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Yours is the first video essay I’ve seen mention her age as a factor to her consent, which I appreciate. People never seem to take into consideration that even if she had been asked, she wouldn’t have been in a place to properly consent to such a drastic measure
On top of that, she’s also ‘under duress’. Even if she could consent, she’s arguably being made to make a decision while under psychological stress that almost coerces her into the decision. Should she be in her 20s, she has more autonomy and critical thinking capacity for making that decision, but still under the influence of the suffocating circumstances she finds herself living in.
Its the apocalypse rules & laws are no longer in effect. Thats also stupid af. If someone wants to die in a world where u could very easily be grabbed up & made a slave, raped for years, cannibalized, or brutally ripped apart by infected or all of the above together! U have zero right to take away someones choice to die peacefully in this new world. Yall weird af.
I feel like in that universe though a lot of kids have to grow up and in general in that type of universe choosing to want to live or not shouldn’t be controversial because it is a hard terrible world and if someone doesn’t want to keep going that’s understandable, Ellie may be young but she and a lot of others her age are forced to understand heavy things like this. I get the age thing completely but I feel like you have to tie in the context of the universe (I haven’t watched the video yet just scrolling through comments lol)
@@mandywardrop7279 I disagree with this argument. Even if she's gone through a lot, she's still a child and still has less life experience than someone Joel or Marlene's age, and they're using that life experience against her.
From a practical scientific standpoint, killing Ellie is actually a very stupid thing to do. Given the nature of her immunity, it's not at all clear that you could synthesize a "vaccine" that would have the same effect. She's infected. Her body just doesn't respond to the fungus the same way. They have no real idea of why she works the way she works, and killing her would cut off their access to additional tissue and a study subject if their initial guess is wrong. If the useful thing turned out to be in her blood, bone marrow, or living tissue -- they'd be putting a clock and a hard limit on their ability to use it for any purpose. It's bad ethics and it's bad science.
On top of that, there is no logistic system to get the vaccine out to people in need, would the fireflys even supply to people who work with/support the military that they are actively attacking?
@@DonnieDaise Sure, I can't say 100% it wouldn't work, but it pretty nearly 100% wouldn't work. And there are less permanent and invasive methods that are (at least collectively) more likely to work that haven't even been attempted. So why on earth would you jump to the thing that prevents you from trying anything else? It's just pragmatism. If you're filming a movie and you need to shoot a lot of scenes in a car, and in one of those scenes you blow the car up, you shoot that scene when you're sure you have all the other footage you're going to need.
@@MertKayKay YOU AREN'T WRONG THOUGH. Also there is currently *no* vaccine of any kind that is approved to fight or treat a fungal infection. So what are the odds that some scrappy underfunded randos in an old university hospital are going to figure it out on their first attempt? Also, one of the ONLY promising fungal vaccine candidates uses monoclonal antibodies, for which you absolutely do not need or WANT a dead human source. If they'd managed to formulate a vaccine for ant cordiceps or monkey cordiceps using the same technique then perhaps this would be a legitimately balanced choice. But as it is, even if Joel hadn't cared about Ellie, he would have been right to get her out of there. The IRB never would have approved this mess.
On the point about sparing NPCs, I'll note that during the firefly hospital section, I did actually manage to spare one NPC and the dude ran for dear life. It was quite shocking tbh because most times I wait for the NPCs to get back up and proceed to kick their heads in the second they raise any weapon at me ( I had a thing for justifying my kills in games back then ). Till today, My brother chalks it up to being a glitch but I honestly like to think the mechanic was probably accounted for.
I think that is a thing that can happen in The Last of Us. I remember playing the original ps3 game back in 2013, can't recall what level it was but it wasn't the finale, it was outside and during the day. An enemy begged for his life and when I lowered my gun he ran away and escaped. It was surprising because that sort of thing was very unexpected, especially back then. I was actually disappointed that mechanic didn't seem to return in part II.
@@katefrost8500 I frigging knew it, the problem now is knowing how to trigger it. I don't know if it happens because you consistently give people a chance or because a random variable in the games code that only rarely occurs.
It would've been even worse if the fireflies had intended to breed Ellie to see if it was something genetically inheritable. That would've had higher success rate in terms of finding a vaccine since they'd have multiple subjects, assuming it was something genetic. But would've been extremely messed up.
Yeah, take some of her eggs and do ivf on numerous other women. Then, you dont need to wait 9 months per kid. The issue is then that they may have to wait for the baby to mature to a similar age to Ellie before the immunity kicks in. For that matter, Ellie might not even be genetically immune. It might just be the fungus that evolved to not degenerate the human mind. So, take some spores from her and infect some people first. There are so many steps to do before just killing her, even if we want to be pragmatic and kold hearted. Emotionally, the ending hits hard. But with the introduction of the sequel were we are told that they 100% would be able to make a cure from sacrificing their only immune patient. It just doesn't make sense.
To be fair to the show, their version of Joel is much less of a closed off prick than game Joel. I think Bill's character in the show was changed in a way that made sense and that pushed Joel to make the decision to save Ellie in the end instead of being a dark reflection of Joel. I think that's a pretty neat way to change Bill's story and still give him an important role in Joel's development as a character.
I think because of the character development we see when playing along side bill in the game, it would be hard to translate that gameplay into something interesting to watch on screen. I like the tv adaptation because it felt natural. It felt like they had played the game and wanted to do it justice. Bill was a hard dude who lost the only person he ever slightly gave a shit about, but the show adds value to the relationship we see in the game. I like that. Leaves less ambiguity about their relationship than in the game.
I'll quote one other TH-camr, who also talked about Fireflies' morality: "You're okay with playing Unit 731, but disrespecting someone's sexuality is out of the question for you?!"
if nothing else, i think its very telling how so many GamersTM conflated a "protagonist" with a "hero" and just can't cope with it. Like, is media literacy really this low? The hysteria over what happened to Joel couldn't have been more 'bro do you even nuance?' Which is made worse by the fact that TLOU/2 isn't even that deep. Its pretty basic though dramatic, stuff.
@Satya Hahaha! You see it a lot in Shonen anime especially, where the protagonist -> the Chosen One, and their actions are always morally just. It's why people have such an issue with Eren Jaeger being criticised (for example).
@@shenotski Caring about a character can't be undermined. If you care, you care. Just because you don't like what happened to them doesn't mean you stop caring, and that you're upset about what happened to the character so much, rather proves the games did a good job. Just because you can't move on, doesn't mean you get to say it was poor writing. Writers are under no obligation to give you exactly what you want. Such is life. And indeed letting go and moving on is rather the point of TLOU2. Let Joel go :P he wasn't a hero, or a good guy and liked him though many did, acceptance is your only option.
Neil Druckmann for ScreenRant, "Things you might have missed in The Last of Us Part II" 1. Violence is bad, actually 2. Its kinda fun to play though, huh?
The relentless roasting of sites like ScreenRant's incredibly keen and thought-provoking game journalism was just a lovely sprinkling on top of this delicious video-essay sundae :)
I had to put my phone down after you showed the Ellie killing whatever that stupid rapist's name was and Joel calling her baby girl. Like what. How am I supposed to go on after that?? It gets me every time
I once watched a video essay (can't find it again) that made the point mainstream Hollywood movies can't have a truly grey protagonist or actual moral question. It kinda explains The Last of Us’ ending.
I think Tess was definitely referencing at least partly the romantic tension between her and Joel. The two were very flirty, and while that is totally fine among BFFs, I always saw the two as having a romantic tension neither wanted to really discuss or commit to.
Personally, I think a big part of why I struggled with TLOU2 was because it came out during lockdown here in Australia and unlike the first game, where it felt like even though the world you are playing in is depressing and sad, you're working towards something good, something hopeful, in the second game you're working towards something bleak and exhausting, and the real world was already bleak and exhausting. It felt like a slog to get through. I left the game feeling like shit.
Babe wake up a new MertKay essay on something that lets me see a new perspective on stuff I already love to see if I can love it more and/or see if I can become more critical on the stuff I enjoy while also noticing stuff I haven't thought before just dropped (and just in time to be BG noise for doing art for a final)
Niel's "confirmations" of Ellie's surgery might be one of the most frustrating things I've ever seen a writer do, alongside J.K. Rowling and her Twitter ramblings on Harry Potter. It's completely unnecessary and moreover completely destroys the entire point the game was trying to get across and if I was part of the writing staff for the first game alongside him, I'd be absolutely PISSED that he said that. Nah, fuck that, I'd honestly be petty enough to write my own Tweet to completely rebutt his statement, saying that's his opinion and the reality is that it's left up to player interpretation, because THAT'S THE POINT. (Not to mention the fact that what the Fireflies were even trying to do was catagorically short-sighted at best and fucking stupid at worst. In all realms of Science, their "plan" was incredibly fucking risky, needlessly so I might add and they could've ended up dooming the one chance they actually have BY killing Ellie in the process. Niel "confirming" what he did completely removes all of that nuance as well and just makes the Fireflies seem like completely just, benevolent geniuses, which even FURTHER removes them from any moral ambiguity they could've previously had in the player's minds and hilariously, makes the treatment of Joel at the hospital scene when he wakes up seem even more out of place than it already was.) I have so many gripes with that whole "confirmation", if it wasn't glaringly obvious and so I thank you so much for both bringing it up and voicing why it's so fucking stupid to even attempt to do as such, because it's been rent free in my head ever since I seen it. Just so stupid! On another note: this video was brilliant and I really love your analysis here and your thoughts on how the hospital section was handled. As someone who played TLoU on release, back on the PS3 and oncemore when the PS4 was released, my memory was a bit foggy on the exact framing of how everything plays out - it's been a while. Your guide through the scenarios in the game/explainations were (as always) clear and consise and put me right back behind the controller in my head; a great refresher! I'm also absolutely convinced you're spot on about the ending. I remember always being conflicted and kinda being all straight faced on subsequent content, not really disliking or greatly liking it either, never feeling too strongly one way or another, but I realise a lot of that now is because I've been subconsciously hung up on how the last section of the first game never REALLY sat right with me and never really understanding why. Like, emotionally, it's there, but something always itched away at my brain somewhere and I think this video not only scratched said itch, but completely removed it. *This is an extremely long-winded way of saying this was (another) fucking solid video Mert! Glad I stayed up until 6am, insomnia riddled to watch every second of it! Look forward to the next one as always! Who knows? Maybe Niel being put on blast again for his grave writer's sin will allow me to sleep soundly!*
I have a very personal view of TLOU2. I mostly ignore Neil's whole deal cause I find him to be infuriating but I did find Ellie's journey through revenge an interesting character analysis, like I think that going through the journey is less about "violence bad" but more about Ellie learning about what made Joel like that. Like I personally see it as a journey through her loss and through the trauma of seeing someone you love killed and the hopelessness of not being able to do any about it. I also find that making Ellie just as morally grey as Joel was to be an interesting deal, like someone who we love can also do deeply violent and cruel things. I dont know, maybe its a bit of bias on my end, I actually do like Abby and Lev, even if their main plot is grossly done (lev's mostly)
I wanted to write a comment about my love for TLOU2 but you did it a lot better than I ever could, I too really enjoy the story from BOTH perspectives which is very different from most people, I grew to care for Abby and understand her struggles as well, the game makes it almost impossible to love Ellie wholeheartedly anymore because of how many chances she gets to walk away and live her life... she just can't do it till it's too late and it's frustratingly heartbreaking 😭 TLOU2 is my favourite game ever made personally, I can understand why people don't like it though even if it hurts my soul 🥲💀
This is exactly how I read TLoU2 as well. I played it in the months after dealing with my grandfather’s death and the whole thing felt like it was about dealing with the anger of grief.
@@MertKayKaygruff traumatized man finds self actualization through parenting a snarky teenage girl. The Witcher and TLOU know exactly what the people need
29:52 This actually isn't Ellies first kill! Her first kill was an infected woman, and her second kill was her infected best friend :) Though, in TLOU2, she does talk about this (the guy in the hotel) as her first kill.
I really like how detailed and thorough this video is! And I also love how you addressed the Israel/WLF/Palestine/Seraphites issue, Neil adding "facts" to the game OUTSIDE of the game, and Bruce's strained relationship with the company. I think these points are rarely discussed in other video essays. I agree with most, if not all, your points. The only thing I'm not 100% on board with is Joel being "bad" mainly bc "bad" seems to be quite subjective to everyone at this point in time. He CAN be an asshole and he IS an asshole from time to time but I wouldn't categorize him as a bad person especially when we ALL have been assholes at some point in time due to certain circumstances. The mere fact that he's capable of genuine self-reflection, realizing his mistakes, and making amends w people makes me believe that he's not "bad".
I have been arguing since my very first playthrough of TLOU that the vaccine matters exponentially less than the fact that this story is about the kind of love that you would burn the world down to save. I think TLOU2 was trying to convey that in a revenge story, as well, but failed to execute the same level of careful story-telling that paints the player's actions as a necessity. Pair that with expecting players to get invested in the growth of a character who starts the game doing something unforgivable, and well-fleshed our characters behaving inconsistently with what we know about them, and you get a very flawed game that is difficult to enjoy.
Very funny that people continue to conspicuously ignore that TLoU2 was co-written by someone, her name is Halley Gross and she talked at length about it in the Naughty Dog documentary about the making of the game.
Which is ironic. Part 1 had one writer. Of course Bruce S. was greatly involved in the making of the story, but it had one credited writer. Part 2 not only had even more directors but it also had two writers. I feel people lie and say Druckmenn went “solo” so they can pretend it was all his misguided ideas and not a collaborate effort by a team.
I feel like for a lot of players, the final segment of TLOU is the closest they get to experience following a truly grey character they actually relate to, which is why their first instinct is to either disown the character to create separation with the self, writing Joel off as fully evil in his actions, or to somehow rob the situation of its complexities to make it a justified choice. Interestingly enough, something similar happened with this new indie darling: Mouthwashing. Though I don't want to go into detail and risk spoiling it for people who haven't played it.
2 things I noticed as well: at the beginning of the game, he is more hesitant to shoot jimmy and tries warning him a couple times instead of shooting randomly. Also, when henry is pointing the gun at joel, he actually looks like hes afraid to lose his life (in a sense losing his purpose- protecting ellie)
The hardest easteregg I found while playing TLoU that not a single gamerrant list has ever pointed out is that the game is on. It is so difficult to actually notice this little detail while playing the game yet it stares at us during the whole campaign and even more! I've never seen such details in any other video games I've played
interesting you didnt like the live action bill. i can understand it, because he is not the same person as in the game. i personally like the episode. and there are 2 different versions for me where i can like both. i was more disappointed about the city. it was just few houses with traps outside the fence, but inside it was not like done. i would love to see a city with a lot of hidden traps between the alleys.
Back after finishing watching the whole video: I think the 2nd game wasn't about saying VIOLENCE IS BAD: in that world violence is NECESSARY. To protect yourself, the people you care about, your community. But the thing is how much is enough? How much is justified? I don't think the game wanted to give answers to these questions, but make us think about them... The other thing is we never usually get to play as a "bad person", and any bad thing we do is supposed to be justified...it was interesting to see the yeah, the people we love can hurt other people and make mistakes, and we can do that too... We can be the villain in someone else's life and not even question our actions because we think we are "right". Game is not perfect in any way, shape or form but me, personally, thought that was something completely different than "violence is bad, ok?"
It’s been a while since I’ve finished last of us pt1 again and after watching not even the first 20 minutes of this video, it’s totally helped me come to terms with why the TLOU2 felt contrived. So much of the 2nd game is calling in Joel’s choice into question - with a lot of the conversation being around joel robbing Ellie of her autonomy. Yet, the firefly’s did the exact same thing. Joel and Ellie never got to talk about it beforehand, which I would have argued made it easier to question Joel’s decision at the end. Whereas the firefly’s never really gave us a reason to believe in them; as all we’ve seen was them being incompetent, beating joel whilst he was performing CPR, anesthetizing ellie against her consent, treating Joel at gun point to leave whilst talking down to him, etc. The world also didn’t do a great job of showing us that it’s worth saving. We see cruelty and ruthlessness at every corner of the games world, and there’s no indication that human society would ever be able to return to what it once was, cure or no cure. Great stuff, love the work you do
So I didn't play the last of us at release, but for some reason I misremembered a synopsis of the plot and I kept thinking that the ending was that Ellie killed Joel after what he did to the fireflies. So for a while I was really confuse why people were so pissed that he died in part 2.
Bill's episode in the show was my favorite which I think is quite telling, as it was essentially a stand-alone story almost completely detached from the main plot, and not long after I lost interests in the show itself lmao
like I get that Bill is much better utilized in the game, it's what he was made to be, but I think I just like that type of story that his episode in the show was, alot better than the story the show or even this game is telling. it's just a matter of personal preference rly but yeah being given a taste of something I like better and knowing it wouldn't appear again in the show, it kinda turned me off the whole thing :/
One thing the show did that I'm sure was on purpose is that they made it so that people are hunting Henry because he betrayed them for a cure which he got by ratting out their leader to the fireflies. Thus showing us that the fireflies don't necessarily use what they've got to help people, they often use their resources as bargaining chips to gain more power.
It's surprisingly sparse and only noticable when you consider the game as a metatextual reference and deeplore examined through a post-modern, post-media, post-marxist lense but my Gamerants detail you may have missed is this game is actually a take on the obscure horror subgenre of "zombie apocalypses."
I have historically been the biggest TLOU2 defender. I have been in the TRENCHES defending that game, but I have to admit, a huge portion of it was because of the "anti-sjw/anti-woke" backlash it received. Even to this day I'm still almost reactionarily defensive of the game, but your video has opened my eyes some to a lot of its major flaws.
Totally! It was so annoying to see the game brigaded by alt right weirdos. I love how TLOU2 plays but yeah I didn't enjoy the story - and the cultural war waged over it prevented any constructive discussion! Thanks for watching
That comment is spot on. I had a lot to criticize about that game, but I always had to distance my self from alt right grifters in order to do so and it was incredibly frustrating.
What a coincidence you put out this video literally like a day after I randomly decided to replay it. The game's story and characters have really stuck with me ever since I watched a playthrough of it back when it came out (I didn't have a PS3, but also I was way too young to be playing a game like that at the time anyway). Still an all-time favorite of mine to this day.
I watched a playthrough too! I was an xbox/Nintendo kid so assumed I'd never get to play it. I'm glad we both got the chance to give this game a proper whirl because it is fantastic
The remaster of Ellie is such a bummer. They had to make her more similar to the Ellie of TLOU2, but that way they kind of removed the original Ellie, if that makes sense.
Didnt realise how much I needed someone to fairly criticise TLOU2 and Druckmann until now honestly... TLOU2 sucked, but all discourse around was poisoned by the stupid "Urhm 🤓☝️ how can woman have muscle! Woman cut sandwich not limbs ☝️" crowd. Going into TLOU2 I thought I'd love it as "revenge as cautionary tale" is one of my favourite story themes (ie, Medea's slaying of her kids) but the way it was presented in TLOU2 was so...weird?? It didnt feel anti revenge, it felt anti retaliation. Finding out Neil's dogshit views on Palestine morbidly explains his "violence is always bad, even if its against someone who mercilessly victimised you" views exactly. But, more relevant to the bulk of this video, despite The Last of Us being analysed to hell and back by everyone and their mom, I actually found this to be a unique analysis of it!! It didn't feel like it treaded old ground, It offered quite a few new takes on a game I've heard been dissected dozens of times. It always shocks me how you're able to dissect media In ways that make me re-consider my, what I believed were steadfast views on it....Another Mertkaykay banger!! Screenrant could never.
Thanks so much nohetero 😭 I was very worried about retreading other analysis so I'm really glad you found this unique. As always thank you for watching
Wow, I was not ready to have my view on this game and it's ending shaken up like this. The level of analysis here is the best I've seen in a video essay in a long while. I'll definitely have to check out your other videos.
I and my family have adored this game for years, with my siblings and i dressing up as ellie and some infected and my father dressing as joel for comiccon in 2014, and to the point my younger sibling named themself after a character in the second game. Despite being self proclaimed experts on the game, you have so so many insights that we maybe considered but never fully explored, and you have made me fall in love with this game all over again
Of all the emotional moments in this game, the one that always makes me cry is when Sam tries to take that toy. I even teared up watching the scene in this video. The forced loss of innocence (is it a loss if he never was allowed to have it?) just gets to me like nothing else. This was a great essay, I'd love to see more videogame analyses from you!
It’s kinda funny to consider how many overlaps there are between Joel and Kratos, as men who damn their worlds in the face of loss. I find it kinda interesting how that series is both a lot less afraid to condemn its protagonist directly, but also has him grapple with the responsibility of his actions and work towards a form of redemption. Makes you wonder what TLOU2 would have looked like if they weren’t afraid to actually take a stance on Joel’s actions.
actually gasped with glee when i saw this video come up in my feed. after the brutal takedown of part 2, i never thought this video would come, and i am so glad you made it. at the same time, TLOU is my favorite game of all time, having irrecoverably altered my brain chemistry from watching Markiplier's playthrough at a young age. let's see if this video makes me get my moth tattoo lasered off.
Man, I can't really judge the people in TLOU just due to how shitty and bleak that world is. Like, Joel legit terrifies the shit out of me, so imagine how fucking hopeless I felt in the David/Ellie chapter. I would have pulled a Henry almost immediately out of a sense of despair, I ain't built for this.
My biggest gripe with TLOU, as it evolved in this transmedia franchise… is that it evolved at all. The simple fact that Ellie is infected makes it impossible for me to buy into the idea of a sequel where she can have a family and not infect another person through consensual/non-consensual relationship. It’s like carrying an Alien but not giving birth. Who knows if an embryo can spread through kissing. As much as it is capable of giving fantastic character interactions, I no longer can buy in into the idea that their world can or needs to be saved. The intro is literally fantastic. For me, the game just went downhill and I played it 11 years ago on PS3. And my favorite moment was when Ellie gave the photo to Joel, if the player chooses to get it from Ellie… It’s a small moment, but it was effective! I’ve not replayed it since.
I always look forward to your videos, you have such an amazing way of looking at media,. whenever you post i know im about to be sat rewatching all your videos for at least a couple hours 😂
Excellent video. watching all these important, character defining moments back to back with the music tracks you chose brought tears to my eyes. I had forgotten how emotional this game made me. Fun fact. In the original version of the game, when Tess demands to know why Ellie's medical status said that she was infected, she actually didn't point her gun at her. The voice acting is the same throughout both versions, so the tone implies the threat, but she didn't actually aim the gun at her. It seems small, but this seemingly little change in character action informs us that Tess knew she was in control even without needing to hold a gun to a child's face. It somehow comes off as more badass to me, like she's in control in this situation both without needing to draw her gun, and it showcased her ability to remain calm in a seemingly bad situation. The gun being aimed just feels a bit much for me, personally. I don't know what you'd think about it though. Maybe it's whatever. Edit: She sorta moves the gun forward, but doesn't aim it directly in Ellie's face like she does in the Remake. Again, it's a small detail, but I think it's one worth discussing since it shows how in control Tess is at all times.
This was really fun to listen to!! Thank you! Would absolutely love to see a similar analysis of red dead redemption 2's Arthur or others if you are looking for similar topics on grey characters.
I’m with you girl. I spent all last week, not just wearing 2 hoodies, but also 2 pairs of bottoms. The only clothing recommendation I would ever consider making is these super warm leggings I got from primark. They were about £7 and look like regular black leggings but have the softest thickest fur on the inside. I know this sounds like it could be horrible but it’s super soft and comfortable, even after a bunch of washes. Seriously, if you live in the UK and have a cold house I can’t recommend enough. I’m going back for more on Friday. I was walking my dog in them at 3am in the snow (she’s old and mental) And you can wear them under something else if you’re super nesh. They were by the tills. Seriously.
I cried while playing a few games: Journey, Night in the Woods, Silent Hill 2, Telltale 's The Walking Dead... But at the end of The Last of Us part 2, with the credits rolling and "Beyond Desolation" playing, I was bawling like a 2 year old... I had to drink a double whiskey, no ice, to settle the f down.... No other game traumatized me like that. I accept it is not perfect and the pacing is weird sometimes but when it does it right, which is most of the game, it's a steel punch to the guts..
Your videos are so much fun, and you always bring up such great points that i never consider. i’m so happy you did a video on this game, it’s one of my favorites! i’m glad i’m not the only one that felt like TLOU1 & 2 try to pick sides a little too much, like trying to get us to side with Joel and hate the Seraphites.
i also feel like TLOU2 leaned way too hard into trying to make us dislike Ellie, to the point where she is a downright villain instead of morally gray. i feel like it’s weird to try to make us hate her as if she doesn’t have a good incentive to get revenge, even if it isn’t morally right. i also hated how they compared Ellie to a canniballistic predator, thanks for bringing that up.
Great video essay. About the FF, I subscribe to the belief that you have to assume they would have been successful, for TLOU1 and TLOU2 to work. That’s just IMO, but Joel expressly tells Tommy in TLOU2 opening that “and they were going to make a cure”. He doesn’t question their ability either. Just tells Marlene “Find someone ELSE”. TLOU1 the original had grimey looking surgical suite. On TLOU2 and TLOU1R, it got retconned into a very clean and orderly place.
I think tess knows about sarah because she says 'i get it' after her justifying why they should keep going despite finding out she is infected after joel says "do i need to remind you what is out there"
Neil's comment is similar to Ridley's answer regarding Blade Runner. BR's biggest "mystery" is "Is Rick Deckard a Replicant?" Is he able to track them down so efficiently because he is a replicant? Ridley Scott dropping out of nowhere that "Rick Deckard is a Replicant" hurts the movie more than anything. The question mattered, not the answer; the lack of an answer was important to invite people to think. Fun Fact: Ellie from The Last Of Us Part 2 is none other than Ellie from The Last Of Us Part 1 but older!
the hidden detail that I noticed is that if you think about it, the story of the last of us could fit reasonably well into the zombie apocalypse genre! Also you can see giraffes at one point if you look close enough 🤯
Having to watch this in little chunks bc TLOU's emotional moments still hit me like a ton of bricks, goddamnit this game😭😭😭😭😭😭😭 (great video so far tho, really enjoying it)
WHOA I DIDNT GET THE NOTIFICATION FOR THIS, I just finished an absolute monster of a paper and I’m beyond ready to tune into an enormous video essay let’s goooooo 🖤🖤
TLOU and Walking Dead Season 1 were how far you'd be willing to go to save your child. TLOU2 was a reaction and reflection on how these actions cause ripples and repeat cycles that even the best people struggle to break.
I'd love to see your analysis of the TV Show. I thought it exacerbated everything that's wrong with Druckmann's writing and created something so devoid of nuance and gradation and pacing, it was really a horrible watch.
Favorite char is also Bill (Dan Dority from Deadwood). Two more Deadwood references in TLOU1R - (1) Ellie’s optional shirt skin; (2) canned peaches with Sam. The last one could not have been coincidental. I’d like to think Druckman is a Deadwood fan, the building up of Jackson mirrors it.
Love your take on the show. They try to make Joel the “good guy” with emotional issues in the show, spazzing out like Tony Soprano. Most importantly, not enough time spent with Joel/Ellie, not enough combat. Trying to make drama where it takes away from their relationship (Too much Sarah, Kathleen, Frank). The Jackson episode must be so confusing to non-gamers. And the first season did not earn the payoff “ok” ending, simply doesn’t resonate like the game.
I fully believed that Ellie was *not* the first immune person the fireflies had access to. I thought it was a twist at the end that Ellie wasnt the first immune like wveryone thought she was, guess thays egg on my face for assuming "the other cases" meant other immune.
I just wanted to say that I loved this video so much, I almost cried multiple times but that’s just the the last of us effect! Now being serious, your analysis was beautiful and I think right on point. About TLOU 2 I was a little sad because yes part of the writing is a little.. something, in some parts at least, but taken that the game is great as a game (TLOU 1 already was) I think the story is very beautiful as it is, we are reintroduced to a Ellie/Joel dynamic again but with people that we initially disliked (Abby at least) making it a little interesting because we get to have different points of view and is up to us to decide if Ellie’s actions or abby’s are valid, grey or plainly wrong. I think it does that really well and gives us a new perspective on the characters as people. But overall yeah sometimes are quite a miss! Again I loved this essay wholeheartedly:) 💖
The canned peaches scene is 10x better than the schlock they gave us in the TV show, wasting precious 2 episodes on Karen Kathleen (at least we get Tommy’s VA too - looks like a grizzled Rick Grimes)
i like that they went deeper into bills character and his relationship with frank in the show. however , they used all of bills time showing their relationship and not who he is aside from that
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Fun fact: Joel had a daughter before meeting Ellie. This was implied at the start of the game.
This one might be my favourite
Fun fact: It is implied that some enemies in the game are actually zombies
Fun fact. Ellie might be a lesbian. This is implied when she makes out with a lesbian
Fun fact you might have missed: Bill is not only a dark reflection of Joel's standoffishness, Bill is also short for "William"
Oh my god I was sitting here trying to make the connection when I realised I've been bamboozled again
@@MertKayKayi thought they were trying to imply a meaning between bill and ellie’s last name and then i realized it’s just game rant 😭
Fun Fact: In TLOU2, you can jump. This is a reference to the "Mario" franchise.
Yours is the first video essay I’ve seen mention her age as a factor to her consent, which I appreciate. People never seem to take into consideration that even if she had been asked, she wouldn’t have been in a place to properly consent to such a drastic measure
On top of that, she’s also ‘under duress’. Even if she could consent, she’s arguably being made to make a decision while under psychological stress that almost coerces her into the decision. Should she be in her 20s, she has more autonomy and critical thinking capacity for making that decision, but still under the influence of the suffocating circumstances she finds herself living in.
Its the apocalypse rules & laws are no longer in effect. Thats also stupid af. If someone wants to die in a world where u could very easily be grabbed up & made a slave, raped for years, cannibalized, or brutally ripped apart by infected or all of the above together! U have zero right to take away someones choice to die peacefully in this new world. Yall weird af.
I feel like in that universe though a lot of kids have to grow up and in general in that type of universe choosing to want to live or not shouldn’t be controversial because it is a hard terrible world and if someone doesn’t want to keep going that’s understandable, Ellie may be young but she and a lot of others her age are forced to understand heavy things like this. I get the age thing completely but I feel like you have to tie in the context of the universe (I haven’t watched the video yet just scrolling through comments lol)
@@mandywardrop7279 I disagree with this argument. Even if she's gone through a lot, she's still a child and still has less life experience than someone Joel or Marlene's age, and they're using that life experience against her.
@@AngelofGrace96"i disagree because I disagree"
From a practical scientific standpoint, killing Ellie is actually a very stupid thing to do. Given the nature of her immunity, it's not at all clear that you could synthesize a "vaccine" that would have the same effect. She's infected. Her body just doesn't respond to the fungus the same way. They have no real idea of why she works the way she works, and killing her would cut off their access to additional tissue and a study subject if their initial guess is wrong.
If the useful thing turned out to be in her blood, bone marrow, or living tissue -- they'd be putting a clock and a hard limit on their ability to use it for any purpose. It's bad ethics and it's bad science.
Me hijacking any TLOU discussion to suggest an anti fungal
On top of that, there is no logistic system to get the vaccine out to people in need, would the fireflys even supply to people who work with/support the military that they are actively attacking?
It’s meant to be ambiguous. Either party saying it 100% would or wouldn’t work is wrong.
@@DonnieDaise Sure, I can't say 100% it wouldn't work, but it pretty nearly 100% wouldn't work. And there are less permanent and invasive methods that are (at least collectively) more likely to work that haven't even been attempted. So why on earth would you jump to the thing that prevents you from trying anything else?
It's just pragmatism. If you're filming a movie and you need to shoot a lot of scenes in a car, and in one of those scenes you blow the car up, you shoot that scene when you're sure you have all the other footage you're going to need.
@@MertKayKay YOU AREN'T WRONG THOUGH. Also there is currently *no* vaccine of any kind that is approved to fight or treat a fungal infection. So what are the odds that some scrappy underfunded randos in an old university hospital are going to figure it out on their first attempt? Also, one of the ONLY promising fungal vaccine candidates uses monoclonal antibodies, for which you absolutely do not need or WANT a dead human source.
If they'd managed to formulate a vaccine for ant cordiceps or monkey cordiceps using the same technique then perhaps this would be a legitimately balanced choice. But as it is, even if Joel hadn't cared about Ellie, he would have been right to get her out of there. The IRB never would have approved this mess.
On the point about sparing NPCs, I'll note that during the firefly hospital section, I did actually manage to spare one NPC and the dude ran for dear life. It was quite shocking tbh because most times I wait for the NPCs to get back up and proceed to kick their heads in the second they raise any weapon at me ( I had a thing for justifying my kills in games back then ). Till today, My brother chalks it up to being a glitch but I honestly like to think the mechanic was probably accounted for.
I think that is a thing that can happen in The Last of Us. I remember playing the original ps3 game back in 2013, can't recall what level it was but it wasn't the finale, it was outside and during the day. An enemy begged for his life and when I lowered my gun he ran away and escaped. It was surprising because that sort of thing was very unexpected, especially back then. I was actually disappointed that mechanic didn't seem to return in part II.
@@katefrost8500 I frigging knew it, the problem now is knowing how to trigger it. I don't know if it happens because you consistently give people a chance or because a random variable in the games code that only rarely occurs.
Therapist: the absolut unit MertKayKay doesn't exists, she can't hurt you
MerrKayKay with two jumpers:
I recorded the WHOLE THING and then watched the footage back and thought: Oh no.
@@MertKayKay Hey, we're here for the critical thought and entertainment, not the fashion! Although you might start a trend...
Some of your videos have genuinely changed the way i view many things. Cant wait to have my view of TLOS shattered and rebuilt
I haven't even played the game but the show fucked me up and I can't wait to think new thoughts about it
Damn that's high praise, thank you!
@@MertKayKayNo like seriously. I have a completely different way of thinking about James Sunderland now. Thank you
It would've been even worse if the fireflies had intended to breed Ellie to see if it was something genetically inheritable. That would've had higher success rate in terms of finding a vaccine since they'd have multiple subjects, assuming it was something genetic. But would've been extremely messed up.
Who's to say they wouldn't harvest her eggs and use multiple women to do so? 👀
Yeah, take some of her eggs and do ivf on numerous other women. Then, you dont need to wait 9 months per kid.
The issue is then that they may have to wait for the baby to mature to a similar age to Ellie before the immunity kicks in.
For that matter, Ellie might not even be genetically immune. It might just be the fungus that evolved to not degenerate the human mind. So, take some spores from her and infect some people first. There are so many steps to do before just killing her, even if we want to be pragmatic and kold hearted.
Emotionally, the ending hits hard. But with the introduction of the sequel were we are told that they 100% would be able to make a cure from sacrificing their only immune patient. It just doesn't make sense.
To be fair to the show, their version of Joel is much less of a closed off prick than game Joel. I think Bill's character in the show was changed in a way that made sense and that pushed Joel to make the decision to save Ellie in the end instead of being a dark reflection of Joel. I think that's a pretty neat way to change Bill's story and still give him an important role in Joel's development as a character.
I think because of the character development we see when playing along side bill in the game, it would be hard to translate that gameplay into something interesting to watch on screen. I like the tv adaptation because it felt natural. It felt like they had played the game and wanted to do it justice. Bill was a hard dude who lost the only person he ever slightly gave a shit about, but the show adds value to the relationship we see in the game. I like that. Leaves less ambiguity about their relationship than in the game.
I'll quote one other TH-camr, who also talked about Fireflies' morality: "You're okay with playing Unit 731, but disrespecting someone's sexuality is out of the question for you?!"
if nothing else, i think its very telling how so many GamersTM conflated a "protagonist" with a "hero" and just can't cope with it. Like, is media literacy really this low? The hysteria over what happened to Joel couldn't have been more 'bro do you even nuance?'
Which is made worse by the fact that TLOU/2 isn't even that deep. Its pretty basic though dramatic, stuff.
Thing is they succeeded in making people care about them then proceeded to undermine that. It’s a case of story retardation.
@Satya Hahaha! You see it a lot in Shonen anime especially, where the protagonist -> the Chosen One, and their actions are always morally just. It's why people have such an issue with Eren Jaeger being criticised (for example).
@@MertKayKay shoutout to FDSignifiers videos and his beef with Eren and his 'fans'
@@shenotski Caring about a character can't be undermined. If you care, you care. Just because you don't like what happened to them doesn't mean you stop caring, and that you're upset about what happened to the character so much, rather proves the games did a good job.
Just because you can't move on, doesn't mean you get to say it was poor writing. Writers are under no obligation to give you exactly what you want. Such is life. And indeed letting go and moving on is rather the point of TLOU2. Let Joel go :P he wasn't a hero, or a good guy and liked him though many did, acceptance is your only option.
I do not like TLOU, at all. I do very much like this 2 hour video essay on TLOU though. Good work Mert.
Neil Druckmann for ScreenRant, "Things you might have missed in The Last of Us Part II"
1. Violence is bad, actually
2. Its kinda fun to play though, huh?
The relentless roasting of sites like ScreenRant's incredibly keen and thought-provoking game journalism was just a lovely sprinkling on top of this delicious video-essay sundae :)
After every jab, I thought, "no way is that going to work again", and then it would lmao
I had to put my phone down after you showed the Ellie killing whatever that stupid rapist's name was and Joel calling her baby girl. Like what. How am I supposed to go on after that?? It gets me every time
I cry like a baby
I once watched a video essay (can't find it again) that made the point mainstream Hollywood movies can't have a truly grey protagonist or actual moral question. It kinda explains The Last of Us’ ending.
I think Tess was definitely referencing at least partly the romantic tension between her and Joel. The two were very flirty, and while that is totally fine among BFFs, I always saw the two as having a romantic tension neither wanted to really discuss or commit to.
Some people believe theyve slept together and that they denied any romantic feelings and it fits joels persona admittedly
Personally, I think a big part of why I struggled with TLOU2 was because it came out during lockdown here in Australia and unlike the first game, where it felt like even though the world you are playing in is depressing and sad, you're working towards something good, something hopeful, in the second game you're working towards something bleak and exhausting, and the real world was already bleak and exhausting. It felt like a slog to get through. I left the game feeling like shit.
That's such a good point! It was a bleak game at a bleak time
Babe wake up a new MertKay essay on something that lets me see a new perspective on stuff I already love to see if I can love it more and/or see if I can become more critical on the stuff I enjoy while also noticing stuff I haven't thought before just dropped (and just in time to be BG noise for doing art for a final)
Niel's "confirmations" of Ellie's surgery might be one of the most frustrating things I've ever seen a writer do, alongside J.K. Rowling and her Twitter ramblings on Harry Potter. It's completely unnecessary and moreover completely destroys the entire point the game was trying to get across and if I was part of the writing staff for the first game alongside him, I'd be absolutely PISSED that he said that. Nah, fuck that, I'd honestly be petty enough to write my own Tweet to completely rebutt his statement, saying that's his opinion and the reality is that it's left up to player interpretation, because THAT'S THE POINT.
(Not to mention the fact that what the Fireflies were even trying to do was catagorically short-sighted at best and fucking stupid at worst. In all realms of Science, their "plan" was incredibly fucking risky, needlessly so I might add and they could've ended up dooming the one chance they actually have BY killing Ellie in the process. Niel "confirming" what he did completely removes all of that nuance as well and just makes the Fireflies seem like completely just, benevolent geniuses, which even FURTHER removes them from any moral ambiguity they could've previously had in the player's minds and hilariously, makes the treatment of Joel at the hospital scene when he wakes up seem even more out of place than it already was.)
I have so many gripes with that whole "confirmation", if it wasn't glaringly obvious and so I thank you so much for both bringing it up and voicing why it's so fucking stupid to even attempt to do as such, because it's been rent free in my head ever since I seen it. Just so stupid!
On another note: this video was brilliant and I really love your analysis here and your thoughts on how the hospital section was handled. As someone who played TLoU on release, back on the PS3 and oncemore when the PS4 was released, my memory was a bit foggy on the exact framing of how everything plays out - it's been a while. Your guide through the scenarios in the game/explainations were (as always) clear and consise and put me right back behind the controller in my head; a great refresher! I'm also absolutely convinced you're spot on about the ending. I remember always being conflicted and kinda being all straight faced on subsequent content, not really disliking or greatly liking it either, never feeling too strongly one way or another, but I realise a lot of that now is because I've been subconsciously hung up on how the last section of the first game never REALLY sat right with me and never really understanding why. Like, emotionally, it's there, but something always itched away at my brain somewhere and I think this video not only scratched said itch, but completely removed it.
*This is an extremely long-winded way of saying this was (another) fucking solid video Mert! Glad I stayed up until 6am, insomnia riddled to watch every second of it! Look forward to the next one as always! Who knows? Maybe Niel being put on blast again for his grave writer's sin will allow me to sleep soundly!*
I have a very personal view of TLOU2. I mostly ignore Neil's whole deal cause I find him to be infuriating but I did find Ellie's journey through revenge an interesting character analysis, like I think that going through the journey is less about "violence bad" but more about Ellie learning about what made Joel like that. Like I personally see it as a journey through her loss and through the trauma of seeing someone you love killed and the hopelessness of not being able to do any about it. I also find that making Ellie just as morally grey as Joel was to be an interesting deal, like someone who we love can also do deeply violent and cruel things. I dont know, maybe its a bit of bias on my end, I actually do like Abby and Lev, even if their main plot is grossly done (lev's mostly)
Damn Tardis, that's a reading I never considered. Really well framed. Thanks for sharing
I wanted to write a comment about my love for TLOU2 but you did it a lot better than I ever could, I too really enjoy the story from BOTH perspectives which is very different from most people, I grew to care for Abby and understand her struggles as well, the game makes it almost impossible to love Ellie wholeheartedly anymore because of how many chances she gets to walk away and live her life... she just can't do it till it's too late and it's frustratingly heartbreaking 😭 TLOU2 is my favourite game ever made personally, I can understand why people don't like it though even if it hurts my soul 🥲💀
This is exactly how I read TLoU2 as well. I played it in the months after dealing with my grandfather’s death and the whole thing felt like it was about dealing with the anger of grief.
I thought I saw the isreal/palestine parallels in LoU 2, thanks for confirming that I wasn’t overthinking it lol.
I haven’t even played this game and I’m tearing up at Ellie giving Joel the photo…
omg I sob THE WHOLE WAY THROUGH THIS GAME
@@MertKayKaygruff traumatized man finds self actualization through parenting a snarky teenage girl. The Witcher and TLOU know exactly what the people need
Free Palestine.
I never expected this to touch on Druckmann's writing and deeper involvement with the stories, thank you Mert
29:52
This actually isn't Ellies first kill!
Her first kill was an infected woman, and her second kill was her infected best friend :)
Though, in TLOU2, she does talk about this (the guy in the hotel) as her first kill.
I guess it's her first /human/ kill. I know it's debatable but maybe it felt like actually taking a life, as opposed to putting something down
it’s never stated whether or not she killed riley, as far i know.
I really like how detailed and thorough this video is! And I also love how you addressed the Israel/WLF/Palestine/Seraphites issue, Neil adding "facts" to the game OUTSIDE of the game, and Bruce's strained relationship with the company. I think these points are rarely discussed in other video essays.
I agree with most, if not all, your points. The only thing I'm not 100% on board with is Joel being "bad" mainly bc "bad" seems to be quite subjective to everyone at this point in time. He CAN be an asshole and he IS an asshole from time to time but I wouldn't categorize him as a bad person especially when we ALL have been assholes at some point in time due to certain circumstances. The mere fact that he's capable of genuine self-reflection, realizing his mistakes, and making amends w people makes me believe that he's not "bad".
Very true re: Joel being "bad" and what that means, especially in our context versus the context of the game! Good point.
I have been arguing since my very first playthrough of TLOU that the vaccine matters exponentially less than the fact that this story is about the kind of love that you would burn the world down to save. I think TLOU2 was trying to convey that in a revenge story, as well, but failed to execute the same level of careful story-telling that paints the player's actions as a necessity. Pair that with expecting players to get invested in the growth of a character who starts the game doing something unforgivable, and well-fleshed our characters behaving inconsistently with what we know about them, and you get a very flawed game that is difficult to enjoy.
Very funny that people continue to conspicuously ignore that TLoU2 was co-written by someone, her name is Halley Gross and she talked at length about it in the Naughty Dog documentary about the making of the game.
Which is ironic.
Part 1 had one writer. Of course Bruce S. was greatly involved in the making of the story, but it had one credited writer.
Part 2 not only had even more directors but it also had two writers.
I feel people lie and say Druckmenn went “solo” so they can pretend it was all his misguided ideas and not a collaborate effort by a team.
@@Indigo_1001 More so Druckman has taken over the company so her being the co-writer is his decision along with stealing Uncharted 4 from Amy Hennig.
@@shenotskiwhich highlights the themes of part 2 people ignore what they want if it doesnt fit their narrative...
I feel like for a lot of players, the final segment of TLOU is the closest they get to experience following a truly grey character they actually relate to, which is why their first instinct is to either disown the character to create separation with the self, writing Joel off as fully evil in his actions, or to somehow rob the situation of its complexities to make it a justified choice.
Interestingly enough, something similar happened with this new indie darling: Mouthwashing. Though I don't want to go into detail and risk spoiling it for people who haven't played it.
2 things I noticed as well: at the beginning of the game, he is more hesitant to shoot jimmy and tries warning him a couple times instead of shooting randomly. Also, when henry is pointing the gun at joel, he actually looks like hes afraid to lose his life (in a sense losing his purpose- protecting ellie)
A two hour mert video essay is just what I needed to have on while I sew today. I’ve truly been blessed
The hardest easteregg I found while playing TLoU that not a single gamerrant list has ever pointed out is that the game is on. It is so difficult to actually notice this little detail while playing the game yet it stares at us during the whole campaign and even more! I've never seen such details in any other video games I've played
interesting you didnt like the live action bill. i can understand it, because he is not the same person as in the game. i personally like the episode. and there are 2 different versions for me where i can like both. i was more disappointed about the city. it was just few houses with traps outside the fence, but inside it was not like done. i would love to see a city with a lot of hidden traps between the alleys.
Saying TLOU2's moral was "violence is bad" is like saying TLOU's moral was "FAMILY".
Vin Diesel would love TLOU
Back after finishing watching the whole video: I think the 2nd game wasn't about saying VIOLENCE IS BAD: in that world violence is NECESSARY. To protect yourself, the people you care about, your community. But the thing is how much is enough? How much is justified? I don't think the game wanted to give answers to these questions, but make us think about them... The other thing is we never usually get to play as a "bad person", and any bad thing we do is supposed to be justified...it was interesting to see the yeah, the people we love can hurt other people and make mistakes, and we can do that too... We can be the villain in someone else's life and not even question our actions because we think we are "right".
Game is not perfect in any way, shape or form but me, personally, thought that was something completely different than "violence is bad, ok?"
It’s been a while since I’ve finished last of us pt1 again and after watching not even the first 20 minutes of this video, it’s totally helped me come to terms with why the TLOU2 felt contrived. So much of the 2nd game is calling in Joel’s choice into question - with a lot of the conversation being around joel robbing Ellie of her autonomy. Yet, the firefly’s did the exact same thing. Joel and Ellie never got to talk about it beforehand, which I would have argued made it easier to question Joel’s decision at the end. Whereas the firefly’s never really gave us a reason to believe in them; as all we’ve seen was them being incompetent, beating joel whilst he was performing CPR, anesthetizing ellie against her consent, treating Joel at gun point to leave whilst talking down to him, etc. The world also didn’t do a great job of showing us that it’s worth saving. We see cruelty and ruthlessness at every corner of the games world, and there’s no indication that human society would ever be able to return to what it once was, cure or no cure.
Great stuff, love the work you do
Bro i moved to Australia and u still manage to upload as I’m going to bed??
Where in Australia? :o
@MertKayKay you know the earth? Look underneath it
@@ahumanbeingfromtheearth1502 she was asking where IN australia, not where it is on the map
@@MertKayKay Perth! Figured I’d leave u suckers to ur freezing winter, apologies
So I didn't play the last of us at release, but for some reason I misremembered a synopsis of the plot and I kept thinking that the ending was that Ellie killed Joel after what he did to the fireflies. So for a while I was really confuse why people were so pissed that he died in part 2.
Redem no more cheese before bed
Maybe you were confused by the ending of the first season of Walking Dead?
@@williamtimonen6814 That might be an explanation, but I'm pretty sure look into Telltale Walking dead way later
.
Bill's episode in the show was my favorite which I think is quite telling, as it was essentially a stand-alone story almost completely detached from the main plot, and not long after I lost interests in the show itself lmao
like I get that Bill is much better utilized in the game, it's what he was made to be, but I think I just like that type of story that his episode in the show was, alot better than the story the show or even this game is telling.
it's just a matter of personal preference rly
but yeah being given a taste of something I like better and knowing it wouldn't appear again in the show, it kinda turned me off the whole thing :/
One thing the show did that I'm sure was on purpose is that they made it so that people are hunting Henry because he betrayed them for a cure which he got by ratting out their leader to the fireflies. Thus showing us that the fireflies don't necessarily use what they've got to help people, they often use their resources as bargaining chips to gain more power.
It's surprisingly sparse and only noticable when you consider the game as a metatextual reference and deeplore examined through a post-modern, post-media, post-marxist lense but my Gamerants detail you may have missed is this game is actually a take on the obscure horror subgenre of "zombie apocalypses."
Haha you had me in the first line, I thought I was about to get absolutely schooled
I have historically been the biggest TLOU2 defender. I have been in the TRENCHES defending that game, but I have to admit, a huge portion of it was because of the "anti-sjw/anti-woke" backlash it received. Even to this day I'm still almost reactionarily defensive of the game, but your video has opened my eyes some to a lot of its major flaws.
Totally! It was so annoying to see the game brigaded by alt right weirdos. I love how TLOU2 plays but yeah I didn't enjoy the story - and the cultural war waged over it prevented any constructive discussion! Thanks for watching
That comment is spot on. I had a lot to criticize about that game, but I always had to distance my self from alt right grifters in order to do so and it was incredibly frustrating.
What a coincidence you put out this video literally like a day after I randomly decided to replay it. The game's story and characters have really stuck with me ever since I watched a playthrough of it back when it came out (I didn't have a PS3, but also I was way too young to be playing a game like that at the time anyway). Still an all-time favorite of mine to this day.
I watched a playthrough too! I was an xbox/Nintendo kid so assumed I'd never get to play it. I'm glad we both got the chance to give this game a proper whirl because it is fantastic
The remaster of Ellie is such a bummer. They had to make her more similar to the Ellie of TLOU2, but that way they kind of removed the original Ellie, if that makes sense.
An Easter Egg you missed is that the Cordyceps Virus isn’t a virus at all, but actually a fungal infection
Didnt realise how much I needed someone to fairly criticise TLOU2 and Druckmann until now honestly... TLOU2 sucked, but all discourse around was poisoned by the stupid "Urhm 🤓☝️ how can woman have muscle! Woman cut sandwich not limbs ☝️" crowd.
Going into TLOU2 I thought I'd love it as "revenge as cautionary tale" is one of my favourite story themes (ie, Medea's slaying of her kids) but the way it was presented in TLOU2 was so...weird?? It didnt feel anti revenge, it felt anti retaliation.
Finding out Neil's dogshit views on Palestine morbidly explains his "violence is always bad, even if its against someone who mercilessly victimised you" views exactly.
But, more relevant to the bulk of this video, despite The Last of Us being analysed to hell and back by everyone and their mom, I actually found this to be a unique analysis of it!! It didn't feel like it treaded old ground, It offered quite a few new takes on a game I've heard been dissected dozens of times.
It always shocks me how you're able to dissect media In ways that make me re-consider my, what I believed were steadfast views on it....Another Mertkaykay banger!! Screenrant could never.
Thanks so much nohetero 😭 I was very worried about retreading other analysis so I'm really glad you found this unique. As always thank you for watching
30 seconds into the second game, Ellie starts screaming “I’ll kill you”, and I figured out the ending right there.
One of the most unbiased and level minded analysis of media I have encountered. As always, a real pleasure following along your chain of thought.
Thank you!
Mertkaykay casually carrying the last 2 hours of my shift on her back
Wow, I was not ready to have my view on this game and it's ending shaken up like this. The level of analysis here is the best I've seen in a video essay in a long while. I'll definitely have to check out your other videos.
Wow, thank you Gibby!
I and my family have adored this game for years, with my siblings and i dressing up as ellie and some infected and my father dressing as joel for comiccon in 2014, and to the point my younger sibling named themself after a character in the second game. Despite being self proclaimed experts on the game, you have so so many insights that we maybe considered but never fully explored, and you have made me fall in love with this game all over again
Of all the emotional moments in this game, the one that always makes me cry is when Sam tries to take that toy. I even teared up watching the scene in this video. The forced loss of innocence (is it a loss if he never was allowed to have it?) just gets to me like nothing else.
This was a great essay, I'd love to see more videogame analyses from you!
It’s kinda funny to consider how many overlaps there are between Joel and Kratos, as men who damn their worlds in the face of loss. I find it kinda interesting how that series is both a lot less afraid to condemn its protagonist directly, but also has him grapple with the responsibility of his actions and work towards a form of redemption. Makes you wonder what TLOU2 would have looked like if they weren’t afraid to actually take a stance on Joel’s actions.
actually gasped with glee when i saw this video come up in my feed. after the brutal takedown of part 2, i never thought this video would come, and i am so glad you made it. at the same time, TLOU is my favorite game of all time, having irrecoverably altered my brain chemistry from watching Markiplier's playthrough at a young age. let's see if this video makes me get my moth tattoo lasered off.
Man, I can't really judge the people in TLOU just due to how shitty and bleak that world is. Like, Joel legit terrifies the shit out of me, so imagine how fucking hopeless I felt in the David/Ellie chapter.
I would have pulled a Henry almost immediately out of a sense of despair, I ain't built for this.
Perfect timing, I've nearly finished my Mertkk binge
My biggest gripe with TLOU, as it evolved in this transmedia franchise… is that it evolved at all. The simple fact that Ellie is infected makes it impossible for me to buy into the idea of a sequel where she can have a family and not infect another person through consensual/non-consensual relationship. It’s like carrying an Alien but not giving birth. Who knows if an embryo can spread through kissing.
As much as it is capable of giving fantastic character interactions, I no longer can buy in into the idea that their world can or needs to be saved. The intro is literally fantastic. For me, the game just went downhill and I played it 11 years ago on PS3. And my favorite moment was when Ellie gave the photo to Joel, if the player chooses to get it from Ellie… It’s a small moment, but it was effective!
I’ve not replayed it since.
I always look forward to your videos, you have such an amazing way of looking at media,. whenever you post i know im about to be sat rewatching all your videos for at least a couple hours 😂
Got me crying in the club rn (read: smiling on my bed) Arium, thank you
Your videos are always so detailed and amazing, i am thankful for them, can’t wait to tackle this one!!
:'( omg thank you
Excellent video. watching all these important, character defining moments back to back with the music tracks you chose brought tears to my eyes. I had forgotten how emotional this game made me.
Fun fact. In the original version of the game, when Tess demands to know why Ellie's medical status said that she was infected, she actually didn't point her gun at her. The voice acting is the same throughout both versions, so the tone implies the threat, but she didn't actually aim the gun at her. It seems small, but this seemingly little change in character action informs us that Tess knew she was in control even without needing to hold a gun to a child's face. It somehow comes off as more badass to me, like she's in control in this situation both without needing to draw her gun, and it showcased her ability to remain calm in a seemingly bad situation. The gun being aimed just feels a bit much for me, personally. I don't know what you'd think about it though. Maybe it's whatever.
Edit: She sorta moves the gun forward, but doesn't aim it directly in Ellie's face like she does in the Remake. Again, it's a small detail, but I think it's one worth discussing since it shows how in control Tess is at all times.
This was really fun to listen to!! Thank you! Would absolutely love to see a similar analysis of red dead redemption 2's Arthur or others if you are looking for similar topics on grey characters.
Interesting that you say that! I'm about to stream it blind for the first time, I'm super excited to play it
I’m with you girl. I spent all last week, not just wearing 2 hoodies, but also 2 pairs of bottoms. The only clothing recommendation I would ever consider making is these super warm leggings I got from primark. They were about £7 and look like regular black leggings but have the softest thickest fur on the inside. I know this sounds like it could be horrible but it’s super soft and comfortable, even after a bunch of washes. Seriously, if you live in the UK and have a cold house I can’t recommend enough. I’m going back for more on Friday. I was walking my dog in them at 3am in the snow (she’s old and mental) And you can wear them under something else if you’re super nesh. They were by the tills. Seriously.
I'm always happy to see new TLOU content, and this was great!
I cried while playing a few games: Journey, Night in the Woods, Silent Hill 2, Telltale 's The Walking Dead... But at the end of The Last of Us part 2, with the credits rolling and "Beyond Desolation" playing, I was bawling like a 2 year old... I had to drink a double whiskey, no ice, to settle the f down.... No other game traumatized me like that. I accept it is not perfect and the pacing is weird sometimes but when it does it right, which is most of the game, it's a steel punch to the guts..
Your videos are so much fun, and you always bring up such great points that i never consider. i’m so happy you did a video on this game, it’s one of my favorites! i’m glad i’m not the only one that felt like TLOU1 & 2 try to pick sides a little too much, like trying to get us to side with Joel and hate the Seraphites.
i also feel like TLOU2 leaned way too hard into trying to make us dislike Ellie, to the point where she is a downright villain instead of morally gray. i feel like it’s weird to try to make us hate her as if she doesn’t have a good incentive to get revenge, even if it isn’t morally right.
i also hated how they compared Ellie to a canniballistic predator, thanks for bringing that up.
My favorite Game Rant hidden detail is that TH-camr MertKayKay played the Last of Us.
Your videos are a joy to watch - always happy to see a new upload. Thanks.
Great video essay. About the FF, I subscribe to the belief that you have to assume they would have been successful, for TLOU1 and TLOU2 to work. That’s just IMO, but Joel expressly tells Tommy in TLOU2 opening that “and they were going to make a cure”. He doesn’t question their ability either. Just tells Marlene “Find someone ELSE”.
TLOU1 the original had grimey looking surgical suite. On TLOU2 and TLOU1R, it got retconned into a very clean and orderly place.
I think tess knows about sarah because she says 'i get it' after her justifying why they should keep going despite finding out she is infected after joel says "do i need to remind you what is out there"
Neil's comment is similar to Ridley's answer regarding Blade Runner. BR's biggest "mystery" is "Is Rick Deckard a Replicant?" Is he able to track them down so efficiently because he is a replicant? Ridley Scott dropping out of nowhere that "Rick Deckard is a Replicant" hurts the movie more than anything. The question mattered, not the answer; the lack of an answer was important to invite people to think.
Fun Fact: Ellie from The Last Of Us Part 2 is none other than Ellie from The Last Of Us Part 1 but older!
the hidden detail that I noticed is that if you think about it, the story of the last of us could fit reasonably well into the zombie apocalypse genre! Also you can see giraffes at one point if you look close enough 🤯
I watched yesterday during work, it made the day go by easier.
You are always an smart person to listen.
Aww thanks Jose!! Thanks as always
Having to watch this in little chunks bc TLOU's emotional moments still hit me like a ton of bricks, goddamnit this game😭😭😭😭😭😭😭 (great video so far tho, really enjoying it)
WHOA I DIDNT GET THE NOTIFICATION FOR THIS, I just finished an absolute monster of a paper and I’m beyond ready to tune into an enormous video essay let’s goooooo 🖤🖤
Hell yea, the perfect family video for Thanksgiving. TY Mert!
Also I think you missed the biggest thing. Ellie was going to be operated on in a hospital, implying she was going through surgery
mertkaykay post while im nervous before my drivers test yayyy
How did you do?
🥶 I've been doing the two jumpers thing a lot this year as well.
i'm a frozen unit rn :(
Qmazing video, very well thought out. Except one thing, the last of us 2 isn't "revenge bad" it's "forgiveness good"
sick headshots on those clips wow
I edited out all the times you whiffed because I didn't want them to think it was my footage, and I didn't want to get called a fake gamer :'(
amazing video. unrelated but i adore your hair. the blue streaks are so cute!
I'm just about to do a long drive for Thanksgiving, but I'll watch this as soon as I can!! :P
YESSSSSS MORE MERT CONTENT, WE THRIVE BECAUSE OF YOU
ARF ARF ARF ARF
WOOF WOOF WOOF WOOF
TLOU and Walking Dead Season 1 were how far you'd be willing to go to save your child.
TLOU2 was a reaction and reflection on how these actions cause ripples and repeat cycles that even the best people struggle to break.
Yess thank you for this movie length video I can't wait to watch it 👏
MertKayKay covering possibly my favourite game of all time.
I know what I’m doing with the next 2 hours of my life
I'd love to see your analysis of the TV Show. I thought it exacerbated everything that's wrong with Druckmann's writing and created something so devoid of nuance and gradation and pacing, it was really a horrible watch.
Favorite char is also Bill (Dan Dority from Deadwood). Two more Deadwood references in TLOU1R - (1) Ellie’s optional shirt skin; (2) canned peaches with Sam. The last one could not have been coincidental. I’d like to think Druckman is a Deadwood fan, the building up of Jackson mirrors it.
Also, Joel is just like Seth Bullock (impulsive, violent, stubborn), the “main character” of the ensemble show.
Speaking out my arse since I’m no dr., but why couldn’t they do a spinal tap or smth instead of jumping to “Igor bring me her brain!”?
Omg I'm so excited for your take on this lol. What a nice surprise to see in my recommendations.
Happy Thanksgiving from the US Mert!
-EE
Happy Thanksgiving EE! I'll drink a pot of gravy in your honour
@@MertKayKay as my American founding fathers intended!
@@MertKayKay ok so TLOU2 video when?
oh snap new MKK vid heck yeah buddy
Love your take on the show. They try to make Joel the “good guy” with emotional issues in the show, spazzing out like Tony Soprano. Most importantly, not enough time spent with Joel/Ellie, not enough combat. Trying to make drama where it takes away from their relationship (Too much Sarah, Kathleen, Frank).
The Jackson episode must be so confusing to non-gamers. And the first season did not earn the payoff “ok” ending, simply doesn’t resonate like the game.
I fully believed that Ellie was *not* the first immune person the fireflies had access to. I thought it was a twist at the end that Ellie wasnt the first immune like wveryone thought she was, guess thays egg on my face for assuming "the other cases" meant other immune.
I just wanted to say that I loved this video so much, I almost cried multiple times but that’s just the the last of us effect! Now being serious, your analysis was beautiful and I think right on point. About TLOU 2 I was a little sad because yes part of the writing is a little.. something, in some parts at least, but taken that the game is great as a game (TLOU 1 already was) I think the story is very beautiful as it is, we are reintroduced to a Ellie/Joel dynamic again but with people that we initially disliked (Abby at least) making it a little interesting because we get to have different points of view and is up to us to decide if Ellie’s actions or abby’s are valid, grey or plainly wrong. I think it does that really well and gives us a new perspective on the characters as people. But overall yeah sometimes are quite a miss! Again I loved this essay wholeheartedly:) 💖
Yipee new video from a fave youtuber!!
Aww thanks Sunny!!
Fun fact: Bill in the last of us is also Bill Williamson from RDR 2
He jumps universes
I just started mi shift at work so this is a god sent 😍
Have fun at work! :D
The canned peaches scene is 10x better than the schlock they gave us in the TV show, wasting precious 2 episodes on Karen Kathleen (at least we get Tommy’s VA too - looks like a grizzled Rick Grimes)
Im so excited!! Your uploads are the best. I always know it will be the most thought out analysis 😄👍
i like that they went deeper into bills character and his relationship with frank in the show. however , they used all of bills time showing their relationship and not who he is aside from that