Are Your Speakers Loud Enough? Use These Formulas To Find Out...
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ธ.ค. 2022
- Learn how to convert watts to decibels so you can calculate how loud your speakers will get!
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I've done FOH stuff for churches and other small venues, but I never knew the math behind the specs and I really appreciate the clarirty (pun) in your video. I feel like I learned more about speakers in one 5 minute video than 10 years of experience.
Nearly seven years ago, when my daughter graduated high school (and was about to attend college on a bioengineering path), I spoke with an old friend who was a higher-up at a well-known medical device manufacturer. I asked her what qualities she wanted from a scientist. She told me "We've hired some of the best scientists in the world and the mistake we always regret is that they cannot communicate their ideas and findings in a clear and concise manner. I want young talent to be experts in their scientific field, but I also want them to be excellent writers and speakers and effective conveyors of information."
I think you've mastered this.
Thanks, Jo! I always appreciate your comments.
My neighbors NEVER think their speakers are loud enough! I'm the exact opposite, I don't like my sound loud, about as loud as normal speech is the loudest I listen to my stuff at. I'm a low watt listener.
Best video on this ever I have ever watched. Thanks for the refresh!
I've just found this channel yesterday and I'm so excited to see more of your videos. Thanks man!!!
Welcome, Mauricio!
Your a great teacher man...keep it up 💪🏾
Great information as always
I have speakers which are 115-119 dB spl/ meter, and I only use 5W/ch Pass Labs amplifier, and it is a very loud system, and very clear.
Already know this stuff but still watched your video, Kyle. All of your videos are enjoyable to see!
Glad to hear this, Emiel! Thanks!
Good video as always
Yep! That's a University. Thank you for always sharing us some lesson.😊
Thanks for your videos man ! I work in audio, did many gigs and FOH and stuff etc..., and your content really helps recalling the basics, with a clarity I sometimes couldn't find in classes or masterclases :) But mostly it provides some reliable and understandable content for soundies-wannabes !
(Gosh, reading those logs formula sent me back in the past 8 years ago in school not understanding sh** at this time)
@Audio-University isn't quite weird, thanking a sound guy for feedback, when you think of it 😛 ?
Are Desi-Bells how many bells Desi Arnez could play at a time? 😂
Nicely done vid. No stupid music. Very clear articulation.
Very intelligent guy, respect🙏
All explain in easy to understands and simple way.
Learned and enjoyed
Interesting and useful
Thanks for posting.
Thanks for watching! Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you for the video. Really helpful ❤
Glad to help, Monty!
Great clear explanation as usual. I followed the links to the other videos recommended too. Would you be able to do a video explaining EPDR and how to calculate it?
thanks for sharing the knowledge
Glad to help, Haris! Thank you.
I really appreciate 🙏🙏🙏 you for all of this free lessons 📚📚🖍
I wanna learn how set and record drum by using a mixer
Thanks 🙏
thanks love ♥
Good one as usual. I was just confused between Sound Pressure Level and Sound Power Level.
Although this is a good estimation. There are two issues here:
1 - That 97 db/w.m should be a graph. Without it, you have no idea what frequency that number came from. There could be a 1khz spike that is much louder then all the other frequencies but that's the number they give you giving you a false representation of it's real world value. Very common with manufactures listing the 1khz spike as the efficiency of their subwoofer cabinet when the cabinet isn't going to be used above 150 hz.
2 - Power compression is real. Putting 500w into that cabinet continuous is going to heat up that voice coil, increasing it's impedance and there is no more volume to be gained by increasing power anymore. Probably sound like crap at that level as well. Just because it can go that loud doesn't mean it will sound good doing so.
I love his descriptions - very clear and super easy to understand ... THANK YOU!!!
And scientifically correct... always. That's the best part.
Thanks to both of you for your support! I’m glad you’re enjoying the videos.
high quality educational content
Excellent!
Thanks, Sebastian!
The loudest claims I've seen are from Altec Lansing, Klipschorn, and a B-52 folded horn at 118 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt. Several years ago. I built my own 15" front-facing rear-loaded folded horns, and though I don't know what they measured, my 15 watt/channel receiver would get unbearably load in a large room. I made 2, so I could stack them for my bass amp, and so I could separate them and put a mid and a tweeter horn on the top for my stereo.
Great video! Well-explained in the most efficient way I can imagine. I am wondering about line array speaker. It is said that line array speaker has less dB reduction over distance compared to point source speaker. How is that so?
Thank you! ^-^
My home stereo is a 1986 Technics 350 watt amp dividend into two outlets for two sets of Technics speakers that are all 8 ohms and is very loud. I have another 1000 watt and 1500 watt amps and 1000 and stage monitor speakers and bass for public events not for home use.
Nice video's! I've been subscribed since we met at the AES meeting a few months ago.
Just to clarify, the inverse square law is only true in a free field environment. That means no reflections. In a reverberate space, reflections need to be considered. For instance a sound source placed on a wall or corner, will have a much difference level drop off characteristics compared to a speaker placed in the middle of a field.
That’s right! Thanks.
Great channel, so much info. This has helped me so much setting up our church audio. I do have an amp question though. We are replacing our old amp with a new Behringer nx 6000. I have two 350 watt at 8 ohms yorkville passive speakers. We haven’t bought the amp yet. Looking for advise on if this seems like good amp for the speakers and if wiring them in series or parallel would be better. Any info would be great!
Great video, any guides on how to wire car audio?
I enjoy the way you present sound theory in a clear and easy to understand way. One question. Is it not true that line array speakers drop 3db per double the distance?
In theory, yes. There will be less loss over distance with a line array. Great point!
Hi Kyle, first of all I've been following you for several years now and I like your way of presenting the videos and concepts.
I would like to start by saying that everything you have described is true and I agree with what you present.
However I would like if you could explain better what an amplifier actually does and its relationship with the SPL.
An example we have 2 similar amplifiers of the same brand but of different models and the same speaker is connected to them.
The first amplifier will be called A with 500 W of power and 21 dB of gain, the other will be amplifier B of 100 W of power and 30 dB of gain.
Once again the same speaker is used, under the same circumstances, the preamplifier is not going to move the volume pot, so the lower power amp B of 100 W will sound louder than the A with more Watts.
People should know that most of the SPL is due to the gain of the amplifier than to the consumption of the amplifier itself.
It is like the magnifying glass and the magnification, that is the gain and not the size of the magnifying glass, which would be the power in this crude example.
On the other hand, it is true that the amount of SPL is lost with the relationship described by the inverse law of distance, that you double the distance and lose 6 dB, that is true but ONLY if it is measured outdoors, in open field or in an anechoic chamber and not in a room.
For everything else I congratulate you, very good video.
Hi, thanks for the video! I have a somewhat very basic problem I just can’t solve (sorry for the beginner question). I have an amp pedal with no headphone out. I use it through a small mixer to play and listen through headphones. But I’d like to use it without headphones sometimes. Can I simply connect studio monitors to the mixer? Will that not blow out the monitors? Or is the 4 cable method through an amp cab (with fx loop) the only way to hear it without headphones?
Thanks!
I love your clear explanations and I fully understand what your saying but I struggle preforming it on a calculator 🙈😭🤣 it’s driving me crazy how do I get more officiant at this ?
Amps also differ in sound output even if they are the same wattage, for instance, its a well known thing that Tube Guitar Amplifiers tend to be louder than Solid State amps of the same Wattage, and drastically louder than the Digital amps of the same wattage. This matters less with Monitoring or Playback as most of those amps are Solid state transistor based, but it matters a lot with Guitar and Bass amps.
For example my bass player uses a 100watt Bass amp, which does not seem like it would be that loud, but its a tube amp and I can confirm the volume of this amp is insane. Of course the output varies even between amps of the same type of tech (be it a different circuit or even different Tubes/Transistors etc)
If I was chosing a guitar Cab I would be happy that a 120watt cab would handle a 100Watt solid state or digital amp, but I would not be confident it could handle a 100watt tube amp, i would want a cab that takes at least 140watt, probably closer to 200.
I know what you are talking about is far more precise, its just something I have always found interesting (Tube power vs Solid State vs Digital)
read about Ohm law
1.Does feeding the speaker with number of watts closer to its peak number of watts (using good quality amplifier), help in sound quality, other than SPL?
2.Does it enhance bass output of the speakers?
3. Any science backing behind wattage "headroom"?
Great question! Check out this video: th-cam.com/video/6B0OlQaD_i4/w-d-xo.html
1: a good quality amplifier with power close to the peak SPL or not, will improve the sound quality. But that’s due to better internal components. Has nothing to do with watts in any way.
2: it’s recommended to get an amplifier that can deliver more continuous power than the speaker is capable of handling (e.g. speaker 500 watts continuous, amplifier 800 watts continuous). It will not enhance the low frequent energie (“bass”). But there are amplifiers that are more focused on low frequency output and others more towards the high end. Depends on the manufacturer. This also answers your third question. There is some science behind wattage headroom: more power from the amplifier than the speaker can handle continuous (approximately 1.5 times the speaker recommended power) results in healthier situations. In other words, you will never run into distortion delivered by the amp. The opposite let’s say a 200 watts amp for a 500 watts speaker will bring problems sooner or later. You will crank up the volume, 200 watts is nearly reached and the amplifier distorts from the output right into the speaker. Hope this answers your questions.
Important to know that many cheaper speakers on the market have peak watts listed instead of continuous watts , as a way to falsely advertise the wattage
Well, 6dB "air loss" pr. metre. That is in FREE air, right? In a home with walls, corners and so on, the "Air Loss" should be much less. I usually calculate - 3.5dB in a typical home pr. metre. Also it would be worth mentioning, that when using TWO cohesive speakers 6dB will typically be added. Do you agree to those rules of thumb, or do I need to adjust my bearings? 😀. Thank you for some excellent videos. I love how you explain and demo things, sir!
You’re definitely correct that barriers, reflections, and multiple speakers will generally always cause less loss over distance than in a free field. Although, I’m unaware of a rule of thumb for estimating that.
Thanks for the comment! Good points!
@@AudioUniversity haha.. How should i measure to confirm? Pink noise? To my knowledge the speaker efficiency specs are measured with a band limited pink noise signal, right? So if i use that, and measure over a distance of first 1 metre and then 4 metre. We would be able to calculate the nominal loss pr. metre in a typical home, with speakers placed close to corners. What is your take on this? Ill guess that ceiling height also have a lot to say? Would you agree, that I could do a practical test in the way described?
Yes. This seems right. I would expect a lot of variance based on lots of other factors though.
I found out mine are too loud, because my wife says turn it down😂
It's very grateful
What is the difference b/w rms power rating and program power of a loud speaker????
can a big speaker like your 500w still play a 1w signal?
This guy knows his stuff. I’d love to know how Bose gets so much throw at the back of a room. I have many Bose portable speakers and they are as loud at back of room as standing right in front.
I was just wondering the same thing. LD column systems are the same
Do you own LD? Which model?
This makes sense, but I am lost on one point. So the dB formula used for power is 10*log. But, we are talking about dB SPL, which is normally 20*log. How does using the first relate to SPL when using it for a power ratio? I know I am missing something important lol
Check out this video: th-cam.com/video/xSe7y9tYex8/w-d-xo.html
Really good video. What is the ideal dB for humans?
Based on that, I can calculate what speakers I need.
The threshold of damage (where hearing damage begins to occur) is often said to be around 80 dBSPL. Unfortunately, it’s common for concerts to run at levels up to 110 or 120 dB!
I’d recommend determining a target and designing the system to provide some extra headroom.
I have a small 4 ohm PA Amp and two 4 ohm speakers,,i want to add a small passive monitor. .How do i connect it to my PA.. My amp has only two 4 ohm speaker out jacks sockets . Regards for any help.
I don't get the 20 Log calculation. Right before it's said that pressure in dB decreases by 6 per metre. This means if the speaker has 124 dB by 500 watts within 1 metre distance the loss at 10 m is 54 dB, not 20. Thats quite a difference that should be explained.
In this way you can also calculate the coefficient of power (COP) of your loudspeaker. But don't be surpriced how inefficient loudspeakers in general are. For the loudspeaker in the video with its 97 dB/W at 1 m distance the COP is only 3.16%. If you have a very inefficient speaker you can get just 85 dB/W. The COP of this speaker is only 0.2%. A hypothetical loudspeaker with a COP of 100% has 120 dB/W. With a highly efficient horn loudspeaker you can achieve up to 106 dB/W which corresponds with a COP of 25%.
When you operate a pair of the speakers in the video at a power of 2 x 500 W you generate a heat of 970 W, which is allready a nice contribution for heating of your living room. If you use a class AB power amplifier it will contribute at least additional 500 W fof heating power, so you will get in total more than 1500 W heating power contribution.
In reality it is mostly more than enough if you operate a 97 dB/W loudspeaker at 1 W electric power for your living room. It is ok to go 10 to 15 times higher with your amplifiers output power in order to reproduce a good headroom for percussive music. Under this operating conditions allready your amplifier operates with a very low COP because at low output voltages most of the operating voltage is used at the same current by your output stage producing more than 10 times the heat of your electric output power.
A relatively large class A operating range by a quiescent current of 100 mA or even more also contributes significantly to inefficient operation. For my self made 2 x 12 W home audio amplifier I set the quiescent current to 50 mA. So I generate only 2.4 W at my symmetric +/- 12 V power supply. For my living room I need considerably less than 2 x 1 W (typically 2 x 200 mW) of output power at the terminals of my Magnat Vector 1 loudspeakers for normal listening. And they are not very efficient with their (measured) 91 dB/W.
After a hiatus, my studio monitors seem SO much quieter than they used to be. I have my audio interface turned all the way up and its still not enough. This was not an issue previously. I'm thinking maybe its the room, I changed studios, the new one having higher ceilings, but it still doesn't quite make sense considering how dramatic the difference is. Anyone have any thoughts, ideas?
Here are some things I’d check…
- Cables
- Volume on Monitors
- Interface Driver Update
did you lose some hearing during your hiatus? too much loud music when you're partying? pick up a construction job running a Jack hammer? wear your ppe hearing protection. been shooting guns without ppe?
NEED HELP
I need to cover a large outdoor area with music without disturbing the neighbors. It's a long term install.
What should I research to understand the best way to achieve this?
Cardioid and Endfire arrays.
So at 100 metres with 90db sensitivity, 360 watts of continuous power will it be 75db or 5.5 db?
20log (100/1) is 40 but using the other calculation I got 115db at 1 metre and -6db x 100 = -485db.
One calculation says I'll hear 40db at 100 metres and the other one says I won't hear anything at all doesn't it?
Oh wait I just did 20log(100/1) which is 40, so I will lose 40dB over 100 metres then
Probably the easiest way is to buy a good brand speakers if you can afford it or a ready to play speaker box folded horn or scoop, but for a budget people experiments are endless
I think the formula is wrong. Power directly proportional to 1/r^2. Just imagine the sound point is sending out like a "round shape" not "square shape", so the are of a circle is pi*r^2. And that's why when we judge the power loss over distance become 20 log(dist 2/dist 1) instead of 10log(p2/p1), because of that square bring down becomes 2*10 in log theory.
Easy way to calculate spl without a calculator:
Let's count the steps:
2…4…8…16…32…64…128…256…512
There's our 500 watts. That's 9 steps at 3db per step for a total of 27db gain.
9x3= a lot easier than sone log BS! 😊
okaay!!!
Give me a video..fake or original speaker difference
You need more subs man.
Tech info minus the "audiophile" bs, sign me up.
π
Excellent Video. Thanks for reminding some formulas. Though I disagree with the statement ".....rest is converted in to Heat". About 30-45% will be directly converted to heat with a class AB amp and 10-20% for Class D amp and lesser in Class H or so. With a decently efficient audio amplifier most of the electrical energy gets converted in to mechanical energy and a portion of that mechanical gets converted into acoustic energy. Correct me if I am wrong.
"most of the electrical energy gets converted in to mechanical energy" . I wouldn't agree with that. That voice coil is just a big resistive heater. At least all the turns of the coil outside the magnetic gap is anyways (the Thiel-Small parameter "x-max" lets you know how much is outside the gap on either side which is why high x-max drivers have poor efficiency). The turns inside the magnetic gap may convert a good portion of that energy into mechanical energy but it is still losing energy to resistive heating as well. All said and done, a speaker like the EV used in this video will only convert about 1% (considered quite good) of it's electrical input into sound energy irregardless of the amplifiers efficiency which is a totally different calculation.
@@wally7856 @wally7856 You are right. I wish this wasn't the case. So much more loud sound we would get 😂 for the power we put into those things. I didn't take the speaker heat into account. I only spoke about amplifier part. In future we can see more efficient speaker. Let's hope for that at least.