I watch this channel just to feel less depressed in general sometimes. The relationship between the two of you is contagiously heartwarming. Keep up the great work!
It is really cool and unique and special, great show great example of how to have a great father son dynamic which is so rare these days, I'm sure there are many jealous parts watching 😂
@@jarad4621yes. Watching these 2 together sometumes triggers my envious feelings of longing for that parent child relationship I never had with my mom or dad. Dealing with "envy" is one of my shadow parts.ha
Thank you for being my favourite podcast. This topic is in my face every day at my job of over 20 years. Hundreds of members of the public moment to moment to practice with 40 hours a week. Not long ago I resented it deeply and tried to leave more than once. Now it's my "charnel ground" often; a place for me to overcome fear and recognize others' fears. God presents me with the situations that will show me myself and give me the space to exercise free will. Controversial as that may be. These shadows of mine want to be freed up; I know because others see them arise on my face and reflect back how they affect the world. Red flags abound. Hand shakes to you both. Deep bows.
Great topic, and I really appreciate Rick's handling of the "Golden Shadow" aspects that aren't often addressed. From my personal explorations I find that the repression of those "gentler" aspects of self that were unable to defend themselves is perhaps the most problematic and tragic of all, limiting the efficacy of the individual in pursuing or even recognizing positive needs and goals. The threat those parts were confronted with caused other parts to become defensive, even vicious toward them (inner critic), furthering the suppression in pursuit of "safety" at the cost of being "invisible". Even upon recognition of this dynamic, it appears that there is still no place in the outer world for them to express, for acceptance without exploitation, further encouraging the defending parts and hampering integration efforts as well as practical matters. It's a very resistant arrangement. I have been approaching this issue through use of "semi-active imagination" for almost 2 years, playing out the "characters" in an internal narrative drama with attempts to write them out; I usually find my literary skills insufficient to the task, and the conscious awareness unable to hold and convey the depth and nuance of the subconscious imagery and emotional/ conceptual associations that emerge - as Joseph Campbell and many others have observed, words are inadequate symbols. Of course I don't have the formal training to prepare for such an undertaking and would not have chosen to pursue it. If events had not "conspired" to crack my subconscious open like the San Andreas faultline under my feet, which I fell into, I would not have. Carl Jung warned about the dangers of taking up these "quests" unprepared, and his own experiences with "psychosis" that led to his Red Book stand as his example. However, I can only imagine that almost NO ONE actively CHOOSES to do this and that many others besides myself find themselves overwhelmed and overmatched by this involuntary process due to crisis. So, how DOES an average "disordered" person prepare for such an event, and how does one who finds himself on an unfamiliar ocean under alien stars navigate the hazards and bring back the gold from the shadow? A followup video with some practical guidance would be a real treasure for the world, and a lifesaver for those of us awash in heavy seas. Thanks Rick and Forrest, great content as usual.
Dr. Hanson, as someone who has lifelong experience with “the jungle” (intrusive thoughts) I so appreciate your vulnerability and willingness to offer your own experiences. By doing so you thereby normalize them for the rest of us, many of whom are too ashamed to admit to having them. I’ve had them too about people I love including my grandmother and more recently postpartum my son - very different than a compulsion to actually harm. It’s very disturbing when the thoughts arise but they are in fact just thoughts. Thank you for touching on this taboo and very important subject!
"The shadow is not necessarily always an opponent, in fact, they are exactly like any human being with whom we have to get along. Sometimes by giving in, sometimes by resisting, sometimes by giving love, whatever the situation requires. The shadow becomes hostile only when ignored or misunderstood." -Marie Louise Von-Franz
I really love listening to you two on this podcast, playfully encouraging each other to grow, fuelled by a genuine love for each other. Forever- inspiring, do-able. A wonderful gift for all humanity!
This non dualistic reframing is so very helpful. Thank you. Rick briefly mentioned trauma as a cause of repression, and mentioned anger at his parents. I believe many viewers would benefit from a deeper dive into this angle of shadow work, where for some of us, our id barely developed and our shadow is disproportionately large...
I agree, and I appreciate you bringing trauma to the discussion. I tend to think of trauma, in the sense of lasting physiological effects (a la Body Keeps the Score) as how the shadow and its parts have been ingrained in the nervous system. Those parts of us that were shunned and repressed and cast into the shadow to keep us safe, they speak to us from the unconscious nervous system, alerting us to danger and the risk of encountering something that hurt us in the past. I think these embodied responses are where we can start to learn the skill of observing and listening to our shadows, and eventually befriending them as mentioned in the video. By holding space for all of this we can also start to teach our nervous systems that we are actually safe
I love the idea of getting reconnected with the wilderness of our Earth and with the wilderness of our minds. I think this was an excellent exploration of shadow work. And I agree, it sounds very difficult, but you both have inspired me to keep embarking on the journey of unpacking and accepting my mind for what it is. Thanks again for another great one🐶
You are my favorite find these days! Love your duo and the way you both interact! Very insightful! Thank you both for this beautiful work ,it is a great gift!
I worked my way through a book, Romancing the Shadow, by Zweig, I wouldn't say the entire process was complete but it certainly helped me at the time .
So thankful I found you Forrest. I came across a video by chance earlier today without your dad, and intrigued by you, I watched another. Your father’s books saved my life after a traumatic experience of psychosis. They were truly instrumental in restoring my psychospiritual wellbeing.
Brilliant work ! 18 mins in and this has opened up another level of awareness and insight into a recurrent dream theme I’ve been baffled and troubled by for years ! Thanks 🙏
Listening while I have morning coffee. I’m working on my own integration and having your words clarify what’s coming to awareness through the natural maturation of self is so helpful! Thank you!!!
I would really love it if you included a bibliography at the end of episodes (i.e. the description/comments/video). It'd be great, for example, to know where the Marie-Louise von Franz quote is from to be able to look up later. This is such a juicy topic. I'd love to read about it and do some more.
Just discovered your channel and watched your video on rumination as I'm currently finding myself ruminating on a recent event. LOVE the format, it's so well researched and highly valuable content so thank you! Also loved the recap at the end of the episode, genuinely so useful I made notes haha
Hey you two. Often listen to your podcasts and find them very helpful. Thanks. 👏 This one in particular has been really thought provoking. I need to listen again, ponder more, re read 'care of the soul' which has been on my shelf for years .....maybe now is the time? You're certainly making Jungian ideas and shadow work more palatable, digestible, less overwhelming? Not sure which yet 🤔 but thanks for sharing your tips 😊
This was so wonderful! Learning this was so eye opening! I totally loved the honesty of Rick about the grandmotherly person with the buggy and also your reaction!! I’ve had a thought like that and then judged myself severely that something like that would even come up!! Now I know it was most likely a shadow thought. I will listen to this again and start my work on my shadow!! ❤
Thank you! I’ve been curious about how to do shadow work. As you pointed out, Jung didn’t address how to do this work. I appreciate both of you for your honesty and your willingness to go deep.🙏🏼
I remember discovering my shadow (the external one) as a six-year-old, walking home from the movies. As I passed each street light I moved from no shadow as I stood right under the light, and then growing in front of me as I moved forward. It was a sense of integration into the wider world. Now, as an adult, I've found that when I can see my inner shadow, I have a better indicator of where I am in my walk through life. The inner shadow helps me understand where others may be when all I can see is their shadow.
This was exceptionally helpful. there's so much to learn about shadow work, and it's hard for me to zoom out of it and see all the parts together in a summary fashion. this episode really helps to collaborate all the info in a succinct way, so thank you. also, my kiddo sometimes voices that she has the urge to "push the grandma in the street" so to speak, and I usually just point out to her that it's natural, and also a strength that she able to resist the urge. I may have to send her a link to the episode, for that example alone. Great job, you guys!
So glad that such a dense topic is being made so accessible (and that a video on Shadow Work has 15k views), thank you! So much advice out there around "Change your thoughts and change your life" overrides the gold in the shadow - sure my inner critic is harsh, and creates lots of tension, but what is it trying to protect me from? If I don't honor that, this harsh SOB inside me is still running the show from the wings.
I'm one of those people who is pretty much pure negative shadow (perks of being an Enn#4) and quite ironically that's the reason why I'm consuming this content in the first place: I'm a perfectionist and I've spent most of my life focusing on trying to become an acceptable person worthy of existence and belonging, by straightening out the worst parts of myself that were plainly visible to me but shameful and embarrassing in the face of other people and society at large. It was only recent events and now this episode that helped bring to light (heh) the fact I had some of the best parts of myself shoved into a dark closet and the key thrown away, I'm talking things like creativity, vulnerability and even stuff like ignorance, being allowed to make mistakes or be wrong, or dumb even. I've spent most of life being angry at people for being clueless and ignorant and I see now it's because it was drilled in me that I always had to do exactly the right thing and could never do anything that made me look bad or stupid, and that in turn led me to hide my vulnerabilities and become hyper-independent and unable to reach out to others, which has also been a huge source of resentment for me when I see others freely asking for help (that they never end up using nor being grateful for), especially at times when I feel like the weight of the world is on my shoulders and I'm about to collapse and others have absolutely no idea of it because I'm not allowed to include them in my life and express how much I'm struggling. I feel like I have my work cut out for me, I have a lot to think about. Thanks a lot Forrest and Rick! You guys rock 🌟
Absolutely adore your podcast, just come across this recently and am working through the content which I'm really enjoying. Would you consider some of these topics in future: - schema therapy and exploring the overlap or roots in psychodynamic therapy - navigating politics and power at work or other group / community settings - addiction in its various forms and interventions used to overcome it - how systemic issues (geopolitical issues, intergenerational poverty and trauma) intersect and impact one's ability to change; is it really reasonable to place emphasis on self-determination and self-agency? Also is this largely a western concept? - Are the constructs of diagnoses in mental health helpful, as outlined in DSM V and ICD 10 and what are the limitations? - what is your opinion on the blank screen in psychoanalytic theory? How relevant do you think psychodynamic theory is in contemporary practice? - how do you work with individuals who present with antisocial personality disorder? - how do you work with individuals who present with narcissistic personality disorder? - how do you work and deal with people you don't like? In terms of your own work but also in relation to clients/patients - why do people engage in conspiracy theories and how can you help them? - what is identity and what is the concept of the fragmented self? How does one develop a strong core sense of who they are? - what is behavioural therapy and where does this sit relative to other therapies? - what are the limitations of therapy? What can clinicians realistically provide? - people talk a lot about being an adult or 'adulting' what does that mean for you? How do you help people who are stuck in that early adult mindset (limited responsibility, limited structure, poor self efficacy) move to the next stage of their lives (when they feel stagnant and are in their 30s or 40s) - How do you help people who have experienced trauma (abuse, neglect) and appear much younger, stagnant at a much younger age than they are (say 50 year old acting like a young child) - how do you deal with people who act in a histrionic manner or manipulative manner to get what they want? Thanks so much again for your podcasts - love listening to the two of you speak with one another the dynamic is so joyful to watch!
Just a thought, I had while watching, (before you'd mentioned projection and bullying); Could Narcissists be living in a state of fully rejecting their shadow side, and perhaps therefore be projecting ( consciously or unconsciously) that unclaimed part of themselves onto others and even the outside world. Certain beliefs or belief systems, especially those learned as a child could promote the tendency or compulsion to deny and repress the shadow side, too. Especially certain religious beliefs and the shame that may be associated with them. Some religious beliefs have been distorted and misused, to cause shame and humiliation Shame, appears to be an emotion or state that is often ignored as a potentially strong, underlying cause of many issues, including those that are psychological and physical health and wellbeing related. Unconcious / Toxic shame is a large part of the unknown subconscious iceberg that people often aren't aware they have repressed. The energy and Trauma has to go somewhere and can manifest itself as illness and disease. Ive often thought that it's very important to teach children about 'What To Do', rather than just focusing mostly on 'What Not To Do' - It's very difficult to live a negative, after all! When you're told Not to Cry, for example it can attach shame to something you actually need to do, at times to be healthy and whole. So they shame stays and the emotions are repressed, potentially leading to a unconcious vicious cycle in later life. Thank You for this Important and Great, video. You make Such A Great Team! God Bless You. 💞✨
Thank you ! This episode was very helpful for me . I would love some recommendations for me to self work on this aspect of myself. I love your podcast it has help me change and deal with many challenges this year ! Thank you 🙏
I don’t always have to watch these videos all the way through, but I appreciate that I learn amazing tools and perspectives whether I listen to an hour, the whole episode, or just twenty minutes. Thank you for sharing your work. I would love to see a video about the psychology of homelessness, drug addiction, and poverty. Even the common phenomenon of people “enjoying” homelessness. I would love to see a video about the effects that these conditions have on family members, friends, and generations of families over time. 😊 not sure if this is your forte, but it’s definitely affected me and my family.
Oh yeah...order...Feng shui simplicity, oder, balance, serenity. It's how I regulate my nervous system. And my closet is color codedas well...my husband is chaotic in his spaces. It's a challenge. Working to maintain boundaries in my tidy space and allowing chaos in his. A very delicate balance.
I can't help but see how much this overlaps with the work that people with autism and/or adhd have no choice but to do if they want to live well, especially if diagnosed late in life. But it's not about a few little bits of yourself but a very big part of who you are that has been constantly judged, deemed as wrong, unacceptable, etc. Now the term 'unmasking' gets used for this but it seems to be essentially the same. And more often than not cannot be done from a place of comfortable self-confidence, because that was never able to grow when big parts were being rejected by society/the majority of people we meet in life.
The furry community now having a statistically higher chance of well-being than the average American is the world late stage Capitalism has eloquently crafted
I liked this one so much I'm going to listen again. It's pretty amazing to me and stunning how one can go through a lot of life and not know that there are these aspects that live inside of some dark corner of your psyche. And these parts can feel quite strong when they emerge and you can absolutely know you would never act on them. And yet there are other urges that can be pretty negative that one cannot seem to stop themselves from acting on. I wonder about that. How about a part 2 of this?!!!!
I've been listening for quite a while and have a question regarding this subject as I'm trying to embrace and develop this skill more. Through self reflection, I've seen some of it. In society it's commonly fraund upon to let out the more angry , mean , or benign parts of ourselves. It's a thin line , this part is essential for being closer connected to your inner child. The angry side of things in my life are suppressed radically within the majority of males, including myself. As with all emotions that are suppressed they are a balloon under water , in some form or the other they express themself that might or might not be directly related to it. Would you have some practical tips to unleash the pressure gauge or find environments that really give an outlet mentally. And how to find the hidden undiscovered parts even if that will be uncomfortable. If this gets read , I love what you guys are doing ! Keep it up :)
Great video again. I’ve watched a lot of content about shadow and shadow work and this is the first time I feel like I’ve properly understood it. Completely separate note, I’m noticing a lot of cuts/editing of the videos and I’m curious why they’re done. I guess because it bothers me; it seems like you’re having a very natural, laid back, easy conversation, yet these apparently minor cuts are made. The cuts, for me, undercut this feel to your discussions. I personally feel like, unless the cut content is really irrelevant or whatever, the content should be left in. Then again, I’m not a content creator, nor do I have experience of editing etc so there may be a perfectly good reason. If you happen to see this comment, I’d love to get your thoughts.
Looking forward to delving into this! Forrest & Dr. Rick, I have a bunch of questions. I am a 3rd year grad student just beginning my post grad (minor focus) in trauma. I literally take notes and re-listen to many of your podcasts. So informative & useful. Thank you! Do you have an email? Thanks to you both for your topics, approach, and sensitivity on so many relevant subjects. Peace to all...🌲🌼
I loved Herman Hesses book Sid Hartha. But when I read his other book “Damian“ it frustrated me because his hostility to the duality that protagonist was struggling with was so unnecessary. I felt intrinsically for my own life. Both the light and the dark side were valid and had positive potential . I Really enjoyed this podcast about Jung’s concept of shadow self. If only Damian had this information, he wouldn’t have been such a sad creature.
You noted that there is not so many "how's" in Jung's work. Von Franz's student, Arnold Mindell probably noted the same and started Process Oriented Psychology, that is all about the "how". You might find interesting looking into that!
I must say I relate better to your father and his words than to you. Perhaps it’s a generational thing? Perhaps it’s the life experience, I particularly noticed this during your podcast on alienation of parents by adult children. Your father’s words on that topic were simply wonderful. He gives you the courtesy of his full attention where you allow your attention and eye contact to shift and move as though he is less important than you are. I hope you continue to learn and grow and help others.
I'm shocked at Dr. Rick's shadow & will be releasing my bun... especially when wheeling babies🤣🤣🤣🤣 How do we access the shadow & put it back in the basement?
If you want to see an example of shadow formation, that is societal expectation pushing down unwanted parts of ourselves, you need to look no further than about 50min into this video. Dad: "I remember walking down the street one day..." Son: "You're about to get us cancelled, it's game over for this podcast buddy." and again about 2 minutes later. Dad is like: "here is my unwanted part." Son is like: "you are not allowed to express this because expected societal punishment." It's kinda funny to see you speak about the very subject of societal suppression and then immediately do it and not even clock it. Am I wrong in this break down?
Well Forrest's tone made it quite clear he was being sarcastic, just in case. And it was also a thinly veiled reference to the TH-cam algorithm which might very well punish them in some form because of the "scandalous" nature of that specific segment of the video.
I was very guilty of projection of my emotions being caused by another person. I deeply understand this, in that I truly do understand the concept that my reality is a reflection of me. It's my perception that creates my emotions, which flavour the meaning I give, dictating how I'm responding.
"The Golden Shadow". I am glad there is something to call it. I knew the concept, but not its name. I know of someone who cast a large majority of their "light"aspect to their shadow. Their enthusiasm, creativity, gentle caring nurturing nature, emotional expression, unique independent thought. His light was a threat to his "survival" as a young person. It's also known as Soul Murder. I prefer not to think of it as murder, but rather buried alive. It is the soul, which can not die. One needs to simply remove all the dirt piled ontop of it, to free it to shine brilliantly one more .
I watch this channel just to feel less depressed in general sometimes. The relationship between the two of you is contagiously heartwarming. Keep up the great work!
I agree. Its like a soothing balm for the soul.❤
Seeing your father son relationship is already of great value. Thank you both.
It is really cool and unique and special, great show great example of how to have a great father son dynamic which is so rare these days, I'm sure there are many jealous parts watching 😂
@@jarad4621yes. Watching these 2 together sometumes triggers my envious feelings of longing for that parent child relationship I never had with my mom or dad.
Dealing with "envy" is one of my shadow parts.ha
THE Dr. Rick Hanson started his career in his forties?!!!! 😮 So inspiring. That's when I'll be starting mine! ✨😌🕊️
😮this hopeful!
period queen! you GOT this 💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼
Never too late ❤
I started learning piamo at age 60. Now Im writig a Musical.😂
@@michellemonet4358 incredible! So inspiring 😀🕊️✨
Thank you for being my favourite podcast.
This topic is in my face every day at my job of over 20 years. Hundreds of members of the public moment to moment to practice with 40 hours a week.
Not long ago I resented it deeply and tried to leave more than once. Now it's my "charnel ground" often; a place for me to overcome fear and recognize others' fears. God presents me with the situations that will show me myself and give me the space to exercise free will. Controversial as that may be.
These shadows of mine want to be freed up; I know because others see them arise on my face and reflect back how they affect the world.
Red flags abound.
Hand shakes to you both. Deep bows.
Great topic, and I really appreciate Rick's handling of the "Golden Shadow" aspects that aren't often addressed. From my personal explorations I find that the repression of those "gentler" aspects of self that were unable to defend themselves is perhaps the most problematic and tragic of all, limiting the efficacy of the individual in pursuing or even recognizing positive needs and goals. The threat those parts were confronted with caused other parts to become defensive, even vicious toward them (inner critic), furthering the suppression in pursuit of "safety" at the cost of being "invisible". Even upon recognition of this dynamic, it appears that there is still no place in the outer world for them to express, for acceptance without exploitation, further encouraging the defending parts and hampering integration efforts as well as practical matters. It's a very resistant arrangement.
I have been approaching this issue through use of "semi-active imagination" for almost 2 years, playing out the "characters" in an internal narrative drama with attempts to write them out; I usually find my literary skills insufficient to the task, and the conscious awareness unable to hold and convey the depth and nuance of the subconscious imagery and emotional/ conceptual associations that emerge - as Joseph Campbell and many others have observed, words are inadequate symbols. Of course I don't have the formal training to prepare for such an undertaking and would not have chosen to pursue it. If events had not "conspired" to crack my subconscious open like the San Andreas faultline under my feet, which I fell into, I would not have. Carl Jung warned about the dangers of taking up these "quests" unprepared, and his own experiences with "psychosis" that led to his Red Book stand as his example. However, I can only imagine that almost NO ONE actively CHOOSES to do this and that many others besides myself find themselves overwhelmed and overmatched by this involuntary process due to crisis. So, how DOES an average "disordered" person prepare for such an event, and how does one who finds himself on an unfamiliar ocean under alien stars navigate the hazards and bring back the gold from the shadow? A followup video with some practical guidance would be a real treasure for the world, and a lifesaver for those of us awash in heavy seas. Thanks Rick and Forrest, great content as usual.
Dr. Hanson, as someone who has lifelong experience with “the jungle” (intrusive thoughts) I so appreciate your vulnerability and willingness to offer your own experiences. By doing so you thereby normalize them for the rest of us, many of whom are too ashamed to admit to having them. I’ve had them too about people I love including my grandmother and more recently postpartum my son - very different than a compulsion to actually harm. It’s very disturbing when the thoughts arise but they are in fact just thoughts. Thank you for touching on this taboo and very important subject!
I love the two of you together! It warms my heart to hear you having professional conversations and still saying, "Dad". So sweet. 😊
So agree! It’s amazing to hear you say “Dad” 🌻 it’s like the warmth we all longed for with our own fathers.
@@kathleengalek4441absolutely it's such a rare thing these days and a great example
"The shadow is not necessarily always an opponent, in fact, they are exactly like any human being with whom we have to get along. Sometimes by giving in, sometimes by resisting, sometimes by giving love, whatever the situation requires. The shadow becomes hostile only when ignored or misunderstood." -Marie Louise Von-Franz
I really love listening to you two on this podcast, playfully encouraging each other to grow, fuelled by a genuine love for each other. Forever- inspiring, do-able. A wonderful gift for all humanity!
This non dualistic reframing is so very helpful. Thank you.
Rick briefly mentioned trauma as a cause of repression, and mentioned anger at his parents. I believe many viewers would benefit from a deeper dive into this angle of shadow work, where for some of us, our id barely developed and our shadow is disproportionately large...
I agree, and I appreciate you bringing trauma to the discussion. I tend to think of trauma, in the sense of lasting physiological effects (a la Body Keeps the Score) as how the shadow and its parts have been ingrained in the nervous system. Those parts of us that were shunned and repressed and cast into the shadow to keep us safe, they speak to us from the unconscious nervous system, alerting us to danger and the risk of encountering something that hurt us in the past. I think these embodied responses are where we can start to learn the skill of observing and listening to our shadows, and eventually befriending them as mentioned in the video. By holding space for all of this we can also start to teach our nervous systems that we are actually safe
I love the idea of getting reconnected with the wilderness of our Earth and with the wilderness of our minds. I think this was an excellent exploration of shadow work. And I agree, it sounds very difficult, but you both have inspired me to keep embarking on the journey of unpacking and accepting my mind for what it is. Thanks again for another great one🐶
You are my favorite find these days! Love your duo and the way you both interact! Very insightful! Thank you both for this beautiful work ,it is a great gift!
I worked my way through a book, Romancing the Shadow, by Zweig, I wouldn't say the entire process was complete but it certainly helped me at the time .
So thankful I found you Forrest. I came across a video by chance earlier today without your dad, and intrigued by you, I watched another. Your father’s books saved my life after a traumatic experience of psychosis.
They were truly instrumental in restoring my psychospiritual wellbeing.
Amazing! Which book did you read?
Brilliant work ! 18 mins in and this has opened up another level of awareness and insight into a recurrent dream theme I’ve been baffled and troubled by for years ! Thanks 🙏
Your podcast is phenomenal. I look forward to each episode. Thank you to you and your father, Dr. Hanson for all your efforts!
Listening while I have morning coffee. I’m working on my own integration and having your words clarify what’s coming to awareness through the natural maturation of self is so helpful! Thank you!!!
This is the most useful info I've seen on The Shadow.
Thank you for this. It’s the most helpful video I’ve seen on this topic. Thank you!
I would really love it if you included a bibliography at the end of episodes (i.e. the description/comments/video).
It'd be great, for example, to know where the Marie-Louise von Franz quote is from to be able to look up later. This is such a juicy topic. I'd love to read about it and do some more.
There’s a lot of stuff on the Patreon!
I listened to this on Apple Podcasts. It’s one of my favourite episodes! I relate to it so well and it’s really interesting.
Just discovered your channel and watched your video on rumination as I'm currently finding myself ruminating on a recent event. LOVE the format, it's so well researched and highly valuable content so thank you! Also loved the recap at the end of the episode, genuinely so useful I made notes haha
Hey you two. Often listen to your podcasts and find them very helpful. Thanks. 👏 This one in particular has been really thought provoking. I need to listen again, ponder more, re read 'care of the soul' which has been on my shelf for years .....maybe now is the time? You're certainly making Jungian ideas and shadow work more palatable, digestible, less overwhelming? Not sure which yet 🤔 but thanks for sharing your tips 😊
This was so wonderful! Learning this was so eye opening! I totally loved the honesty of Rick about the grandmotherly person with the buggy and also your reaction!! I’ve had a thought like that and then judged myself severely that something like that would even come up!! Now I know it was most likely a shadow thought. I will listen to this again and start my work on my shadow!! ❤
Thank you! I’ve been curious about how to do shadow work. As you pointed out, Jung didn’t address how to do this work. I appreciate both of you for your honesty and your willingness to go deep.🙏🏼
I remember discovering my shadow (the external one) as a six-year-old, walking home from the movies. As I passed each street light I moved from no shadow as I stood right under the light, and then growing in front of me as I moved forward. It was a sense of integration into the wider world. Now, as an adult, I've found that when I can see my inner shadow, I have a better indicator of where I am in my walk through life. The inner shadow helps me understand where others may be when all I can see is their shadow.
This was exceptionally helpful. there's so much to learn about shadow work, and it's hard for me to zoom out of it and see all the parts together in a summary fashion. this episode really helps to collaborate all the info in a succinct way, so thank you.
also, my kiddo sometimes voices that she has the urge to "push the grandma in the street" so to speak, and I usually just point out to her that it's natural, and also a strength that she able to resist the urge. I may have to send her a link to the episode, for that example alone.
Great job, you guys!
Fantastic, thank you for these wonderful podcasts ❤
So glad that such a dense topic is being made so accessible (and that a video on Shadow Work has 15k views), thank you! So much advice out there around "Change your thoughts and change your life" overrides the gold in the shadow - sure my inner critic is harsh, and creates lots of tension, but what is it trying to protect me from? If I don't honor that, this harsh SOB inside me is still running the show from the wings.
I'm one of those people who is pretty much pure negative shadow (perks of being an Enn#4) and quite ironically that's the reason why I'm consuming this content in the first place: I'm a perfectionist and I've spent most of my life focusing on trying to become an acceptable person worthy of existence and belonging, by straightening out the worst parts of myself that were plainly visible to me but shameful and embarrassing in the face of other people and society at large. It was only recent events and now this episode that helped bring to light (heh) the fact I had some of the best parts of myself shoved into a dark closet and the key thrown away, I'm talking things like creativity, vulnerability and even stuff like ignorance, being allowed to make mistakes or be wrong, or dumb even.
I've spent most of life being angry at people for being clueless and ignorant and I see now it's because it was drilled in me that I always had to do exactly the right thing and could never do anything that made me look bad or stupid, and that in turn led me to hide my vulnerabilities and become hyper-independent and unable to reach out to others, which has also been a huge source of resentment for me when I see others freely asking for help (that they never end up using nor being grateful for), especially at times when I feel like the weight of the world is on my shoulders and I'm about to collapse and others have absolutely no idea of it because I'm not allowed to include them in my life and express how much I'm struggling.
I feel like I have my work cut out for me, I have a lot to think about. Thanks a lot Forrest and Rick! You guys rock 🌟
Hi there fellow Enneagram 4. I can relate so much to you. I am 63. Working through all my lifetime of unworthiness.
Wow this is a beautiful episode
Absolutely adore your podcast, just come across this recently and am working through the content which I'm really enjoying.
Would you consider some of these topics in future:
- schema therapy and exploring the overlap or roots in psychodynamic therapy
- navigating politics and power at work or other group / community settings
- addiction in its various forms and interventions used to overcome it
- how systemic issues (geopolitical issues, intergenerational poverty and trauma) intersect and impact one's ability to change; is it really reasonable to place emphasis on self-determination and self-agency? Also is this largely a western concept?
- Are the constructs of diagnoses in mental health helpful, as outlined in DSM V and ICD 10 and what are the limitations?
- what is your opinion on the blank screen in psychoanalytic theory? How relevant do you think psychodynamic theory is in contemporary practice?
- how do you work with individuals who present with antisocial personality disorder?
- how do you work with individuals who present with narcissistic personality disorder?
- how do you work and deal with people you don't like? In terms of your own work but also in relation to clients/patients
- why do people engage in conspiracy theories and how can you help them?
- what is identity and what is the concept of the fragmented self? How does one develop a strong core sense of who they are?
- what is behavioural therapy and where does this sit relative to other therapies?
- what are the limitations of therapy? What can clinicians realistically provide?
- people talk a lot about being an adult or 'adulting' what does that mean for you? How do you help people who are stuck in that early adult mindset (limited responsibility, limited structure, poor self efficacy) move to the next stage of their lives (when they feel stagnant and are in their 30s or 40s)
- How do you help people who have experienced trauma (abuse, neglect) and appear much younger, stagnant at a much younger age than they are (say 50 year old acting like a young child)
- how do you deal with people who act in a histrionic manner or manipulative manner to get what they want?
Thanks so much again for your podcasts - love listening to the two of you speak with one another the dynamic is so joyful to watch!
Fabulously done!.
Just a thought, I had while watching, (before you'd mentioned projection and bullying);
Could Narcissists be living in a state of fully rejecting their shadow side, and perhaps therefore be projecting ( consciously or unconsciously)
that unclaimed part of themselves onto others and even the outside world.
Certain beliefs or belief systems, especially those learned as a child could promote the tendency or compulsion to deny and repress the shadow side, too. Especially certain religious beliefs and the shame that may be associated with them. Some religious beliefs have been distorted and misused, to cause shame and humiliation
Shame, appears to be an emotion or state that is often ignored as a potentially strong, underlying cause of many issues, including those that are psychological and physical health and wellbeing related.
Unconcious / Toxic shame is a large part of the unknown subconscious iceberg that people often aren't aware they have repressed.
The energy and Trauma has to go somewhere and can manifest itself as illness and disease.
Ive often thought that it's very important to teach children about 'What To Do', rather than just focusing mostly on 'What Not To Do' - It's very difficult to live a negative, after all!
When you're told Not to Cry, for example it can attach shame to something you actually need to do, at times to be healthy and whole.
So they shame stays and the emotions are repressed, potentially leading to a unconcious vicious cycle in later life.
Thank You for this Important and Great, video. You make Such A Great Team!
God Bless You. 💞✨
*The shame
Wow. So helpful - thank you!
Looking foward very much to listening to this podcast later on today.
Thanks!
Thank you ! This episode was very helpful for me . I would love some recommendations for me to self work on this aspect of myself. I love your podcast it has help me change and deal with many challenges this year ! Thank you 🙏
I don’t always have to watch these videos all the way through, but I appreciate that I learn amazing tools and perspectives whether I listen to an hour, the whole episode, or just twenty minutes.
Thank you for sharing your work.
I would love to see a video about the psychology of homelessness, drug addiction, and poverty. Even the common phenomenon of people “enjoying” homelessness.
I would love to see a video about the effects that these conditions have on family members, friends, and generations of families over time. 😊 not sure if this is your forte, but it’s definitely affected me and my family.
Oh yeah...order...Feng shui simplicity, oder, balance, serenity. It's how I regulate my nervous system. And my closet is color codedas well...my husband is chaotic in his spaces. It's a challenge. Working to maintain boundaries in my tidy space and allowing chaos in his. A very delicate balance.
Thank you once again! I will listen to this again. You guys are just wonderful including your shadow 😉!! Namaste 🙏🌺
Fantastic episode. If anyone wants to go in deeper about shadow work, Heidi Priebe has some great videos on it.
I can't help but see how much this overlaps with the work that people with autism and/or adhd have no choice but to do if they want to live well, especially if diagnosed late in life. But it's not about a few little bits of yourself but a very big part of who you are that has been constantly judged, deemed as wrong, unacceptable, etc. Now the term 'unmasking' gets used for this but it seems to be essentially the same. And more often than not cannot be done from a place of comfortable self-confidence, because that was never able to grow when big parts were being rejected by society/the majority of people we meet in life.
The furry community now having a statistically higher chance of well-being than the average American is the world late stage Capitalism has eloquently crafted
"The more you try to erase me, the more that I appear" - Thom Yorke
"The more you resist. The more I persist"
Great discussion. I did feel repression from Forest each time the dad mentioned the vicious shadow though.
this is some Persona 4 type of content that I like
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!😊
Very interesting to have address the "Shadow" logic, in a cultural perspective...
I liked this one so much I'm going to listen again. It's pretty amazing to me and stunning how one can go through a lot of life and not know that there are these aspects that live inside of some dark corner of your psyche. And these parts can feel quite strong when they emerge and you can absolutely know you would never act on them. And yet there are other urges that can be pretty negative that one cannot seem to stop themselves from acting on. I wonder about that. How about a part 2 of this?!!!!
Thank you. 🙏
What was the book that Dr. Hanson recommended as one of his top 10? I was driving while listening so I couldn't jot down the title. Thanks!
Care of the Soul by Thomas Moore
Wow your guest is spot on
I've been listening for quite a while and have a question regarding this subject as I'm trying to embrace and develop this skill more.
Through self reflection, I've seen some of it.
In society it's commonly fraund upon to let out the more angry , mean , or benign parts of ourselves. It's a thin line , this part is essential for being closer connected to your inner child.
The angry side of things in my life are suppressed radically within the majority of males, including myself. As with all emotions that are suppressed they are a balloon under water , in some form or the other they express themself that might or might not be directly related to it.
Would you have some practical tips to unleash the pressure gauge or find environments that really give an outlet mentally. And how to find the hidden undiscovered parts even if that will be uncomfortable.
If this gets read , I love what you guys are doing ! Keep it up :)
i like them so much....❤❤❤
Great video again. I’ve watched a lot of content about shadow and shadow work and this is the first time I feel like I’ve properly understood it.
Completely separate note, I’m noticing a lot of cuts/editing of the videos and I’m curious why they’re done. I guess because it bothers me; it seems like you’re having a very natural, laid back, easy conversation, yet these apparently minor cuts are made. The cuts, for me, undercut this feel to your discussions. I personally feel like, unless the cut content is really irrelevant or whatever, the content should be left in. Then again, I’m not a content creator, nor do I have experience of editing etc so there may be a perfectly good reason. If you happen to see this comment, I’d love to get your thoughts.
great episode, thanks so much to you both.
Thank you very helpful ❤
Looking forward to delving into this! Forrest & Dr. Rick, I have a bunch of questions. I am a 3rd year grad student just beginning my post grad (minor focus) in trauma. I literally take notes and re-listen to many of your podcasts. So informative & useful. Thank you! Do you have an email?
Thanks to you both for your topics, approach, and sensitivity on so many relevant subjects.
Peace to all...🌲🌼
I loved Herman Hesses book Sid Hartha. But when I read his other book “Damian“ it frustrated me because his hostility to the duality that protagonist was struggling with was so unnecessary. I felt intrinsically for my own life. Both the light and the dark side were valid and had positive potential .
I Really enjoyed this podcast about Jung’s concept of shadow self. If only Damian had this information, he wouldn’t have been such a sad creature.
You noted that there is not so many "how's" in Jung's work. Von Franz's student, Arnold Mindell probably noted the same and started Process Oriented Psychology, that is all about the "how". You might find interesting looking into that!
good stuff!
So beautifully said 😮😅. Excellent thanks very much 😅
15:55 If I am not assertive & I resent/ feel upset when i see someone acting assertively, how is that projecting?
Excellent thanks very much 😮😅
Effing brilliant
If you were to call this a kind of therapy what would be its name? I am looking for a therapy like this😊
I must say I relate better to your father and his words than to you. Perhaps it’s a generational thing? Perhaps it’s the life experience, I particularly noticed this during your podcast on alienation of parents by adult children. Your father’s words on that topic were simply wonderful. He gives you the courtesy of his full attention where you allow your attention and eye contact to shift and move as though he is less important than you are. I hope you continue to learn and grow and help others.
Hey, I hope you continue to grow, and learn to help others as well
projection.
I need a step by step guide
Outlines like for a child to help with my attention
I'm shocked at Dr. Rick's shadow & will be releasing my bun... especially when wheeling babies🤣🤣🤣🤣 How do we access the shadow & put it back in the basement?
If you want to see an example of shadow formation, that is societal expectation pushing down unwanted parts of ourselves, you need to look no further than about 50min into this video.
Dad: "I remember walking down the street one day..."
Son: "You're about to get us cancelled, it's game over for this podcast buddy."
and again about 2 minutes later.
Dad is like: "here is my unwanted part."
Son is like: "you are not allowed to express this because expected societal punishment."
It's kinda funny to see you speak about the very subject of societal suppression and then immediately do it and not even clock it.
Am I wrong in this break down?
Well Forrest's tone made it quite clear he was being sarcastic, just in case.
And it was also a thinly veiled reference to the TH-cam algorithm which might very well punish them in some form because of the "scandalous" nature of that specific segment of the video.
😂💦 50 minute mark
BwaHaHaHa 😅 💦
the baby 👼🏻
I wonder how you integrate. being an alcoholic or a pedophile. How you reconcile with this?! I think this theory is flawed.
Hi! Your volume is quite low. Trying to listen while out on the street but can’t hear 🥴
I was very guilty of projection of my emotions being caused by another person. I deeply understand this, in that I truly do understand the concept that my reality is a reflection of me. It's my perception that creates my emotions, which flavour the meaning I give, dictating how I'm responding.
"The Golden Shadow". I am glad there is something to call it. I knew the concept, but not its name. I know of someone who cast a large majority of their "light"aspect to their shadow. Their enthusiasm, creativity, gentle caring nurturing nature, emotional expression, unique independent thought. His light was a threat to his "survival" as a young person. It's also known as Soul Murder. I prefer not to think of it as murder, but rather buried alive. It is the soul, which can not die. One needs to simply remove all the dirt piled ontop of it, to free it to shine brilliantly one more .
What if it's bringing awareness to the light aspects that one has designated to their shadow. Is that still inappropriate?