Thanks to Manscaped for sponsoring today's video! Get 20% OFF + Free International Shipping with my promo code BUILDING at mnscpd.com/buildingbeautifully. Part 2 is now out! Check it out here: th-cam.com/video/cEFMwzMW_AI/w-d-xo.html Hope you all enjoy this video! I've had a few viewers point out that I somehow missed Mount Kuring-gai and Mount Colah when finding the quietest station on the T1. Basically, Warrawee really isn't the quietest station on the T1, even excluding the Richmond Line...my bad. Sorry about that! Warrawee is still a really quirky station that is relatively quiet compared to the rest of the T1, so I don't think it's an amiss inclusion on this list. In the near future, I'll do a video visiting those stations north of Hornsby to make up for my mistake!
Mount Colah is on the rise, with apartments going up all around recently, and an upgrade under construction. Mount Kuring-gai is possibly one place that has the right to be quiet given the terrain, however the lack of any footpath to the nearby industrial zone isn't ideal, despite many choosing to do that walk. And Asquith has also risen up the ranks recently thanks to development around it - I think Asquith is the main driver for better frequencies of buses and trains in that area, though I am bias as a local.
HI building beautifully just to mention when you did your video on the Richmond line you said how Kurrajong used to have a train Station but the Line Closed down due to a Land Slip and you said that you would do a video of where the old railway line from Richmond to Kurrajong used to go
I doubt that the opal-based stats are accurate at either Cheltenham or Warrawee, because many of the school students don't bother tapping on or off, they get free travel anyway, not much point
Very surprised that Waterfall rates as a "quiet" station. The carpark is always full, the trains starting from here during the morning peak are packed and on the weekends many bushwalkers use it. Yes, there are waterfalls within reasonable walking distance from the station. On a sombre note, I was one of the first RFS responders to the train derailment and it is still very firmly entrenched in my mind.
Same, being a T4 terminal and proximity to Wollongong I'd expect a lot more people, cars are always lined up down the freeway on ramp. Wonder how it compares to somewhere like Loftus, unless the TAFE brings a big number.
I believe that even though the carpark gets busy, the fact the town is so small means very few people actually can walk to the station, and there's no buses to the station. That carpark definitely can't have much more than 100 spots, so 560 visits a day sounds about right to me.
@@BuildingBeautifully Waterfall is a small township with about 500 residents. From either side of the railway line it is an easy walk to the station for most. The majority of residents are elderly and use own transport. The carpark has 190 spaces and eight disabled parking spots. It is full by about 7.30 every morning. Many commuters from south of Waterfall drive to it to catch the train. It is also a transfer station for trains coming from Thirroul and Wollongong. So I guess the low passenger numbers does make sense.
Hi Sharath, thanks for checking out Warrawee station! I’m only one of a few people who can say they use Warrawee station other than Knox students. I was actually only there just yesterday. I pretty much only use the station to see a friend of mine who works there. He also used to work at Cheltenham too. And most of the time the station is exactly how it is portrayed here. The only time when it’s busy is at around 3:30PM when all the Knox Boys leave school. There are about 2-3 trains that need to be flagged because of the amount of people on the platform. If you look from the footbridge during that time, it’s a big sea of navy blue! Warrawee is one of several examples of these infill stations on the North Shore. These include Killara, Waitara, Artarmon, and Wollstonecraft. Except for Artarmon and nowadays Waitara, there’s often not a lot of development happening in these areas. And the reasons why are very similar to Warrawee and Cheltenham. Wollstonecraft was never supposed to be built and instead a cutting between St Leonards and Waverton was going to go straight through when the line was extended in 1893. The residents insisted on a station being built so that’s why there’s that very sharp curve on the line. Nowadays their descendants hate it! Between Turramurra and Pymble which is the longest distance between 2 stations on the line, another station was supposed to be built in around 1943 called Beechworth Road. There was a lot of demand by locals in an area where there weren’t many shops, apartments, nor schools nearby. The Railway Commissioner said it was too premature at the time and it never went ahead. It would’ve been a very interesting station as it would’ve been on a deep cutting. Everyone forgot about its existence until I checked in the local library and found some documentation about the fight to build one there both in 1943 and before then and put it on Wikipedia. I really enjoyed this video, so thanks for making it!
I visited Wollstonecraft on a recent weekend afternoon, there was a decent amount of people getting on and off. Nothing huge, but comparable to something like north Strathfield at that time. I assume they don't like the noise? Seems reasonably used though.
Interesting, I'm a recent resident of Turramurra and now Gordon, and I had no idea that there was supposed to be a Beechworth Road station! I travel along that section often, and it is a noticeably long bit. Would have made for good bushwalk access to the lovely nearby Sheldon Forest. It also would have been the only station between St Leonards and Waitara to be situated on the west side of Pacific Highway, as the line ducks that way just north of Pymble station and just south of Turramurra station, due to the steep slope next to the Pymble Hotel.
Thanks a lot for that insight Matthew, I wish I'd known about Beechworth Road earlier as I might have mentioned it! It doesn't seem like anyone really knows about it since there's nothing about it online, so kudos to you for researching and finding out about that.
@@BuildingBeautifullyCountrylink, too? What's the least used station on the line to Broken Hill? How long can you stand on the road there? 😉 (One time I took the Indian-Pacific, back in the early 1990s, it broke down somewhere in the NSW outback. They announced that people should stay on the train, and of course a lot of people alighted, including me. The sun was rising, emus were running on the horizon, and there was a dirt T-junction, with signs pointing the direction and distance to three towns I'd never heard of, the nearest one 122km away. One of my favourite train moments ever. Three hours later, another locomotive arrived and took us on the rest of our journey to Broken Hill, Cockburn (actual name of the station) and Adelaide. And not a single car passed.)
although it's not very heavily used I do have a soft spot for Waterfall station because of the trails in the Royal National Park that it access to. Coming to Sydney from Brisbane I was really impressed that Sydneysiders can access such great national parks conveniently without needing a car.
Definitely a big downside of Brisbane as someone who's also moved to Sydney from Brisbane (honestly the only downside I can think of). Brisbane is significantly better than Sydney in terms of quality national parks within close geographic proximity, but a car is absolutely mandatory as we all know coming from there. Obviously why so many of us learn to drive in highschool.
Waterfall is not an unused station, even if the stats say otherwise. It is well known from Wollongong locals that many people drive to Waterfall (as an alternative to Sutherland) and catch trains to the city, or suburbs before hand and vice versa. Also as a last “buses replace trains” situation, we often end at Waterfall, and hundreds of people will catch buses to Wollongong station. I think it’s still extremely important, which I suppose you did say, haha. Anyway, I will die on my hill, Waterfall is an integral line for those on the south coast, and I don’t know if your stats take into account the amount of times buses replace trains from this station. It is something to consider, I suppose 😊😊
@@BuildingBeautifully The fact that integral stations that are key community infrastructure count as the lowest usage indicates to me that our current usage threshold for building a station is too high. In the video, you noted the lack of cars going along a road as an indicator of low density. Nonetheless, the road is there. Should we close it? I'm a big fan of you and your channel, I'm glad you're geeking out on this stuff and I love your perspective. But we don't have to be satisfied with roughly the level of investment in public infrastructure that we have, while billions go into tollroads. Things could be really different if we want them to be.
Used to go to Knox, yeah warrawee is as busy as the city train stations after/before school but has like a single old lady and 2 rabbits on the entire weekend. It's basically a private station for the school.
I'm actually quite an avid Waterfall Station user. When I commuted Town Hall from Wollongong I would drive to Waterfall and use the train the rest of the way. That allowed me to skip the part where the train slowly climbs up the escarpment.
I often take my family on "suburban bushwalks". A nice one is from Thornleigh to Hornsby along the "great northern walk". It takes around ~5 hours to walk, and then ~5 minutes to return by train 🙂
To the west of Waterfall station is Lake Toolooma. The lake is actually a rail dam that was built to supply water for steam trains. Water was pumped, using a steam engine, up to the rail line. Waterfall was an important stop back in the day. The walk down to the lake is very enjoyable and worth the effort. I have done several bushwalks that involved catching the train to or from Waterfall station. The Royal is a good place for a walk but I actually prefer Heathcote NP as it is much quieter and has a far more remote feel. Keep up the good work with your videos. Cheers.
Worth noting that quiet stations are much easier to fare evade, meaning these numbers wouldn’t include locals using them to travel just a couple of stations
a scary fact about the 2003 waterfall train accident is that my father and his whole family where suppost to on that train, luckly they missed their train but if they haddent, who knows i might not of been here writing this comment. love your videos buddy keep up the good work!
I wouldn't be surprised if the patronage numbers for Cheltenham and Warrawee are much higher than the Opal count. Students are notoriously bad at 'forgetting' to tap on and off if both stations don't have barriers. Waterfall might be a little higher for those people transferring from a terminating service to a Port Kembla service rather than catching an express from Sutherland but I don't think it would be that big a bump, at least compared to the other 2 stations.
"of a station existing for a select special few" this reminds me of how the Metro-North Railroad in New York has small stations with limited service dedicated to hikers! Which is pretty cool when you can take transit to go hiking! So it's not just for the few who wanna go hiking, but also for the special views! These are Manitou and Breakneck Ridge on the gorgeous Hudson Line (one of the most beautiful stretches of railway in the US), and Appalachian Trail on the Harlem Line. With Appalachian Trail station being significant as it's the only rail station directly located on the whole Appalachian Trail! Breakneck Ridge serves its namesake, same for the Appalachian Trail, and Manitou serves Bear Mountain and Anthony's Nose. And Warrawee's story reminds of how there's a suburb outside Chicago called...Golf. Yup, just Golf! Basically, Albert Earling was the president of the Chicago, Milwaukee and St. Paul Railroad company in the early 1900s, so of course, he had his own private railcars! Earling was a member at Glen View Club and would hitch his private car to the back of northbound trains, unhitching at a special siding station the railroad company had created for these trips. He told colleagues he was "going to golf", and before long, people called it the "golf stop" and thus its name simply became Golf.
I know you didn't mention the T7 because of course it's short, but it's still cool that the service exists! For those who don't know: The line opened in 1911 and was originally built as the Abattoirs Branch line to serve the State Brickworks, abbatoirs, and associated sale yards located in the area that is now Sydney Olympic Park. The line closed in stages in 1984 and 1995 when these facilities moved out of the area. After the last passenger service on the line was withdrawn in 1995, the line was rebuilt and realigned in places to serve the new stadiums and sports grounds that were being built for the 2000 Summer Olympics. On the Long Island Rail Road in New York, one of the most interesting stations is Pinelawn! The station opened in the 1890s. In 1902, William H. Locke Jr. had the vision to create a beautiful memorial park on Long Island for those in the city, who were offered the ease of the LIRR to bring their loved ones for funeral arrangements. In its first years of service, Pinelawn Memorial Park provided overnight accommodations for families who were burying their loved ones within the vast, peaceful, green land. Long Island National Cemetery was eventually created there in the 1930s after the US gov purchased land from Pinelawn Cemetery to house more WWI veterans as Cypress Hills Cemetery in Brooklyn didn't have enough space.
Waterfall station is great for anyone interested in exploring the Royal National Park without a car - countless times I took my bike and started rides on the trails and roads from the station.
Cheltenham is the perfect place if you want a quiet life, it's beautiful. A lot of homes with character and well built too. and they have large blocks of land. But for most it's far too expensive and isn't possible.
One thing to note about Waterfall Station. The size of the car park relative to the size of the suburb is pretty big, I think it's safe to assume most of those cars are people that live in Helensburgh and drive to Waterfall because of more frequent trains plus it's easier to get a park.
@@BuildingBeautifully This is a good point. Frequency drives usage, but in Sydney transport planning we've always insisted in seeing the usage figures before providing frequency. We've put the cart before the horse. Um. The passenger. The passenger before the cart. That's it.
I live up the road from Telopea station and I can safely say that the railway station no longer exists; it's pretty much been rebuilt as a light rail stop
One of the things that I love about railways is that underutilised stations don't significantly detract from their efficiency yet do provide the significant benefits of rail transport to the people who use them. Sure, there may be stations that aren't surrounded by shops and tower blocks but it's not like the train has to go out of its way to get to them, the railway line is already there.
Its crazy how similar this is to places in melbourne. Warrawee is basically heyington, with the difference heyington literally borders the school. Waterfall could be Upper Ferntree Gully with the whole suburb on the other side of the main highway and the start and end for a lot hikes and bike rides up the dandenong ranges Cheltnehem could be Chatham or Willison, just plonked into the nimbys backyard
when i was in high school, (normo boys) lots of guys i knew used warrawee, and i dated a few girls that used that station, from hornsby girls and barker. I would have thought the quietest station was vineyard.
warrawee is my home station and ive used it for decades now.. i can say from years of observation that the opal numbers are pretty much just non-students. school kids taking a train 2 or 3 stops rarely tap on or off
Lost Sydney Idea: You should do a video on the history and failure of the Eastwood County Road. It was a major road that was planned through Ryde but never ended up being built, however great chucks of the land still remain empty and the outline of the road can be seen on a satellite imagery.
The same also happened in South Turramurra, for an intended future extension of the then F3 motorway. This accidentally preserved a long stretch of bushland that was then developed right before the whole Northconnex saga began, thus massively jacking up the price of what would have otherwise been a cut-and-cover project.
I think Sharath has done a video on the Eastwood County Road. The reservation is still intact, from Epping Rd to Silverwater and Kissing Point Rds, and since no government after 70 years has chosen to abandon it, I think you could assume that it is still considered to be an option for future transport infrastructure. It was recently proposed as a corridor for a Light Rail line from Parramatta to Macquarie Park via Eastwood by an independent feasibility study commissioned by Parramatta City Council, which was completely ignored by TfNSW, which instead favoured the current route now under construction to Carlingford, with next to no chance of it being extended to Epping, let alone Macquarie Park. The County Road corridor could still be used for a LR line on a more direct route from Parramatta to Macquarie Park via Eastwood by branching from the line now under construction at Church St , North Parramatta, instead of the original intention to branch from the Carlingford Line at Dundas. It could be an integral part of an upgraded road and public transport corridor between Parramatta and Macquarie Park, where existing transport links are too indirect.
It's great having public transport serve lower density areas. Everyone benefits from a decrease in car dependency and congestion. Wish these areas had even a few shops though.
Problem is that it's hard to have trains serving all low-density areas. So you have areas like Cheltenham that have a train station, yes, but then many suburbs nearby like West Pennant Hills, Westleigh, North Rocks, Marsfield, that don't have trains. A low-density city where every suburb has a train station would be very costly. Not completely unfeasible, but certainly just building more density around the stations would be easier.
I would imagine that Casula and Yennora are in the running for quietest station on the t2/t5 lines. Leightonfield is probably one of the quietest on the t3 line too.
Whats with the razor ad. Is TH-cam that bad now? Maybe you need to see Mt Kuring Gai station where there's absolutely nothing around it (isolated surrounded by bush) and very few trains ever stop there as Sydney's most quiet. Lucky to have a few hundred visits per day. Leave your money of the fridge for the free video idea.
Apart from peak hour (because I'm not sure of the stats for that), half as many trains stop at the stations from Hornsby to Berowra as stop as Warrawee. I'd not be surprised if there were as many passengers use it as Warrawee, even not counting the Knox xtudents.
Waterfall is an enigma to me because whenever I'd get the train to go into the city with mum, Waterfall was always the last stop. One day I just kinda want to get on a train and go all the way there for a round trip to scratch the itch of the childhood mystery that is Waterfall. Wolli Creek too. I always remember those names.
That's how I feel about so much of the T4. I lived in Mortdale for 4 years as a teenager but never ventured further south excluding being driven down the Princes Highway headed out of Sydney as a whole, and I never paid too much attention to the places around me. But I remembered the names. I've always lived in the inner west otherwise, and as an adult I am so intrigued by many places along the T4 because I heard these names every day on the train yet knew nothing about them. It helps that south Sydney feels so disconnected to the rest of Sydney I suppose.
I grew up in Waterfall, it is a beautiful little town with a strong railway heritage, it's where I began my love for trains from. In terms of guessing the next ones, after a bit of thinking, I might've deciphered it: T2: Yennora, T3: Leightonfield, T8: this is the tricky one that has sorted stumped me, my best guesses are Turrella or perhaps Bardwell Park or Narwee, my only other thoughts further down the line are Macquarie Fields or Leumeah.
You may find that on the T2 that it's Casula is the quietest station. As you have only the Powerhouse Theater on one side and that quite large open paddock on the other side also the shops are about 1 kilometer away from the station, which makes it very isolated after dark and that's all.
Interesting that Cheltenham received a station upgrade and lift access in 2015 with so few visitors. Thornleigh and Normanhurst, on the same line, only just had their station upgrades completed in 2023.
It's one of the richest areas in Sydney, most millionaires per acre I believe. Dom Perrottet lives in the area for example. I lived just across the M2 from there and went to school in Beecroft, it's crazy how nice the area is.
They were basically required to do it when they rebuilt the station to put the new freight line through - Cheltenham used to be wheelchair accessible because both platforms were on street level but when they built the new line they took that away
I traveled from Cheltenham station to the city for 10 years up until 2008 it is a very nice station I glad the have lifts now and you forgot the best attaction of Cheltenham .Cheltenham Oval just to let you know bower birds nest in the bush near station
0:30 does anyone know what package the GUI displaying the numpy array came from? It would be so helpful if I had a better way of looking at a numpy array than printing it.
Full video report coming up: First off, I found "If you want me to do it in numerical order, too bad" rather amusing. Good thing I wasn't really thinking about wanting them to be in that order. I was surprised at first that Cheltenham was quieter than Denistone. But after the explanation I can see why. They're probably about the same. Oh wait, it is Denistone as said a while after where I was up to in the video at the time. (I'm writing this comment while I watch the video) How did you miss that Sharath? Great sponsor by the way. It's one of the few that I would watch instead of skipping it because I just don't care. For the T1 I can definitely see how it's Warrawee after the explanation. Just like another Denistone. And I love the stand in the middle of the road test. But if this included the Richmond line for those wondering, I believe the quietest station is Clarendon. Very cool to catch the train to Waterfall from North Sydney. I wasn't expecting Waterfall to be the quietest station on the T4. Probably because it's the terminus for the T4. But I guess it is right on the edge of Sydney and if it only has a population of 522, it makes sense. And then there's this line. "Most of the town is on the west of the highway while the station and railway is on the east of the railway." I was expecting that the station and railway would be in the same place as the station and railway. And I was half expecting a mention of the two crashes that happened at Waterfall. Very nice video. I can't wait for the next one! And also, here are some predictions for what the stations in the next video will be: Casula, Leightonfield, and I'm not sure for the T8 so I'll guess Panania.
can you please do a video on the origional warringah freeway network that got cancelled. there is a reserve of land going throug belrose where i live that i have been told was going to be a freeway going to south creek at dee why but i can't find any maps
As someone who lived in the Cheltenham almost all their life its worth noting that not only are there no shops around the station, there are no shops at all in the entire suburb. The only business is the cafe at the bowls club and thats only existed for about 5 years.
@@TrainzForNSWVlogsMay as well do the whole of the Main North Line as well as the Hunter while he is up this way. I am sure Sharath would love the history of the Ardglen tunnel and Werris Creek station building. He could also cover the about to reopen West Tamworth to Westdale freight line.
The YIMBY perspective as expressed is weirdly reductive. I have a lot of sympathy with some of these ideas. Building more good public infrastructure is important, and giving more access to it by creating more high and medium density mixed use around it is great. But why not both? Does all quirkiness have to go? Do we always have to squeeze every dollar, as if public infrastructure has a set budget that can't ever change, so our only choice is to optimise rather than addressing privatisation and wealth concentration directly? Look: In 1900 when these stations were built, the population of Sydney was under half a million. Nonetheless, our forebears were prepared to make the investment. Now the metro population is 10x that. A million visits a year is easily enough to justify the building of a train station. They're literally a few sheds and platforms, a couple of sets of stairs and these days two elevators. Treating them like precious rare things that should not be allowed unless they also directly serve a high density cluster is captured thinking. There are roads for private cars *everywhere*, most lined on both sides with free car storage. The problem is not that these stations have 1% of the traffic of Town Hall and are unaccountably allowed to remain open. The problem is that the Town Hall station platforms have been basically unchanged since 1932 and are dangerously overcrowded, because we've stopped demanding that governments build things other than motorways. I have never been to Cheltenham, but having seen it on the channel I'm now planning to hop on a train there and take a 10 minute stroll to Ahimsa Sanctuary, 3.5 acres of original bushland open to the public in care of the National Trust and featuring the home built that Mary Byles built by hand and the Hut of Happy Omen. Maybe I'll take a trek up the walking trail, through the lungs of Sydney to City View Rock to enjoy an eco-utopian moment in the liminal space of tree canopy and skyscraper. So come on. What's wrong with a rail line having a bit of charm? You *almost* admitted you appreciated it, but ideology came charging back. What's the actual problem? The line has to go through that area anyway, it's between Epping and Beecroft. As you mention there are no shops but over 1,000 kids go to the public school there. Does every suburb have to be either a car-dependent food desert or a bustling hypermetropolitan cyberpunk free trade zone? We should of course be improving urban design by making more major stations surrounded by high and medium density mixed use zones. But this should be additive, not zero sum. More public transit is better for everyone. More mixed use, more creative re-use, higher densities - all great. I moved into a suburb that's bustling and slated for the highest population increase in the State because I'm up for that. But we don't have to have a single vision for the whole city.
Amen, you have said all I wish I could say in words far more eloquent than mine. Diversity is key, and I'll bet those moving to Cheltenham are doing so precisely because it has beautiful homes and the peace of mind that comes from not living in a human hive. It costs a packet to live there, so why not let those who are fortunate enough to have their amenity? And the station is hardly a burden to anyone. And I couldn't stomach any more of the video once he trotted out 'yimby'.This was a delightful channel when he started, uncovering lost Sydney treasures and the long forgotten history of things, but now he is an ideologue essentially shilling for property developers. He needs to remember it is "yes in my backyard", not "yes in everyone's backyard"!! Unsubscribed, don't believe he is promoting 'building beautifully' at all.
You can take the monthly tap on/off data and use the attendance data from Google to work out the hours and days of the week when they're busiest and an estimate of how many people would have been there.
Most of those stations have got quite a few medium density housing in the station vicinity, so that could contribute to the ridership, but Berowra is emptyy. Maybe there's enough hikers going to berowra creek n ku ring ai national parks
From my experience with Berowra, I’ve always seen more people get off there than Mt Kuring-Gai, there’s also hikers and Central Coast trains stop there so it’s so much more convenient than Mt K. If you’re travelling to Strathfield off peak for example, going from Mt K adds about 30mins to your journey compared with Berowra. That probably motivates people to do a short drive to Berowra (same for anyone going to Central Coast)
When I was working for Sydney Trains I did a lot of shifts at Warrawee and the lack of any shops was annoying. Couldn't even get that early morning coffee - ziltch! The next stop towards Hornsby Wahroonga station is the total opposite with great cafes, restaurants, shops, etc. Now Denistone is another story... not a shop to be seen anywhere and whilst I was working there, I jokingly asked a customer on the platform where are all the shops? - her response was... "We don't want no shops here, it's peaceful here without them". If you had one of those mobile coffee vans I reckon you could make some good money by parking in the small carpark next to the station say from 6.00am to 8.00am to service all those heading to work with some caffeinated beverages & donuts 😁
Guess we must have had the same idea at the same time because I was thinking about building a website doing the same exact things using the same dataset a month ago! University exams have put that on the back burner for now though
I lot of posts have mentioned Holsworthy. I would’ve thought with a carpark and a fair bit of medium density housing built around it that it would it quite busy. I know the traffic around peak hour can be a challenge.
A lot of people have said Holsworthy, but funnily enough, from a quick count there's at least TEN stations on the T8 that are quieter than Holsworthy haha.
The very rare occasion when you can travel from North Sydney to Waterfall (and vice versa). Happened as recently as Saturday the 11th of November and Sunday 12 November. This was due to track works on the T4 line in the city tunnels. When the T2 lines is out of service too, then the St Peters and Erskineville Stations enter the T4 lines..... I've lived in Sydney my how life, and haven't ventured out to some of the stations and suburbs featured on this page. It's like a "Sydney Weekender" meets "Getaway", and makes me want to visit these places :)
Thanks for the doco- very interesting. True story, some years ago (within the last decade) I was on a train on the Northern Line towards Hornsby and as we were approaching Denistone, the guard announced "Quietest station on the network, no-one gets on and no-one gets off!'
Really enjoyed the video, thank you. Sharath I was just about to call an uber to drive down that street in Warrawee. I thought you might be standing there for a week.
Thank you, Sharath; this was so much fun to watch. When you mentioned accidents at Waterfall, I didn't remember the first, but the second one brought back memories of the news broadcasts. It was nice of you to offer your condolences to the families, as well. Would you perhaps do a collab with Phil from Sydney Trains Vlogs one day? I would definitely watch that.
Just found your channel. Some really cool stuff. If you're looking for other ideas, consider Epping. Specifically, the Essex St/Epping Rd intersection. As far as I'm aware, it's the ONLY westbound exit from east side of Epping station since the right-turn from Langston place onto Bridge St closed several years ago. It's an absolute clusterfuck, especially around drop-off/pick-up times of the nearby Epping Public School. One ways street and almost complete gridlock. There's been massive property development in the last few years, and it continues today with a mega apartment complex being constructed on Cambridge St. If that's not enough, all North Epping traffic goes though the Eastern side of Epping as well, making it even more hectic.
Waterfall gets a lot of peak hour patronage, mostly people who live south of there driving up and catching the more frequent Sydney trains service. Go during the week, and the entire town is full of cars parked for the day waiting for their owners to get the train back and drive home.
Fascinating. I live in Rouse Hill and am on the Metro everyday, and as it happens, I tend to frequent Warrawee and Cheltenham stations up to 6 times a week for work.
Hey mate, great video as always. You mentioned that you’re “not that good at coding”. I’m a software engineer as well as a massive urbanist, so if you want to recruit someone with programming skills I’d definitely be keen to see if I can offer some assistance :) Keep up the good work!
Warrawee's "overpass constructed in 1977"? I caught the train from Warrawee to and from school (not Knox!) every day for 10 years from 1973 onwards. The overpass was already there in 1973.
"Cheltenham has 1297 people per day"...but that approximates a complete trainload. What are your suggestions to overcome these low usage stations? Waterfall would be a huge loss to the total network given the Illawarra line starts / terminates there. Would you prefer to see the boffins close it down and use it as a marshalling yard, terminating the T4 at Sutherland
Do you live in Sydney? If so, that's bloody shocking. There's a stereotype sydneysiders barely know what is outside their own suburb that makes most of us other Aussies judge you and it sounds like you may be the stereotype 😂
Thanks to Manscaped for sponsoring today's video! Get 20% OFF + Free International Shipping with my promo code BUILDING at mnscpd.com/buildingbeautifully.
Part 2 is now out! Check it out here: th-cam.com/video/cEFMwzMW_AI/w-d-xo.html
Hope you all enjoy this video! I've had a few viewers point out that I somehow missed Mount Kuring-gai and Mount Colah when finding the quietest station on the T1. Basically, Warrawee really isn't the quietest station on the T1, even excluding the Richmond Line...my bad. Sorry about that! Warrawee is still a really quirky station that is relatively quiet compared to the rest of the T1, so I don't think it's an amiss inclusion on this list. In the near future, I'll do a video visiting those stations north of Hornsby to make up for my mistake!
Congrats on the sponsorship Sharath!
Mount Colah is on the rise, with apartments going up all around recently, and an upgrade under construction. Mount Kuring-gai is possibly one place that has the right to be quiet given the terrain, however the lack of any footpath to the nearby industrial zone isn't ideal, despite many choosing to do that walk. And Asquith has also risen up the ranks recently thanks to development around it - I think Asquith is the main driver for better frequencies of buses and trains in that area, though I am bias as a local.
HI building beautifully just to mention when you did your video on the Richmond line you said how Kurrajong used to have a train Station but the Line Closed down due to a Land Slip and you said that you would do a video of where the old railway line from Richmond to Kurrajong used to go
Quite an interesting company to sponsor I must say 🤨
ok
For those who don't know, the Maccas in 12:23 is Engadine Maccas, infamously rumoured to be the place where Scott Morrison soiled himself as an adult.
haha yes
PM stands for Pooped at Mcdonalds
You learn something new everyday lol
The sacred lands, I feel blessed to go past it almost every day lol
💩
Big thanks to Lawrence Mooney for bringing us that amazing story ;)
I doubt that the opal-based stats are accurate at either Cheltenham or Warrawee, because many of the school students don't bother tapping on or off, they get free travel anyway, not much point
Very surprised that Waterfall rates as a "quiet" station. The carpark is always full, the trains starting from here during the morning peak are packed and on the weekends many bushwalkers use it. Yes, there are waterfalls within reasonable walking distance from the station. On a sombre note, I was one of the first RFS responders to the train derailment and it is still very firmly entrenched in my mind.
Same, being a T4 terminal and proximity to Wollongong I'd expect a lot more people, cars are always lined up down the freeway on ramp. Wonder how it compares to somewhere like Loftus, unless the TAFE brings a big number.
Correct
I believe that even though the carpark gets busy, the fact the town is so small means very few people actually can walk to the station, and there's no buses to the station. That carpark definitely can't have much more than 100 spots, so 560 visits a day sounds about right to me.
@@BuildingBeautifully Waterfall is a small township with about 500 residents. From either side of the railway line it is an easy walk to the station for most. The majority of residents are elderly and use own transport. The carpark has 190 spaces and eight disabled parking spots. It is full by about 7.30 every morning. Many commuters from south of Waterfall drive to it to catch the train. It is also a transfer station for trains coming from Thirroul and Wollongong. So I guess the low passenger numbers does make sense.
@@BuildingBeautifullymost people there drive up from the southern stations like Helensburgh and Stanwell park
Hi Sharath, thanks for checking out Warrawee station!
I’m only one of a few people who can say they use Warrawee station other than Knox students. I was actually only there just yesterday. I pretty much only use the station to see a friend of mine who works there. He also used to work at Cheltenham too. And most of the time the station is exactly how it is portrayed here. The only time when it’s busy is at around 3:30PM when all the Knox Boys leave school. There are about 2-3 trains that need to be flagged because of the amount of people on the platform. If you look from the footbridge during that time, it’s a big sea of navy blue!
Warrawee is one of several examples of these infill stations on the North Shore. These include Killara, Waitara, Artarmon, and Wollstonecraft. Except for Artarmon and nowadays Waitara, there’s often not a lot of development happening in these areas. And the reasons why are very similar to Warrawee and Cheltenham.
Wollstonecraft was never supposed to be built and instead a cutting between St Leonards and Waverton was going to go straight through when the line was extended in 1893. The residents insisted on a station being built so that’s why there’s that very sharp curve on the line. Nowadays their descendants hate it!
Between Turramurra and Pymble which is the longest distance between 2 stations on the line, another station was supposed to be built in around 1943 called Beechworth Road. There was a lot of demand by locals in an area where there weren’t many shops, apartments, nor schools nearby. The Railway Commissioner said it was too premature at the time and it never went ahead. It would’ve been a very interesting station as it would’ve been on a deep cutting. Everyone forgot about its existence until I checked in the local library and found some documentation about the fight to build one there both in 1943 and before then and put it on Wikipedia.
I really enjoyed this video, so thanks for making it!
I assumed the curve at Wollstonecraft was to negotiate the steep grade between Waverton and St Leonards
I visited Wollstonecraft on a recent weekend afternoon, there was a decent amount of people getting on and off. Nothing huge, but comparable to something like north Strathfield at that time. I assume they don't like the noise? Seems reasonably used though.
Interesting, I'm a recent resident of Turramurra and now Gordon, and I had no idea that there was supposed to be a Beechworth Road station! I travel along that section often, and it is a noticeably long bit. Would have made for good bushwalk access to the lovely nearby Sheldon Forest. It also would have been the only station between St Leonards and Waitara to be situated on the west side of Pacific Highway, as the line ducks that way just north of Pymble station and just south of Turramurra station, due to the steep slope next to the Pymble Hotel.
Thanks a lot for that insight Matthew, I wish I'd known about Beechworth Road earlier as I might have mentioned it! It doesn't seem like anyone really knows about it since there's nothing about it online, so kudos to you for researching and finding out about that.
oh nice
Id love to see this with the intercity lines, that would be fun!
It's on the list for sure. The Hunter Line has been long-requested
@@BuildingBeautifullyCountrylink, too? What's the least used station on the line to Broken Hill? How long can you stand on the road there? 😉
(One time I took the Indian-Pacific, back in the early 1990s, it broke down somewhere in the NSW outback. They announced that people should stay on the train, and of course a lot of people alighted, including me. The sun was rising, emus were running on the horizon, and there was a dirt T-junction, with signs pointing the direction and distance to three towns I'd never heard of, the nearest one 122km away. One of my favourite train moments ever. Three hours later, another locomotive arrived and took us on the rest of our journey to Broken Hill, Cockburn (actual name of the station) and Adelaide. And not a single car passed.)
although it's not very heavily used I do have a soft spot for Waterfall station because of the trails in the Royal National Park that it access to. Coming to Sydney from Brisbane I was really impressed that Sydneysiders can access such great national parks conveniently without needing a car.
Definitely a big downside of Brisbane as someone who's also moved to Sydney from Brisbane (honestly the only downside I can think of). Brisbane is significantly better than Sydney in terms of quality national parks within close geographic proximity, but a car is absolutely mandatory as we all know coming from there. Obviously why so many of us learn to drive in highschool.
This channel has turned me into a train geek.
same!
Welcome to the brethren of train geeks
😍😍
Man’s utilising that ENGG1811 knowledge
Waterfall is not an unused station, even if the stats say otherwise. It is well known from Wollongong locals that many people drive to Waterfall (as an alternative to Sutherland) and catch trains to the city, or suburbs before hand and vice versa. Also as a last “buses replace trains” situation, we often end at Waterfall, and hundreds of people will catch buses to Wollongong station. I think it’s still extremely important, which I suppose you did say, haha. Anyway, I will die on my hill, Waterfall is an integral line for those on the south coast, and I don’t know if your stats take into account the amount of times buses replace trains from this station. It is something to consider, I suppose 😊😊
Personally i drive to heathcote station from Illawarra, cuts of a little bit more time and easier to park + maccas
Oh no doubt it's an integral station. Won't deny that! But hey, the stats don't lie. It's definitely the quietest on the T4.
Touche 😉@@BuildingBeautifullyhey, regardless, great video, I really love your content.
@@BuildingBeautifully The fact that integral stations that are key community infrastructure count as the lowest usage indicates to me that our current usage threshold for building a station is too high. In the video, you noted the lack of cars going along a road as an indicator of low density. Nonetheless, the road is there. Should we close it?
I'm a big fan of you and your channel, I'm glad you're geeking out on this stuff and I love your perspective. But we don't have to be satisfied with roughly the level of investment in public infrastructure that we have, while billions go into tollroads. Things could be really different if we want them to be.
As someone who used live in the Northern, Warawee station is used mainly for Knox student (A private school). It's mostly busy during school hours.
That's... what he said... in the video?
Correct
Used to go to Knox, yeah warrawee is as busy as the city train stations after/before school but has like a single old lady and 2 rabbits on the entire weekend. It's basically a private station for the school.
@@diggitydingdongI thought he hypothesised it… this comment confirms it.
@@theglarvskinator4744I've seen plenty of people take dogs on the train, and I love it when they do. Never rabbits, though.
I'm actually quite an avid Waterfall Station user. When I commuted Town Hall from Wollongong I would drive to Waterfall and use the train the rest of the way. That allowed me to skip the part where the train slowly climbs up the escarpment.
Seems that a lot of people do that!
Same here😅 thx to the good people of Waterfall who walk to the station and us plebs fill the parking lot
Yep that's a clever move. Seems everyone else drives to Sutherland and creates a massive parking headache :)
Ah, Yes. Engadine Maccas, where Scomo shat himself.
It's a pity that such a fine dining establishment should be associated with such scum
To be fair Warawee and Cheltenham are both largely high school stations and if you ever catch the train there at the right time prepare to be flooded
I often take my family on "suburban bushwalks". A nice one is from Thornleigh to Hornsby along the "great northern walk". It takes around ~5 hours to walk, and then ~5 minutes to return by train 🙂
Like at Warrawee, I suspect much of the patronage at Cheltenham is school students commuting from nearby suburbs.
To the west of Waterfall station is Lake Toolooma. The lake is actually a rail dam that was built to supply water for steam trains. Water was pumped, using a steam engine, up to the rail line. Waterfall was an important stop back in the day. The walk down to the lake is very enjoyable and worth the effort.
I have done several bushwalks that involved catching the train to or from Waterfall station. The Royal is a good place for a walk but I actually prefer Heathcote NP as it is much quieter and has a far more remote feel.
Keep up the good work with your videos. Cheers.
Worth noting that quiet stations are much easier to fare evade, meaning these numbers wouldn’t include locals using them to travel just a couple of stations
a scary fact about the 2003 waterfall train accident is that my father and his whole family where suppost to on that train, luckly they missed their train but if they haddent, who knows i might not of been here writing this comment. love your videos buddy keep up the good work!
I wouldn't be surprised if the patronage numbers for Cheltenham and Warrawee are much higher than the Opal count. Students are notoriously bad at 'forgetting' to tap on and off if both stations don't have barriers. Waterfall might be a little higher for those people transferring from a terminating service to a Port Kembla service rather than catching an express from Sutherland but I don't think it would be that big a bump, at least compared to the other 2 stations.
"of a station existing for a select special few" this reminds me of how the Metro-North Railroad in New York has small stations with limited service dedicated to hikers! Which is pretty cool when you can take transit to go hiking! So it's not just for the few who wanna go hiking, but also for the special views! These are Manitou and Breakneck Ridge on the gorgeous Hudson Line (one of the most beautiful stretches of railway in the US), and Appalachian Trail on the Harlem Line. With Appalachian Trail station being significant as it's the only rail station directly located on the whole Appalachian Trail! Breakneck Ridge serves its namesake, same for the Appalachian Trail, and Manitou serves Bear Mountain and Anthony's Nose.
And Warrawee's story reminds of how there's a suburb outside Chicago called...Golf. Yup, just Golf! Basically, Albert Earling was the president of the Chicago, Milwaukee and St. Paul Railroad company in the early 1900s, so of course, he had his own private railcars! Earling was a member at Glen View Club and would hitch his private car to the back of northbound trains, unhitching at a special siding station the railroad company had created for these trips. He told colleagues he was "going to golf", and before long, people called it the "golf stop" and thus its name simply became Golf.
12:24 haha mr shat himself
I know you didn't mention the T7 because of course it's short, but it's still cool that the service exists! For those who don't know: The line opened in 1911 and was originally built as the Abattoirs Branch line to serve the State Brickworks, abbatoirs, and associated sale yards located in the area that is now Sydney Olympic Park. The line closed in stages in 1984 and 1995 when these facilities moved out of the area. After the last passenger service on the line was withdrawn in 1995, the line was rebuilt and realigned in places to serve the new stadiums and sports grounds that were being built for the 2000 Summer Olympics.
On the Long Island Rail Road in New York, one of the most interesting stations is Pinelawn! The station opened in the 1890s. In 1902, William H. Locke Jr. had the vision to create a beautiful memorial park on Long Island for those in the city, who were offered the ease of the LIRR to bring their loved ones for funeral arrangements. In its first years of service, Pinelawn Memorial Park provided overnight accommodations for families who were burying their loved ones within the vast, peaceful, green land. Long Island National Cemetery was eventually created there in the 1930s after the US gov purchased land from Pinelawn Cemetery to house more WWI veterans as Cypress Hills Cemetery in Brooklyn didn't have enough space.
Best day when Sharath posts
Waterfall station is great for anyone interested in exploring the Royal National Park without a car - countless times I took my bike and started rides on the trails and roads from the station.
Cheltenham is the perfect place if you want a quiet life, it's beautiful. A lot of homes with character and well built too. and they have large blocks of land.
But for most it's far too expensive and isn't possible.
You're getting good at this! Keep it up
Thank you!
One thing to note about Waterfall Station. The size of the car park relative to the size of the suburb is pretty big, I think it's safe to assume most of those cars are people that live in Helensburgh and drive to Waterfall because of more frequent trains plus it's easier to get a park.
Plus, more likely to get a seat. Since the train is nearly standing room only in peak at that stage.
For sure yes. They really gotta increase the frequency of SCO services.
@@BuildingBeautifully This is a good point. Frequency drives usage, but in Sydney transport planning we've always insisted in seeing the usage figures before providing frequency. We've put the cart before the horse. Um. The passenger. The passenger before the cart. That's it.
The trophy for least busy station in Sydney is a 6 way tie between Rosehill, Camellia, Rydalmere, Dundas, Telopea and Carlingford stations
Those stations are no longer in use and are being converted to the Parramatta Light Rail.
I live up the road from Telopea station and I can safely say that the railway station no longer exists; it's pretty much been rebuilt as a light rail stop
Except that the stations no longer exist and have been snapped up by the new light rail…
Why are these open? Because the people who get off at the busy stations have to have got on somewhere.
One of the things that I love about railways is that underutilised stations don't significantly detract from their efficiency yet do provide the significant benefits of rail transport to the people who use them. Sure, there may be stations that aren't surrounded by shops and tower blocks but it's not like the train has to go out of its way to get to them, the railway line is already there.
Its crazy how similar this is to places in melbourne.
Warrawee is basically heyington, with the difference heyington literally borders the school.
Waterfall could be Upper Ferntree Gully with the whole suburb on the other side of the main highway and the start and end for a lot hikes and bike rides up the dandenong ranges
Cheltnehem could be Chatham or Willison, just plonked into the nimbys backyard
when i was in high school, (normo boys) lots of guys i knew used warrawee, and i dated a few girls that used that station, from hornsby girls and barker. I would have thought the quietest station was vineyard.
I think your wrong the pink flamingos, aka cheltenham girls crowd the platforms all the time, i think they just don't tap on that much
warrawee is my home station and ive used it for decades now.. i can say from years of observation that the opal numbers are pretty much just non-students. school kids taking a train 2 or 3 stops rarely tap on or off
For sure, I think if they actually tapped on the stats would look a lot different
Lost Sydney Idea: You should do a video on the history and failure of the Eastwood County Road. It was a major road that was planned through Ryde but never ended up being built, however great chucks of the land still remain empty and the outline of the road can be seen on a satellite imagery.
The same also happened in South Turramurra, for an intended future extension of the then F3 motorway. This accidentally preserved a long stretch of bushland that was then developed right before the whole Northconnex saga began, thus massively jacking up the price of what would have otherwise been a cut-and-cover project.
I think Sharath has done a video on the Eastwood County Road. The reservation is still intact, from Epping Rd to Silverwater and Kissing Point Rds, and since no government after 70 years has chosen to abandon it, I think you could assume that it is still considered to be an option for future transport infrastructure.
It was recently proposed as a corridor for a Light Rail line from Parramatta to Macquarie Park via Eastwood by an independent feasibility study commissioned by Parramatta City Council, which was completely ignored by TfNSW, which instead favoured the current route now under construction to Carlingford, with next to no chance of it being extended to Epping, let alone Macquarie Park.
The County Road corridor could still be used for a LR line on a more direct route from Parramatta to Macquarie Park via Eastwood by branching from the line now under construction at Church St , North Parramatta, instead of the original intention to branch from the Carlingford Line at Dundas. It could be an integral part of an upgraded road and public transport corridor between Parramatta and Macquarie Park, where existing transport links are too indirect.
They kept delaying its construction because "environmental studies are needed before we can do anything". A convenient excuse to simply do nothing!
Waterfall allows people to visit the National Park without a car.
My day is complete with a new Building Beautifully video 😎
Haha. Was going to say, Denistone is the real answer! It was my station 50 years ago and I knew it was still quiet. 😂
It's great having public transport serve lower density areas. Everyone benefits from a decrease in car dependency and congestion. Wish these areas had even a few shops though.
Problem is that it's hard to have trains serving all low-density areas. So you have areas like Cheltenham that have a train station, yes, but then many suburbs nearby like West Pennant Hills, Westleigh, North Rocks, Marsfield, that don't have trains.
A low-density city where every suburb has a train station would be very costly. Not completely unfeasible, but certainly just building more density around the stations would be easier.
I would imagine that Casula and Yennora are in the running for quietest station on the t2/t5 lines. Leightonfield is probably one of the quietest on the t3 line too.
Watching this on the Sydney train let’s go
Whats with the razor ad. Is TH-cam that bad now? Maybe you need to see Mt Kuring Gai station where there's absolutely nothing around it (isolated surrounded by bush) and very few trains ever stop there as Sydney's most quiet. Lucky to have a few hundred visits per day. Leave your money of the fridge for the free video idea.
Apart from peak hour (because I'm not sure of the stats for that), half as many trains stop at the stations from Hornsby to Berowra as stop as Warrawee. I'd not be surprised if there were as many passengers use it as Warrawee, even not counting the Knox xtudents.
Waterfall is an enigma to me because whenever I'd get the train to go into the city with mum, Waterfall was always the last stop. One day I just kinda want to get on a train and go all the way there for a round trip to scratch the itch of the childhood mystery that is Waterfall. Wolli Creek too. I always remember those names.
That's how I feel about so much of the T4. I lived in Mortdale for 4 years as a teenager but never ventured further south excluding being driven down the Princes Highway headed out of Sydney as a whole, and I never paid too much attention to the places around me. But I remembered the names. I've always lived in the inner west otherwise, and as an adult I am so intrigued by many places along the T4 because I heard these names every day on the train yet knew nothing about them. It helps that south Sydney feels so disconnected to the rest of Sydney I suppose.
Bah, these puny stations that you speak of are mere Denistone wannabes!
For me denistone is like dead, probably becuase only buisness people, take it and they tap on becuase they avoid fine.
I grew up in Waterfall, it is a beautiful little town with a strong railway heritage, it's where I began my love for trains from. In terms of guessing the next ones, after a bit of thinking, I might've deciphered it: T2: Yennora, T3: Leightonfield, T8: this is the tricky one that has sorted stumped me, my best guesses are Turrella or perhaps Bardwell Park or Narwee, my only other thoughts further down the line are Macquarie Fields or Leumeah.
You may find that on the T2 that it's Casula is the quietest station. As you have only the Powerhouse Theater on one side and that quite large open paddock on the other side also the shops are about 1 kilometer away from the station, which makes it very isolated after dark and that's all.
Will we the quietest stations regional? Keep up the great work
Interesting that Cheltenham received a station upgrade and lift access in 2015 with so few visitors. Thornleigh and Normanhurst, on the same line, only just had their station upgrades completed in 2023.
Meanwhile Bankstown line only getting all our lifts along the line now due to Metro upgrade. LOL
It's one of the richest areas in Sydney, most millionaires per acre I believe. Dom Perrottet lives in the area for example. I lived just across the M2 from there and went to school in Beecroft, it's crazy how nice the area is.
Cheltenham girls high school might be a reason for that. I think if it weren't for student patronage the station would be the least busy in that line.
They were basically required to do it when they rebuilt the station to put the new freight line through - Cheltenham used to be wheelchair accessible because both platforms were on street level but when they built the new line they took that away
I traveled from Cheltenham station to the city for 10 years up until 2008 it is a very nice station I glad the have lifts now and you forgot the best attaction of Cheltenham .Cheltenham Oval just to let you know bower birds nest in the bush near station
"why are these even open" is a very dangerous question when it comes to railway stations - sincerely, a Brit
Pls Sharath Do a tour of the central coast newcastle line from Berowra North to newcastle :)
0:30 does anyone know what package the GUI displaying the numpy array came from? It would be so helpful if I had a better way of looking at a numpy array than printing it.
I personally thought Denistone was more quiet but I can't argue with sources.
Cheltenham has about 1000 high school girls use it every school day in the morning and the afternoon.
Cheltenham like Warrawee serves the large population at Cheltenham Girls High School
Haha at 3:24 when you bust out the IPA translation in subtitles I started laughing. I love how nerdy the railway community are, keep on being you.
You mentioned Town Hall as being the busiest station in Sydney, I always thought it was Central.
Why do they call it Waterfall when there's no waterfall?
Full video report coming up:
First off, I found "If you want me to do it in numerical order, too bad" rather amusing. Good thing I wasn't really thinking about wanting them to be in that order.
I was surprised at first that Cheltenham was quieter than Denistone. But after the explanation I can see why. They're probably about the same. Oh wait, it is Denistone as said a while after where I was up to in the video at the time. (I'm writing this comment while I watch the video) How did you miss that Sharath?
Great sponsor by the way. It's one of the few that I would watch instead of skipping it because I just don't care.
For the T1 I can definitely see how it's Warrawee after the explanation. Just like another Denistone. And I love the stand in the middle of the road test. But if this included the Richmond line for those wondering, I believe the quietest station is Clarendon. Very cool to catch the train to Waterfall from North Sydney.
I wasn't expecting Waterfall to be the quietest station on the T4. Probably because it's the terminus for the T4. But I guess it is right on the edge of Sydney and if it only has a population of 522, it makes sense. And then there's this line. "Most of the town is on the west of the highway while the station and railway is on the east of the railway." I was expecting that the station and railway would be in the same place as the station and railway. And I was half expecting a mention of the two crashes that happened at Waterfall.
Very nice video. I can't wait for the next one! And also, here are some predictions for what the stations in the next video will be: Casula, Leightonfield, and I'm not sure for the T8 so I'll guess Panania.
Hey - I love this channel but the attacks on Warrawee station have got to stop. Just unacceptable!
great video! interesting stations, you should do a video about Casula station, it is just tucked down a suburban street and seems very quiet.
Very watchable. And I'm not just talking about that impressive mustache...
can you please do a video on the origional warringah freeway network that got cancelled. there is a reserve of land going throug belrose where i live that i have been told was going to be a freeway going to south creek at dee why but i can't find any maps
As someone who lived in the Cheltenham almost all their life its worth noting that not only are there no shops around the station, there are no shops at all in the entire suburb. The only business is the cafe at the bowls club and thats only existed for about 5 years.
I definitely know leightonfield will be the quietest on the T3
petition for an intercity version
Ok but he'll have to go up the Hunter
Agreed
@@TrainzForNSWVlogs mindarriba,hilldale,wallarobba,wirrigulla, would be great
@@adaumfitzawitt1869Middle Door
@@TrainzForNSWVlogsMay as well do the whole of the Main North Line as well as the Hunter while he is up this way. I am sure Sharath would love the history of the Ardglen tunnel and Werris Creek station building. He could also cover the about to reopen West Tamworth to Westdale freight line.
As Someone who enjoys train videos you were fairly rude in this video
Flemington, Leightonfield and Holsworthy would be my guesses
And I got 1 out of 3. Genuinely surprised about Holsworthy being wrong. Flemington was a stab in the dark though
Can we get a new video on the Rozelle interchange if you get the chance please!
The YIMBY perspective as expressed is weirdly reductive. I have a lot of sympathy with some of these ideas. Building more good public infrastructure is important, and giving more access to it by creating more high and medium density mixed use around it is great. But why not both? Does all quirkiness have to go? Do we always have to squeeze every dollar, as if public infrastructure has a set budget that can't ever change, so our only choice is to optimise rather than addressing privatisation and wealth concentration directly?
Look: In 1900 when these stations were built, the population of Sydney was under half a million. Nonetheless, our forebears were prepared to make the investment. Now the metro population is 10x that. A million visits a year is easily enough to justify the building of a train station. They're literally a few sheds and platforms, a couple of sets of stairs and these days two elevators. Treating them like precious rare things that should not be allowed unless they also directly serve a high density cluster is captured thinking. There are roads for private cars *everywhere*, most lined on both sides with free car storage. The problem is not that these stations have 1% of the traffic of Town Hall and are unaccountably allowed to remain open. The problem is that the Town Hall station platforms have been basically unchanged since 1932 and are dangerously overcrowded, because we've stopped demanding that governments build things other than motorways.
I have never been to Cheltenham, but having seen it on the channel I'm now planning to hop on a train there and take a 10 minute stroll to Ahimsa Sanctuary, 3.5 acres of original bushland open to the public in care of the National Trust and featuring the home built that Mary Byles built by hand and the Hut of Happy Omen. Maybe I'll take a trek up the walking trail, through the lungs of Sydney to City View Rock to enjoy an eco-utopian moment in the liminal space of tree canopy and skyscraper.
So come on. What's wrong with a rail line having a bit of charm? You *almost* admitted you appreciated it, but ideology came charging back. What's the actual problem? The line has to go through that area anyway, it's between Epping and Beecroft. As you mention there are no shops but over 1,000 kids go to the public school there. Does every suburb have to be either a car-dependent food desert or a bustling hypermetropolitan cyberpunk free trade zone?
We should of course be improving urban design by making more major stations surrounded by high and medium density mixed use zones. But this should be additive, not zero sum. More public transit is better for everyone. More mixed use, more creative re-use, higher densities - all great. I moved into a suburb that's bustling and slated for the highest population increase in the State because I'm up for that. But we don't have to have a single vision for the whole city.
Amen, you have said all I wish I could say in words far more eloquent than mine. Diversity is key, and I'll bet those moving to Cheltenham are doing so precisely because it has beautiful homes and the peace of mind that comes from not living in a human hive. It costs a packet to live there, so why not let those who are fortunate enough to have their amenity? And the station is hardly a burden to anyone.
And I couldn't stomach any more of the video once he trotted out 'yimby'.This was a delightful channel when he started, uncovering lost Sydney treasures and the long forgotten history of things, but now he is an ideologue essentially shilling for property developers. He needs to remember it is "yes in my backyard", not "yes in everyone's backyard"!! Unsubscribed, don't believe he is promoting 'building beautifully' at all.
You can take the monthly tap on/off data and use the attendance data from Google to work out the hours and days of the week when they're busiest and an estimate of how many people would have been there.
when you looked at the t1, did you go up from hornsby to berowra? i assume the stations in between would have less patronage than warrawee.
Mt kuringgai
Most of those stations have got quite a few medium density housing in the station vicinity, so that could contribute to the ridership, but Berowra is emptyy. Maybe there's enough hikers going to berowra creek n ku ring ai national parks
From my experience with Berowra, I’ve always seen more people get off there than Mt Kuring-Gai, there’s also hikers and Central Coast trains stop there so it’s so much more convenient than Mt K.
If you’re travelling to Strathfield off peak for example, going from Mt K adds about 30mins to your journey compared with Berowra. That probably motivates people to do a short drive to Berowra (same for anyone going to Central Coast)
Wouldn't it be great if they reopened the Ropes Creek line again!
Sharath we need to get Geoff Marshall out to do a least used stations... Australian edition with you.
I wonder if the data is slight tainted as alot of these stations have poles not gates, how many people just don't tap on or off?
Hey, a bit off topic here, but can you send me the code for sorting the data set, it could be useful for many things
My guesses are
T2: Casula
T3: Leightonfield
T8: Panania
I lived in casuals until 1990.
The station virtually feels like it’s in a massive crater
When I was working for Sydney Trains I did a lot of shifts at Warrawee and the lack of any shops was annoying. Couldn't even get that early morning coffee - ziltch! The next stop towards Hornsby Wahroonga station is the total opposite with great cafes, restaurants, shops, etc. Now Denistone is another story... not a shop to be seen anywhere and whilst I was working there, I jokingly asked a customer on the platform where are all the shops? - her response was... "We don't want no shops here, it's peaceful here without them". If you had one of those mobile coffee vans I reckon you could make some good money by parking in the small carpark next to the station say from 6.00am to 8.00am to service all those heading to work with some caffeinated beverages & donuts 😁
hmm Having a network that includes less busy stations is maybe necessary. It would be nice if they built stations in busy places too.
Waterfall = 500 less car trips, which is worthwhile.
Guess we must have had the same idea at the same time because I was thinking about building a website doing the same exact things using the same dataset a month ago! University exams have put that on the back burner for now though
I lot of posts have mentioned Holsworthy. I would’ve thought with a carpark and a fair bit of medium density housing built around it that it would it quite busy. I know the traffic around peak hour can be a challenge.
A lot of people have said Holsworthy, but funnily enough, from a quick count there's at least TEN stations on the T8 that are quieter than Holsworthy haha.
Half expecting an episode on Vineyard next
The very rare occasion when you can travel from North Sydney to Waterfall (and vice versa). Happened as recently as Saturday the 11th of November and Sunday 12 November. This was due to track works on the T4 line in the city tunnels.
When the T2 lines is out of service too, then the St Peters and Erskineville Stations enter the T4 lines.....
I've lived in Sydney my how life, and haven't ventured out to some of the stations and suburbs featured on this page. It's like a "Sydney Weekender" meets "Getaway", and makes me want to visit these places :)
Excel pivot tables dude
Warawee has A LOT of school kids catching the train. Like A LOT. they probably are forgetful about tapping their opal cards.
Thanks for the doco- very interesting. True story, some years ago (within the last decade) I was on a train on the Northern Line towards Hornsby and as we were approaching Denistone, the guard announced "Quietest station on the network, no-one gets on and no-one gets off!'
Really enjoyed the video, thank you. Sharath I was just about to call an uber to drive down that street in Warrawee. I thought you might be standing there for a week.
Thank you, Sharath; this was so much fun to watch. When you mentioned accidents at Waterfall, I didn't remember the first, but the second one brought back memories of the news broadcasts. It was nice of you to offer your condolences to the families, as well.
Would you perhaps do a collab with Phil from Sydney Trains Vlogs one day? I would definitely watch that.
Just found your channel. Some really cool stuff. If you're looking for other ideas, consider Epping. Specifically, the Essex St/Epping Rd intersection. As far as I'm aware, it's the ONLY westbound exit from east side of Epping station since the right-turn from Langston place onto Bridge St closed several years ago. It's an absolute clusterfuck, especially around drop-off/pick-up times of the nearby Epping Public School. One ways street and almost complete gridlock. There's been massive property development in the last few years, and it continues today with a mega apartment complex being constructed on Cambridge St. If that's not enough, all North Epping traffic goes though the Eastern side of Epping as well, making it even more hectic.
Waterfall gets a lot of peak hour patronage, mostly people who live south of there driving up and catching the more frequent Sydney trains service. Go during the week, and the entire town is full of cars parked for the day waiting for their owners to get the train back and drive home.
Scomo shate himself maccas
Fascinating. I live in Rouse Hill and am on the Metro everyday, and as it happens, I tend to frequent Warrawee and Cheltenham stations up to 6 times a week for work.
Correction: Intercity and regional services heading towards Gosford and beyond also pass through platform 3 at Cheltenham.
Hey mate, great video as always. You mentioned that you’re “not that good at coding”. I’m a software engineer as well as a massive urbanist, so if you want to recruit someone with programming skills I’d definitely be keen to see if I can offer some assistance :) Keep up the good work!
Warrawee's "overpass constructed in 1977"? I caught the train from Warrawee to and from school (not Knox!) every day for 10 years from 1973 onwards. The overpass was already there in 1973.
"Cheltenham has 1297 people per day"...but that approximates a complete trainload.
What are your suggestions to overcome these low usage stations? Waterfall would be a huge loss to the total network given the Illawarra line starts / terminates there. Would you prefer to see the boffins close it down and use it as a marshalling yard, terminating the T4 at Sutherland
Predictions for next video:
T2 - Mcdonaldtown or Casula
T3 - Leightonfield or Sefton
T8 - Holsworthy
1:57 “If you want me to do it in numerical order, TOO BAD” lol Sharath your funny.!
i genuinely had no clue waterfall and even wollongong were so close to sydney
Do you live in Sydney? If so, that's bloody shocking. There's a stereotype sydneysiders barely know what is outside their own suburb that makes most of us other Aussies judge you and it sounds like you may be the stereotype 😂
@@dingobonza its traffic on the pacific highway, it makes it seem like its further away. also no, i dont live in sydney
@@gamermuffinn1600 that makes sense as it's the Princes Hwy. Probably for the best, it sucks here and I wanna move back to QLD every day lol