Hi mate, I just wanted to let you know I only recently got into MESBG after playing 40k and heresy for years and your channel has been a big help in learning all the stuff I've needed to get started. I have a small mordor army and I got my mate the isengard battlehost for his birthday, we played our first game the other night and had an absolute blast, some of the most fun I've had playing a wargame in a long time. We played scanario 4 - burn the supplies and after a very intense fight in the middle it was a draw all round as we were both broken by the final turn, but not before a very dramatic duel between Saruman and The Witch King. MESBG is such a unique wargame with so much cool stuff in it, thanks for all your content as its been instrumental in getting into this game.
Totally agree that the Fellowship characters need tuning up. Especially Legolas, Strider, and Gandalf. I got to play on your terrain, Kingdom of Saxonia, the other day. It was amazing! Really thematic and played exceptionally well. My playgroup is printing your other sets as well!
Legolas is allied in so many lists cause he is very good. Gandalf and Aragorn are situational, but they were back then balanced for the scenarios and this they still done fine.
Wow that Nazthak profile seems really fun. I think while in most games he probably can not pull off crazy shenanigans, the fact that he can steal the wargear before it can be passed on should make him pretty good at dealing with enemy banners. And if you end up not needing the banner or not wanting the dueling penalty you just discard it.
Host of the witch-king is kinda how I was already playing Angmar, now it is a lot stronger even, so that's definitely gonna be nice to play for the one tournament when I can haha
Totally agree that in light of these modern models, the heros we all love from the films definitely need a buff. Hopefully that's resolved in the new edition.
Great video as always Jacob - I gotta say, if you compare Eanur and Aldrach, is that if you compare these guys to Eomer, they're either "pretty good" in the comparison (Eanur will be about the same price as Eomer, but will be base F6/C6 with -2 Fate, but has a lance vs. Eomer's +1S from an army bonus and +1 To Wound if Eowyn/Theoden has died). That's not a bad comparison all told. Aldrach . . . well, his base cost is basically the same as a mounted Eomer and without any Legion bonuses, he seems markedly worse. I honestly think he'd be better in the 60-80pt range as a 2A/2 Wound hero, as you recommended.
Thanks for explaining that the supplement will immediately be null and void. The most GW thing ever. This mixed with their absolute insane pricing on the new models is gonna turn so many people off of this line up. Apart from the heroes I know I probably won't be buying much this time.
Games Workshop was very transparent with this supplement release, it wasn't the plan but the books were printed and it allowed people to finish their collection. People have been saying that the new models were expensive but the werewolves still sold out almost instantly so the price is clearly justified to a large portion of the audience.
@@ConquestCreations I do get it, but it's so frustrating that (myself included) we act like their pricing is okay. I also worry that now the game has their attention again it's going to become less balanced.
@@ConquestCreationsI dunno bro…. The werewolves etc selling out is a product of supply and demand. GW aren’t exactly known for having a great volume of supply lol.
@@shammytheshamrock With War of the Rohirim and later Gollum releasing we are going to see a ton of new models and rules over the next few years, rules imbalance is going to happen unfortunately (at least initially). New life being breathed into the game is good for everyone though ultimately
There is also Lord of the Rings Online: Shadows of Angmar (which was the MMO's title at launch and it focused on a resurgent Angmar) and also War in the North (which again focuses on a resurgent Angmar at time when they're believed to be destroyed).
So happy that you can get the arnor warriors and all the old minatures that were soo expensive. Like the dunedain. I will get me all the old ones that were gone.
Thanks for the amazing content!!! A friend of mine is looking at getting into MESBG and is interested in angmar and arnor so this video helped him get a taste of the new profiles coming out. A quick question, GW said that with the new edition all previous supplements will be invalidated. Does this mean profiles from those supplements, e.g. these new ones or ones from other supplements like elfhelm, will become invalid to play or will these profiles be added to the main army book?
I get what you mean when you say that the Fellowship heroes should be the beef cake of the game. There's always been power creep in GW games, and that's why I'm always a bit skeptical whenever there's a bit too much attention to the game. On the plus side, there's a new edition coming up, so there's a good chance of rebalance!
I'm not sure what you mean by bigger (like physically?) but I really like when they create new profiles / heroes that are more powerful than the characters we know and love from the Fellowship. I think the idea that the Fellowship consists of the absolute most elite heroes in Middle Earth waters everything down. I didn't get the sense that the likes of Gimli, Legolas, and Boromir out-class _all_ the other heroes / villains of Middle Earth, even if they are very heroic. It makes things more interesting for them to encounter equally (or more so) powerful characters, and it raises the stakes of the story. If they were all god tier heroes like book Glorfindel I think it would have been a boring story. But that's just my take, to each their own.
Yeah I definitely don't feel the warlord is too much. In comparison to the actually legendary leading heroes of LOTR he is not that strong, he is not that strong compared to Eomer, Imrahil, Elessar, Elrond, Dain, Glorfindel etc. and also he features in several of the games that are about the rising of Angmar so he is kinda relevant. I actually don't like it so much that Legolas is so over the top in the movies (killing a mumak, running up a bridge which is collapsing block by block) so I like that his profile is more toned down.
Yes the fellowship is based on bravery; friendship; that they have something to fight for...not necessarily simply being the toughest and mightiest heroes of the time or of each race. It simplifies the story and takes something from the meaning of the story to say the fellowship are stronger than everyone else. Their sacrifice makes them legendary.
100% agree, the fellowship are great heroes of their time but their real strength lies in the fact that they are a tight knit alliance of guys that have each other's backs.
Elladan and Elrohir are noted as fighting alongside and being with Arathorn when he makes his last stand and dies and yet its been missed again. Previously you could not even ally the two together properly as it was a yellow combo...
How much longer will the late pledge for Tor Ithilas be open? I'm a college student who has to wait a few more paychecks before I can afford it but I love the terrain and would love to support the channel.
Definitely with you on this one Jacob! Throughout game releases it came to the top over and over again that e.g OG fellowship of the ring consists of sissy little girls that are NO match to MADE up characters which is super NOT cool 😓
My biggest dissapointment rules-wise is the breaking of the unified and logic "humanoid stats". It has happened a few times before, but I liked that all humanoids are base S3 and D3 (and heroes base D4), and then armors and shields add to that. This allows not only for balance but also to easily remember stats just by looking at the mini. And some exceptions like dwarves being base D4 were understandable. But now we have these shirtless carn dun men being D4 base with no justification at all. I hope in the next edition they don't do away with that unifying characteristic like in the other GW games.
Nazthak killing just normal warriors and stealing some wargear is also interesting. He could easily get heavy armor and the shield putting him up to D7. Plus all the fun special stuff from named heros. Also maybe grab a spear first so he can fight and be at less risk. 😂 So many fun options.
Great vid. Thanks for running through everything. 100% agree rangers of the north just arnt good enough with only fight 4. Definitely need to be fight 5 for the cost of them. Or some rule of fight 5 if within 6 inches of army leader or something similar. Its a shame because i love the rangers but they just struggle to win fights
Interesting that GW say this wasn't their plan, wonder if this was meant to release much earlier? Or maybe even they didn't anticipate getting War of the Rohirim so early.
We don't have all the details but I reckon this was supposed to come 1 year after the Defence of the North around when the Glorfindel model was released. I think there was a delay as Games Workshop renegotiated thier deal with New Line to get the rights to future Lord of the Rings Film releases
i look at the likes of rutabi being good because rhun isnt a land weve really explored in the books and actual lore, so its possible that warriors on the same level to the fellowship exist outside of that part of middle earth that wouldnt have been heard of, so i guess it works in that regards. still i do agree they shouldnt be trumping the main characters
Agree on Aldrac hurting the theme of the game. Stats sound like some legendary hero. He's gonna mow through loads more enemies than Glorfindel for example. Bad...
"Man Who Reads Book" is once again a pillar of the community. His April fools joke day video when the title was Man(whore)eads Books was fucking hilarious lol.
My angmar army that’s been in progress for errr a few years might finally get themselves together…to fight all the other angmar armies that will probably start popping up 😂
I also thought the Shadow of Rhudaur has F5 and Naztak has F4 (the same as normal orc captains). The Shadow of Rhudaur could at least work with F3 in some debuffed way but Naztak becomes complete trash with F3. I guess some of the profiles on tabletopadmiral are incorrect.
Thanks for the comment, I would be super surprised if they changed it. In 40k it makes sense where you have Titan weapons and Gretchen running around on the same battle field but in Middle Earth where the biggest difference is a Hobbit to a troll I don't think as much differentiation is needed
I'm not convinced that the Shade shooting debuff will be that impactful, I am new so I don't have as much experience, but so far out of 4 games, shooting has killed one horse and 2 unshielded orcs.
How do these new legendary legions make you feel about upcoming changes? With so much player choice being lost (even among green alliances, i doubt im running galadrial, theoden and grimbold anytime soon) do you think this new army building format will hold up with current players?
Thanks for the question. I'm really excited for the changes to army building. All of the armies that I play are thematic so I'm not loosing any choices and I'm gaining special rules that will make my armies reflect the theme even better. I think these legendary legions all seem pretty well balanced. The Arbor one is definitely the strongest and the rest look to sit middle to bottom of the pack in terms of power (not based on playing with or against them, just my precursory thoughts, could change when they are in use). It gives me a lot of hope for what we will see in the new rules.
I would like to kindly disagree about the fellowship. The reason for the fellowship was to be hidden and secert. It was meant not to have mighty heroes or else it would have not been in secret because sauron was keeping tabs on all the epic heroes of Middle Earth. Sauron was expecting all the grwat heroes to band together to defeat him. But the reason why the fellowship worked becuase it was not made up of people was expecting.
I totally agree, I was a bit surprised by their rules. I was expecting them to be in the 50-60 point mark and be similar to an ogre only with a 10" movement
Technically Arvedui *should* have poor stats, he was the prophesised last king, a generally not great king, and a man who ultimately lost the hope of Arnor. Arvedui should suck - but Arnor definitely needs a boost. It needs a Hero of Legend who can genuinely carry, that or it needs siege engines or something. Angmar is all about monsters and terror and Arnor is, while thematic, on a rules level simply so outmatched. Witch-king, the Tainted, Dwimmerlaik, Gulvahar, Hill Trolls, a shit load of Spirits with an army rule that makes Spirits insanely effective, and now a whole new subfaction that is led by an astonishing beatstick, as well as being given ANOTHER Spirit Hero and an Orc that can wield items his foes drop. It just isn't fair. EDIT: Y'ask me GW should just invent an Arnorian commander. Have him be a friend of literally any of the named Arnorians, have him serve dutifully with Arvedui, have him be famously injured by a Nazgul, have him be the Arnorian commander during the Siege of Fornost, etc. The third guy alongside Glorfindel and Erendur, yknow? Easy to justify an over 100pt character at that point
worried that the characters being made for the animation are gonna be like arzog and bolg super strong super powerful but they are just made that way to bring hype and attention towards the animation thats being made and ofc GW will capitalize on it and make big bank but these new characters that we havent heard of before but all out of nowhere are super strong pointing at the cheftain aldrac, im a little worried 😯 😯
"It makes the Carn dum model pack really good value"💀. You can mayby say that for the first pack were you use the options. After that they are just way to expensiv for regular warriors.
How strict would you be about the scavenge rule when the enemy model was killed in a fight with Nazthak+friends? Only if Nazthak personally dealt the final blow?
That's how the rule reads to me, though they could definitely have been more clear about it. It says: when Nazthak kills an enemy; not: when an enemy dies in a combat he's involved in, or some such. I would read it as literally as possible.
Are the profile stats on tabletopadmiral really all correct? According to some other reviews from people who already read the book the Shadow of Rhudaur is F5. I also don't understand why Naztak is F3. It should be F4 as with every other orc captain. He becomes complete trash because of his F3 I think. The extra point of might doesn't change much here if he dies first round to two F3 Rohan warriors f.e.
For the Carn Dum models, I really hope they get some buffs that reflect the changes in the new addition. As for our current edition, I think the basic Captain of Carn Dum is super underrated. With +1 to wound (against enemy heroes) he can really punch above his weight class. Now can he take on Celeborn, Dain, Bard, or Aragorn? No... But cheaper heroes under 100 points he can really give them a whooping. Aranarth, Faramir, Argadir, Gamling, Lurtz... This guy can really give them a hard time for only 55 points...
I dunno about other people but I’ll be using proxies for the werewolves. They are pretty generic, recycled from Gothmog’s warg and silly price for just two. I’m not a fan of GWs half assed two packs. They should at least make 4 for conversions.Even if you buy those two, you are gunna have to convert a load or proxy. At which point you are asking yourself why you didn’t just proxy entirely. Sure, the pre-order sold out but we don’t know the supply. GW aren’t known for their ability to create supply.
@@jarrodstubbs7415 you are totally right they are changing it for the new edition. the army lists in this book will be over ruled by the new edition. It is unfortunate timing that this book will have a short lifespan but Games Workshop was very transparent with it not being the original plan, and that this book was delayed
I think there is a decent chance that they move into legends. Keep in mind that this isn't removing them! They will still be allowed at heaps of events and in all casual play
Its not unfortunate timing...gw time everything like a wizard... everything and anything arrives precisely when they mean it too. Good review though and it seems a nice thematic book. It will be interesting to see how these units operate in the new edition, if they even are kept.
I’m fine with the Carn dum models but it is very unthematic and dumb that they have D5 with no armour modelled on them. To me it screams classic GW making rules to sell new models.
I do agree that the fellowship characters like Legoland and aragon need to be a lot stronger compared to these made up characters. I think that the heroes need to be buffed but I also think that many of the named characters like the Witch King need better combat profiles to fit their lore counterparts. This would also let some of the special characters that are made up fill more niche roles while letting real characters allow for powerful gameplay
I love your channel but I have to disagree with you on one point: The Morghul Blade is awful! The Witch King should never be in combat because he's made of paper, and if he by some miracle manages to win, he only has 1 attack, which any decent target will Fate anyway. I would rather buy 10 Orc spears
In the Witch-King Legion, he apparently gets all the bonuses for the Crown of Morgul (boost to 3A and reroll to cast/resist tests) without having to buy it . . . the Morgul Blade may still be a waste of points, but the Witch-King should be pretty decent in combat. The GMG video Jacob referenced talks about those rules here: th-cam.com/video/RsM1A560Fsw/w-d-xo.html.
![The History of Morgoth [COMPILATION] | Tolkien Explained](/img/n.gif)
You always provide the most balanced and viewer friendly videos. Thanks for this , was a very enjoyable analysis.
Hi mate, I just wanted to let you know I only recently got into MESBG after playing 40k and heresy for years and your channel has been a big help in learning all the stuff I've needed to get started. I have a small mordor army and I got my mate the isengard battlehost for his birthday, we played our first game the other night and had an absolute blast, some of the most fun I've had playing a wargame in a long time. We played scanario 4 - burn the supplies and after a very intense fight in the middle it was a draw all round as we were both broken by the final turn, but not before a very dramatic duel between Saruman and The Witch King. MESBG is such a unique wargame with so much cool stuff in it, thanks for all your content as its been instrumental in getting into this game.
Thanks for the comment mate! Welcome to the game! I love Middle Earth for all the cinematic moments that happen in every game
Totally agree that the Fellowship characters need tuning up. Especially Legolas, Strider, and Gandalf.
I got to play on your terrain, Kingdom of Saxonia, the other day. It was amazing! Really thematic and played exceptionally well. My playgroup is printing your other sets as well!
Legolas is allied in so many lists cause he is very good. Gandalf and Aragorn are situational, but they were back then balanced for the scenarios and this they still done fine.
By far the best video breakdown of this supplement
Wow that Nazthak profile seems really fun. I think while in most games he probably can not pull off crazy shenanigans, the fact that he can steal the wargear before it can be passed on should make him pretty good at dealing with enemy banners. And if you end up not needing the banner or not wanting the dueling penalty you just discard it.
Host of the witch-king is kinda how I was already playing Angmar, now it is a lot stronger even, so that's definitely gonna be nice to play for the one tournament when I can haha
Keep on with the good work! Really liked the style of the video!
Totally agree that in light of these modern models, the heros we all love from the films definitely need a buff. Hopefully that's resolved in the new edition.
Great video as always Jacob - I gotta say, if you compare Eanur and Aldrach, is that if you compare these guys to Eomer, they're either "pretty good" in the comparison (Eanur will be about the same price as Eomer, but will be base F6/C6 with -2 Fate, but has a lance vs. Eomer's +1S from an army bonus and +1 To Wound if Eowyn/Theoden has died). That's not a bad comparison all told. Aldrach . . . well, his base cost is basically the same as a mounted Eomer and without any Legion bonuses, he seems markedly worse. I honestly think he'd be better in the 60-80pt range as a 2A/2 Wound hero, as you recommended.
Thanks for explaining that the supplement will immediately be null and void. The most GW thing ever. This mixed with their absolute insane pricing on the new models is gonna turn so many people off of this line up. Apart from the heroes I know I probably won't be buying much this time.
Games Workshop was very transparent with this supplement release, it wasn't the plan but the books were printed and it allowed people to finish their collection.
People have been saying that the new models were expensive but the werewolves still sold out almost instantly so the price is clearly justified to a large portion of the audience.
@@ConquestCreations I do get it, but it's so frustrating that (myself included) we act like their pricing is okay. I also worry that now the game has their attention again it's going to become less balanced.
@@ConquestCreationsI dunno bro…. The werewolves etc selling out is a product of supply and demand. GW aren’t exactly known for having a great volume of supply lol.
Your just poor lol
@@shammytheshamrock
With War of the Rohirim and later Gollum releasing we are going to see a ton of new models and rules over the next few years, rules imbalance is going to happen unfortunately (at least initially).
New life being breathed into the game is good for everyone though ultimately
Great review and explanation.
Awesome 👌 thanks 🙏
There is also Lord of the Rings Online: Shadows of Angmar (which was the MMO's title at launch and it focused on a resurgent Angmar) and also War in the North (which again focuses on a resurgent Angmar at time when they're believed to be destroyed).
great video, dont forget re the stats that the fellowship will prob be buffed
So happy that you can get the arnor warriors and all the old minatures that were soo expensive. Like the dunedain.
I will get me all the old ones that were gone.
Thanks for these man!!
Thanks for the amazing content!!! A friend of mine is looking at getting into MESBG and is interested in angmar and arnor so this video helped him get a taste of the new profiles coming out. A quick question, GW said that with the new edition all previous supplements will be invalidated. Does this mean profiles from those supplements, e.g. these new ones or ones from other supplements like elfhelm, will become invalid to play or will these profiles be added to the main army book?
I get what you mean when you say that the Fellowship heroes should be the beef cake of the game. There's always been power creep in GW games, and that's why I'm always a bit skeptical whenever there's a bit too much attention to the game.
On the plus side, there's a new edition coming up, so there's a good chance of rebalance!
I'm not sure what you mean by bigger (like physically?) but I really like when they create new profiles / heroes that are more powerful than the characters we know and love from the Fellowship. I think the idea that the Fellowship consists of the absolute most elite heroes in Middle Earth waters everything down. I didn't get the sense that the likes of Gimli, Legolas, and Boromir out-class _all_ the other heroes / villains of Middle Earth, even if they are very heroic. It makes things more interesting for them to encounter equally (or more so) powerful characters, and it raises the stakes of the story. If they were all god tier heroes like book Glorfindel I think it would have been a boring story. But that's just my take, to each their own.
Yeah I definitely don't feel the warlord is too much. In comparison to the actually legendary leading heroes of LOTR he is not that strong, he is not that strong compared to Eomer, Imrahil, Elessar, Elrond, Dain, Glorfindel etc. and also he features in several of the games that are about the rising of Angmar so he is kinda relevant.
I actually don't like it so much that Legolas is so over the top in the movies (killing a mumak, running up a bridge which is collapsing block by block) so I like that his profile is more toned down.
Yes the fellowship is based on bravery; friendship; that they have something to fight for...not necessarily simply being the toughest and mightiest heroes of the time or of each race. It simplifies the story and takes something from the meaning of the story to say the fellowship are stronger than everyone else. Their sacrifice makes them legendary.
100% agree, the fellowship are great heroes of their time but their real strength lies in the fact that they are a tight knit alliance of guys that have each other's backs.
Elladan and Elrohir are noted as fighting alongside and being with Arathorn when he makes his last stand and dies and yet its been missed again. Previously you could not even ally the two together properly as it was a yellow combo...
This is a very strange one, I am not sure why they were not included in the legion
Given Lindon and Rivendell's involvement in the war against Angmar, you'd expect to see both factions represented in the book
How much longer will the late pledge for Tor Ithilas be open? I'm a college student who has to wait a few more paychecks before I can afford it but I love the terrain and would love to support the channel.
Great review
Definitely with you on this one Jacob! Throughout game releases it came to the top over and over again that e.g OG fellowship of the ring consists of sissy little girls that are NO match to MADE up characters which is super NOT cool 😓
Where did you get those wall mounted torches!?!? I NEED those in my basement lol
My biggest dissapointment rules-wise is the breaking of the unified and logic "humanoid stats". It has happened a few times before, but I liked that all humanoids are base S3 and D3 (and heroes base D4), and then armors and shields add to that. This allows not only for balance but also to easily remember stats just by looking at the mini. And some exceptions like dwarves being base D4 were understandable. But now we have these shirtless carn dun men being D4 base with no justification at all. I hope in the next edition they don't do away with that unifying characteristic like in the other GW games.
Nazthak killing just normal warriors and stealing some wargear is also interesting. He could easily get heavy armor and the shield putting him up to D7. Plus all the fun special stuff from named heros. Also maybe grab a spear first so he can fight and be at less risk. 😂 So many fun options.
Would be a fun character to play in a campaign collecting wargear and in the final battle having a really tanky ork
Great vid. Thanks for running through everything. 100% agree rangers of the north just arnt good enough with only fight 4. Definitely need to be fight 5 for the cost of them. Or some rule of fight 5 if within 6 inches of army leader or something similar. Its a shame because i love the rangers but they just struggle to win fights
Thanks you ! was very interesting
Interesting that GW say this wasn't their plan, wonder if this was meant to release much earlier? Or maybe even they didn't anticipate getting War of the Rohirim so early.
We don't have all the details but I reckon this was supposed to come 1 year after the Defence of the North around when the Glorfindel model was released. I think there was a delay as Games Workshop renegotiated thier deal with New Line to get the rights to future Lord of the Rings Film releases
Could be after effects of COVID delays still.
i look at the likes of rutabi being good because rhun isnt a land weve really explored in the books and actual lore, so its possible that warriors on the same level to the fellowship exist outside of that part of middle earth that wouldnt have been heard of, so i guess it works in that regards. still i do agree they shouldnt be trumping the main characters
Agree on Aldrac hurting the theme of the game. Stats sound like some legendary hero. He's gonna mow through loads more enemies than Glorfindel for example. Bad...
"Man Who Reads Book" is once again a pillar of the community. His April fools joke day video when the title was Man(whore)eads Books was fucking hilarious lol.
My angmar army that’s been in progress for errr a few years might finally get themselves together…to fight all the other angmar armies that will probably start popping up 😂
I think the correct pronunciation for Fraecht is Me-di-vh.
Shadow of Rhudaur might be F5 and S3 according to other reviews from people with the book (Like Goonhammer)
I also thought the Shadow of Rhudaur has F5 and Naztak has F4 (the same as normal orc captains). The Shadow of Rhudaur could at least work with F3 in some debuffed way but Naztak becomes complete trash with F3.
I guess some of the profiles on tabletopadmiral are incorrect.
Wondering if they're going to simplify the wound chart in the new edition to use the 40K style instead...
Thanks for the comment, I would be super surprised if they changed it. In 40k it makes sense where you have Titan weapons and Gretchen running around on the same battle field but in Middle Earth where the biggest difference is a Hobbit to a troll I don't think as much differentiation is needed
I'm not convinced that the Shade shooting debuff will be that impactful, I am new so I don't have as much experience, but so far out of 4 games, shooting has killed one horse and 2 unshielded orcs.
Can we still run the old Arnor lists somehow with Hobbit archers?
Keen for the wolf pack.
How do these new legendary legions make you feel about upcoming changes? With so much player choice being lost (even among green alliances, i doubt im running galadrial, theoden and grimbold anytime soon) do you think this new army building format will hold up with current players?
Thanks for the question. I'm really excited for the changes to army building. All of the armies that I play are thematic so I'm not loosing any choices and I'm gaining special rules that will make my armies reflect the theme even better.
I think these legendary legions all seem pretty well balanced. The Arbor one is definitely the strongest and the rest look to sit middle to bottom of the pack in terms of power (not based on playing with or against them, just my precursory thoughts, could change when they are in use). It gives me a lot of hope for what we will see in the new rules.
I would like to kindly disagree about the fellowship. The reason for the fellowship was to be hidden and secert. It was meant not to have mighty heroes or else it would have not been in secret because sauron was keeping tabs on all the epic heroes of Middle Earth. Sauron was expecting all the grwat heroes to band together to defeat him. But the reason why the fellowship worked becuase it was not made up of people was expecting.
I honestly thought the wearwolves would be more, maybe even higher with something like beorns feral/rage rule
I totally agree, I was a bit surprised by their rules. I was expecting them to be in the 50-60 point mark and be similar to an ogre only with a 10" movement
@@ConquestCreations yeah, could update them for the new supplement or if not some homebrew rules will be tried out I think
Technically Arvedui *should* have poor stats, he was the prophesised last king, a generally not great king, and a man who ultimately lost the hope of Arnor. Arvedui should suck - but Arnor definitely needs a boost. It needs a Hero of Legend who can genuinely carry, that or it needs siege engines or something. Angmar is all about monsters and terror and Arnor is, while thematic, on a rules level simply so outmatched. Witch-king, the Tainted, Dwimmerlaik, Gulvahar, Hill Trolls, a shit load of Spirits with an army rule that makes Spirits insanely effective, and now a whole new subfaction that is led by an astonishing beatstick, as well as being given ANOTHER Spirit Hero and an Orc that can wield items his foes drop. It just isn't fair.
EDIT: Y'ask me GW should just invent an Arnorian commander. Have him be a friend of literally any of the named Arnorians, have him serve dutifully with Arvedui, have him be famously injured by a Nazgul, have him be the Arnorian commander during the Siege of Fornost, etc. The third guy alongside Glorfindel and Erendur, yknow? Easy to justify an over 100pt character at that point
worried that the characters being made for the animation are gonna be like arzog and bolg super strong super powerful but they are just made that way to bring hype and attention towards the animation thats being made and ofc GW will capitalize on it and make big bank but these new characters that we havent heard of before but all out of nowhere are super strong pointing at the cheftain aldrac, im a little worried 😯 😯
"It makes the Carn dum model pack really good value"💀.
You can mayby say that for the first pack were you use the options. After that they are just way to expensiv for regular warriors.
Nazthak is really great for killing banners and not allowing your opponent to transfer it!
Good luck actually doing that during a game!
@@AleInBywater It's a lot more likely than getting the legendary weapons of heroes.
How strict would you be about the scavenge rule when the enemy model was killed in a fight with Nazthak+friends? Only if Nazthak personally dealt the final blow?
That's how the rule reads to me, though they could definitely have been more clear about it.
It says: when Nazthak kills an enemy; not: when an enemy dies in a combat he's involved in, or some such. I would read it as literally as possible.
Aldrac 2 A 2W 2F for 80-90 points makes more sense
Are Wild Wargs up from 7 to 8 points in the Legendary Legions or is that just a typo?
Maybe they boosted the points value because they get the knocked down on a charge.
@@wyndhamrobertson5384 Looks like it's a typo if you watch the GMG video where he flips through the book it shows 7 points
Are the profile stats on tabletopadmiral really all correct? According to some other reviews from people who already read the book the Shadow of Rhudaur is F5.
I also don't understand why Naztak is F3. It should be F4 as with every other orc captain. He becomes complete trash because of his F3 I think. The extra point of might doesn't change much here if he dies first round to two F3 Rohan warriors f.e.
For the Carn Dum models, I really hope they get some buffs that reflect the changes in the new addition.
As for our current edition, I think the basic Captain of Carn Dum is super underrated. With +1 to wound (against enemy heroes) he can really punch above his weight class. Now can he take on Celeborn, Dain, Bard, or Aragorn? No... But cheaper heroes under 100 points he can really give them a whooping. Aranarth, Faramir, Argadir, Gamling, Lurtz... This guy can really give them a hard time for only 55 points...
Nice
I dunno about other people but I’ll be using proxies for the werewolves. They are pretty generic, recycled from Gothmog’s warg and silly price for just two. I’m not a fan of GWs half assed two packs. They should at least make 4 for conversions.Even if you buy those two, you are gunna have to convert a load or proxy. At which point you are asking yourself why you didn’t just proxy entirely. Sure, the pre-order sold out but we don’t know the supply. GW aren’t known for their ability to create supply.
Buying a very expensive book for two month and then having to buy 4 more?
That sucks
Thanks for the comment, the easy option is to not buy the Rise of Angmar book unless you want it for the narrative play scenarios
I thought Mighty Blow was D3 wounds? 7:25
the "Bane" special rule gives you D3 wounds. Might blow gives you 2 wounds
So I won't be able to take Carn Dum with the witch king?
These are just the legendary legions, the Carn Dum models are also available in the regular Angmar list where they can go with the Witch King
@@ConquestCreations I thought they were changing that in the new edition though? I must be misremembering it. Nvm ty
@@jarrodstubbs7415 you are totally right they are changing it for the new edition. the army lists in this book will be over ruled by the new edition. It is unfortunate timing that this book will have a short lifespan but Games Workshop was very transparent with it not being the original plan, and that this book was delayed
do you think guys they will removwe orc trackers? :(
I think there is a decent chance that they move into legends. Keep in mind that this isn't removing them! They will still be allowed at heaps of events and in all casual play
Its not unfortunate timing...gw time everything like a wizard... everything and anything arrives precisely when they mean it too. Good review though and it seems a nice thematic book. It will be interesting to see how these units operate in the new edition, if they even are kept.
I’m fine with the Carn dum models but it is very unthematic and dumb that they have D5 with no armour modelled on them. To me it screams classic GW making rules to sell new models.
I do agree that the fellowship characters like Legoland and aragon need to be a lot stronger compared to these made up characters. I think that the heroes need to be buffed but I also think that many of the named characters like the Witch King need better combat profiles to fit their lore counterparts. This would also let some of the special characters that are made up fill more niche roles while letting real characters allow for powerful gameplay
First
I love your channel but I have to disagree with you on one point: The Morghul Blade is awful! The Witch King should never be in combat because he's made of paper, and if he by some miracle manages to win, he only has 1 attack, which any decent target will Fate anyway. I would rather buy 10 Orc spears
In the Witch-King Legion, he apparently gets all the bonuses for the Crown of Morgul (boost to 3A and reroll to cast/resist tests) without having to buy it . . . the Morgul Blade may still be a waste of points, but the Witch-King should be pretty decent in combat. The GMG video Jacob referenced talks about those rules here: th-cam.com/video/RsM1A560Fsw/w-d-xo.html.