The way to fix the dent is to remember what the guy who dented it looked like, and wait for the next Tewkesbury. Deal him a whopping great blow, and when he's lying on the ground, say something uncomplimentary about his mother. I'm taking this from my experience playing hockey, which, granted, is a little more brutal than medieval warfare.
I am glad to see that you managed to get to terms again and that the same armourer got to finish the job. Allways sad to end a relationship on a low note, happy to see things have improved
I hope it was a simple misunderstanding (we only got Lindybeige's version of events, after all,) and not that he felt bullied into it because of the video. I saw more than a few comments under the last video saying that their experience with the armorer was much better.
Perhaps my perspective is a bit skewed, what with being an SCA (rattan) combatant, but anyone hitting carbon heat-treated steel hard enough to do that with one blow? That's not only no accident, that's just dangerous. I think you should listen to your armourer for this one. Get it repaired properly once. You'll be kicking yourself otherwise.
i suppose its less a single blow, but repeatedly hitting the same spot and weakening it over time. to the point where it just takes one hit to crack it.
@@raymondfoster9326 in An Tir, hitting as hard as you possibly can is considered uncouth. as it is said, "we're here to kill our friends, not to injure them." still, I've seen helmets get creased, and that also takes a very high degree of gitness.
I'd be a bit more concerned that someone is hitting people with such force to cause that much damage to plate armor at a reenactment (as apposed to a tournament).
Just think if the person hitting underestimated the thickness and quality of the armor. He could've done severe damage to the person / Lindybeige! Awful people out there.
@@misterjder1.831 That's what I was thinking. Or if he he had moved his arm in the path of the blow. As good as the armor may be, if the breastplate took that much damage, his arm could have been injured.
It was great to meet you Lloyd. I was very impressed by how you coped in the full armour and the heat. I think I may need to take up dance as a fitness regime before next Tewkesbury
It was interesting that people said that they felt it in their legs afterwards. My legs were fine. It's usually my back that complains the most, but that's because I knackered it quite badly in my twenties.
Dancing would be a great exercise for this. Knights would, of course, do a lot of dancing. It's a cultural thing that everyone does a lot. And you would get fit and supple.
@@neilwilson5785 some dancing such as cossack was a demonstration of their athleticism and martial prowess, particularly being able to mount a horse in a single bound. Some dance styles are descended from martial arts. many more are just for fun of course.
At an American civil war reenactment, I ran out of cartridges so I "took a hit" and went face down. Then the line behind advanced over me and someone stepped on my canteen and put a great big dent in it. But now I have a story, and a canteen with less water capacity.
Your canteen maybe cost 40 bucks a little hard to compare apples and oranges there. Imagine your canteen cost 100 Grand and someone stepped on it I'm sure you'd have a little bit more than a story... you'd have a lawsuit.
WW2 reenactor here, I have 2 stories. The first one, me and my friend are shooting videos of ourselves in close quarters combat, he as the british, me as the german. His helmet recieves some notable damage, mine only minor. We were not thrilled after this, but hey, to this day he goes around telling the story of "that time my helmet got dented by a german trying to stab me", so it was cool in the end. Second one, me and a few friends are at a re-enactment, and there's this guy. He's the "in the know" guy there. He is the guy who knows more than all of us (and the same guy that had us fight with nonsensical tactics he made up and created a squad composed of 3 squad leaders, 3 machinegunners and 2 riflemen. yeah. a moron). Not only was he a moron, he was also an absolutely obnoxious prick. He took a big ol' stick and started bonking me on the head with it. Repeatedly. Bop. Bop bop. Bop bop bop, bop bop. I had my helmet on, granted, but god it sucked. The thing rang like a bell with my head in it, not nice, and my padding is somewhat lacking, so i got somewhat hurt in the process. I am NOT a guy that snaps, but I came to a point where I thought "if you touch me one more with that fucking thing i'm calling the fucking police on you". Luckily my helmet was unhurt, but if it were I believe I would have called the cops. That's when I broke contacts with the re-enacting society organizing the event, making sure I let the organizer know in much detail what happened.
@@panzerparty6510 yeah, It's not that easy finding the right reenactor group, my first we're just a bunch of dirty old men who sat around and drank all day 😂 I've always wanted to do WW reenacting, but not much of that that I can find.
@@RobotJohny it's thick stainless steel i don't want to make more stess spots, I'll keep it for the memories. Need another one that's grey anyway if I want to join specific regiment's.
The scratch is slightly cool in my opinion because it is a visual representation of the edge of a weapon very quickly hitting the armour and glancing off. Something that happened so quickly can put a story you can see and remember for so long. On the other hand the dent is not good at all and must be repaired.
Also thats how you stop being a shiny, get your armor worn, especially as it becomes more uniform and spread over as he keeps reenacting. Like real armor less like shiny metal
Yeah, but he'll always see the smirk on that git's face, and the story will be about a git doing something a-purpose that he wasn't supposed to, so, not a fun story to tell and retell. Lloyd will have to make up an epic lie, instead.
If someone hit your sturdy armor hard enough to dent it that badly, they're seriously a danger to other participants. Like bruh it's not even a tournament. He's lucky your plate wasn't aluminium.
He’s not really lucky that it’s not aluminium anyone walking onto Tewksbury without proper grade armour brings it on themselves. I would also say that it’s Tewksbury if your armour doesn’t have at least 3 chunks taken out of it you need to get more involved. I’ve used my vanbrace to catch two handed shots with war hammers and I’m still here.
I also liked the "oh, and by the way they're my sponsor" comment a little bit later. As if there was anyone still watching that hadn't figured that out. But I guess it's in the TH-cam code that you have to actually SAY it.
It's a perverse compliment. They were envious and did not have the capacity to be happy for someone else. These types also tend to be people that have never been punched in the mouth before.
@@johnqpublic2718 On the same level of nerdy as brass and wood instruments when the sounds can be created digitally if you ask me. But people still love it.
I think you should repair the dent, but leave the gouge. Sort of like the Spartans, who's cloaks are worn and frayed over the course of their military career, and it might help you avoid the gits who are on the look out for a "shiny" next time.
The same happened with old judo trainers, they washed their suits, but not their belts. The greener/browner/blacker the belt, the more experience they had.
It'd be a lot worse to be the one guy coming out of a real battle with totally undamaged armour - there'd be a lot of questions and/or speculation about how you kept your armour pristine...
i recall that many breastplate were bullet proofed/ crossbow proofed by shooting at it, and the resulting dent occasionally was then decorated. so proudly dented intentionally possibly before ever being purchased
I mean, if someone dents your armor in a real battle, you have the logical recourse of just killing that person in response Can't get away with that at a re-enactment...I don't think....
Glad to see the armor got sorted along with the relationship with the armorer! It occurs to me looking at that dent and accompanying gouge in the heat treated steel that if the git had missed and caught say a chain mail area, you probably would have been needing a hospital. Considering you were padded up underneath, hitting hard enough to have the weapon dig into hardened steel (must have been very pointy) instead of skating, pushing back the plate into firm enough contact to dent, and moving you back at the same time, that pointy bit would have gone through chain and pierced you. Maybe not deeply if it didn't split the ring, but there would have been blood. That git needs to be removed from the hobby. Possibly violently.
@@Ninja-Alinja stainless steel is harder to work than other types but this isn't that. Modern, homogenous steel ist easier to work than "old", lower quality steel.
Over the years my harness has acquired a number of dents, most I chalk up to acceptable wear and tear. Most reenactors are competent combatants that know what they are doing and modify the blow to suit the occassion. All blows are meant to be controlled. Some on the other hand are decidedly worrying. My harness is well made and fits me well. Two bits of damage it has taken really concerned me. One of my tassets has a horizontal 10mm deep dent on the inside edge that could only have been made by truly hard swung weapon. The other is on the side plate on my knee, that was hit hard enough to bend it into a taco. Neither did any damage to me, the armour worked but it could have. If the blow had missed the plate somehow or the armour had been weak it would have caused a serious injury. A friend of mine suffered broken ribs when a "git" aimed a hard thrust at his breastplate and missed and hit the arm pit. Another time I was fighting an "armoured" fighter only to discover his brigandine was just a fabric vest with decorative studs. I guess the lesson is always moderate your blows, fight as tho your opponent is unarmoured.
It was a great weekend, I'm glad you managed to get everything working in time and join us. Armour needs continual tweaks and improvements, but you are getting there now and your armour is currently working better than a lot of peoples'.
Hey I'm glad the armourer was willing to work with you to get your armour ready for the event. Bummer about the dent tho, hopefully it won't be too much of a pain to fix. Cheers. 💚
The one way this could happen accidentally, imo, is if the opponent slips and falls forward into you, just as he's going for a thrust (and doesn't let go of his weapon...) looking at the gash, into heat-treated high carbon armor... if that is from 'accidentally over-tapping' the opponent, how on earth would armor have had any hope vs a lance thrust from cavalry? I hope everyone there had plated armor, because eating that kind of 'tap' into chainmail with light padding would have done more than shoving someone backwards. Imagine such a 'tap' glancing upwards into the throat.
Three cheers for the armorer! When they were working on the holes for helmet, it looked like he was installing an absolutely wicked headbutt weapon (6:00) A shame about some re-enactors intentionally looking to damage another persons gear. I would heed the advice of the armorer regarding that damage.
Good to see your armourer managed to get it ready in time. As for the damage, if it doesn't affect the integrity of the armour, then leave it as a battle scar. Otherwise get it fixed properly.
At a major university in the State of Maryland (check us out we have the best flag) there was an underground group that did live steel [pointy pointy slice and dice]. No gits as they're easy to weed out and the cost of good armor/weapons prevented the Trust Fund Babies from taking up the sport on a lark. Members were strongly encouraged to make their own kit. Do the chain-mail knitting, how to work with leather, then on to small bits of steel armor. After +/- 18 months you knew everyone and they knew you quite well.
The Cretan that put the dent in the armour I daresay he enjoys pushing over little girls and pulling the wings off flies! And as for the excuse makers ,dry your eyes ,some people are just shits stop apologizing for them it only encourages them. Sounds like a great event, well done to all who took part, children everywhere will love you for it
If the gouge was to be fixed up a bit so as to not be glaring, then it would look quite a bit like a proofing mark. And even if the gouge is left it still works as such (I know a proofing mark would not be period accurate, but the concept still works). So while I understand the want to fix it right away, I think it looks "intentional" enough that it could be left until you either have an opportunity to more practically visit your armorer, or you have enough other nicks and bumps that it warrens a visit anyway. But most importantly, CONGRATULATIONS ON HAVING COMPLETED THE ARMOR!
As always, Lindybeige is providing a public service. the audio from 7:23 to 8:01 should be played by a DM when a D&D party suggest that their party of mixed adventurers, 'sneak up' on anything.
After years of waiting I’m so glad we can finally see your armour and live vicariously through you!! Pity about the dent though it does remind me of a test shot dent like the later armours.
Reenactment fighting is tricky, it means a massive range of things to different people from pokey pokey to fights that I’ve seen full contact people wince at. Problem is big events mix it all in, there are people I’ll fight full speed at but only people I know are not to armour proud. What is the armour for? Fighting or showing my armour is very much fighting these days and it’s mangled in places but I wouldn’t assume the person I was hitting had the same ideal unless I knew them. Tweks was hard hitting and the elbows of my arms have a few massive gouges and while I don’t care the person doing it wouldn’t have known that.
Seeing how much skill and effort goes into making this kind of armour even today with modern tools and metallurgy equipment makes you really appreciate the blacksmith's who designed and made it back in the 13/14th centuries
It's sad when anything pristine becomes spoiled, but on the other hand, from a philosophical point of view, if your armour never took a beating then it would not be fulfilling it's potential. You now have the dubious honour of having experienced beeing saved from fatal injury. Imagine what would have happened if your armour had not been there (actually don't). Perhaps on one level you might be able to appreciate it more than you otherwise would do. Cold comfort I know. What a git.
You can add metal back by welding in the gouge with some filler and the grinding appropriately. This will mess with the heat treatment of the breast however and the whole process will probably need a professional.
Comment from a fellow re-enactor, if that helps, I think that dent looks amazing! Really looks like some prick tried to kill you (not far off reality i suppose) and I think it looks superb in a medieval piece of armor. It looks used, it looks believable. I 100% understand that getting such things that way sucks (I do speak from experience here, if I see that guy on the street again I'm punching him all the way to the hospital) but at least there is an upside. Pricks. Cheers!
If you get ANY damage take it back to the smith. Sucks but it needs to be heated. High Carbon is harder but also more brittle vs low carbon softer steel. Most field plate should try to be .40 to .50 percent Carbon for your next set. So you can use hammer and light heat to get most of your dents out with out damaging your gear. ( Note: I am NOT a smith. So make sure you ask your smith on what to do for EVERY armor set. ) I joust in Full Plate and its tool grade high carbon. I am a master at Riding and Lancing down my opponents. I let the Smith do there job they know best. That is why they do it as a job.
This armourer, he must Be a different Chap than The original one? I remember you And him had a falling out. And you are dashing good sir, in your shining armour. On unrelated note, dont know If you ever read this but you were My inspiration to start sewing medieval (14th-15th century) clothes last Summer, i discovered i Have a talent For it And im making myself a yellow-green woolen cotehardie at The moment. So thank you!
It seems that it's the same guy. Maybe some comments from viewers made him understand that he is visible online, maybe Lloyd had some more cash, and maybe all the falling out wasn't as bad as it seemed.
take the torch to the dent, go to the car fixing place of your choice and have them spotweld a tab to the dent. After using a slidehammer to pull out the dent, just fill the scratch with solder or weld and pretty up the area, maybe put an ornamental bit on top to hide it ever existed.
For TTRPG purposes, can you put on the full kit and try sneaking around so we can see how easy or impossible it is? Maybe see if ‘NPC Guard’ will detect your approach? 😄
I'm not an armourer, I have been a metalworker since the early 90's. That's probably best fixed with heat, particularly the dent. As far as the scratch goes, no metal was actually removed, so you should probably be able to make it look alot better yourself with a mirror polished hammer. (You want and have a mirror polish, the slightest imperfection in the hammer will be carried into the work.) I'd take a trip back to the armourer if time and money allow.
This reminds me of my friend who has an all original 442 1968, who brings his car to car shows. He had gotten hit in the front quarter panel, an passenger side door as another car backed into the next spot. I know my buddy replaced all the damaged parts, with all new original parts... that was not cheap, but it's his pride an joy. I imagine, that some of us feel the same way.
Oh man I laughed so hard when you showed all the power tools tangled together! I keep threatening where I work that "One of these days I'm just going to take all the power cords and make one super cord!"
I would suggest you take pride in your authentic battle damage. You aren't just some prissy fop son of a wealthy baron flitting about in your shiny new armor anymore. You are a battle hardened soldier !.
The sons of barons were highly overrepresented as hardened professional soldiers... This is the Middle Ages we are talking about. In fact, the etymological origins of "baron" is literally "soldier". People need to study actual medieval history instead of going off the Hollywood conception of the Middle Ages.
A proper knight would have his armorer fix it, so it's perfectly historically appropriate to do the same. It's a business expense and a perfect prompt for a video on the subject of repairing armor and how high-maintenance it must have been. Don't have him hide it too well; battle scars should be proudly displayed.
I'm happy you got in touch with your armourer again. The dent/gauge? It just looks awesome. Bragging about a perfect, shiny armour never used in battle is what a Frenchman would do.
Sorry to hear that, hope it didn't put too much of a dampener on your time at Tewskesbury, it's such a great festival when I've gone (had to miss it again this year though).
The dent was made without any heat so there should be no issue to hammer it out cold either. I'd say find an armourer willing to give you a lesson how to hammer out dents from your armor. Leave the scratch how it is after buffing
Hammering out a dent in a hardened, heat treated piece of armor while cold is not a good idea. It causes undue stress and weakens the armor at best and could crack it at worst. Cold hammering a dent out of mild steel is fine, but high carbon steel used in armor needs heat to properly repair. It may even need to be normalized and rehardened in that spot.
I recognise that chap in the calendar 3:27 , it's Andy Deane of the Royal Armouries. He won the Easter joust this year. His armour is truly gorgeous too!
That's a lot of weld. And it will ruin the heat treatment all around the dent. Not a terrible idea but I think for something so valuable, it would be best to have it repaired properly.
That is best compliment your armourer can have. He has produced a masterpiece of craftsmanship that has done its job and protected the wearer from serious injury. The git is probably a watcher of this channel. The git, if discovered, should pay for the damage, given that it wasn't competitive and was fully scripted.
I am so glad that there are still craftsmen making these pieces. Thanks Lloyd for showing this; very impressive armour!. BTW that dent in your armour would have taken some force, if that had got through a gap instead, I dread to think what could have happened.
I was about to post exactly that. As much as I enjoyed watching his videos in the past, the feeling of being scammed keeps me from watching his videos. They just pop up in my timeline to remind me to never use kickstarter again.
You should repair the dent, of course, but rather than hide it try to accentuate the gouge in it. Like some kind of great big Kintsugi bowl. It'll be a cool sort of record of your battles.
Two things, lindy, to perhaps assuage the savage beast: 1) The guy may only have been as experienced as I at re-enactment (it wasn't me!), but thought "Wow, great armour - must be a lord!" - so naturally, as per historical times, have been a bit desperate to succeed. 2) I did martial arts too, and as a friend once told me, he didn't think his Gi was entirely real until there was a bit of blood on it - so congrats, Lindy, blood on the Gi!
Hello Lindybeige - since you like armor, medieval stuff, LARP, and presumably some fantasy elements - you should consider visiting Le Duche de Bicolline in Quebec, Canada. I think you would really enjoy the big week long faire and battle event that is held in August each year. This will be my 4th year. Maybe I will see you there in 2023?
It's awesome to get another "biege video"! my life has been missing your videos Lloyd, so happy for another to come out! I saw on the chat section from somewhere else (I think it was shadaversity, talking about TH-cam burnout...) and saw on the replies to your comment, that a massive number of people had been auto-unsubbed from your channel, it sucks because you are my favorite "youtuber" and my day is always better after watching a new lindybiege video, you deserve more subbs, not less than you actually get :/
You could get a welder to fill the gouge then grind it flat to match then you dont lose any material. You would be surprised how a good welder can match the steel and you wont even notice it was ever damaged.
Ooof - even above the waist that's a low blow Mr Beige - no chivalry in these Lancastrian fiends (or jealous re-enactors). On the positive side I wouldn't worry about it showing - it's a good part of the history of the piece, it's an excellent field test and it will mostly remove the fear of it happening again.
Whatever you do with the dent, make sure it doesn't compromise the level of protection, maybe you can have a decorative reinforcement riveted in the zone? I'm not familiar with what could ruin the look of the armor, but make sure that scratch won't become a crack.
So I have frequently seen people stating something along the lines of "Well Actually, plate armor was made to fit really well and wouldn't impede your movements. SO having a penalty to stealth is Unrealistic." But it is pretty clear that when moving in plate you would still make much more noise than when moving in cloth or leather. So I think losing stealth is perfectly reasonable.
Hey Lloyd, the dent can be fixed and the gauge can be filled in and made invisible. Or, perhaps, it can even be filled in visibly to show the scar. Japanese art called kintsugi comes to mind.
Turn the dent into an opportunity. Love to see a video on how knights repaired and maintained their armour. It would be a real part of life for a knight and the smith. Definitely be something i would watch.
If you have the money to get a full suit of armor formed from scratch, you should hopefully have enough money for both upkeep and reperation. And the squire to put it on obviously
Says the person who doesn't have a suit of armor, you wouldn't mind if I came up and smashed the s*** out of the hood on your car, it'd give it character right...lol
I agree. Makers of things often dent and use chemicals and things to make their pieces look older and more worn for asthetics. It's like the old saying of not taking an untested blade (armor in this case) into battle.
@@Charok1 I'd be seeing you at the hospital if someone were to hit that spot on the chest plate again, and this time make an actual hole through it, as well as in everything past.
The medieval armourer would make all his tools, including machine tools, he'd set up with a waterwheel somewhere for powered hammers, presses, drills, and lathes. Or if he were a camp follower he'd have a bunch of human arms to power his machines.
Dented my armor?!?
Sounds like a perfectly fine reason to declare a multi-generation feud.
This needs to be the top comment
We must ralley the banners
Casus belli!
Not only is your armour battle-ready, but it's battle-damaged too! Doesn't get more period than this!
Lindy thinks that gits are 1-2% of people. My experience is that 10-20% is nearer the mark.
@@neilwilson5785 20% easy.
@@neilwilson5785 nah, simply 90% of people stayed at home.
@@neilwilson5785 truth ..
Agreed. Keep it. Every dent and scratch is a war time story haha. Keep it
The way to fix the dent is to remember what the guy who dented it looked like, and wait for the next Tewkesbury. Deal him a whopping great blow, and when he's lying on the ground, say something uncomplimentary about his mother. I'm taking this from my experience playing hockey, which, granted, is a little more brutal than medieval warfare.
I am glad to see that you managed to get to terms again and that the same armourer got to finish the job. Allways sad to end a relationship on a low note, happy to see things have improved
I hope it was a simple misunderstanding (we only got Lindybeige's version of events, after all,) and not that he felt bullied into it because of the video. I saw more than a few comments under the last video saying that their experience with the armorer was much better.
Should of sorted it with a sword fight
I respect this man highly!!!
was that the same armorer as was referenced in the other Lindy video??
Was there a issue with the gentleman from white rose?
It was great to fight alongside you, hopefully again next year!
Drach! ❤ Hope you make a video on the event too, or at least a quick recap on a QnA :)
Oh, cool, Drach and Lindy fighting side by side!
figth???'??HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
You all looked pretty intimidating in the photos. The future king is surely safe from harm!
@@frankbarnwell____ nerd
Perhaps my perspective is a bit skewed, what with being an SCA (rattan) combatant, but anyone hitting carbon heat-treated steel hard enough to do that with one blow? That's not only no accident, that's just dangerous.
I think you should listen to your armourer for this one. Get it repaired properly once. You'll be kicking yourself otherwise.
I did SCA here in Australia and we were taught to hit as hard as we possibly could...
Reenactment is different though, it should be gentle.
i suppose its less a single blow, but repeatedly hitting the same spot and weakening it over time. to the point where it just takes one hit to crack it.
ignore that, i thought you where referring to the knuckle piece back at the workshop, the cuirass piece was definitely a deliberate act of malice .
Yea get it repaired correctly by a professional, unless you want a "battle worn" look.
@@raymondfoster9326 in An Tir, hitting as hard as you possibly can is considered uncouth. as it is said, "we're here to kill our friends, not to injure them." still, I've seen helmets get creased, and that also takes a very high degree of gitness.
I'd be a bit more concerned that someone is hitting people with such force to cause that much damage to plate armor at a reenactment (as apposed to a tournament).
Just think if the person hitting underestimated the thickness and quality of the armor.
He could've done severe damage to the person / Lindybeige!
Awful people out there.
@@misterjder1.831 That's what I was thinking. Or if he he had moved his arm in the path of the blow. As good as the armor may be, if the breastplate took that much damage, his arm could have been injured.
It's not a very good reenactment if nobody dies
Yeah, I'm not sure "he was a shiny" stands up as a defense against murder charges
@@Daedrex technically true xD
It was great to meet you Lloyd. I was very impressed by how you coped in the full armour and the heat. I think I may need to take up dance as a fitness regime before next Tewkesbury
It was interesting that people said that they felt it in their legs afterwards. My legs were fine. It's usually my back that complains the most, but that's because I knackered it quite badly in my twenties.
Dancing would be a great exercise for this. Knights would, of course, do a lot of dancing. It's a cultural thing that everyone does a lot. And you would get fit and supple.
@@lindybeige the knacker back of my twenties is a bit off too.
still, 51 yesterday and ever foolhardy. 🙂
@@lindybeige I'm in my mid 20s, and my back is now much better after I knackered it in my early teens
@@neilwilson5785 some dancing such as cossack was a demonstration of their athleticism and martial prowess, particularly being able to mount a horse in a single bound. Some dance styles are descended from martial arts. many more are just for fun of course.
At an American civil war reenactment, I ran out of cartridges so I "took a hit" and went face down. Then the line behind advanced over me and someone stepped on my canteen and put a great big dent in it. But now I have a story, and a canteen with less water capacity.
Your canteen maybe cost 40 bucks a little hard to compare apples and oranges there. Imagine your canteen cost 100 Grand and someone stepped on it I'm sure you'd have a little bit more than a story... you'd have a lawsuit.
@@ChIGuY-town22_ I wasn't complaining or comparing, just
telling of my experience, sheesh.
P.S. His armor cost probably around 10k
WW2 reenactor here, I have 2 stories.
The first one, me and my friend are shooting videos of ourselves in close quarters combat, he as the british, me as the german. His helmet recieves some notable damage, mine only minor. We were not thrilled after this, but hey, to this day he goes around telling the story of "that time my helmet got dented by a german trying to stab me", so it was cool in the end.
Second one, me and a few friends are at a re-enactment, and there's this guy. He's the "in the know" guy there. He is the guy who knows more than all of us (and the same guy that had us fight with nonsensical tactics he made up and created a squad composed of 3 squad leaders, 3 machinegunners and 2 riflemen. yeah. a moron). Not only was he a moron, he was also an absolutely obnoxious prick. He took a big ol' stick and started bonking me on the head with it. Repeatedly. Bop. Bop bop. Bop bop bop, bop bop. I had my helmet on, granted, but god it sucked. The thing rang like a bell with my head in it, not nice, and my padding is somewhat lacking, so i got somewhat hurt in the process. I am NOT a guy that snaps, but I came to a point where I thought "if you touch me one more with that fucking thing i'm calling the fucking police on you".
Luckily my helmet was unhurt, but if it were I believe I would have called the cops. That's when I broke contacts with the re-enacting society organizing the event, making sure I let the organizer know in much detail what happened.
@@panzerparty6510 yeah, It's not that easy finding the right reenactor group, my first we're just a bunch of dirty old men who sat around and drank all day 😂 I've always wanted to do WW reenacting, but not much of that that I can find.
@@RobotJohny it's thick stainless steel i don't want to make more stess spots, I'll keep it for the memories. Need another one that's grey anyway if I want to join specific regiment's.
It is interesting to see that the relationship between the armorer and the knight is a negotiation. Glad it worked out.
A negotiation... backed up with lots of $$$
armourer you git 🤬🤬
The scratch is slightly cool in my opinion because it is a visual representation of the edge of a weapon very quickly hitting the armour and glancing off. Something that happened so quickly can put a story you can see and remember for so long. On the other hand the dent is not good at all and must be repaired.
This is my take as well. It might not be the immaculate set that Lindybeige and envisioned and hoped for anymore, but it has some history now!
Also thats how you stop being a shiny, get your armor worn, especially as it becomes more uniform and spread over as he keeps reenacting. Like real armor less like shiny metal
Scholars dont find this stuff cool
@@HeliodromusScorpio Scholars dont find anything cool
Yeah, but he'll always see the smirk on that git's face, and the story will be about a git doing something a-purpose that he wasn't supposed to, so, not a fun story to tell and retell. Lloyd will have to make up an epic lie, instead.
If someone hit your sturdy armor hard enough to dent it that badly, they're seriously a danger to other participants. Like bruh it's not even a tournament. He's lucky your plate wasn't aluminium.
Or what if the weapon had glanced off and caught someone somewhere exposed?
If he were the type of git I expect: he probably did a few probing shots to gauge his git level thrust
He’s not really lucky that it’s not aluminium anyone walking onto Tewksbury without proper grade armour brings it on themselves. I would also say that it’s Tewksbury if your armour doesn’t have at least 3 chunks taken out of it you need to get more involved. I’ve used my vanbrace to catch two handed shots with war hammers and I’m still here.
@@johnfitzalan3128 seems like you're an dumb git, it's an reenactment, not an buhurt, not everyone can afford proper grade armor.
All armor dents That is what it is supposed to do instead of denting your body.
the "i'm gonna check wondrium to see if they have an armor repair course" was one of the best unexpected transitions i've ever seen!! XD
and obviously, Lindy now has a project to move on to.
I also liked the "oh, and by the way they're my sponsor" comment a little bit later. As if there was anyone still watching that hadn't figured that out. But I guess it's in the TH-cam code that you have to actually SAY it.
He's finally doing it.
I remember first watching a video about armour so many years ago.
Next we might see a finished illustrated novel!
I once spent a long time on a kite shield. Was rather proud of it. A "git" as you called it smashed it. No other reason than, "I wanted to".
It's a perverse compliment. They were envious and did not have the capacity to be happy for someone else. These types also tend to be people that have never been punched in the mouth before.
@@andrewdriver3318 I punched him in the mouth with the broken shield
Just what I needed to relax, Watching someone making armour in the 21 century, Thank you.
Armour that is completely defenseless against 21st century arms- it's truly nerdy.
@@johnqpublic2718 Yes, so I'm going for depleted uranium for my suit
@@johnqpublic2718 On the same level of nerdy as brass and wood instruments when the sounds can be created digitally if you ask me. But people still love it.
I think you should repair the dent, but leave the gouge. Sort of like the Spartans, who's cloaks are worn and frayed over the course of their military career, and it might help you avoid the gits who are on the look out for a "shiny" next time.
The same happened with old judo trainers, they washed their suits, but not their belts. The greener/browner/blacker the belt, the more experience they had.
Whose.
TBF, for someone who did that the first time deliberately, the git would probably see the repaired dent and take it as an inviting target...
It is good to see that this project had a happy ending in spite of a turbulent process.
This probably happened to real knights on their first day wearing their shinny armour to battle. And they were pissed too.
Hence the "Black Prince".
It'd be a lot worse to be the one guy coming out of a real battle with totally undamaged armour - there'd be a lot of questions and/or speculation about how you kept your armour pristine...
i recall that many breastplate were bullet proofed/ crossbow proofed by shooting at it, and the resulting dent occasionally was then decorated. so proudly dented intentionally possibly before ever being purchased
I mean, if someone dents your armor in a real battle, you have the logical recourse of just killing that person in response
Can't get away with that at a re-enactment...I don't think....
Also, the guy with the shiny never-seen-battle armor might well be a kid who's a softer target than veterans in equivalent kit.
We call them "resentful" here. A kind of nastier, more evil version of the "envious"
Glad to see the armor got sorted along with the relationship with the armorer!
It occurs to me looking at that dent and accompanying gouge in the heat treated steel that if the git had missed and caught say a chain mail area, you probably would have been needing a hospital. Considering you were padded up underneath, hitting hard enough to have the weapon dig into hardened steel (must have been very pointy) instead of skating, pushing back the plate into firm enough contact to dent, and moving you back at the same time, that pointy bit would have gone through chain and pierced you. Maybe not deeply if it didn't split the ring, but there would have been blood.
That git needs to be removed from the hobby. Possibly violently.
Good to see that you two made peace.
Dave's 'new' apprentice looks to be in his 60s.
He’s on his 48th year. Only eight more and he’ll be qualified.
Glad you and Dave sorted it out, seems like a nice chap
As I watch this, I keep thinking how they made this armor before power tools. They were amazing craftsman back then. I have immense respect for them.
Without taking anything away from them, I assume the metal was lower quality und easier to work than modern steel.
@@Ninja-Alinja stainless steel is harder to work than other types but this isn't that. Modern, homogenous steel ist easier to work than "old", lower quality steel.
Making of one set of armor would take almost as long as it would take Lindy to upload a full series of videos!
@You just lost the game They would use water-powered wheels whenever possible. They also had pedal-powered grinding machines.
Over the years my harness has acquired a number of dents, most I chalk up to acceptable wear and tear. Most reenactors are competent combatants that know what they are doing and modify the blow to suit the occassion. All blows are meant to be controlled. Some on the other hand are decidedly worrying.
My harness is well made and fits me well. Two bits of damage it has taken really concerned me. One of my tassets has a horizontal 10mm deep dent on the inside edge that could only have been made by truly hard swung weapon. The other is on the side plate on my knee, that was hit hard enough to bend it into a taco. Neither did any damage to me, the armour worked but it could have. If the blow had missed the plate somehow or the armour had been weak it would have caused a serious injury.
A friend of mine suffered broken ribs when a "git" aimed a hard thrust at his breastplate and missed and hit the arm pit. Another time I was fighting an "armoured" fighter only to discover his brigandine was just a fabric vest with decorative studs.
I guess the lesson is always moderate your blows, fight as tho your opponent is unarmoured.
It was a great weekend, I'm glad you managed to get everything working in time and join us. Armour needs continual tweaks and improvements, but you are getting there now and your armour is currently working better than a lot of peoples'.
That is a very deep gouge and dent. That was a LOT of force.
Hey I'm glad the armourer was willing to work with you to get your armour ready for the event.
Bummer about the dent tho, hopefully it won't be too much of a pain to fix.
Cheers. 💚
I'm so relieved you got some of the changes to the armour that you wanted.
Good on Dave for fixing his mess.
The one way this could happen accidentally, imo, is if the opponent slips and falls forward into you, just as he's going for a thrust (and doesn't let go of his weapon...)
looking at the gash, into heat-treated high carbon armor... if that is from 'accidentally over-tapping' the opponent, how on earth would armor have had any hope vs a lance thrust from cavalry?
I hope everyone there had plated armor, because eating that kind of 'tap' into chainmail with light padding would have done more than shoving someone backwards.
Imagine such a 'tap' glancing upwards into the throat.
Three cheers for the armorer! When they were working on the holes for helmet, it looked like he was installing an absolutely wicked headbutt weapon (6:00)
A shame about some re-enactors intentionally looking to damage another persons gear. I would heed the advice of the armorer regarding that damage.
Good to see your armourer managed to get it ready in time. As for the damage, if it doesn't affect the integrity of the armour, then leave it as a battle scar. Otherwise get it fixed properly.
Lindy has made it a long way, since the old WW2 videos days, good to say you still around.
I think the best thing that came from that hit is: We all know now that this armor really works!
At a major university in the State of Maryland (check us out we have the best flag) there was an underground group that did live steel [pointy pointy slice and dice]. No gits as they're easy to weed out and the cost of good armor/weapons prevented the Trust Fund Babies from taking up the sport on a lark. Members were strongly encouraged to make their own kit. Do the chain-mail knitting, how to work with leather, then on to small bits of steel armor. After +/- 18 months you knew everyone and they knew you quite well.
glad it was properly hardened armor and you were not hurt
The Cretan that put the dent in the armour I daresay he enjoys pushing over little girls and pulling the wings off flies! And as for the excuse makers ,dry your eyes ,some people are just shits stop apologizing for them it only encourages them. Sounds like a great event, well done to all who took part, children everywhere will love you for it
If the gouge was to be fixed up a bit so as to not be glaring, then it would look quite a bit like a proofing mark. And even if the gouge is left it still works as such (I know a proofing mark would not be period accurate, but the concept still works). So while I understand the want to fix it right away, I think it looks "intentional" enough that it could be left until you either have an opportunity to more practically visit your armorer, or you have enough other nicks and bumps that it warrens a visit anyway. But most importantly, CONGRATULATIONS ON HAVING COMPLETED THE ARMOR!
As always, Lindybeige is providing a public service.
the audio from 7:23 to 8:01 should be played by a DM when a D&D party suggest that their party of mixed adventurers, 'sneak up' on anything.
Very glad that your armourer sorted out the issues
2:08 Just reminds me of
"Unless the next bloke we run into is armed with a can opener, I'd say we're good to go."
_Cait, Fallout 4_
After years of waiting I’m so glad we can finally see your armour and live vicariously through you!!
Pity about the dent though it does remind me of a test shot dent like the later armours.
Reenactment fighting is tricky, it means a massive range of things to different people from pokey pokey to fights that I’ve seen full contact people wince at. Problem is big events mix it all in, there are people I’ll fight full speed at but only people I know are not to armour proud. What is the armour for? Fighting or showing my armour is very much fighting these days and it’s mangled in places but I wouldn’t assume the person I was hitting had the same ideal unless I knew them. Tweks was hard hitting and the elbows of my arms have a few massive gouges and while I don’t care the person doing it wouldn’t have known that.
Seeing how much skill and effort goes into making this kind of armour even today with modern tools and metallurgy equipment makes you really appreciate the blacksmith's who designed and made it back in the 13/14th centuries
It's sad when anything pristine becomes spoiled, but on the other hand, from a philosophical point of view, if your armour never took a beating then it would not be fulfilling it's potential. You now have the dubious honour of having experienced beeing saved from fatal injury. Imagine what would have happened if your armour had not been there (actually don't). Perhaps on one level you might be able to appreciate it more than you otherwise would do. Cold comfort I know.
What a git.
You can add metal back by welding in the gouge with some filler and the grinding appropriately. This will mess with the heat treatment of the breast however and the whole process will probably need a professional.
It ain't going to be cheap...
Comment from a fellow re-enactor, if that helps, I think that dent looks amazing! Really looks like some prick tried to kill you (not far off reality i suppose) and I think it looks superb in a medieval piece of armor. It looks used, it looks believable. I 100% understand that getting such things that way sucks (I do speak from experience here, if I see that guy on the street again I'm punching him all the way to the hospital) but at least there is an upside.
Pricks.
Cheers!
If you get ANY damage take it back to the smith. Sucks but it needs to be heated. High Carbon is harder but also more brittle vs low carbon softer steel. Most field plate should try to be .40 to .50 percent Carbon for your next set. So you can use hammer and light heat to get most of your dents out with out damaging your gear. ( Note: I am NOT a smith. So make sure you ask your smith on what to do for EVERY armor set. ) I joust in Full Plate and its tool grade high carbon. I am a master at Riding and Lancing down my opponents. I let the Smith do there job they know best. That is why they do it as a job.
This armourer, he must Be a different Chap than The original one? I remember you And him had a falling out. And you are dashing good sir, in your shining armour.
On unrelated note, dont know If you ever read this but you were My inspiration to start sewing medieval (14th-15th century) clothes last Summer, i discovered i Have a talent For it And im making myself a yellow-green woolen cotehardie at The moment. So thank you!
He seems to be the same guy from the earlier armour videos
What did the fall out about
@@chuckmiller7294 Watch his last armor video. Over quite many things actually.
@@paistinlasta1805 i see! Thank you. Im glad If they worked out their differences
It seems that it's the same guy. Maybe some comments from viewers made him understand that he is visible online, maybe Lloyd had some more cash, and maybe all the falling out wasn't as bad as it seemed.
take the torch to the dent, go to the car fixing place of your choice and have them spotweld a tab to the dent. After using a slidehammer to pull out the dent, just fill the scratch with solder or weld and pretty up the area, maybe put an ornamental bit on top to hide it ever existed.
For TTRPG purposes, can you put on the full kit and try sneaking around so we can see how easy or impossible it is? Maybe see if ‘NPC Guard’ will detect your approach? 😄
I am for this.
Metatron did a video on this if you want to watch one now.
I'm not an armourer, I have been a metalworker since the early 90's.
That's probably best fixed with heat, particularly the dent.
As far as the scratch goes, no metal was actually removed, so you should probably be able to make it look alot better yourself with a mirror polished hammer. (You want and have a mirror polish, the slightest imperfection in the hammer will be carried into the work.)
I'd take a trip back to the armourer if time and money allow.
Great flecktarn pants on the metal worker. I have some and they're awesome. Comfortable and durable.
I have a pair too. They're great.
This is probably my favorite series of yours, man, I love the insights on armor smithing.
Good that you two got everything fixed. Would be weird to have to go to a different blacksmith in order to adjust someone else's work.
The holy trinity of any craftsman, time, tools, and talent.
To be honest, seeing Lindy in this armour got me questioning my loyalty to my Lord and sovereign.
I'm sure Lindy's intention was not to suborn treason. God Save the Queen
This reminds me of my friend who has an all original 442 1968, who brings his car to car shows. He had gotten hit in the front quarter panel, an passenger side door as another car backed into the next spot. I know my buddy replaced all the damaged parts, with all new original parts... that was not cheap, but it's his pride an joy. I imagine, that some of us feel the same way.
A point about fixing armour
Oh man I laughed so hard when you showed all the power tools tangled together! I keep threatening where I work that "One of these days I'm just going to take all the power cords and make one super cord!"
I would suggest you take pride in your authentic battle damage. You aren't just some prissy fop son of a wealthy baron flitting about in your shiny new armor anymore. You are a battle hardened soldier !.
Bro I get it but this kind of craftsmanship costs thousands and thousands of dollars. This suit was probably over 5k
The sons of barons were highly overrepresented as hardened professional soldiers... This is the Middle Ages we are talking about. In fact, the etymological origins of "baron" is literally "soldier". People need to study actual medieval history instead of going off the Hollywood conception of the Middle Ages.
Love the pure improv when the cameraman didn't stop recording!
A proper knight would have his armorer fix it, so it's perfectly historically appropriate to do the same. It's a business expense and a perfect prompt for a video on the subject of repairing armor and how high-maintenance it must have been. Don't have him hide it too well; battle scars should be proudly displayed.
that's the first ad i haven't skipped through in months! well made.
also, i really liked your story, and your armorer's shop!
Ah so you two sorted out your differences then. I'm glad to see that you finally got your armour the way you wanted it.
I'm happy you got in touch with your armourer again. The dent/gauge? It just looks awesome. Bragging about a perfect, shiny armour never used in battle is what a Frenchman would do.
I hope everyone has the wonderful opportunity to learn of this absolutely legendary man
What a fascinating name you have
@@thenameless3271 Thank you, have a great day 😊
Sorry to hear that, hope it didn't put too much of a dampener on your time at Tewskesbury, it's such a great festival when I've gone (had to miss it again this year though).
The dent was made without any heat so there should be no issue to hammer it out cold either. I'd say find an armourer willing to give you a lesson how to hammer out dents from your armor. Leave the scratch how it is after buffing
Hammering out a dent in a hardened, heat treated piece of armor while cold is not a good idea. It causes undue stress and weakens the armor at best and could crack it at worst. Cold hammering a dent out of mild steel is fine, but high carbon steel used in armor needs heat to properly repair. It may even need to be normalized and rehardened in that spot.
I recognise that chap in the calendar 3:27 , it's Andy Deane of the Royal Armouries. He won the Easter joust this year. His armour is truly gorgeous too!
I wonder exactly how long it will take to get the full suit of armour on when its done? Also damn that armour looks so good.
That's a lot of weld. And it will ruin the heat treatment all around the dent. Not a terrible idea but I think for something so valuable, it would be best to have it repaired properly.
What had they said about a weld?
Huh, I must have posted the reply on the wrong comment... there was another comment about how he could fill in the dent with weld.
That is best compliment your armourer can have. He has produced a masterpiece of craftsmanship that has done its job and protected the wearer from serious injury. The git is probably a watcher of this channel.
The git, if discovered, should pay for the damage, given that it wasn't competitive and was fully scripted.
Good to see that your armourer has become a little more congenial than he was in the not so distant past.
Looked like a different armourer, unless I'm mistaken.
I am so glad that there are still craftsmen making these pieces. Thanks Lloyd for showing this; very impressive armour!. BTW that dent in your armour would have taken some force, if that had got through a gap instead, I dread to think what could have happened.
How about we race to finish “In Search of Hannibal”?
That elusive Hannibal keeps slipping away.
Hannibal is on the finishing line. Lindy had the full script given to the graphics guys a few months a year.
I was about to post exactly that. As much as I enjoyed watching his videos in the past, the feeling of being scammed keeps me from watching his videos. They just pop up in my timeline to remind me to never use kickstarter again.
@@FrankYooToob scammed? Hmmmmm
It'll be a marathon...
Wonderful video took me back to my SCA days and armoring up for a Sunday post brunch melee.
Hey Lindybeige, what happened to your friend who travelled to Ukraine to fight there (you told us in a video)? Can we get an update?
He was dying and went to a meat grinder to die. Put two and two together.
It was good to see you at tewksbury and having marvious chats about armour and medieval fashion
Finally! An armor episode!
You should repair the dent, of course, but rather than hide it try to accentuate the gouge in it. Like some kind of great big Kintsugi bowl. It'll be a cool sort of record of your battles.
Sir Lloyd of Beige
Two things, lindy, to perhaps assuage the savage beast: 1) The guy may only have been as experienced as I at re-enactment (it wasn't me!), but thought "Wow, great armour - must be a lord!" - so naturally, as per historical times, have been a bit desperate to succeed. 2) I did martial arts too, and as a friend once told me, he didn't think his Gi was entirely real until there was a bit of blood on it - so congrats, Lindy, blood on the Gi!
Hello Lindybeige - since you like armor, medieval stuff, LARP, and presumably some fantasy elements - you should consider visiting Le Duche de Bicolline in Quebec, Canada. I think you would really enjoy the big week long faire and battle event that is held in August each year. This will be my 4th year. Maybe I will see you there in 2023?
It's awesome to get another "biege video"! my life has been missing your videos Lloyd, so happy for another to come out! I saw on the chat section from somewhere else (I think it was shadaversity, talking about TH-cam burnout...) and saw on the replies to your comment, that a massive number of people had been auto-unsubbed from your channel, it sucks because you are my favorite "youtuber" and my day is always better after watching a new lindybiege video, you deserve more subbs, not less than you actually get :/
You could get a welder to fill the gouge then grind it flat to match then you dont lose any material. You would be surprised how a good welder can match the steel and you wont even notice it was ever damaged.
Ooof - even above the waist that's a low blow Mr Beige - no chivalry in these Lancastrian fiends (or jealous re-enactors). On the positive side I wouldn't worry about it showing - it's a good part of the history of the piece, it's an excellent field test and it will mostly remove the fear of it happening again.
I can see why knights had multiple squires.
Whatever you do with the dent, make sure it doesn't compromise the level of protection, maybe you can have a decorative reinforcement riveted in the zone? I'm not familiar with what could ruin the look of the armor, but make sure that scratch won't become a crack.
So I have frequently seen people stating something along the lines of "Well Actually, plate armor was made to fit really well and wouldn't impede your movements. SO having a penalty to stealth is Unrealistic." But it is pretty clear that when moving in plate you would still make much more noise than when moving in cloth or leather. So I think losing stealth is perfectly reasonable.
Also, it _does_ impede your movement.
So great you finally found a good smith!
Hey Lloyd, the dent can be fixed and the gauge can be filled in and made invisible. Or, perhaps, it can even be filled in visibly to show the scar. Japanese art called kintsugi comes to mind.
Get a welder to add metal to the gouge. Then grind off the excess. (AFTER pounding out the dent, of course.)
Turn the dent into an opportunity. Love to see a video on how knights repaired and maintained their armour. It would be a real part of life for a knight and the smith. Definitely be something i would watch.
Yeah I would love to know if any historical examples of armor repair exist! That would make a great video if so.
16:39 hammer it out and solder the gouge. and if you use the right alloy, the solder will leave a nice "scar" for display/story purposes.
Is it so bad to have a dent in your armor? I'm sure plenty of knights and soldiers had dents in their armor. Just makes it look more authentic to me.
The dent will tend to capture points and is weakened from its original condition. Best to restore it for strength and safety.
If you have the money to get a full suit of armor formed from scratch, you should hopefully have enough money for both upkeep and reperation. And the squire to put it on obviously
Says the person who doesn't have a suit of armor, you wouldn't mind if I came up and smashed the s*** out of the hood on your car, it'd give it character right...lol
I agree. Makers of things often dent and use chemicals and things to make their pieces look older and more worn for asthetics. It's like the old saying of not taking an untested blade (armor in this case) into battle.
@@Charok1 I'd be seeing you at the hospital if someone were to hit that spot on the chest plate again, and this time make an actual hole through it, as well as in everything past.
“A knight in shining armour is a man who has never had his metal truly tested.”
(I know it’s actually spelled “mettle”. The pun was intended.)
Now imagine forging this without electricity or machined tools. Historical craftsmen were astounding.
The medieval armourer would make all his tools, including machine tools, he'd set up with a waterwheel somewhere for powered hammers, presses, drills, and lathes. Or if he were a camp follower he'd have a bunch of human arms to power his machines.
I wonder if you could get some sort of adornment to cover up any remaining superficial damage?
A little lion token, maybe bronze?