I'm so ready to run this. We have a cleric and druid of Selune. I'm going to let them summon the moon into avernus to destroy an army, majora's mask style. Just hope they live that long.
In school I once saw a kid "sell his soul" for a cookie. Signed paper and everything. Is that legally binding in Avernus? Cause having a stock of souls going into this place seems like it would be a big help.
Quick tip I picked up in another youtube video and fleshed out for my own campaign... Start the campaign in Elturel right before its fall! I have it so that Duke Ravenguard of Baldurs Gate asked them to investigate Thavius Kreig and his potential devilish dealings. They accompany him to the city, split off to do their own thing, and while they're there.... boom. Elturel is ensnared by infernal chains draging the city and the party into the Nine Hells. Adds a huge, memorable set peice for the opener of your campaign and shoots them into the story with their own motives of self preservation to drive them on. Just an idea but I really loved it when I found it so I wanted to share!
Since the video is about preparing for Baldur's Gate: Descent Into Avernus, I'd like to offer a few observations I've made while running this, and I hope they're helpful for other DMs preparing to run this campaign. TL;DR There's some cool stuff in the book (infernal war machines, infernal contracts, Baldur's Gate gazeteer), but it suffers from a *lot* of problems (continuity errors, confusing design elements, author's assumptions overriding player agency) that you'll need to fix, regardless of whether or not you enjoy strictly linear adventures. On to the wall of text. 1. The adventure is very linear (read: railroad). If that's what you and your players want, you might enjoy this. If that's not what you and your players want, then you will have to think of a way to circumvent the linear narrative structure, such as: turning Baldur's Gate and Avernus into a point crawl (like a hexcrawl or dungeon crawl, but from point to point); rethinking the sequence of events that take place so they make sense; re-imagine the locations in Avernus so that they become situations that the characters find, rather than links in a series of plot hoops they have to jump through. 2. As written, the adventure is too vague on a lot of things that have to be clear for the DM. You will need to clearly define the problem that characters have to overcome; clearly define the relationships between villains; clearly define for yourself what the mystery is that players must solve; and place lots of additional clues for the players to find that will help them solve the mystery. For example, at one point early on, the only way to advance the plot is for an evil NPC to do the Big Reveal, despite their odds of survival being slim. At another point shortly thereafter, the only way to advance the plot is to find a McGuffin that's easy to miss, and if the players do miss it, the adventure literally tells the players where they should have looked, and then forces them to go back to get it. There's a lot of potential for the thrill of uncovering the overall truth in stages, but as written the villain NPC prevents all of the exciting plot-twist moments by spoiling the whole mystery in their Big Reveal. 3. Do research on Avernus. Read "Fiendish Codex II: Tyrants of the Nine Hells" (3.5E), "Planes of Law" (2E Planescape), "Book of Vile Darkness" (3.5E), Planescape adventures that take place in Avernus, and anything else you can find doing a Google search. The adventure doesn't give the DM any coherent guidance or useful information that they can use to adapt or improvise in response to unexpected player decisions. When in Avernus, locations are described only in terms of where they fit in the predetermined sequence of events that *must* be followed in order to advance the story. 4. Be ready to make up your own dungeons, because the dungeons in the book can get really lazy. For example, the Crypt of the Hellriders is something like thirteen rooms, but there are only seven unique room descriptions in the key. Also, there are no random encounter tables for Avernus like there were for Storm King's Thunder or Tomb of Annihilation. You should make some. 5. You'll have to do a *lot* of reorganizing and fleshing out. There are a lot of narrative elements - like villain motivation and schemes - that don't make sense. In fact, much of the book feels like a collection of ideas that sound cool but were unfinished and then strung together without much planning or forethought. 6. The adventure does not understand what redemption is. The entire time you're in Avernus, there are two goals: 1) rescue Elturel, and 2) redeem Zariel. In fact, the book spends most of its Avernus pages on the railroad to redeem Zariel but it never really thinks about what that really means. Redemption is not being given your old sword and suddenly deciding to turn over a new leaf. Redemption is the long process by which you show contrition, seek forgiveness, and atone for the hurtful things you've done. So really, it's impossible for the characters to redeem Zariel; she has to want to redeem herself. As the DM, you'll need to decide if giving Zariel her old sword and succeeding on an easy-to-moderate Charisma (Persuasion) check is enough to make the *Archduke of Avernus* want to atone for... what, exactly? You'll also need to decide what Zariel would want to be forgiven for. Two reasonable options might be 1) forsaking her celestial vows by allying with Asmodeus, or 2) Zariel, in her pride and hubris, taking advantage of the misplaced faith of good people in an ill-advised crusade that was doomed to failure and lead to their needless deaths or worse. Either way, you'd be changing the objectives of the players, so plan for that. The further I read in the adventure, the more I got the impression that the adventure was more interested in telling its own story than in facilitating the players' story. I also got the impression that there were a number of things included which were unnecessary or self-indulgent, but were still included either because it was a nostalgic call-back for players, a forced sightseeing tour, fan service, or a tie-in with an upcoming D&D product. For example, there's no reason to care about Baldur's Gate as it's presented in the book; it's so filled with crime and corruption that the idea of it being pulled into Avernus doesn't seem so bad. Even characters who are from Baldur's Gate wouldn't be blamed for wanting the city to go away. In my opinion, the only reason to save the city is because Adam Lee assumes that's what the players and characters would want to do because, "I mean, come on... it's *Baldur's Gate*!" as though that's reason enough (it's not). Oh, and there's also its connection with the upcoming Baldur's Gate 3 PC game. Name brand recognition is a thing, if we're feeling cynical. If you've read this far, thanks. I'll wrap up. BG:DiA plays like an incoherent collection of cut-scenes, and players are railroaded through something that feels like fan fiction. Players' decisions don't matter and too many specific plot threads don't make sense. A DM can salvage some useful stuff from it, but the adventure as written is probably 5E's worst.
Doug I really appreciate this well thought out review and description. I’m a player in this right now and I’m having a really good time. I guess I appreciate my DM more, knowing what he has to do to pull this off. :)
Wish they had included some more information about Jander Sunstar. He's not just a random NPC; he's got some back story that newcommers to D&D might miss.
Adam is apparently the sort of DM who railroads his players by threatening to kill their characters by fiat if they don't do what he wants. Since that's written into the adventure.
After running this adventure for the last 2 years I have some real choice words for this guy... it took so much work to get this adventure into a working condition which is very disappointing considering the price tag
my first instinct for this module is making a character inspired by one of the classes in the diablo series (like monster hunter ranger for the demon hunter or war mage for the sorceress)
@@biteso2333 Goodness, I'm not sure Artificer was official yet when I posted that comment originally, lol. But now that it's out in the Eberron book, absolutely!
Just started to play this campaign, I'm playing a Tiefling cleric light domain LG. The other players in my group are a bunch of stab happy murder hobos.......I think I'm in trouble.
Great interview :) I am going to start playing it hopefully within the next couple of months . We are just finishing up out current campaign and will start new characters for Descent into Avernus . I bought the book , but I am being good and not reading too much into it as a player . Not sure on what character to play , I am thinking of a Conquest Paladin , an Arcane Archer or maybe a Scout . An Horizon Walker(Ranger) might be interesting as well.
My players have finished LMoP and don't want to start again from 1st level, how would you go about running this adventure? Force them into Act I somehow and just tweak the difficulty of the encounters to account for them being level 5, or figure out a way to on-board them straight into Act II? Product Director
Level 5 is where you descend, so I'd just have phandelver be the city that is swallowed, and retweak the people there. It would be quite largely different, but it's doable if you're confident. However if you're not, just have them, being the heroes of Phandelver, go rescue the recently vanished Elturel, and start at the end of chapter 1.
I'm going to play as a tiefling paladin descended from Zariel and unlike most tieflings who tricksters or morally ambiguous he wants to be a hero and he will try everything in his power to stay a hero.
I ran something similar back when I was working on getting my lvl 0 dm skills to lvl 0.01 lol Basically a descendant of an infernal bloodline dedicated to be a Paladin like his mentor who had freed him from his "fate worse than death" (keeping it clean) until the mentor is later taken to forcefully serve the fated sentence. Throughout the story dreams of evil and horrific deeds haunt this Paladin struggling to find his mentor only to realize the dreams are him remembering what he's been doing through the journey. The weaker his mentor becomes the more intense and sinister the memories become. Eventually desires of the darkness begin to replace faith with lust for vengeance. Having fallen beyond redemption he stands before his broken mentor and captors he learns about his past and why overtime he was able to remember events that he'd first thought were dreams. Accepting his destiny he denies his former mentor the freedom of death but vows to make the suffering so legendary that mentors name will be echoed throughout eternity with the torment already endured by mentor being the last time mercy would shine on the unfortunate one. Sorry so sloppy. I had to get it done fast and leave out a lot of the details. Would love to hear more about yours if you ever get the time. Good day all
Constantine is a DC Comics (Vertigo imprint) character that's been around since 1985 and has had a number of different comic series. He's *basically* a supernatural detective, but the character gets into a lot more than just detective work. There was a 2005 movie (fun to watch, but not very true to the comics) and a very brief TV show (haven't seen it, can't say much about it). The character has a Liverpool accent, chainsmokes constantly, and looks like Sting. It's worth a read. : )
- Greetings, I was just curious if firearms, like revolvers, Muskets available in this campaign? If so I hope we get some bad ass demon forged firearms.
lol he makes the comment that FR is the most pop setting, which may have been true in older editions but in 5e it's basically the ONLY setting. Eberron has 2 books. Greyhawk has 1 adventure that can easily be genericed into other settings. Ravnica has one book. think that's it.
Theres some good 3rd party content as well, Like The Tal'Dorei campaign book through Green Ronin Press, and some of the online homebrew content of DM's Guild.
I cast suggestion on an npc we were interrogating to answer some questions and it caused us to skip a good 12 sessions in this campaign. Both proud and disappointed
This isn’t a bad thing, I mean no offence at all, but when Adam talks, it doesn’t look like those words should be coming out of his mouth. He looks more like a bassist from a once-was 90s grunge band, or a tire specialist at a Wal-Mart.
Great interview! It's like I could actually hear the door to the nine hells opening as they talked!
Nah it’s just a mimic who wants to be annoying
Ahhh, D&D. Once again proving that doors are the bane of our existence!
Edric Leggett well that and the promise of loot
Never underestimate the power of a door.
Someone lost his stealth roll.
I'm so ready to run this. We have a cleric and druid of Selune. I'm going to let them summon the moon into avernus to destroy an army, majora's mask style.
Just hope they live that long.
In school I once saw a kid "sell his soul" for a cookie. Signed paper and everything. Is that legally binding in Avernus? Cause having a stock of souls going into this place seems like it would be a big help.
He was reborn in the river Styx as a lemur
I own my friends soul in trade for a mountain dew.
I bought my friends soul for a box of tag alongs. Weird that you have the same story
A girl gave me hers for a high five once, contract and everything.
@@nicoprinzi2463 more importantly are we evil for even attempting to buy souls?
Quick tip I picked up in another youtube video and fleshed out for my own campaign...
Start the campaign in Elturel right before its fall!
I have it so that Duke Ravenguard of Baldurs Gate asked them to investigate Thavius Kreig and his potential devilish dealings.
They accompany him to the city, split off to do their own thing, and while they're there.... boom. Elturel is ensnared by infernal chains draging the city and the party into the Nine Hells.
Adds a huge, memorable set peice for the opener of your campaign and shoots them into the story with their own motives of self preservation to drive them on.
Just an idea but I really loved it when I found it so I wanted to share!
“Oh my God, Richard! Come in or stay out! Or for the love of God, get the WD40!”
Since the video is about preparing for Baldur's Gate: Descent Into Avernus, I'd like to offer a few observations I've made while running this, and I hope they're helpful for other DMs preparing to run this campaign.
TL;DR There's some cool stuff in the book (infernal war machines, infernal contracts, Baldur's Gate gazeteer), but it suffers from a *lot* of problems (continuity errors, confusing design elements, author's assumptions overriding player agency) that you'll need to fix, regardless of whether or not you enjoy strictly linear adventures.
On to the wall of text.
1. The adventure is very linear (read: railroad). If that's what you and your players want, you might enjoy this. If that's not what you and your players want, then you will have to think of a way to circumvent the linear narrative structure, such as: turning Baldur's Gate and Avernus into a point crawl (like a hexcrawl or dungeon crawl, but from point to point); rethinking the sequence of events that take place so they make sense; re-imagine the locations in Avernus so that they become situations that the characters find, rather than links in a series of plot hoops they have to jump through.
2. As written, the adventure is too vague on a lot of things that have to be clear for the DM. You will need to clearly define the problem that characters have to overcome; clearly define the relationships between villains; clearly define for yourself what the mystery is that players must solve; and place lots of additional clues for the players to find that will help them solve the mystery. For example, at one point early on, the only way to advance the plot is for an evil NPC to do the Big Reveal, despite their odds of survival being slim. At another point shortly thereafter, the only way to advance the plot is to find a McGuffin that's easy to miss, and if the players do miss it, the adventure literally tells the players where they should have looked, and then forces them to go back to get it. There's a lot of potential for the thrill of uncovering the overall truth in stages, but as written the villain NPC prevents all of the exciting plot-twist moments by spoiling the whole mystery in their Big Reveal.
3. Do research on Avernus. Read "Fiendish Codex II: Tyrants of the Nine Hells" (3.5E), "Planes of Law" (2E Planescape), "Book of Vile Darkness" (3.5E), Planescape adventures that take place in Avernus, and anything else you can find doing a Google search. The adventure doesn't give the DM any coherent guidance or useful information that they can use to adapt or improvise in response to unexpected player decisions. When in Avernus, locations are described only in terms of where they fit in the predetermined sequence of events that *must* be followed in order to advance the story.
4. Be ready to make up your own dungeons, because the dungeons in the book can get really lazy. For example, the Crypt of the Hellriders is something like thirteen rooms, but there are only seven unique room descriptions in the key. Also, there are no random encounter tables for Avernus like there were for Storm King's Thunder or Tomb of Annihilation. You should make some.
5. You'll have to do a *lot* of reorganizing and fleshing out. There are a lot of narrative elements - like villain motivation and schemes - that don't make sense. In fact, much of the book feels like a collection of ideas that sound cool but were unfinished and then strung together without much planning or forethought.
6. The adventure does not understand what redemption is. The entire time you're in Avernus, there are two goals: 1) rescue Elturel, and 2) redeem Zariel. In fact, the book spends most of its Avernus pages on the railroad to redeem Zariel but it never really thinks about what that really means. Redemption is not being given your old sword and suddenly deciding to turn over a new leaf. Redemption is the long process by which you show contrition, seek forgiveness, and atone for the hurtful things you've done. So really, it's impossible for the characters to redeem Zariel; she has to want to redeem herself. As the DM, you'll need to decide if giving Zariel her old sword and succeeding on an easy-to-moderate Charisma (Persuasion) check is enough to make the *Archduke of Avernus* want to atone for... what, exactly? You'll also need to decide what Zariel would want to be forgiven for. Two reasonable options might be 1) forsaking her celestial vows by allying with Asmodeus, or 2) Zariel, in her pride and hubris, taking advantage of the misplaced faith of good people in an ill-advised crusade that was doomed to failure and lead to their needless deaths or worse. Either way, you'd be changing the objectives of the players, so plan for that.
The further I read in the adventure, the more I got the impression that the adventure was more interested in telling its own story than in facilitating the players' story. I also got the impression that there were a number of things included which were unnecessary or self-indulgent, but were still included either because it was a nostalgic call-back for players, a forced sightseeing tour, fan service, or a tie-in with an upcoming D&D product. For example, there's no reason to care about Baldur's Gate as it's presented in the book; it's so filled with crime and corruption that the idea of it being pulled into Avernus doesn't seem so bad. Even characters who are from Baldur's Gate wouldn't be blamed for wanting the city to go away. In my opinion, the only reason to save the city is because Adam Lee assumes that's what the players and characters would want to do because, "I mean, come on... it's *Baldur's Gate*!" as though that's reason enough (it's not). Oh, and there's also its connection with the upcoming Baldur's Gate 3 PC game. Name brand recognition is a thing, if we're feeling cynical.
If you've read this far, thanks. I'll wrap up. BG:DiA plays like an incoherent collection of cut-scenes, and players are railroaded through something that feels like fan fiction. Players' decisions don't matter and too many specific plot threads don't make sense. A DM can salvage some useful stuff from it, but the adventure as written is probably 5E's worst.
Doug I really appreciate this well thought out review and description. I’m a player in this right now and I’m having a really good time. I guess I appreciate my DM more, knowing what he has to do to pull this off. :)
When you come to the comments to see if people are enjoying DIA, but everything is doors.
Wish they had included some more information about Jander Sunstar. He's not just a random NPC; he's got some back story that newcommers to D&D might miss.
He has been to Ravenloft, yes? Vampire in the mist?
Quintin Steevessenior Yeah he has, he’s even thrown down with Strahd
We just ran into him tonight and I went crazy. Vampires in the Mist and Realms of Valor. I read those 20+ years ago.
I came to hear about the new campaign, I stayed to oil the door hinges.
Adam was the sort of DM who was constantly wanting to make his paladins fall, wasn't he?
Adam is apparently the sort of DM who railroads his players by threatening to kill their characters by fiat if they don't do what he wants. Since that's written into the adventure.
After running this adventure for the last 2 years I have some real choice words for this guy... it took so much work to get this adventure into a working condition which is very disappointing considering the price tag
kept taking off my headset in confusion
This is so helpful to get as a DM
my first instinct for this module is making a character inspired by one of the classes in the diablo series (like monster hunter ranger for the demon hunter or war mage for the sorceress)
Excited to run this. Do I get a door soundboard for creep factor? Lol
4:58 Made an entirely new character just so I could emulate Constantine in-game xD
Currently running an all-warlock game and...oof. I really hope these guys make it!
I like the part where someone went through the squeaky door multiple times during the interview.
My Lulu is Bubbles the Power Puff Girl.
After hearing about the Mad max aspect, I want to play some kind of mechanic-esque character. Maybe a forge cleric?
Artificer!
@@biteso2333 Goodness, I'm not sure Artificer was official yet when I posted that comment originally, lol. But now that it's out in the Eberron book, absolutely!
Looking like a young Will Farrell
Staying adorable is important.
GOD. DAMN. DOOR.
NO!
Good and fun interview. I don't really feel any more prepared to run the game, though
Party full of bards no one can stop the CHR monster
Is that Cedric the owl from King's Quest as a voice reference??!
Somebody spend some money on WD40! Oil that freaking door! Lol
WD 40 is not a lubricant.
Just started to play this campaign, I'm playing a Tiefling cleric light domain LG.
The other players in my group are a bunch of stab happy murder hobos.......I think I'm in trouble.
How did it go?
@@Almighty_Mage not well.
That’s kinda funny, 90% of my campaigns have ended up with that exact assortment.
Tonight is the last session of Avernus for my Party. I'm the Vengence Paladin and yes it was very hard all the way. But worth it.
Got the book and the maps and the dice set...giddyup!
What is the point of Lav mics if you are going to have them sensitive enough to pick up every God damn time a door opens!
Great interview :)
I am going to start playing it hopefully within the next couple of months . We are just finishing up out current campaign and will start new characters for Descent into Avernus . I bought the book , but I am being good and not reading too much into it as a player . Not sure on what character to play , I am thinking of a Conquest Paladin , an Arcane Archer or maybe a Scout . An Horizon Walker(Ranger) might be interesting as well.
Omg the door! Like stop!
My players have finished LMoP and don't want to start again from 1st level, how would you go about running this adventure? Force them into Act I somehow and just tweak the difficulty of the encounters to account for them being level 5, or figure out a way to on-board them straight into Act II?
Product Director
Level 5 is where you descend, so I'd just have phandelver be the city that is swallowed, and retweak the people there. It would be quite largely different, but it's doable if you're confident. However if you're not, just have them, being the heroes of Phandelver, go rescue the recently vanished Elturel, and start at the end of chapter 1.
Oil the door please!!
I plan on playing a Half-Drow Fighter(Champion or EK) or Paladin(Oath of Heroism) for this mod
Ahhhh I came here for the good oil, but I hear you are all out.
I'm going to play as a tiefling paladin descended from Zariel and unlike most tieflings who tricksters or morally ambiguous he wants to be a hero and he will try everything in his power to stay a hero.
I ran something similar back when I was working on getting my lvl 0 dm skills to lvl 0.01 lol Basically a descendant of an infernal bloodline dedicated to be a Paladin like his mentor who had freed him from his "fate worse than death" (keeping it clean) until the mentor is later taken to forcefully serve the fated sentence. Throughout the story dreams of evil and horrific deeds haunt this Paladin struggling to find his mentor only to realize the dreams are him remembering what he's been doing through the journey. The weaker his mentor becomes the more intense and sinister the memories become. Eventually desires of the darkness begin to replace faith with lust for vengeance. Having fallen beyond redemption he stands before his broken mentor and captors he learns about his past and why overtime he was able to remember events that he'd first thought were dreams. Accepting his destiny he denies his former mentor the freedom of death but vows to make the suffering so legendary that mentors name will be echoed throughout eternity with the torment already endured by mentor being the last time mercy would shine on the unfortunate one. Sorry so sloppy. I had to get it done fast and leave out a lot of the details. Would love to hear more about yours if you ever get the time. Good day all
Had a similar pc. Zariel tiefling divine soul sorcerer
Hold the door! Hold the door!
Where can I get Adam's t-shirt?
Seriously- I want both of their shirts.
I'm still trying to remember what old D&D manual or module I saw that drawing in.
I would totally play an Oath of Redemption Paladin
omg, i loved this adventure but now even more because of the hollyphant!
What book/show/setting is this Constantine they are talking about from? Sounds interesting.
If I googled correctly it's a 2005 movie with Keanu Reeves
@@AvinTheBest I think it's also a comic book, but same setting as the movie you found
It's a DC comic
Constantine is a DC Comics (Vertigo imprint) character that's been around since 1985 and has had a number of different comic series. He's *basically* a supernatural detective, but the character gets into a lot more than just detective work. There was a 2005 movie (fun to watch, but not very true to the comics) and a very brief TV show (haven't seen it, can't say much about it). The character has a Liverpool accent, chainsmokes constantly, and looks like Sting. It's worth a read. : )
- Greetings, I was just curious if firearms, like revolvers, Muskets available in this campaign? If so I hope we get some bad ass demon forged firearms.
Where did Adam Lee get that shirt? I need it
Someone should lock that squeaky door or fire the person that keeps playing with it
lol he makes the comment that FR is the most pop setting, which may have been true in older editions but in 5e it's basically the ONLY setting. Eberron has 2 books. Greyhawk has 1 adventure that can easily be genericed into other settings. Ravnica has one book. think that's it.
Theres some good 3rd party content as well, Like The Tal'Dorei campaign book through Green Ronin Press, and some of the online homebrew content of DM's Guild.
You forgot Ravnica and a few minor suppliments for other MTG settings dude...
Exandria (by way of Wildemount) also got a book
D&D Beyond, great video! Enjoy your Friday! 💯🙏🙌
Anybody else NEED AL's T-Shirt?
Yikes. Grease them hinges, yo!
The door!!!!!
Sounds interesting
It’s official...I’m going to give Lulu a Mickey/Minnie Mouse Voice when I run this...
A game that can pit players against one another... That wont end bad at all.
And thus Hodor is born
I cast suggestion on an npc we were interrogating to answer some questions and it caused us to skip a good 12 sessions in this campaign. Both proud and disappointed
OMG I can't concentrate on what they are saying because of that damned DOOR!
Political intrigue. The houses are like corporations are evil and they’re trying to get as much as they can. Is ebberon fantasy shadowrun?
Nah Eberron is fantasy real life
This isn’t a bad thing, I mean no offence at all, but when Adam talks, it doesn’t look like those words should be coming out of his mouth. He looks more like a bassist from a once-was 90s grunge band, or a tire specialist at a Wal-Mart.
*humming* Oil, oil, oil your dooor, gently down the hallllll
dose anyone think a campaign in abir would be cool
Lets Do some 5e Dragonlance ....
For Krynn!! FOR PALADINE!!!
11:22 metagame pidgeon
Wtf is with the door lol
Why is he wearing a beanie like he's some punk teenager, looks silly.
As if I cared about DnD Beyond. They are part of the Corporation, not the Community.
Talk is too abstract.
I want stories about stories :/