Why do the Elves like Trees? - The Story of the Dead White Tree in Gondor - Tolkien's Lore in LotR
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ธ.ค. 2024
- In Lord of the Rings we see this strange withered White Tree in Minas Tirith. We also find it on Gondor's banners, but what's up with with the Dead White Tree in Lord of the Rings? What is with the tree? What does it mean? What's the story behind it? Time for a LotR Lore video exploring the history of Arda - or Middle-earth and Aman to precise - in Tolkien's lore. Well it's a long story and I try to answer it in-depth as always in my Lord of the Rings Lore videos. This also answers the question: why do the elves like trees so much? Considering how influential Lord of the Rings was for the genre, It becomes clear that this is probably also the reason why in fantasy elves like trees.
Tolkien created a lot of lore and history around those trees (Middle-earth and Aman). The story crosses many other topics I have already explained in other videos (I mention that probably a bit too often in the video), so I skip some details here and there.
We start with early Arda, with Laurelin and Telperion, the Two Trees of Valinor, go over Galathilion to Celeborn, to Nimloth until the line of the trees of Gondor starts and seems to end in Minas Tirith (Minas Anor). This also explains why the elves like trees so much.
Characters connected to the White trees are ofc Isildur in Númenor, Aragorn and Gandalf in the Third Age, but also Sauron, the Nazgul (Ringwraiths) with their leader Witchking of Angmar and his city Minas Morgul. As always I will also explain some book difference compared to the LotR movies.
I also want to thank Niahti, who allowed me to use her amazing art work in my video:
www.artstation...
Feel free to check out her work:
www.artstation...
#LotR #Lore #explained
#### Sources ####
Books:
Lord of The Rings (1954-1955) by J. R. R. Tolkien
The Silmarillion (1977) by J. R. R. Tolkien; Editor: Christopher Tolkien
The Hobbit (1937) by J. R. R. Tolkien
Unfinished Tales (1980) by J. R. R. Tolkien; Editor: Christopher Tolkien
Pictures from:
The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring (2001)
The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (2003)
The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey (2012) (not sure if the Dol Guldur picture is actually from the 2nd Hobbit movie)
The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies (2014)
Shadow of War
Shadow of Mordor
Maps:
lotrproject.com...
Two Trees of Valinor Art Work:
Niahti; www.artstation...
Recommended Wiki (best by far):
tolkiengateway.net
The Philosopher's Games / TPhGames / TPhLore
Follow me on Twitter for updates and news:
@PhilosophGames
/ philosophgames
I usually make analytical gaming and Tolkien & LotR lore content. Feel free to check my channel (ThePhilosophersGames) for more:
/ thephilosophersgames
My mother introduced me to The Lord of the Rings when I was about nine in the fifties. I have loved and reread them over and over since then, and all the books by his son Christopher. As a child artist I illustrated many of the events and characters. I raised my daughter with the books and now my grandchildren have just finished the Hobbit. When I hear your voice it is like hearing a traveler from Middle Earth retelling the stories I have loved for sixty years. You do a great service to us all and I hope many will be encouraged through your work to read Tolkien’s masterpiece for themselves.
So far, the one and only person who, in my opinion, able to explain Tolkien world in detail. I learn so much from your video, thanks!
Thank you :) Always nice to hear that my videos are useful and can people learn from them ^^
I absolutely do not understand the complaints about your accent, the pronunciation of words and names in Tolkien languages, and even your use of English. Really! I think your presentation is clear, easy to understand and very professional while expressing your warmth and passion for the history of Middle Earth and it’s peoples. I began to read the Hobbit and Lord of the Rings in the sixties when I was 10, and have an extensive library. I think you have done a penetrating and thorough collection detailing and outlining these narratives. Thank you-I’ve enjoyed and learned a lot.
Tolkien was so in depth with a seemingly more complete and detailed history than our own. It's almost as if he channeled his writings from a parallel universe that is as real as ours is.
Yes it's mind blowing how much detail there is. I think because Tolkien wanted to create his own mythology, he focused a lot on meaning and fate. These concepts live from references and story elements being connected to each other. Tolkien was a true grandmaster in this regard.
LOTR fandom: "bet you can't do a video on the random white trees in the movies and lore!"
Thephilosophersgames: "hold my beer....."
haha pretty much ^^ The most mind blowing thing is, that there is so much lore about those trees. It's amazing. Esp. considering that i just talked half an hour about some trees and in the end it all makes sense :D
I've been re-reading Tolkien's majestic tales of Arda in great depth since 1974; your re-telling of these tales provides a refreshing and genuinely insightful narrative.
A lot of work goes into writing and structuring my videos and that's a thing I always try to accomplish. So thank you, very happy to hear this :)
Always great to learn more about tlotr lore. Once again, such an amazing amount of detail in each aspect, great work.
Thank you, it's also always great to see you comment here! Happy you liked it :)
I mean, what's not to like?
Thoughts on Amazon and the Tolkien Rights Tv deal? Can you feel the same effect of Star Wars now coming to TLOTR?
I think the rights situation is too complicated for that to happen, but who knows. If all parties can agree on some terms, it is possible. I hope, that Amazon sees potential in the genre and is looking for a powerful IP. With Tolkien's lore they have access to a huge universe and I'm interested to see, what they will make out of it. The universe has enough amazing stories outside of Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit. So source material shouldn't be a problem. Also Amazon has shown with this huge investment, that they are interested in creating something good. The competition is not at rest and getting this right, could be a huge boost. Ofc. should it be successful, it can happen, that we will see a Star Wars like development.
I live by a floodplain and there are often thick blankets of mist there, at dawn, twilight, and night, and at night, when the moon shines, you can clearly see thick streams of mist coming from the river, and blankets of mist forming all over the flood plain, and the willows are silhouetted by the bright moon, and so are the alders, and the other trees.
In the day, the trees around there, give off a golden-green glow as the light of the sun shines on them. Reminds me of Laurelin, whereas at night, certain trees kinda glow in a way that reminds me of Telperion.
And the plains themselves make it easy for me to imagine what the plains of Valinor/Aman look like, especially in the spring, when blossom is everywhere and the grass is fresh, and there are bees. And the sunsets illuminate the tops of the grass, too, and the architecture in the Villages and the nearby manors look somewhat Elven, in addition to the pristine gardens and such.
A beautiful story! I love how the light of the Two Trees of the Valar live on in the Sun and Moon and in the Simiril that became the Dawn Star! Wonderful video and summary of Tolkien's writings!
Yes agreed, it's a beautiful story and gives the world something mystical. I really like it. It also explains why the Elves enjoy nature, the starts and trees so much ^^ Thanks again :)
Great video, very clear and well explained!
Thank you ^^
It's about time you did another Tolkien video (lol) Anyway I find the White Tree of Gondor to be quite fascinating and (like all things Tolkien) quite deep in its lore and history. It's honesty one of my most favorite Artifacts in Middle Earth! :)
Thank you :) Yes wanted to release it at the end of February, but the moth is quite short and production did not go as smooth as I wanted it to be. So I plan to release another one this month, but we will see how this goes. My friend at GeekZone also did an excellent video on the topic, but I realized that too late.
Yes the story behind the White tree of Gondor is amazing. Actually how all of this is connected with the world and pretty much all races is mind blowing. It was a lot of fun doing research.
ThePhilosophersGames I see! I love Geekzones channel, i'm so glad you're friends with him! I completely agree, its completely mind blowing how connected it is! See ya in the next video! :)
Finally a new lore video :D Sadly some pop sounds are in my voice recording, I assume my pop filter was still too close to the mic, there are also some stupid mistakes in it, sorry for that. I made a little background to replace the simple black. Do you like that more, or do you want back the black? It was also requested to use fan art and I contacted several artists, to ask for permission, but only one wrote back, so special thanks to Niahti (www.artstation.com/niahti) for letting me use her amazing art work (The Two Trees of Valinor).
I also made some new maps, an additional information bubble and highlighted some stuff in the texts for better readability. A lot of smaller editing stuff, I hope you like it.
If you ask how the two lamps looked:
andead.deviantart.com/art/Ormal-659225699
Sadly the artist did not reply =/
I hope you like it :)
ThePhilosophersGames
Your stuff is exceptional
Thank you :)
I would like to thank Niahti also for her contribution to your presentation. It is indeed beautiful. There are so many amazing fan artists-Sorry more did not write back.
I just love hearing your pronunciation. I’m listening to all the books on audible and I wish they used your pronunciations. Love it
Thank you! A lot of research goes into the pronunciation of my video too, so much appreciated. I even made a video about this topic :)
Very comprehensive, seems like you put a lot of thought and work into the video.
Thank you :) Yes, it was far more work than expected. Wanted to release like a week ago, but needed more time. I also never thought, that the video would become that long (again ^^)
I want to thank you for the great content and for your work. GREAT naration and interpretation.
Happy you enjoyed it. Thank you too for commenting and watching :) That helps a lot on YT these days ^^
It's always interesting to think how deep Tolkien's understanding of men goes. The wisdom and words and promises of ancestors for men are swiftly forgotten, sometimes within as little as a single century. Memories turn into stories. Stories into legend. Legend into myth. The memory of men is disappointingly short and the honor and trust forgotten and even spited upon by later generations.
Well said. Tolkien tried to reflect that and explain how myth is created here and there. That also makes Men quite interesting for stories ^^ It's maybe also the price of a very limited lifetime. We need to learn so much and never even get close to know everything and then we die and the next generation needs to learn again.
@@ThePhilosophersGames this is true but pride and the need to prove to our betters also leads to the wise being looked down upon for their, for lack of a better term, "cautious" nature. Thus leading to acts of violence either out of malice or sheer stubbornness. Success comes from understanding there is a natural order to things. Tolkien proved this time and again in his stories. The fall of Numinor, the line of kings breaking, even by his own admission of the story he never finished after the fall of Sauron. Books such as his can give us a much deeper understanding of humanity as a whole and allows us to better ourselves juat by being humbled, knowing that a man long dead and forgotten by general society had us catagorized, and even openly mocks men, a century ago.
I had hoped that you were going to address the trees of Lothlorien and why the elves live in them as well as a significance of Galadriel's gift to Sam and how it replace the party Tree in Hobbiton.
The topic was so complex, that I ended up just going through the story and explaining why the elves love the trees so much. This is a topic for a Lothlórien video though.
It sets my heart ablaze with glee to hear to proper pronunciation of Feanor. I've used the name for well over a decade as a username and I cannot tell you how much it grates my nerves when I hear "feener"... the difference two dots over a letter make =D
haha I can imagine ^^ Thank you, happy you liked it :)
DUDE are you a literature teacher or something???? You explained thousands years of history like it was nothing....way better than my history teachers😂
haha no I'm not a teacher ^^ but I would say I'm quite good at explaining and to be fair, I wrote a script, which took me some weeks (esp. fine tuning), so I'm at an advantage when it comes to people holding a lecture live. Also thank you :)
Numenoreans: "Thank you greatly elves, for these gifts, what a beautiful Tree!"
< *In Thought To Self* >
[ Yeeeeeah, thanks soooo much! This tree more than evens everything out...
I'm sure eternal life on happiness island is over-rated anyways...
Thanks, though for taking the time to stop in and again remind us all how you elves got arbitrarily handed "never-ending eternal bliss on heaven island + reincarnation in case of accident ☆free of charge☆", while we got "able to die"... the gift that keeps on giving...
Why is it we're fighting on Eru's side, again?]
Numenoreans: "Give the Ainur our regards!
< *Thought* >
[Ya Jerks!!]
haha yes death does not look attractive as a gift, but on the other side it generates a drive, that elves are often missing. And who knows where the spirits of Men are going. Some Men can have some certainty that there is an afterlife, that's different for us, so our perception of death (compared to some fictional characters) is slightly different I would assume. Ofc nobody wants to die (not even the elves. They can't be sure to be re-embodied either).
@@ThePhilosophersGames lol, yes I agree with it being like a fire under your butt to get out and make that change.
Where as eru-hini are content with static existence thus the pull to aman's unchanging/undying land, Man is driven mad without ceaseless change, thus they will cause it if need be in middle earth... the whole 100 lively years vs. 1000 just content years...
I was just having some fun reading into the mind of Ar-farazon (sp?) Shortly before he booked a cruise to aman with thomas cook vacations... and having to endure an elven layover before hitting Valinor and bringing what he would see as aggravating paltry trinkets compared to the elven bliss + eternal living hand in hand with literal gods.
Numenoreans having only a guaranteed (yet easily negated, if only they would) death on his horizon (all for seemingly 'cuz screw you humie that's why' reasoning)...
haha this all makes it a li'l easier to see how ol' lord of gifts there could start sounding more n more just a wee bit enticing to envious Numenoreans unhappy with man's gift
(I wondered... Eru must've forgot man was awakening that day, and had to pick up a gift last minute, and death was all remaining on the shelves)
haha really good post ^^ had to laugh (esp. the last line) :) Yes that was probably what Ar-Pharazôn and his people were thinking xD
sauron 100% whipped up dat plague with sorcery from his boi melkor lol
Yes I think that is the case too, but if I recall correctly Tolkien words this idea very carefully in the books, so to be consistent with this, I worded it carefully too.
Great video as always best part was that animation of the Floating Island XD. It was great Also I don't know why but the TH-cam bell thing got switched off for me.
Thank you! Yes I thought that would be funny, but it's somewhat accurate at the same time ^^ I also had to maneuver around the Beleriand text, because it was part of the map in the background layer xD
Yes this bell things does what it wants on YT, it can be annoying. Still happy you found your way to the video anyway :D
*This guy deserves 1M subs. Not 10k.*
I agree, Tom :P But I'm also happy with 10k ^^
Interestingly the sun has traditionally been identified as male and the moon as female.
I doubt the 7 stars of Gondor's banner is for the palantiri. It is likely also for the 7 stars in the big dipper.
Only youtuber with consistent proper pronunciation and DESPITE the accent too!
So if the sun and moon were gifted to Maia what if Tom and Goldberry have the same origins Tom being born with the earth (land), and Goldberry the rivers (water). Hence why Tom call command natural beings, and Goldberry can recall the path of the rain into new waters.
these 'earth' illustrations look....well, quite simplistic.
they are very simplistic 😅 But was the best I could make without getting in to trouble using prettier illustrations from e.g. books.
Hi, Chris! I had a LOTR question and I haven't found the answer online so I was hoping you could help answer it: We know that after Bilbo escaped with the ring, Gollum left his mountain and searched for the ring and bilbo. He knew only his name and that he was a hobbit which he then told Sauron/Black Riders. My question is how did Gollum come across Sauron/Black Riders in the first place?
The exact detail of how he got captured we don't know, but Sauron summoned the One Ring and by this Gollum was drawn to Mordor. Gandalf and Strider tried to find him first, but failed and so Gollum went to Mordor and was captured threre. I think Gollum even went to Mordor 2-times and was only captured the 2nd time, but I might mix things up.
@@ThePhilosophersGames oh, okay. That makes sense because otherwise they would have to search a lot to have come across Gollum on Middle earth.
Man...you are GOOD!!!
Thank you ^^
Yess im so happy💪New lotr video
And you really have voice for something like this👌
I hope you like it :) You are also in the video :P
Damn, you’re good.
haha thanks ^^
Wait, how are your subscribers this low to content like this?
Thanks :) I don't know =/ But I'm also still surprised, that a small channel like mine gets so many views on some videos. So I won't complain ^^ I just try to keep making good content, subs are slowly increasing, so I'm happy :D
Just wanted to say keep it up my man, your channel is a hidden gem for me. Not only for the LoTR videos (which are admittedly my favourite part) but the rest of your videos in general come off as very thorough and well-thought, more-so than many other channels I've come across. Once again, keep up the good work, just know we appreciate the content.
Thank you :) Sadly my other content does not get as many views, but I'm usually quite happy with how the videos turned out and I think they are quite good. So thanks for mentioning it too ^^
@Блядь Россия if you try to listen to what he says, instead if just hearing them, then his voice won't matter.
That Sauron guy is a bad seed 🤔
:D
I don´t understand how the ring was saved after the destruction of Numenor?f Sauron had the ring with him when the island was sunk. How did his spirit carried the ring to Mordor?
There are two componentsn to this: Ainur (angel like spirit beings like Sauron) are complete without a physical form and are able to manipulate/change the physical world, so moving an object should not be a problem or a Maia even when without a physical body (as long as he is not diminished to a shadow, which Sauron was not, because of the Ring surviving). And the One Ring was also part of Sauron himself. His will and big parts of his power were in it, so it's plausible that he can move with it, because it's a part of his being.
This is probably a bit off subject, do you think Gandalf planted the seedling that Aragon found?1
That's a good question, but difficult to answer. Manwë send word through his eagles:
Sing now, ye people of the Tower of Anor,
for the Realm of Sauron is ended for ever,
and the Dark Tower is thrown down.
Sing and rejoice, ye people of the Tower of Guard,
for your watch hath not been in vain,
and the Black Gate is broken,
and your King hath passed through,
and he is victorious.
Sing and be glad, all ye children of the West,
for your King shall come again,
and he shall dwell among you
all the days of your life.
*And the Tree that was withered shall be renewed*,
and he shall plant it in the high places,
and the City shall be blessed.
Sing all ye people!
So a it's a renewal of the Friendship of the Dúnedain and Aman and so this sapling was needed as token and to fulfil this promise or prophecy. How it got there is hard to say, but Gandalf as Ambassador of Aman bringing King Elessar to it makes sense. So yes behind the scenes he could have planted it there. But also more super natural means would be possible. I think for mythology the how is not that important as the that it's there. But good question, never thught of it :)
@@ThePhilosophersGames Thank you. Gandalf knew about so many things and brought people where they needed to be.
No problem. Yes that's a good way of putting it :)
mooore lord of the rings please thank you! great video
Thank you :) I try to release another one this month, but my time management is very bad, so no promise =/
Because that's where they make their cookies
TL/DR: Because their secret spirit animal is a dog :)
lol
10:10 Did you say that Numenor (Elena?) meant Star Wars? I don't tink that's what you said, but now I've heard it, I cannot unhear it!!
haha no, but it's quite similar: starwards :D
I love your videos and appreciate but the vanyar didn't exist when yavanna created the trees. I don't think exolloher was an elvish word.
Thank you :) Yes the hill had a Valarin name before, but was then called Ezellohar by the Vanyar Elves (in the Silmarillion this name is mainly used). In Quenya it was called Corollaírë. I think Ezellohar was derived from the Valarin form Ezelloxar/Ezellochar (same with the special form Mahanaxar (in Quenya Rithil-Anamo). It's from the Valarin form maxananaskad/machananaskad. You find it in The War of the Jewels.
@@ThePhilosophersGames thank you for your reply I haven't read morgoths ring and some other Tolkien books but the silmarilion is one of my favourite books. Your videos are very detailed and informative. I should have known you'd have an answer for me thanks.
Or maybe the white tree is deciduous , meaning it loses leaves in winter ,autumn .
🤣Jk
haha
i like this video
Thank you :)
Not so strange. The tree was tied to the line of Isildur, Not his brother Anarion from whom Earnur descended. The line of kings never failed.
Correct. Not the blood line failed, but the Kingdom of Arnor, however Anárion's line failed and Gondor did not "accept" or ignored Isildur's line (Arvedui tried, but his claim was rejected).
Why elves like trees? Duh, because they are elves.
😅
anyone else here for elden ring
I'm waiting for it too 😂
I will cover Elden Ring on my relatively new second channel (this channel is Tolkien stuff; the second is gaming stuff), in case you are interested:
th-cam.com/users/TPhGames
(I will also stream my playthrough on Twitch)
Do you have an german accent?
Yes :D I'm from Germany :)
ThePhilosophersGames me too! I live near the border to Luxemburg.
I'm from central North Rhine-Westphalia :D
You are a joy to listen to. Thank you!!
Who doesn't like trees?
true ^^
How did elfs build their ships,cities and all without cutting trees?
I assume they also chopped wood maybe in a more balanced way. There were ofc a certain group of Wood-elves that did not chop wood or went hunting, but that is not the same for all groups of the Elves. The Noldor for sure had to get their wood somehow (also metals, stone, etc). Ofc maybe they traded a bit with other groups.
twee.
:P
Hard to follow due to the improper/mispronounced English words.
lol
Great content, annoyingly pretentious manner of speech and accent
Speech and accent are sadly nothing I can change easily. Trying to pronounce names as Tolkien described it in Appendix E of The Lord of the Rings often doesn't help too ^^ But thank you. Most work goes into the content.
No trouble here my good man.! Some are just incredibly rude and presumptuous
I love the content but what’s with the weird accent man? I mean no disrespect btw😅
Thank you :) I try to pronounce names from Tolkien's universe as Tolkien described it in Appendix E of Lord of the Rings and my normal English is with a German accent. The English th and s sounds are very difficult for me esp. switching between them in long sentences. I also have to admit, that I made many stupid mistakes this time. More than usual, but I don't know why.