I bought a 4 ton air to water h/p with 80 gal. buffer, no fittings or extras direct from china, delivered to home, usa, $3500. heating guy here so did myself, I use a regular thermostat outside to trigger oil boiler, which h/p is hooked into, when o/d temp is under 40F. as unit is a little under sized, and quicker heat recovery. works great in shoulder months.
Great video, thanks for sharing your experience. 4630kWh for heating/cooling over a full year. To put it into context, was the heat pump providing 100% of the heat for your home or did you have other heat sources? What climate zone are you in? What temp do you keep your house at? Do you have oil usage to compare to from previous years? Is the heat pump providing your domestic hot water? Is the heat pump only running the 3 fan coils or do you have radiators/baseboard also? Finally, around what temperature water do you have the heat pump set to? I'm guessing its based on outdoor temperature since you have the fancy controller, so around 32F what water temperature do you use? Those things will influence how close you get to those manufacturer published specs. Great job and thanks again for sharing!
Great questions! The heat pump is servicing about 1/3 of our house, with the oil boiler still servicing the rest. We also have a wood stove that we use most weekends throughout the winter. We are in zone 5 in Connecticut. The portion of the house served by the heat pump is kept around 70 degrees all the time. We do have oil usage, the bar graph I showed around 9:18 shows our oil usage in orange and total household electricity use in blue. Total energy usage has not changed much, just shifted from oil to electricity. The heat pump is not providing any DHW right now, just running three fan coils. We will be expanding with more fan coils and radiant floors in the next few years. You are correct, I am using outdoor reset control for the water setpoint. Its about 105F at 32 degrees, maxing out at 120F at design temp of 2 degrees. I actually want to get a boiler plumbed in so I can run warmer water (up to 140 or so) and turn off the heat pump when outside temp gets down below maybe 15 degrees. The HBX controller has this capability built in. I hope to have better data collection next winter to directly measure temperatures and calculate actual efficiency. Thanks for watching!!
Oh man, that really added up! I'm glad you did the calculations to show that you really are saving money in the long run, but boy, I hope you never have to spend all that money ever again!!
I spent about $20K before tax credits for an air to air system at about the same time, so the price is not too shocking. But in just equipment costs per the invoice, about $12.5K. I'm in Colorado and had a gas forced air system. The Mitsubishi system is called 4 ton but really 54,000 BTU/hr. It has a matching air handler. Over a year, it uses about 6200 kWh for the heat pump and about 950 kWh for the air handler. Maybe 75% of that usage is heat, and really influenced by the amount of time under 10 degrees F. It works down to -20F but works really hard.
Good reference data, thanks for sharing that. Hydronic equipment is certainly more expensive. If we had ducting in our house we would definitely have done that. I think we will do a hybrid fuel approach to use our boiler when the heat pump struggles to keep up in the coldest weather. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for sharing. Looking at the slope of your iotawatt chart - looks like a little less power consumption in summer. Would be cool to see outside temp vs kwh. btw iotawatt is great - has influxdb integration which works well with grafana for much faster data parsing. Just pita to learn grafana.
Yes, summertime usage is definitely less. I intend to get temperature data on outdoor temp and heat pump inlet and outlet temps so I can calculate actual efficiency. I'll definitely check out grafana, thanks for the tip!
@@betweentwobrooks FWIW - iotstack>RPi5 was easiest to get server setup with mqtt/infux/grafana/node red. I had zero interest figuring all that out on its own and node-red for some next level data acq - eg arduino temp>mqtt>influx so I could mix my boiler data across sources in grafana. I hated figuring it all out but very glad I did now.
I'll be sure to check out your play list as there isn't much out there for A2W heat pump installations in North America. Comments: it seems like A2W systems in North America are less common and more expensive than the ones I see people getting in England and other places in Europe where they are much more common. The brands are more mainstream (e.g. Daikin & Mitsubishi) while A@W systems here are seen as niche. I'm in the process of buying a house with a 20 year old gas boiler & indirect water heater (no air conditioning) and I'm seriously considering going all electric as well as I can put solar on my roof. $$$-wise for a "5-ton" system the equipment cost isn't so shocking as I was quoted $20k for a 2-ton replacement a/c gas furnace.
Saving money was never a primary goal. Replacing our failing boiler, getting rid of our failing oil tank, discontinuing use of our failing chimney, and adding central air conditioning were the main goals. This is the first step to accomplish that. Much better than spending $20k+ on a traditional air conditioning system and still having to fix all the old oil infrastructure...
I bought a 4 ton air to water h/p with 80 gal. buffer, no fittings or extras direct from china, delivered to home, usa, $3500. heating guy here so did myself, I use a regular thermostat outside to trigger oil boiler, which h/p is hooked into, when o/d temp is under 40F. as unit is a little under sized, and quicker heat recovery. works great in shoulder months.
Thank you for the detailed information. You saved all the labor cost also.
Yes, labor cost would have been very high too. Thanks for watching!
Great video, thanks for sharing your experience. 4630kWh for heating/cooling over a full year. To put it into context, was the heat pump providing 100% of the heat for your home or did you have other heat sources? What climate zone are you in? What temp do you keep your house at? Do you have oil usage to compare to from previous years? Is the heat pump providing your domestic hot water? Is the heat pump only running the 3 fan coils or do you have radiators/baseboard also? Finally, around what temperature water do you have the heat pump set to? I'm guessing its based on outdoor temperature since you have the fancy controller, so around 32F what water temperature do you use? Those things will influence how close you get to those manufacturer published specs. Great job and thanks again for sharing!
Great questions! The heat pump is servicing about 1/3 of our house, with the oil boiler still servicing the rest. We also have a wood stove that we use most weekends throughout the winter. We are in zone 5 in Connecticut. The portion of the house served by the heat pump is kept around 70 degrees all the time. We do have oil usage, the bar graph I showed around 9:18 shows our oil usage in orange and total household electricity use in blue. Total energy usage has not changed much, just shifted from oil to electricity. The heat pump is not providing any DHW right now, just running three fan coils. We will be expanding with more fan coils and radiant floors in the next few years. You are correct, I am using outdoor reset control for the water setpoint. Its about 105F at 32 degrees, maxing out at 120F at design temp of 2 degrees. I actually want to get a boiler plumbed in so I can run warmer water (up to 140 or so) and turn off the heat pump when outside temp gets down below maybe 15 degrees. The HBX controller has this capability built in. I hope to have better data collection next winter to directly measure temperatures and calculate actual efficiency. Thanks for watching!!
Oh man, that really added up! I'm glad you did the calculations to show that you really are saving money in the long run, but boy, I hope you never have to spend all that money ever again!!
Agreed! Thanks for watching!
I spent about $20K before tax credits for an air to air system at about the same time, so the price is not too shocking. But in just equipment costs per the invoice, about $12.5K. I'm in Colorado and had a gas forced air system. The Mitsubishi system is called 4 ton but really 54,000 BTU/hr. It has a matching air handler. Over a year, it uses about 6200 kWh for the heat pump and about 950 kWh for the air handler. Maybe 75% of that usage is heat, and really influenced by the amount of time under 10 degrees F. It works down to -20F but works really hard.
Good reference data, thanks for sharing that. Hydronic equipment is certainly more expensive. If we had ducting in our house we would definitely have done that. I think we will do a hybrid fuel approach to use our boiler when the heat pump struggles to keep up in the coldest weather. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for sharing. Looking at the slope of your iotawatt chart - looks like a little less power consumption in summer. Would be cool to see outside temp vs kwh. btw iotawatt is great - has influxdb integration which works well with grafana for much faster data parsing. Just pita to learn grafana.
Yes, summertime usage is definitely less. I intend to get temperature data on outdoor temp and heat pump inlet and outlet temps so I can calculate actual efficiency. I'll definitely check out grafana, thanks for the tip!
@@betweentwobrooks FWIW - iotstack>RPi5 was easiest to get server setup with mqtt/infux/grafana/node red.
I had zero interest figuring all that out on its own and node-red for some next level data acq - eg arduino temp>mqtt>influx so I could mix my boiler data across sources in grafana.
I hated figuring it all out but very glad I did now.
This is great info! I recently set up a RP with NodeRed, I will definitely look into this with iotawatt
I'll be sure to check out your play list as there isn't much out there for A2W heat pump installations in North America.
Comments: it seems like A2W systems in North America are less common and more expensive than the ones I see people getting in England and other places in Europe where they are much more common. The brands are more mainstream (e.g. Daikin & Mitsubishi) while A@W systems here are seen as niche. I'm in the process of buying a house with a 20 year old gas boiler & indirect water heater (no air conditioning) and I'm seriously considering going all electric as well as I can put solar on my roof.
$$$-wise for a "5-ton" system the equipment cost isn't so shocking as I was quoted $20k for a 2-ton replacement a/c gas furnace.
Thanks for watching!
So you used to pay $35.38 / MMBtu, and after spending $22,000 you pay $33.79 / MMBtu? So you only save $65 a year after spending $22,000?
Saving money was never a primary goal. Replacing our failing boiler, getting rid of our failing oil tank, discontinuing use of our failing chimney, and adding central air conditioning were the main goals. This is the first step to accomplish that. Much better than spending $20k+ on a traditional air conditioning system and still having to fix all the old oil infrastructure...
I had the same question, but figured it had multiple purposes and therefore was a one and done type project. @betweentwobrooks