Elden Ring - The root of the problem
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 เม.ย. 2024
- The Erdtree is a majestic sight, but the decline of majesty is a constant theme in FromSoftware games. It's evidently already lost much of its luster, but it seems there may still be further for it to fall.
Song used: Village Ruins - King's Field IV OST - เกม
Deeproot isn't quite as far down physically as it should be for everything to fit together perfectly, so technically the trunk seen below ground overlaps somewhat with the Erdtree's placement. Still, I think the intended implication is that it should be viewed as a continual line, and if so, the fact it bends so severely can't be a great sign for the Erdtree's health.
Well, knowing that the Lake of Rot is surpringsily close to the Erdtree roots as well, its adds even more fun to the Lands Between
If they don't line up properly, maybe the Shadow of the Erdtree second tree is the Deeproot tree while the actual Erdtree isn't properly shown underground? In all likeliness that's NOT the case, but if placements are off and given the weird lineups on the trunks compared to the image for SotE, it's at least an interesting thought.
Edit: Should clarify I have like.... surface level depth on any and all lore stuff and just like making crackpot theories. Like that cloud in the center of the map covering a small DLC island that may lead to a massive underground area. The Towers DO form a ring and it's interesting to be there. Like I said. Crackpot theories.
We know that From Software loves realism projections with thing like this, usually the tree root systems are not that far undeground, uprootings clearly can show you this if you search images. Roots grow few meters(feet) deep and then just spread outwords from central point, so it's not that impossible. To be honest if there's root for half of the tree it's more anomalous then if deep root depth were not... that deep.
Btw the trunk is the original tree called "Greattree" but when the Golden Order came, the Erdtree grew over it
Wasn't there an older tree? One was aluted to in horn knights or whatever they called
Imagine finding a parking spot after searching for half an hour, only for a 4.5km tree to fall on your car, and the insurance company calling it an "act of marika's tits" or some shit
Imagine no other car is damaged by its fall 😢
It probably would be specified in the 2000ths footnote in your insurance contract too.
The bastards.
the tree also lands on the insurance company
Marikas mommy milkers
"an act of marika's tits" made me wheeze. They must've bumped the erdtree. Mystery solved. Screw the insurance company, Gideon will pay you handsomely.
I can't wait how many questions won't be answered in the dlc
the true Fromsoftware DLC experience
Aaaaand the identity of Velka would not be revealed again
@@KommissarAlexandergiven that GRRM wrote the whole narrative for the game, and miyazaki said a large part of the narrative was basically removed & sectioned off to be used for the DLC, I have reason to believe it will tie everything together (inb4 i eat these words in june)
@@bigboy6019 Miyazaki said both the base game and the DLC are separate parts of a mythos that GRRM has created. Some parts of DLC's storyline may have influenced the base game, but DLC was not supposed to be included from the beginning
@@metalmonster9536 "we just want to point out that he hasn't written anything exclusively and new for the sake of this DLC.
But it would still be fair to say that he and his mythos that he created for us are involved in the creation of Shadow of the Erdtree in the same way. And the reason for that is that in making the base game and making Elden Ring, we took from that mythos, but we only took one part of it. We took from a part that created the story of Elden Ring and created the world that we wanted to envision, and the Shadow of the Erdtree is yet another part of that original mythos that he wrote and that has inspired us to create the story of this DLC."
this is the one im thinking about
The second stage in Ranni’s plan…the Black Knife Lumberjacks…
C'mon, man. Ranni wouldn't be THAT ridiculous...
...they'd be the Black AXE Lumberjacks.
And kind of like an opposite Night's Cavalry, you'd only be able to encounter them when it isn't nighttime. Because they sleep all night and they work all day.
The tree seems like it'd fall on Liurnia, so Ranni didn't plan that part too well.
@@StraightOuttaJarhois Thet cut down Erdtree, they eat their lunch, they go to the lavolatory.
@@Karak-_- On Wendnesdays they go shopping, and have buttered scones for tea
I’m still convinced of the theory that the bottom half of the tree was a separate tree entirely, and that the erdtree was “grafted” onto it much in the same way real world plants are sometimes grafted onto other plants to help them grow in foreign environments. This would explain why the “newer” section of the tree grows at an angle.
That would be a mendbending revelation for the DLC considering how much weve heard of grafting in this game but never before connected it to the erdtree itself
I agree with this theory, but I think the erdtree was grafted to a pre existing root system.
Then it burned and became spectral.
The birth of omens is the biggest clue to this. The grafting was a partial success because of this traits of the older tree are showing in the rebirth process.
Also trees leaning over house is a bad omen, so the erdtree leaning over the golden order is bassicaly a prophecy of their inevitable failure
Yeah, I'm convinced that the Erdtree was never what we think it is. It's a parasite growing on the real tree that once stood there, put in place by the Outer Gods, giving only enough back to keep people happy and to keep them from asking questions.
Yeah but there’s no evidence for that (the “great tree” stuff is a mistranslation)
It would also explain the non-glowing portion of the erdtree behind morgotts throne you enter through, which I is suspiciously wedge shaped just like a real tree graft
In horticulture, when you take a plant and attach it to another so they grow as one, its referred to as grafting; when the original plant starts to dominate the new plant its called an "Omen"
The original tree was one that birthed Dragons. Marika's Erdtree is grafted onto that tree's roots, which is why Omen in-game and everything Crucible related get draconic features like horns or tails. It is the original tree stock trying to dominate the graft.
@@hammertime732 yup!! thats what I was alluding to! so cool how deep the lore goes in this game, even the language used tells tales
@@hammertime732 I'm gonna need to remember this because I think that's the most believable theory I've ever heard.
Grafted plants may have a visible bend or discontinuation where the graft was performed.
^
^
Oh no godrick is at it again
Of course it is the act of Godrick the Golden, mightiest of all Demigods, and employer to Rick
@@darkprime6815 I don't think grafting was ever Godricks creation.
The Unholy Centipede like ghouls that can be stun locked with healing spells, obviously were grafted long before Godrick existed.
He just stole the process from something else and started abusing it on himself and others.
The "Chinese Lion" creature from the DLC trailer looks like a grafted creature to me as well.
I think it was a far more common practice than people would believe.
shits serious when Zullie pulls out the protractor
Facts
I subscribe to the idea that the Shadow-Tree is weighing down the Erdtree and just invisible to anyone outside of the veil. Kinda like the Amygdala, it was always there, you just couldn't see it.
Similar to the evil spirits that plant themselves on your shoulders, causing stiffness and worsening body posture.
this activated my brain neurons thank you i love it
Is it possible that the DLC is set in the past and the bending of the Erdtree has already happend and the Shadow-Tree has already been delt with or is that an impossible suggestion?
@@SuperSymn NO. Miyazaki himself said in the interview that we are not going to travel to the past nor the future in the DLC, it happens in the present. The interview come out the same day as the trailer and this is already all well known.
@@TK-bo5kj Ok perfect thank you
I love how her statues make it obvious she is a puppet.
i never noticed that before, i thought it was more a reference to Jesus Christ as she is a god/messiah figure, but I think you're on to something.
@@yamo511 Both her hands are impaled by a rune arc when we find her, it's likely more of a reference to her punishment.
@@yamo511 same.
I think that it symbolizes that she created the golden order. She is posing like a crucible that is dropping hot metal. The erdtree looks like that too, and the elden ring has the same design. Hell the crucible is actually a thing in elden ring. She is showing that by controlling the elden ring she has made this world. She put all the aspects of the world together, melted them, picked what to remove (the rune of death) and dropped the molten metal. The molten metal cooled down and stabilized and thus the lands between were remade under her golden order
@@afridge8608 interesting, but I thought the crucible was primordial, and the Elden Ring existed before Marika as other gods used it prior to the Golden Order
It’s actually tilting due to a very large, undiscovered beaver we haven’t seen yet :3
True Elden Beast
Nidhogg, except it's a beaver instead of a dragon.
Beaver Communion Incantations would be awesome.
THE ELDEN BEAVE
that's adorable
"Patch 1.11:
- Fixed the Erdtree not being at 90° angle."
"If it fell" dude, I'm not asking for an ER2, but that setting would be spectacular. The Lands Between after being catastrophically struck by the fall of a snapped Erdtree.
Imagine an entire legacy dungeon in the hollow of the erdtree.
@@shirouyasha69 I'm thinking about it. The number of cool things they could do with it. A section could be inside the tree, but elsewhere the massive pieces could contaminate and be contaminated by all kinds of things, creating new environments and lifeforms.
Actually, this could be something cool irrespective of ER. A game taking place in the carcass of an ancient, gigantic thing isn't that new, but Fromsoft has never done it and it'd be really cool if they had an idea like that.
The erdtree is wilting and in order for it to possibly bloom it must be pruned. Burning off a plant that is effecting the bunch is a common practice in a garden.
Reminds me of how Marika wanted to keep her order perfect and absolute so maybe she refuses to change the Erdtree even as it's wilting
Some plants require fire to sprout, some are burnt to prevent disease spreading, but it's not common to burn crooked plants or burn other plants off of crooked plants, am I missing something?
@@launchbase4944 @melaniabladeofmiquilla It depends on where you live. For a historical example, many cultures of native Americans practiced controlled burns to maintain the ecology of the continent for thousands of years, viewing it as their garden. Then colonists came and outlawed the practice which is part of the reason we've had such horrible wildfires in California, big overgrowths of plants in certain areas makes them use too much surface water and get sick and dry and dense. Now our government is starting to follow their model, they've started doing regular controlled burns and it's drastically cut down on the amount of wildfires, plus every one restores a large amount of nutrience to the soil for new plants to grow off of.
@@Foxingg blame the horrible conservation "efforts" of the state of california, not colonists lmao
@@yamo511 i didn't. And they're the same thing
During my playthrough of the game I remember assuming that the roots in the Capitol were creating a path for you. Since without them you couldn't reach parts of the city and complete your task. Some of the roots are obviously new and damaging the surrounding structure. Like a fulfillment of prophecy and the Erdtrees foreknowledge of your arrival.
They’re more like vines, as they grow out of the ground.
Imagine that big ass tree falling over
I mean, it won't last for long if it keeps burning...
hell yeah
The resulting earthquake would probably level the entire continent
@@leilaclarridge5807and thats only if all the roots being pulled above ground doesnt explode the continent first lol
Poetic that the entire Erdtree looks like a single dandelion seed in the thumbnail. Very nice touch.
Exactly! How did the seeds actually spread, in The Lands Between?
@@SebTed-qu2el 🤔
Humble suggestion for a future video: comparison between the bloodletting beast and the skull on the altar in the grand cathedral
I would like to do more Bloodborne videos, but it's always a hassle to mess with it comparatively, since it's not on PC.
@@ZullietheWitch I imagined so :( not even your mighty sorceries can replace the power of a PC
but still mighty enough to create all those extremely helpful false depth chalices
I’m pretty sure that’s Laurence’s skull. Interacting with it lets you hear his last conversation with Willem, we know that he became a beast before he died, and it wouldn’t make much sense to have a skull on display if it weren’t a relic of some important figure in the Church.
@@ZullietheWitchbut you've got that. I Remember seeing It in an old video of yours😂😂😂
I heard a theory that points out how Godrick's grafting is a reference to a real-life horticultural technique of grafting a piece of one plant onto the root system of another to make a hybrid plant. This, along with the reference to the catacomb roots as "Great Tree roots" makes me think that this bend in the Erdtree is not just from it withering, but from the weakening of the connection point where the Erdtree had been grafted to the Great Tree's trunk. The Great Tree itself may be trying to shrug off the weakened Erdtree, much like how plant grafts can eventually fail as the host plant rejects the foreign graft.
I Wonder If that would be a good or Bad Thing...
You make a good point in referring to the bottom half of the Tree as a separate plant. The question then, I suppose, would be what was the original Tree?
@@leilaclarridge5807 I personally believe it to likely be the remains of the primordial crucible
I heard a similar theory from the tarnished archeologist I think, just that there crucible could be a tree stump regrowing with multiple saplings, with one winning in the end, it's very interesting and look at the full video. Currently his theories are more or less what I'm going with
@@ricardojanate That's also where I heard my theory. I think what happened is the Great Tree was felled, and the crucible was all the new sprouts forming from the trunk. The Erdtree was grafted onto the Great Tree trunk at this point in time, and was cultivated to outlast all the other sprouts.
With some dude that has an ability to quake the ground with every stomps and hand slams living at the heart of it, it is no wonder the Erdtree just gave up and started falling.
Bruh *HOW DID I NOT NOTICE THE 2ND TREE WRAPPING AROUND THE ERDTREE ARTWORK FOR THE DLC???* I thought it was another branch...
Yeah, thats literally been all over Elden Ring lore side of things since the reveal back in 2022
Blindness or living under a rock are the two options.
have you tried looking at it with your eyes open? that usually helps me out
@@insertedgynamehere___969 uh. No? I'm talking about the dlc artwork.
@@launchbase4944 have you tried not being a snob? That usually helps me out
Lokey has an interesting theory that Marika disrupting the original cycle of life and death (as well as the succession of Elden Ring hosts) by removing the Rune of Death and consolidating power is what caused the “age of plenty” during Godfrey’s era to end. It's totally in line with both what the game presents and Miyazaki's favorite theme about the hubris of rulers leading to decline for everyone
You have to realize that Erdtree is an alien lifeform grown out of the celestial (fell from stars) Outer God (Greater Will) seed (which is the Order, Pattern, or Elden Ring). It is a parasitic lifeform which attacks the Crucible which is the tru(er) source (as we know it in game), also having the adherents still loyal to that (Crucible Knights and that whole faction).
At least this is how I see it according to deep dives into game lore and reading discussions of numerous people talking about it online.
Ranni and Marika had a conspiracy to restore the old order / or remove and change the order to no order at all, to let the world find its own way (in which I totally agree with Ranni, making her ending my favorite).
It's an interesting theory, but I think that the Rune of Death annihilating souls indicates that it doesn't help bring anything to the Erdtree, and the Lands Between doesn't seem like a place where plants can't obstain sustenance. Also, Lokey theorizes that the Erdtree was an emergency measure, and thus not meant to be the norm, that was enacted to still provide the Elden Ring's blessings after its previous wielder died. However, if that were the case, once Marika claimed the Elden Ring she'd be able to do everything the Erdtree did, so nothing would be lost to Marika's society at all.
Additionally, the Elden Beast's arena implies that the Greater Will's plans involve having Erdtrees on planets throughout the universe. If Erdtrees are only emergency measures, why have so many Erdtrees? Why does even Elden Stars, the oldest incantation that tells of the Elden Ring's arrival, use an Erdtree sigil?
Also, something a few item descriptions claim is that the Erdtree was thought to be eternal and thus shouldn't have seeds. However, Marika declared herself "the Eternal" and nobody ever questioned that despite her having kids throughout her reign. IMO, this is meant to be a sign that people are applying a double standard to the Erdtree. The people of Altus Plateau may just be resentful that the Erdtree works like an actual tree with a fruiting season, and that it distributes seeds that could let each region have its own Erdtree.
@@nightscout9979 I think you're reading way too much into the Elden Beast arena thing. We don't even have evidence anywhere in the game that other planets similar to the world the Lands Between are in even exist.
@@nu1x Your theory is based on a complete misunderstanding of a lot of the game’s fundamentals. It’s a common misunderstanding, so I can’t blame, you but it’s wrong nonetheless. The Greater Will is not an “alien” entity in the sense of some malevolent invader extrinsic to the world, but the creator deity of the entire universe, responsible for the existence of life itself. We learn this from Hyetta with her insight into the creation of the universe and the origins of the Frenzied Flame.
We don’t know whether it is or isn’t an “Outer God” because we don’t actually know what things define an “Outer God” or not - only four entities (Formless Mother, Frenzied Flame, Malenia’s god of Scarlet Rot, and an unnamed god of death) are identified as Outer Gods in-game. The Greater Will as God of Order mirroring the Frenzied Flame’s status as God of Chaos would make sense, especially given their roles in the creation myth, but we don’t know for sure if the label applies to it because it’s defined so vaguely.
Nowhere is it suggested that the Crucible was some unrelated force that the Erdtree is a “parasite” on. Characterizing the Erdtree as a “parasite” is completely mistaken - even if the Greater Will were malevolent and “alien”, the Erdtree’s relationship with the world is symbiotic, not parasitic. The age in which the Crucible was seen as divine and the Crucible Knights served under Godfrey was the age of plenty early into the existence of the Erdtree.
I’m going to remain agnostic on the question of whether Marika and Ranni conspired, but this idea that a lot of people seem to have that Marika’s plan accomplishes Ranni’s goals is completely silly. If true, it would mean Ranni’s questline is totally pointless - why go through the whole business of finding the Fingerslayer Blade to kill her Fingers and then remove the Order from the world if you already accomplish this in the Elden Lord endings? Ranni wouldn’t need to carry out her own plan, and could just sit pretty until a Tarnished defeats the Beast.
I recommend watching Smoughtown's video on the Greater Will for a better understanding of this subject
@@soarel325 The Elden Beast manifests a kind of stellar stage for the cosmos itself, complete with mature Erdtrees in all directions, as though to reveal just what the Tarnished is up against. Since there are basically no Erdtrees north of Leyndell, we know these aren't mere representations of the minor Erdtrees and saplings in the Lands Between.The Numen are also said to come from outside the Lands Between, and their links to Nox civilization imply that they might come from another planet. The gravity creatures come from other worlds too, in particular the Astels. Ranni even plans to travel through space in her ending.
The incantation that tells of the Elden Ring coming to the Lands Between is Elden Stars, essentially a shooting star that itself launches other shooting stars as it travels through the air. The golden star that the Elden Beast rode could have sent other golden stars to other worlds. Some outer gods also appear to be stellar bodies, such as the moons and the blood star (implied to be the Formless Mother), so it's not a stretch for the outer gods to have a presence on other worlds.
SUch subtle environmental storytelling setpieces that go a long way to flesh out the world yet their true implications only seen in a Zullie video through careful analysis.
Brilliant as always!
Miquella was building Erdtreehouse, but it turned out to be too heavy.
i'm now imagining tourist Tarnished taking photographs where it looks like they're holding up the leaning Erdtree
It’s likely possible the reason the Erdtree is starting to tilt, Is due to the roots now connecting itself with the dead Erdtree that’s been tainted by those who live in death.🐱
If deathroot is based on strangler fig plant, it could very well be the constricting "shadow" of the Erdtree, slowly contributing to its withering and eventual death.
Rune of Death is called "a forbidden shadow, plucked from the Order" after all.
Godwyn's corpse seems to be the seedbed for the deathroot and notably sprouts alternative black trunk reaching upwards towards Erdtree.
"Root" of the problem...
Well worded.
The erdtree having offspring in the form of minor erdtrees, erdtree saplings (the places where golden seeds are found) and its golden seeds could mean that the erdtree itself may be a part of it's own cycle of life and death. Fated to die one day as it is a physical plant and let one of its offspring take its place. Just like how Marika has her Empyrean children. Just like her children, some have died, some have become corrupted, and some have been more favored. The 2nd generation of erdtree's also seem to be starting to fill some of it's parents shoes. As most of the time they are either surrounded by dead bodies or causing the environment to flourish or both. Seemingly reminiscent of erdtree burial.
Also I just like the idea of nurturing one of my excess golden seeds into my own little demigod plant.
I thought so as well. I thought demigods would be protecting Erdtree sapplings in their respective territories to benefit from it, forge a symbiotic relationship with it, and have it eventually replace the Old Erdtree.
Granted, it was cool headcanon which is not true, alas.
@@matiasluukkanen7718 Unless you take into account the haligtree. However, the haligtree as far as we are aware is not a descendant of the erdtree. Merely Miquellas attempt at cultivating his own sacred plant species similar to Marika's erdtrees through his own blood. In this respect not only did he form a literal, physical symbiotic relationship with the tree, embedding himself in it and it slowly taking his shape not too dissimilar to Marika being paracausally linked to the erdtree. But also that once those plans failed due to mohgs lust for his sibling, taking his cocoon... Malenia somewhat bonded with the tree as well through her scarlet rot.
I remember reading in the game or in some TH-cam video how the erdtree wasn’t supposed to ever have offspring, and to be eternal. Also that the mere fact of spreading saplings to grow into smaller golden trees started when the original erdtree was dying, as a mechanism of preservation.
@@jmiquelmb
You remember correctly. In the Crimson Seed Talisman item description:
"A crimson-colored talisman patterned after an Erdtree seed. Boosts HP restoration from the Flask of Crimson Tears. The Erdtree was once perfect and eternal, and thus was it believed that Erdtree seeds could not exist."
It seems that the Erdtree only released seeds in distress due to the Shattering. As it is said in the golden seed description:
"A golden seed, found at the base of an illusory tree. Increases a Sacred Flask's number of uses. When the Elden Ring was shattered, these seeds flew from the Erdtree, scattering across the various lands, as if life itself knew that its end has come."
@@theiceelemental820 The Haligtree appears to have its own tree avatars and tree spirits, so it was probably developed from an Erdtree seed.
I've a little knowledge about forestry and one of a few things I thought about the Erdtree is one can possibly view the minor erdtrees like root suckers. Some trees, when ill or damaged, will send up things that look like saplings but aren't actually new individuals (most commonly seen in beech, which unfortunately in the NE US is currently suffering from an invasive fungus) - the result is almost a zombie tree, continuing to live through its offshoots but won't ever really recover or fruit as fully again, My other thought was about the Erdtree itself--the bottom branches are very barren. This is somewhat natural and normal in healthy trees as it grows new branches above that shade out the ones below, but when it becomes especially abundant, the dead lower limbs can be signs of damage or disease. They can also be dangerous bc they can fall on people/things.
Overall, very interesting. The Erdtree is one of my fav focal points in the game, bc it starts off as a guide and becomes more threatening/ominous the closer you actually get to it as it looms overhead.
So it's sort of like how clonal plants operate normally, but on a lesser scale and reserved for emergencies?
@blarg2429 yeah basically! the suckers will die if cut off from the main tree (insofar as i know) unlike clonal plants but otherwise same idea. Beech is the biggest that comes to mind because you'll see one big beautiful but dead/dying tree surrounded by these weedy looking thickets of not-saplings that just Aren't doing the ecosystem function beeches normally do. And once the main tree finally runs out of steam, usually the whole thing collapses (it can take years however)
Marika seems to be the queen of gaslighting; capable of hiding entire alternate personalities, states of the world, holy trees, and entire lands, behind a veil of trickery.
Honestly; what makes her so interesting is that her plans to get a Tarnished to end all this are SO vague, that we still don't know if it was well intentioned or not, given how creepy the outer gods are.
"Girboss, Gatekeep, Gaslight" - Marika, probably
Something that comes to mind when I think about the Erdtree's placement is how it is located right at the cliff that faces the inner sea of the Lands Between. If we think about how Farum Azula was once supposed to be in the middle of the map (maybe somewhere south of Leyndell) and later got torn away, maybe this could have affected the Erdtree's placement per se, leaving it in the middle of a big crack but still (barely) attached to the main continent to the north, where Leyndell lies. What I want to point out is that one part of this big crack could be the cliffside to the south of Leyndell. I don't know enough about the lore to say whether this relationship could make any sense, but it is something that comes to mind when observing the environment. I'm sorry if I didn't express myself well, I'm not a native English speaker.
I like the idea that the erdtree in the lands between is more like an illusion, or a VEIL, and the tree we see in the shadowlands is how the erdtree actually appears.
If we consider that the Erdtree was once already burned, it could explain the damage and leaning of the tree. There are some depictions in the game of the Erdtree on fire long before our story starts.
golden order prophets would sometimes have visions of the Erdtree burning, maybe it is a reference to that. They did get banished after talking about it though, so I don't know why the idea would be commemorated in paintings
There is ash in Leyndell long before we come along and burn it, and all the houses have waxed their doors and windows shut, which is similar to what could be done in the past where duststorms/sandstorms were uncommon, think it did happen in America at some point?
@Skrallizar There was a series of sandstorms that happened in North America in the 1930s called the Great Dust Bowl. I don't remember if anyone waxed their windows and doors shut when that happened though.
I wonder how many people were able to make it out Leyndell. A lot of the homes and buildings are still waxed shut, so either people got trapped in, or people were evacuated beforehand and wanted to protect the buldings while they were gone.
Praise The Tree!
I think it’s important to note that the door into the Erdtree is not tilted, even with the Erdtree leaning, which would mean that the Erdtree hasn’t shifted since it was built, presumably early into Marika’s age
also the fact that the erdtree we see is an illusion. the real tree is long gone
minor erdtrees have bark of a solid brown, but the big erdtree is all transparent yellow, just like Golden Shade of Godfrey, another illusion
from morgott's arena we can see a bit of real brown (slightly white) bark under the yellow illusion
in the frenzyflame ending, the final cutscene, the illusion dissapear and you can see the erdtree is nothing more than a stump
also i think there is things about another tranished already burning his maiden a long time ago. bernhal or something else, which would be why the tree is not here anymore
it's burned, and the ashes are still in Leyndell
When Maliketh is defeated and Leyndell becomes the Ashen Capital, brown branches can clearly be seen in the Erdtree's canopy. Some of these branches even fall into Leyndell, with one in particular having the Erdtree's Favor +2 Talisman on it. The Erdtree is thus real, not an illusion, and it simply glows just like the minor Erdtrees at the Minor Erdtree Church. In the Frenzied Flame ending, the titular fire has literally just burned the Erdtree, and the bark peels outward in such a way that it protrudes past where the golden bark was.
As for the ashes in Leyndell when it's the Royal Capital, that likely is indeed from Bernahl's Finger Maiden burning the Erdtree. Bernahl never defeated Maliketh, so the flames probably were only as strong as when Melina initially burns the Erdtree, thus doing far less damage. That prior fire is probably why the Erdtree's lower branches don't have any leaves on them.
Let me cook for a bit here::
So we know that Godwyn, as incarnation of the Living Death, exists in a "Dream Realm" separated from the "material" or physical world. The influence of his existence is metaphysically transferred to many points across the realm, particularly the foundatioun of Godrick's Castle where we find a pseudo-copy of him.
In Shadow of the Erdtree we are invited into a Shadowy Realm split from the rest of the Lands Between, with Miquella present there as well. Not in body, only in spirit. We also know he wishes to free his brother from his cursed existence, wanting him to die a "true death". To that end people already speculated about his "alter ego" St. Trina being possibly linked to this endeavour, as sleep is how dreams are accessed. Not to mention the old adage that "Sleep is the brother of Death".
Where does the DLC come in? Well look at 2:10 and see the "growth" choking the Erdtree...and look where it emerges from. While this area is "elsewhere" in the Lands Between or "used" to be there, if we just look at these two large tree structures they do seem to relate to the "real" position of what they are: The Erdtree is standing crooked and bend, still where it once did...and aside from it, just a little displaced, something emerges from the ground and chokes the LIFE out of it.
I am very certain that the growth we see here is the metaphysical manifestation of Godwyn's influence on the Erdtree with his deathroot, seeing how it actually looks more like thick root growing OUT of the ground instead. An "inverted tree" so to speak, fitting how Those Who Live In Death are anathematic to the Golden Order. There is also something else which I found very confusing and is still unanswered (unless I missed something on this): We never learned WHERE Godwyn died. The place was never specified, only that it happened at "night"...which is what brings me to a curious question: Could Godwyn have been assasinated...inside the realm under the veil? The coniferous trees from the trailer, where we see his assasination, looks somewhat like those we see in the trailer. Whatever the case, my bet is that Miquella divested himself of everything he was bestowed with to enter the Spirit World not just to find an alternative to the Greater Will but to find yet another way to pursue the release of his brother from this undead state.
Tiche's Spirit Ashes note that Godwyn was murdered in Leyndell, as Tiche and Alecto had to flee the royal capital.
@@nightscout9979 Ah, I see. I never got her ashes, that might explain it. Still, the rest stands IMO. No matter whether any of it sticks though, I am eager for "More" all the same.
the channel tarnished archeologist has a theory that the erdtree was actually something grafted not the stump of an older tree. So if we assume that's the case, it leaning might imply the grafting was done poorly.
And where did they find a colossal golden tree to glue on top of the older one?
And how does the Crucible fit in this, considering it's the "primordial form of the Erdtree", not an extraneous body that got the Erdtree grafted on top?
@@cammyshill3099 A graft to a stump wouldn't be a fully grown tree but a small sapling, the "crucible" could refer to the process that can occur after you graft something where a bunch of new branches and so on can spring up alongside the grafted saplings.
Tarnished Archeologist does a LOT of reaching in his videos.
@@cammyshill3099 That's not how grafting works, it wouldn't have been a fully grow tree at the time.
@@cammyshill3099It would make sense since the crucible could have been dedicated to the great tree that is mentioned in some parts of the game. The cult of the great tree could have gradually forgotten in favor of the erdtree cult.
I like the idea of deathroot acting as a parasitic plant that grows up and around another tree, choking the life out of it
Abnormal bending or curvature may be a sign of PD or Peyronie’s Disease
I also like the idea that the erdtree is based on a yew tree, which instead of having a single trunk has multiple overlapping roots in the middle phase of its lifespan.
interdasting
2 reasons why i simply cannot follow the idea that the erdtree was once straight: the way inside the tree is an ancient stone doorway that is not crooked and if you stand at the right angle around the tree, it will look straight, straight enough for a good painting.
Completely unrelated but geez the Erdtree is such an iconic image. Just thinking about that when watching this vid. No matter where you are in the Lands Between, the image of the Erdtree is burned into our brains. It’s beautiful.
My favourite perspective is from Caelid, as I love the deep contrast between Red and Gold.
Night-time Liurnia is also good, having the bright golden Erdtree shine among the cosmos
Tarnished archaeologist has a good vid about the erdtree being an illusion, which is why its glowing gold like godreys phantom
Everything holy in the lands between glows gold, and the erdtree emits light
The shadow of the Erdtree is made of dark matter and it's gravitational pull is bending the Erdtree!
Fromsoft, who just thought tilting the tree was more visually appealing: 😅
Jokes aside, From's depictions of the status quo on the verge of collapse are super cool, the way the powers that be desperately scramble to preserve their authority. The Dark Souls trilogy is about prolonging the Age of Fire, no matter how many "chosen" must be fed to the flames, and it ends showing the world buried in ash, nothing left for a new Age to inherit.
I wouldn't be surprised if the second tree isn't trying to destroy the Erdtree, but instead prop it up. It certainly looks like Deathroot, perhaps even with his soul slain, Goldwyn still attempts to maintain the Golden Order, even if it's literally rotten inside.
When ur faster then light u only get to live in the darkness
maybe what we see in the lands between is the actual shadow of the erdtree, and the one in the land of shadow is the real one, perhaps why marika hid it
you know bro is serious when the protractor comes out
Seeing as the Land of Shadow is confirmed to exist in the same physical space as the Lands Between, just obscured from sight, it's reasonable to assume that whatever this second tree is, it's always been there, perhaps choking the life from the Erdtree, and it too has been obscured from sight in order to preserve the false perception of the Golden Order's/Erdtree's strength and maintain influence.
I think something cool is if you look at Shadow of Erd tree announcement art you start to get an idea of how different the in-game vs in-lore scales of Elden Ring are. In that art you see the shadow of the erd tree to be what looks several miles away and completely dwarfing mountains. To me this indicates that these trees aren't just 3 miles high but potentially like 10-20 which is bonkers and something you could see from 100s of miles away. Also it shows off how instead of the lands between being 30 square miles, it's probably 100s or 1000s of square miles. Doesn't effect the game but it does let my imagination run wild.
Relations of time and space can be bent and distorted for the sake of storytelling, and the entirety of the game is storytelling.
your videos are magical!
also important to think about the fact that the erdtree is mostly hollow, a sign of rot and near death old age
The mass of two whole cities being sunk below the earth near the roots of the Erdtree probably didn't do the thing's stability any favors. Then there's the cancer that is the outgrowth of Godwin the Golden's corpse undermining literally everything in the Lands Between. That one dead tree doesn't stand a chance.
Considering the ancient looking door on the erd tree and the throne area being connected to it, I don't believe the erd tree has shifted during the golden order. It must have happend long before the capital, or even the stone doors were built.
It's possible that the paintings of the Erdtree were just made from an angle where the tree is either leaning directly toward or away from the viewer, and the tree has always been bent.
But when Gideon glimpsed into the will of Queen Marika, he shuddered in fear.
At the end that should not be.
Zullie getting me hyped for that dlc
crazy how close we are to the DLC release! great vid
Shadow of The Erdtree, I wonder if it works like the shadows of the Empyreans.
Imagine the new area we go to is where they make the shadows or just kidnap the shadow copies and kill off the originals.
@@darkprime6815 Miquella's power is over sleep and youthful purity, and the compulsion of men's hearts in hopes and dreams. It feels like we are entering the death realm, like the dirty things swept under the rug. Our purpose is like Jung on dreams, talking about he who looks inside awakes. We see things as they are, and rise to manifest our own tree free of stranglers.
man, this kings field ost is perfect for the video
I love how much theorizing is happening before shadow of the Erdtree
Wait, if there's something similar in size to the erdtree in the deeproot depths but it doesn't quite line up, then couldn't that just be whatever is growing to weigh down the erdtree in the DLC?
Seeing the image of the weighed down Erdtree immediately reminded me of Strangler Figs. For those unaware, strangler figs are a kind of tree from tropical environments that grows from crevices in other trees. By sapping nutrients from a host tree, they grow roots downward and branches upward around the host tree, to the point where the host can die and leave a hollow, free standing strangler.
While the effect of stranglers usually isn't this dramatic, it is possible. It also made me stop to wonder if the Erdtree itself might be a Strangler that killed off whatever tree came before. It would explain a lot of details, to me at least.
great content, thank you for the insight!
if you keep this up, I'll soon hear baby cries in the distance
I'm willing to bet that the second tree in the dlc image is actually Godwyn's death blight influence, grasping up and strangling the tree
interesting, after I started reading Berserk again, thinking about buying this game and for the amazing lore and charactere designs
Huh, keen eyes. I didn't even realize it was a tree growing over and smothering another.
I asked in the Elden Ring subreddit a year ago why the Erdtree leans. The top votes comment was that it was moving, like plants do, towards the sunlight....
I was thoroughly upset by this answer lol. The Erdtree is humongous, it doesn't need to "lean towards the sunlight" because of how massive it is. I was under the impression from the beginning that it was falling or loosened by the deeproots depths' deathblight or something else like that, and until otherwise that's what I believe.
Anyone notice how the Erdtree looks like its being "cast" or "projection", almost like the ghosts that walk around and guide you to the catacombs? Like a projection of Marika's Golden Order on top of which once was NOT considered blasphemous. But in Shadow of the Erdtree trailers, it looks REAL and an actual physical tree.
I think the golden tree is a false projection on top of the real tree below in the Depths. And that's where Godwyn is...
0:11 Idk if its because its a picture, but the erdtree at the time it was painted this piece was definetly more golden while now looks more pale
Imagine the sound this tree will make when it falls... everyone will hear it
I was not expecting to see a protractor in this Elden Ring lore analysis...
The 'other growth' is actually quite a common thing in forests - the banyan tree and other trees like it are known as 'strangler figs' because that's exactly what they do. Their seeds sprout at the top of a tree to get sunlight, then send roots down along the trunk into the ground, and eventually as the strangler fig thickens, the host tree weakens and eventually dies.
Wow very deep and interesting vid, i guess we will know more in the dlc. Nice job!
I agree that it's just the game model. I work on trees irl and grafting the entire trunk of a tree to a new root zone isn't really a thing it's usually done with cuttings from the limbs when both donor and host are relatively young and that angle becomes less abrubt over time as they grow together. You can tell how long it's been since a tree has been grafted due to this fact and if it was grafted then due to the abrubt angle it wouldn't have been that long ago relatively so the erdtree still would have been impossibly huge to move there. The explanation for the tree leaning is in it's location, i see this all the time, planted on a slope with a body of water on one side the roots are going to support the weight way better on the mountain side so it's going to lean the other way where the roots have to grow way deeper under the sea bed if at all
No no, the Erdtree was grafted on the previous Great Tree stump while still a sapling, and began growing alongside other branches that were springing up from the stump.
@@Myclutchisgone that's not how grafting trees works dude. Grafting a sapling onto a stump of an adult tree that is somehow still alive will not result in the sapling overtaking the tree. The sapling will not revitalize the tree it will just end up self competing and die to the tree with the established root zone
There's some speculation that the golden Erdtree is a magical Illusion akin to first Elden Lord Godfrey, cast upon the trunk of the orignial Erdtree that has long since died. Would at least make more sense than some impossible grafting.
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My money is on, that the original erdtree is in the depths and the new one was crafted from that, but in shadows of the erdtree that original tree grows and wraps around the new growth forming the twisted image we see in the trailer
The Erdtree itself was once burnt and replaced 'with an object of faith', the ghostly erdtree we see today, but that faith is waning as gods leave the lands between and the average person has gone insane. The rotted stump is finally beginning to topple.
Hey! I’m pretty sure I was the first person to suggest the idea at 2:11 on the day the trailer released! I made an extremely similar image, down to the colors too lol. I wonder if this is another tree that Messmer or someone has planted that’s goal is to suck the life out of the Erdtree, squeeze the sap from it (as you can see sap dripping down towards the half moon shaped building in the image), or otherwise kill the Erdtree. Love this, great vid Zullie.
The Erdtree has been burned to a stump even before the breaking of the Elden Ring and the illuminated part we see aboveground is an illusion, like the sites of grace are. Seen only by those chosen by grace. This theory is elaborated on by the @Tarnished Archeologist.
the deeproot stump is what's left of the second darker tree strangling the erdtree after marika chopped it down to suppress it's influence. The Erdtree leans because it used to be pulled almost entirely at a 45 degree angle by the shadow tree, but now that it's been chopped down it has slowly been getting straighter as eons pass, still not totally upright.
i like to imagine that it is like the Leaning tower of Pisa where the ground is spongy making it lean.
Erdtree is actually a ghost tree so there is no problem at all xd
I assumed that the trees need some sort of life-force to feed from, hence why the Haligtree is dying after Miquella was torn from it.
In that case I suppose Marika/Radagan's broken body and/or the shattered Golden Order ring could be causing the tree to begin faltering.
In a very early interview. Miyazaki talks about the themes in his game regarding birth, growth, death, and rebirth. He directly related this theme to The Erdtree, talking about how it’s this unparalleled force of life that will one day die. I like that, instead of a Fromsoft game taking place AFTER the death of an age, in Elden Ring we’re just about to reach an end of an age - represented by the still-standing erdtree
If the Erdtree falls in Leyndell, and no one is around to hear it...
LEANING TOWER OF PIZA?!?! IS THAT YOU?!?!
Man I'm stoked for the DLC.
That black tree seems to be Godwyn's tree of death. It's blackened entirely and erupting directly below the erdtree.
I think the mutating body of Godwyn is rotting the base of the Erdtree as he evolves into this nightmare undead fish monster
Zullie I’m curious to see your thoughts about other aspects of the Erdtree’s model. I saw in a Ziostorm video he looks up close at the branches and you can see golden vines wrapping around regular great tree vines. I would love your commentary!
i think the simpliest theory would be that it ran out of ground for the roots and slumped over cause its just to damn big
Every divine tower when it is raining, the tree is itself transparent, illusion tree confirmed you cannot convince me otherwise.
If you use a telescope or bow and zoom in, the Erdtree stops being transparent, so the transparency seems to be a glitch. Even the giant wooden trunk Zullie brings to the surface in this video looks transparent in one spot when the camera is distant, so that probably isn't intended.
I can't believe I predicted which music would play in this video before watching
Maybe the EVIL erdtree is there in real life strangling and breaking the tree but it’s veiled out of sight from the rest of the Lands Between just like the new DLC area
It is an "object of faith" and its tottering angle is a sign that the illusion of the faith is toppling over. It is like a crooked church steeple, only it is not even made of wood, but is a Spirit Ash.
Can't wait for all the new juicy lore!!!
When I first saw the tree, I interpreted the askew angle being due to the curvature of the earth or something