I have never seen on anything modern to play with either 🥱
@@batterieman3001 Makes sense.
A HDMI ARC connection would’ve been handy.
As someone who loved all those bells and whistles in early 2000s equipment, this device feels like it has no soul 😢
No volume knob is absolute no-go.
+1
& physical buttons
I understand, there's a lot of cheap micro systems that do have that. I also think it's a thing that should be on it.
It's nice to have but not a dealbreaker on a system of this size.
Even earlier versions of this only had up and down volume buttons.
Funny how that works. Young, pre internet, me dreamed about having all the music in the world at my disposal, but since that's a reality music doesn't feel special any more it became a commodity. In my mind a sound system like this reflects that way of thinking.
Had that dream too
This has been a blast from the past series but I agree, we've culminated in a grey austerity box.
@@joeylummox7330and Austin..thankfully..fortunately..we have many genres of great music other than so called Pop..which is unpopular to most people i know..i discovered Vocal Trance and Lounge and Chill..and there's always Classical / Soft Rock / 60's 70's 80's / Soul funk / Smooth Jazz / Acid Jazz and so on..i'd settle for Denon's new Austere grey box..does what it claims..pity it doesn't make the tea though..
@@joeylummox7330 Agreed! Appropriate for playing odorless, colorless, normalized contemporary music!
"A Flower!" 🎶 (If you know, you know! 😉)
@@joeylummox7330 Yawn. Every generation has had the older generation bemoaning the trajectory of popular music.
It's only a grey austerity box because it's the austerity model. The Marantz version is the proper black hi-fi with metal switches and accent lighting.
@@amac203 AHHHHH!!! Are you awake now? I tend to agree with you, although I must say that nowadays the music scene is way more fragmented: back in the 90s you had MTv to dictate what was in, but nowadays where does one go to find out what's popular?
In the Netherlands we had the Firato exhibition every year from 1950 to 1998, which grew into several very large exhibition spaces in Amsterdam full of hi-fi stereo sound equipment and video equipment.
From the cheapest to the most expensive, in short, the golden times, of sound and video equipment, great time to experience.
Experienced this first with my father and later with good friends, marveling at a huge amount of equipment
Why did it finish in 1998? Was it the then growing dominance of little silver discs for both audio and video?
@@anonUK The amount of visitors dropped enormously end of the 90s, so they stopped.
I also enjoyed the FIRATO the couple of times I went there. I think I was there with my brother in the early 80s, perhaps even end of 70s. I recall very much the heaps of promotion material I collected for all the nice stuff I saw (I was 10 or so). I remember some brands made life-size foto-prints of some "boomboxes" so that (when you couldn't afford it) you could stick it to your wall and imagine you have one! Good times.
I couldn't give a single toss about micro systems, but I'll watch 100 of these because I want to see what Techmoan thinks of them.
It's pretty awesome that CD is still rocking on till this day. Alongside vinyl records and cassette tapes bouncing back.
I'm THAT guy who NEVER experienced CDs as a full-on format! ( I have a few..) I was on cassette in 1975 (when the world was all about 8 track!) Held on to cassette until MiniDisc. Then of course, MP3. Reason? I liked to "roll my own". Yeah, I had what the hipsters call vinyl (We just called them records, many records were NYLON and not VINYL!) LOL! (I'm old, born 1962).
Spot on.
Why?
@@discopants68 Because your music can't really evaporate in a puff of bytes when someone decides storing your music on a server is no longer profitable when you own it on a physical object.
At this point if I like an artist's music it's just easier to buy one of their CDs. The alternatives are really only to find it on TH-cam, which is generally easy but gets you a truly appalling audio quality (pretty sure it's gotten *worse* over the last decade, somehow...), or to try and hunt it down on whatever music-focused streaming service that artist's music winds up on. Which means logging in to site after site and trying to search for the song.
A rack of CDs is just... so much less of a hassle to deal with.
Really enjoyed this micro hifi series you've done. Great job as always
I'm curious to see how you could mix new tech with old this looks like a prime candidate for a stack minidisc and that sony tc-s1 deck due to their size. Also I want those sample wav ogg mp3 files by techmoan :D
Radio people, lol !
only local stations, why need that ? in relation 'Where you are', Radio 1 !
"I kept forgetting I was doing a review and just enjoyed the music" is a strong recmmendation.
Still think most people should have an AV receiver and some bookshelf speakers. Cheap, supports everything and sounds excellent.
A basic 2-channel amp is all you really need. Everything else is just a cheap dongle that usually has app control now.
I agree though I'd say spend some money on a good set of speakers and not necessarily new ones. Start with speakers, then fill in with what you can and upgrade as you feel necessary. I am a speaker hoarder though, so I am biased. I think aiming for a particular "sound" that defines some companies like Klipsch, JBL, Wharfedale etc. is a good place to start. It will also give you an idea where to go. I run a usb from my computer into a Schitt dac that then goes into a tube preamp that then feeds an integrated JVC amp from the 70's, into a pair of Klipsch KG 4's. All in I'm at or slightly over the price paid for this Denon system (not including my computer). I also have a cd/dvd player and a cassette player that I had lying around but can also be found for relatively cheap. You can easily make a better system for $500 or less.
@@theladyfingers___ If you just want 2ch stereo, then yeah, I agree.
But AV receivers can be had for not much more, and will give you far more options, an FM tuner, (Some have DAB) WiFi, depending on model, and HDMI connections to connect your Blu-ray players etc. As well as 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound capability. So an AV receiver is the way to go if you want all that functionality.
You can't get a dongle that will power surround sound speakers. But it all depends what you want as an individual I guess.
@@theladyfingers___ almost, add a subwoofer and you are really laughing. Something like a KEF that doesn’t even need a sub out amp!
Av receiver aren't cheap
Same thing is with car stereos. In 2000s stereos had some cool displays with some VU-Meters animation, or some cars or dolphins. It was beautiful. And also old stereos feel like they aren't made from cheap plastic
My car stereo from 1989 shows the frequency/preset, indicates the tape direction and if the receiption is good enough for stereo. That's all. And it is perfectly fine for me. In the 2000s they had this crap and it was bad, it's just distracting. Today cars have huge 15" screens with too much stuff going on, i hate it.
@@macdaniel6029 I agree, plenty of examples from every era of good quality, bad quality, simple, flashy. There is a distinct oversimplification recent years. I can't even tell apart car brands, etc
I bought my wife a stereo with the dolphins!
@@raycreveling1583Pioneer used to do dolphins. They made great car stereos.
Wonderful! Thanks for the presentation!
That unit reminds me of McDonald's restaurants. In the old days, units and McDonald's used to be colorful and fun, now grey and dull. But still serve a main purpose.
Looks like the ideal system to put on your shelf next to all the box files and accountancy manuals.
I recently bought a Panasonic SC-PMX92EG-K, coupled with and audio-technica record player, as a group gift to a friend, we tested it toghether and it is a great little thing: very good audio quality and great output power (60 Watts per speaker) without distorsions, also it has as many inputs as you want for a modern hi-fi, also it looks great, great materials (metal and wood), it has its fair weight, real knobs/controls, and the grill covers of the speakers are removable
This is the perfect solution if your parent‘s old stereo from the 90s is broken. It might seen „dull“ but at least your mom does not call you on a Sunday morning at 7am and says that the radio is „broken“ because she accidentally activated a stupid EQ preset. Very well done, Denon.
I found Albrecht products to be much better for that - they even support a special mode where they lockout all controls outside the preset/volume/power ones.
Actually my 86yo mum bought such a unit, it is teadious to understand the remote and menu, but other way she's happy with it.
@@pear7777 I would have liked a second, simplified remote, some dedicated memory buttons for the radio and a big volume dial but I guess that was cut by the cost savers.
Much to complicated
Your "old" stereo might not have been this old because this does not replace a cassette deck
Waking up at 4am and getting to watch Mat is a great way to start a Saturday.
It'd be so cool to have an interview with someone involved in designing these systems, particularly those older ones which were laiden with whimsical features. I'd love to know how those features managed to make it into the product, as my feeling is that engineers just created little features on their own and brought them to the table, and they were just thrown in.
Techmoan, you are so relatable, everytime you make a point i go "THIS, THIS IS IT". Physical buttons > touch controls, removable plugs > non removable plugs ect.
Mazda drivers in the US had their head units toasted when a radio station sent out track thumbnails in a JPG format but without the .jpg extension. This sent the head units into a permanent boot loop.
Sounds familiar to me, here in Germany we're still using FM mostly, DAB was around in the late 2000s but failed and it's scheduled for deactivation, however that date (I don't know) isn't really safe, IMHO they made DAB+ for new sold vehicles far too late mandatory (21st of December 2020).
However, the FM stations ususally use RDS for station name, traffic information (my Audi MMI records these in the background) and also radio text for Song, Artist and some further informations, but around ten years ago, some public stations began to insert the songname and artist played at the moment in place of the station name (because cheap and older radios have just plain RDS but no radio text) and this idea itself tbh isn't wrong, but it messes up station lists, although I have an option in my MMI 3G to make the station names static, it's still messed up.
When I saw the ps5 for the first time, I thought I'd prefer a gray box, but having it in person, at least it isnt boring.
Thanks for the video!
Ps5 IS boring through
we need more fun! As a 66 year old geezer with "essential tremor" and radically reduced dexterity this system means very little to me! I guess what does make me hopeful is there is a growing number of younger folk who do get the appeal of older audio systems! Another great video with some thoughts to takeway! Cheers chum!🧡
Regardless of the wattage claims though this is still probably one of the best mini systems you can possibly get.
I thought the 65 watts was the max the speakers could handle as appose to what the system outputted?
Love some physical buttons
that's depressing. I guess the bar is very low these days.
@@smartgorilla imagine being blind and having to use this
@@BrennanYoung imagine being older too. My solution is to now tipex my mates black button on his pc or tablet or whatever so they don't get confused.
Thanks for this mini-series. I've got the older Denon RDCM41DAB, and after seeing this, I'm glad I have. It's got old fashioned things (from 2019) called buttons and dials, and it's construction is that obsolete metal!
The lack of an ability to search through MP3 tracks kills it for me as I listen to a lot of audiobooks. Really odd that you can't do that.
^ this. How it's even possible that such basic functionality is missing just blows my mind. I have never come across an mp3 player of any kind that can't do this. Absolute dealbreaker!
Play it in another app and airplay it over
@@FrankieShovels
^^^This
Same with Dj sets that usually 1-2 hours long, sometimes even longer. If you want to skip several minutes of one particular track you don't like - you stuffed.
Maybe they'll add that function with a firmware or app update later on, especially if someone at Denon is a Techmoan fan :)
Denon has created a remarkable device!! It only *_consumes_* 55 Watts of energy from the AC line, but it outputs 130 Watts of audio. 230 % efficiency!! Move over Elon Musk.
A few years ago I decided to buy the Philips TAM8905/10 system, mostly because I wanted a dedicated setup with a cd player. I must say I am still very pleased with it. It has all the modern stuff, so Spotify Connect, DAB+, Bluetooth and a usb port to read mp3's from a flash drive, but it also has a CD player and an AUX in, so I've got my record player hooked up to that as well. It looks nice, has very decent speakers for the price and with 100W they have some power as well. Just a suggestion for those looking for a nice little micro system with some capability to play cd's and hook up older gear.
Definitely a Philips fan
¡Gracias Mat! Greetings from Mexico.
Loved this series on micro HiFi systems. I bought a Denon DT-1 (30 w) from 2018 during the first months of the pandemic at a discount and although it's not as sophisticated as this one, it has physical buttons and it plays less formats (AM/FM , optical, Bluetooth, CD, mp3, analog), I am quite happy with it and mainly use it to enjoy my CDs and listen to the radio or stream music while being in my bedroom. Really appreciated your appreciation (sorry) of stereo sound, since It is one of the reasons i consider this small machine as my "main" music player in the house.
Shoutout to any other DT-1 owners here! Love to read your experience with this system.
This Denon is as inspiring as HÅLLBAR Bin with lid, light grey from Ikea
hållbar just means durable wich isnt very inspiring either XD
Very well done series on micro Hi-Fis. I am 100% with you when it comes to the excitement factor of the Denon device vs the older models. All that "silliness" was part of the fun of purchasing and enjoying a sound system. PS: Thank you for the years of very entertaining and enjoyable videos!!
Well, at least you can still buy a micro system that supports a physical media format :-) Great video and really enjoyed this three part series.
You do some of the best and most thorough HiFi videos I've ever watched. Thank you.
I bought one of these (in black) with a denon turntable and some wharfadale diamond 9.1 speakers... attached a bunch of other separates (second hand) such as a tape deck, blu ray player and a tape deck.. added a mac mini and cheap monitor... couldn't be happier with the sound quality.
oh and a mini disk
Well that's great, but how did you do all that with only one line input?
@@BelgianSquirrel I bought one of those splitters, fully uitilised the optical inputs.
Uncanny. I purchased the N10 with the same speakers 2 days before this video came out. Basically my entire use-case was as an internet radio & Roon/DLNA endpoint for my home office. Been very satisfied with it so far. I wasn't after the loudest volume, or the heaviest bass. Just a nice, clear audio output whilst I work.
Thank you for your audio technology addiction, and for allowing all of us to live out our addiction through your excellent videos. :)
/M/p/$\ /w/$/ /p/$/ /c/p/ /L/r/M/Were involved in me being drugged raped and cut me at the Swindon dental Anaestheticclinic and they Murdereda person therejoanneto/$$oun/
Hi Mat. Just to confirm some of your comments at 13:15ish: Heart North & Mid Wales is indeed in stereo at 40kBps, using the HE-AACv2 algorithm (DAB+). Heart North West is, as you rightly mentioned, at 112kBps joint stereo using the older standard MPEG layer 2 encoding. The infrastructure for the two multiplexes is operated by two different operators, using all different equipment, so there is a likelihood the sound may be 'coloured' by the different technology used, as well as the different encoding algorithms. Both services have exactly the same audio processing applied, so should sound the same up to the point where they are encoded. Hope this helps. Keep up the good work! And look after yourself. 🙂
I’m loving this series. Do more! 👏
Can't bear a Pioneer 70's stack system with all the neon blue lights. To die for.
Nice display and the build quality looks good. Nothing worse than buying a nice hifi only to find the display or cd tray is crooked.
It's built good enough to keep Matt out of it..😂😂
I just got the Denon RCD-M41 for my new micro hifi setup and so far I'm really satisfied, nice crisp sound and enough power to fill a room. This was a great video to watch!
I have the N10 version and have been overall happy with it. Still gets firmware updates. Bluetooth connection has been a bit finicky for my Android phone, but through time I've figured out how to connect quickly (for the most part). Also works with my Logitech Harmony remote. Speakers are okay, I wish the the bass was more distinctive and seperated in the sound, but I guess it's to be expected for a budget set like this. But it gets the job done for my needs :)
I too have the N10, one useful feature appears when using the Digital inputs, number 1 (TV) is that turning the TV on will wake the Amp from standby and also put it back to sleep when the TV is turned off.
Putting the supplies Speakers on stands also improved fidelity.
This devices seems to have the option to connect an additional subwoofer to it, which should give you a more distinct bass.
@@andreasklindt7144 Yeah, but I'm just not interested in having one of those big woofers taking up place in my small apartment. I'll invest in some more balanced speakers one day :)
@@andreasklindt7144 Yeah. I got Fostex PM-SUBmini2 Studio subwoofer.
600£ is not "budget system" at all. You can easily get a really decent receiver + good shelf speakers for that price, and left with sone cash for a few months of Spotify still.
Matt, this series has been a great watch. It's great to have this kind of perspective on the history of these products.
I think I have a bit of a different perspective on the color choices. The way these systems are designed is a reflection of what people want now... And that is something that disappears when they put it in their living room. They want to turn it on while they do other things: reading, cleaning, working out, or whatever.
Which, oddly, happens back to where things started with the Edison phonograph, and later with hifi consoles. They were frequently designed to be pieces of furniture that blended into your living room. You'd turn them on when you wanted to listen to something, typically while you were doing something else, then turn them off and close them when they weren't in use.
Anyway, it all just seems to have come full circle in my opinion.
It's kind of like old buildings vs new ones, nothing spent on personality, all practicality and cost savings.
Thank you for this great series Matt! It lets me appreciate my hifi setup more and more as time goes by and new stuff pops up. I'm using my now 24 year old Pioneer stereo amp (A-307 R) with my PC as the main sound source. It plays whatever I want in fantastic quality via the 1st generation X-Fi Xtreme Music card, has a 40" full HD colour display and I can connect almost everything to it that I want. There is also an old Pioneer tuner ( F-204RDS) and an old Yamaha tape deck (KX-390) connected to the amp, just in case. I could even connect a record player to it since the amp has a built-in phono pre-amp. I'm glad I bought this stuff over 20 years ago when you could get decent hifi equipment for a reasonable amount of money. And it still works fine!
Thank you for a great 3 part series, your right this unit is very much a plain jane and the others very much eye candy
I love my old, trash picked denon UPO-250. Crude, simple, does whatever I want. It is a bit small for my speakers (beolab penta, also trash picked) but honestly I never had it even at half volume. Never seen a better system, I love it!
Great series, thanks Mat. The brand name, CEOL, is interesting as ceol is the Irish word for music. Maybe it’s just a coincidence, but maybe not.
😎😄
Maith thú!
I spotted that , figured it was either an easter egg suggested by some engineer with connections to Ireland , or a coincidence.
Was going to post that too then saw your post 😊
Awesome reviews. Being born in 1980 and my folks getting in the quad format from 74+ and collecting dead media formats since I enjoy your videos.
I suspect the electronics inside is a car radio, but put into mini-case for home use.
I'm back from a trip to Germany, and this is peak German Airport Design philosophy.
So weird, the other day I was literally searching through your library on videos about modern HiFi systems like this one. It's like you saw what I wanted and responded.
A full review, very welcome. Pity about the lack of proper buttons and a tuning knob. "Not much playfulness" sums it up.
"Download an APP, " the product lost me there. There are so many things you need an AAP for nowadays it is bloody annoying. I need an App to open my locker at work; what's wrong with a key? 😕
A keys a bit shit to operate a hi fi though.
This was a great video (as always).
For a Denon (and at that price), it looks remarkably cheap (plastic construction and fixed grille speakers). I've been looking at the Panasonic SC-PMX92. To me it looks much nicer, has a metal case, more traditional controls on the unit and more substantial speakers. Cheaper than the Denon as well, although I don't think the Panasonic has internet radio.
So, the smart thing to do is to buy a Bluetooth sender receiver of decent quality, and use whatever "dumb" hi-fi you want to through analog or digital and then the apps on your phone will continue to work as long as Bluetooth is around,.
The hi-fi doesn't become landfill ever as you can always upgrade your phone, the device that connects to the hi-fi though RCA or digital or line in, and there are plenty of apps offering digital radio etc etc.
Built in streaming reminds me a lot of iPod/phone docking hi-fi of the 2000s. As soon as something changes in the spec, it's dead.
If there's a n app tied to a physical product, just say NO.
I have the "cheapest" (because it certainly wasn't cheap for me) Denon record player and it sounds great with a Polk Audio sound bar that still had an analog input. It was the closest thing in 2021 (when I bought them) to the HiFi setup we had at home when I was a kid. I actually appreciated that the Polk Audio bar doesn't force me to connect it to the Internet like a lot of modern things do.
WHOO HOO! Put on the kettle and fetch the Custard cream biscuits, Techmoan is on.
it's a special occasion - time to open the hidden box of Clubs and KitKats.
Wait... is he British or something?
Imagine having techmoan for like an uncle and as a kid going to his place and getting shown all the old and weird tech. Hey at the very least, I’m sure he could lend you a spare system for whatever format you like, his house must be overflowing with tech.
@41:00 lol sounds like you preferred the first two machines that caused you no end of trouble than the brand new machine that worked fine. Excellent videos as always. Thanks for making 👍🏻
works fine yes but it's boring
Lol the world moved so quickly, it feels like just yesterday we had hi-fi in our house, and now it's just a smart internet-ai tv
I've got an older Denon from about 12 years ago that's still going strong. It doesn't have nearly as many features, which may or may not be a plus for some people. I personally prefer my stuff simple, so I like it. It's heavy and made of metal, like it's supposed to be. A subwoofer is a necessity for full sound, and the thing cranks. What I do wish it had is Bluetooth connectivity. It can connect by cable to Apple phones, which was a standard back then for all these things, but I've never been a member of that -cult- club. It's fun to see the new version, but I don't see much benefit, at least for older people like me who just want to play their CDs and listen to the radio, and who should therefore just get a great deal on a gently used old system.
I have a very nice Sony a/v reciever that has dts, dolby digital etc but no bluetooth or dab radio (just fm/am). I bought a £45 bluetooth transceiver that plugs into the optical input and lets me stream hd/aptx quality music to the old workhorse from my phone. It works very well indeed and sounds amazing so if you need bluetooth connectivity I would highly recommend getting one of these little devices. Its worth it just to stream internet radio which makes up for the lack of dab as well as adding thousands of other stations.
The DENON DM-41DAB has Bluetooth. It's the metal-cased, non-streaming equivalent to the CEOL-N11, I would say. £349 new from Currys, at the moment or second-hand on e-Bay for less. I paid £320 for it in December 2017.
Does the old one not have any inputs? You can get bluetooth auxiliary inputs, or chromecast audio devices, and probably loads more.
@@Milamberinx The current Denon M41DAB has BT but it's the only model in Denon's M range of mini systems that do.
I have an old N7, butq iqt suddenly died a couple months ago 😢 not sure whether to replace
I actually have a couple of these things -- older US versions. I've had an RCD-N7 that spent some number of years on display at a local appliance shop before I purchased it, and after a number of years, the remote control just stopped working. I tried getting a new remote control, but the ones that were available were slightly different versions -- which didn't switch one of the inputs I wanted to use properly. Figuring that it was the stereo system itself that wasn't working, I ordered a "new" one -- an RCD-N10. After getting that and "just trying the remote control," that worked just fine. And after trying that remote, I found that the original remote worked just fine, once again. Beats me what happened there. So, I just kept using the RCD-N7, while the RCD-N10 sits in the closet, in its original box with its original remote, waiting to take over, should it be needed. But I continue to use the RCD-N7 for the purpose I've always used it for -- as a "bedroom" system, powering a couple of modern bookshelf speakers, and switching between TV sound input and MP3 files saved on a USB drive -- plugged into the front panel. Virtually nothing external has changed all that much -- the inputs on the back have changed a bit, and of course the features have changed a bit. But I've literally used the RCD-N7 for more than a decade, and it's still going strong.
One of the possible reasons that it doesn't bring up the album covers when it is playing music locally is that it you need to play for a service that supplies them. There used to be an open source & free album cover service, but I think that died off a while back. When playing from a music service, they have the covers as part of their licensing for the music, and thus can display them.
Nope, plenty of media playing software on Linux gets the album covers for downloaded music or ripped CDs. Those databases still exist.
@@Daijyobanai Nice. Thank you! The last I heard, some company had bought one of the sites and was starting to charge money for the service. I'm a Linux user myself...but tent to play most of my music from the command line...I guess old habits die hard...I've been using Linux since 1992.
Grace note CDDB. Winamp used to connect to it I believe, in the 'good old days' of the Internet before everything had to be monetised.
It works in the car thou.
I think you're confusing the album or track art with the CDDB (?) Database that used to be used to identify a CD and fill in the track details.
Mat, you always make my Saturday breakfast better. Great video on an otherwise dull audio system. For me, I use a Yamaha 5.1 theater system for most of my sound listening, and it works fine. As my house is small enough, I don't need a dedicated HiFi. My Yamaha 5.1 will serve that purpose for 90% of the house. If I'm listening to music, like to go to bed or something, I can use the 5.1 sound bar I have in the bedroom and that will serve the purpose OK. A HiFi IMO is obsolete. If I want to add a CD or record or cassette player down the line, I have multiple RCA line line level inputs I can use to add on. I'm not saying there isn't a niche use case for one that transcends obsolescence, but just for me, I don't need to get one as my house is too small and what I have sounds leaps and bounds better than anything you can get in a bookshelf system. Yes, I have a BT speaker that I keep around, but that is mainly used for better sound from my laptop when needed or used when I'm listening out in my garden.
Thank you for taking the time w/ the mirco HiFi series. Love the older systems. The new units seem to have a sterile aestethic begging to blend into our bland everyday lives.
I really enjoyed the series. Thank you for being so creative and exploratory. Seeing the difference between the three eras, it gets clear how "flat" the humanity has become as years has gone by. The minimalism now screams out on our face in every sense. It's in the architecture, it's in the furniture, it's in the music, it's in the perfumery, it's in the electronics... So sad!
Battleship grey
“haze gray”
Ocean grey or military grey?
Jubilee Line Silver
Cloudy Grey
Corporate Grey
Can’t beat physical dials on systems - gives you greater sense of control.
Seeing these Microsystem videos made me really feel nostalgic. In my local electronic market for the longest time they had like an audio isle with multiple micro station all around for people to sit down and prelisten to their audio CD's or LP's. Sadly they removed it a few years ago. They even removed the headphone stations at the Music area where you could scan the barcode and listen to snippets. I guess its all because of the corona situation back when. Shopping for music sucks now.
40:51 I said "fun" exactly when you said "fun", Matt. It was the only word that came to mind when you were describing what was missing!
I was tempted to get one of these systems or one like it at least but once I realised most of the work would be done via an app on my phone I decided that I would be better off buying one of the last LG mobile phones (they are known for being the best phones for audio quality DACs) and just connecting that to my 20-year-old technics midi system. It is now permanently attached to the stereo and I listen to all my tunes via Deezer plus 100 or so FLAC-based albums that I have put on the hard drive.
Which model LG phone do you use?
God I miss LG phones so much.
@@darronjknight The LG V30 and V40 both had excellent DACs and headphone amps and made a great streaming solution. They also, if I remember correctly, had SD card slots so easy to load up lots of music.
Look into Fiio BTR-series DACs mate!
I've a BTR5 and it's great. Got use for my old headphones again and got into IEM's because of it's capabilities.
I use it on the go via BlueTooth with my phone (currently Pixel 5), at the office via USB-C with my laptop (which also works with my phone, but not really mobile that way) and often plug it into AUX inputs for the great sound quality.
WIll recommend.
The previous ones they did a few years ago (silver with volume knob) were lovely things
You CAN play the cd in a group.
All you need to do is to group it in reverse to what you did.
Drag the hometheater to the n11 instead.
So the n11 is the master and home theater is the slave.
I'll start by praising the quality of the video and the channel, in general! Hats off!
I'm not sure if anyone else mentioned it but, as I specifically tested the multimedia part of a descendant of the infotainment system from the R172, I can say a few things about the services behind the CD ID functionality.
This (including covers) is provided through a generous contract with Gracenote (commercial evolution of CDDB). I'm not sure, as I only tested on connected cars, but the functionality might only be available if the car has an active internet connection. Of course, the system is rather generic in the sense it has a high probability of failing with special edition albums and such.
In this day and age, when everything is a subscription, I wouldn't expect a company like Denon to keep up for free a service that constantly eats cash. Especially at this price point.
Coming back to Denon, as an owner of an "ancient" AVR-X1000 receiver, I got disappointed by a similar contract as the one mentioned above. As a recently released device, the internet radio favorites could be managed for free on 3rd party site. Fast forward a few years, the said service asks for 5 $ a year (not much, but more than nothing) and, at the time I write this, radiodenon.com/ doesn't even work.
Didn't expect to see Irish language in there. Ceol is Irish for music.
The naming might have been outsourced as Denon has never acknowledged that and might not actaully be aware! I do wonder how other countries pronounce ceol in Irish it's 'K(yee)ole' if that makes any sense.
I have always been a huge fan of Denon products. Great bang for the buck. Nice, clean and no fuss looks.
This and the same thing by Marantz (MCR-612) are quite expensive in Australia, between $800-1000, and that’s without the speakers. It does do a lot though. The technics SA-C100 is in a world of its own though at $1800. The budget option is the Yamaha CRX-B370D at under $300
Yeah, I've got the CR-510 which I believe is the same thing just without the CD transport. And aren't they discontinued?
I got myself recently panasonic sa-pmx92 for less than half a price of denon, it is silver and has got three knobs 🙂very happy with it
This system is like the modern day McDonald’s restaurant; subdued colors, no character and leaves your wallet empty
I just acquired a Sony CMT-M333NT from the UK so I had to buy a step up converter for my U.S. power supply. This thing is just fantastic. Built-in minidisc, cassette, and CD with USB for Net MD, optical and Analog inputs. I wiring it up for bluetooth in the optical port. To my ear it sounds terrific. I'm especially happy with well-made and stylish cassette mechanism. I'm installing it in my office next week. I have a weakness for these vintage systems with knob/button interfaces. No tracking, no firmware upgrades, no subscription required. My cassette, vinyl, minidisc and CD collection is a little out of hand - but its so fun.
I never seen a more boreing Hi-Fi equipment. As exciting as a washing machine or a fridge.
I really admire your ability to make this as interesting as it became...
I love this! I'd love to see some Panasonic 2004-2005! I was born later 97 so in a grey area, I grew up really young with tapes but not long, then as I grew up everyone has their "xtrabass" button on and full blast with these 300+ watt systems and let me just say they sound insane to this day, pretty basic tape decks that most the time need belt replacement, but the 5 CD changer systems almost always work fine to this day! I had for a while picked up at a thrift store but got lost in moving, couldn't play a cassette without it sounding hummed every few seconds and slow, but amazing radio for the most part and fantastic CD playback with insane bass.
They looked like space ships I guess that was the 04-06 vibe for looking cool and it dates them for sure haha but they live up to it! They've super heavy too, speakers can pump out some crazy loud and low bass with VERY little distortion.
Hahaha you're so right about touch controls. For some devices i don't care as much but especially for things like cars it's a nightmare.
Imagine unsteadily pawing your way though arcane menus to change the channel or pair your new phone while driving... Nightmare. So glad the manufacturers are slowly moving back to more sensible controls...
I'm deaf in one ear, but I've always wanted to have good HIFI equipment for listening to music. Today, I've got what I like: a good amp, a good minidisc player/recorder connected to a good CD player and good speakers. And it all cost me just 100euro....I sometimes use Bluetooth speakers, but when my friends discover my real HIFI set-up, everyone is surprised by the quality of the sound coming from old equipment!
And it's thanks to Techmoan that I've been able to do all this ;)
It's too complicated to perform a simple task. It's not just plain, it's plain boring. Thanks again. I've enjoyed your series on micro systems.
Modern systems haven't really forgotten stereo, people just don't buy two speakers.
You can set up any Sonos, Alexa, Google speaker, etc... In stereo mode if you buy two of them. I just bought a little Walmart ONN brand $15 Bluetooth speaker for the shower - it has stereo mode if you buy two of them and link them together.
Totally agree, it is sad that much of the modern hi fi equipment doesn't appear to be very interesting! Compare this to the Sony FH-7 you covered a while ago. That was an aspirational product when it came out in the 1980s, and it still looks great now. You can plug modern gear into its auxiliary input and have the best of both worlds! I'm sure that the manufacturers could make something more interesting these days, but do they care that much? The little Denon has probably sold well enough. Then again, classic audio gear remains popular for a reason........
In 2017, my mom and i moved to a new apartment and i decided to buy myself a new audio setup for my bedroom and i chose a Denon CEOL N9 that was heavily discounted in a Hi-Fi shop nearby, back then i was only listening to spotify, i had no physical media in my possession.
I was incredibly suprised by the sound of that Denon system, i was super happy with that, what i wasn't happy with was spotify connect because every 3 months it would just stop working for like a week until the Denon unit got a firmware update that would bring back the Spotify Connect for again a few months until it got down again. That made me crazy so i ended up digging in my old stuff a Chromecast Audio and connected it via TOSLINK because that had no problem with Spotify Connect. The Chromecast was not ideal either cause at some point in 2018 we got a new internet provider and a new internet box with it and that internet box would give lots of dropouts in wifi that caused the Chromecast to have lots of issues with streaming in the standard quality. So after all that streaming mess i started only using bluetooth.
Years have passed since, i moved out on my own and one of the first thing i did moving out was building my own hi-fi setup with separates components i chose myself with an amp that had a lot of analog inputs so i could just connect as many things as i wanted.
I still have that Denon C9 setup but, the streaming capabilities are dead to me, too unreliable, and Airplay is also limited to older specs so no multi room streaming which was my biggest motivation to start streaming music. The CD player never worked and bluetooth is too painful to use. So this C9 is just used with it's speakers on my desk for my Gaming PC and nothing else. I enjoy that it has EQ settings but that's about the only thing i like about it after only 6 years of owning it.
Loved this 3 chapter video Thanks for your efforts techmoan 🙌
Good little unit. I used to have the previous models (N9 and N10). The N9 had annoying software bugs and flaky wifi connection.The binding posts on the N10 were so tiny even thinner cable I struggled to insert.
I eventually switched to the marantz equivalent so I can use better cables with banana plugs. And the sound is warmer with no as harsh trebles as in Denon.
With all this type of systems, the included speakers is the limiting factor. I have seen quite good speakers going real cheap on the used market. Getting good speakers is the best upgrade on most systems.
I had an older version of this from the video. You can buy it without speakers and add any third party speakers to make the most of the system. Makes a huge difference.
Now I own a similarly featured Marantz and they just come without speakers.
As a side note, as an American, I'm glad we don't have DAB. We have Satellite Radio (SiriusXM, which is going by the wayside now after almost 20 years). Its always nice and clear across the country, with the same stations anywhere. I was recently in Europe and played around with DAB for a few minutes in the rental car. It didn't seem any more impressive to me than FM with a clunky interface (but that may have been down to a Hyundai Tucson).
Found my "vintage-ish" Denon UDRA-F10 reciever at a second hand store some year ago for £20. Unfortunately not the rest of the system (neither a remote) included so it doesn't match my other units by size, but that's a hell of a beast being quite small. It needed some cleaning and a hunt for a compatible remote, although i could reach most functions from the panel.
im waiting for mat to come out in a translucent rain coat, walk over to his fancy hifi, "do you like, huuey louis and the news"?
So the system cant play a spotify track by itself you need the manufacturers app on your phone? At that point wouldnt it be easier to bluetooth from the phone?
DENON CEOL-N11- It does what it says on the tin, coldly and without mercy.
Got a nice little Denon mini system myself, though I went with the RCD M39 without dab, mostly because a friend gave it to me. Works lovely with my record player and apple TV. Perfect for my office :)
Good video series on the mini systems :)
I read a magazine today about 80s and 90s tuning, and they showed an "SGS"-Mercedes which had a full HiFi-stack in the dashboard (side by side rather than stacked) and a video recorder (with "Grundig"-stickers but allegedly panasonic-internals) in the center console.
Probably not where the companies expected to find their stuff^^
About six years ago I bought a Pioneer HM-76 receiver and this Denon seems like a lower spec version of it. The Pioneer has a nice color display that shows album artwork and other information and has a physical volume knob and buttons. It's a really a shame there's not much like it other than units that cost a lot more.
How is navigating a fully-loaded flash drive with the Pioneer? I purchased a Yamaha a while back and navigation is dreadful.
Yeah but they still go for 550 Euros today, so I imagine it'd be a bit more 6 yrs ago...
yeah but you couldn`t see anthing on that screen from 4 meters...so it`s useless...
Your summation was spot-on, throughout the video at various points I kept thinking: "Ironically, this is the least interesting of all the mini-systems you reviewed."
Yes, it's 'functional', but even the app is "Meh". In fact, just before you finally dug into the app, I thought, "That display is boring, why did they even bother. Just have a blank box with a power button, and control the rest with the app." .... Then, the app was even less interesting with it's nearly complete lack of color.
It's "seriousness" taken away too far. I miss the old hi-fi's of the 80's (which i couldn't afford at the time) and the design aesthetic with a thousand buttons and graphic foo-foo's that looked like they were up to something special, even if they were somewhat superfluous.
In today's digital world, there's still no reason they couldn't build with that type of cool philosophy. The fact is: They're really just trying to produce them all as cheaply as possible, and ship them worldwide to as many department stores as well accept them. Which, as you say, is partially down to the ignorance of the modern consumer, who thinks a $25 Bluetooth speaker is good for anything more than a device you attach to your belt while rock climbing, and is likely going to last for one excursion and be done. 😅