lol if I ride 100 watts for an hour 5 times a week I will get way less fit. Strange to me thoughts shared but every right to express it. I’m way slower then you are and my bike costs a lot but I don’t think u need to justify it with ur level of fitness. Don’t know how u can ride while being so lean. Good genetics. Get the hike u can afford and enjoy being fit. Train harder than last time.
Hey Greg, glad you enjoyed the video. Big fan. Would love to a collaboration with you. Some ideas could be: Diet of a pro body builder vs a cyclist. Compare our power outputs on the bike vs lifting weights in the gym 😂 Pro bodybuilder bike set up vs competitive cyclist I’m open to hear any other ideas 💡 that you would find to be a good collaboration. I feel like we would have a really fun time doing this and offer great content for our viewers to watch! Hope to hear from you soon. Let’s make this HAPPEN and KEEP PEDALING!
I think the point is that a lot of people buy an expensive bike thinking It will make them faster. I doesn't (well not much anyway), I have an entry-level bike with 105 and I'm routinely dropping guys with expensive aero bikes, carbon rims etc because I'm fitter. That being said, If I had the disposable income to buy a 10k bike I would without hesitation, but it's not dissimilar to me owning a Porsche GT3RS: other than the odd track outing I'll barely use 20% of its capabilities.
Buy an expensive bike if that’s what you want and you get enjoyment out of it. Its an individuals choice. Don’t shame a cheap bike and don’t shame an unfit rider on an expensive bike. Ride bikes have fun! How many people take their 4x4 pick ups off-roading, or Ferrari’s to the race track. U do U. Whatever puts a smile on your face!
I agree also I'm a 70 year old fat guy with an $8000 bike. I enjoy the bike immensely. I also like high end cars - but I'm no racing driver and don't pretend to be. Them super professionals bike champions are genetic freaks with a startlingly good VO2 Max. The average rider cant even get near to them. You cant train your self to be anywhere near the pro's genetic advantages. It's the old story. - You got it - or you ain't. - Deal with it - don't pretend.
@@whazzat8015 Woweee 8000 years old - two questions. (a) Did you ride your bike to work when you were working on the pyramids or Stone Henge? (b) The question we all want to know - How did you build either of those?
LOL'ing at a lot of the comments here. I have a both an $8,000 SystemSix Hi-Mod and a $600 Allez Steel with upgraded Ultegra components. I'm 5 minutes faster on a local 9 mile stretch of road on my System Six. FIVE MINUTES. The bike matters. Period. If you want to get into the best shape possible, then yeah I'll agree that the bike doesn't matter. If you want to go as fast as possible, then yes the bike and components matter. I will admit that the performance difference between a $2,500 bike and a $10,000 bike is splitting hairs. Not much difference and you're at the point of diminishing returns.
$8000 carbon whip vs $600 flexy steel whip is rocket ships to apples. In regards to diminishing returns for amateurs its even more so considering fitness is the biggest factor (ignoring PEDs).
After riding bikes for more than 30 years, I learned that buying the most expensive bike I can afford made me to ride more. It weakened my wallet but strengthened my health. Sounds a good investment for me.
@@lastlavender5351 True. But if a nice bike helps motivate someone to ride and it is reasonably within their financial capabilities, then it is well worth it in my opinion.
Came back to cycling after several years and used my old road bike to get fit on and to se where it took me. Three years later I treated myself to something special, nothing wrong with that. You are right, training and getting your head right comes first and will pay dividends, but I love my dream bike and ride it regularly.
I couldn't watch the full thing. It got boring quickly when all you heard was talk about fitness. It got so boring, I started to read people's comments...haha!
Cycling equipment has crazy diminishing returns. The difference between a mid range bike and a high end bike in terms of mechanical efficiency are single digit percentages, differences in aero making the biggest difference. But in a race situation you are far more likely to lose because you blew your stack with bad tactics or just how the race shapes up rather than because of your equipment. At the highest levels these things add up, but there is no bike out there that makes up for chasing the wrong breakaway or riding outside your limits.
That's a limited understanding. The guys in the breakaway with faster bikes can not be caught with the same fitness and a slower bike. With a faster bike they can be caught.
@@benbraceletspurple9108 speaking of limited understanding! An aero frame and wheels vs a non-aero frame a wheels has a potential benefit of a few seconds in an hour. It not even noticeable. Wind tunnel testing is absolutely useless, and it's all marketing BS. REal world testing proves otherwise. The guys in the breakaway are pushing big watts and have good body positioning. The equipment does almost nothing.
Two years ago I built my Litespeed C1R bike with 10 speed Ultegra DI2 & rim brakes for just over $1400 and I love it. I see no need to run out and spend a huge amount of cash to "upgrade" from this bike.
I finally treated myself this year (because of pandemic there was just more time to bike). I am poor so spending a whole months salary on a bike is a huge deal for me. And once I did I was really intimidated, actually apologizing to my Orbea because I was not getting the most use of this amazing bike. Like it deserves to be with someone that can push it to it's limits. But taking it out every day I could feel that I was getting more and deserving, not faster at all, but overall much stronger and I knew that I could push myself more and ride for longer. Because I bought a more expensive bike I really felt that I had to earn it, so it resulted in me biking more, getting fitter and stronger (losing 10kg this 'pandemic season' alone). And now I even wake up in the morning without thinking about what the weather is like outside, just go and bike anyways. I live in Norway so now it's pretty dark and pretty cold most of the time, but the joy I get pedaling around kinda beats that.
@@Kevinschart closer to 3000, so yes that month and the next two months after that I was poor. But it was a good investment. And a nice gift to myself that keeps on giving.
Idk but if anyone’s looking for a decent hardtail checkout the schwinn moab 3 especially if you want to upgrade it. I got mine, small frame, I’m 5’7 for $650 on Amazon. Their main website last time a checked has some instock for 770$.
Or buy a good second hand bike. I bought 4th hand former pro bike for around 1200 USD, it was well maintained but with a few scratches, and the seller was an enthusiastic cyclist.
I recently bought a second hand scott gravel bike for $650 cash at a coffee shop to use as my commuter to the gym and just stop driving my car. My last dope trek road bike (~$2200)was stolen.... so I’ve been without wheels for three years, and this second hand buy got me back on the road!! This video hits dead on with making smarter choices with your dollar, and making sure the real machine (your body) is at peak condition! New sub dude!
as a triathlete the amount of hours that goes into my cycling is insane... but you are right if you are a beginner it will be hard to hit 300 watts plus in the uphill's and feel fast no matter what the bike is .. cycling needs massive leg power and mental strength
Hahaha got my bike for free, a 1988 Road bike from my grandfather but I did change a lot from it to get it down to 7.7kg and I only spend 400$, I'm dropping all these expensive bike riders at ease.
@@Balmung812 Perzactly! One could find (prePandemic) a 15-20 year old bike with low mileage, primo componentry, @22 lbs for $200. At 30+ years you have a fine ridable machine, but the gearing will be a bit of reach, 12speeds total and a bit heftier, though with a supple steel frame ride, salable for the investment , should you want something else, with savings in the four figures. After all, who's gonna be there for you later?? your legs or the guys that want to take your money?
My friend was flexing with his new 8000 dolar bike on start line of race and mocking me about my 1500 dolar 10.5kg bike. You can imagine his face when i was droping him on climb in first couple of kilometers of race. :) There is no better feeling. :)
thats the best feeling ! when i can drop some self called PRO" just cause they had some exp and a nice bike, i drop them in the first hill and they were drafting after me, i watched and they were gone, despite of my effort i felt soooo nice
There was some ultra endurance track runner in my town, his friend made him hop on a bike and he cycled that thing like a rotor engine. So he suggested he enter some amateur cycling race, and he entered with a single speed bike. Everyone thought he was crazy, but he won like 2 races before they disqualified him for "being on steroids". Moral is if you're in good shape, it doesnt matter if other people's bikes are made of carbon or even platinum.
@Vicki Peterson Nope, he was just one of those real life superhumans that runs like 20 kilometers a day as routine. Like i said he's an ultra endurance runner. People like him get nicknamed "Diesel" cuz they just keep going and going, i heard of another one like him in the news recently so they are not that rare.
I’m gonna be honest with you and say that I’ve watched your vids before and not subscribed, but this vid made me want to sub because I think this fitness first mentality is needed to help people with less money get into the sport! Great content and I look forward to more.
If you like the feel of quality components, and don't have or don't want to spend a lot of money, an older high-end bike with low miles is a good option. I actually enjoy riding some of the older steel bikes more than newer carbon bikes. And I tend to ride more often and stay out longer when I enjoy the ride. So I get better exercise while enjoying it more.
My brother with aluminum road bike sweeps carbon cyclist in our town and he was known for sweeping lightweights bicycle everytime he ride and participate to a boundary race,what they don't know is that he used pedaling a mega weight of steel bicycle when he was a kid and there he got his power dude, it's not the bike it's your leg
Fitness is clearly key. Diet is a major part of fitness. Eat well. Train well. But also buy the best bike you can if it’s what you enjoy. Life is short. I’m just buying a nice custom build Titanium bike. It’s a thing of joy and beauty. No harm in expensive gear. But I’d never go into debt for it.
Electronic shifting is my primary reason for purchasing a more expensive bike. I hate poor shifts, and I don't have the time or desire to constantly be screwing with my derailleurs, especially now that I have a family and far less time than I used to have to play with my bike. Electronic shifting alleviates that problem and allows me to just focus on riding and enjoy the time I have on the bike, but it also tends to come on higher spec (and higher price) bikes. I've also found over the years that if I never upgrade wheels, or by the time I want to, technology has advanced and it's harder to find compatible wheelsets. Might as well pay for decent wheels up front.
@@monkmchorning Cables stretch. Everything 105 and up has been relatively solid for me, but the lower end groupsets tend to give me issues. Front derailleurs especially. That said, it depends somewhat on application. For a gravel bike or mountain bike, I'll always go mechanical so I can perform field fixes if I need to.
Money can buy you speed! But most of the gains are only on long and/or high watts rides so I do agree with you that for 99% of riders a mid range bike ($2000- $4000) is more then enough! And that it more important to focus on improving fitness, endurance and physical strength then being obsessed with the bike.
Lmao I've had terrrrible 5th hand bikes with terrible allignment, geartrain, and weighed 35+ lbs. Anything 25lbs or below is a dream...and I'm buying a 18.5 lbs Madone SL6 tomorrow ✨
I'm with you. The advanced aluminum frames from Cannondale, BMC, Trek, and Specialized are all excellent, and so is the midrange carbon. Match with 105, Rival, or even Tiagra, and you have a very satisfying ride.
I totally agree with this!! I started my cycling journey on a heavier Hybrid bike and bought myself my first road bike, nothing to expensive. My weight-loss and fitness level have excelled because I trained hard on a heavier bike 👌🏽
There is a middle ground, department store bikes are unlikely to fit or operate well and the fancy options (disk brakes) are of such low quality that they are nothing more than an annoyance. For a beginner I would suggest a bike that FITS, uses common durable components, enough gear range for their fitness/terrain and starting with new cables, pads and a tune up. Suggested upgrade path would start at the contact points; bibs, saddle, shoes, pedals, bar tape. Continue until they are comfortably riding a reliable steed. Materials do matter, carbon does a very nice job dampening vibrations and flexing where you want it, but not where you don't. I've never ridden an alu fork that wasn't awful. Going to vintage steel is a mixed bag, they are very soft and noodle like, but you'll need to know how to work on them, got your cone wrenches handy? Downtube shifters are bombproof, annoying, but super simple to adjust correctly. Oh and that 6 speed 11-24 freewheel... Not what i would recommend for a new rider.
@@JeBaSIINGH23 yeah it's a difficult time for it, but somewhat unfortunately I'll bet that a year from now the used market is going to explode. I have a very short (4'10ish) coworker, my god, her options are nearly non-existent for a road bike.
@@All4Grogg I'm thinking the same thing! I'm planning on upgrading when that happens!!! Oh man I know how it feels, I bought the only 49 in all of my city... GTA yup it was a tough find
So tired of people bashing those who buy expensive bikes. Its their money. Why does anyone care? How do we calculate a bike's value? If people are motivated to ride by having a shinny new high-end model its far, far better than not going out on a ride. Have fun out there - and stop comparing whatever you ride with whatever other people ride. (I ride a 13 year old bike myself)
Pedalar, new sub here. I love your videos, I'm also from Toronto. Just picked up my first road bike, a second hand Specialized Tarmac SL2 with 105 componentry and a second hand Tacx Flux S. Your content is inspiring, keep up the amazing work!
Sweet setup! I’m a big believer in buying secondhand.. let someone else pay the premium for new and shiny, then take it off their hands a few years later for a fraction of the price 👍🏻
@@Oakpathetics thanks! I recently picked up cycling and it doesn't make sense to me buying brand new, especially when I'm not sure if I even like/love it. Actually, I'm addict to cycling 😎💯
It's not a waste of money if money is no object. If you have to take a second mortgage to get that super bike, then it doesn't make sense. But those who have ridden superbikes vs. the middle of road carbon with tiagra components can all agree that the ride on the superbike is much, much sweeter.
Hi. I have a Giant TCR 2020 105 Kom, but just bought an "expensive" Canyon Ultimate SL Disc Etap Force. Why? Because the Giant really felt shitty, and I felt cheated. I do not regret, there is no comparison between them, although I will keep the TCR for the trainer.
Nah. How much money is in the bank doesnt determine whether some is a "waste". What does is $$$ invested vs performance improvement outcomes (or just outcomes if we want to include things like emotional outcomes). Imagine running a business where the CEO says "who cares we have a of money". No one would think investing in something with minimal or shit returns is OK because theres more money.
You sir are dropping some serious logic! I’ve been drooling over the more expensive bikes, shopping to jump from a aluminum frame “gravel bike” to a carbon frame and feeling the pull that I should get the way more expensive electric shift super light race bike when in reality I’m never going to race in crit, over weight but getting lighter and stronger thanks to the tacx trainer and Zwift lol and pushing 40... 105 will be the next for me! Riding out of halton hills Ontario. Great vids!
It's great hearing you're increasing your fitness and it'd ironic you mentioned a carbon gravel bike with electronic shifting which I have and I don't think it's worth it and wished I would have got mechanical and saved some $$$. Keep the good work up!!!
Its genetics. You can train all you want but you're not going to turn into Peter Sagan or Greg van Avermaet or no matter what your bike costs. The easiest way to get rid of some weight is to lose it rather than paying $ XXXX + for a lighter bike.
Totally agree. Why worry grams in bike, if rider has kilos of extra weight. I bought entry price bike with wider gravel tires, which makes riding very comfortable and I can take trips to places which are beyond road bike. I mostly drive road but occasionally it's fantastic to drive dusty gravel road or totally dark sideroads with super bright lamp.
Fitness determines performance... amen. Recently started back cycling on a used Felt Z5 and I have to get myself in shape. This is the bike I will use to do it.
Do you ride 8 hours a day, cyclists, runners. Train,eat ,sleep. And have failed marriages. Runners an easy 20 in the morning. Afternoon an easy 15, Kenyons run 20 one way and 20 back. Running for money. Is hard. Cris Carmichael Lance Armstrong’s coach.said once you get a life it’s hard to get on your bike 12 hours a week... didn’t you see Lance’s Nike commercial...plus the mountains... DDD...
Can relate! I love my old 2013 TCR Advance 2 (10sp 105). I ended up getting a new ultegra groupset (r8000 11sp). I'm rebuilding it and putting my r5700 10sp 105 on my commuter bike. Dedicating my money and time on fixing my old bike because then it means more when I build it up myself.
I’d recommend an aero race bike for riders who can average 20 mph for 2 hours riding solo on rolling terrain or if they ride 24 mph avg on group rides. If a rider is averaging 15 mph week in and week out then it doesn’t matter.
I like what you just said. If your not a pro all your doing is wasting your money. Like myself, when I was riding, I never used clip-less peddles, just toe straps and I did fine. But you are right about what you said; everything you said. Peace!!!!
You got a point regarding fitness to ride. As an older rider (61), fitness is paramount to your incentive to ride, regardless of the amount of money spent to buy a bike. I've ridden with guys bikes that are 20+ yrs old and they routinely drop guys on expensive bikes, because of their fitness level. I have worked hard on my fitness to ride my bikes, because the fitter you are the more you're going to enjoy riding. It doesn't matter whether it's a $1,500 or $10,000 bike, I'm going ride either one at the same speed.
Hello from Paris ! Nice video. I often see riders buying high end bikes with Dura Ace and finally downgrading the spare parts and components to 105 because of the price. I prefer 105 and good wheels.
You seem to forget about one important thing : passion If only top riders would deserve to ride those super expensives bikes, the bike industry wouldn't even build them. Why buy a Ferrari or even a BMW or a Mercedes when you can only drive 60 miles/hour on the road ? Passion is the answer and this goes the same with bikes. Most of the people don't buy an expensive bike because they need it, it's because they want it. Also sometimes, buying an expensive bike will force you to improve your fitness. I totally get what your point but if every rider would buy a bike depending on his fitness, we would see pretty cheap bikes all day long.
Yeah I think this video is off base. High end bikes exist for the same reason anything high end exists. People have surplus cash and want to spend it on nice shit.
Comes down to just go out there and ride with whatever you have, no excuses. I am a rower who have been injured for 3 months, rib fracture which has been super slow to heal. Did some cycling to keep some of my fitness before the snow hit( live in northern Sweden). The bike I used was a 1970 grandma 2 speed city cruiser with wobbly wheels, heavy as hell and a faulty second gear that forced me to mainly use first( it's a pretty cool bike, only has a coaster brake and you shift by breaking). Of course I was looking for something else to use but couldn't find someone selling a racer in my small town so just used what I had. Did 2h-2h30m rides on that cruiser everyday for a month. Best speed I could manage on the bike was a session were I did 49 km in almost exactly 2h, fairly flat, no wind, mostly riding car roads and going pretty much all out. So incredibly slow bike but why would speed matter unless you are using it for transportation or competing? Obviously you would want a racing bike and not a cruiser since an upright posture prevents using power to an extent and also you would want access to lots of gears. Other than that though I don't see why not something like an old cheap vintage racer wouldn't work for most people . It's not like your body can tell the difference between a slow and fast bike. You will gain fitness in just the same way. A cheap vintage racer is precisely what I am trying to find now. Cycling was pretty fun so figured I would keep cycling as cross training after winter.
Alternative: 10-year-old high end bikes have fantastic performance, are very light and cost $1000-1500. Still have my 2004 Cannondale full Dura-Ace road racer and it would not be the limiting factor for someone trying to go fast.
I don't think you need the most expensive but there is definitely a difference between a cheap Walmart bike and an entry level Trek, Giant, Specialized, Bianchi, etc. I've found the ultra cheap bikes from Walmart, box stores are super heavy, poorly built group sets, poor sizing/geometry and no help. My first reentry to cycling was a used Specialized Dolce for 500 which was far lighter and fit me so much better than my ancient steel Schwinn. Great bike, got me to want to ride more. Next bike was an entry level carbon bike for 1700, got me to want to ride even more. Then came the gift of my Bianchi Oltre XR3 and that bike has really changed my viewpoint about pricing. Lightest bike I've ever had, most comfortable/best fitting bike I've ever had, best shifting, etc. All in all I see myself riding that bike forever and wanting to ride it every day.
Great video!! Definitely recommend a bikefit especially the bike on your tacx at 9:30min - sitting a bit high which is causing you to rock on the saddle and open your ankle through the bottom of the pedal stroke . Give you more comfort and maximise your efficiency! Great channel! Look forward to your next videos!!!
Appreciated and I mentioned this in previous videos that clip of me on the trainer was me recording my position before I did an at home bike fit which I ended up lowering my saddle height. Thanks for the encouragement!
i have a Kouta kharma carbon fiber 2008...but still have it,and invest Giant TCR advanced disc 2021 just couple months ago. but to invest this kind of bike its worth it. honestly i invest this bike for my health, now i'm 52 years old and still going strong:)
I used to be like you, training with a cheap bike. But One day I was training hard and felt a sudden lack in moral due to the piece zhiet I was riding. Thats when I realized I needed Chris Froomes bike and that changed my life
Getting new equipment can help motivate you. Knowing that there are no excuses left and it's down to you to push. Nothing wrong with enjoying gadgets and buying upgrades if it keeps you in the saddle. It's all part of the show.
I live in switzerland. In summer its warm to hot not too hot and in winter its freezing cold sub zero. I ride the bike 2h a day for comuting to and from work. Iam warm in winter and fresh in summer. Why? Because I use qualuty clothing.
I ride a Trek checkpoint ALR and the only place I struggle keeping up with Tarmacs and Emondas is on the climbs. There you really really feel the weight but otherwise most people on more expensive bikes around here are less fit than I am or too muscular in the wrong places, especially the upper body. My biggest argument for staying aluminum though is how I use my bike. I can't justify the mental cage an expensive bike would put me in. This ALR went for 1200$ on sale and it lets me get out there so I can scratch it up without it killing me and live the way I want to live. That's my argument to stay within my budget and capabilities. A more expensive bike would personally make me a worse, more anxious rider.
It's a waste of money for most people, certainly if it's only a bike for weekend/sunday rides. Those folks buy a €5000+ bike for riding an average speed of hardly 25km/h, that is just plain ridiculous.
If the issue is fitness, what you ride is actually doesn't matter. You can still be efficient with heavier bikes, then you'll become even faster in superbikes.
This is kind of pointless really. I have an s-works venge, I’m a good rider but definitely not a professional racer and I probably don’t get the maximum that the bike can offer but I love riding it, it feels great and I can afford it. It’s like 90% of people who drive Porsche 911 GT3s, they too are probably not racing car drivers but they love the the feeling of the car and the engineering behind it. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it and there’s no point in hating on such people. For that matter I should tell you that you should work harder so you can actually afford to ride the bike you actually want but I won’t because that too is a silly statement.
Agree. When we talk about "you should buy this and that", somebody must categorize group of people first. Then talk about thing "they should buy". In many cases, rich people and pro cyclist must exclude from the discussion. Rich people can buy whatever they want and pro cyclist get sponsored. The only thing that make people hate to each other in non-pro world because when expensive bike owner look down to cheap bike owner and the minivelo smoked them all and everybody offended😅 Not all, probably in some cases. This hateness not only in bike world, most cases in this maniac materialistic world such cars, handphone, motorbike, toys, rc, clothing etc. Same hateness occur. This drama will keep going forever. Probably we also need this kind of argument/drama for company to make less expensive bike better.
I agree there shouldn’t be hating on expensive bikes as everyone’s financial situation is different.. a spesh aethos could be 1 day salary for some and if they want to enjoy nice things, good on them.. I think this applies to most of us who are thrifty.. no doubt the best gains are achieved from fitness. I’ve also become a lot more cynical about the bike manufacturers marketing BS.
Your comment is completely valid, but there's nothing more fun than picking out the guy on the 5 - 10k bike on a ride an ensuring you're ahead of them. To me, they are nothing but motivation to try harder...
I rode with the Italian Olympic team on the roads of Rio in 2016 and I felt like they were on motorcycles, so hard they can ride. I couldn't keep up for 2 minutes!
Enjoying the video. I'm 67 and bought a $1300 USD ebike 49.7 lbs. After six months, I totally ride with the motor off. I do an hour of cardio and Total Gym resistance training daily for the past year. Road are gravel and asphalt. Looking for a non ebike, anything under 25 lbs will be awesome. Oh yeah, I lost 30 lbs doing this. Same as getting a lighter bike.
I'm from Buffalo. I feel your pain on the cold weather stuff. 105 and carbon is definitely the sweet spot. Once you go DI2 though it's hard to go back.
True. My bike was 3k when I bought it. I got in great form with it for the last 3 years then I started swapping for upgrades. The upgrades smoothen and make the ride better when you have the fitness up. Not just an expensive bike. Eddy Mercx said, "don't buy upgrades, ride up grades."
I paid through the nose for Ultegra on my Cannondale and, although I’m pleased with it, I will definitely not be buying it again as 105 is more than enough. To be honest, I may even go with Tiagra....
@T D I watched his other video where he said it gives a 30 sec advantage over the course of a race. To me this doesn't justify the cost, as I use it for fitness. For ride quality I use 28c ))
Do you have a top 5 bikes you recommend for what you talking about. because I'm looking to take my fitness to the next level but like you said I'm not trying to break the bank either
So honest and true!!! but yeah, I'll stick to my alloyframe-alloyfork-Claris endurance-fit bike ($800) than the "beginner" carbon bike with 105 groupset ($2000) (C'mon man it isn't entry-level... Lol...) {there is a price difference of $1200} I can get fitter on the current bike I have and compete... Thanks!!!! Subbed!!!!
Been there, done that. From an entry-level to the flagship, UCI pros kind of gears. In the end, it is the training, the discipline, and consistency. $20K of racing gears won't let you ride faster than in a $2K gear. Sure uphill, lighter will help, deep rims will help with flat terrains, etc. The help these gears give does not outweigh the athleticism. If you gotta spend, go for an aero helmet and skinsuit first. I wish I could go pro but like what I mentioned, the hunger and discipline aren't with me.
Honestly, I agree. Unless you're racing or climbing mountains you really don't need an expensive bike. The only 2 things that affect a bike on flat ground are rolling resistance and wind resistance. The only time the weight of the bike comes in to play is in climbs and in acceleration that's it. If you're not racing or climbing 1000's of feet during a ride then a top spec aluminum Bike will always be better than an entry level carbon bike and similarly priced. I have a 2010 Cervelo S-1, the first aero race bike ever made, the fact that I have no problem keeping up with people on a group ride is why I've not bought a carbon bike. True a carbon bike is probably going to out sprint me, but I'm not racing. It's slow to climb but I live in an area of rolling hills and river valleys so the weight really doesn't bother me, and again I'm not racing. If I wanted to buy a Dogma F I could, but why? To say I have one?
I'm riding a Bianchi 928L (2007) invested in a good groupset Dura-Ace 7800 10 speed. And dropping race geometry, disc aero bikes owners from the group. The only thing I'm looking forward to is adding modern shifters.
I want to argue with you because of my decision to own expensive bikes, but you're right. Also, I used to have a 2016 TCR Advanced SL identical to yours. What do you think of yours? I felt that the ISP made the ride too stiff. The 2021 TCR 105 is killer.
You are so right. I started road cycling with a $7.7k BMC Roadmachine last July. In Oct, I found a 2012 BMC Aluminum frame, built it up with sourced together R8000 groupset. My aluminum bike rides better and I ride better than the expensive bike. As you stated, I am not in shape enough to push the new bike. I’d like to know more about getting into better shape. Oh btw, I’m much older
Reality is most people don't want to make the time to train(me included sometimes). The other reality is that some people have $ burning a hole in their pocket and want something nice even if they aren't that fast or super competitive. I see your point and agree that training is far better for your experience than trying to buy speed but one is easy and one isn't, let's see what most people pick...
Ah I see what you're saying. For me, I don't necessarily think that someone doesn't "deserve" to ride a high-end bike because they're not fit enough, but I do 100% agree that it's more worthwhile to get a cheaper bike. It's just that with expensive bikes, you're improving the equipment by such a small margin per dollar that you're not getting a return unless you're an elite competitor. If I was riding a $12,000 superbike, Chris Froome would still blow me away on an $800 entry-level bike.
Great to hear you are fit , i think if you race a expensive bike is dodgy unless someone else is paying for it , but a really lovely bike is about how it makes you feel , like cars we don't need to be formula 1 drivers to drive a Ferrari
I'm 51 yo now. When I was younger I did ride/race when possible with domestic and sometimes foreign professionals. There is more than they are just "fit"...they are the genetic freaks of the fit athletes. They simply are capable of doing more with less. Yes, most of us just lack the baseline fitness to even be able to train at that level. But one can train and race (and waste) a lot of resources pursuing a pro career and NEVER get there, in fact MOST NEVER GET THERE. The bike helps but has very little to do with it, a trained pro will ride crap if that's what they are paid to do and still win. The bike is just a tool--nice tools are better but any tool will do b/c it's the craftsman that makes it happen.
I'm on a 2016 TCR model. Added a power meter. Changed wheels and tyres. That's it. All gains are due to me training. I don't waste money trying to go faster by buying a top end machine. Lots of things to do first before splashing the cash.
I could agree with some things you’ve mentioned. BUT... if you a passionate about cycling buy a bike thats the MOST you can afford! If you go cheap, that’ll only make you think of upgrading every time you get on it and see others with better gear, specially if you have potential. Getting a cheap bike will only make it more expensive in the future! Im blessed and had the opportunity to get a 7k bike and I love it. Dont think of selling it anytime soon, in fact unless I crash, frame gets damage, I dont see myself changing it. It has everything I want and need in a bike as a competitive cyclist. Another point: if expensive it will hold its value due to better group-sets, carbon rims and frame. A cheap bike will not hold its value, it will be harder to get most of money you paid for at beginning and buying another Cheap bike will not fix your desire to get the best you can afford. I didnt go Cheap and I could have gone that route and saves prob 4-5k. But Im happy and love my bike. Motivated me to wake up early or ride late after work. 😉 If you are just testing if you like cycling is another story. Rent or use a friends bike before even buying a “cheap” bike because even then it will cost you 2-3k which is not easy money to drop on bike for most people. If you are just using it for indoors (swift), no brainer, get a Walmart bike and connect to Wahoo or Tacx whatever you have. I live in Florida, everything is flat around here. I wanted an AERO FRAME bike which typically go higher in price that normal climbing or lighter frame models. At the end, it depends how serious you are and how deep your pockets are.
I need ur opinion please... am getting into biking regularly... which one u reckon i go for - Java Siluro 3 2019 or the 2010 Specialized Allez Elite Saxo Bank edition?
I've owned some expensive bikes, but decided to get back into cycling and spent just £95 on a new bike,; it has an aluminium frame and is light enough. It's enjoyable to ride for 30 miles+. I've realised that you don't need the best bike to enjoy cycling, and if you're not racing, the time doesn't matter; I seem to go faster than most around me anyway. Just enjoy cycling. Oh, and I'm losing weight fast!
I would trade riding on a zwift for riding outdoors in Arizona when it's 115f any day of the week. Nothing can replace being outdoors and getting fresh air and negative ions.
When u pedal down stroke Your legs Way too extended like chopping ...... lower saddle at least 1-2 cm and more saddle back by 3 mm-5 mm for better knee control and power
I get this comment a lot, in the video that was me recording my current position and then changing it once I reviewed the clip. I did lower it down. (I filmed it as I was doing my own bike fit/ correction) thanks!
with the saddle too high , the leg remains extended for 2 or 3 cm of pedal movement at the 6 o'clock position. This is lag. It must be made up somewhere. The result is an excessively high acceleration at the 9 o'clock position (upswing). The knee angle should close up instantly after full leg extension.
I largely agree with this, but it's not just about your overall fitness level but the terrain you regularly ride. People who live in flatter, less demanding locales like the Midwest don't need hydraulic disc brakes and the stiffest, lightest carbon frames - as they really need to push it to 10/10ths to see all the benefits of a high-end bike. However, if you live in say Utah or Colorado with really steep gradients on some of the highest mountain passes, someone of mediocre to intermediate-level fitness will still benefit immensely from upgrading a bike somewhere in the 2.5 - 3k range, as opposed to riding a much cheaper bike. The better drivetrain will shift cleanly on steep hills, the bike will climb with much more prowess and efficiency, and the descent will be less scary when you have the brakes to keep your speed in check on a long mountain road. Really depends on where you're riding it and how hard you're pushing yourself. Just my 2 cents.
I have only been riding for 2 years, after having not riding for over 40 years, and have gone through two road bikes before I settled in on a Pinarello Gan. I found out quality matters as does the material, from starting out with a steel frame Bianchi, to an aluminum frame with a carbon fork Bianchi which was fast but didn't have the quality ride as the Gan. I agree with many of the comments on this thread, buy a bike you can afford, new or used, and ride to your capability. I would love to have a Dogma F8 or F12, but it doesn't make sense for me being 67 and only do light competitions.
Yes totally agree you put the effort in you're cycling you will get the results I am on a giant tcr advanced 2017 and I love it ,Iam still learning and I would love to get on a more modern bike down the track when I am better in group rides and faster, and I love the fitness of cycling and I like to test myself on the hills , thanks for the info, like you're channel . Alex . Perth WA .🚴♂️🇦🇺
I raced in the late 80s early 90s. I had no money. Always wanted the beautiful Colnago but couldn't afford it. Got a cheap carbon fiber specialized allez epic frame from a specialized rep and built it up with Campy Athena. I raced crits which meant crashes, so I didn't get Shimano brake shifters or Zipp wheels. I'm glad I didn't, I've seen expensive equipment get destroyed in pileups. Most of us who race low amateur race crits, so equipment is secondary to strength and tactics.
lol if I ride 100 watts for an hour 5 times a week I will get way less fit. Strange to me thoughts shared but every right to express it. I’m way slower then you are and my bike costs a lot but I don’t think u need to justify it with ur level of fitness. Don’t know how u can ride while being so lean. Good genetics. Get the hike u can afford and enjoy being fit. Train harder than last time.
Hey Greg, glad you enjoyed the video. Big fan. Would love to a collaboration with you.
Some ideas could be:
Diet of a pro body builder vs a cyclist.
Compare our power outputs on the bike vs lifting weights in the gym 😂
Pro bodybuilder bike set up vs competitive cyclist
I’m open to hear any other ideas 💡 that you would find to be a good collaboration. I feel like we would have a really fun time doing this and offer great content for our viewers to watch!
Hope to hear from you soon. Let’s make this HAPPEN and KEEP PEDALING!
That's an edited comment?! Scarecrow , you need a brain , not a bike. More bloodflow above your neck and less to your legs.
@@whazzat8015 😂🤣
@@Pedaler My money is on Greg winning an 500m sprint, any event of a greater distance and well, thanks for attending Greg...
I think the point is that a lot of people buy an expensive bike thinking It will make them faster. I doesn't (well not much anyway), I have an entry-level bike with 105 and I'm routinely dropping guys with expensive aero bikes, carbon rims etc because I'm fitter.
That being said, If I had the disposable income to buy a 10k bike I would without hesitation, but it's not dissimilar to me owning a Porsche GT3RS: other than the odd track outing I'll barely use 20% of its capabilities.
Buy an expensive bike if that’s what you want and you get enjoyment out of it. Its an individuals choice. Don’t shame a cheap bike and don’t shame an unfit rider on an expensive bike. Ride bikes have fun! How many people take their 4x4 pick ups off-roading, or Ferrari’s to the race track. U do U. Whatever puts a smile on your face!
I agree 💯% ..
I agree also
I'm a 70 year old fat guy with an $8000 bike. I enjoy the bike immensely.
I also like high end cars - but I'm no racing driver and don't pretend to be.
Them super professionals bike champions are genetic freaks with a startlingly good VO2 Max.
The average rider cant even get near to them. You cant train your self to be anywhere near the pro's genetic advantages.
It's the old story. - You got it - or you ain't. - Deal with it - don't pretend.
@@lezivanerrol3697 I am an 8000 year old fat guy with a $70 bike. same enjoyment, same balance.
@@whazzat8015 Woweee 8000 years old - two questions.
(a) Did you ride your bike to work when you were working on the pyramids or Stone Henge?
(b) The question we all want to know - How did you build either of those?
Yep, its your bike, do what you want with it. But if you don't ride it you have wasted your money.
LOL'ing at a lot of the comments here. I have a both an $8,000 SystemSix Hi-Mod and a $600 Allez Steel with upgraded Ultegra components. I'm 5 minutes faster on a local 9 mile stretch of road on my System Six. FIVE MINUTES. The bike matters. Period. If you want to get into the best shape possible, then yeah I'll agree that the bike doesn't matter. If you want to go as fast as possible, then yes the bike and components matter.
I will admit that the performance difference between a $2,500 bike and a $10,000 bike is splitting hairs. Not much difference and you're at the point of diminishing returns.
$8000 carbon whip vs $600 flexy steel whip is rocket ships to apples.
In regards to diminishing returns for amateurs its even more so considering fitness is the biggest factor (ignoring PEDs).
I have a question. Do you think that the new Caad 13 with 105, is the sweet spot? Especially if you could have just one road bike?
Sweet spot is always a good used bike sth like Tarmac sl3 or madone or synapse from 2017 etc@@MrWelfarehater
After riding bikes for more than 30 years, I learned that buying the most expensive bike I can afford made me to ride more. It weakened my wallet but strengthened my health. Sounds a good investment for me.
@@lastlavender5351 True. But if a nice bike helps motivate someone to ride and it is reasonably within their financial capabilities, then it is well worth it in my opinion.
I’m with you. When I see my madone SLR hanging on the wall I wanna ride it 🤣🤣
Big plus is that you don't have enough money left to do anything but train.
@@whazzat8015 Haha.... the point is to buy the most expensive bike you can afford not the most most money can buy.
Same. The ride quality is also really noticeably better
Came back to cycling after several years and used my old road bike to get fit on and to se where it took me. Three years later I treated myself to something special, nothing wrong with that. You are right, training and getting your head right comes first and will pay dividends, but I love my dream bike and ride it regularly.
Talks too much about his fitness and not really why buying an expensive bike is a waste of money.
Dead right, just goes on and on and on, without getting to the point of the video. wasted my time
This video could have been edited down a lot. The bit about pros was completely unnecessary
The me me me generation.
I couldn't watch the full thing. It got boring quickly when all you heard was talk about fitness. It got so boring, I started to read people's comments...haha!
@@richardevans9465 thanks for the info. Glad i went to the comments first. Didn't watch the vid too.
Cycling equipment has crazy diminishing returns. The difference between a mid range bike and a high end bike in terms of mechanical efficiency are single digit percentages, differences in aero making the biggest difference. But in a race situation you are far more likely to lose because you blew your stack with bad tactics or just how the race shapes up rather than because of your equipment. At the highest levels these things add up, but there is no bike out there that makes up for chasing the wrong breakaway or riding outside your limits.
That's a limited understanding.
The guys in the breakaway with faster bikes can not be caught with the same fitness and a slower bike. With a faster bike they can be caught.
And it's not even the aero of the bike, but the position that the bike makes you get int
@@benbraceletspurple9108 speaking of limited understanding! An aero frame and wheels vs a non-aero frame a wheels has a potential benefit of a few seconds in an hour. It not even noticeable. Wind tunnel testing is absolutely useless, and it's all marketing BS. REal world testing proves otherwise. The guys in the breakaway are pushing big watts and have good body positioning. The equipment does almost nothing.
You're bike is as good as the rider, riding it, no matter what bike you're on .🚴♂️🇦🇺
Two years ago I built my Litespeed C1R bike with 10 speed Ultegra DI2 & rim brakes for just over $1400 and I love it. I see no need to run out and spend a huge amount of cash to "upgrade" from this bike.
I finally treated myself this year (because of pandemic there was just more time to bike). I am poor so spending a whole months salary on a bike is a huge deal for me. And once I did I was really intimidated, actually apologizing to my Orbea because I was not getting the most use of this amazing bike. Like it deserves to be with someone that can push it to it's limits. But taking it out every day I could feel that I was getting more and deserving, not faster at all, but overall much stronger and I knew that I could push myself more and ride for longer.
Because I bought a more expensive bike I really felt that I had to earn it, so it resulted in me biking more, getting fitter and stronger (losing 10kg this 'pandemic season' alone). And now I even wake up in the morning without thinking about what the weather is like outside, just go and bike anyways. I live in Norway so now it's pretty dark and pretty cold most of the time, but the joy I get pedaling around kinda beats that.
How I've love to ride a bike in Norway I heard the wether is nice out there. My bucket list for a long time.
Being poor in Norway its not being poor at all 🤣 in my country you can literaly buy a car bases in the price of these bikes
poor with $2000+ bike🤔. not vey poor at all
@@Kevinschart closer to 3000, so yes that month and the next two months after that I was poor. But it was a good investment. And a nice gift to myself that keeps on giving.
You are poor and can buy a bike with a monthly wage? Fuck off, monthly wage in my country is 200 dollars and that buys no bike.
Your next video should be: If you have a true passion for cycling, always buy the best bike you can afford!
Idk but if anyone’s looking for a decent hardtail checkout the schwinn moab 3 especially if you want to upgrade it. I got mine, small frame, I’m 5’7 for $650 on Amazon. Their main website last time a checked has some instock for 770$.
Or buy a good second hand bike. I bought 4th hand former pro bike for around 1200 USD, it was well maintained but with a few scratches, and the seller was an enthusiastic cyclist.
I recently bought a second hand scott gravel bike for $650 cash at a coffee shop to use as my commuter to the gym and just stop driving my car. My last dope trek road bike (~$2200)was stolen.... so I’ve been without wheels for three years, and this second hand buy got me back on the road!! This video hits dead on with making smarter choices with your dollar, and making sure the real machine (your body) is at peak condition! New sub dude!
Greatly appreciate! Bummer to hear about the stolen bike but glad your making best with what you got. All the best.
as a triathlete the amount of hours that goes into my cycling is insane... but you are right if you are a beginner it will be hard to hit 300 watts plus in the uphill's and feel fast no matter what the bike is .. cycling needs massive leg power and mental strength
Buy a high end used road bike. 3-4 years old. Get a $10k bike for $4k. Riding Pinarello Dogma f8 and paid $2300.
agreed. i will never buy new again
You could get it for half that before the pandemic.
Just got a net cervelo s3 full carbon, wheels etc sram red for 2200... Not disk brakes but good deal tbh
Hahaha got my bike for free, a 1988 Road bike from my grandfather but I did change a lot from it to get it down to 7.7kg and I only spend 400$, I'm dropping all these expensive bike riders at ease.
@@Balmung812 Perzactly!
One could find (prePandemic) a 15-20 year old bike with low mileage, primo componentry, @22 lbs for $200. At 30+ years you have a fine ridable machine, but the gearing will be a bit of reach, 12speeds total and a bit heftier, though with a supple steel frame ride, salable for the investment , should you want something else, with savings in the four figures. After all, who's gonna be there for you later?? your legs or the guys that want to take your money?
The trouble is that the price of bikes has really gone up a lot in the last decade.
My friend was flexing with his new 8000 dolar bike on start line of race and mocking me about my 1500 dolar 10.5kg bike. You can imagine his face when i was droping him on climb in first couple of kilometers of race. :) There is no better feeling. :)
thats the best feeling ! when i can drop some self called PRO" just cause they had some exp and a nice bike, i drop them in the first hill and they were drafting after me, i watched and they were gone, despite of my effort i felt soooo nice
Love that. My problem is getting new riders. Beginners only want high end carbon bike.
@@gnrkulim173 i have to tell you that all i want its some decent wheels, i dont care if its aluminum of carbon, just have to bee decent.
@@raulfernandezperez73 I'm pretty slow, yes I already changed to high end aluminium wheelset. It's better than cheap carbon wheel
@@gnrkulim173 aluminun its good and last longer, yes carbon its lighter and some times more confortable
There was some ultra endurance track runner in my town, his friend made him hop on a bike and he cycled that thing like a rotor engine. So he suggested he enter some amateur cycling race, and he entered with a single speed bike. Everyone thought he was crazy, but he won like 2 races before they disqualified him for "being on steroids". Moral is if you're in good shape, it doesnt matter if other people's bikes are made of carbon or even platinum.
@Vicki Peterson Nope, he was just one of those real life superhumans that runs like 20 kilometers a day as routine. Like i said he's an ultra endurance runner. People like him get nicknamed "Diesel" cuz they just keep going and going, i heard of another one like him in the news recently so they are not that rare.
I’m gonna be honest with you and say that I’ve watched your vids before and not subscribed, but this vid made me want to sub because I think this fitness first mentality is needed to help people with less money get into the sport! Great content and I look forward to more.
That's totally true now ived decided to buy a cheap bike now and improve my health, getting fit while saving for my future dream bike.
@@Ridesinsta360 which more reasonably priced bike are you going to go for Anthony?
If you like the feel of quality components, and don't have or don't want to spend a lot of money, an older high-end bike with low miles is a good option. I actually enjoy riding some of the older steel bikes more than newer carbon bikes.
And I tend to ride more often and stay out longer when I enjoy the ride. So I get better exercise while enjoying it more.
My brother with aluminum road bike sweeps carbon cyclist in our town and he was known for sweeping lightweights bicycle everytime he ride and participate to a boundary race,what they don't know is that he used pedaling a mega weight of steel bicycle when he was a kid and there he got his power dude, it's not the bike it's your leg
Fitness is clearly key. Diet is a major part of fitness. Eat well. Train well. But also buy the best bike you can if it’s what you enjoy. Life is short. I’m just buying a nice custom build Titanium bike. It’s a thing of joy and beauty. No harm in expensive gear. But I’d never go into debt for it.
@@jamsxr I went to the Enigma. Completely custom build. I'm 56. Dont smoke. Dont drink. May as well have one before I die.
The most expensive road bike is the one not ridden.
Bruh, that's deep and is making me thinking of my older machines gathering dust. I should spend sometime with them soon...
Electronic shifting is my primary reason for purchasing a more expensive bike. I hate poor shifts, and I don't have the time or desire to constantly be screwing with my derailleurs, especially now that I have a family and far less time than I used to have to play with my bike. Electronic shifting alleviates that problem and allows me to just focus on riding and enjoy the time I have on the bike, but it also tends to come on higher spec (and higher price) bikes. I've also found over the years that if I never upgrade wheels, or by the time I want to, technology has advanced and it's harder to find compatible wheelsets. Might as well pay for decent wheels up front.
If you set it right in the first place, the only time you should need to touch it is when you replace the cables.
@@monkmchorning Cables stretch. Everything 105 and up has been relatively solid for me, but the lower end groupsets tend to give me issues. Front derailleurs especially. That said, it depends somewhat on application. For a gravel bike or mountain bike, I'll always go mechanical so I can perform field fixes if I need to.
@@davekendall1338 Tiagra 4700 is pretty remarkable. Really.
Money can buy you speed! But most of the gains are only on long and/or high watts rides so I do agree with you that for 99% of riders a mid range bike ($2000- $4000) is more then enough! And that it more important to focus on improving fitness, endurance and physical strength then being obsessed with the bike.
True, but the person who trained an has is going to beat the person who hasn't on a hill climb, completely irrespective of bike cost.
Direct to consumer bikes from ribble are sub $1,000 even sub $800. The days of lbs ripoffs are over.
Lmao I've had terrrrible 5th hand bikes with terrible allignment, geartrain, and weighed 35+ lbs. Anything 25lbs or below is a dream...and I'm buying a 18.5 lbs Madone SL6 tomorrow ✨
@@Nostalgiaforinfi But by the time you pay someone to assemble and tune it correctly you might as well have bought a discounted name brand bike.
I'm with you. The advanced aluminum frames from Cannondale, BMC, Trek, and Specialized are all excellent, and so is the midrange carbon. Match with 105, Rival, or even Tiagra, and you have a very satisfying ride.
IT's the truth, they are a waste of money.. You'll get even a greater work out on a heavier, dept store bike. Train heavy, race light.
I totally agree with this!! I started my cycling journey on a heavier Hybrid bike and bought myself my first road bike, nothing to expensive. My weight-loss and fitness level have excelled because I trained hard on a heavier bike 👌🏽
There is a middle ground, department store bikes are unlikely to fit or operate well and the fancy options (disk brakes) are of such low quality that they are nothing more than an annoyance.
For a beginner I would suggest a bike that FITS, uses common durable components, enough gear range for their fitness/terrain and starting with new cables, pads and a tune up.
Suggested upgrade path would start at the contact points; bibs, saddle, shoes, pedals, bar tape.
Continue until they are comfortably riding a reliable steed.
Materials do matter, carbon does a very nice job dampening vibrations and flexing where you want it, but not where you don't. I've never ridden an alu fork that wasn't awful.
Going to vintage steel is a mixed bag, they are very soft and noodle like, but you'll need to know how to work on them, got your cone wrenches handy? Downtube shifters are bombproof, annoying, but super simple to adjust correctly. Oh and that 6 speed 11-24 freewheel... Not what i would recommend for a new rider.
@@All4Grogg buying 2 bikes in my sizes during a pandemic was a miracle let alone the quality. That was a gain for me
@@JeBaSIINGH23 yeah it's a difficult time for it, but somewhat unfortunately I'll bet that a year from now the used market is going to explode. I have a very short (4'10ish) coworker, my god, her options are nearly non-existent for a road bike.
@@All4Grogg I'm thinking the same thing! I'm planning on upgrading when that happens!!! Oh man I know how it feels, I bought the only 49 in all of my city... GTA yup it was a tough find
So tired of people bashing those who buy expensive bikes. Its their money. Why does anyone care? How do we calculate a bike's value? If people are motivated to ride by having a shinny new high-end model its far, far better than not going out on a ride. Have fun out there - and stop comparing whatever you ride with whatever other people ride. (I ride a 13 year old bike myself)
Pedalar, new sub here. I love your videos, I'm also from Toronto. Just picked up my first road bike, a second hand Specialized Tarmac SL2 with 105 componentry and a second hand Tacx Flux S.
Your content is inspiring, keep up the amazing work!
Sweet setup! I’m a big believer in buying secondhand.. let someone else pay the premium for new and shiny, then take it off their hands a few years later for a fraction of the price 👍🏻
@@Oakpathetics thanks! I recently picked up cycling and it doesn't make sense to me buying brand new, especially when I'm not sure if I even like/love it. Actually, I'm addict to cycling 😎💯
One thing I noticed was the more expensive the bike the more it is suited for pros so it’s lighter and all the parts wear quicker.
It's not a waste of money if money is no object. If you have to take a second mortgage to get that super bike, then it doesn't make sense. But those who have ridden superbikes vs. the middle of road carbon with tiagra components can all agree that the ride on the superbike is much, much sweeter.
Hi. I have a Giant TCR 2020 105 Kom, but just bought an "expensive" Canyon Ultimate SL Disc Etap Force. Why? Because the Giant really felt shitty, and I felt cheated. I do not regret, there is no comparison between them, although I will keep the TCR for the trainer.
Nah. How much money is in the bank doesnt determine whether some is a "waste".
What does is $$$ invested vs performance improvement outcomes (or just outcomes if we want to include things like emotional outcomes).
Imagine running a business where the CEO says "who cares we have a of money". No one would think investing in something with minimal or shit returns is OK because theres more money.
Totally agree, the weight savings is 2 lbs? A must if you are a pro, silly for cyclist enthusiasts.
Exactly. As an enthusiast you're already putting that weight back on the bike with water bottles lol.
You sir are dropping some serious logic! I’ve been drooling over the more expensive bikes, shopping to jump from a aluminum frame “gravel bike” to a carbon frame and feeling the pull that I should get the way more expensive electric shift super light race bike when in reality I’m never going to race in crit, over weight but getting lighter and stronger thanks to the tacx trainer and Zwift lol and pushing 40... 105 will be the next for me! Riding out of halton hills Ontario. Great vids!
It's great hearing you're increasing your fitness and it'd ironic you mentioned a carbon gravel bike with electronic shifting which I have and I don't think it's worth it and wished I would have got mechanical and saved some $$$. Keep the good work up!!!
Its genetics. You can train all you want but you're not going to turn into Peter Sagan or Greg van Avermaet or no matter what your bike costs. The easiest way to get rid of some weight is to lose it rather than paying $ XXXX + for a lighter bike.
Totally agree. Why worry grams in bike, if rider has kilos of extra weight. I bought entry price bike with wider gravel tires, which makes riding very comfortable and I can take trips to places which are beyond road bike. I mostly drive road but occasionally it's fantastic to drive dusty gravel road or totally dark sideroads with super bright lamp.
Fitness determines performance... amen. Recently started back cycling on a used Felt Z5 and I have to get myself in shape. This is the bike I will use to do it.
Agree. When you are lost , it doesn't make much difference, what your bike weighs, or how fast you pedal.
I’m gonna get a 700 dollar Poseidon X cause of the versatility and price, I thought it was quite pricy until I saw the prices of other bikes
Do you ride 8 hours a day, cyclists, runners. Train,eat ,sleep. And have failed marriages. Runners an easy 20 in the morning. Afternoon an easy 15, Kenyons run 20 one way and 20 back. Running for money. Is hard. Cris Carmichael Lance Armstrong’s coach.said once you get a life it’s hard to get on your bike 12 hours a week... didn’t you see Lance’s Nike commercial...plus the mountains... DDD...
Can relate! I love my old 2013 TCR Advance 2 (10sp 105). I ended up getting a new ultegra groupset (r8000 11sp). I'm rebuilding it and putting my r5700 10sp 105 on my commuter bike. Dedicating my money and time on fixing my old bike because then it means more when I build it up myself.
cheap bike 2000€, me looking at my 70€ cheap bike !omg
I’d recommend an aero race bike for riders who can average 20 mph for 2 hours riding solo on rolling terrain or if they ride 24 mph avg on group rides. If a rider is averaging 15 mph week in and week out then it doesn’t matter.
That's a very fast average!!!!
Next vlog is how you train, structured training how to get stronger and faster for common cyclists like me 95 kgs.
👀🤭 one step ahead of me
I like what you just said. If your not a pro all your doing is wasting your money. Like myself, when I was riding, I never used clip-less peddles, just toe straps and I did fine. But you are right about what you said; everything you said. Peace!!!!
Much appreciate safe riding!
You got a point regarding fitness to ride. As an older rider (61), fitness is paramount to your incentive to ride, regardless of the amount of money spent to buy a bike. I've ridden with guys bikes that are 20+ yrs old and they routinely drop guys on expensive bikes, because of their fitness level. I have worked hard on my fitness to ride my bikes, because the fitter you are the more you're going to enjoy riding. It doesn't matter whether it's a $1,500 or $10,000 bike, I'm going ride either one at the same speed.
Great to hear your enjoying riding. Keep crushing it!
I follow a few pros on Strava and they average 50-100 miles a day with 5,000-10,000 feet climbs. Not many people have the time for that much riding.
You can still achieve very good fitness will low amounts of kilometres. Training + Diet need to be optimized to achieve peak performance.
Kms dont really matter. Time in zone does. And you need to understand what zone does what in regards to physiological changes.
Hello from Paris ! Nice video. I often see riders buying high end bikes with Dura Ace and finally downgrading the spare parts and components to 105 because of the price. I prefer 105 and good wheels.
A well kept road bike under 100 dollars can get you everywhere period. I will spend 1k on a bike one day soon though.
You seem to forget about one important thing : passion
If only top riders would deserve to ride those super expensives bikes, the bike industry wouldn't even build them.
Why buy a Ferrari or even a BMW or a Mercedes when you can only drive 60 miles/hour on the road ? Passion is the answer and this goes the same with bikes. Most of the people don't buy an expensive bike because they need it, it's because they want it.
Also sometimes, buying an expensive bike will force you to improve your fitness.
I totally get what your point but if every rider would buy a bike depending on his fitness, we would see pretty cheap bikes all day long.
Yeah I think this video is off base. High end bikes exist for the same reason anything high end exists. People have surplus cash and want to spend it on nice shit.
Comes down to just go out there and ride with whatever you have, no excuses. I am a rower who have been injured for 3 months, rib fracture which has been super slow to heal. Did some cycling to keep some of my fitness before the snow hit( live in northern Sweden). The bike I used was a 1970 grandma 2 speed city cruiser with wobbly wheels, heavy as hell and a faulty second gear that forced me to mainly use first( it's a pretty cool bike, only has a coaster brake and you shift by breaking).
Of course I was looking for something else to use but couldn't find someone selling a racer in my small town so just used what I had.
Did 2h-2h30m rides on that cruiser everyday for a month. Best speed I could manage on the bike was a session were I did 49 km in almost exactly 2h, fairly flat, no wind, mostly riding car roads and going pretty much all out.
So incredibly slow bike but why would speed matter unless you are using it for transportation or competing? Obviously you would want a racing bike and not a cruiser since an upright posture prevents using power to an extent and also you would want access to lots of gears. Other than that though I don't see why not something like an old cheap vintage racer wouldn't work for most people . It's not like your body can tell the difference between a slow and fast bike. You will gain fitness in just the same way.
A cheap vintage racer is precisely what I am trying to find now. Cycling was pretty fun so figured I would keep cycling as cross training after winter.
Alternative: 10-year-old high end bikes have fantastic performance, are very light and cost $1000-1500. Still have my 2004 Cannondale full Dura-Ace road racer and it would not be the limiting factor for someone trying to go fast.
I don't think you need the most expensive but there is definitely a difference between a cheap Walmart bike and an entry level Trek, Giant, Specialized, Bianchi, etc.
I've found the ultra cheap bikes from Walmart, box stores are super heavy, poorly built group sets, poor sizing/geometry and no help.
My first reentry to cycling was a used Specialized Dolce for 500 which was far lighter and fit me so much better than my ancient steel Schwinn. Great bike, got me to want to ride more. Next bike was an entry level carbon bike for 1700, got me to want to ride even more. Then came the gift of my Bianchi Oltre XR3 and that bike has really changed my viewpoint about pricing. Lightest bike I've ever had, most comfortable/best fitting bike I've ever had, best shifting, etc. All in all I see myself riding that bike forever and wanting to ride it every day.
It isn't necessary to spend a fortune in order to get a decent bike.
Entry level used bikes, any recommendations?
Fuji...good quality , comfortable, good brakes and low price points...try offer up in your area...
Great video!! Definitely recommend a bikefit especially the bike on your tacx at 9:30min - sitting a bit high which is causing you to rock on the saddle and open your ankle through the bottom of the pedal stroke . Give you more comfort and maximise your efficiency! Great channel! Look forward to your next videos!!!
Appreciated and I mentioned this in previous videos that clip of me on the trainer was me recording my position before I did an at home bike fit which I ended up lowering my saddle height. Thanks for the encouragement!
@@Pedaler Cool man! Just discovered your channel today so will catch up on the previous videos!
All the best!!
i have a Kouta kharma carbon fiber 2008...but still have it,and invest Giant TCR advanced disc 2021 just couple months ago. but to invest this kind of bike its worth it.
honestly i invest this bike for my health, now i'm 52 years old and still going strong:)
There is a saying for the message of your 19 min video summerized in 4 words:
"look Pro , go Slow"
I used to be like you, training with a cheap bike. But One day I was training hard and felt a sudden lack in moral due to the piece zhiet I was riding. Thats when I realized I needed Chris Froomes bike and that changed my life
Hey, Bro thank you for knocking in my head and open it up, what you discussed in this vlog hit me hard and its true, thank you...
Getting new equipment can help motivate you. Knowing that there are no excuses left and it's down to you to push. Nothing wrong with enjoying gadgets and buying upgrades if it keeps you in the saddle. It's all part of the show.
Well said
I live in switzerland. In summer its warm to hot not too hot and in winter its freezing cold sub zero. I ride the bike 2h a day for comuting to and from work. Iam warm in winter and fresh in summer. Why? Because I use qualuty clothing.
Great video, honest, very detailed. I started with a $1400 entry level tiagra bike and will follow this advice as I progress. Thanks!
All the best!
I ride a Trek checkpoint ALR and the only place I struggle keeping up with Tarmacs and Emondas is on the climbs. There you really really feel the weight but otherwise most people on more expensive bikes around here are less fit than I am or too muscular in the wrong places, especially the upper body. My biggest argument for staying aluminum though is how I use my bike. I can't justify the mental cage an expensive bike would put me in. This ALR went for 1200$ on sale and it lets me get out there so I can scratch it up without it killing me and live the way I want to live. That's my argument to stay within my budget and capabilities. A more expensive bike would personally make me a worse, more anxious rider.
It's a waste of money for most people, certainly if it's only a bike for weekend/sunday rides. Those folks buy a €5000+ bike for riding an average speed of hardly 25km/h, that is just plain ridiculous.
The bike you have is the best bike. Treat it right, so when you get your dream bike you know what todo.
I still don’t understand why I can’t be superfit and also ride the best bike
Great video! Could you possibly make a video about your diet during that time?
If the issue is fitness, what you ride is actually doesn't matter. You can still be efficient with heavier bikes, then you'll become even faster in superbikes.
This is kind of pointless really. I have an s-works venge, I’m a good rider but definitely not a professional racer and I probably don’t get the maximum that the bike can offer but I love riding it, it feels great and I can afford it. It’s like 90% of people who drive Porsche 911 GT3s, they too are probably not racing car drivers but they love the the feeling of the car and the engineering behind it. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it and there’s no point in hating on such people. For that matter I should tell you that you should work harder so you can actually afford to ride the bike you actually want but I won’t because that too is a silly statement.
Agree.
When we talk about "you should buy this and that", somebody must categorize group of people first. Then talk about thing "they should buy".
In many cases, rich people and pro cyclist must exclude from the discussion. Rich people can buy whatever they want and pro cyclist get sponsored.
The only thing that make people hate to each other in non-pro world because when expensive bike owner look down to cheap bike owner and the minivelo smoked them all and everybody offended😅 Not all, probably in some cases.
This hateness not only in bike world, most cases in this maniac materialistic world such cars, handphone, motorbike, toys, rc, clothing etc. Same hateness occur. This drama will keep going forever.
Probably we also need this kind of argument/drama for company to make less expensive bike better.
I agree there shouldn’t be hating on expensive bikes as everyone’s financial situation is different.. a spesh aethos could be 1 day salary for some and if they want to enjoy nice things, good on them.. I think this applies to most of us who are thrifty.. no doubt the best gains are achieved from fitness. I’ve also become a lot more cynical about the bike manufacturers marketing BS.
Your comment is completely valid, but there's nothing more fun than picking out the guy on the 5 - 10k bike on a ride an ensuring you're ahead of them. To me, they are nothing but motivation to try harder...
@@aaron___6014 ‘your equipment’ has many meanings...😛😛.... and no you don’t want fault equipment....
yup, your last statement was silly
So glad I subscribed to this channel. Thanks bro!
No worries all the best! Appreciate the support
I rode with the Italian Olympic team on the roads of Rio in 2016 and I felt like they were on motorcycles, so hard they can ride. I couldn't keep up for 2 minutes!
Awesome
Enjoying the video. I'm 67 and bought a $1300 USD ebike 49.7 lbs. After six months, I totally ride with the motor off. I do an hour of cardio and Total Gym resistance training daily for the past year. Road are gravel and asphalt. Looking for a non ebike, anything under 25 lbs will be awesome. Oh yeah, I lost 30 lbs doing this. Same as getting a lighter bike.
I'm from Buffalo. I feel your pain on the cold weather stuff. 105 and carbon is definitely the sweet spot. Once you go DI2 though it's hard to go back.
I have Etap and have ridden Di2. And unless paid to ride them I would choose mechanical.
True. My bike was 3k when I bought it. I got in great form with it for the last 3 years then I started swapping for upgrades. The upgrades smoothen and make the ride better when you have the fitness up. Not just an expensive bike. Eddy Mercx said, "don't buy upgrades, ride up grades."
105 + carbon frame + carbon wheels = perfect
what is so wrong with aluminium wheels? can anyone xplain?
Have a look at Winspace Hyper carbon wheels they retail for $1100 from China. Brilliant reviews.
I paid through the nose for Ultegra on my Cannondale and, although I’m pleased with it, I will definitely not be buying it again as 105 is more than enough. To be honest, I may even go with Tiagra....
@T D I watched his other video where he said it gives a 30 sec advantage over the course of a race. To me this doesn't justify the cost, as I use it for fitness. For ride quality I use 28c ))
It would be great if you did a diet/calorie intake/amount of calories used (when you got into great shape). Or the plan you used. Love the videos
Do you have a top 5 bikes you recommend for what you talking about. because I'm looking to take my fitness to the next level but like you said I'm not trying to break the bank either
So honest and true!!!
but yeah, I'll stick to my alloyframe-alloyfork-Claris endurance-fit bike ($800) than the "beginner" carbon bike with 105 groupset ($2000) (C'mon man it isn't entry-level... Lol...)
{there is a price difference of $1200}
I can get fitter on the current bike I have and compete... Thanks!!!!
Subbed!!!!
Safe riding and thank you.
Been there, done that. From an entry-level to the flagship, UCI pros kind of gears. In the end, it is the training, the discipline, and consistency. $20K of racing gears won't let you ride faster than in a $2K gear. Sure uphill, lighter will help, deep rims will help with flat terrains, etc. The help these gears give does not outweigh the athleticism. If you gotta spend, go for an aero helmet and skinsuit first. I wish I could go pro but like what I mentioned, the hunger and discipline aren't with me.
Honestly, I agree. Unless you're racing or climbing mountains you really don't need an expensive bike. The only 2 things that affect a bike on flat ground are rolling resistance and wind resistance. The only time the weight of the bike comes in to play is in climbs and in acceleration that's it. If you're not racing or climbing 1000's of feet during a ride then a top spec aluminum Bike will always be better than an entry level carbon bike and similarly priced. I have a 2010 Cervelo S-1, the first aero race bike ever made, the fact that I have no problem keeping up with people on a group ride is why I've not bought a carbon bike. True a carbon bike is probably going to out sprint me, but I'm not racing. It's slow to climb but I live in an area of rolling hills and river valleys so the weight really doesn't bother me, and again I'm not racing. If I wanted to buy a Dogma F I could, but why? To say I have one?
I'm riding a Bianchi 928L (2007) invested in a good groupset Dura-Ace 7800 10 speed. And dropping race geometry, disc aero bikes owners from the group. The only thing I'm looking forward to is adding modern shifters.
It's all about good training, good food, good rest, aerodynamic, power to weight ratio and a clean new transmission. That's it in my opinion.
I want to argue with you because of my decision to own expensive bikes, but you're right. Also, I used to have a 2016 TCR Advanced SL identical to yours. What do you think of yours? I felt that the ISP made the ride too stiff. The 2021 TCR 105 is killer.
You are so right. I started road cycling with a $7.7k BMC Roadmachine last July. In Oct, I found a 2012 BMC Aluminum frame, built it up with sourced together R8000 groupset. My aluminum bike rides better and I ride better than the expensive bike. As you stated, I am not in shape enough to push the new bike. I’d like to know more about getting into better shape. Oh btw, I’m much older
Reality is most people don't want to make the time to train(me included sometimes). The other reality is that some people have $ burning a hole in their pocket and want something nice even if they aren't that fast or super competitive.
I see your point and agree that training is far better for your experience than trying to buy speed but one is easy and one isn't, let's see what most people pick...
Cycling at Pro-Level is a full time job. For pro-cyclist doing 50-100 miles is their work
Ah I see what you're saying. For me, I don't necessarily think that someone doesn't "deserve" to ride a high-end bike because they're not fit enough, but I do 100% agree that it's more worthwhile to get a cheaper bike. It's just that with expensive bikes, you're improving the equipment by such a small margin per dollar that you're not getting a return unless you're an elite competitor. If I was riding a $12,000 superbike, Chris Froome would still blow me away on an $800 entry-level bike.
👍
@Pedaler Can you make a video about what you eat on a daily basis. Changing my eating habits is the hardest part of getting fit for me.
Great to hear you are fit , i think if you race a expensive bike is dodgy unless someone else is paying for it , but a really lovely bike is about how it makes you feel , like cars we don't need to be formula 1 drivers to drive a Ferrari
I'm 51 yo now. When I was younger I did ride/race when possible with domestic and sometimes foreign professionals. There is more than they are just "fit"...they are the genetic freaks of the fit athletes. They simply are capable of doing more with less. Yes, most of us just lack the baseline fitness to even be able to train at that level. But one can train and race (and waste) a lot of resources pursuing a pro career and NEVER get there, in fact MOST NEVER GET THERE. The bike helps but has very little to do with it, a trained pro will ride crap if that's what they are paid to do and still win. The bike is just a tool--nice tools are better but any tool will do b/c it's the craftsman that makes it happen.
I'm on a 2016 TCR model. Added a power meter. Changed wheels and tyres. That's it. All gains are due to me training. I don't waste money trying to go faster by buying a top end machine. Lots of things to do first before splashing the cash.
I could agree with some things you’ve mentioned. BUT... if you a passionate about cycling buy a bike thats the MOST you can afford! If you go cheap, that’ll only make you think of upgrading every time you get on it and see others with better gear, specially if you have potential. Getting a cheap bike will only make it more expensive in the future!
Im blessed and had the opportunity to get a 7k bike and I love it. Dont think of selling it anytime soon, in fact unless I crash, frame gets damage, I dont see myself changing it. It has everything I want and need in a bike as a competitive cyclist.
Another point: if expensive it will hold its value due to better group-sets, carbon rims and frame.
A cheap bike will not hold its value, it will be harder to get most of money you paid for at beginning and buying another Cheap bike will not fix your desire to get the best you can afford.
I didnt go Cheap and I could have gone that route and saves prob 4-5k.
But Im happy and love my bike. Motivated me to wake up early or ride late after work. 😉
If you are just testing if you like cycling is another story. Rent or use a friends bike before even buying a “cheap” bike because even then it will cost you 2-3k which is not easy money to drop on bike for most people.
If you are just using it for indoors (swift), no brainer, get a Walmart bike and connect to Wahoo or Tacx whatever you have.
I live in Florida, everything is flat around here. I wanted an AERO FRAME bike which typically go higher in price that normal climbing or lighter frame models. At the end, it depends how serious you are and how deep your pockets are.
I need ur opinion please... am getting into biking regularly... which one u reckon i go for - Java Siluro 3 2019 or the 2010 Specialized Allez Elite Saxo Bank edition?
I've owned some expensive bikes, but decided to get back into cycling and spent just £95 on a new bike,; it has an aluminium frame and is light enough. It's enjoyable to ride for 30 miles+. I've realised that you don't need the best bike to enjoy cycling, and if you're not racing, the time doesn't matter; I seem to go faster than most around me anyway. Just enjoy cycling. Oh, and I'm losing weight fast!
I would trade riding on a zwift for riding outdoors in Arizona when it's 115f any day of the week. Nothing can replace being outdoors and getting fresh air and negative ions.
When u pedal down stroke Your legs Way too extended like chopping ...... lower saddle at least 1-2 cm and more saddle back by 3 mm-5 mm for better knee control and power
I get this comment a lot, in the video that was me recording my current position and then changing it once I reviewed the clip. I did lower it down. (I filmed it as I was doing my own bike fit/ correction) thanks!
with the saddle too high , the leg remains extended for 2 or 3 cm of pedal movement at the 6 o'clock position. This is lag. It must be made up somewhere. The result is an excessively high acceleration at the 9 o'clock position (upswing). The knee angle should close up instantly after full leg extension.
I largely agree with this, but it's not just about your overall fitness level but the terrain you regularly ride. People who live in flatter, less demanding locales like the Midwest don't need hydraulic disc brakes and the stiffest, lightest carbon frames - as they really need to push it to 10/10ths to see all the benefits of a high-end bike.
However, if you live in say Utah or Colorado with really steep gradients on some of the highest mountain passes, someone of mediocre to intermediate-level fitness will still benefit immensely from upgrading a bike somewhere in the 2.5 - 3k range, as opposed to riding a much cheaper bike. The better drivetrain will shift cleanly on steep hills, the bike will climb with much more prowess and efficiency, and the descent will be less scary when you have the brakes to keep your speed in check on a long mountain road. Really depends on where you're riding it and how hard you're pushing yourself. Just my 2 cents.
I have only been riding for 2 years, after having not riding for over 40 years, and have gone through two road bikes before I settled in on a Pinarello Gan. I found out quality matters as does the material, from starting out with a steel frame Bianchi, to an aluminum frame with a carbon fork Bianchi which was fast but didn't have the quality ride as the Gan. I agree with many of the comments on this thread, buy a bike you can afford, new or used, and ride to your capability. I would love to have a Dogma F8 or F12, but it doesn't make sense for me being 67 and only do light competitions.
Yes totally agree you put the effort in you're cycling you will get the results I am on a giant tcr advanced 2017 and I love it ,Iam still learning and I would love to get on a more modern bike down the track when I am better in group rides and faster, and I love the fitness of cycling and I like to test myself on the hills , thanks for the info, like you're channel .
Alex .
Perth WA .🚴♂️🇦🇺
Thanks for sharing your experience and motivation! Did you do any stretching or strength training to get your results?
I raced in the late 80s early 90s. I had no money. Always wanted the beautiful Colnago but couldn't afford it. Got a cheap carbon fiber specialized allez epic frame from a specialized rep and built it up with Campy Athena. I raced crits which meant crashes, so I didn't get Shimano brake shifters or Zipp wheels. I'm glad I didn't, I've seen expensive equipment get destroyed in pileups. Most of us who race low amateur race crits, so equipment is secondary to strength and tactics.
Thanks for sharing your experience, couldn’t agree more!
Love the passion! After the first of the year let’s get fit.
You know it 🦾
Yes please. Can you share your training plan for that insane weight loss
I always say the difference between a 3000 dollar bike and a 12000 dollar bike is about 2 pounds!