Gear Prices Plummeting
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Used asking prices are beyond absurd
Sofa fantasies
Fully agree with your opinions Barry. Too many economic indicators that point to a down turn. I seldom buy used. Refused to buy anything used these last 4yrs. For my purposes, it made more sense to buy new. Especially since I keep 90plus precent of what I buy gearwise.
I truly, truly hope things don't get as bad as they can. Nobody knows for sure when or where, but lots of things in the economy right now make no sense. And since everything under the sun in the current day is hyper-politicized, whatever truth we find will be the truth we dig out ourselves from all the garbage commercial media is feeding us.
Trust nobody, challenge the status quo always, never assume and always verify. All. Be kind to all as much as possible. Yes the poor will always be with us, but always be charitable when affordable.
If you can't spare a dollar, spare a smile, a kind act & word because you just never know how much difference it can make in someones day, and they're free. You can't put a price on a good heart and what comes from it. Grace and humility are also sacred elixirs to the soul.
Much love to you Sir.
well said!
Used prices seem to be returning to normal, as far as I can tell. They were highly inflated. Sellers have to adapt and lower their asking prices, if they want to move the gear. People have gotten used to thinking of their old junk as assets.
Gear prices are greatly inflated and have been for a long time. It is the halo effect since many pieces are based on rare vintage gear. However, if you look at the BOM/production cost, these companies are generally making crazy profits! And the market is saturated, hence all the people offloading used gear.
Great trend observation. Was at my local music store yesterday and always talk w the manager. He says there is a glut of gear for sale on reverb, Sweetwater (used) etc. Prices are very flexible.
Anything computer/software based (control surfaces, convertors, modelers) or anything produced in massive quantiles depreciates at an insane rate. All the analog gear I gave away 20 years ago cause I thought was outdated is worth a fortune today. Manufacturers will ONLY lower prices when the public stops buying.
And Barry.... there is a coming "chip" problem. Everything from a steam iron to this laptop run on "chips" that we do not produce. This is going to be a fundamental problem soon for our country. Right now I have a perfectly good Toyota Corolla dead in the garage because I cannot get a replacement ECU to run the systems. My neighbor has a 2021 Highlander, same thing with the tranny cannot get a replacement control unit
It is well known - we have a continuous land mass below us (provided you're American or Canadian) in Mexico, Central America, and South America with cheap labor ready to be industrialized further. There will be growing pains, but we'll get it done. It's the changing dynamic of global shipping. As the US steps down from being global police (check out the changes in naval ship distributions), we'll become far more regional in production. I think we'll be fine, after some adjustment.
As chips increase the value of my used gear increases
There is no “coming” to this, it’s in fact been going since 2020/2021, COVID caused it. It’s gotten a WHOLE lot better over the past year, I buy a lot of electronics components, it’s better now. But, in most cases I could find a part, or alternative, the issue was the cost wasn’t worth it, they were up 250-1000%. But, if you’re willing to pay, you’ll likely find the part somewhere.
As for the “problem”, I’m not sure who you’re referring to, I’ll assume the US, and if that’s the case I sort of agree. The US continues to dominate the high-end component market, lacking is the low end, mainly consumer, components, that could be an issue. Many of the chip fabs are looking to open capacity in Mexico to serve the North American markets, that’s the best option.
I’ll also add the components weren’t the only issue in the supply chain, still isn’t, the inputs are often just as difficult to find. Argon has for example, and others, some of which Ukraine was the largest producer of.
It depends on the gear… most computer and digital related stuff goes down with time, not so with some synthesizers or some high end audio gear. My Jx8P has gone up and so did my Sequential Rev2. There is also trends that come with new gear, for instance the Empress reverb pedal went down a little with the release of the Meris Mercury X and so on. I actually like being used at Guitar Center because of the 30 day return policy in case there is something wrong - I got my Avid Dock like that and the first one I got, one of the encoders was not working- I returned it and got another used one.
That is sorta true - especially for analog synths - but there does seem to be a ceiling except for the Jupiter 8's and such. I sold my JX-3P almost 10 years ago when prices peaked - $1.2kUS w/ programmer. If you look on Reverb, the selling price for these has flat-lined the past few years despite hacked firmware availability and inflation. I think it is the DCO/budget stuff which suffers.
Great Content Barry!
very interesting
I have noticed this as well, the near new asking prices for used gear of just 2 years ago are going away. It’s the economy, people need cash, they sell things and if they need it bad enough, they sell cheap. Once that starts the rest around it go down.
I just tried selling a bunch of camera gear and I had ZERO interest in it. Lots of scammers, but no real buyers. The gear was priced very competitively and all of it is in excellent condition. I ended up selling it to MPB which was offering about 30% more than my local camera store and just shy of what I could get on eBay after fees. People are seriously hurting financially right now.
”…For used gear”. There you go, title fixed 👍
Timely video for me just took advantage of some killer deals this past week for upgrade number 2 for my project studio. I was able to afford and swap some gear with out issue. But my recommendation is start slow and learn the daw and real knowledge of recording before investing in the next phase. Good luck !!!
I remember when the RND 542 tape emulator came out it was 950 au brand new. You now pay about 1000 on reverb for used. I agree the lack of disposable income is inflating asking prices but the actual sale price may be more sobering. Items are sitting on Reverb for some months before sale.
I buy and sell used pro-audio gear constantly for my studio and the equipment I use to play out. My experience has not been that of prices “plummeting”.
Hey Barry you’ve owned quite a few control surfaces and mixers. Are you currently using the built in monitor control in your control surface or do you use external hardware?
The oven by Maor Appelbaum & HendyAmps Stereo Tube and Solid State Multiband Tone Shaper Looks really cool. Thinking about picking it up. Barry have you seen or heard anything about this box?
Predicting prices going out from here is not a very easy thing as there are economic forces which are in opposition. Heavy never ending strong inflation has always been with us and will continue because the politicians are printing so much money to fund their endless wars and boondoggles. But the rising prices are squeezing the lower end consumers who are in a form of depression-stagflation. So nominally prices for things should go up while the purchasing value of that money is dwindling to dust.
Very bad times are here and will be getting worse. Sell anything you don't value a lot and use the money in the market to collect dividends.
The whole 1 finger beat producer coming in to a million dollar studio and placing his 5 year old Dell laptop on the desk to show how they made their high charting hit is a thing. Especially with musicianship being something that just isn't that important to music makers outside the rock and country range. I just don't see youth buying a lot of gear unless they are in traditional mode with their music. Plus the cost of gear for the stuff people really want is still crazy which is why plugins are a blessing to most musicians/producers/engineers who want something close to the hardware pieces out there. I'm really surprised gear moves in the numbers it needs to today to keep hardware companies and stores afloat. Hats off if they can still do it!
I always buy used when possible, unless it’s a tuner or something like it.
Same here. I bought my interface, audio cables, monitor speakers and displays new but my synths and the 2012 Mac Pro I still use till I can move to Apple Silicon were all off eBay. No point in spending more than you need to. I actually use the bag my Bass Station II came with as a slightly larger messenger bag for day to day use and just have a large backpack for cycling/food shopping when needed.
I kind of think UA stuff is falling more, and faster since people are not "HANDCUFFED" to UA hardware in order to use the plugins! Jailbreak baby!!!!!! lol
I just recently sold a delay pedal just a month ago for about $170 that i bought brand new for about $300 just a year ago. I was shocked how much money I was losing getting rid of it, but I went ahead and sold it based on a variety of reasons. I do the same thing on Reverb before selling: I always look at what the gear has actually sold for and not what people are asking, and then I'll price based on what they've sold for and i can usually sell my stuff pretty quick. I think you're right: gear is coming down in value right now and yeah it could just very well be a combination of folks not having time and that times are just getting tougher and tougher.
Barry, a friendly suggestion. It would be great if you added some screen shots or video examples of topics you discuss. IE A Reverb Selling price history chart.
Looks overflowing already. Time for a complete redesign.
About time. It's been £150 for a decent 2 input audio interface and £400 for a mono synth or sample & synthesis tone module/"groove box" since the 90s. I bought some of my stuff used even now because prices have never gone down much.
i think not only what you've said in the videos is true but also the fact that new gear is coming out that's a lot cheaper and of the same quality or better. take interfaces as a example. things like the Evo series from audient are looking very appealing to someone like me who wants a bigger interface without breaking the bank. the Apollo series was great for no latency when using UAD plugins but now i can do that without having a Apollo series interface. another thing is that companies are making exceptionally good quality analog pieces for cheaper as well. I was looking into getting a la2a style compressor and oh boy i feel like iv stumbled on a great thing when I found the lin2a. it sounded so close to the original for such a low price I thought to myself this is a no brainer!
Good insights. What is the difference on a company's profits between offering a 15% discount and lowering a price by 15%?
I’m in western Maryland and am seeing a trend of prices dropping over the past quarter. I’m also seeing less interest in items I have for sale. I find if you’re not pressed to sell you will eventually get your asking price (or at least close) but I’ve had stuff listed for months with little to no interest. On another note it’s a great time to buy if you have the extra cash on hand! I scored a $1000 retail priced guitar that was barely used for $400 with a hardshell case. I traded up for a $1400 guitar then traded up for a $2400 guitar with only a $400 cash investment (plus travel time and gas). It’s always been a hobby of mine to buy and trade up. Trades are a great way to move gear when we have a crappy economy like we do right now. 😊
I like to buy new unless the used one is like 50/60% less otherwise I rather buy new. Think some of the new prices on everything went up a bit too much in tha last few months. Think prices will drop too and also think we might see some smaller brands will close down.
Another big indicator of the market was how many of the big companies weren’t at NAMM this year. And a lot of the big boys that used to spring for huge booths and displays tremendously cut down to nothing but a small squat with a table and couch. Spending isn’t in the budget for them.
Do you use the ARC for your monitor controller? I'm in the market for one that doesn't color my sound.
Yes
Console prices having dropped. Looking for a used CL5 and Rio and the prices are still there since the DM’s are slow to delivery
I can say I'm alot more conscious about how much I spend on gear and what I buy now. And then there are alot of new products coming out that have great technology that I want to get to know better. Unlike when I was young, there are more competitive products out there that keep me curious and will always keep me buying something. Pro Keyboards is definitely a market where you got to pay attention.
I saw one used digital mixer on Ebay for a good price, but when I scrolled down to the description, the seller was offering a 20% for cash at a personal pick-up. Back in late 2019 it was $3,500 and has increased to $4,000. I will wait a while to see what happens. It is electronic so I won't buy second hand.
I usually give a try to b-ware gear as it is covered by warranty.
On Reverb I was only able to get some Stam Audio stuff, brand new. Many used gear is much overpriced on that site...😞 Sellers claim they need to charge more due to shop fees.
I have always been able to get a 20 percent discount reverb when a local shop is selling online.
I’m all for a correction in the market in general. Prices both new and used have just been insane these past few years.
Guitars? I wasn't expecting that one. Top five answers on the board, heres the question. Name something people wont buy used........ Speakers? Can I see Speakers. Survey says....SPEAKERS! Ding! ding! ding!. #2 through #4 any thing purely digital. Audio interfaces, EFX racks like and Eventide H3000, anything from TC.. Any Thing. . And the #5 answer on the board......vintage synths. Sure you say, but those are only used and I say thats right, but don't do it. Don't. Do. It. Good luck servicing a Juno 60. Nice vid!
Not my interface. I brought a LYNX HILO in 2020 in the UK for $3000 in the UK today there averaging at $4500. i got lucky they sound sweet, i wouldn't pay $4500 today, id get an RME, which i tested at the time and it sounded just as good, but had less routing options.
This is likely a US issue.
Used prices on guitar gear in the UK are starting to fall, thankfully. A lot of the inflation on used gear was down to availability, but production seems to have returned to pre-Covid levels for a lot of gear so there is no longer a scarcity bubble driving used prices. At least that’s how it seems in the UK.
The used asking prices has been quite absurd for the last few years. Anything regardless of vintage or status has gone up tremendously in price. You could buy a piece new and one from 2006 that was mass produced fetched the same price on the used market - whereas a few years ago it would have been 50% cheaper
I think what we are seeing now is a return to that state. The supply lines have cleared up, as you said people aren't stuck at home anymore or already have the gear they want.
At least I hope it turns out that way. I loved buying and trying loads of different gear, but I did not dare touch the used market in the last few years because of the huge price swings.
I don’t think UA is a great measurement for pricing, because most people are transitioning away from dsp
most home studio people use apollos
I'm new at this but why are people moving away from dsp?
@@ARKenMan New computers are so powerful there is less of a need. People would rather spend money on processing power on their computer vs inside their interface.
That new computer with the extra processing power costs $. Upgrade only if beneficial or dead. Latency also factored in when recording. Pros/cons need to be taken into account. Don't forget about electric power consumption & heat generation.
I’ve been selling my modular modules at a huge loss just to move them. I’ve been buying some used gear at huge reductions too. It’s a give and take. 😪
cheap prosumer gear will drop in a struggling economy but High end stuff will only keep going up.
Prices are going up on New gear not down. I've seen this from several companies. I don't know what kind of effect that would have on the used market. I think people are just selling because they need money as you mentioned. The economy in the US is fighting for its life right now.
Buying guitar used is ok if it has stainless steel frets, otherwise I usually stay away.
SS frets is a garuantee you will have it in playable condition with no refretting need
Always aware that with used there could be problems.... idc i just send it to repair and get brand new components in. Refurb at discount price! Better than new!
I'll believe it when i see it, people apparently will wait 10 yaers to sell something on reverb, trying to get a price that's 5 percent less than buying it new, than there's the vintage stuff, that's quadrupled in price last 10 years, then you add in the absurd percentage, that reverb and paypal steal from every sale
You are already seeing it.
Prices are crashing. Fast. I don’t see how mew pricing holds…especially for imports when the American made guitars can be had for
Nice glasses
Gear especially consoles jumped in price on the used market right at the beginning of the lockdowns. A used Soundcraft MH-3 48 channel went from $1000 to $2000 to $7500 which is abysmal or a Midas Heritage 3000 went from $2500-$3000 to $10,000 as an average. I think some of this might be a correction in the market as well on top of the overarching inflation have helped to bring prices back down to a normal level.
They’re always up when you’re looking for that one thing
Months ago you predicted price drops, and they've been slow, but steady
cheap guitars are still going for well over what they were new in 2018...other prices are dropping, its really weird. Xair 18's went UP in price!
I don't see your links in this video.
Thanks for letting me know, I completely forgot to put them there. Appreciate you!
This is largely going to depend on the type of equipment and market trends. Digital tools (interfaces, controllers) lose value immediately after purchase and don’t recover. High end analog can often appreciate over time. I have units here that I bought used that now sell between 200%-500% upward of what I paid for them.
Sadly your UAD interface is a dead-weight since M1 - it will be a hard sale.
It's been difficult to sell used gear for the last two years now.
This problem is not going to get better for awhile....money is tight.... its not going to change for awhile..plan on keeping what you have unless you don't mind taking pawn shop prices...
When the market is down it's a good time to buy used gear, not a good time to sell.
You want to sell your stuff when the market bounces back up, if you sell now you'll be loosing money.
Don't do that unless you really need too.
Garbage doesn’t retain its value…if you have junk or obsolete equipment don’t expect to sell it for a high price.
Universal Audio 1176LN has been selling used for $1400, new 1K more. It’s not just happening to lower gear.
You are absolutely right Barry. I agree 100%, right now inflation is kicking everyone’s butt and it’s really pushing people into survival mode. Secondly the music industry is dead, they majors are broke, the business model is broken, and to be frank the new generation doesn’t care that much about music or art that much. As a result, I think you are going to get some unbelievable gear at rock bottom prices over the next couple of years. Some of these online music stores will be going bankrupt in that time frame as well. Things are not looking good for the economy with all the debt we have and all our government can do is inflate as much of the debt away which will only make things more difficult for everyone, so those with any assets that can get cash for them will be forced to sell based on their circumstances.
Thank you... I have been saying this for a couple years. I work at a local high school and the kids ABSOLUTLEY do not care about any kind of artistic expression. Go to the after school gaming and robotics room and it is jammed. The kids wont play after school sports either. Its a fundamental shift in our paradyme.
Damn kids stay off my lawn!
@@mrshiney2 Everything is about money, status, and clout….. it’s not about God, country, family, love and Artistic expression is about expressing love and the human experience. Society is extremely cynical today…..men have learned that love is conditional, women have learned to be independent and hypergamic to the n-th degree so there is no expression or wanting of a union. Both are miserable Hence that eliminates a large portion of music in a positive aspects. That leaves music only in the debauchery and negative aspects of life (abuse, depression, addiction, death, or harm) and that is where most music is today… and if it is not in that what is left is not really emotional but perfect robotic 4:4 loud uncreative dance music where no one expresses themselves not even through dance. Hence why you are seeing a proclivity for country music resurgence for those that still care about the aspects that reminds us of the human experience. It’s a society problem ultimately. Everything is about money…. Even in your statement about kids that don’t play sports if they do it’s about getting a scholarship or going pro.
You brought a tear to my eye because you are 100% right. We are living in clown world.
@@risingphoenix1484the god idea has done nothing positive for the growth of mankind. Those who think they wish to live by the god idea should look at Saudi Arabia and similar countries. Music is alive and well. We watch videos about gear, to create and perform music. Society will do far better without the god idea and the other crazy idea, because we were born in the US, we are the greatest people, allegedly blessed by some god character of ancient stories. Life is special for one reason, it is so very limited with respect to time. After we die, that is it, game over. We will all become memories for the living. We won't even know we no longer exist, again. Not living is easy to understand. It is just like before your parents existed, you also didn't exist and some day, you won't exist at all again, just like before. It is getting to the not existing any longer that seems quite inconvenient at some point in the journey.
Things have been going up for the last three years exponentially for synths. I blame youtube influencers
Saving 5-10% on buying used gear isn't enough incentive for me to buy someone else's problems.
The percent is much greater than that, I have never had one single issue with buying or selling used gear. Never, not one time.
"... You should buy gear now. Oh look here is some of my gear for sale..." Guy.
The market is flooded right now because the average Joe is selling off his pandemic purchases. I lost count of the number of people who bought guitars, synths, drums, studio equipment, etc... and are now offloading for a fraction of what they paid a few years ago.
look at the price of an imac from 2010, its worth zero but probably enough for most people
If they do analog, yes.
the price you put on ads measure the willing you really have to sell it.
I just let go of my Burl converters for half price of what I paid 😢
Nothing used is dropping in price where I'm at. If anything the asking prices are going up.
Bro in my country I can't sell a midi controller used. It's a Komplete Kontrol A49 keyboard i'm selling for half of the price new. No one interested. I don't understand wtf
People have an aversion to used guitars … ?! I don’t think so …
Modern used, sure … but the most expensive/valuable guitars are all used, by now …
I said “ some” people
i have trust issues so i buy new XD
this guy buys hi sells low and looses and hes giving advise on what?
Did you actually watch the video? This guy.
If you dont have proper disposable cash save money on expensive monitoring by buying a top specced headphone amp from China. I won't mention the company, but it's Cheap..relatively. Research it. I'm done lusting after monitors after realising what a top line cans amp will do. With some middling headphones. Again, no need to go crazy.
No need to waste time, money and space attempting to set up a room. More than likely unsuccessfully. Save that stuff for people who think they know what, where and why they're hearing what they're hearing. Really very few know or have the resources available to learn to know.
A bit like buying Ferrari to drive around the burbs. Smoke and mirrors
Music from the making to the production has become, in many ways, a marketing/consumption racket. Especially with us all plugged into youtube etc
OTB is overrated.
The main driver of inflation is corporate gouging.
Printing Money is the actual reason, Corporations have no power unless there are monopolies like Fuel and Electricity , Medical, Pharma, Insurance .......
The main driver of inflation is printing money.
@@TheThinker43dude, you beat me by 32 seconds! 😂
No its printing of money/credit from the Federal Reserve and Gov’t spending that causes inflation. If you look at the GDP, it’s gov’t spending that is the primary reason for the increase in GDP. It’s really simple in fact, supply and demand….if you increase the supply of money = increase inflation…. It’s a monetary phenomenon
Can we give a hundred thumbs up to this?
Why do you have a pic pasted to the upper right hand corner?
Are you blocking something you don't wanna show, or have ant one seeing something?
🙄. Weird video. “Here’s how I feel, even though the actual data says otherwise.” Probably best to ask where do you get your news?
I mentioned in the Video about looking at sold sales for any particular item at reverb.
Basically SELL SELL SELL NOW! Because as we are seeing with the rise in grocery prices, interest rates etc, people are not going to have disposable income for much longer…….. thanks Dems! I am streamlining this comment because there are more factors at play, but you get the gist.
There are no longer interest in music... So gear are useless
Then why watch me?
God Bless Barry Johns 🙏🎸
God Bless President Trump 🙏🇺🇸