Hey, David. I can't believe you haven't had feedback on this review since I last wrote you. I've purhased a few gravel bikes since then, the Canondale Topstone Lefty the only one with a suspension fork. I love all of them. Yesterday, I saw that Jenson USA, a bicycle discounter in the U.S., had a Warbird AXS Rival on a blowout special, 60% off the MSRP. I remembered this review, how enthusiastic you were about the pairing of the Rockshox Rudy and the Warbird, and decided to try this combination for myself. The bike should arrive by Monday.
I have just bought a Giant Revolt X which comes with this fork and it is a blast on the farm tracks and woods. But also great on the tarmac. I love it!
I use the Niner MCR gravel bike that has standard switchable air shocks front and rear. It is a carbon bike that weighs about 25 lbs. It also has a dropper post, which is useful on the trail for stability but also makes you far more aero downhill on tarmac. A different kind of bike would be the canyon grail that weighs 18 or 19 lbs, no shocks, but a flexing seatpost and a flexing handlebar.
You couldn't have said it any better...the price is very hard to swallow after I first looked it up. Especially when you can get a really nice mtb fork for only like 1 or 2 hundred more.
I have beein riding the Grizl CF SL 8 Suspension 1by for 3 weeks, its great. The dropper post with the dropper handlebar is still a perfect combination to take trails with you and the suspension fork allows me to come home relaxed. :-).
@@RttnAm1 I prefer the suspension fork. The gain in fun off-road is greater than the weight and aero disadvantage. I don't have a fork lock and I don't miss it either. The only disadvantage I see is the missing eyelets for quick mounting of fork bags. The combination of the dropper post and suspension fork brings the action of a mountain bike with the feel of the speed of a single wheel road bike on a single ride, in my opinion.🤩
had to laugh when you said how bad 90's mountain bikes were. I have one. Without shocks! The Warbird looks fabulous. Great review: I think I've been sold on suspension forks, which is a first.
The UK doesn't have much of the 'it isn't worth tarmac, but you'd still drive a car down it, just a bit slower' roads they have out in the US. Well they just lead to some property you might visit, mostly they don't go anywhere. UK gravel is a more varied thing and includes a bunch of ruttier farm tracks, and muddy churned up bridleways that have dried out a bit in the summer, as well as rockier stuff mainly up north. In such an environment the Rudy probably makes the most sense.
This is why I've decided to get a gravel bike with suspension - there's no real (or hardly any) gravel tracks where I live, which leaves searching out bridal paths which are generally uncomfortable to ride on stiff forks.
Definitely awesome. Have ridden all kinds of road bikes and MTBs for my 40 ys. of cycling and have always embraced equipment progress. If it rides better: yes bring it on!
The Warblrd is my favourite gravel bike. Mine is set up with a rigid Salsa WaxWing fork, a RedShift ShockStop seatpost, a Selle SMP Plus celeste saddle and so forth - and I absolutely love it: It's both very comfortable and, as you mentioned, fast.
would have loved deeper analysis on why 90s mtb are different to modern gravel bikes. It may 'feel' apparent but talk on handling, geo etc would be good to have covered , or maybe another video just on that?
actually geometry is almost the same as modern gravel - there's even a flatbar gravel/mtb for Specialized. There are advances in wheels, carbon forks are almost standard and 1x is a lot easier to deal with than 3x say going over a log. The bikes got lighter etc so it's all very incremental upgrades but it adds up and nowadays you can get 1x12 (with SRAM NX) on even 'budget' bikes.
What’s the difference between a 90’s era MTB and a modern gravel bike? How about 26” wheels, rim brakes, quick release axles, straight head tubes, 3x drivetrains, narrow rims…should I keep going?
I have the Topstone Lefty, front and rear compliance. Whatever one believes is irrelevant because the clock doesn’t lie.Suspension on dirt is faster, period. I have a rigid gravel bike and although great fun,it’s slower. I have two Tarmacs, one S-Works eTap, a stumpy, a DH rig, a hard tail and a jump bike. I have raced MTB successfully from way back and still own a 90’s MTB, and like Dave rightly has pointed out they are not good. The Cannondale solution is really good and I will keep it but I will definitely be building a new bike with this fork. As time goes on technology will improve, deliver more fun and create more smiles. Bring it on. Ride anything you want and enjoy yourselves. Peace.
Wonderful content. To the detractors, I look at it like this, a gravel bike with a suspension fork is the correct tool for many. In the area I live, this is ideal.
Riding any bike comes down to comfort and endurance. If the body gets relief then you can ride more with more enjoyment and a suspension fork will take out some of the punishment that your upper body receives. I believe that this is a natural progression of the gravel bike and it’s only a matter of time before bike companies are spec’n them. But first rockshox must bring the price down . The fork seems slightly over priced, probably because it’s new, but hopefully it’ll get below $.600-$550.🤞
I think the relationship between 90's mountain bikes and today's gravel bikes is a a case of convergent evolution. They started separately, and evolved separately to have similar traits. However, they're obviously pretty different.
How mtbing started in the 70's :Orange county.USA.Riders taking old 10 spd road bikes , Scwinn's & others and converting them. Many were trashed in the process but this led to bikes made for off roading. Surely ,we are going full circle.If you make too many compromises it is not fit for purpose. I started on full rigid mtb 1990,then front susp,full XC susp(short travel 63mm),100 mm .Now on 29er with long tr, front. To me gravel bike would be best for adventure/touring with load capability like my old rigid mtb with panniers etc.
As always, you give me a lot of things to think about. Right now, I am contemplating building my own gravel bike, and I have been eyeing the possibility of getting one of these Rudy beauties. You also have me thinking hard about going 1x, which I was pretty sure I would never want to do. Thanks for the cogent and well thought-out video, once again.
Good review. I use it the same way. I bought this suspension, ride it on trails and in summer I go on a bike trip with a rack with panniers on the back and front panniers. I have just 1 expensive gravel bike and it works for everything. I am very happy with it.
Ride what makes you happy and gets you out more. Nothing else matters. Personally, being able to lock out the fork means I can own a single bike for my Midwest USA riding. I can commute to work and explore the city but then go bikepacking, rip some gravel or single track, and fly down some milder mtb trails. I have no desire to get rly rowdy on a bike and therefore don’t need anything with more travel. Win win win
At this point you could just as well slap a dropbar and narrow semi slick mtb tires on a hardtail mtb. For the price of this bike you'd probably end up with a lighter and more capable bike. Will be interesting to see how far they're going to take this gravel bike development in the future. At some point they're going to cross a line into mtb territory.
You'd also have to change the shifters/levers, probably the brake calipers (different lever ratios between MTB and road brakes), probably the chainring, and then a lot of other modifications to get the geometry right. I don't think a conversion is just that simple.
@@mihalis1010 Surly now offer a drop bar which works with mtb levers and shifters, (it's called the "Corner Bar"). A LOT of older mtbs will see themselves converted with such an option.
For everyone saying a gravel bike is just a 90s MTB, or even a more recent hardtail MTB, I would like to share that I went that route last year and setup an early Eriksen 29er hardtail with traditional MTB geo from the 90s/2000s with an 80mm SID and "gravel" gearing. I was faster than my buddies on dedicated gravel bikes on downhills and chunkier sections but they dropped me quickly and regularly on flatter sections and climbs (more than usual). I found this came down to geometry and being less aero. I was running flat bars on a longer stem so "maybe" drops would've improved things a bit, but I doubt it would have made enough of a difference. And I was running 700c. With 26" tires and 7-9 speed hubs on a 90 bike you're going to be even harder pressed to come close with gearing except at the top and bottom. So in my experience, if you're riding alone a hardtail MTB of any vintage is of course totally serviceable and fun on "gravel", but if you're hoping to ride in groups I would suggest trying to get yourself a dedicated gravel bike. I did. And I even sold the Eriksen which was beautiful and titanium and that says something. :)
I actually think my next bike might be a full suspension MTB with semi-slick tyres that are around 50mm. MTB have become so capable, and I'm not planning on throwing myself off cliffs or jumps anytime soon. But I do see the value in a super comfortable ride that is still reasonably fast with the right tyres.
Girvin used to make one back in the '90's.....I never had one but I've had one of those new Redshift suspension stems on my gravel bike for the past 6 weeks.....and it's a bit of a game changer for me....
my next bike will be gravel + suspension. I love the feel of dropbar gravel bikes, but where I live the gravel trails will also have a lot of ruts and giant rocks and the decents can be kinda painful. thinking of the salsa stormchaser.
I can see the appeal of having suspension on a gravel bike. After riding mine through forests for four hours on really bumpy trails and getting shaken to shit and having a headache at the end of my ride this makes sense. Whilst still being efficient to ride it on the road to the trails.it’S all about comfort and efficiency whilst not sacrificing weight and speed innit. Cool review. Where are the trails you’re on they looks lovely?
That's exactly the reason why I sold my gravel bike last year, refurbised my ol' '90s MTB with a new airfork, huge 2.25" race XC tires and a dropper bar. And voilá, my perfext gravel bike and its frame geometry is almost identical to modern gravel bikes. Only the modern 28" wheels are missing, but the beefy 26" tires make it almost a good 27.5" bike. And 27.5" gravel bikes seem to be the new trend anyway. :)
I don't know whether you're in the UK therefore how specific you're asking, but this could be large sections from southern central to SE England in late spring to mid summer. I think he's said he often rides in the Cotswolds area and this could be.
I have the 30mm travel Rudy's on a bike and they are brilliant. They obviously aren't for big hits, but they absolutely kill trail chatter and vibration.
A great video as always David. A couple of questions. Would you put it on your lovely Fairlight or a custom steel gravel build that could be made around this fork? And if you double your gravel bike up as a winter road bike with a second set of wheels and road tyres would it work? I be interested to know what you think! Thanks for the great content 👍
I guess I'd rather wait for Suntour to catch up with Rockshox as I am looking for something light, good working and at a price of around U$150-200. They had a gravel fork, but it was a non-starter just like Fox. Hope they try again.
@@captaincommodore8901 Suntour Swingshock is dead-born failure. Have you tried it? It flexes on a packed gravel bike like after having a few strong beers.
Is Suntour's GVX a bad gravel fork? I was eyeing at getting one for my bike, but there's barely any reviews on it anywhere. Why did you say it's just like Fox?
@@vincetarrosa Yes, somehow the Suntour fork never took off. Maybe too heavy and too expensive compared to Rockshox. Or they had problems in the factory.
Hi, I would like to know the length of all tapered tube. From where the tapered starts (at 1,5" or 39.8 mm) to where the tube ends (at 1 1/8" or 28.6 mm). It is usually about 250 millimeters, but I need to know the exact length to see if I can mount it on my bike. Thanks
I own a custom built diverge evo with flat bars, future shock 2.0 and PNW coast suspension dropper post. I love it! It is really efficient on the road and in chunky gravel it is basically a dual suspension 90s MTB? XD.
Well, in short time we'll have the Paris-Roubaix race. There it will be decided whether the fork takes off (like the Rockshox Roubaix in the '90s) or not. I can imagine that many bikes will be retrofitted quickly with suspension in time.
Why would a race like the Roubaix be a deciding factor for tech like this? I get that's extreme for roadies, but Paris-Roubaix is tame. This type of tech is more for the likes of Belgian Waffle Ride or Unbound Gravel.
@@cjohnson3836 It's because of UCI requirements. All bikes in UCI races have to be available to customers after 6-12 months (somehow). Enthusiastic customers usually buy professionel replicas first and then it trickles down to average joe customers. Front forks will become ubiquitious like disc brakes after a while. We'll see...
That old Zaskar....gorgeous.... Lot of cash to spend out on this fork....Think I'll stick with my Redshift stem, although if I had the money, I'd give it a go....Possibly to do with the fact I've used RockShox MTB forks for 30 odd years, and they're good kit.
OOH David - I’ve only just got the Redshift Stem after watching your review and haven’t even put it on yet. Now I need this lol. The whole XPLR set up is amazing. I’ve love the 10-44 1x set up (what’s that you have on the front? Mine’s a 40). I like the look of the dropper - must check out your review on that. But after feeling like I was losing my fillings on a trail last weekend, I now wonder if I need to add this to my Open Up
The missing link between gravel bikes and 90s MTBs is basically tech advancement and new standards. The intent is almost the same. 90s XC MTBs and gravel bikes target what we now call green trails. The 1996 XC Olympic and World Championship courses would be well enjoyable on a modern gravel bike with a suspension fork and 4Xmm tubeless tires. A modern XC bike might be overkill for a skilled rider on these, but can handle 90's downhill courses. For comparison, your GT has a 73.5* STA, 70.5* HTA, 50mm tires, between 50-75mm of elastomer travel, and 550mm handlebar. The Salsa has a 74* STA, 69* HTA, 56mm tires, 30 or 40mm air travel, and drops that flare to a similar width as the old MTB bars. The similarities reflect the similar goals. It's okay to accept suspended gravel bikes are the ideal bikes for the same green trails 90's MTBs were designed to tackle and result in a modern interpretation of the OGs. The further gravel bikes go towards 'capability', the worse they are on tarmac, to the point of losing usefulness as a road bike. That's one reason I ditched my Lauf equipped, wide bar gravel bike.
@@lechprotean the Lauf was only a part of what made the bike great for gravel and trails, but not best for the road. It was quite soft but I doubt it cost much speed. It did feel a bit disconnected on tarmac. Cornering was less tight. Wide bars aren't aero and do cost speed. While those can be swapped, the overall character of that bike was kind of like a big American car from the 80s due to slack angles and a long wheelbase.
Could there be issues with downtube clearance? The controls look to have been kept as low as possible, but it obviously depends on frame design. The risk of frame damage could be high if it doesn't clear.
Hi, David do you still have the same opinion seven months later? Can you give me the exact specs of this bike? Why did you choose the Salsa frame? Thank you.
I have a rigid carbon fork with lots of mount points and tbh, I gave up on putting stuff there - it affects the handling, steering and singlepath clearance too much. I'd much rather get the panniers in the back than any weight on the fork.
Agree. It’s the only thing stopping me from upgrading to this. Bind mounts just don’t cut it. So if a manufacturer adds the mounts to a gravel fork, they can have my money
When you look at early incarnation MTB's and consider guys rode them with zero suspension, you'd be reasonable to ask if gravel roads need suspension. If the forks are well priced into the bikes overall costs then it's not a bad addition.
The thing is, forks on the after market are horribly expensive. A Rudy for EUR 869,- is just beyond reach for most buyers. But from the OEM point of view they are included in new bikes at almost no surcharge. In short time gravel front forkes will be like trekking bike forks... everywhere.
I really want that fork on my hybrid mountain bike because I don't need that much travel since I mainly ride on road and my hands just can't handle the rigid forks when going descends.
One you get to a really really rough surface for long rides, are you not better off on a good XC bike? Throw some drop bars on that if you really needed to? I guess the gravel out by me in the Midwest or my ride style just never warranted anything like that. Good tubeless tire setup and but a suspension seatpost on and some thicker bar tape and its plenty good for me. If it’s more than that, I just bust out my XC bike.
My biggest worry with a suspension fork would be to lose some of that instant power delivery. Does it feel like you lose a lot of energy out of the saddle? Love the tech btw, never understood how more choice can be a bad thing.
This bike as a whole was made for a different purpose. Warbird is a racing ready gravel bike. And, King won the Dirty Kanza/Unbound Gravel on a Cannondale lefty stating specifically that it was the suspension that allowed him to ride on aero bars the whole time (otherwise, you get beat up as you now have no arm flex to absorb the vibrations). If you approach this from that frame, this all makes sense. No, its not for everyone. It does have a place though.
So difficult not to be a naysayer or a grinch. New thinking is always good, BUT this is just so niche and the differences between a 650b adventure bike, a monster cross bike, a hardtail 29er with a Sid, and this, in real terms are just too hard to define for me. It always circles back; if the entire industry is trying to get suspension onto drop barred bikes (redshift, lauf, spesh future shock, this) then is that actually because the bikes can't really cope with the terrain as well as an XC bike... Would like to have a go on one for a long ride to really get to whether it is worth it.
If you ride this bike set up, you're guaranteed to enjoy it - it would be great......and so would a purpose built Mountainbike. I don't think you're being a naysayer or a grinch, you're simply calling out what's right in front of our noses. Bike industry marketing an old thing as a new thing to sell more things.
The appeal of suspension is long ride comfort. Roads here suck, riding a normal road bike with 25c tires was hell, I can still remember the road buzz in my hands. I can see the appeal to take the edge of long road rides while not sacrificing too much speed. And I see the appeal if you ride rocky gravel and road
What about the Salsa Cutthroat or Cotic Cascade? Those can do at least 29x2.4, how would that compare to the Rudy? How does the Rudy compare to the MRP Baxter?
Probably not because it’s flat mount… I’m getting ready for an easy 180 upgrade on my fox fork though. It even has an option for 80 or 100mm travel upgrades.
Maybe is to late to have an answer.... I'm 37, and I'm starting at biking. Do you think that this type of bike would be better for an starter than a mtb???
So essentialy it is a modern XC hard tail with dropbars and 700c wheels. V brakes and front suspension made Mountain biking more comfy in the early 90s, looks like this so called gravel thing is doing the same for the 20 20s.
Thinking about buying the canyon grizl, which got the rudy 30 on it. Im wondering if 30 isnt just a gimmick.. Think the 40 mm version would be more for me but i cant really find a bike with it in the same price range. What do you guys think? 30mm sus worth it?! And any 400 rudy bike reccomendations?
As an admitted lover of gimmicks, and guy in his 40s with a sore back who loves gravel riding with a drop bar bike. Dave, which bike would you go for? BMC URS with soft tail? Special Diverge with FSS 2.0? Or dive into this new range form SRAM with the suspension dropper? Others chime in as well. Keep the comments clean though otherwise internet karma will get you!
@16:37 Lol. Not sure about most people, but wouldn't take my bike to a blacksmith - it's the 21st century David!! Then again, I did see a couple of 'Clydesdales' on a group ride! Does this count?
Love gravel for its lack of physical suspension. I feel where suspension may be needed, the really gnarly stuff, such small travel is useless. I find I could use a bit of travel more in the rear wheel to prevent the occasional snake bite. I achieve perfect (almost) suspension in the front wheel with my body and have much more fun doing it. Your senses have to be more engaged, ankles, legs, core and arms have to be coordinated to absorb the grounds’s incongruences. Pedaling through a rock garden, your butt is not completely planted on the saddle, but floating above it, lightly resting on it. True gravel requires developing, learning a handling skill, that is extremely rewarding. A handling TECHNOLOGY which you will own for life, that does not go obsolete, or degrade. On the contrary, a technolgy which you will keep evolving as you have fun, and save your families’ cash. No reliance in external suspension, it only detracts from improving skills, disconnects from the ground, adds weight, never feels complete, money pit, sabotages the efficiency and pedalling joy of a light simple bike.
So, what are your opinions, this RockShox Rudy or Lauf suspension fork? I am leaning more towards the Lauf, but, I would consider it if the Rudy was upside down
Evenhanded review as always. I suspect the sticking point will ultimately be geometry. Rigid replacement forks for mountain bikes are suspension-corrected to preserve geo because suspension is the norm; it seems unlikely gravel bikes would ever incorporate sus forks to that extent. Gravel bike designs that offer 700/650b interchangeability are already compromises in terms of handling. Fork options would seem to require even bigger compromises. On the other hand, for my all-road-ish riding even GRX is overkill, so I may be all wet. If as you say the Rudy makes you faster, and if racing drives r&d as it usually does, then market segmentation will proceed as it usually does, creating a million niches to see what sells. The next gen Rudy will prob add a way to carry gear on it.
Great review. Currently planning to buy an XC bike for off-road in east Africa but this has me wondering if I should go for the Canyon Grizl with this fork. Of course, it’s seems impossible to actually get hold of any bike at the moment anyway 😢
Watch this video and then the one from cycling tips before this one, and tell me they haven’t done these reviews from a script! They’re nearly identical.
Interesting to compare to a 90s MTB, but why not compare to a current MTB. Throw some drop bars on a current hardtail and you've got a gravel bike for a lot less money :)
Modern MTBs have a long reach and short stem. Road bikes have short reach and long stem. But old 90's MTBs had short reach and long stems as well. So '90s MTBs are the way to go for conversion!
Your the only gravel cyclist reviewer I listen too. I appreciate your un biased opinions and your riding experience of all bicycles. Thanks mate! 👍🏼
Hey, David. I can't believe you haven't had feedback on this review since I last wrote you. I've purhased a few gravel bikes since then, the Canondale Topstone Lefty the only one with a suspension fork. I love all of them. Yesterday, I saw that Jenson USA, a bicycle discounter in the U.S., had a Warbird AXS Rival on a blowout special, 60% off the MSRP. I remembered this review, how enthusiastic you were about the pairing of the Rockshox Rudy and the Warbird, and decided to try this combination for myself. The bike should arrive by Monday.
I have just bought a Giant Revolt X which comes with this fork and it is a blast on the farm tracks and woods. But also great on the tarmac. I love it!
I use the Niner MCR gravel bike that has standard switchable air shocks front and rear. It is a carbon bike that weighs about 25 lbs. It also has a dropper post, which is useful on the trail for stability but also makes you far more aero downhill on tarmac. A different kind of bike would be the canyon grail that weighs 18 or 19 lbs, no shocks, but a flexing seatpost and a flexing handlebar.
Whoa, that niner MC9 RDO looks gnarly! I want one! Great price too. Now just how to get one to Japan.
You couldn't have said it any better...the price is very hard to swallow after I first looked it up. Especially when you can get a really nice mtb fork for only like 1 or 2 hundred more.
But a mtn bike fork will have too much travel for a gravel bike
I have beein riding the Grizl CF SL 8 Suspension 1by for 3 weeks, its great. The dropper post with the dropper handlebar is still a perfect combination to take trails with you and the suspension fork allows me to come home relaxed. :-).
Ordered mine 3 days ago.
Are you also fine with the bike on normal asphalt or is it just good on gravel?
Did tou receive yours ? I’m torn between rigid and suspension fork !
Would really appreciate your opinion ! Thank you
@@RttnAm1 I prefer the suspension fork. The gain in fun off-road is greater than the weight and aero disadvantage. I don't have a fork lock and I don't miss it either. The only disadvantage I see is the missing eyelets for quick mounting of fork bags. The combination of the dropper post and suspension fork brings the action of a mountain bike with the feel of the speed of a single wheel road bike on a single ride, in my opinion.🤩
@@deltarider100 thank tou very much I think I will follow your advice then go for the suspension too !
had to laugh when you said how bad 90's mountain bikes were. I have one. Without shocks! The Warbird looks fabulous. Great review: I think I've been sold on suspension forks, which is a first.
The UK doesn't have much of the 'it isn't worth tarmac, but you'd still drive a car down it, just a bit slower' roads they have out in the US. Well they just lead to some property you might visit, mostly they don't go anywhere. UK gravel is a more varied thing and includes a bunch of ruttier farm tracks, and muddy churned up bridleways that have dried out a bit in the summer, as well as rockier stuff mainly up north. In such an environment the Rudy probably makes the most sense.
This is why I've decided to get a gravel bike with suspension - there's no real (or hardly any) gravel tracks where I live, which leaves searching out bridal paths which are generally uncomfortable to ride on stiff forks.
I bought this RockShok when I converted my 4 season bike to gravel. It made a HUGE difference in how it performed.
Rockshox should sponsor you, your review convinced me to buy it.
Definitely awesome. Have ridden all kinds of road bikes and MTBs for my 40 ys. of cycling and have always embraced equipment progress. If it rides better: yes bring it on!
I ride a slate with a beautiful 30mm lefty. The fork id really a game changer for me and it is a Dirty Kanza wining bike.
The Warblrd is my favourite gravel bike. Mine is set up with a rigid Salsa WaxWing fork, a RedShift ShockStop seatpost, a Selle SMP Plus celeste saddle and so forth - and I absolutely love it: It's both very comfortable and, as you mentioned, fast.
would have loved deeper analysis on why 90s mtb are different to modern gravel bikes. It may 'feel' apparent but talk on handling, geo etc would be good to have covered , or maybe another video just on that?
actually geometry is almost the same as modern gravel - there's even a flatbar gravel/mtb for Specialized. There are advances in wheels, carbon forks are almost standard and 1x is a lot easier to deal with than 3x say going over a log. The bikes got lighter etc so it's all very incremental upgrades but it adds up and nowadays you can get 1x12 (with SRAM NX) on even 'budget' bikes.
It's true, you need a deeper analysis to assuage your dissonance that you overpaid massively for a glorified 90s mtb, LOL!
What’s the difference between a 90’s era MTB and a modern gravel bike? How about 26” wheels, rim brakes, quick release axles, straight head tubes, 3x drivetrains, narrow rims…should I keep going?
I have the Topstone Lefty, front and rear compliance. Whatever one believes is irrelevant because the clock doesn’t lie.Suspension on dirt is faster, period. I have a rigid gravel bike and although great fun,it’s slower. I have two Tarmacs, one S-Works eTap, a stumpy, a DH rig, a hard tail and a jump bike. I have raced MTB successfully from way back and still own a 90’s MTB, and like Dave rightly has pointed out they are not good. The Cannondale solution is really good and I will keep it but I will definitely be building a new bike with this fork. As time goes on technology will improve, deliver more fun and create more smiles. Bring it on. Ride anything you want and enjoy yourselves. Peace.
Wonderful content. To the detractors, I look at it like this, a gravel bike with a suspension fork is the correct tool for many. In the area I live, this is ideal.
Riding any bike comes down to comfort and endurance. If the body gets relief then you can ride more with more enjoyment and a suspension fork will take out some of the punishment that your upper body receives.
I believe that this is a natural progression of the gravel bike and it’s only a matter of time before bike companies are spec’n them.
But first rockshox must bring the price down . The fork seems slightly over priced, probably because it’s new, but hopefully it’ll get below $.600-$550.🤞
I think the relationship between 90's mountain bikes and today's gravel bikes is a a case of convergent evolution. They started separately, and evolved separately to have similar traits. However, they're obviously pretty different.
As an evo ecologist, I have to give you a like due to the rare, correct, in the wild, invocation of the phrase, "convergent evolution".
Oh yeah? Can you write that differences down for me, please? Because with this fork released the only difference I see is handlebars and wheel size.
@@amdmg7 wheels, drop bars, brakes, geometry, 1x drivetrain, dropper post (if applicable), tires...etc. Everything is different.
Very informative review as always - Thank you, David! =)
👍
How mtbing started in the 70's :Orange county.USA.Riders taking old 10 spd road bikes , Scwinn's & others and converting them. Many were trashed in the process but this led to bikes made for off roading. Surely ,we are going full circle.If you make too many compromises it is not fit for purpose. I started on full rigid mtb 1990,then front susp,full XC susp(short travel 63mm),100 mm .Now on 29er with long tr, front. To me gravel bike would be best for adventure/touring with load capability like my old rigid mtb with panniers etc.
As always, you give me a lot of things to think about. Right now, I am contemplating building my own gravel bike, and I have been eyeing the possibility of getting one of these Rudy beauties. You also have me thinking hard about going 1x, which I was pretty sure I would never want to do. Thanks for the cogent and well thought-out video, once again.
Good review. I use it the same way. I bought this suspension, ride it on trails and in summer I go on a bike trip with a rack with panniers on the back and front panniers. I have just 1 expensive gravel bike and it works for everything. I am very happy with it.
Would you buy the suspension again if your focus was longer bike trips on mostly asphalt, little gravel?
Ride what makes you happy and gets you out more. Nothing else matters. Personally, being able to lock out the fork means I can own a single bike for my Midwest USA riding. I can commute to work and explore the city but then go bikepacking, rip some gravel or single track, and fly down some milder mtb trails. I have no desire to get rly rowdy on a bike and therefore don’t need anything with more travel. Win win win
Damn that Triple Triangle frame.😍
At this point you could just as well slap a dropbar and narrow semi slick mtb tires on a hardtail mtb. For the price of this bike you'd probably end up with a lighter and more capable bike. Will be interesting to see how far they're going to take this gravel bike development in the future. At some point they're going to cross a line into mtb territory.
You'd also have to change the shifters/levers, probably the brake calipers (different lever ratios between MTB and road brakes), probably the chainring, and then a lot of other modifications to get the geometry right. I don't think a conversion is just that simple.
@@mihalis1010 Surly now offer a drop bar which works with mtb levers and shifters, (it's called the "Corner Bar"). A LOT of older mtbs will see themselves converted with such an option.
For everyone saying a gravel bike is just a 90s MTB, or even a more recent hardtail MTB, I would like to share that I went that route last year and setup an early Eriksen 29er hardtail with traditional MTB geo from the 90s/2000s with an 80mm SID and "gravel" gearing. I was faster than my buddies on dedicated gravel bikes on downhills and chunkier sections but they dropped me quickly and regularly on flatter sections and climbs (more than usual). I found this came down to geometry and being less aero. I was running flat bars on a longer stem so "maybe" drops would've improved things a bit, but I doubt it would have made enough of a difference. And I was running 700c. With 26" tires and 7-9 speed hubs on a 90 bike you're going to be even harder pressed to come close with gearing except at the top and bottom. So in my experience, if you're riding alone a hardtail MTB of any vintage is of course totally serviceable and fun on "gravel", but if you're hoping to ride in groups I would suggest trying to get yourself a dedicated gravel bike. I did. And I even sold the Eriksen which was beautiful and titanium and that says something. :)
@@BoogieBrewEven for these special handlebars, you often have to get longer cables to fit your flat bar brakes/shifters.
I actually think my next bike might be a full suspension MTB with semi-slick tyres that are around 50mm. MTB have become so capable, and I'm not planning on throwing myself off cliffs or jumps anytime soon. But I do see the value in a super comfortable ride that is still reasonably fast with the right tyres.
Suspension stems are so 90’s I love it. Was it giroflex that used to make them?
Girvin used to make one back in the '90's.....I never had one but I've had one of those new Redshift suspension stems on my gravel bike for the past 6 weeks.....and it's a bit of a game changer for me....
Thanks
my next bike will be gravel + suspension. I love the feel of dropbar gravel bikes, but where I live the gravel trails will also have a lot of ruts and giant rocks and the decents can be kinda painful. thinking of the salsa stormchaser.
I can see the appeal of having suspension on a gravel bike. After riding mine through forests for four hours on really bumpy trails and getting shaken to shit and having a headache at the end of my ride this makes sense. Whilst still being efficient to ride it on the road to the trails.it’S all about comfort and efficiency whilst not sacrificing weight and speed innit. Cool review. Where are the trails you’re on they looks lovely?
That's exactly the reason why I sold my gravel bike last year, refurbised my ol' '90s MTB with a new airfork, huge 2.25" race XC tires and a dropper bar. And voilá, my perfext gravel bike and its frame geometry is almost identical to modern gravel bikes. Only the modern 28" wheels are missing, but the beefy 26" tires make it almost a good 27.5" bike. And 27.5" gravel bikes seem to be the new trend anyway. :)
I don't know whether you're in the UK therefore how specific you're asking, but this could be large sections from southern central to SE England in late spring to mid summer. I think he's said he often rides in the Cotswolds area and this could be.
Really nice Video and lots of useful impressions that didnt come to my mind just by looking at the fork. Great!
Glad it was helpful!
Nice review David! Thinking about sticking one on the BMC URS ONE!
You should!
Even 2 years on, I'm still not convinced! 40mm seems plausible, 30? I really can't see much point! Great video, as usual! ✌️
I have the 30mm travel Rudy's on a bike and they are brilliant. They obviously aren't for big hits, but they absolutely kill trail chatter and vibration.
i like it looks like it is set perfect , im tempted to go one when i buy a gravel bike next
A great video as always David. A couple of questions. Would you put it on your lovely Fairlight or a custom steel gravel build that could be made around this fork? And if you double your gravel bike up as a winter road bike with a second set of wheels and road tyres would it work? I be interested to know what you think! Thanks for the great content 👍
its nice to see gravel bikes twithought the tan sidewall.
Awesome review and video David. If not for the dropped chain stay that frame looks a lot like my S-Works Aethos.
I guess I'd rather wait for Suntour to catch up with Rockshox as I am looking for something light, good working and at a price of around U$150-200. They had a gravel fork, but it was a non-starter just like Fox. Hope they try again.
The waiting is over :D Look for the Suntour Swingshock. It is very likely what you have in mind.
@@captaincommodore8901 Suntour Swingshock is dead-born failure. Have you tried it? It flexes on a packed gravel bike like after having a few strong beers.
@@DilbertMuc It wasn't to serious :P
Is Suntour's GVX a bad gravel fork? I was eyeing at getting one for my bike, but there's barely any reviews on it anywhere. Why did you say it's just like Fox?
@@vincetarrosa Yes, somehow the Suntour fork never took off. Maybe too heavy and too expensive compared to Rockshox. Or they had problems in the factory.
9.5kg with suspension and a dropper post hahaha, that’s the same weight as my Giant alloy road bike as it came stock 😄
Hi, I would like to know the length of all tapered tube. From where the tapered starts (at 1,5" or 39.8 mm) to where the tube ends (at 1 1/8" or 28.6 mm). It is usually about 250 millimeters, but I need to know the exact length to see if I can mount it on my bike.
Thanks
Suntour also has a gravel fork, the Suntour GVX. Have you tried that one?
I haven’t tried that one yet, one to add to the list
Looks fun. Current price on bike tires direct is 463 US dollars
I own a custom built diverge evo with flat bars, future shock 2.0 and PNW coast suspension dropper post. I love it! It is really efficient on the road and in chunky gravel it is basically a dual suspension 90s MTB? XD.
Well, in short time we'll have the Paris-Roubaix race. There it will be decided whether the fork takes off (like the Rockshox Roubaix in the '90s) or not. I can imagine that many bikes will be retrofitted quickly with suspension in time.
Why would a race like the Roubaix be a deciding factor for tech like this? I get that's extreme for roadies, but Paris-Roubaix is tame. This type of tech is more for the likes of Belgian Waffle Ride or Unbound Gravel.
@@cjohnson3836 It's because of UCI requirements. All bikes in UCI races have to be available to customers after 6-12 months (somehow). Enthusiastic customers usually buy professionel replicas first and then it trickles down to average joe customers. Front forks will become ubiquitious like disc brakes after a while. We'll see...
That old Zaskar....gorgeous....
Lot of cash to spend out on this fork....Think I'll stick with my Redshift stem, although if I had the money, I'd give it a go....Possibly to do with the fact I've used RockShox MTB forks for 30 odd years, and they're good kit.
OOH David - I’ve only just got the Redshift Stem after watching your review and haven’t even put it on yet. Now I need this lol. The whole XPLR set up is amazing. I’ve love the 10-44 1x set up (what’s that you have on the front? Mine’s a 40). I like the look of the dropper - must check out your review on that. But after feeling like I was losing my fillings on a trail last weekend, I now wonder if I need to add this to my Open Up
12:51 specialized owes you royalties for the STR coining here
The missing link between gravel bikes and 90s MTBs is basically tech advancement and new standards. The intent is almost the same. 90s XC MTBs and gravel bikes target what we now call green trails. The 1996 XC Olympic and World Championship courses would be well enjoyable on a modern gravel bike with a suspension fork and 4Xmm tubeless tires. A modern XC bike might be overkill for a skilled rider on these, but can handle 90's downhill courses. For comparison, your GT has a 73.5* STA, 70.5* HTA, 50mm tires, between 50-75mm of elastomer travel, and 550mm handlebar. The Salsa has a 74* STA, 69* HTA, 56mm tires, 30 or 40mm air travel, and drops that flare to a similar width as the old MTB bars. The similarities reflect the similar goals. It's okay to accept suspended gravel bikes are the ideal bikes for the same green trails 90's MTBs were designed to tackle and result in a modern interpretation of the OGs. The further gravel bikes go towards 'capability', the worse they are on tarmac, to the point of losing usefulness as a road bike. That's one reason I ditched my Lauf equipped, wide bar gravel bike.
That's just one small point. Still loving the content and value the perspective you bring. Keep up the good work!
Well said!
interesting - how did lauf make the bike unfeasible for road? Was it too soft/spongly?
@@lechprotean the Lauf was only a part of what made the bike great for gravel and trails, but not best for the road. It was quite soft but I doubt it cost much speed. It did feel a bit disconnected on tarmac. Cornering was less tight. Wide bars aren't aero and do cost speed. While those can be swapped, the overall character of that bike was kind of like a big American car from the 80s due to slack angles and a long wheelbase.
Could there be issues with downtube clearance? The controls look to have been kept as low as possible, but it obviously depends on frame design. The risk of frame damage could be high if it doesn't clear.
This is a huge issue. I was about to order a fork until I read your comment. Thank you.
Hi, David do you still have the same opinion seven months later?
Can you give me the exact specs of this bike?
Why did you choose the Salsa frame?
Thank you.
You missed one downside. No mounts for cages or bags, unlike a lot of carbon forks.
I have a rigid carbon fork with lots of mount points and tbh, I gave up on putting stuff there - it affects the handling, steering and singlepath clearance too much. I'd much rather get the panniers in the back than any weight on the fork.
Agree. It’s the only thing stopping me from upgrading to this. Bind mounts just don’t cut it. So if a manufacturer adds the mounts to a gravel fork, they can have my money
@@lechproteantotally agree, plus anything catches on strapped on stuff I would be concerned on the carbon fork being affected
Thank you for a trip down memory lane :)
When you look at early incarnation MTB's and consider guys rode them with zero suspension, you'd be reasonable to ask if gravel roads need suspension. If the forks are well priced into the bikes overall costs then it's not a bad addition.
The thing is, forks on the after market are horribly expensive. A Rudy for EUR 869,- is just beyond reach for most buyers. But from the OEM point of view they are included in new bikes at almost no surcharge. In short time gravel front forkes will be like trekking bike forks... everywhere.
Great video David I feel convinced about this suspension solution. Please let me know the frame brand we saw here
I really want that fork on my hybrid mountain bike because I don't need that much travel since I mainly ride on road and my hands just can't handle the rigid forks when going descends.
One you get to a really really rough surface for long rides, are you not better off on a good XC bike? Throw some drop bars on that if you really needed to?
I guess the gravel out by me in the Midwest or my ride style just never warranted anything like that. Good tubeless tire setup and but a suspension seatpost on and some thicker bar tape and its plenty good for me. If it’s more than that, I just bust out my XC bike.
My biggest worry with a suspension fork would be to lose some of that instant power delivery. Does it feel like you lose a lot of energy out of the saddle? Love the tech btw, never understood how more choice can be a bad thing.
@N. D. True, but you will still compromise on responsiveness when standing on the pedals, maybe it needs a remote lockout like a lot XC bikes have.
Hi David - could you see this replacing the fairlight? Or would you consider adding the fork to it? Any thoughts on the two travel options?
I would love to try this fork on my Fairlight
@@davidarthur would be interesting how it gets on against the redshift to create the smoothest ride!!
Got mine off wiggle for £579 seemed a good buy at that price. Going to fit mine on the already diverse nukeproof digger.
Blimey that's a decent discount considering it was only launched last year
@@davidarthur it never ended up fitting my wheelset but it’s a very good price!
Gravel bike should be simple that's people prefer it over full suspension mountain bike.
I still prefer rigid pure gravel bike
Exactly, it's the simplicity of the gravel bike that keeps the riding pure and more enjoyable.
This bike as a whole was made for a different purpose. Warbird is a racing ready gravel bike. And, King won the Dirty Kanza/Unbound Gravel on a Cannondale lefty stating specifically that it was the suspension that allowed him to ride on aero bars the whole time (otherwise, you get beat up as you now have no arm flex to absorb the vibrations). If you approach this from that frame, this all makes sense. No, its not for everyone. It does have a place though.
It's true, whatever is the trend Kamil Adam is on it!
Getting mine installed on my BMC Urs today :P
What about the Cannondale Topstone lefty? Have you test that one yet? I would like to see what you think of that one.
What BB standard does that have? JS.
Super présentation , je vais monter cette fourche sur mon Canyon endurace on : 👍👍
May I know the info on the series of bicycles from which brand?
does it work with 650B??!! maybe something worth covering
What frameset are you using on this video?
So difficult not to be a naysayer or a grinch. New thinking is always good, BUT this is just so niche and the differences between a 650b adventure bike, a monster cross bike, a hardtail 29er with a Sid, and this, in real terms are just too hard to define for me. It always circles back; if the entire industry is trying to get suspension onto drop barred bikes (redshift, lauf, spesh future shock, this) then is that actually because the bikes can't really cope with the terrain as well as an XC bike... Would like to have a go on one for a long ride to really get to whether it is worth it.
If you ride this bike set up, you're guaranteed to enjoy it - it would be great......and so would a purpose built Mountainbike. I don't think you're being a naysayer or a grinch, you're simply calling out what's right in front of our noses. Bike industry marketing an old thing as a new thing to sell more things.
The appeal of suspension is long ride comfort. Roads here suck, riding a normal road bike with 25c tires was hell, I can still remember the road buzz in my hands. I can see the appeal to take the edge of long road rides while not sacrificing too much speed. And I see the appeal if you ride rocky gravel and road
Great review Dave . That kit is off the scale, please divulge ?.
Thanks! It’s Sportful Giara, there’s a link in the description to check it out
What about the Salsa Cutthroat or Cotic Cascade? Those can do at least 29x2.4, how would that compare to the Rudy? How does the Rudy compare to the MRP Baxter?
These things really are becoming the mtb of yester year
Can you install the Fork with a 650b wheel?
Can you please let me know if it is possible to fit a 180mm disc? Are any special adaptors required? Tks.
Probably not because it’s flat mount… I’m getting ready for an easy 180 upgrade on my fox fork though. It even has an option for 80 or 100mm travel upgrades.
What bike model is this? Thanks
Maybe is to late to have an answer.... I'm 37, and I'm starting at biking. Do you think that this type of bike would be better for an starter than a mtb???
So essentialy it is a modern XC hard tail with dropbars and 700c wheels. V brakes and front suspension made Mountain biking more comfy in the early 90s, looks like this so called gravel thing is doing the same for the 20 20s.
Thinking about buying the canyon grizl, which got the rudy 30 on it. Im wondering if 30 isnt just a gimmick.. Think the 40 mm version would be more for me but i cant really find a bike with it in the same price range. What do you guys think? 30mm sus worth it?! And any 400 rudy bike reccomendations?
The Giant Revolt X1 aluminium frame, just got it and it's great. Frame suspension corrected as well.
As an admitted lover of gimmicks, and guy in his 40s with a sore back who loves gravel riding with a drop bar bike. Dave, which bike would you go for? BMC URS with soft tail? Special Diverge with FSS 2.0? Or dive into this new range form SRAM with the suspension dropper? Others chime in as well. Keep the comments clean though otherwise internet karma will get you!
It's a dropper post - not rear suspension at all.
@@whistlerrealestate1 Youre absolutely right Dean. But it does have some cushioning when dropped.
30! Gramms lighter than the fully potent 100mm Sid fork. Honestly Rock Shox?
After watching this I have answered for myself the question 'does a suspension fork belong in gravel biking?' Yes, it does.
@16:37 Lol. Not sure about most people, but wouldn't take my bike to a blacksmith - it's the 21st century David!!
Then again, I did see a couple of 'Clydesdales' on a group ride! Does this count?
drop bar XC bike?
it makes more sense to have rear suspension before front.
What handle bars are those?
Love gravel for its lack of physical suspension. I feel where suspension may be needed, the really gnarly stuff, such small travel is useless. I find I could use a bit of travel more in the rear wheel to prevent the occasional snake bite. I achieve perfect (almost) suspension in the front wheel with my body and have much more fun doing it. Your senses have to be more engaged, ankles, legs, core and arms have to be coordinated to absorb the grounds’s incongruences. Pedaling through a rock garden, your butt is not completely planted on the saddle, but floating above it, lightly resting on it. True gravel requires developing, learning a handling skill, that is extremely rewarding. A handling TECHNOLOGY which you will own for life, that does not go obsolete, or degrade. On the contrary, a technolgy which you will keep evolving as you have fun, and save your families’ cash. No reliance in external suspension, it only detracts from improving skills, disconnects from the ground, adds weight, never feels complete, money pit, sabotages the efficiency and pedalling joy of a light simple bike.
would this fork be the lightest ( 1.23kg ) in the market ?
So, what are your opinions, this RockShox Rudy or Lauf suspension fork? I am leaning more towards the Lauf, but, I would consider it if the Rudy was upside down
Rudy everyday imo
Awesome!!
This fork on the BMC Urs is then the best gravel bike available? :D
That could be an exciting combo for sure
@@davidarthur Because i got the Urs so i will go for the 40mm fork :D
Evenhanded review as always. I suspect the sticking point will ultimately be geometry. Rigid replacement forks for mountain bikes are suspension-corrected to preserve geo because suspension is the norm; it seems unlikely gravel bikes would ever incorporate sus forks to that extent. Gravel bike designs that offer 700/650b interchangeability are already compromises in terms of handling. Fork options would seem to require even bigger compromises. On the other hand, for my all-road-ish riding even GRX is overkill, so I may be all wet. If as you say the Rudy makes you faster, and if racing drives r&d as it usually does, then market segmentation will proceed as it usually does, creating a million niches to see what sells. The next gen Rudy will prob add a way to carry gear on it.
Great review. Currently planning to buy an XC bike for off-road in east Africa but this has me wondering if I should go for the Canyon Grizl with this fork. Of course, it’s seems impossible to actually get hold of any bike at the moment anyway 😢
I am so curious if the RockShok gravel fork is compatible with the Future Shock 2.0. I can't find any information on this.
No it won’t be, you can’t use any other fork with the future shock. But I have to ask why would you want to?
Thanks.
Great looking and the fork doesn’t look out of place IMO! As always though priced way too high.
Watch this video and then the one from cycling tips before this one, and tell me they haven’t done these reviews from a script! They’re nearly identical.
I have a set of New Ruby forks I never fitted! Used by Motorola in Paris Roubaix 😉
Suspension stem that's all u need red shift pro!
Will 650b wheels fit on those forks? I checked the website and it only seems to mention 700c.
Now all I need is a motor to haul the extra weight along and the dollars that go with that
Trust me you don’t need a motor to make this bike fast. Top ten in my local CX race and similar round a 100km gravel route
Love it!
Interesting to compare to a 90s MTB, but why not compare to a current MTB. Throw some drop bars on a current hardtail and you've got a gravel bike for a lot less money :)
Modern MTBs have a long reach and short stem. Road bikes have short reach and long stem. But old 90's MTBs had short reach and long stems as well. So '90s MTBs are the way to go for conversion!
Looks great good way to go and more fun🤙