Truth and Science 5/6: Thinking, Cognition, consciousness and the "I am". Knowing first principles!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2023
- Alternative title: Britain vs Germany: The "I am nots" vs the "I ams"
Jeff and I continue digging into GA 3, Truth and Science (Wahrheit und Wissenschaft) which Steiner called "A prologue to the Philosophy of Spiritual Activity"
#rudolfsteiner
#empiricism
#germanromanticism
#fichte
In this episode we look at chapter 6 "Theory of Knowledge Free of Assumptions and Fichte's Science of Knowledge". What it the relationship between the "I am", cognition and consciousness
Frederik Amrine's article on Fichte mentioned by Jeff: www.waldorflibrary.org/images...
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I'm impressed by the depth of this conversation, especially the second part of the video - I will listen again to this part in a couple of days... Jeff was definitely in the flow in this one, thanks 🙏Jeff and Angus!
I'll add my two cents' thoughts on this 😉 hehe... I'll blame Angus, who suggested at min 1:57:10, that we should find different ways to deepen our understanding of what 'I' is, what 'Astral' is, what 'Etheric' is...
One can 'connect' with someone else because our 'I' is the same - we connect at the level of 'I', and feel the Self of the other individual.
Okk. But while the 'I' (and the Higher 'I') might be the same for all of us, I think the Self (and... the Higher Self!!!), are unique.
The Self consists of the 'I', but also includes the other 'layers' we package as... 'Soul' (includes what some name Astral, Etheric...).
The Self is unique because of the thinking processes, perceptions, concepts, emotions, level of freedom etc we allow (/ consent, knowingly or unknowingly!) to 'enrich' our 'I'.
And so, each journey towards achieving the Higher Self is unique for each individual.
Of course, intuition whispers that the very end product is the same for all of us...
This might sound depressing for some, yes, but only for those who did not properly consider that... there is only the present moment, nothing else, and so, in truth, we are in this eternal, UNIQUE journey... forever.
Beautifully woven perspective. I will meditate on this near to Koan response. Love it. Thank you for your kind words and thoughtful contribution. Keep it flowing, please!
Beautifully put Ana .... I'll happily take the blame for you finding different word pictures to convey these life enhancing true ideas. We are all artists!
Window analogy is amazing, thank you Jeff for brining it out! Helped me clarify my confusion about the russian doll aspect of concept to idea stacking! When the all that is out of the window, the content of the idea, is shorthanded or metaphorised to be, a window, the idea befomes concept. And concepts are more readily accessible within the given, ideas need to be Looked Through.
Oh wow, and then Angus th book analogy, helped me with my thoughts about philosophy, that a worldview is almost a learnt skill, learning a new relationship between symbols. That is what I mean by digging the root, the riddle, as deep as you can, in different directions. No one root is The Root. (I guess unless we are growing dandelions wnd carrots.. )
Roots Windows and Books.
"Roots Windows and Books" Sounds like a song that will write itself and that you will sing. Thank you for this beautiful realization/distillation. A lovely contribution to the conversation in both of these spaces.
@1:12:00 ish
This part was such a struggle to me, but here is thinking I am thinking about. That philosophy must and should be considered a football match, because only in developing one side well can the other deepen too. The potentialities and scary consequences of an idea are not there as soon as it is had, they are drawn out by careful deliberation or! Of stubborn negation! Of "I don't understand this therefore you must be wrong!" Either I the student and successor don't understand enough, or the philosopher is in the wrong direction. But there's a sense that both are the same gesture and the same affirmation. It is not the point of philosophy to figure it out, but to develop one of the roots of the riddle so thoroughly that the contradictions become clear. If that's true, I probably cannot be a philosopher, it's quite a brave thing to do. It humbles me and humbles the philosophers I regard, that their individual mission is failed but the meta mission succeeds because of their failures. Human striving huh! This includes Steiner too, it is just as much his fault as the fault of modern anthroposophists where we fail or where we misunderstand, but if there is no judgement or emotion in observing this then we can continue without illusion.
Nice reflections Kate. I think you are going to be able to incorporate them into the final video. There are also deep connection with GA 151 going on here.
@@TheExceptionalState oh human and cosmic thought! I would love to refresh my knowledge of it for this week, is there a particular lecture that you could point me to?
@@TheExceptionalState Never mind, Lecture 2!
If the father of feeling is thinking, then I will say the mother of feeling is wisdom.
Me too
or also Kyriotetes who goes by the name of Sophia/Philosophia/Anthroposophia. .
What a conversation! Jeff, I would like to quote you personally in the words from 2.00.02 to 2.00.39 at the end of a talk next Sunday. Am I (I Am) permitted?
Yes you may. I think you should include the next ten seconds as well please.
@@jeffbarney3584 The talk is "Cosmic Cycles and Ethical Individualism" beginning with the "known" life wave of an individual plant. I intend to return to that footing finally with your words on dialog with plants, animals and people, end with "but you can't do it if you're NOT independent as well". What you said Jeff was pure gold, so thank you. Verily, I was led here today.
@@forbearancemp5283 That is lovely and I am honored. Will the talk be recorded. I would love to see it. Wildly intriguing title! Thank you for your gracious comments.
@@jeffbarney3584 I have not noticed other speakers being recorded there. Notes are often taken on material that's provided and I will be providing some material on the day with links, should people want some "homework" It's a dense topic so it might be recorded, I'll let you know, and thank you guys!
@@forbearancemp5283 Any or all of the material would be fantastic. Lets put our money where our selves are and build up a community working on and through this living material as an act of service to all in mutuality.
Through this study, and also studying Schickler, I realised how much my religiospiritual outlook is influenced by Kant's limits. I wonder at a solution to this, because I do believe, and believe belief and faith are useful for the soul, and reject the cynicism that demands certainty in Knowledge over belief. Here is how I might solve it, if I am told God = God, I can believe and collect and work it into my mental picture from an outside imperative. Or, could it he that in Faith, I am doing God = God because I created this in thinking. Is Faith not there whenthe I postulates a, so a can = a? If we determine the Self a littl better, can we help Kant to save religion from skepticism on one side and solipsism on the other. This act of the I postulating. " I am what I am and I can 'cos I can. " i might call that Faith!
I feel like I am playing with Fichtes flaming head, logical tools are tools not toys! :D
@@theseventh7865 Your line of thinking helps me realize just how paper thin the difference is between conventional natural science and exoteric religion in originating principles. It is a a sort of re-original sin against the self/soul aspect of nature. God, gravity, motion, "genetic", chemism even abstract insular telos all explanatory principles extrinsic and exogenous to the "behaving" entity. Seems to me there has to be a reason for faith otherwise it is fake knowledge born from a desperation for certainty; a cognitive default postulate which is a sin by both parties.