For any of you that do not read Chinese: 神中神: God amongst gods 非常nice: Very nice, or as we know it, BEEG nice 有一定作用: Has some uses 總比沒用強: Better than nothing 無感: No feeling 捏鼻繞著走: Pinch your nose and walk around it 下地獄去吧: Go to hell
Hahaha, the Chinese tier list adds to the experience. Might be useful to add the current patch number in the video title or video description, in case future updates might change the meta.
If you roll a protectionist Industrialist when you've switched to council republic, you can go from Laissez Faire to Cooperative ownership with zero dissaproval. Otherwise it's a minus 20 malus and you're risking a revolt. That is one case where they're useful.
I've been wondering how much one's late game skill really matters, cause I feel like often by at least 1900 you're so ahead of everyone else that it doesn't really matter if you do things optimally or not. Like yeah things like efficiency per labor Vs per construction matter, but how much do you think those kinds of considerations actually affect things?
It depends who you play as. A country with backward laws, low literacy, and poor technology takes a lot longer to get going than some European countries. For a real challenge try playing as Great Qing or Japan. By 1900 you’ll still have a lot to do.
@@lateralus6512 just build 300-500 unis as china and you will be on european tech by 1880 max, probably even faster. Japan is pretty much similar, just starts with worse eco, better literacy and a journal entry to go through
Positivists are awesome when you are on Monarchy and want to go communist. If you have them on the Industrialists and Petit Bourgeoisie they don't rev because they hate both monarchy and council republic equally.
@@pelayla Well if you have a good monarch with cautious for example and have different laws you want to pass getting rid Monarchy isn't my #1 priority.
technocracy is also kinda nice early game before your trade unions have the numbers to be empowered by universal suffrage and so they're pretty nice for getting onto that
I like early game authoritarian as honestly Oligarchy has got to be my 2nd favorite gov type. 100 authority, basically always able to pass laws because of lack of government ideology penalty and government size allowances. With few exceptions it will be one of my early go to law passes because of its ability to rapidly reform all other aspects of the country. Often if land owners roll authoritarian in an autocratic state it can allow one of the easiest ways out of autocracy and a perpetually powerful aristocracy
Oligarchy gives more power to industrialist as it gives more political power to pop's that support them. Technocracy gives more power to Inteligencia,Armed forces and Trade unions as it gives political clout to engineers, officers and academics
@@kingmasterfilip2965 thanks So because generaly the industrialist are too powerful (41%) technocracy would be best ? But I pretty sure that the 33% boost on engineer renforce the industrialist (and we all now before workers movment, their are industrialist)
Technocracy is best because it allows the trade unions to come up and you have a better ballance with a strong intelligentsia. Sometimes its better than voting.
I believe a few adjustments are warranted. Jingoists are an early game blessing to snap out of Peasant Militia and No Colonization on backwards countries but the usefulness end there. It makes no sense to leave it at the same tier as Anarchist, which is a surefire way to get Multiculturalism without requiring the blessing of almighty RNGesus or country-specific JE (it also helps that unlike Humanists and Enlightened Royalists, Anarchists are not awfully rare midgame). You can easily negate the disapproval of everything else by enacting Multiculturalism and use the resulting approval as buffer to find another leader.
The problem is the really backward countries have bigger fish to fry than colonization/don't have the tech on game start. Peasant militia might also be meta now, I gotta test it more. You can consistently roll a Humanitarian/Enlightened royalist, I have a video on how to do it, and start passing multiculturalism within a week of researching Feminism.
@@generalistgaming I believe it's very situational. Asian countries will likely benefit a lot less from Colonization than playing as any centralized african country, on which beelining Colonization is a must. As for Peasant Levies becoming meta, how so? It handicaps every unit to its first available tier, no? Unless you have plenty of POPs to throw into the meat grinder like Great Qing, soon you'll run out of POPs or support to maintain any war. As for rolling Humanitarian/Enlightened Royalist, it requires some healthy cheese. If that's being considered for this list, Moderate ideology should rank a lot higher, no?
Playing on an earlier version of the game where you can sway France and USA will back down for day 1 independence and have Texas win the war, then take Texas and you have coast access.
I was watching one of your streams where you said the the private construction bug was still in the game. I just wanted to ask if you had tried adjusting the government wages when you notice it happening. It seems to reset it for me when I encounter it.
In one of my communist games, i rolled a social democrat PB which kept their approval high enough compared to their other possible ideologies, letting me get their full bonus
@@АртемМакєєв lots of shopkeepers pops getting lots of money probably, i could probably have pushed them out a bit more if i grew the army but by that point thebgame was slow enough and i was waiting on integrating the last of europe, and they wouldnt have posed a real problem until the SocDem lesder died (debug node wouldve put that by the end date anyway) so i was in no rush
I honestly feel like I don't understand late mil tech prioritization all that well tbh, and I need to make the tier list for it (never made it up from the previous wave of tier lists)
I'd probably do a country tier list first, but ranking these is weird. It's probably S tier N German Fed, Germany, and HRE or something? Like what's the criteria for ranking? Percent increase in power? Then it's maybe Italy?
I feel like you underestimated the obnoxiousness of Traditionalist in the very early game, especially on Landowners, you can exile him yes but you're eating a big approval penalty that can hurt a lot. Meanwhile you can't pass public schools because you can't get off state religion
There is at least one ideology thats seems missing on the wiki... idk its name but it is a american unique one that supports homesteading with a wagon or somthing like that as logo. That or I blacked out during the video, which was a great one!
According to the google translate app on my phone, the tiers are like so (named in descending order): God among gods Very nice Has a certain effect Better than useless Indifferent Pick your nose and walk around Go to hell
I really wonder , can you get to 100 SOL for every worker at least at one factory? Or at least max income to the point when capitalists/landowners have 100 SOL
one time protectionist on industrialists is NOT annoying is if you're trying to ram through socialism but your industrialists are strong. they won't support you going from LF to command or coops, but they also won't object
you can't roll a radical landowner normally, but you can through exiling, which is specifically interesting for paraguay who can kick out and reinvite manuel ortiz. sometimes ai paraguay does it and radical manuel ortiz is hanging out in the pool for other countries
for orleanist: ok using an orleanist to pass LF in france is strong. but henri-philippe orleans himself is crucial for enacting monarchy in krakow for the memes
Yeah I'm discounting this, and the heuristic of having everything below them be bad and above be good is pretty nice for organization and making the tier list clear.
I think you're massively overstating the downside of Anarchist. Each "Disagree" is only -1 and each "Strongly Disagree" is -2 so you're getting -2 from Laissez-Faire, -1 from Parliamentary Republic, and -1 from Dedicated Police Force. Meanwhile you're also getting +1 from Right of Assembly or +2 from Protected Speech, and don't forget +2 from Multiculturalism even after the +20 bonus for passing it in the first place decays. So it's a wash if you have Universal Suffrage and Protected Speech, and you can even pass those laws to further appease the Anarchist IG. If you're bricking your Trade Unions' trait bonuses I'm dubious that the Anarchist's negative stances are at fault there. Besides which, you want Anarchists more on the Rural Folk since it's the only way to override Isolationist.
@@generalistgaming You can force an Anarchist through the same method, and earlier too (Anarchist requires only one Era 3 tech, Humanitarian requires two). There are also scripted events that create Anarchists whereas there aren't for Humanitarians (I guess there's the Brazil specific one that makes Isabela an Enlightened Royalist but you saw yourself in your Brazil playthrough how awkward it is to exploit that one, and in any case it's no use if you aren't Brazil). Besides which, none of this has anything to do with whether rolling an Anarchist bricks your Solidarity or Propaganists, which I'll again argue it simply doesn't. It works out to maybe a -2 or -3 from laws at worst (and realistically less than that) which is not hard to overcome and the fact that Humanitarian is better at most only justifies Anarchist being A tier rather than S. I'd still put it in S tier myself, though, you said yourself how strong Multiculturalism is and this outshines everything else about Anarchist even when there are alternative options.
Yeah but the point is that you force the other two instead, because they're better. If the other two didn't exist anarchist would be easy S tier. So I feel it's kind of a miss for timeliness.@@dryhad9253
@@generalistgaming They're better by a matter of degrees, only justifying Anarchist to be one tier lower at most, certainly not two. My point is the only downside you talk about in the video for Anarchist is really not the problem you seem to think it is and in most gamestates will not even be noticable. Also, if you have an influential Rural Folk then Anarchist is in fact better to the extent that you can roll it on your RF when you can't roll Humanitarian.
Isn't this a huge failure by paradox though? I think it would be better if all paths in terms of policies were pretty much equally viable, just depends on what you wanna do that game.
I don't think so. Some policies just have/had a bigger impact on economy and SoL than others and the game, trying to be the simulation that it is, should reflect this. Not banning your industrie should result in better economic growth than bannig your industrie. Not being a bastard should give you higher migration than having an ethnostate (and that migration and anti-discrimination laws are good for the economie and higher SoL has been known for a very long time at this point). So playing as a significantly backwards nation should be harder imo. In this context, having character ideologies of different usefullnes is also more of a feature than a bug, providing you with either temporary opportunites that you need to take advantage of (f.e. humanitarian) or posing as temporary obsticals that need to be overcome (f.e. traditionalist)
I mean I think they're making a game that is more simulation than balance oriented. The laws don't have to be balanced, and can't really if they want to simulate the century. The nations certainly aren't balanced
For any of you that do not read Chinese:
神中神: God amongst gods
非常nice: Very nice, or as we know it, BEEG nice
有一定作用: Has some uses
總比沒用強: Better than nothing
無感: No feeling
捏鼻繞著走: Pinch your nose and walk around it
下地獄去吧: Go to hell
谢谢你, 我不知道多的汉字. Hope that's correct, thank you for the explanation. BASED.
Hahaha, the Chinese tier list adds to the experience.
Might be useful to add the current patch number in the video title or video description, in case future updates might change the meta.
我们很开心|
If I redo the tier list I'll put the patch there
If you roll a protectionist Industrialist when you've switched to council republic, you can go from Laissez Faire to Cooperative ownership with zero dissaproval. Otherwise it's a minus 20 malus and you're risking a revolt. That is one case where they're useful.
That's true, yeah
With Generalist living by a highway and me living by an airport, I get the best of two worlds when watching these.
9:40 when you research Corporatism, they replace Pious ideologies with Corporatism.
Also, 14:55 Enlightened Royalists do like Women’s Suffrage.
The inclusion of the moderate in the 'better than nothing' tier is one of those instances of irony that I like.
Oof
He didn’t know that at the time.
I've been wondering how much one's late game skill really matters, cause I feel like often by at least 1900 you're so ahead of everyone else that it doesn't really matter if you do things optimally or not. Like yeah things like efficiency per labor Vs per construction matter, but how much do you think those kinds of considerations actually affect things?
It doesn't matter much. I am interested more from a theoretical perspective than a practical one. The ai is extremely weak.
It depends who you play as. A country with backward laws, low literacy, and poor technology takes a lot longer to get going than some European countries. For a real challenge try playing as Great Qing or Japan. By 1900 you’ll still have a lot to do.
@@lateralus6512 just build 300-500 unis as china and you will be on european tech by 1880 max, probably even faster. Japan is pretty much similar, just starts with worse eco, better literacy and a journal entry to go through
Its matter for GDP. Line go UP
@@gorelovelive5022 Ok I’ve not tried building anywhere near that many universities as Great Qing. I’ll give it a go on my next run.
Beligum i think can start with the landowners having the ideology reformer
Positivists are awesome when you are on Monarchy and want to go communist. If you have them on the Industrialists and Petit Bourgeoisie they don't rev because they hate both monarchy and council republic equally.
ideally you're not on monarchy by the time you're switching to council republic, though
@@pelayla Well if you have a good monarch with cautious for example and have different laws you want to pass getting rid Monarchy isn't my #1 priority.
technocracy is also kinda nice early game before your trade unions have the numbers to be empowered by universal suffrage and so they're pretty nice for getting onto that
@@pelaylaWell monarchy is one of the easier ones to get off of, going from parliamentary to council could be quite a bit harder
I like early game authoritarian as honestly Oligarchy has got to be my 2nd favorite gov type. 100 authority, basically always able to pass laws because of lack of government ideology penalty and government size allowances. With few exceptions it will be one of my early go to law passes because of its ability to rapidly reform all other aspects of the country.
Often if land owners roll authoritarian in an autocratic state it can allow one of the easiest ways out of autocracy and a perpetually powerful aristocracy
What is better between oligarchy and technocracy ? because I like the authority and the -10 ideologie bonus
Oligarchy gives more power to industrialist as it gives more political power to pop's that support them.
Technocracy gives more power to Inteligencia,Armed forces and Trade unions as it gives political clout to engineers, officers and academics
@@kingmasterfilip2965 thanks
So because generaly the industrialist are too powerful (41%) technocracy would be best ?
But I pretty sure that the 33% boost on engineer renforce the industrialist (and we all now before workers movment, their are industrialist)
Technocracy is best because it allows the trade unions to come up and you have a better ballance with a strong intelligentsia. Sometimes its better than voting.
technocracy though it's generally a bit hard to get onto, best method I've found is getting a positivist in power
Techno, but that's usually hard to pass and not worth really. You can demarginalize TU
I believe a few adjustments are warranted. Jingoists are an early game blessing to snap out of Peasant Militia and No Colonization on backwards countries but the usefulness end there. It makes no sense to leave it at the same tier as Anarchist, which is a surefire way to get Multiculturalism without requiring the blessing of almighty RNGesus or country-specific JE (it also helps that unlike Humanists and Enlightened Royalists, Anarchists are not awfully rare midgame). You can easily negate the disapproval of everything else by enacting Multiculturalism and use the resulting approval as buffer to find another leader.
The problem is the really backward countries have bigger fish to fry than colonization/don't have the tech on game start. Peasant militia might also be meta now, I gotta test it more. You can consistently roll a Humanitarian/Enlightened royalist, I have a video on how to do it, and start passing multiculturalism within a week of researching Feminism.
@@generalistgaming I believe it's very situational. Asian countries will likely benefit a lot less from Colonization than playing as any centralized african country, on which beelining Colonization is a must.
As for Peasant Levies becoming meta, how so? It handicaps every unit to its first available tier, no? Unless you have plenty of POPs to throw into the meat grinder like Great Qing, soon you'll run out of POPs or support to maintain any war.
As for rolling Humanitarian/Enlightened Royalist, it requires some healthy cheese. If that's being considered for this list, Moderate ideology should rank a lot higher, no?
What's the best strategy for going for the American Territory achievement?
Playing on an earlier version of the game where you can sway France and USA will back down for day 1 independence and have Texas win the war, then take Texas and you have coast access.
Take a shot everytime he says "timeliness perspective"
I was watching one of your streams where you said the the private construction bug was still in the game. I just wanted to ask if you had tried adjusting the government wages when you notice it happening. It seems to reset it for me when I encounter it.
In one of my communist games, i rolled a social democrat PB which kept their approval high enough compared to their other possible ideologies, letting me get their full bonus
How were they not marginalized?
@@АртемМакєєв lots of shopkeepers pops getting lots of money probably, i could probably have pushed them out a bit more if i grew the army but by that point thebgame was slow enough and i was waiting on integrating the last of europe, and they wouldnt have posed a real problem until the SocDem lesder died (debug node wouldve put that by the end date anyway) so i was in no rush
Ah, that does seem pretty useful. Radical PB is often super sweet
when are we getting the late game military tech tier list
I honestly feel like I don't understand late mil tech prioritization all that well tbh, and I need to make the tier list for it (never made it up from the previous wave of tier lists)
Could you make formables tier list or cultures based on traits list?
I'd probably do a country tier list first, but ranking these is weird. It's probably S tier N German Fed, Germany, and HRE or something? Like what's the criteria for ranking? Percent increase in power? Then it's maybe Italy?
Countries are not really unique enough to rate them
Question: how do you get the labor union ig de marginalized if my avg SO is only 10 even though i have the society techs and got rid of peasants?
universal suffrage
I feel like you underestimated the obnoxiousness of Traditionalist in the very early game, especially on Landowners, you can exile him yes but you're eating a big approval penalty that can hurt a lot. Meanwhile you can't pass public schools because you can't get off state religion
Maybe - I do mention that I feel that the sub medium guys are probably not correctly ordered.
There is at least one ideology thats seems missing on the wiki... idk its name but it is a american unique one that supports homesteading with a wagon or somthing like that as logo. That or I blacked out during the video, which was a great one!
you mean the andrew jackson thing?
You talk about Jeffersonian ideology?
That's not a character ideology. Its an ig ideology.
According to the google translate app on my phone, the tiers are like so (named in descending order):
God among gods
Very nice
Has a certain effect
Better than useless
Indifferent
Pick your nose and walk around
Go to hell
Make SoL maxing tutorial
I really wonder , can you get to 100 SOL for every worker at least at one factory? Or at least max income to the point when capitalists/landowners have 100 SOL
I gotta test unbugged migration first because that's the biggest reason to go SoL
Good stuff👍
Thanks 👍
gg with ANOTHER banger
one time protectionist on industrialists is NOT annoying is if you're trying to ram through socialism but your industrialists are strong. they won't support you going from LF to command or coops, but they also won't object
you can't roll a radical landowner normally, but you can through exiling, which is specifically interesting for paraguay who can kick out and reinvite manuel ortiz. sometimes ai paraguay does it and radical manuel ortiz is hanging out in the pool for other countries
for orleanist: ok using an orleanist to pass LF in france is strong. but henri-philippe orleans himself is crucial for enacting monarchy in krakow for the memes
Imho but moderate ideology is best , cause you can roll literally any ideology by exiling them
You can't roll literally any ideology, it's just the ideologies you can roll are not gated by IG
Yeah I'm discounting this, and the heuristic of having everything below them be bad and above be good is pretty nice for organization and making the tier list clear.
Industry banned eic?
Maaaybe. Low key want to do an EIEIC run
Why is it in chinese?
和
you got that chinese tier list
我们很开心
The other one had scuffed images
Omegalol bro does know he has some ramdon viewers from china and from hk on yt as well.
我们很开心
I think you're massively overstating the downside of Anarchist. Each "Disagree" is only -1 and each "Strongly Disagree" is -2 so you're getting -2 from Laissez-Faire, -1 from Parliamentary Republic, and -1 from Dedicated Police Force. Meanwhile you're also getting +1 from Right of Assembly or +2 from Protected Speech, and don't forget +2 from Multiculturalism even after the +20 bonus for passing it in the first place decays. So it's a wash if you have Universal Suffrage and Protected Speech, and you can even pass those laws to further appease the Anarchist IG. If you're bricking your Trade Unions' trait bonuses I'm dubious that the Anarchist's negative stances are at fault there.
Besides which, you want Anarchists more on the Rural Folk since it's the only way to override Isolationist.
The thing is that you can force a Humanitarian/E. Royalist so consistently
@@generalistgaming You can force an Anarchist through the same method, and earlier too (Anarchist requires only one Era 3 tech, Humanitarian requires two). There are also scripted events that create Anarchists whereas there aren't for Humanitarians (I guess there's the Brazil specific one that makes Isabela an Enlightened Royalist but you saw yourself in your Brazil playthrough how awkward it is to exploit that one, and in any case it's no use if you aren't Brazil).
Besides which, none of this has anything to do with whether rolling an Anarchist bricks your Solidarity or Propaganists, which I'll again argue it simply doesn't. It works out to maybe a -2 or -3 from laws at worst (and realistically less than that) which is not hard to overcome and the fact that Humanitarian is better at most only justifies Anarchist being A tier rather than S. I'd still put it in S tier myself, though, you said yourself how strong Multiculturalism is and this outshines everything else about Anarchist even when there are alternative options.
Yeah but the point is that you force the other two instead, because they're better. If the other two didn't exist anarchist would be easy S tier. So I feel it's kind of a miss for timeliness.@@dryhad9253
@@generalistgaming They're better by a matter of degrees, only justifying Anarchist to be one tier lower at most, certainly not two. My point is the only downside you talk about in the video for Anarchist is really not the problem you seem to think it is and in most gamestates will not even be noticable. Also, if you have an influential Rural Folk then Anarchist is in fact better to the extent that you can roll it on your RF when you can't roll Humanitarian.
Isn't this a huge failure by paradox though? I think it would be better if all paths in terms of policies were pretty much equally viable, just depends on what you wanna do that game.
I don't think so. Some policies just have/had a bigger impact on economy and SoL than others and the game, trying to be the simulation that it is, should reflect this. Not banning your industrie should result in better economic growth than bannig your industrie. Not being a bastard should give you higher migration than having an ethnostate (and that migration and anti-discrimination laws are good for the economie and higher SoL has been known for a very long time at this point). So playing as a significantly backwards nation should be harder imo.
In this context, having character ideologies of different usefullnes is also more of a feature than a bug, providing you with either temporary opportunites that you need to take advantage of (f.e. humanitarian) or posing as temporary obsticals that need to be overcome (f.e. traditionalist)
I mean I think they're making a game that is more simulation than balance oriented. The laws don't have to be balanced, and can't really if they want to simulate the century. The nations certainly aren't balanced
I love Marxism ❤