Newark ship blaze blamed on Ports America-owned loading vehicle
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2024
- Cause of Newark Ship Fire
What's Going on With Shipping?
Sept 16, 2023
In this episode, Sal Mercogliano - maritime historian at Campbell University (@campbelledu) and former merchant mariner - discusses Limited Liability filing by Grimaldi - the owner of Grand Costa d'Avorio - and the focus on a vehicle owned by Ports America and operated by American Marine Services for the fire and death of two Newark firefighters.
#newarkfire #carcarrier #fire #supplychain #shipping
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Newark ship blaze blamed on Ports America-owned loading vehicle
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32 CFR § 536.123 - Limitation of liability for maritime claims.
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Why your stolen car may be in West Africa and what's being done about it
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What? Stolen? Never! Not maintained? No! Corruption? Hardly ever....
The maritime limit of liability law needs to go. It's from the 1800's and it allows egregious practices to pass without censure. When the El Faro went down due to poor maintenance and due to the ship's captain sailing into a hurricane, the operating company claimed 0 liability after causing over 40 deaths with their idiocy. Same with a tour company that sunk a boat after "remodeling" it with a falsified inspection and getting a dozen killed.
I stated before in comments that I was an investigating officer in the USCG on the inland waterways. I also was a senior claims examiner for workers compensation claim, property and liability. All most all claims were complex, in litigation, and some involved alleged fraud. The Newark fire is a couple of magnitudes more complex than what I have handled. This has the potential to take years to resolve.
Easily resolvable.....The stevedore's Jeep Wrangler pusher caught fire.
Yeah, so many years that anyone who could be considered actually responsible for the tragedy is long past dead by the time the piper is to be paid, which would seem to me to be the whole point of current law. "Delay, delay, delay, until you don't have to pay." And your forever excuse as to why that can be done if you've got the money to do it? "Well it's complicated." Yeah, I'll bet it is.
As a longshoreman at a different US port, the stevedore company will usually put the absolute smallest amount of effort needed to keep their vehicles operating.
Hi Sal I'm from the UK and I totally agree with your point of second hand/old vehicle being loaded on to ships for export, I have tacken vehicles to the port of Tilbury on the east coast of the UK and every single one have been filled with meny thing's some in black bags and boxes of god knows what one day I took a truck to Tilbury and had to put it over a weigh bridge to find it was over loaded by 5 metric tons, we run these trucks at 18 metric tons on the road and it was absolutely stacked to the roof with cardboard boxes it was supposed to be computers and parts no-one includeding myself never knew what was in the boxes it could of been flammable materials for all I know it could well been petrol ((gas as you call it)) and if computer inks were involved no-one but no-one knew what I had hauled nearly 100 miles all the manifest said 1× 18ton truck loaded with computers and spare parts, thank you for your video's and your indepth reports on shipping very very interesting thank's again Sal.
You support Ukraine Nazis? Look into it.
@mickbaker
Sounds like smuggling was going on.
@kellikelli4413 I can't say anything I took to Tilbury docks was smuggling but I can't go through every box or bag that we're in vehicles I delivered to the Docks but I do know that customs dvla and police were often at the transport export area of the Docks.
This has been going on for years. I remember in the 90s a RORO full of junk/wrecked/non-running being exported to Lagos out of the port of Newark. You'd never seen such a pile of crap in your life, there was oil and gasoline dripping all over the place. The Nigerians would rebuild and sell them locally, apparently.
I worked in South Africa for a few years and My goodness if you see what they done with vehicles you would never want to buy anything but brand new vehicles unless you give a second hand vehicle a very very good going over with a fine tooth comb.
Thanks for the story Sal. This is your true value. Bringing stories and findings to light. The loss of life feels even worse to me now.
As a firefighter I love your break downs. I know nothing of commercial shipping as I am from Colorado. Thank you for your coverage. You help me to understand things I wouldn't about your industry.
I know on the LSMR’s we converted at NNS, there was enough ventilation, sprinkler systems and de-watering systems allowed the US Army vehicles at remained fueled as part of the design. The sprinkler system was capable of pumping 3500gpm times 2. The USMC pre-positioning ships had systems to de-fuel the vehicles to be safely transported.
The LMSRs have AFFF systems as well as CO2, and, with massive de-watering pumps, can withstand a serious bout of firefighting.
The problem is that it is near impossible to fight a fire, as the cargo is too close together for firefighting is turn-out gear to maneuver and attack the fire before it spreads.
The tires, lube oils, interior, wiring, are all combustible, and will melt and spread fire. It is a real shit-show.
I used to travel on a ro ro out of Bayonne NJ to Bremerhaven Germany. It was on a 25year contract to haul military equipment. I was surprised to see all these junk cars being pushed on. I asked and these were owned by military personnel who would be stationed in Europe. If you brought one over, you could bring a new one back. They were to be junked once they got there. A total waste to get around a regulation.
When I was in stationed in Germany you couldn't get a 'junk' vehicle licensed. If it had rust on it, it failed the inspection. The Germans didn't want crap on their roads, and had very strict rules about brakes and all safety equipment.
@@durgan5668 The point was to get one over, not drive it. The usual "Lemon Lot" cars swapped between G.I.s for many tours handled most of that. In the 1980s some bases had their own small salvage yards (just a parking area) where G.I.s could harvest parts for free. A nice arrangement all around. Of course German standards are geared to coerce car replacement so a bit of otherwise irrelevant rust served that bureaucratic purpose, and AAFES sold many new rides in Europe or delivered in CONUS.
My nephew did this, he bought a ancient VW when he was transferd to Germany and a year later he has bought a top model Mercedes (much, much cheaper than what one would cost in the US) and had it shipped back. Since he was military it was customs n tax free too
Other companies tow non running vehicles onto the ships. Grimaldi will not pay for a tow company to load non running povs so the alternative is to push with a designated push vehicle. It's a very unsafe practice. Here in Baltimore we've had cars go into the water and people die from this practice. Which is why we have outside tow companies come and load non running povs. Again except for Grimaldi who refuses to cover the added cost for the safer tow company.
Great comment Brian.
Interesting comment, I work with Grimaldi in UK in Tilbury, rules now are it must start, run and stop under its own power or it does not get loaded. Similarly no contents allowed to be packed in vehicles loaded for W.Africa.
@@johnchapman3601 Grimaldi usually uses skid steers here in Baltimore but when when they have more non runners then the skid steers can handle they push with a designated vehicle.
I can see the logic of that liability act catching on. "Judge, my client is innocent because the incident that led to the victim's death took place before my client was arrested. Ballistic tests confirm that the bullets had already exited the gunbarrel when they impacted with the victim. The prosecution claims that my client killed a corpse with an empty gun!"
So how did the bullets exit the gun barrel 😆😆
Although I believe that may be the cause, I'll wait for the official US Coast Guard, NTBS, ATF, or NFPA official reports. This sounds like legal maneuvering before any official government reports.
Great insight to the Newark ship fire and the tragic loss of the 2 fire fighters, always very informative channel, well done Sal for keeping us informed on the news on various topics of shipping and related issues!
👍😉👍
I did a MSC “humanitarian support delivery” to Tecorate & Cape Coast Ghana in 2009. The port was a zoo. Very few operational controls over cargo offloads. The Port Engineers told us that most of the used vehicles being offloaded by other ships were stolen by USA gangs. We left uninjured. Carry on.
This is the exactly the same in the UK lot's stolen by gangs you wouldn't want to meet in the streets even in day light and your carrying a fire arm.
Outstanding update and summary, Sal. Up to your usual high standards. Thank you, bud!
The mainstream media rarely does a follow on report. Thanks for the explanation of the situation.
Vehicles make for impressive fires even without battery or fuel tank! I worked salvage long ago in the cutting torch era in Jersey City and if spatter ignited an interior there was much entertainment, especially if it lit off after the hull was deep in a horizontal stack (think "dominos"). Vehicles are basically built to burn.
So many do not understand this.
The report amounts to an attorney's letter. Of course the shipowner is trying to minimize liability.
Well, of course they are, and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. Look at it this way. Suppose you're having a party and onr of your guests sets fire to your house. Do you accept liability for that? Of course not! You blame the guy who actually started the fire. Why should this be different, just because it's a corporation?
I'm going to suggest the reason FD exited was because there was an understanding the CO2 discharge system would be activated, and that system failed. Even if the vessel could not be firmly sealed, the CO2 system could have provided some early opportunities to fight the fires. Also, I believe the process of shipping used vehicles around the world is about to come under new laws and greater scrutiny. It could become months before a used vehicle leaves the dock.
Good North America loses a lot of stolen vehicles this way.
Have watched some of yr vids previously, but this one is exceptionally well done and well explained!
I wish the Families and Friends of the deceased Peace and Comfort.
They will never fully recover from this, especially if it is found that the deaths were avoidable.
Thanks, Dr. Sal. I hope the Newark Firefighters' survivors have a primary benefit of Workers' Compensation death benefits and life insurance. Sadly, the litigation will likely drag on for many years. If NJ is like CA, there will be unscrupulous attorneys siphoning off the survivors' money in exchange for "pie in the sky" someday.
loading cars for west Africa that are in such a poor state they can't even be pushed on, has a similar vibe to developed countries sending all our plastic and e-waste to Asia where it just gets dumped. If some of the cars are also stolen that only adds to the shoddiness of it all. No one asks questions, "just doing their job", until there's some kind of disaster.
Now I'm Retired but my career was as a cargo inspector at ports up and down the US east coast. Mostly involved with New import and export vehicles but also heavy equipment, containers and break bulk cargo. By and large most on port vehicles operated by the stevedoreing companies are what you and I would call Junkers. No longer roadworthy by state laws but still used as shuttles or for other jobs. It doesn't surprise me that one would break down on board the vessel, I've seen that many times. Luckily I've never been onboard a vessel when fire was involved.
Sal,
They were loading and had the stern ramp open. When they released the CO2, did they have all the fire doors and ventilation openings closed, and the fans shut down? The impression given is the ship's crew was monitoring the loading and promptly responded to the fire. This begs the question, why didn't the crew check to see if the jeep was safe? I also wonder how much CO2 they had onboard. Did they have enough for one or two zones? Or, did they have enough for the entire cargo hold?
Will this case eventually be tried using Admiralty Law as opposed to normal Civil Law? Can you give information on the differences in how a case like this plays out? There should have been audible and visual warnings that CO2 was released. Were these warnings operative? Were there ship's officer(s) coordinating with the Newark Fire Department? Did they tell them CO2 had been released? What role did the shoreside crew play in the response?
Bob
The source was a Jeep. You needn't say more.
Just when I thought your Hawaiian shirts couldn't get any better, you drop this Campbell Camels one on us 😊
You know it!
I once borrowed a friend's ->JEEP Grand Cherokee
I want to know what the local fire/arson investigators & insurance companies have found
you are not the only one - one of my journalist friends is trying to get hold of the reports
Thank you for the channel and for the follow up. Wow an ICE vehicle was responsible for the fire. I'm sure we'll see the headlines clarifying it wasn't due to an EV...NOT! Regardless, following the recent event on the car carrier in European waters, it's clear some changes are required to ensure they can better manage fires that start/spread to EVs. Commiserations to the brave fire fighters who lost their lives.
It's not an ICE Vehicle, and this isn't even an official determination of cause. This is the ships owner attempting to shift blame before any official reports come out. So treat it with skepticism until the Coast Guard and Fire Investigation Reports are released. Even if true ICE has nothing to do with the named vehicle. It belonged to the contract service company of the Port.
@@andrewtaylor940Internal Combustion Engine, not Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
That’s a serious shirt Professor Sal!
Sam, great job again. One of my favourite TH-cam news type channels. Please keep the research and stories coming!
Also goes to show you how the laws around maritime liability desperately need reform.
seems like they should have some sort of PALLET SYSTEM for non-running and non-moving vehicles, therein (while the others are driven) you just get those DISABLED vehicles off on quickly with a fork lift/yard lift to a deck with appropriate clearance (ref: same as how they move wrecks around at places like CoPart and Mannheim). forgetting the fire issue for a moment, it seems like a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME to be "bulldozing" them off and on with a POS Jeep. on Crowley's coming out the Caribbean with Sugar Cane, yard trucks just run on and connect to the individual trailers, and just roll them off. rinse and repeat.
Thank you Sal for improving maritime safety by educating us so we can all keep our public organs accountable with credible info.
It's a laudable goal, but the world is falling apart around us.
Thanks Sal
I remember back when a ship full of iron ore briquets caught fire en route to Sparrows Point Maryland. All the briquets melted together into one solid chunk.
I'll have to search for photos of these Mad Max Jeeps. This gives "it's a Jeep thing" a new depth. I hear quite the can of worms being opened here. This is going to get complicated. Thanks for sorting it all out.
Great info. Thank you Sal…..
Ah.. :) a definite level-up in the visual mood on the set! very improved and much appreciated!
As someone who has worked in an underground enviroment and seen how easy proper onboard fire suppression is to fit, I amazed it was not fitted. They went cheap a cobbled something together instead of getting a dedicated machine with proper safety features.
Unless a firefighter is paid equal to a Lloyds top underwriter (or lawyer which ever the greater) he or she would be nuts to respond to a "commercial" fire.
Mrs Richards: "I paid for a room with a view!"
Basil: (pointing to the lovely view) "That is Torquay, Madam."
Mrs Richards: "It's not good enough!"
Basil: "May I ask what you were expecting to see out of a Torquay hotel bedroom window? Sydney Opera House, perhaps? the Hanging Gardens of Babylon? Herds of wildebeest sweeping majestically past?..."
Mrs Richards: "Don't be silly! I expect to be able to see the sea!"
Basil: "You can see the sea, it's over there between the land and the sky."
Mrs Richards: "I'm not satisfied. But I shall stay. But I expect a reduction."
Basil: "Why?! Because Krakatoa's not erupting at the moment ?"
Outstanding coverage. As every single sailor trained in shipboard firefighting will confirm, you were spot on. I think since they were loading vehicles (gas/oil/hydraulic) that afff would be the first go to. We are all trained to attack a fire based on being class A, B, C, D. This was a class bravo fire and justified afff immediately.
it's kinda troubling that Newark port, one of the largest by volume in the US, doesn't have a local fire dept. versed in vessel firefighting. OK, the city itself probably doesn't get revenue directly from the port, the Port Authority is a government chartered organization exempt from local taxes, but either the city should ask for such assistance or announce that it wouldn't respond to such incidents and the Port should be responsible for providing fire protection. Often, certain types of large industrial establishments have internal firefighting units, for example, oil refineries. Such places require specialized equipment and trained individuals to handle these situations. As for the ship's owners trying to limit liability, well often when a ship enters a facility it is effectively governed by the rules of the facility and the various contracts involved in the engagement. Thus the ship company and the ship's officers have little or no say as to who is working on the ship or the equipment they are using. What does surprise me is using gas powered vehicles in this procedure rather than diesel, even small vessels are treated differently with diesel engines vs gas. There are lots of diesel pickup trucks around that would be good at these tasks. Also these used vehicle issues, even if they run, I sure wouldn't want some old junker that probably has leaks all over, with a full gas tank, down in my cargo hold. Former CG officer and maritime college instructor.
That was a really interesting summary...many thanks..
The Jeep Wrangler has a track record for catching fire. I have over the years seen videos on this.
Liar.
Post 2006, they redid almost everything powertrain-wise. And yeah, there were issues.
If this had been an older Wrangler with the 4.0, much more reliable.
Thanks for another informative video. It'd be fun to read the pleadings in this case. A question: you showed 32 C.F.R. sec 536.123, which is a federal regulation, not a statute, or act. Is the actual statute 46 U.S.C. App. 182-8, Limitation of Vessel Owner's LIability / Loss by fire?
In the UK ships with older cars and eps lorries, either past 600,000km or 900,000km are shipped off to parts of Africa is very common.
last year alone my friend sold 500 lorries that ended up being shipped to Africa - all of them were running and driving with new MOTs.
Thanks, great research!
With over 20 years as a firefighter I can say you can never be trained to cover everything you could get called for. But ship board firefighting is a specialty and if these firefighter were not trained to respond to a ship board fire then it would seem like the department bares a lot of the responsibility in this. I know why the owner is trying to limit liability on his part and if this jeep is the cause of the fire it would also seem the owner of the jeep is the most liable. Agree with the comment that this is going to take a long time to sort out which is never good for the families. Thank you for all the info you do provide to keep us up to date in all this
Loading used vehicles for west africa and using a 2007 Jeep Wrangler to push them onboard... this sounds like an atempt to get around the enviromental restrictions on scrapping/recycling vehicles by dumping them in Africa....all in all playing very fast and loose with the law.... It's amazing how firms suddenly find that everything is worth so much less when it's in their intrests to do so...
Thank you for the explanation.
My very first thought just minutes in was that used cars headed for Africa must be stolen, because the EU has more cars and is thousands of miles closer.
Having said that, I strongly doubt that car theft rings pay employees to siphon gas out of their stolen cars or clean trash or car seats, floor mats, gas cand in the trunks etc.
The Fire Department probably realized that the two fire fighters could not call for help on the radio. Ships are steel cans that radio waves do not penetrate, so sooner or later the families' lawyers are going to be filing against the Fire department if these two fire fighters were not trained properly to know that if you move out of line of sight of the hatch they entered, communications would deteriorate completely after they turned a corner (radio waves will bounce along passageways for a few dozen feet before they become too jumbled).
Multiple layers of incompetence, sadly not uncommon
Surprised that a big ports like New York/ New Jersey, dont have specialist trained fire fighters, a group trained to deal with Ship board fires, and their special unique problems. In the UK there are a couple of firefighter schools that specialise in ship board fires. they receive fire fighters from ports around the country for specialist training. These fire fighters then go back and pass on the experiences to others. The school at McDonalds road in Edinburgh has a mocked up ship superstructure that can be set with fires and filled with smoke for realistic exercises. As an ships engineer I had to go there once for a firefighting course, that was 4 days long, when inside this mock-up with a good fire going it can be frightening and disorientating if you've never experienced a fire in a confined labyrinth of corridors and rooms. Occasionally years ago now, In Liverpool or London, we used to get the local fire brigade visiting our ship for a tour, to have a look round and familiarise themselves with typical ships layouts, and fire fire fighting appliances, etc.
The FBI needs to do an inventory categorizing vehicles (legal, stolen, totaled: accident, totaled: stolen catalytic converter; failed state inspection, etc) but I don't think it will be done.
For all of the environmentalists: keeping these wrecks running (most with disabled/missing pollution control systems) results in more worldwide emissions than all of the emissions savings if every new car was required to be electric and the electric power generated to power those EVs were generated by pollution-free magic.
Credit where credit is due, in India it has been forbidden for decades to import used motor vehicles (with minor exceptions like an immigrant bringing a vehicle that he or she owns).
I many years ago came across mention of a product called (as I remember it) "safe foam". It is a metallic wool (don't remember what type of metal) that a fuel tank can be packed with that modestly decreases fuel capacity but stops a fuel tank from exploding and in the case of a leaking fuel tank it confines a fire to the fuel leaking from the tank. It's probably high time that vehicles should undergo some form of mandatory preparation for maritime transport..whatever the cost it won't be as bad as loosing an entire ship and lives..🤔
Sal "Parrot Head" Mercogliano. Thanks man. Great channel!
When a vessel like this is loaded with used vehicles for export, is there a comparison made of the vehicles' serial numbers to a national database of serial numbers of stolen vehicles? Does a national database of stolen vehicles even exist?
Serial number...
You mean a VIN?
Well at least it didn't burn for weeks on end!
when my brother shipped an SUV from Oakland to Honolulu the passenger compartment had to be empty and fuel near empty.
Some companies have rules in place.
It's hard to believe that the port authority isn't required to have an on-site FD with personnel trained and equipped to fight shipboard fires (or any other emergency situation on-board)
I've got some rather shocking news for you regarding the Port Authorities "On-Site" Fire Crash Rescue at the Airports that it controls. aka Newark, LaGuardia and JFK. They're not Full Time Firefighters. They are Port Authority Police who have just enough training to drive the trucks and get the white stuff out. The Fire House's aren't staffed. The Port Authority Police Officers are still doing their normal Police Jobs throughout the airports until an Alarm goes out. Then they respond to the Fire Station to pick up the Crash Trucks. They are entirely dependent on FDNY or Newark FD coming in behind them, getting them water and taking over and actual hand firefighting.
@@andrewtaylor940 If that is true, it will get people killed. The key to fighting a fire is to get to it fast. If these guys have to get from a terminal to a station, how much time is lost?
It will be interesting to see the result of this case!! Why are they even allowed to load cars that are stolen?? Should they have a title?
Astonishing that a single Jeep can take out almost an entire carrier. There must have been numerous human and/or mechanical faults compounding the problem.
A fire in a cargo hold is catastrophic regardless.
Automotive fuel tanks have been made of plastic for forty years.
Sounds like the Tacoma FD was more capable of handling a dockside ship fire versus the NJ/NY authorities.
Great Video, Interesting Subject, Obviously there are issues that are well beyond what you have discussed! New Sub here! thanks for sharing
I love how Dr. Sal loves this s**t. Absolutely eats and breathes it.
~$400/ton is a bit more than twice #1 scrap steel buy price at scrapyards or "absurdly low".
Grimaldi Loading secondhand vehicles for transport to West Africa....What could possibly go wrong ??
What makes a 2007 Jeep Wrangler suddenly burst into THICK BLACK SMOKE is what the true question here is!
Pushing is not what it is designed for. The load on the transmission and the catalytic converter may have generated very high temps and a trans line possibly broke, fluid ignited by the red hot converter....boom!
Ive seen the the new eJeep burning like torches on the side of highway .
@@bengone3349 Good Call. Could be just a vibrating line that finally started leaking.
May vary depending on the type of vehicle and the transmission itself, but it is typically between 20 and 50 PSI at idle, and can increase to 100 PSI or more during driving. If ATF leaks from a vehicle and comes into contact with the hot exhaust pipe, it can ignite and cause a fire. This is especially true if the ATF is leaking under pressure, such as from a ruptured transmission cooler line.
ATF fires can be difficult to extinguish and can cause significant damage to a vehicle.
One company will ALWAYS try to blame another company... I doubt the TRUTH will ever be known.
More important than ever to have properly serviced equipment working on this vessels.
If fire extinguisher CO2 released in the ship, is at a lower temperature than the fumes from the fire. Then the CO2 from the fire extinguisher should stay in the ship. At standard temperature and pressure, the density of carbon dioxide is around 1.98 kg/m3, about 1.53 times that of air. Unless of course there's ventilation of fresh air into the ship, entering the area affected by fire and thus pushing the fire extinguisher CO2 away from the area affected by fire. Or am I missing something?
They shoukd have never used that jeep for that.
Another outstanding report. Thank you.
If I may, I would like to raise a point though. Until now, all speculation of the root cause we're EVs. Subsequently, affecting public opinion on safety of EVs.
I don't own stocks, work or anything with any EV manufacturer, but I used to drive one for 4 yrs, and it was the safest and most advanced road vehicle I have driven. Thanks
Thanks for the story Sal In german ports they do the same thing with old jeeps to push the non working cars on board. Especially for loading cars to noth africa.
If new vehicles loaded on a ship is limited to about a gallon of fuel (makes sense from a safety perspective), then I would think that the charge in the batteries of a BEV would have a similar restriction. I wonder what the reality on that is?
And who/how would they(someone) check that???
Having Li-ion batteries nearly depleted does not mean they are safer. In fact quite the opposite. If you’re going to store or travel with a device with Li-ion batteries the industry recommendation is to discharge the cells to 40%.
@@glennac Lion batts are shipped with about 40% charge or less, its the law in the US. In the cars once they get to the dealer they get charged... 100%
Hi Sal, now they know who to sue.
Sal or is it Tony lots of laughts your very well spoken and brilliant I love your way of explaining
Great presentation as usual. Also, best shirt so far!
Most colleges and universities have a school tie. Cambell U has taken it to a whole new level.
By reading the screen at 4:09 it sounds as if as soon as the Jeep went up the AMS employees did a runner and said "It's your ship, you put it out" which gave the fire time to spread. If it had been just a single vehicle on fire then a couple of folks with fire extinguishers should have had no problem extinguishing it or at the very least dousing it until crew members arrived. It seems like this whole thing could have been avoided before it became a disaster so I'd sue if it was my ship and the families of the two firefighters should sue also.
Quick question: Where is the firefighters overcome by the CO2 suppression system? Or was it in fact Carbon Monixide? I have had to activate a large CO2 suppression system during a Haz Mat clean-up.
For me I think of a ship as being all steel and find it crazy that a vehicle fire ( that’s not crammed in) can spread that much……my thinking on this though may end up being some for of negligence due to using the Jeep in a manner not recommended by the manufacturer
Same with every kid thinking "my school can't burn down its made of cinder blocks and concrete.....
Dead wrong.
All the steel is covered in paint. I had to put out a fire out once on a tug boat. The paint on the deck was creeping along on fire. It’s easy for the fire to spread even if everything goes right.
Paint used for repainting cars often contains cellulose nitrate as the binder. It gives a very nice finish. However it burns fiercely like a firework, generating its own oxygen as it is heated. I have experienced this when repairing old cars by welding, and have learned to have a few buckets of water handy when welding on a car. I don't think new cars are now painted with paint containing cellulose nitrate, but it is extensively used in the repair trade.
When you say owner said there is no E.V. vehicles aboard, does E.V. category include "Hydrid" (aka E.V. and I.C.E.) combination vehicle(s)?
I work at the port of Baltimore and these “used” cars are junk yard cars. It left our port not on fire and didn’t catch fire till it started getting unloaded at another port. We are not the blame
Hey Sal. Good work, as usual.
Question: Aren't stevedores the people who arrange for and supervise port labor, and longshoremen the ones who do the actual work, such as driving the cars aboard?
I always thought stevedores was the East coast name for what the West coast called a longshoeman, I could be wrong. If so someone will chime in.
Nice report Dr.
Seems like limit liability law has some adverse incentives such as it being better to sink the ship than getting damaged ship to port
At Copart etal, they use forklift to move cars around but I am thinking these are too big to fit into the ship?
I was on a RO-RO ship, we had a few forklifts, largest one was a 40 ton, for moving containers around.
Nice coverage Sal.
Thanks Sal for another informative show
My only question is why were the firemen not using BAs ? Confined fires it should be the first thing you grab
Yes, the Jeep/junky thing with a bunch of tires on its front bumper used push non-op vehicles around on the decks caught fire, it wasn't owned by the shipping company/ship owner. However the firefighting response by the ship's crew is just damn deplorable IMO. They should have had that fire contained within 120 seconds. The ship sits in water, its pretty damn easy to pump 500 to 1000 gallons per minute thru a fire hose, which I think is what a fire hydrant on land gives you. The thing is these ships are registered in some place like Costa Rica with no inspections, no codes, no test of the crew to see if they know how to respond to an emergency or fire. IMO if the ship had the right firefighting equipment and a well trained crew, that Jeep fire would have been put out within 5 minutes. IE using the carbon dioxide suppression system with all the hatches open shows me the crew didn't do fire drills/know what they were doing.
Thank you
Hi Sal,
I enjoy and appreciate your channel. I happen to be an expert in all forms of vehicle logistics including ro/ro and an electric vehicle manufacturer. Therefore, if you would like some additional information for the ev issues, I would be happy to help.
JL
All RORO need additional fire watch and firefighting equipment on all decks at all time. MORE IS BETTER!
3X so when shipping hot cars LOL
I'm loving that shirt, Sal.
It's spiffy!