Ashes of Creation - Don't believe the hype
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 เม.ย. 2021
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This game might be good, it might even be GREAT, but it won't be as fantastic as the insane, unrealistic levels of hype of saying it WILL be.
Ashes of Creation is a new MMOPRG being created by small studio 'Intrepid Studios'.
The staff making it have a great deal of MMO design experience, from everquest and everquest 2, to Planetside 2 and Star Wars Galaxies.
Please look forward to this game, but stop hyping it to damaging levels.
Thanks to my Patreon supporters and Twitch subs for making my videos possible. - บันเทิง
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Hey Josh! Appreciate the vid :) I'd tend to agree that in most cases, hyping a game in development can raise expectations to unattainable heights and ultimately negatively impact the impression upon release for a game. With that being said though, I would caveat, there is a clear distinction between hype and excitement. Players should feel comfortable in expressing their excitement for a game or company *based* on solid reasons. Whether that excitement is for things like; graphics, designs, gameplay, philosophy, customer service, community interaction, transparency etc. When projects get this type of support and feedback from fans it helps the development by motivating the developers and dare I say, the industry in a few ways. Consumers aka players have a very powerful voice when it comes to expressing their content or discontent with the direction of a genre, or project. And it's important to use that voice so companies can navigate better when catering gaming experiences for their audiences. So in summary, tempering expectations can be a good thing, but don't be afraid to express your excitement or support for projects that you feel are doing a good job in specific areas. Cheers!
Yeah, no. Remember Cyberpunk? CDProjecktRed. The savior of gaming.
Hey, Steven! It's the middle of the workday. Why are you commenting on videos, instead of being hard at work leading the dev team?
@@XFreeStyleZX during lunch I read/watch community discussions on Reddit/forums/discord and the TH-cams/Twitterverse etc 😂
@@XFreeStyleZX he seems to do a LOT of PR. Not a bad thing honestly. I like being communicated to, instead of just left wondering what stages development is in. I do appreciate the transparency of him and his crew.
Hey Steven, hows about stopping all the banning of discord members who raise legit concerns? Ive seen a number of people called toxic simply for raising logical questions. Thanks a bunch fam. You have created an echo chamber, im sure youre aware
Never forget Ultima online originally had a fully functioning animal ecology. No one ever seen it because the players killed them all.
Ultima was ground braking, it's still very playable and in my opinion one of the greatest games ever
th-cam.com/video/KFNxJVTJleE/w-d-xo.html
I remember watching that video, I found it hilarious that the devs never considered how lunatic murderhobo players can be.
@@DaemonPrince that was back in the early 90s. Back then we didnt think "metagame" we had fun
@@jimmythecrow Your talking like if they did the same thing now people still wouldn't be going around making animals extinct .We both know that isn't true.
I remember when No Man's Sky was set to release, and a guy commented on a trailer for the game, that the game would be so good that it would change society as we know it. He seemed convinced that the game would not only be the greatest game ever made, but that it would be so revolutionary that human reality would not be the same again.
thats what dumb people do , they believe the marketing
@@orkhepaj Often it isn't even the marketing. Obviously marketing includes hyperbolic claims but the hype train tends to often out do even the marketing.
The game is just a whole different game than the release and still releases new free update.
@@1Piecer Yes, I play it, it's great with great devs. The problem was the main guy promising things too early because he had no experience in marketing etc etc
@@orkhepaj The main guy behind NMS had zero experience marketing to he promised things too early. But he never promised that the game would change human reality, so not really marketing in the instance of this guy
The problem I have with the concept of giving players so much influence is that so many players are dicks.
So many communities for MMOs are so incredibly toxic.
If you really have players shaping the world to an extent as claimed, they will fuck it up. I'm sure of it.
Also, the META. Left to themselves, players will reduce all options to the most effective strategy available, and force all other options out of existence. Being able to shape the world and face consequences of it sounds like there's going to be great variety and infinite possibility, but players will eventually grind that all down to whatever is most efficient and they'll all be the same.
I like to min max myself to get through a big challenge, but I tend to be the person wandering around doing my own thing for fun, and always get people baffled by it.
@@annana6098 Then you'd probably recognize some of the disbelief when I explain that exploring and gathering are two of my top requirements for an mmo.
This is especially true of pvp'rs. The majority really cannot comprehend a view of gaming that doesn't consist of beating others down and trash talking each other for an afternoon.
It's not just communities, it's PvP communities. While not ALWAYS true, games with more limited PvP tend to have nicer communities - at least on a surface level, but also deeper than that.
PvP communities tend to have a really toxic "git good, scrub!" culture that reviles "Casuals" or "carebears" who don't want to PvP. While you can get some of that from PvE raid heavy games, you don't get the latter, and that cuts down a lot of toxicity just right there. AoC is looking like Eve online just in a fantasy setting. Which can be good or bad, but even Eve knows to have some safe-ish zones like 1.0-0.9-0.8 sectors in space where the police patrol heavily and civilians are well protected.
@@aspektx I played Warcraft for a long time and really enjoyed it. When I joined, I played mostly solo for months, following quests all over the world, reading all the books available in-game, paying absolutely no mind to how many experience points I was getting as I experienced the world. Barely a single person could see me without telling me that I needed to go somewhere else to level faster. You see, there is a most efficient route to max level, and how dare I actually do these quests that give ten percent less xp. But Warcraft at least has many people who do everything.
I also played Maple story, it was even worse over there. QUESTS? Why would you do quests? Just stand in one spot and kill mushrooms brainlessly for forty hours, then do the party quest over and over and over again, that's the fastest way!
FF Andy's are incredibly toxic and self righteous.
Lost hope for Ashes the moment I found out it would depend on players to build the world.
It'll be fun for the first couple months, then it'll devolve into griefing and top guild dominance like basically every game of it's type.
@@AJ_Ol Not "whales", exploiters. Because that's what happened to NW - the people who got the best gear and maxed their professions rarely got to that point legitimately. I played on a server where a company of exploiters literally capped each of their characters with gold, full Voidbent as soon as they hit 60, exploited lags and windowmove invulnerability to control territories, and even lagged through closed door to PVE bosses that were already in game with full drops, but were not supposed to be accessible (hence the closed door).
"Whales" are P2W people that would throw money at the game to progress.
@@TarisSinclair While "Whales" mostly mean people who make a lot of microtransactions in modern usage, that's just because of the state of online multiplayer. A "Whale", at core, is anyone who is bloated, ie, has gotten super-high stats, tonnes of items, etc. and essentially "beaten" the game, because their character is too over-powered to ever fail. You had "Whales" before micros, on games like pre-F2P TF2 and early Counter Strike: Source, where almost all the purchase exclusives or pseudo-exclusives were simply cosmetic.
Again, in modern usage, this normally means they engage in a lot of micros because that's the easiest way to get the stuff required for that level of 'bloat', but it isn't necessary.
I have to admit it makes me leery as well .
Well, emulating life is hard, in this degree, because in real life the threat of griefing is remedied (mostly) by death. Permanent death.
Perhaps a MMO trying to emulate life, in this regard, could implement a system in which an account has several characters tied to it, in different archetypes, within a family tree.
Within a family, each player has a single Hero (1 month respawn), and citizens, capable of respawning normally, or on lesser time restraints.
The Hero plays like a normal MMO, and has immense power of the citizens. They are used to go out, grind, and gather rare materials for the family.
Each citizen character can take on roles within a civilization, and progress as such. Perhaps, even with an "autopilot" feature, to populate the world with character generated NPC's.
If your Hero Character dies in a town raid, world PVP, or some other non-safe fashion; they are on respawn for a month, incentivizing smarter play with Hero Characters.
Citizens are underwhelming, in combat ways, but may still perform combat, but primarily engage in duties around a town or civilization.
Perhaps fragmenting the game between Heros and Civilians could allow for some interesting gameplay elements, in which a player may engage in seperate parts of the game mechanics, and pursue different avenues to advance their Family.
Idk though, could be an interesting idea.
@@WilliamMcAdams No, that's a terrible idea.
People would just play in the most boring, risk averse ways ever. Most people would just get bored during the month long downtime and quit. Either that or multi account use would be rampant, and players who can't be bothered to maintain multiple accounts would get tired of falling behind and leave.
The game would inevitably turn P2W as the publisher sold early revives.
Basically the only people for whom this is even marginally interesting are people interested in civilian RP, but at that point, you might as well just cut out the extraneous hero nonsense and optimize the civilian side of the gameplay.
You can't develop gameplay concepts without taking into account how players will react to them, and no playerbase is ever going to react well to forced month long breaks.
There's a graveyard full of The-Last-MMO-You'll-Ever-Play
Developer: "We're going to make the last MMO you will ever play!"
Everyone: "Coolcool, join the back of the queue"
The amount of wow killers out there... and then it ended up being wow classic 😂
That’s this whole guys TH-cam career
I’m still playing WoW. Lol. But this is one of the few in the past six or seven years that I actually have faith. I have so much faith in it that I sunk money into one of the founders kids to be part of the Alpha tests. If it fails, it will just be another one of those MMO games that end up in the great MMO graveyard. But I have a feeling this one may be different. Now New World that’s an entirely different story. LOL
unfortunately wow poisoned the well for mmorpg games
There once was this game a friend got all excited about, it also had a massive hype train, a hugh sucess kickstarter, a really amazing trailer in wich it claimed to be the revival of a almost dead genre, almost 11 years later, Star Citizen is still a hot mess.
yeah...honestly i really wished they would have just made a co-op space action game...doesnt need crazy amounts of fidelity...heck im still fine with freespace graphics... i just wanted a new game like that... *sigh* maybe they will finish squadron 42 someday
@@SharienGaming seconded
They got lucky I had wanted a game like that ever since I was a kid so I still love it lol
This is actually not true, if you go to the star citizens sub Reddit plenty of people are pretty happy with it and it gets plenty of content update. It’s not that easy to create a game that’s never existed before especially when you have to invent a lot of your own tools to make it. News outlets are definitely blowing a lot of it Out of proportion. Each planet is the size of like multiple open world games and you can see how long one open world game takes to make. And there’s multiple planets now so I would never have expected this thing to be done within even 10 years. There’s a reason why no other game company is making a game like that. Games similar like that are not even first person, they do top down like eve online.
@@nawab256 After i spend way over 1000 hours with this dumpsterfire of a game i don't need no media or redditpleps to tell me how i have to think off it.
There are bugs in the game that i encounter today as i did 4 years ago when i first played the game. The so called content updates just brings any new mechanics to the game of wich a good portion doesn't work properly. I am very well aware that a game made from scratch need some time and money, both are given plenty and also a not that small number of people working on it. Taking this 3 points into account and experience all the progress and updates myself the past few years i witness first hand how badly they they do decisions and how they ignore problems with core mechanics for long periods of time if they care at all.
If we are talking about size of an open world, if i subtract all the space that is just filled with rocks, trees and such stuff, there is not that much left besides the 4 cities and a bunch of copy paste bunkers and outposts. For that one point i can compare it to like elite dangerous wich has a few billion planets to land on and drive (and now also walk around) on it, it started development around the same time and had it's full release many years ago, also i think No Mans Sky has way more planets and stuff, but i never played that so i cant make any comparisons. Calling star citizen one of a kind is nonsense cause it is simply not true, not in his current state and not with the current method of development.
Also, of course most other companies don't make such a game, and the reason is pretty simple: time and money. Chris Roberts had a known name and history he turned into money and created a whole new level of whalebaiting to get the funds. No regular game company can afford to pay several hundrets of million dollars upfront for a game wich takes them this long before it generates profit without going bankrupt and / or destroyed by investors and players. Thats something Chris Roberts himself said something similar back in the crowdfunding days, that was the reason he started a campaign for fundraising in the first place.
Two years later, 7 years into development, it's still NOT in Beta and they're looking for numerous engineers. Maybe it's for the final crunch, dunno. It doesn't look good. The game itself looks..clunky.
Honestly, Ive played so many bad MMOs throughout the years that I'd be totally stoked if this is just a "good" game. I don't need groundbreaking. Good is enough for me.
I'm also fine with Fun for a few months. I'm no longer delusional to think an MMO can keep me actively playing forever, cause even the games that got me into the genre haven't been able to hold me for to long.
Honestly, the MMO genre lost me years ago because every game is either grindy as hell and boring, or pay-to-win. I don't know if I can just settle for 'good' anymore. It'd take something special to pull me back in.
@@CoffeeGoblyn i want that feeling back, gathering a group and then go to some cave and murder hobo the local mopulation. And invariably run from the mob pull some noob trained to the entrance....
Aeon.. fastest flop
try mobile game called Toramonline best mmo in my opinion so far
I'm excited for Ashes. I was scared when this popped up "Oh no, an exposé piece that actually reveals all this as a scam" but no, very grounded hype control.
I'm not excited for the MMO second coming of christ. I'm just excited for Ashes of Creation.
Thank you for this, hope more people see it.
It already has all the hallmkarks of a scam.
As long as the class system works how they say it will be and they all feel unique enough, I'll be happy enough.
Idk man you do sound like you are expecting "MMO second coming of christ"
@@TheJezryk care to explain?
@@toufiq309 No I expect the things the game has on its wiki page which are planned for the game.
The Node System, the class system, the profession system and a dev team that cares, which ,having followed every monthly update for the last 8 months or so, they definitely do. Also ,it's not like I've preordered the game or anything, to make up my final mind I'm waiting for their last two betas. I'm positively sceptical, but positively enough to be excited
First time I heard about this and the consequence section makes me wonder. I wonder how much consequence there can be without spoiling it for future players. If eventually down the line, the majority of the players errupt the vulcano and the landscape changes, then new players will already see this without doing the quest. Or one server becomes more hostile than others... same with the Node system. While interesting, wouldn't the beginner areas after a while become massive cities even for new players instead of the struggle to building it? I just can't really get behind it. There can't be a consequence system without affecting the future player base
The nodes are the idea behind faction wars. I think they're hoping to have nodes level and be destroyed pretty regularly. (Especially since you can play as a monster to attack the cities, so you don't even have to be in a guild or levelled)
Something I was thinking about a bit....alot of the fun may be tied to building the nodes. What happens to new players? or players who dont like the results?
I just have this snaking suspicion they are gonna be turning out 'fresh' servers often so players can server hop to enjoy the nostalgia or early game rush. hard pass for me.
a sneaking suspicion as well...doh
I mean look at what happened with opening AQ gates. A dedicated amount of players rush to open it, get the rewards, or get to the end of the quest line and server hop to get their mount. Probably will see the same.
It feels kind of like making 2-3x as much content for limited benefit. Like, you need to design both 'Region A' and 'Region A but-ravaged-by-a-volcano', when most players will probably only end up seeing one of them and having marginal impact on which one it is. (Without hopping servers).
I feel like pvp in games that let you steal progress from other players is a very niche thing, like it might sound cool on paper being able to build your own home and gather materials and resources while competing against other players while being able to shape the world around you but in reality, most players just end up getting dominated and frustrated as their progress is either wiped out or stolen.
There might be a large amount of players out there that could appreciate this kind of gameplay but its a very niche crowd, not nearly big enough to sustain an entire mmo. Just look at RUST, it's the perfect example, it has all the things a pvp player might want but none of it is permanent unless your playing in a special server set to retain player progression and most aren't designed that way.
In mmo's I feel like most people playing would prefer permanent progression and it's the "most people" that keep your mmo's alive not the niche few
EvE shows you it's a double edged sword, If player created structures are too easy to take down, nomadic griefing squads will just mow them down like soldier ants. If the structures are resilient, then megaguilds will consume vast areas and turn them into de-facto PvE for their people. CCP have tried so many ways of balancing area control over the years, and every time the players have found a way to either annex everything, or murder hobo vast swaths of space into a wasteland.
Yeah as a DayZ player you learn to accept loss as its part of the experience, you sign up for that type of game when you start and accept that it could take a couple of hours to recoup that loss or days for a base, the more you put in the more you put up as risk, but with a game you can spend very long time playing like mmo, its hard to get motivated if weeks or months is lost, especially if you didnt want to engage in PVP. Id say thats why most roguelikes hit that sweet spot of 30 mins average for a sucessful run, so loss doesnt feel like punishment and you jump right back in
I wouldn't touch such a game with a ten foot pole. I like building, and I hate bullying, so that kind of griefing games just are soooooooooo not for me.
@@ertymexx you should check out valheim if you haven't already, it's basically the quintessential opposite of rust in that the game is super chill, easy to play, easy to build and farm and if you die you do loose what you were carrying at the time but your corpse is permanent so you can get your stuff back any time you feel like it even if you left it half way across the world.
'Rust' is "Grieving - the MMO". there is literally zero reason to play it. Everyone who began it, is now super powerful. New players get grieved instantly.
Basically there is a huge difference between saying "It's GOING to be good" and "I HOPE it will be good".
And there's an even bigger difference between "It's going to be good" and "This game is going to be the saviour of the MMO genre and it will revitalize it".
People need to do some serious expectations management.
Normal people: So Josh, how many tabs do you need open in your browser at any given time?
Josh: Yes.
*Nervously glances to over 150 open tabs in my browser*
If you are doing research and commenting on it I expect you to have at the very very least 10 tabs open. otherwise, you have no clue what you are talking about.
That's a normal amount of tabs. Are you a boring person who gets bored?
When I get to a few hundred tabs open and the browser grinds to a halt I download another browser.
@@AlanGChenery My brother always keep too many tabs open and then he complains to me that his computer and his browser is slow. I'm a bookmark kind of guy, myself. Instead of keeping tabs open for extended periods of time, I bookmark a lot of pages.
I want this to be good... but as some ones this played endless MMOs I know how META works.... having that many moving variables will likely end up in a ton of bugs or game abuse for the sake of efficiency over the developers' hopes for the player base. It sounds like the game will start off great, and as soon as the hardcore players start shaping the meta it will break apart pretty quickly.
Indeed, like it is, the hardcore players will destroy nodes and make life horrible for everyone
@@Krysnha or straight up camp them griefing anyone going there for a quest, or w/e reason.
@@ikeaira8701 Like eve online, i read veteran players do that, in wow when i used to play like a decade ago some players do that to me, one time, and personaly didnt care
@@Krysnha right, you just get back up and move on lol it's not that deep :P BUT it will get annoying after the 50th time being ganked just because I wanted to explore a little or finish a quest xD But it is what it is. I really hope their's proximity chat so I can at least have a chance to potentially clear my way through xD
@@ikeaira8701 so true, so true, when i was playing i want to play, i remember only in silk road and linage 2, decades ago i didint hear that, yes there were trolls but very few, for what i understand was wow that start that and well the idea in MMO only end game mattters, personaly, for me i have more fun in linage 2 and silk road than wow
Here's what I wonder: Is this game going to get a Crowbcat video on it months after release? All the hype from the devs (and The Lazy Peon, that was where I first heard about this game and his hype for it was insulting to anyone's intelligence) about the game just raises my suspicions at this point.
As a major MMO fan i've learned through experience to never board the hype train, i'm glad that the MMO scene seems to be getting some quality additions, but i'm gonna keep it at that and check out the game whenever it releases.
Same here never board the hype train for MMOs, especially when it touts EvEryThInG Is InFluEncED By PLayeRs. These types MMOs ALWAYS fall flat because you get the hardcore people who make it impossible for new players to do anything since they have a stranglehold on everything. And it always leads to trash experiences because not much is created in the developers minds in the cities/pvp/whatever.
especially MMORPG never ever ride the hype train, most cases all mmo's have failed there's only been few success stories very few, seriously top mmo's right now are still Wow, FF14, ESO, Guild wars 2 and runescape
My rule with MMOs is... If it hasn't been released, then it doesn't exist!
Same for me. Cautiously excited is fine but the MMO genre has fucked itself up by devs and publishers likewise too much to be truly excited without raising concern.
The hype train is where your wallet gets a pre-booked seat in First Class and drives off while you're still struggling up the stairs on the wrong platform.
Can't be disappointed if you always expect the worst.
pro gamer move right there
Literally me with each new pokemon game
That's how I flew through my entire education xD set my expectations low and was super stoked when I far exceeded my own expectations!
@@MGC-XIII if i expected 0 getting 1 in a test is fucking awesome
When it comes to MMOS, that's true 120% of the times!
Like grandma always said: Expect the worst, hope for the best.
My old boss used to say something like that. "Plan for the worst and all surprises are pleasant ones."
AoC fans : "Ashes of Creation will be the savior of MMO"
Also AoC fans : "Ashes of Creation made for specific type of MMO players"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I love how Josh is so optimistic about the whole genre in general, but also very rational about it. One can be very enthousiast and also very down to earth too ! I find it super cool !
The spirit of TB lives on in this one
Are you serious?
You'll have to forgive my amusement at that comment but the guy who condescendingly says the only reason people think MMOs suck today are just nostalgic for the EQ days while dismissing the older players and actually believes this era of nonstop photocopied games, one after another after another(for MMOs anyway) is the golden age of the MMO genre.
Yeah, not very grounded in the reality of the state of MMO games today.
Don't take this as an insult but you can't really say with a straight face this is a good place for video games much less MMOs. It's just delusional.
I like his approach, but I still get a lot of copium vibes. From my perspective the mmo genre is already dead and we are looking for a rebirth. Ashes is the only mildly good looking game next to new world. If both of those games turn out bad, then there's nothing else on the horizon.
@@_Titanium_ Heavy agree. I don't see how anyone can be positive and say MMOs today are great! Like really? Wow is doing good? ESO keeps dropping shall we say "social jabs" so it's killing itself.
Like the only really truly good one is FFXIV and it's dumbed down to hell when it comes to combat.
I do see Pantheon rise of fallen as having HEAVY potential as well. I read some of the lore and I can tell they want a true high fantasy world. They want you to get lost into it. They want you to pick like the skar and enjoy RPing as a clan of fanatical savages.
The've also added utility to the classes as well, such as the rogue can climb walls and let down a rope to traverse areas. A warrior can break walls. The Druid can make vine-bridges, the summoner can use portals and summon a raft for rivers, etc. If feels...fresh like their trying to add HEART!
2021 consumer in a nutshell: expecting 11/10, as soon as possible and despite emphasisng the need to socialize, will in fact play mostly alone. Developing an MMO has never been more difficult.
The problem with alot of games is you don't "need" to socialise there is no benefit in doing it and so most don't. Where as if the mechanics are required then players will socialise. I can only speak for games I've played but a good example is arma 3, I see a few new players who come onto servers with a solo mindset and they get chewed up, constantly flanked or not knowing where the enemy is and after about a week or so as they get used to the mechanics and familiar with other players they start interacting and playing as a team, very rarely so I see a new player quit to never return just because they cannot play solo.
@@TwoPlusTwoEqualsFive32 But even in instances where other people are required, like in ESO's trials and dungeons, then you'll just end up being a tool in a group of tools who all want something out of those dungeons and you stop being of any kind of importance once you've left the group or in extremer instances, when you're not playing like others want you to because now you're stalling their grind.
True, it's become very difficult to create an mmo that pleases people and it's solely due to so many companies making terrible mmos. The player base has become jaded
It's like meeting your hero or building up an idea of someone in your mind and being disappointed when you meet them or date them
Had a guy try to pitch me this game while i was working at a gas station in 2018
yeah i remember my father told me that he was 15 the first time he heard talking about it...must have been early 60s ^^
Honestly, ever since TB passed, you and the Spiffing Brit have filled the hole in my life that only a snarky Brit could. Thank you for the excellent content
Neither of these two do what TB did, how do they fill the void? Or are you literally just talking about their voice?
@The Joki G TotalBiscuit
@The Joki G always welcome!
@@RDR911 referring to having a cynical but logical voice breaking down video games fundamentally. Spiff exposes gross and easily abused/fixable glitches (something TB was not only well versed in regarding his reviews in his most popular series) and JSH covers the passionate breakdown and explanation of game development and how semi-defunct and even predatory certain game releases are.
I dunno. I just feel like they fit where he left. I may be wrong and that's acceptable and I'm certainly not pushing my pov onto anyone else. If you feel otherwise, you're welcome to
@@RDR911 TB also started by covering MMO's, wow for the most part.
"The first year of No Man's Sky" is all the description you need to understand why you should not hype up games before release.
easier said than done when plenty of idiots around the world fall for hype all the time despite multiple games never living up to said hype in the end
the second I heard about this one, and got hyped, I also remembered one other game that got hyped up to hell and I even got insanely hyped for too.... this feels like it could become the MMORPG version of Cyberpunk2077
I was pretty hyped for guild wars 2 back in the day and it didn't disappoint.
Josh, I very much appreciate the time and effort you put into your videos. Highly informative and very insightful. I felt you were talking directly to me at 9:15. I have to fully agree, even though I enjoyed EQ back in 2000s, I don't know that I would have that kind of patience again in 2022. I too have shifted to enjoy solo content in an MMORPG. Please keep the videos coming. You're one of the better reviewers out there!
>grounded discussion
>mmo fans
Pick one
Everyone's forgetting the launch day mmo curse nothings going to work and everyone on the hype train is gonna hop right off unfortunately
Never understand people like that, it's common knowledge by now that it happens. Also, if that can sway you from playing an MMO entirely then you shouldn't be playing an MMO in the first place, MMO's require a huge time investment and if you quit due to just server issues on the first few days you really don't even get to experience basically ANYTHING the game has to offer. Tip for any MMO player that has never played a brand new one.
Set your expectations very low on what you get to actually do the first few days, don't take days off work for a new release expecting to just powergame all day long as it's just not going to happen since basically every MMO release day always has issues. Play the game enough to feel if it's something you could enjoy AFTER the issues die down so you get a fair shot at seeing how the game works/feels. Basically don't go in thinking "This game is the WoW Killer, i'm going to play it 18 hours a day once the servers come up", only to find out server issues/overpopulation and other things cause you to not see how the game actually works.
I'd honestly say that if you really want to play a new MMO that is coming out, plan to spend at LEAST 25-50 hours IN-GAME beforehand to actually get a real feel for the game to see if it's something you enjoy or not. Do not judge an MMO based just your few hours in the first day, the game will feel, play and look entirely different from the first few levels compared to mid/endgame and you ALSO deal with whatever launch problems happen to occur that "should" be fixed by the time you invest a bit of your own time in.
If you quit the game with only a few hours played you really should have been able to see that the game isn't for you just from some videos in the first place since in those first few hours you really don't even experience 0.001% of what the game has to offer anyways so it's not the game you don't like it's something else.
Just my 2 cents on people who overhype MMO's, quit early saying it's bad but never even experienced anything the game offers.
Whenever i hear the announcements or hype about new MMO's i just remember the massive hype i used to have for Archeage in... 2010 maybe, at some point between 2010 and 2013 at least. I think i may have tried it at some point as a f2p but if i did, nothing about it stuck with me. But i can still remember the hype, the idea of building your own stuff, making your own ship to sail the seas.
It looks cool. I've caught some of the streams and it feels like an evolution of Guild Wars 2, which is where I make my home since its release on Steam.
I'll definitely give it a shot when it comes out, and since it won't be here for a long time, I should have enough time to finish GW2 by then.
The more I watch your stuff the more I am impressed with your voice word choice and cadence. You really understand your craft, and speak in a way that drives the point while drawing in the listener. Truly one of the most professional content creators I have watched. Keep up the fantastic work.
I have the same fears for Hytale. The hype is too great. The game
may never reach 50% of the games expectations
I just watched one vid on hytale and nothing else. Id play it but i dont want the get caught in the hype
Have to say that I wasn't even particularly impressed when I saw the promotional video. Building your own stuff from tiny ship to massive stations, I have known in EVE Online and I have seen where it can lead to. It is not in and of itself a bad thing, but it is ultimately very niche, since it scales with player activity level and interactions. So, it is nothing for casual players. I can't see it revolutionizing the genre. It will have its audience, potentially, but the pressure for success is much higher than it was MMOs was just for nerds without a life.
Something people have to understand is that as soon as you add a competitive economic system to a videogame (and that doesn't just mean money, it means useful stuff), it's not some abstract thing that can work however you want it to. The same principles apply as apply in real life and I'm sorry there's no way to work an economy to be fun where some people work maybe 2 hours a week and others work 15 hours a day, at least not without taxing the everloving shit out of people. Those who spend 15 hours a day will have such vastly superior resources to those who play infrequently that it will be oppressive and it'll become just like real life - You "play" because you have to to survive in the game, or you are an ant waiting to be stepped on.
I mean that everyone should cater to the working dad. That’s how you get experience boost, level boosts and a whole lot of micro transactions. There’s plenty of mmos that fulfill your needs if you want that, I’ve been waiting for an MMO that doesn’t Hand you shit if you pay real money.
@@nawab256 I can't speak for every MMO existing. But I've played the hardcore type as well as the theme park types with focus on PVE, but never one where I had been given a hand by any of those games. The games I've played there were indeed sometimes one time max level token. Usually used by people who knew the class and just rerolled a toon of that class in another faction. It didn't give them an advantage over others. If people want to play niche games where PVE is absent, that is their choice. However, it requires commitment that goes beyond having a lot of time.
The long and short of it is most MMORPG gamers are in their 30's, I like to imagine most of us have jobs and life commitments. MMORPG's are not what we played when we were going to school and college, we had all the time in the world, all the hours to burn and laptops/gaming pc's were cutting edge equipment for us all to get on board and join these adventures.
Now we get home from work, we are tired, we are hungry, the cat needs feeding, your bin needs taking out and before you know it, it's 9pm and you need to go to bed soon because you're doing the exact same day again tomorrow.
We have got to realise that games need to move from this old school style of being able to invest all your time to it and more to, okay I can sacrifice a few hours to play and crack on.
Honestly, at this stage most MMORPG games are supported by whales and that is it. I speak personally here, I have not enough time in the world to commit. I cannot commit to these weird time based events in game where I first need to prepare for said event then join it. I can't do wars on castles, I cant do massive 60v60 PvP battles; I CAN log in, smash a few quests, do a bit of story content, craft some stuff, grind a little stuff and take part in some group content that doesnt require me to travel for 20 minutes and hope to find a group.
Gaming has changed, our expectations need to change to reflect it.
All of the AoC update emails they send me are just advertising their overpriced cosmetic bundles, trying to bait the purchase with FOMO limited cosmetics. Not at all hype for this. The art design is bland and boring, the combat is absolutely dogshit, and all of their vague promises are nowhere to be seen in actual gameplay.
"FOMO" = Fear of missing out. Classic marketing sales strategy.
Man, I have to confess I once almost subbed to A Realm Reborn because some of the skins looked cool (I had been wanting to get in on FFXIV for a while) but I changed my mind after I paused and thought about it. The amount of money one can save by waiting a bit and avoiding impulsive buying is staggering.
I'm a backer myself but hate the fact that there are already limited time cosmetics, disgusting practice imo
After Cyberpunk I will never be hyped again. Looks cool, is interesting, I will probably play it and try it. If i love it - great! If im disappointed, well thats life :)
Bruh I literally grew up on the hype of Cyberpunk 2077. I was still in school when the first trailer released and everyone I knew was talking about how it would be so realistic and have so much living organic content that you could just open the game and feel like you were literally playing a real person in a real parallel world. And then almost a decade later tha game finally dropped, and it didn't even look or play better than other open world RPGs that already existed, let alone feel like a real living world, and I'm gonna be honest the whole experience has jaded me quite a bit.
Fool me once shame on you, fool me 3 times, shame on me. I literally never pre order now.
@@chtholly8084 Cyberpunk 2077 is not even an RPG, it's just an action with some RPG elements...
I just realized Josh saying his actual name sounds more like he’s saying “Josh Dry Face” than when he’s actually saying “Josh Dry Face”.
Hey there, just recently found your channel and so far have been enjoying it very much. But I have to say I like the BSG decor in the background. Your background is like a Easter egg of golden gems of entertainment.
I have saved this video, in two years I will revisit it and see how fresh it sounds.
Can I reserve my place here, I'll come back when you come back
@@bondrewdbestdad Don't see why not. LOL
In 2 years the game will still either be in development "we only need 2 more years and then your dream game is ready!!" or it will be shut down. People who invest in this game now deserve to have their money taken, they are fools.
"People are hyping this up so much that when it releases, it will be disappointing, through no fault of its own"
Nintendo fans: "First time?"
“Through no fault of its own” Nintendo games haven’t changed at all in 20 years. They can’t even update their UI styles or menus. It’s very much a fault of their own
@@stuglife5514 Can you elaborate more on the UI/menu point? I'm a bit confused. Yea, some games have similar or even the same UI and menus (looking at you, NSMB series). But, the vast majority of games have changed their UI and menu setup, for better or for worse. Comparing BotW's menu to Ocarina or Majora is like night and day, even taking into account their remakes.
I know you were probably trying to be hyperbolic, but even taking that into account it's a bit baffling as to what point you were trying to make.
@@stuglife5514 why u wanna break something that's been working just fine for the past 20 years
@@stuglife5514
Lol, what?
Pretty sure it's the fault of the game when it's promised to be pretty much Everything and be able to do everything. If people then get disappointed at launch when these turn out to be lies, it's through fault of its own
The hype train only has one destination: disappointment. That’s why I never ride it anymore
No Man's Sky and FF14 online are the only 2 games that come to mind - The games that didn't lived upto hype on launch, but they made those expectations a reality moving forward. Important to mention that No Man's Sky is Buy-Once only game with free huge updates and a free VR mode
It's the Half-Life 3 effect. Hype can literally kill a game.
Cannot kill what never lived.
I would have called it the "No Man's Sky effect" myself.
Unless it's Shadowbringers.
@@jaysonbird3975 It's more apt to say it's alive as soon as it's planned to be made, then something killing the interest/make unable to fulfill the hype would kill the project.
@@the0s0ph1st cant be killed by hype if you become the hype
12:14 I had a similar experience with this and Crowfall a few weeks ago. I was invited to their beta, and I'd heard a lot of really unflattering things about the game, so I went in basically expecting a steaming pile of shit. And while what I found didn't really engage *ME* as a player with my own tastes and preferences with my MMOs, I actually found that it was better than I feared. I expected a barely playable, buggy mess, but it really seemed to be fairly well put together. It's still not a game I'm going to really play, but my point is, my expectations were very low, and I was pleasantly surprised.
Here we are 2 years later xD
Yeah, that's true, most mmorpgs I play, I always do so alone, I can't play with others because I don't have the time to, so dungeon diving, completing events and some other things I only have little time to do then and it's usually during hours where most people aren't playing or have already finished doing their daily activities online.
I learned the hard way not to preorder games and never will again. I'm looking at you Fallout 76.
The last game I was tempted to preorder was Anthem. Thank goodness I didn't.
Same
My first time preorder was Star Wars battlefront 2. 🤦♂️ never again
After cyberpunk 2077 everything this man is saying is true to me and I haven't hyped a game since.
For me it was original Fable. Yup dating myself there.
@@playtoyx Original fable was amazing it was one of the first games that gave you that light and dark distinction and it did it very well
@@nou2716 it wasn't the hype though. It was good but expectations were not met.
@@playtoyx LOL Ultima IX for me, so I'll join you in getting dated.
@@playtoyx Peter Molyneux was the absolute king of overhyping his games sadly, full of ideas, very passionated, but completely random in his communication.
Speaking of GW2, I remember the community (and the game devs, mind you) hyping up how there's so many tiny minigames you could play to immerse yourself in the world.
When the game released, there was only 1.
"Expectation management is the key to crisis control."
~My dad
This guy has experienced the glory days of mmo and the downfall. He gets it. Lets all cross our fingers that we can get some games that help rebuild our favorite genre!
Best to not overhype a game before release, it'll never match up to expectations if you expect it to be the coming of Christ for video games. No Man's Sky release state is a good recent example
fuck cyberpunk is a more recent example
No Man Sky released 5 years ago, I think there are newer games that fall in the "recent examples"
@@SpicyMutt Honestly cyberpunk is probably a better example aswell, because it was nowhere near as bad as No Man's Sky when that released, i mean that was filled to the brim with broken promises, gamebreaking bugs, a vast empty galaxy that really wasn't that vast. Cyberpunk is just a decent/good game that had a poor launch, and slightly bad marketing, but people acting like it's equivalent to No Man's Sky is a clear symptom of overhype also makes you overreact.
@@SpicyMutt cyberpunk is a little different. if it had launched with no bugs and in what we would now consider an ideal state then it would be a different story, cyberpunk was pushed out at least a year too soon.
No man's sky is more applicable as it wasn't a bad or buggy game at launch, it was simply massively overhyped. The situations are similar, but different enough it matters.
I was super hyped for guild wars 2 and it turned out to be even better than I expected. Hype is so relative
It may be just me, but I think that developers also often forget the importance of the world itself. If I don't find the world that I am playing in compelling, it just won't pull me in. There are many factors, but I think that the reason for WoW's and LOTRO's successes and continued existance is that they are based on interesting worlds and lore that many people are fans of or familiar with, and it leads to a greater connection. The moment I saw that the races were just generic names hiding generic descriptions, my hype died down a bit for Ashes of Creation...
Fantastic video, really enjoy that you give everything such deep consideration. You made a good point when you spoke about expecting a 10 and being disappointed with a 9. But I do wish you hadn't made that same point 5 more times in the video. Still really enjoyed this :)
What you forget mentioning is that the immense hype for these games is fueled and elevated to new levels by stream media content creators and the so called gaming press. Hype and exaggerated click-bait titles brings in clicks and viewers. Many people believe the hype created artificially by these people , because it's partly the only source of information about a game that they use.
Don't put this all on the consumers, content creators are the biggest problem, the way I see it.
He did mention youtubers and claims they made. He addressed the audience directly to do what they can to help get the best experience they can get for themselves out of the situation.
"MMORPG" and "Small Independent Studio" go together about as well as two things that don't go together at all.
Eh I wouldn't really consider them a small independent studio, more like a medium one and at least these are all some well knowns from the genre and not some young nobodies with a dream and no money. Although I understand why people have their doubts, no community has been bent over backwards like the MMORPG community by independent studios.
Highly skilled and experienced staff with +$10 million locked in with a clear goal. Is the safest gamble, one could gamble.
The studio head himself is a MMO fan ,long time player, funded the entire game himself and surrounded himself with competent people. Actually look at a monthly update ,you'll see it
@@richardgray9284 I mean, Lineage 2 a game from 2003 cost like 50-90 million dollars to make. MMOs are extremely expensive and usually have much larger teams with more experience. Just hope the game is fun for a bit but I don't think any other expectation is reasonable at this time.
@@richardgray9284 that is chump change for an mmo.
I've never even heard of this game, but given my MANY years of play on EQ (from release to 2004, then on a retro server from 2013 to 2016), I TRULY look forward to designers from that era utilizing modern tools to create something EQ-esque.
I've heard so much of this before. I remember a game called Shadowbane. It was hyped and pushed as a gamed that let you 'really change the world'. Players built communities and in that game, they really did. It required a kind of 'seed' to start and you actually chose buildings to add and built them. Other players could attack your settlements and they had a kind of siege system that gave players time to collect to defend their town... it sounded awesome. I also had a kind of hardcore PvP and that was the achilles heel. It killed a lot of the player base so no matter what their settlement system was supposed to evolve into, it didn't get the grow into anything. PvP guilds controlled the non-newbie zones and as soon as you were kicked out of the newbie nest, you got wasted. Who wants to play a game like that? Ashes of Creation might be good, we'll see, I suppose, but no matter what they claim, what they deliver will be more important. I remember another game, called Horizons that claimed that when you crafted a sword, you would have 'So many customization options that you will have literally Millions of possible combinations for unique looks' and then they delivered a game with Dozens of unique loos. They had cut back almost all of those design options when 'optimizing' the graphics. It turns out that millions of options actually slowed down video rendering.. who knew? In fact, while that game actually delivered on many promises by the end, what they were hyped to provide wasn't there at release. They let you play a Dragon PC and that was awesome... in concept. They actually let you play a baby dragon at release and that sucked. You couldn't grow up because they hadn't finished building that content yet. So you had thousands of baby dragons whishing they could fly... I know, I was one of them. Like me, most of the player base bailed on the game. A few die hard playes actually stuck around until the content arrived but it was too late, the train had left the station for other games. Horizons did eventually let you play a dragon who could grow up and fly, rebuild the crumbling ruins of the 'old world' and establish thriving communities... filled with shosts become the players had long gove by then and only a few people ever got to see it. One of my old friends stuck with it and told me stories of the guilds who joined together to rebuild a few old cities, with dragons flying in huge loads of resources for crafters to use as materials for the building process. It sounded cool... too bad it was years too late when it came.
That was my exact experience with Shadowbane, had the guide books and it all looked really interesting, found a guild around the end of the newbie area and proceeded to go out with a small group of my new guild and got absolutely steam rolled in about 2 seconds by a group of players we barely saw before our bodies were smouldering heaps and the guilds small village was basically forfeit. Not really what I was looking for.
@@5dollarfootlongcat The funny thing is, the guys who 'won' those battles, lost us all the war. They killed the game they wanted to play... I heard a lot about how the gamer community in Austin was so disappointed with those developers since it was an Austin group. I was living there at the shortly after Shadowbane died. I suppose that a few people got to enjoy it for a while but MMO games aren't supposed to be flash in the pan things you toss out a few weeks after you buy them. There is no point putting five years of work into something that is going to be torn down in a few months. Such a sad waste...
I cannot stop seeing how out of proportion characters are in the enviroment. The smallest flower is bigger than a head. Even in town, wooden fences are almost as tall as them.
Dude, it's a game not set in the real world. It's a game set in a fantasy world. The keyword here is "Fantasy," of course, not everything you see should represent the scaling of real life.
Lol 😆 its the Gary Coleman mmo
but aren't fences supposed to be built as tall?
wow does this, it’s an art style
AoC: "I am not the messiah"
Starved players: "He is the messiah!"
Preordered to support the devs. Not really gona stay on the updates just one day il recieve I fun email "hey welcome to the beta" (I hope).
He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!
That was a life of brian reference, right?
I'd love to share what i remember voicing my opinion on. This studio went on massive parade about how amazing their mmorpg was and the finished state it was getting towards. Years and years ago. Then released a battleroyal which was, .. ok? and a supposed castle sieging game that was all on the same engine and using assets that were already made due to the near finished state that the mmorpg apparently was at. They then started using their battleroyal to push their supposed mmorpg that had no evidence that even existed and promised that if you played their battleroyal you'd unlock special items for the MMORPG when it launched. Then took their battle royal down when no one liked it and i don't think many even got near the castle sieging simulator. Then we hear nothing for about two years and then we see "alpha footage" of an early EARLY! look on what they've made so far for the MMORPG that apparently was so well and near completed... With no information passed through at all then we had the alpha and now everyone is so happy this game is coming regardless of the near scam this almost became? They clearly had nothing to show for an MMO but clearly used all their money for the battleroyal and then had to scrap it when they released people were asking questions about a MMO that people had backed prior then went to work to build it as fast as they could to show people not to lose faith, hence why the alpha looked as horrible as it did... and the playable section that you had to "BUY" into... was so bad, that even most players believe that even a dude learning how to use a graphics engine for the first time built the landscape. It's probably not going to be what it should have been because they released all these other companies had used scammy ways to make money from backers and are now all being sued and losing their money. This team decided they had to do something to show so they didn't get sued also...
Don't leave us hanging, what studio/game is that? and more importantly, is it something Josh already has a video on?
Although the event timeline is basically correct there's a couple things wrong. The battle royale was always marketed, at least to people paying attention, as a test of the combat systems they'd built already. And it resulted in the discovery that they had some Horrible back end coding which resulted in a number being fired and a lot having to be scrapped. Which is why we saw no future updates for some time after. We also did get some sweet castle siege gameplay using the testing classes, which involved hurling spells and arrows over walls, building magical cover to slowly get the melee classes closer etc.
Won't lie, I bought into it hard at first. I'm still hopeful they come out with something good after their delays but my expectations have tapered pretty quickly. Especially because now they're moving to UE5, so we can expect another delay from that most likely. (Though I've heard they're working closely with Epic and that UE4 and 5 have pretty good asset transfers.)
The only time i ever saw a 'cross platform' game system was in 'Poker night' and "poker night 2'.
You unlocked skins and things for other games they represented. Still, almost not worth playing Poker Night though the second one is a little better and just for the novelty it's fun, IF you can still find an unused key. Steam doesn't list the games any longer though they are still there.
@@SendarSlayer not gonna lie I’m kinda hoping for a win in the end. What ever the past had for them. If they can actually pull it off. I hope for the best success possible. There is no Ill will against this team but we’ve had nothing but dodgy for years. I have been pretty hyped from what they finally have had to show so no doubt when it releases I’ll definitely buy a copy to see for myself at launch. I’m just hoping it won’t be another new world. I wanted new world to be something huge so bad.
@@xenxander yer. I’ve got the battle royal still in my library. It’s kinda what had me pretty furious from the get go. Hopefully they will touch on the subject later in the future and address it all.
Right now its 2022.09.17 and this game according to the devs right now is in "Alpha-1 intermittent spot testing", there are still news of it being worked on but it didnt manage to move away from the first alpha.
Maybe it will come out, maybe it wont. I dont think it will but lets see.
I’m hopeful for Ashes...can’t wait to hear your take tho
we will all get it in about 3 years, because thats how long till this game will come out. Maybe more
@@jonathansoko1085 yeah man MMOs on average take 5 to 7 years to make Ashes started around 2017 so 2022 for 5 years 2024 for 7 years.
2:20 the amount of tabs open YEESH
God! I hate that too 😆!
Rookie. I currently have 2500 tabs open. My last session crashed and wasn't able to load it anymore, because i had even more open... :D
That's fucking amateur hour dude.
AMATEUR
i currently have 86 tabs open :U
How bizarre to have found this video literally one day before its one year anniversary. I wonder if AoC has made enough progress for Josh to make another vid on this -- had never heard of it until this and now I must say that my curiosity is piqued!
I love watching older videos as the supporters screen grows lol
This ones gonna be spicy boys
Like every properly spicy dish it hurts three times.
Once when you're making it. Again when you are consuming it. Finally when it comes out the other end
It just occurred to me after watching a bunch of JSH videos, I can't think of a single time I've ever disagreed with him. His opinion is always well thought out and level headed. The planet needs more of this.
Psychology, my dude. He got you dancing in his palm. With that sweet, sweet British accent.
@@Sayonarin are you sure it’s just the British accent and not that masterpiece of a haircut he has?
He's great, but he falls into the trap of just blaming stuff on corporate greed without trying to understand the back end of it. If he made just that tiny bit more effort to investigate why certain things happen (e.g. why WoW has both a base game price and a subscription) then he'd be perfect. He's still an amazing raconteur but there is still that niche open for someone who actually attempts to understand the logistics and economics of gaming development.
Still, that's like 1% of a problem. 99% agreement isn't bad, and there are very few gaming commentators out there who make the effort to understand the business aspects of gaming development, so JSH isn't perfect but the closest thing to that.
@@zepho100 i think it’s the haircut. every time i watch i just think goddamn i wish i had hair that glorious
@@TiredOfHumans it is glorious. 😂
I'm super skeptical about this game. I very seriously doubt it will live up to the ridiculous hype. It's sad, people never learn.
What they need to learn is not to hype, but give cautious optimism if not excitement.
Stop calling x or y "game killer" just appreciate that it might be a fun game you really enjoy and have no further expectations than that.
In many cases, it's not the corporation funding the hype train, it's people who think too black and white. Savior or villain.
Despite the hopeful/grand claims, you can't exactly blame the company when their fanbase goes hype-rabid.
My suggestion? _Completely ignore the hype_
If the game looks interesting/fun to you, then play it when it's out.
Hype is almost exclusively harmful.
@@JagEterCoola except if you wanted to insure that they didn't do a No Man's Sky, you would work to temper expectations upto a point
@@vixxcelacea2778 it isn't really harmful as long as you're self aware, hype is not gonna make a game more shit, if anything it will make it better through increased investment and thus budget. The only negatives are your feelings getting hurt if it doesn't live up to the hype, pretty shallow and a weak mindset imo
Imagine being a new player after there is an endgame community with all the resources and power... it's darksouls' world, but you never get stronger and perpetually stuck in PVP purgatory, getting your ass kicked.
Cant wait for this. Everone seems to be blinded by ashes but in the most recent stream the combat still looked horrendously clunky..
Edit: Not saying being hyped is bad, just keep around some healthy scepticism. We'll see if It's good post alpha.
Combat is nowhere near a place where they (Intrepid) or us (players) would be comfortable with. They know this, as stated in the latest monthly dev update. This is okay, because:
1 - They know this and have stated so;
2 - They have shown great interest and responsiveness to feedback (see fireball for quick example);
3 - They constantly research and introduce new tools to smooth out combat;
4 - They are prepared to do iterative changes and spend a long time improving combat as opposed to just full revamping it and calling it a day.
As always, they are open to constructive criticism coming from the point of view that understands that some things take time and that animation aren't remotely close to finished. Next Alpha-1 is a TRUE Alpha-1, things are not complete or ready.
Edit: spelling
@@ZephyrorOG I'll believe it when I see them execute on any of their vague promises.
yeah maybe it will be good ... in 2034 ^^. Seriously i dont trust kickstartet mmos but if they pull it off right it will be great ... but not this year and not next year
@@ZephyrorOG there is a saying: am truely is poor if he can't even promise.
This will flop. Can't wait to watch
Just wanted to clarify since one of my videos was mentioned here that my video wasn't at all about me hyping the game, just outlining that due to Peon's video and all the massive content creators(tim, summit, shroud, asmon) reacting to it turned it into the most hyped mmorpg. The message within that video (from what I remember) wasn't about me hyping it as I don't believe it will be anywhere near as good as people think it will but rather the reason it's hyped and why we shouldn't be. I don't believe it will live up to the hype at all and have been telling people to stop hyping the game for over a year now as well as telling people not to buy it. Especially considering I've had multiple conversations with people breaking the NDA and the news from inside the game so far is not even remotely inspiring me with confidence.
Great video though man
Thanks dude, I hope we can play something together sometime :D
Kira is a hyper! Just watch how he hypers The Elder Scrolls online when he talks about it! Everyone is playing ESO cuz of him! :D
Awesome video as always. Watching this I feel like AoC will be another New World. The game will start great and then players will glitch it and abuse it. Give it a few months and only the cheaters running the cities will stay.
On the other note have You seen Broken Ranks? It seems like an interesting marriage of old and new mmo mechanics and ideas. Looks very promising.
This video is honestly pretty good life advice in general. One of the best feelings you can have is not having any expectations whatsoever and therefore having a solid chance to get pleasantly surprised.
I need a t-shirt with the phrase "Don't board the hype train" on it.
Just come on it. We have fun and are all hyper happy until we crash in mountain reality.
The last hype train I got on was Dragon Age 2... despite warning sirens screaming at me that something was wrong. Specifically how fast of a turn-around the game had when Origins took years of careful planning and work to make.
Legit have not pre-ordered a game since, and am significantly more skeptical of the industry as a result.
Good video my man.
But yes, definitely calmly hoping for the best for the game.
does this have a part 2?
All the tabs, pins, and notifications you have open make me want to pull my hair out
I remember some months ago a youtuber made a video of how great Ashes of Creation was and how it harkened back to the OG ever quest and the only thing that ran through my mind was, "Why on Gods green earth would I ever want to play the OG ever quest in 2021?
I'd be curious to know the average age of people excited for this game; I'm wondering if most of the hype isn't coming from people who are mostly older than 30 and nostalgic for the way they remember MMOs being when they were younger.
@@BenkaiDebussy maybe, my first MMO was in 2008
I am absolutely on the hype train. It all just seems so good, but I recognize how irresponsible I'm being.
Do you know waht kind of mmo it is? I find most people think its one thing, but its actually the opposite. So id love to hear what your take on the kind of game it is
@@jonathansoko1085 yea man, I don’t know exactly what you mean by “what kind of mmo, but to try to answer that; it is a sandbox mmo (as opposed to theme park) with a strong emphasis (requirement) of player choice and player /player interaction.
@@jonathansoko1085 I think it's pretty much a themepark mmo promising to deliver excellent quality for all aspects of the themepark
@@jonathansoko1085 Since you've been critical I'd genuinely like to see what you think, rather than trying to downvote and silence critics. I've been following this since the start, I have many concerns, but fundamentally I think the ideas the team has are amazing. The execution is lacking, I worry that it will be too limited in functionality to properly deliver the sandbox player-driven experience.
@@jonathansoko1085 It's a "sandpark" mmo
I appreciate the videos you make they are extremely helpful. My gaming funds are extremely limited and this game looks interesting. I think though it would be best if the developers save homes player side and not server side. That would he helpful for those that want to solo the game. And It is a solid game will it be able to compete? Maybe? I am not over hyped but I am interested.
you have an insane amount of tabs open my boy
ashes of hopes and dreams of gamers.
Been keeping an eye for it. It SOUNDS great, but so far I haven't seen anything to really get me hyped.
I've seen too many "last MMO you'll ever play"s and "WoW killers" die or never get born to be any more optimistic than "I'll wait and see."
@@troodon1096 These "WoW killers" always seems to forget, that people who are playing wow for 5-10 years have a massive investment in the game. Time, money and emotions.
And you have to show something really good, to make them leave all that investment.
The things that worry me about this game is that they seem to be taking a tremendous amount of time on each block: A1, A2. The game is already years in the making and expecting it to cook for another 3 to 4 years. The other issue I have is Intrepid Studios looks like they have enough money to finish this game for release, but they are asking for large one time payments to test their game Alpha - Beta. If they don't show a specific year in which they plan to release soon, I'm going to start thinking it's another Star Citizen.
For me if you said the game is funded, in completition and ask for money it is oveer, also you must never forget the client will not wait forever, 3 or 4 years more, plus cosmetics, yes is another star citizen and like scam citizen people will throw money to them
Seeing how the biggest MMOs have emphasis on story and PvE content, these build your own adventure world games are gonna fall flat a month or so after release.
I remember when it was rift, tera, arch age, black desert, bless
All of them got hyped too much and couldn’t meet expectations
bruh not trying to be negative but bless was so obviously bad from the beginning. if you bought into it, must've been some FOMO or following your favorite streamer or something. just saying in comparison to he other games on the list that one was like wew lad.
@@zegrasisinnocent it's ok I didn't buy in to any of those, only one on that list I've actually played is TERA
@@MoonTone Ahhhh good. was gonna say like damn you're hardcore. I only played Archeage on that list.
Every mmo is the WoW killer, until it releases. At this point the only thing that can kill WoW is Blizzard.
but black desert killed itself. They promised there won't be p2w but broke their promise 2 weeks after it's released
Not going to lie, this game looks about as interesting as a mayonnaise sandwich made of wonderbread.
I lost faith when they showed the initial animations for the mages (the class I usually play) and they were spinning and dancing and twirling all over the place like ballerinas. COmpletely turned me off. THey might change it because the comments were overwhelmingly negative about it but the fact that they made it that way in the first place has me worried they have weeaboos in charge.
@@NoireJin lmao, been more than a year and still no fix, keep dreaming. That suckass animations is what you gonna get.
@@NoireJin I have been following MMO development cycles for about 17 years now.
Do you have any idea I see people saying stuff like "Early Alpha footage! It doesn't mean that's what the animations/UI/Core gameplay loop blah blah blah is really going to look like on launch!!"
Do you want to hazard a guess as to roughly what percentage of them are dead wrong?
@@Sajuek It happens to to developers too. 'Oh don't worry we can change it later, just put it in and we will iterate.' It might happen but you have to convince the team it's higher priority than literally everything else you could do.
@@NoireJin “Don’t worry it’s only beta... Don’t worry its only Alpha” -Every alpha/beta tester for every wow expansion in history, and most if not all MMOs in the last 10 years. MMORPG players are like battered victims that go back to their abuser despite knowing they are going back into an abusive relationship. You are terribly gullible if you believe much will change from Alpha to full release.
Nice video, I'm so hyped with this game.
Alpha tester for ashes here, been doing pre alpha and beta testing for mmo's since 2008 (age of conan then many more since) honestly yes it needs work but thats the point of an alpha, what I will say though is comparing to other games the pre alpha and alpha 1 test phases have not only been more enjoyable (and further along than other game companies claimed for closed beta's) the developers actually listen to input and change the game based on the players needs, wants, and concerns. Rarely have I seen this before, and I am currently testing three upcoming mmo's and rts/survival multiplayer games speaking from my own personal experience ashes is going to be something truly special and I feel nothing but the utmost regret for anyone who won't be joining us to reclaim Verra
When did Josh became such a magazine's cover playboy? I envy his handsomeness!
People: this a wow killer.
Me: i heard this before, and it never does
People need to stop hyping up games as WoW-killers. Just let WoW do its thing and make an MMO setting out to do it's own thing. Only WoW can kill WoW.
to be fair wow killed itself already
@@kblacklabel but then it resurrected itself with Classic. Now that Classic is here, I know for sure I'm not gonna be able to play any other MMO atleast until the end of Classic WotLK
Only the owners of WoW can kill WoW.
@@Sorain1 and they’re trying really hard to kill it lol
This really is a great video, I basically agree with everything you’re saying. For me, just seeing SWG on the “experience list” was amazing, as SWG was, for me, the greatest MMORPG ever. Problem is, today I simply wouldn’t have enough spare time to invest into the game, to enjoy it as much as I did back then. Although I still wish for others to experience something like that.
Are you aware of the SWG Legends server? Has 1000+ people playing daily. I didnt spend much time with swg when it was officially hosted so being able to play it in modern day is really nice.
Guild Wars 2 is the game that checks off basically every point he made when talking about what makes a modern mmo work.
I’m still impressed about how amazing the launch was for GW2 and I think it’s one of the most important moments for an mmo but FF14 had years of a being a total failure of a game to incredibly rise out of its own ashes.
Anything can happen with this new mmo, what the players need to do is show patience and some hindsight. It is easy to tell when developers are actually dedicated versus when it’s time to bail out of the collapsing building.
I back Ashes on the kickstarter and agree with everything said in this video. There's almost zero chance the game will meet expectations on release. Assuming they want to release sometime before 2030 it's highly unlikely they'll be able to complete and polish everything they plan on putting in the game.
My hope is that it's good enough at release to keep people interested while they continue to work on the promised content for later patches.
On the positive side with so many players getting early alpha access they should gave plenty of feedback on what works and what needs to be changed
My two cents... Overhyping a game by the community can actually damage the game and make it seem worse when it comes out.
Just look at cyberpunk... if there were no so much hype.. yes it would come out with problems.. but maybe devs would posponed it more.. and there would not be so much disapointment from the players involved.
Looking forward to the video :D
Cyperpunk was actually a great thing for AoC. Steven has always stated that the game is only going to come out when its ready. Now people see the consequences of rushing a game (see Cyberpunk 2077).
Edit: added clarification
maybe who knows hypothetically, they wouldve launched the game in 2022 or 2023 would be good.
but this game was already in development for 7 freacking years and was the company that hyped the game not the gamers, for fuck sake they bring Keano Reeves to be the sellboy of it, they knew the game would come out shit as fuck and tried to grasp the most money possible before ppl realize how shit it is and stop buying.
Yeah, too much hype is always risky. Especially with games that need no help in being horrible. XD
@@ZephyrorOG Are you aware of the immense amount of over hyping and over promises steven has also made on big platforms? You cant be ignorant to it
yes Hype is both good and bad. TO much Overhyping a game can destroy it when it/if comes out and to little hype can kill it when it comes out due to lack of sales or if its an Indie Dev before they have the funding to start making it if they have a kickstarter or the like.
You would think people learned their lesson about hype since No Man's Sky
The description given for Ashes of Creation sounds like a childhood fantasy of what a game could be, and the problem with those fantasies is that they're so rarely realistic. I hope that this game does well for the sake of diversity and innovation in modern MMOs, but expectations absolutely HAVE to be tempered, especially when such grand claims are being made.