I have we are one triad convergence carbon wheels with BERD spokes, onyx vesper hubs and Chris king tubeless valve stems.... Best upgrade I've made so far and I'm definitely not a pro rider
Yep! We Are One Carbon laced to Hope Pro 5. I was skeptical switching to carbon wheels, but they are so much more precise feeling and I was surprised how much chatter they get rid of. Also pretty nice that my wheels stay true. Having the lateral stiffness and vertical compliance of carbon is badass.
Guys, please, let's face it - carbon wheels are usually about twice as expensive than the alloys. That's the issue. I would gladly try carbon wheels when the difference in prices is reduced significantly. I am sure many riders would too.
I thought that too. I was going through a set of wheels every 2 years like clockwork. Even though twice the price I g ot a set of We are Ones with a life time warranty. Figured if/when I break them I was covered. 4 years later on a couple of frames still running true
@@robertgrob1941 makes sense, no argue about that. However I am very easy on the wheels, never destroyed one. But someday I will try carbon wheel, just to see how it rides
Feels like tobacco advertising in the 50s. If you don’t compete, why buy twice as expensive non-recyclable plastic without even an obvious weight benefit vs high end aluminum competitors ?
This point is always glossed over in these comparisons. Even if carbon wheels are in absolute terms "better" than alloy, the real question for most riders is "Do the improvements justify the increased in price"? Especially for people who are not aiming to win competitions? Top end alloy wheels cost half of entry level carbon ones. Even if you have the budget, wouldn't it be better to have two alloy wheelsets for different conditions rather than one carbon set for the same price?
I've broken countless alloy wheels over the years. I switched to only carbon wheelsets for MTB, road and gravel a few years and haven't even had to true a wheel since. Modern high quality carbon wheels are fantastic!
My alloy hoops have one season on them and have multiple deep gauges in them from sharp rocks scraping off. I have zero concerns about the safety being compromised because this has been the case with all of my alloy wheels over the last 30+ years of riding. I would have some concerns if they were carbon and highly doubt I would get the same life out of a set of carbon compared to alloy. I have had alloy rims bend and even rear hubs shred but I’m just not sold on carbon for Mtb. I’ll keep my beefy alloy setup
Hi Owen thank you so much for explaining the difference between Isotropic and Anisotropic. It's nice to be able to put the proper name to something we know that's happening. Do you and Oli Bridgewood ever meet at the coffee machine? I can only imagine the amazing nerd chat that would go on between you two given the right topic! 😊
9:42 change that to "Only a pro can take advantage of carbon wheels". Sure, I'd feel the difference of commuting to work with a 911 GT3 RS, but it doesn't mean the end result would be any different. Most people don't want or can't invest over 1000€ on rims. Sure, the engineering behind them is nice and it's nice there's people that can afford them, but as of 2024 you'd be better off spending that money elsewhere on your bike and saving the change.
"Carbon is stronger than steel" is an extreme simplification. If you pull carbon fibre in a straight line, this is absolutely true. But damage mostly starts with local delamination. And here the strenght of epoxy counts. And this is way weaker than steel.
After cracking arpund the spokes and needing to warranty a 3rd OEM alloy rim under warranty I went to We Are One carbon and it was the best choice Ive ever made. I didnt expect to feel such a difference. I am really hard on my bikes and these wheels are tough as f.
One way carbon fiber products are always consistent: much higher relative cost. Every other way, it just depends on the direction the fibers are laid and bound, and how many are used. These will affect how a machine (however simple or complex the machine) functions. It's like a bridge with metal lattice and cables. You can alter how a bridge functions with identical materials, based on how you place the lattice and cables. Same with carbon fibers. Carbon vs. steel: steel comes in a zillion different alloy ratios, and also contains carbon. Steel manufacturing is like carbon, it all depends on how you make the material in determining its outcome function (steel has grains, density differences, and so forth). Just like steel manufacturing, carbon fiber products has developed over time to overcome most every challenge and problem they had early in development. Carbon fiber wheels in motorcycles are now better in every way than cast alloy (OEM supply as an example), they are more durable, more compliant, much lighter, and can be used in any condition. But like everywhere else, they cost significantly more.
While you were “busting the myth” of fragile carbon wheels, I was actually “busting” a 310g carbon rim on the first ride. I’d say it put the “frag” in fragile.
I just purchased a set of Reserve HD30 Carbon wheels at a great price. They are very light and my Orbea Rise spools up to speed so fast. I ride very loose over hard packed trails where there are lots of ruts. The wheels give me excellent control and allow me hit these very narrow lines keeping me out of the ruts. Super happy with them.
I ride on carbon wheels currently. I had to relace the rear Roval with thicker spokes because I didn't like the flex when bombing through rock gardens at high speeds. My other bike has a custom build in alloy. My takeaway is that it's rider preference, specific to the type of trails you ride.
Price is a very relative term. If I break one aluminum rim every year, I can just buy a carbon one that will last for 4-5 years. I changed the rim or the wheel every year until I bought a carbon one and they have lasted for 3 years and they are light, straight and very comfortable. I am riding light or medium enduro and trail with insert in rear tire only. Bikes: Kenevo SL, Kona Proces 153 and Stumpjumper 2022.
I did not quite expect this much technical details, but more the real life experience. CF will feel and break differently. Especially important to understand if buying used CF.
I ride on carbon rims, and I would never sell them because they are that good. I ride on very rocky, terrain and the bike takes big and fast hits. I have confidence they are built to last. I'd buy a used set as long as I don't see any damage to the rim, including the nipple holes. Even knowing how hard I ride mine, I'd buy them from someone who rode as hard as me. Just yesterday when washing the bike I cleaned the rims looking for any signs that don't look like the original layup. It's pretty easy to see if there is damage on raw carbon. For me I would not hesitate to buy used as long as, 1) look up reviews and for recalls. 2) just get a clean rag with fresh water to rinse and just go around the rim with a wet rag. When the carbon/finish is wet you will be able to tell if there is any underlying fractures. I can definitely understand the concern but I'd have confidence in a used set of carbon rims. I'd definitely take it to a good mechanic and just get the spokes checked for proper tension.
Reserve 30 (Santa Cruz) wheelset. Well over 8,000 hard ass miles on my 60-lb Norco Range VLT Ebike (the Beast) and they've never even needed a truing. The 1st time I switched to Carbon was maybe ten years ago on my Specialized S-Works Enduro, a Carbon "26er" bike I might add. The difference was life changing. Descents I braked on with alloy, I didn't touch my brakes on the carbon set. They were very stiff.
I swapped to carbon wheels ten years ago.....ironically to save money...after flat spotting yet another Stans Flow EX I gave up. Apart from one experiment with an early light light bicycle rim that lasted ten minutes, I have yet to crack on in that time. Currently reserve 30's on a Specicialzed enduro....mainly rocky bike park duties
As Finroddd said the only problem with carbon wheels for most riders is price , I would love to have carbon hoops on my bikes but cannot justify the cost.
Iv broken a few expensive Carbon hoops but I still like them for my style of riding. A lifetime warrantee is probably the most important thing, Carbon wheel will just teach you how to build wheels properly :D
I have a set of Reynolds carbon XC wheels and one day kaboom! One wheel broke......It was at the aluminum hub. One of the flanges cracked and separated across several spokes. They are deep dish and maybe they are so stiff all the flexing stressed the hub but the rims are super solid. I got it fixed and still ride them 12 years later...on a different frame because eventually the Yeti AS-R frame they were originally on, cracked too. :D
The cost is a critical factor also. At around £400 and upwards for a quality carbon fibre rim at 400g without the lifetime warranty, what are the real world advantages to the majority of riders?
I know Owen is very knowledgeable but unfortunately this video broke myth busting rule #1. Show don't tell. Actually put the myths to the test and let the results speak for themselves. Show us why carbon wheels aren't as fragile as alloy. Show us their compliance. Also, you should post links or mention where you are getting your data. The "proofs" presented were basically, "The wheel brands swear their wheels are stronger and more compliant these days. We should believe them." I think it would have been better if a more unbiased and scientific approach to answering to these myths was used instead.
Have broken some alloy wheels but never a pair of Carbon ,upgrading the wheels is always the thing that makes the most difference on a stock bike ,and carbon is what i urge for when Doing that
Something that I had considered when before I got my wheel set built by my LBS was doing an aluminum front wheel and carbon fiber rear wheel. The back wheel has the most weight so that’s where I wanted to save the most weight. But I’ll be buying a new bike in three years so it wasn’t worth it to me.
Owen. Did you get my E=mtb² Cartoon on the evolution of human thinking . ???. I have had nipples pull through on Carbon rims.But that was Roval in 2018. My new Amflow( E=mtb³?? )has carbon rims. Hopefully 6 years later they will be the Ducks Guts.💪🤞.Cheers
All together Carbon wheels are great but they're not twice as great as a good set of aluminum wheels Though they are twice the price. I have the money I just can't justify spending it there.
I will tell you that I am far from a pro although I'm not horrible and I have carbon wheels on some of my bikes. And absolutely I feel a difference and I even felt more of a difference when I put kush core in my carbon wheels and not really for the better. But it's really not that bad for a downhill. Fun days at the park... And I ride my carbon wheels very hard and only had an issue once which was more of a freak accident
I can usually easily feel infinitesimal increments or changes like spoke tension since I have very high levels of mechanical sympathy. It also make me much slower than someone who doesn't give a sh...
Some alloy rims like my spank 359 feel stiffer than my 9velo and the set of noble carbon wheels I was borrowing this summer. Carbon bars being "compliant" is another weird one, I have both the alloy and carbon one up bars and the alloy feels a lot more compliant and soft. It's all about the construction and less about the material if you analyze things objectively.
I love my carbon wheels. Feel so direct with steering and lateral loads in corners and dont know if i can go back bases on ride quality. I have broke one however got it replaced and now run an insert in the rear. So yes will have to change some things when getting carbon. Have to up air pressure a psi or so and maybe run insert. Alloy and carbon are different so have to use them differently.
That's some good stuff. I look at it this way, bc I think there is more to rider weight, skill, terrain, rim size(height/width) even rim or disk braking, speed and going over the limits. Spokes were seen as compliance or less, back in the day; they're still doing the same work, but talked up much in the media. So your point about materials alone has merit. I'm thinking that carbon for a 29er is comparable or a good direction bc 26 or less is inherently stronger/stiffer. Where did 29er come from? 700c that have used carbon for stiffness and speed, for some time, it's just more responsive. And the road is not forgiving, so compliance is valid there more so? As well as frame stiffness for road, as is full sus' for anchoring that swinging triangle. And the newer racer material bias is about endurance of an alloy rim when beaten up by techy trails while racing...Back to spokes, for my weight on a rear biased HT, I'm going back to 14 straight gauge gauge bc I can feel too much flex in just a slight butted spoke. Just pick up and flex the two, and feel it right there; big difference. So spoke count and type do play a good roll. Even as 32 hole and less, do similarly. So it's a good mix of many things that take some time, experience, broken or changed parts, and money to sort out for the particular rider, terrain, mistakes, etc. Even as frame, axle type, hub drilling asymmetry and measurements contributes to force at the rim diameter... But how much flex is good for carbon? Bc it just snaps, hence replacement cost built into the warranty of expensive sets. Again for my setup, ridden on the street, I'm thinking that a stiffer 24mil rim height 29, in 28 hole w/ straight or bladed spokes will give the characteristics I'm thinking about. And there is always suspension, tire size and pressure that play a greater part in mtb on dirt. And those areas have to be learned and tuned by the riders. So materials, design and marketing will pull some folks in, but it's riding and learning the ropes, even paying your dues that will give the answer.l
Not really interested in plastic rims. Firstly, I expect my rims to be anodized in a chosen color or mirror polished. The cost is going to be offset by Onyx hubs in the middle however, plastico is a nogo for the coin. Plastic frames are out since a fully custom frame would be a car loan! It is going to be Ti or 4130 and tailored to my blueprints, rims are going to be recycled beer cans since they can be anodized or polished to a mirror finish.
Carbon wheels that I would gladly have cost over 2k USD, that is before any import tax. Would love to have them, but not for a price of a decent bike, sorry
It's not a myth rather a real concern: can carbon be as durable in a non tubeless setup, i change tubes and tires over and over the last thing i want is crack a 500 euro rim after a flat with the plastic lever tool
Since you are riding a Canyon why no coverage of the Canyon STOP USE email sent to all registered users of the Spectral:ON CF & CFR, and Torque:ON CF eMTBs… batteries catching fire 🔥.
It takes a lot of energy to produce carbon fibers. Recycling is hard to impossible. While aluminium is also not growing on trees it takes less energy to make it, and if it's recycled aluminium the energy demand is much lower compared to new aluminium.
A we are one carbon rim is only 100g lighter than my spank spike race 33 rim, the carbon wheelset costs about as much as I paid for my brand new carbon trail bike on clearance, so where's the incentive exactly? you want me to spend what I paid for my entire bike on a set of wheels just so I can save 200g and get a lifetime warranty? I don't think so, plus a lifetime warranty is only useful for as long as the manufacturer is still in business, not to mention the down time you can face while you wait for your broken wheel to get warrantied.
Great spot But thats bag - Canyon Frame bag "Long Bracket" it mounts to the two bolts on the upper section of the down tube - I've managed to squeeze in two TPU tubes into it - of course you could fit - a TPU tube and a multitool! Again good eyes - but yep not a Butyl tube - but a very similar coloured bag! Cheers Owen
I would not buy carbon wheels. From personal observation, I have seen far more broken carbon wheels than alloy. I also feel it is another personal preference thing.
Take the lifetime warranty away which will make the wheels less expensive, because after all, you're paying for the replacements really As if you would with ali and just replace it if it got busted up
Agreed. Where's his proof? I thought they were going to take some samples of alloy and carbon rims and put them to the test. Weigh them, test them for stiffness, ride them, etc. etc.
Really good video, as always. I just have one concern : nobody ever mentions that Carbon producing is 3 times more polluting than alloy. This could be of no concern to most of the riders but i do care 😅
"Carbon is stronger than steel" It's not that simple. Carbon is very strong when it comes to tension in fiber direction. However the damage tolarance behaviour is completely different compared to crystalline materials like metals. While carbon is used a lot today in aviation the fibers there have a better quality and the manufacturing of an Airbus A350 cannot be compared with manufacturing of bicycle components in China.
The problem with carbon is that it reduces more mass from ones wallet than ones bike. I can buy 3 sets of alloys for the price of a set of carbons so why would I buy carbon when I could make up the weight saving by making sure I do a poo before riding?
Do you own a set of carbon wheels?
I have a MX set on my Capra. I cant Tell what the difference is to my old Alloy-Wheels…… bcs im just shredding and having fun 😄
I have we are one triad convergence carbon wheels with BERD spokes, onyx vesper hubs and Chris king tubeless valve stems.... Best upgrade I've made so far and I'm definitely not a pro rider
Yep! We Are One Carbon laced to Hope Pro 5. I was skeptical switching to carbon wheels, but they are so much more precise feeling and I was surprised how much chatter they get rid of. Also pretty nice that my wheels stay true. Having the lateral stiffness and vertical compliance of carbon is badass.
On all my bikes 🙈
I have carbon wheels on all 4 of my mountain bikes. I’m waiting for a set of carbon wheels to show up for my gravel bike
Guys, please, let's face it - carbon wheels are usually about twice as expensive than the alloys. That's the issue. I would gladly try carbon wheels when the difference in prices is reduced significantly. I am sure many riders would too.
I thought that too. I was going through a set of wheels every 2 years like clockwork. Even though twice the price I g ot a set of We are Ones with a life time warranty. Figured if/when I break them I was covered. 4 years later on a couple of frames still running true
@@robertgrob1941 makes sense, no argue about that. However I am very easy on the wheels, never destroyed one. But someday I will try carbon wheel, just to see how it rides
How about just running a carbon fibre wheel in the back only. I thought about that since the rear is always heavier.
@@Velo1010 yeah, sounds ok. but I guess most of us that are considering carbon wheels will just go for front and rear.
Carbon fiber has a expiration date. depending on the atmosphere temperature and time is $$$
Feels like tobacco advertising in the 50s. If you don’t compete, why buy twice as expensive non-recyclable plastic without even an obvious weight benefit vs high end aluminum competitors ?
This point is always glossed over in these comparisons. Even if carbon wheels are in absolute terms "better" than alloy, the real question for most riders is "Do the improvements justify the increased in price"? Especially for people who are not aiming to win competitions? Top end alloy wheels cost half of entry level carbon ones. Even if you have the budget, wouldn't it be better to have two alloy wheelsets for different conditions rather than one carbon set for the same price?
I've broken countless alloy wheels over the years. I switched to only carbon wheelsets for MTB, road and gravel a few years and haven't even had to true a wheel since. Modern high quality carbon wheels are fantastic!
My alloy hoops have one season on them and have multiple deep gauges in them from sharp rocks scraping off. I have zero concerns about the safety being compromised because this has been the case with all of my alloy wheels over the last 30+ years of riding. I would have some concerns if they were carbon and highly doubt I would get the same life out of a set of carbon compared to alloy. I have had alloy rims bend and even rear hubs shred but I’m just not sold on carbon for Mtb. I’ll keep my beefy alloy setup
Hi Owen thank you so much for explaining the difference between Isotropic and Anisotropic. It's nice to be able to put the proper name to something we know that's happening. Do you and Oli Bridgewood ever meet at the coffee machine? I can only imagine the amazing nerd chat that would go on between you two given the right topic! 😊
9:42 change that to "Only a pro can take advantage of carbon wheels". Sure, I'd feel the difference of commuting to work with a 911 GT3 RS, but it doesn't mean the end result would be any different.
Most people don't want or can't invest over 1000€ on rims. Sure, the engineering behind them is nice and it's nice there's people that can afford them, but as of 2024 you'd be better off spending that money elsewhere on your bike and saving the change.
"Carbon is stronger than steel" is an extreme simplification. If you pull carbon fibre in a straight line, this is absolutely true. But damage mostly starts with local delamination. And here the strenght of epoxy counts. And this is way weaker than steel.
You left out the No.1 myth, "they're too expensive"
Myth confirmed 😆
After cracking arpund the spokes and needing to warranty a 3rd OEM alloy rim under warranty I went to We Are One carbon and it was the best choice Ive ever made. I didnt expect to feel such a difference. I am really hard on my bikes and these wheels are tough as f.
It's all about the cost dude. Carbon wheels are simple too expensive for most of us mere mortals
One way carbon fiber products are always consistent: much higher relative cost.
Every other way, it just depends on the direction the fibers are laid and bound, and how many are used. These will affect how a machine (however simple or complex the machine) functions. It's like a bridge with metal lattice and cables. You can alter how a bridge functions with identical materials, based on how you place the lattice and cables. Same with carbon fibers.
Carbon vs. steel: steel comes in a zillion different alloy ratios, and also contains carbon. Steel manufacturing is like carbon, it all depends on how you make the material in determining its outcome function (steel has grains, density differences, and so forth).
Just like steel manufacturing, carbon fiber products has developed over time to overcome most every challenge and problem they had early in development. Carbon fiber wheels in motorcycles are now better in every way than cast alloy (OEM supply as an example), they are more durable, more compliant, much lighter, and can be used in any condition. But like everywhere else, they cost significantly more.
No I don't but thank you so much for this information!! Very interesting!!
While you were “busting the myth” of fragile carbon wheels, I was actually “busting” a 310g carbon rim on the first ride. I’d say it put the “frag” in fragile.
I just purchased a set of Reserve HD30 Carbon wheels at a great price. They are very light and my Orbea Rise spools up to speed so fast. I ride very loose over hard packed trails where there are lots of ruts. The wheels give me excellent control and allow me hit these very narrow lines keeping me out of the ruts. Super happy with them.
I ride on carbon wheels currently. I had to relace the rear Roval with thicker spokes because I didn't like the flex when bombing through rock gardens at high speeds.
My other bike has a custom build in alloy.
My takeaway is that it's rider preference, specific to the type of trails you ride.
Price is a very relative term. If I break one aluminum rim every year, I can just buy a carbon one that will last for 4-5 years. I changed the rim or the wheel every year until I bought a carbon one and they have lasted for 3 years and they are light, straight and very comfortable. I am riding light or medium enduro and trail with insert in rear tire only. Bikes: Kenevo SL, Kona Proces 153 and Stumpjumper 2022.
Myth 5: Carbon wheels are expensive af.
Oh wait...
I did not quite expect this much technical details, but more the real life experience. CF will feel and break differently. Especially important to understand if buying used CF.
I ride on carbon rims, and I would never sell them because they are that good.
I ride on very rocky, terrain and the bike takes big and fast hits. I have confidence they are built to last. I'd buy a used set as long as I don't see any damage to the rim, including the nipple holes. Even knowing how hard I ride mine, I'd buy them from someone who rode as hard as me.
Just yesterday when washing the bike I cleaned the rims looking for any signs that don't look like the original layup. It's pretty easy to see if there is damage on raw carbon.
For me I would not hesitate to buy used as long as, 1) look up reviews and for recalls. 2) just get a clean rag with fresh water to rinse and just go around the rim with a wet rag. When the carbon/finish is wet you will be able to tell if there is any underlying fractures.
I can definitely understand the concern but I'd have confidence in a used set of carbon rims. I'd definitely take it to a good mechanic and just get the spokes checked for proper tension.
Reserve 30 (Santa Cruz) wheelset. Well over 8,000 hard ass miles on my 60-lb Norco Range VLT Ebike (the Beast) and they've never even needed a truing. The 1st time I switched to Carbon was maybe ten years ago on my Specialized S-Works Enduro, a Carbon "26er" bike I might add. The difference was life changing. Descents I braked on with alloy, I didn't touch my brakes on the carbon set. They were very stiff.
Fragility still exists among some brands. Looking at you hunt.
I have a 350€ alloy wheelset and I'm perfectly happy with them. I can't even imagine paying 1000€ or whatever for wheels.
I have 50mm 70e alu rimset paired with 2.2/2.5mm spokes and full steel wheel shaft with sealed bearings and nothing more I want
I swapped to carbon wheels ten years ago.....ironically to save money...after flat spotting yet another Stans Flow EX I gave up. Apart from one experiment with an early light light bicycle rim that lasted ten minutes, I have yet to crack on in that time. Currently reserve 30's on a Specicialzed enduro....mainly rocky bike park duties
I’ll stay with aluminum cheaper and they will last me a very long time.
As Finroddd said the only problem with carbon wheels for most riders is price , I would love to have carbon hoops on my bikes but cannot justify the cost.
Iv broken a few expensive Carbon hoops but I still like them for my style of riding. A lifetime warrantee is probably the most important thing, Carbon wheel will just teach you how to build wheels properly :D
I have a set of Reynolds carbon XC wheels and one day kaboom! One wheel broke......It was at the aluminum hub. One of the flanges cracked and separated across several spokes. They are deep dish and maybe they are so stiff all the flexing stressed the hub but the rims are super solid. I got it fixed and still ride them 12 years later...on a different frame because eventually the Yeti AS-R frame they were originally on, cracked too. :D
The cost is a critical factor also. At around £400 and upwards for a quality carbon fibre rim at 400g without the lifetime warranty, what are the real world advantages to the majority of riders?
I know Owen is very knowledgeable but unfortunately this video broke myth busting rule #1. Show don't tell.
Actually put the myths to the test and let the results speak for themselves. Show us why carbon wheels aren't as fragile as alloy. Show us their compliance. Also, you should post links or mention where you are getting your data.
The "proofs" presented were basically, "The wheel brands swear their wheels are stronger and more compliant these days. We should believe them." I think it would have been better if a more unbiased and scientific approach to answering to these myths was used instead.
Exactly!
Seems like a "Buy more shit' video, than any sincere attempt to inform the viewer.
Fit for purpose - professional racers. Manufacturing sophistication is mandatory. Stay away from high temperatures (like vehicle exhaust).
Went from ex511 to a set of weareone 2 years ago... Was careful at first but theyre just sturdy af and not that harsh
Have broken some alloy wheels but never a pair of Carbon ,upgrading the wheels is always the thing that makes the most difference on a stock bike ,and carbon is what i urge for when Doing that
Jesus, every video in GMBN is an ad either explicit like this or implicit like the one trying to create frame size anxiety on the viewers. Sad to see.
Something that I had considered when before I got my wheel set built by my LBS was doing an aluminum front wheel and carbon fiber rear wheel. The back wheel has the most weight so that’s where I wanted to save the most weight. But I’ll be buying a new bike in three years so it wasn’t worth it to me.
Owen. Did you get my E=mtb² Cartoon on the evolution of human thinking . ???. I have had nipples pull through on Carbon rims.But that was Roval in 2018. My new Amflow( E=mtb³?? )has carbon rims. Hopefully 6 years later they will be the Ducks Guts.💪🤞.Cheers
I see a 1000$ new front wheel in your future. I went to industry nine.
All together Carbon wheels are great but they're not twice as great as a good set of aluminum wheels Though they are twice the price. I have the money I just can't justify spending it there.
what brand is the most compliant for carbon hoops but still strong enough for enduro?
I smashed a alloy rear rim and upgraded to carbon under a crash replacement deal. So now i have a alloy front and carbon rear. Any thoughts on this?
Smash the other alloy😄
That's my set up. Gonna swap the front out as soon as I have the cash
@@WorkLessRideMorehow do you find it?
Yes good way to get cheaper mtb new carbon rear alloy front no bike co offers the option its sad
I will tell you that I am far from a pro although I'm not horrible and I have carbon wheels on some of my bikes. And absolutely I feel a difference and I even felt more of a difference when I put kush core in my carbon wheels and not really for the better. But it's really not that bad for a downhill. Fun days at the park... And I ride my carbon wheels very hard and only had an issue once which was more of a freak accident
I can usually easily feel infinitesimal increments or changes like spoke tension since I have very high levels of mechanical sympathy. It also make me much slower than someone who doesn't give a sh...
Some alloy rims like my spank 359 feel stiffer than my 9velo and the set of noble carbon wheels I was borrowing this summer.
Carbon bars being "compliant" is another weird one, I have both the alloy and carbon one up bars and the alloy feels a lot more compliant and soft.
It's all about the construction and less about the material if you analyze things objectively.
I love my carbon wheels. Feel so direct with steering and lateral loads in corners and dont know if i can go back bases on ride quality. I have broke one however got it replaced and now run an insert in the rear. So yes will have to change some things when getting carbon. Have to up air pressure a psi or so and maybe run insert. Alloy and carbon are different so have to use them differently.
That's some good stuff. I look at it this way, bc I think there is more to rider weight, skill, terrain, rim size(height/width) even rim or disk braking, speed and going over the limits. Spokes were seen as compliance or less, back in the day; they're still doing the same work, but talked up much in the media. So your point about materials alone has merit. I'm thinking that carbon for a 29er is comparable or a good direction bc 26 or less is inherently stronger/stiffer. Where did 29er come from? 700c that have used carbon for stiffness and speed, for some time, it's just more responsive. And the road is not forgiving, so compliance is valid there more so? As well as frame stiffness for road, as is full sus' for anchoring that swinging triangle. And the newer racer material bias is about endurance of an alloy rim when beaten up by techy trails while racing...Back to spokes, for my weight on a rear biased HT, I'm going back to 14 straight gauge gauge bc I can feel too much flex in just a slight butted spoke. Just pick up and flex the two, and feel it right there; big difference. So spoke count and type do play a good roll. Even as 32 hole and less, do similarly. So it's a good mix of many things that take some time, experience, broken or changed parts, and money to sort out for the particular rider, terrain, mistakes, etc. Even as frame, axle type, hub drilling asymmetry and measurements contributes to force at the rim diameter... But how much flex is good for carbon? Bc it just snaps, hence replacement cost built into the warranty of expensive sets. Again for my setup, ridden on the street, I'm thinking that a stiffer 24mil rim height 29, in 28 hole w/ straight or bladed spokes will give the characteristics I'm thinking about. And there is always suspension, tire size and pressure that play a greater part in mtb on dirt. And those areas have to be learned and tuned by the riders. So materials, design and marketing will pull some folks in, but it's riding and learning the ropes, even paying your dues that will give the answer.l
Not really interested in plastic rims. Firstly, I expect my rims to be anodized in a chosen color or mirror polished. The cost is going to be offset by Onyx hubs in the middle however, plastico is a nogo for the coin. Plastic frames are out since a fully custom frame would be a car loan! It is going to be Ti or 4130 and tailored to my blueprints, rims are going to be recycled beer cans since they can be anodized or polished to a mirror finish.
Carbon wheels that I would gladly have cost over 2k USD, that is before any import tax. Would love to have them, but not for a price of a decent bike, sorry
Where were you filming this video? :)
Tensile strength in the spokes is what makes a rim stiff not the rim. Carbon is made to break down is not sustainable and degrades in a few years.
It's not a myth rather a real concern: can carbon be as durable in a non tubeless setup, i change tubes and tires over and over the last thing i want is crack a 500 euro rim after a flat with the plastic lever tool
Since you are riding a Canyon why no coverage of the Canyon STOP USE email sent to all registered users of the Spectral:ON CF & CFR, and Torque:ON CF eMTBs… batteries catching fire 🔥.
Expensive carbon wheels live up to the hype. The affordable carbon wheels have the issues that people complain about
Good 🎉
How good are they compared to the good enough wheels most of us already have? Where is this along the line of diminishing returns?
Some carbon wheels are extremely fragile. Some are not. That’s no myth. The same can be said for stiffness, weight, price, quality, et cetera
what about sustainability? is an aluminum wheel better for mother earth?
It takes a lot of energy to produce carbon fibers. Recycling is hard to impossible.
While aluminium is also not growing on trees it takes less energy to make it, and if it's recycled aluminium the energy demand is much lower compared to new aluminium.
A we are one carbon rim is only 100g lighter than my spank spike race 33 rim, the carbon wheelset costs about as much as I paid for my brand new carbon trail bike on clearance, so where's the incentive exactly? you want me to spend what I paid for my entire bike on a set of wheels just so I can save 200g and get a lifetime warranty? I don't think so, plus a lifetime warranty is only useful for as long as the manufacturer is still in business, not to mention the down time you can face while you wait for your broken wheel to get warrantied.
i just watched the gadgets videos and owen says he carries a tpu tube with him. is that a butyl I see strapped to your bike???
Great spot
But thats bag - Canyon Frame bag "Long Bracket" it mounts to the two bolts on the upper section of the down tube - I've managed to squeeze in two TPU tubes into it - of course you could fit - a TPU tube and a multitool!
Again good eyes - but yep not a Butyl tube - but a very similar coloured bag!
Cheers
Owen
I would not buy carbon wheels. From personal observation, I have seen far more broken carbon wheels than alloy. I also feel it is another personal preference thing.
Most people I watch bike packing on carbon wheels end up with numerous cracks in them before their journeys even finished… just saying 🤔
It's the expense for me very pricey
so is owen just remaking all the old videos???
Buy carbon wheels. Buy carbon wheels NOW. I feel brainwashed...
Are they worth the money?
Not for my wallet, knock 30-50% off, then yeah.
Take the lifetime warranty away which will make the wheels less expensive, because after all, you're paying for the replacements really
As if you would with ali and just replace it if it got busted up
They're TOO bloody expensive...ha!
So just talking and no science....
Agreed. Where's his proof? I thought they were going to take some samples of alloy and carbon rims and put them to the test. Weigh them, test them for stiffness, ride them, etc. etc.
🫵🏻 You did not bust any myths, you simply stated your hollow, unproven opinions.
Really good video, as always.
I just have one concern : nobody ever mentions that Carbon producing is 3 times more polluting than alloy. This could be of no concern to most of the riders but i do care 😅
"Carbon is stronger than steel"
It's not that simple. Carbon is very strong when it comes to tension in fiber direction. However the damage tolarance behaviour is completely different compared to crystalline materials like metals.
While carbon is used a lot today in aviation the fibers there have a better quality and the manufacturing of an Airbus A350 cannot be compared with manufacturing of bicycle components in China.
The problem with carbon is that it reduces more mass from ones wallet than ones bike. I can buy 3 sets of alloys for the price of a set of carbons so why would I buy carbon when I could make up the weight saving by making sure I do a poo before riding?